Jonp219 Posted July 8, 2015 Posted July 8, 2015 Do either of these mindsets produce better results in your dating life or in general? I've been told when your mindset comes from a place of abundance it takes pressure off of your psyche. You won't go into a date thinking, "This might be my last chance at love, I better not screw this up". Which eventually breeds an aura of desperation and neediness. Instead, you go in believing that there are plenty of fish in the sea and it doesn't work out, well another train comes in 15 minutes. What I want to know is, is this healthy? Is this realistic? Aren't we just lying to ourselves if we believe there are plenty of opportunities for us? Aren't we just setting ourselves up for failure? How long could someone go thinking positively until he/she sees results? If there's one loaf of bread in the fridge I can't think abundantly and tell myself there's more than enough for me and my family. You can't live in a village of 50 people and tell yourself you're going to find someone special someday, when there aren't enough people to choose from. I just believe it's unrealistic to think abundantly when a scarce mindset makes more sense. Although it's scarier, we can't do nothing about it. What does everyone else think?
d0nnivain Posted July 8, 2015 Posted July 8, 2015 You can't be impractical about it but an abundant mindset has always served me better. It's not that there is only 1 loaf in the house it's that by the time that runs out I will have done something to make sure there is something else to eat. I have always said things like "It's only money; we'll make more" or "there's plenty of fish in the sea." If you read books like The Secret or adopt philosophies like the power of positive thinking, it helps to create an abundant mindset. It's not all wishful thinking. You still have to work for what you want. It's just that you work with the belief that your efforts will pay off. 1
Author Jonp219 Posted July 8, 2015 Author Posted July 8, 2015 You can't be impractical about it but an abundant mindset has always served me better. It's not that there is only 1 loaf in the house it's that by the time that runs out I will have done something to make sure there is something else to eat. I have always said things like "It's only money; we'll make more" or "there's plenty of fish in the sea." If you read books like The Secret or adopt philosophies like the power of positive thinking, it helps to create an abundant mindset. It's not all wishful thinking. You still have to work for what you want. It's just that you work with the belief that your efforts will pay off. I've read "The Secret". But the more I studied the Law of Attraction the more I found that the examples Rhonda Byrne's uses are highly simplified.
d0nnivain Posted July 8, 2015 Posted July 8, 2015 I'm not saying they aren't over simplified; they are mass media books after all. But to me, the abundant mindset feels more natural, although I have a practical streak to guard against the downside. For example before I took the leap of faith to open my own business, I saved a year's worth of living expenses just in case. 1
Ronni_W Posted July 9, 2015 Posted July 9, 2015 (edited) I've read "The Secret". But the more I studied the Law of Attraction the more I found that the examples Rhonda Byrne's uses are highly simplified. I've just started studying this topic more in-depth. Abundance Consciousness is much, MUCH more than just looking at present conditions and manifestations - of health, wealth, love, happiness, whatever - and then using the outer mind to try to change things. (Which I did not know until very recently, as I said.) The true "power" to manifest the abundant life does not come from the outer mind just saying positive affirmations, or whatever sentences that that same outer mind can clearly tell is clearly BS -- our waking consciousness ain't an idiot While 'The Secret' does not try to hide the fact that it is based in spirituality; it needs much more of that, for one to truly be able to develop and harness the power of 'The Secret' -- which ain't a secret or a mystery...but one needs to explore, er, more spiritual teachings than what so far as become mainstream. I couldn't really find a super-appropriate link, but check teachings of the Ascended Masters, if interested to take your search further. I like Kim Michaels' websites, one of which is AscendedMasterLight. Wishing you abundance in all aspects of your life. Edited July 9, 2015 by Ronni_W 1
Author Jonp219 Posted July 9, 2015 Author Posted July 9, 2015 I've just started studying this topic more in-depth. Abundance Consciousness is much, MUCH more than just looking at present conditions and manifestations - of health, wealth, love, happiness, whatever - and then using the outer mind to try to change things. (Which I did not know until very recently, as I said.) The true "power" to manifest the abundant life does not come from the outer mind just saying positive affirmations, or whatever sentences that that same outer mind can clearly tell is clearly BS -- our waking consciousness ain't an idiot While 'The Secret' does not try to hide the fact that it is based in spirituality; it needs much more of that, for one to truly be able to develop and harness the power of 'The Secret' -- which ain't a secret or a mystery...but one needs to explore, er, more spiritual teachings than what so far as become mainstream. I couldn't really find a super-appropriate link, but check teachings of the Ascended Masters, if interested to take your search further. I like Kim Michaels' websites, one of which is AscendedMasterLight. Wishing you abundance in all aspects of your life. Then where does it come from? From your experiences with the subject what has brought abundance into your life?
Justanaverageguy Posted July 9, 2015 Posted July 9, 2015 (edited) Do either of these mindsets produce better results in your dating life or in general? I've been told when your mindset comes from a place of abundance it takes pressure off of your psyche. You won't go into a date thinking, "This might be my last chance at love, I better not screw this up". Which eventually breeds an aura of desperation and neediness. Instead, you go in believing that there are plenty of fish in the sea and it doesn't work out, well another train comes in 15 minutes. What I want to know is, is this healthy? Is this realistic? Aren't we just lying to ourselves if we believe there are plenty of opportunities for us? Aren't we just setting ourselves up for failure? How long could someone go thinking positively until he/she sees results? Great topic and something I am also interested in. Abundant mentality is obviously the way to go and I have found great and some what surprising benefits from this way of thinking. If you truly understand how it works you are never deluding yourself. Because no matter how unlikely - the universe will manifest it into your life if you truly believe it and feel like you are abundant. Once you really actually see this happening - crazy unlikely things just happen regularly because you wanted them to and it becomes easier mindset to maintain. So with that said whats the best way to do this at the beginning when you are still learning the process. Agree with Ronni that lots of spiritual books teach more detailed ways to do this. The most obvious and my personal fav is Buddhism which teaches gratitude. When you are happy with what you have you will get what ever you want. So with that said my opinion is this statement -> "You go in believing that there are plenty of fish in the sea and it doesn't work out, well another train comes in 15 minutes. is not actually the best abundant mindset. Its better then the desperate alternative you posted but not perfect because that still comes from a mindset of "lacking". You still focus on wanting a girlfriend its just ok because there are more to choose from later. It is still shows you are unhappy with what you have. The trick is to take the focus away from what you want and place it on what you already have. Gratitude. So a better abundant mindset for getting a girl is: I'm actually completely and totally happy on my own. I love my life and don't need a girlfriend but if I met someone I really connected with who was an amazing woman then that would just be the icing on the cake of an already awesome life. Its not that I know there is more out there or I trick myself into thinking there are more girls out there if it doesn't work out. It is that I literally don't mind either way because I am completely happy and content and have everything I need already. I'm happy the way things are. How do you make yourself think that ? Learn how to be completely happy on your own and its automatic. Women will flock to you like a moth to a flame Edited July 9, 2015 by Justanaverageguy
Justanaverageguy Posted July 9, 2015 Posted July 9, 2015 Then where does it come from? From your experiences with the subject what has brought abundance into your life? One word. Gratitude. 3
EasyHeart Posted July 9, 2015 Posted July 9, 2015 I haven't heard of this way of thinking, but I have learned one very important fact: People are attracted to positive people and repelled by negative people. I think that's one of the basic rules of interpersonal relationships. 1
endlessabyss Posted July 9, 2015 Posted July 9, 2015 Sounds like a bunch of gnostic bs going on in this thread lmao. I remember when my LTR ended; I was desperately looking for something to latch onto, due to the sheer fact I knew finding someone else was going to be almost an impossibility, and came across some "pick-up" loser, named RSD Tyler. He is the first person I heard divulging this abundance crap. I laugh at it now, because when tried implementing it into my life, the results were the same. I don't act super needy either way; I know things are scarce, but if I was meant to have it, I was meant to have it. I wonder if the person suffering from dehydration, with no water in sight, can tell himself that he is happy as he is, and some water would be icing on the cake, but not needed? Nope, he would suffer. The same thing goes for intimacy and love. You can try to delude yourself that you are happy without it, and it would be icing on the cake, but we all know people who lack these things suffer on the inside, because they are imperative for a healthy psyche. 1
TaraMaiden2 Posted July 9, 2015 Posted July 9, 2015 Then where does it come from? From your experiences with the subject what has brought abundance into your life? Compassionate Giving. That's the real secret to having an abundant amount of serenity and gladness in your heart and Mind. Always making sure others around you have enough. 2
TouchedByViolet Posted July 9, 2015 Posted July 9, 2015 Happiness requires hope. Hope that the future will be worth living. Hope that adversity will pass. Hope that your dreams will come true. Not all these things will happen and nobody can guarantee anything absolutely but hope keeps us going. 2
S_A Posted July 9, 2015 Posted July 9, 2015 (edited) I did not know it had a term, but yeah, I always went in to a date with an abundant mindset. I did not have to convince myself to believe that either, I actually believed there were plenty of fish in the sea. Without such a mindset, you'd probably risk coming off as desperate. Edited July 9, 2015 by S_A 1
Justanaverageguy Posted July 10, 2015 Posted July 10, 2015 I wonder if the person suffering from dehydration, with no water in sight, can tell himself that he is happy as he is, and some water would be icing on the cake, but not needed? Nope, he would suffer. The same thing goes for intimacy and love. You can try to delude yourself that you are happy without it, and it would be icing on the cake, but we all know people who lack these things suffer on the inside, because they are imperative for a healthy psyche. People need water to live that's a given - some feeling of thirst will always occur. Who suffers more though ? The man who focuses only on on the fact he is thirsty and has no water or the man who realised he has no water but he does have an apple and decides to eat it while he waits to find water ? Focus on what you have not what you lack and you will measurably reduce your level of suffering Regarding relationships it is truly possible to be happy on your own - some people actually prefer it. I know lots of people who are single and happy that way but open to something if the right person came along. They are always happier and more attractive then those who have no one and feel desperate and incomplete without someone. Those people are trying to find someone else's to fill a void in themselves and focus only on what they lack.
TaraMaiden2 Posted July 10, 2015 Posted July 10, 2015 Happiness requires hope. No, it doesn't. Happiness requires an open mind that actually releases all expectations. Hope is an empty wish. It has no future, because once you develop Hope, you already want something. Something you have no way of telling, is attainable. Hope that the future will be worth living. Hope that adversity will pass. Hope that your dreams will come true. All yearnings, all desires, all pinned to some point you have absolutely no way of knowing you will reach; you want life to be worth living? Make it so, NOW. You want adversity to pass? Compare your life to someone who HAS no shoes. Hope your dreams will come true? Be realistic. Achieve the achievable, NOW. Dreams are fine, but they are for those who do not 'awaken'. Not all these things will happen and nobody can guarantee anything absolutely but hope keeps us going. And that is precisely why people cling, grasp and desire things they desperately want. This - ^^ THIS - ^^ is precisely what the Buddha was speaking about. That is exactly why people 'Suffer'. Because they cling, and grasp desperately, to Hope. Hope doesn't keep you going. Hope pulls you back. 2
Justanaverageguy Posted July 10, 2015 Posted July 10, 2015 Hope your dreams will come true? Be realistic. Achieve the achievable, NOW. Dreams are fine, but they are for those who do not 'awaken'. I agree with almost everything you said except for this little bit. Be realistic. Seriously who wants to be that ? I'm completely unrealistic about my future and what I will achieve .... but I don't desire to be there now. I'm happy exactly where I am and focused on the now. Future will come to pass eventually. For me the key is just not to focus constantly on the future, grasping for what you desire and being unhappy with what you have now. You can tell the universe what you would like to see in the future .... then just let go of how it comes to pass. Stop trying to "force" it to happen when and how you want it to and and just sit back go with the flow of life and accept that it will come to pass eventually. Because trying not to desire has the exact same effect as grasping for desire. It is just as painful to try and deliberately squash a dream as it is to grasp for it. Got to find the middle way
TaraMaiden2 Posted July 10, 2015 Posted July 10, 2015 I agree with almost everything you said except for this little bit. Be realistic. Seriously who wants to be that ? I'm completely unrealistic about my future and what I will achieve .... but I don't desire to be there now. I'm happy exactly where I am and focused on the now. Future will come to pass eventually. Isn't that what 'being realistic' means? Why would being realistic carry negative connotations? Things are what they are. It's wanting things to be what they aren't that brings stress. Acceptance, joyful, serene contented acceptance of what is, is being realistic. No? For me the key is just not to focus constantly on the future, grasping for what you desire and being unhappy with what you have now. You can tell the universe what you would like to see in the future .... then just let go of how it comes to pass. Stop trying to "force" it to happen when and how you want it to and and just sit back go with the flow of life and accept that it will come to pass eventually. Because trying not to desire has the exact same effect as grasping for desire. It is just as painful to try and deliberately squash a dream as it is to grasp for it. Got to find the middle way Key point. Nailed it. 1
Justanaverageguy Posted July 10, 2015 Posted July 10, 2015 Isn't that what 'being realistic' means? Why would being realistic carry negative connotations? Things are what they are. It's wanting things to be what they aren't that brings stress. Acceptance, joyful, serene contented acceptance of what is, is being realistic. No? Yes true and totally agree it shouldn't be meant as a negative - but for most people when you say "be realistic" it has an inferred meaning of "lower your expectations".
TaraMaiden2 Posted July 10, 2015 Posted July 10, 2015 Yes true and totally agree it shouldn't be meant as a negative - but for most people when you say "be realistic" it has an inferred meaning of "lower your expectations". Well, I see your point. But the problem is, that so many people have high expectations, don't they? They perpetually look to the future, wanting it to be better than the past. So they have high expectations and desires, wants....hopes.... and fail to look at 'here', while looking at 'there'. So yes, in a way it may well mean lowering their sights. But that's not necessarily a bad thing. That's doing what's do-able.... For example, I have not actually had any form of holiday... getting away from it all...leisure break.... time off to chillax..... for 5 years. I occasionally yearn to see the sea again, visit a hot, sandy beach, and swim....to visit my cousins in the hotter realms of Europe.... But finances dictate that's not going to happen any time soon. But the weather here today, is glorious. It's warm, sunny and I have a nice garden. I'm currently doing some washing, which I can hang out to dry. And that's it. So might as well get the best out of today, because that's all I got! 2
Ronni_W Posted July 10, 2015 Posted July 10, 2015 (The true "power" to manifest the abundant life does not come from the outer mind just saying positive affirmations, or whatever) Then where does it come from? From your experiences with the subject what has brought abundance into your life? Well...that's the thing. I've recently gotten into studying it because I realized that I want MORE...I want real, true, lasting abundance in my life. It's led me to Ascended Master teachings on "precipitation" - instantaneous manifestation - whatever you want to call it. The kind of stuff a rather famous guy did on Earth about two-thousand years ago. The power comes from...the place that he talked about. So I've decided to learn how to harness that same power. Do the works that he did; and greater works than he did. That sort of thing. This is a link to a PDF for the first book that I read, along those lines: The Seven Mighty Elohim Speak on the Seven Steps to Precipitation Then I bought the book 'Saint Germain on Alchemy'. There's also a series called something like 'Master Keys to the Abundant Life' by Kim Michaels - I've not bought the book(s), but have listened to some of the chapters. Not that positive affirmations are totally useless. But it really seems to me that one needs to have an abundance consciousness - through all levels of our being - identity, mental and emotional; and not just at the physical/material/outer-mind level, which is what is accessed through positive talking-and-thinking. As far as I can tell, at this point in my studies/journey.
Justanaverageguy Posted July 10, 2015 Posted July 10, 2015 (edited) Well, I see your point. But the problem is, that so many people have high expectations, don't they? They perpetually look to the future, wanting it to be better than the past. So they have high expectations and desires, wants....hopes.... and fail to look at 'here', while looking at 'there'. So yes, in a way it may well mean lowering their sights. But that's not necessarily a bad thing. That's doing what's do-able.... For example, I have not actually had any form of holiday... getting away from it all...leisure break.... time off to chillax..... for 5 years. I occasionally yearn to see the sea again, visit a hot, sandy beach, and swim....to visit my cousins in the hotter realms of Europe.... But finances dictate that's not going to happen any time soon. But the weather here today, is glorious. It's warm, sunny and I have a nice garden. I'm currently doing some washing, which I can hang out to dry. And that's it. So might as well get the best out of today, because that's all I got! I totally agree with your idea of focusing on the now and being grateful for what you have - but - I still believe you actually NEED high expectations for the future plus a little patience. In fact I think when you truly have this - not even just high expectation but a deep knowing - it takes the focus off the future because you know its going to be great so you don't need to worry about it. It allows you to focus on now. I mean remember when you were a little kid and it was Christmas eve ? Wasn't that just the most amazing night ever ? The nervous anticipation, you are so excited. You have an amazing dinner with your whole family, sing Christmas carols. People who normally fight don't - everyone is happy and joyous. Everyone is in the NOW. You are so alive and have so much energy that you can't even sleep. You know tomorrow is just going to be amazing no matter what happens! Remember what that felt like not to "worry" about what was going to happen tomorrow because whatever happened it would be amazing ? Thats high expectations. That is knowing its all going to be great no matter what happens tomorrow rain, hale or shine. Probably the only time I ever saw that situation fail is when you see that one little spoilt kid who was unhappy and "demanded" his present right now. He grasped for it. That's why you just need a little bit of patience so you can wait for the universe to deliver the amazing future So you said the problem is that people have high expectations for the future ... I think it is the exact opposite. They are "realistic" and expect the worst and so they worry about it - constantly. They think of the obstacles and problems that will stop them achieving their goals instead of knowing just go with the flow and it will all just turn out amazing like Christmas day does. That is also the reason why most people don't actually do what they truly want with their life. They are being realistic. I like to ask people I meet a specific question. What would you do with your life if you won 100 million dollars tomorrow ? They usually tell me how they would spend it and I interrupt and say - No what would you actually do with the rest of your life - not what would you do with the money. The answer they give is essentially their dream job - their dream way to spend their life. When I ask them why they are not doing it 99% of the time they will tell me because it is unrealistic to expect I can either get that job or do that job and make enough money to survive. They don't have high expectations so they settle for something less then they truly want. The thing is it really isn't that unrealistic. It is always something related to being creative in the arts, starting their own business or helping other people, animals or the environment. If they had spent the amount of time trying to become a writer or start their own business with animals instead of being a banker which they hate .... they would have been successful. Realistic is an excuse not to follow your true passion and dream. Like I said earlier - It is just as painful to try and deliberately squash a dream as it is to grasp for it. Unrealistic is just the excuse most people use to squash theirs. Edited July 10, 2015 by Justanaverageguy
kendahke Posted July 10, 2015 Posted July 10, 2015 No, it doesn't. Happiness requires an open mind that actually releases all expectations. Hope is an empty wish. It has no future, because once you develop Hope, you already want something. Something you have no way of telling, is attainable. All yearnings, all desires, all pinned to some point you have absolutely no way of knowing you will reach; you want life to be worth living? Make it so, NOW. You want adversity to pass? Compare your life to someone who HAS no shoes. Hope your dreams will come true? Be realistic. Achieve the achievable, NOW. Dreams are fine, but they are for those who do not 'awaken'. And that is precisely why people cling, grasp and desire things they desperately want. This - ^^ THIS - ^^ is precisely what the Buddha was speaking about. That is exactly why people 'Suffer'. Because they cling, and grasp desperately, to Hope. Hope doesn't keep you going. Hope pulls you back. Exactly. There's hope and then there's psychotic hope.
TaraMaiden2 Posted July 10, 2015 Posted July 10, 2015 I totally agree with your idea of focusing on the now and being grateful for what you have - but - I still believe you actually NEED high expectations for the future plus a little patience. ...... <snip> .....Unrealistic is just the excuse most people use to squash theirs. Yes, I see what you're saying. (I didn't re-post your whole comment, no point....) You make for some very sound argument. My take is not so much "Hope for the best but prepare for the worst".... not even that you're saying that... but I have gradually come to follow what I finally realise Kipling meant when he wrote - "If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster And treat those two impostors just the same...." In other words, for my part, I have come to understand that Life is just like a shopping cart - you go partly where you want to, and partly where the damned thing takes you. But wherever you go, whatever the outcome, you must accept that sometimes you're the windshield and sometimes you're the fly, and that in every and all things, 'this too shall pass.' You won/succeeded/achieved your goal? Well done, congratulations. This too shall pass. You lost/failed/missed the mark? So sorry, commiserations. This too shall pass. It seems a depressing way to live, but honestly, it isn't because such an attitude keeps me buoyant, and accepting what comes to pass with an embracing willingness to enjoy the moment, is a sure-fire way of rescuing myself from the wallowing mire of self-pity. Strive for your ideal, but live life as if you had just one more day to live. Because one day - it will be true.
TouchedByViolet Posted July 10, 2015 Posted July 10, 2015 No, it doesn't. Happiness requires an open mind that actually releases all expectations. Hope is an empty wish. It has no future, because once you develop Hope, you already want something. Something you have no way of telling, is attainable. All yearnings, all desires, all pinned to some point you have absolutely no way of knowing you will reach; you want life to be worth living? Make it so, NOW. You want adversity to pass? Compare your life to someone who HAS no shoes. Hope your dreams will come true? Be realistic. Achieve the achievable, NOW. Dreams are fine, but they are for those who do not 'awaken'. And that is precisely why people cling, grasp and desire things they desperately want. This - ^^ THIS - ^^ is precisely what the Buddha was speaking about. That is exactly why people 'Suffer'. Because they cling, and grasp desperately, to Hope. Hope doesn't keep you going. Hope pulls you back. Yes, I see what you're saying. (I didn't re-post your whole comment, no point....) You make for some very sound argument. My take is not so much "Hope for the best but prepare for the worst".... not even that you're saying that... but I have gradually come to follow what I finally realise Kipling meant when he wrote - "If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster And treat those two impostors just the same...." In other words, for my part, I have come to understand that Life is just like a shopping cart - you go partly where you want to, and partly where the damned thing takes you. But wherever you go, whatever the outcome, you must accept that sometimes you're the windshield and sometimes you're the fly, and that in every and all things, 'this too shall pass.' You won/succeeded/achieved your goal? Well done, congratulations. This too shall pass. You lost/failed/missed the mark? So sorry, commiserations. This too shall pass. It seems a depressing way to live, but honestly, it isn't because such an attitude keeps me buoyant, and accepting what comes to pass with an embracing willingness to enjoy the moment, is a sure-fire way of rescuing myself from the wallowing mire of self-pity. Strive for your ideal, but live life as if you had just one more day to live. Because one day - it will be true. You seem to be advocating a type of indifference toward the outcomes in life. That is fundamentally flawed and not part of the human experience. Expectations, results and corrections are necessary to learn and improve. I want to feel alive not numb. Also, though I acknowledge the importance of the present the future is just as important. We, as the human race, attempt to build, plan, create, and structure a world that we believe is stable/reliable for us and our loved ones. Too much focus on the present doesn't allow for a preparation for the future.
TaraMaiden2 Posted July 10, 2015 Posted July 10, 2015 You seem to be advocating a type of indifference toward the outcomes in life. That is fundamentally flawed and not part of the human experience. Expectations, results and corrections are necessary to learn and improve. I want to feel alive not numb. Indifference is entirely the wrong word. You totally misunderstand. It is not indifference we must develop but acceptance of the way things are, because they are the way thy are. This means also developing and cultivating Compassion, kindness and assistance for those who patently have a worse deal than we have. And there is ALWAYS a person nearby who could do with a hand up... EXPERIENCES are what is necessary to improve. Expectations, results and corrections are what happen to us, sometimes without our agreement or bidding. Sometimes they are things we implement, according to necessity. It is learning to accept outcomes and abiding serenely with what happens around us, that matters. Never have I felt more alive, than when I have gladly surrendered to life's evolution of experiences. Also, though I acknowledge the importance of the present the future is just as important. We, as the human race, attempt to build, plan, create, and structure a world that we believe is stable/reliable for us and our loved ones. Too much focus on the present doesn't allow for a preparation for the future. Too much focus on the future makes people forget that all they truly have is the present. Every thought we have, is based either on memory or desired outcome. There is usually little or no room for present contentment and most people do not reside in the present. I think, to be honest if you investigate, most people's minds are anywhere but here and now. They are either thinking about someone else, someone in the past, or someone in the future. Something they wish they had said; something they would like to say; something about someone else that is critical or judgemental. Very few people will ever say they are considering the peace of a present moment. So while I can understand your saying Too much focus on the present doesn't allow for a preparation for the future. ...You will very rarely find anyone ever does focus on the present.
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