Did I deserve so much punishment?

[remorseful_tab]

Today H called. He called to say to pack the things our son would need this weekend. He said come Friday he will directly pick our son from school and take him to his apartment and on Monday he will drop him directly to school.

 

He doesn't even want to see my face. This hurts!

[DKT3]

A betrayal on this level NEVER goes away, and it plays a part in many decisions you make going forward. As wrong as it maybe, I've found myself using it as an excuse for things I've done since. This sh*t doesn't go away, sure you may think it does, you want it to but it doesn't. Things can be going great then she gets a wrong number call, or it takes her 2 hours to go to the store when she said she would be back in 1. Sitting down to enjoy some down time and finding that the women on the show is cheating on her husband. When there is something sexual she doesn't want to do and you ask yourself "did she tell him no".

 

All the best intentions in the world WS or BS doesn't make this sh*t go away. 8 mo or 8 years. No one here can truly claim it does or they wouldn't be here.

[DKT3]

Today H called. He called to say to pack the things our son would need this weekend. He said come Friday he will directly pick our son from school and take him to his apartment and on Monday he will drop him directly to school.

 

He doesn't even want to see my face. This hurts!

 

His actions show a great deal of anger. I'm sorry your going through this, but its time to start protecting yourself.

 

When I divorced my WW, by the time she got served I was no longer angry, I had dealt with that and it was 14 months removed. I just can't get pass the feeling that something else happened. It maybe something that you are not aware of. There is so much disgust for you in his action.

 

Did he actually say he doesn't want to see your face.

[remorseful_tab]

Did he actually say he doesn't want to see your face.

 

No.

 

I thought he will be coming by the house to pick him up and drop him in the house Sunday night.

[Clay]

Today H called. He called to say to pack the things our son would need this weekend. He said come Friday he will directly pick our son from school and take him to his apartment and on Monday he will drop him directly to school.

 

He doesn't even want to see my face. This hurts!

 

Have you tried to ask him if he would sit down and talk to you? Have you called him? I understand you would like some answers. I would just tell him that. Tell him you respect his decision you would just like to talk to him so the both of you can settle some things and work out a good co parenting arrangement.

 

Who knows. He might open up to you and it will help you both move forward.

 

Clay

[TrustedthenBusted]

 

He doesn't even want to see my face. This hurts!

 

Sorry to hear that. I'm watching a good friend go through this the last couple years. Her husband seems as pissed off today as he was on D-Day, to the detriment of their kid, if you ask me.

 

Nobody can tell him when or how to heal, but he's a pretty stubborn, prideful guy, and even though he's already remarried, he still hangs on to the anger and disdain.

 

Hope you don't end up in this situation.

 

Man, if we could only take it all back eh?

[drifter777]

A betrayal on this level NEVER goes away, and it plays a part in many decisions you make going forward. As wrong as it maybe, I've found myself using it as an excuse for things I've done since. This sh*t doesn't go away, sure you may think it does, you want it to but it doesn't. Things can be going great then she gets a wrong number call, or it takes her 2 hours to go to the store when she said she would be back in 1. Sitting down to enjoy some down time and finding that the women on the show is cheating on her husband. When there is something sexual she doesn't want to do and you ask yourself "did she tell him no".

 

All the best intentions in the world WS or BS doesn't make this sh*t go away. 8 mo or 8 years. No one here can truly claim it does or they wouldn't be here.

 

I did exactly the same thing. Like your husband, I was focusing all my energy on healing and I knew that strict NC was the best way.

 

Prepare yourself for divorce because he is.

[gettingstronger]

A betrayal on this level NEVER goes away, and it plays a part in many decisions you make going forward. As wrong as it maybe, I've found myself using it as an excuse for things I've done since. This sh*t doesn't go away, sure you may think it does, you want it to but it doesn't. Things can be going great then she gets a wrong number call, or it takes her 2 hours to go to the store when she said she would be back in 1. Sitting down to enjoy some down time and finding that the women on the show is cheating on her husband. When there is something sexual she doesn't want to do and you ask yourself "did she tell him no".

 

All the best intentions in the world WS or BS doesn't make this sh*t go away. 8 mo or 8 years. No one here can truly claim it does or they wouldn't be here.

 

 

 

This x100- I tell my husband, its like bamboo- shoots every freaking place you look!

[HereNorThere]

Take the 8 years for what is really was - a beautiful, selfless gift to you and your child.

 

The affair is definitely the catalyst that started the reaction, but truthfully, you two just have different personality types. He's an altruistic man who is willing to sacrifice is own needs for the greater good of others. He sacrificed 8 years of his life so that you didn't have to raise a one year old on your own; so that your child grew up with the concept of having a real home.

 

Look at it like this, if on 9-12-2001, Osama Bin Laden sent over 20 more men to help up start picking up bricks and body parts, would the U.S. still be bitter about being attacked? Sometimes things are just so heinous, so cruel, that there's no way to walk them back. I'm not comparing what you did to that, just using hyperbole to drive home a point.

 

Reading on these boards, you start to notice that there are a lot of similarities when it comes to personality types and people capable of long-term deception. Pre-affair, the BS uses rationalization to counter the cognitive dissonance of knowing your partner has these traits. You know, the rose colored glasses of love. Once you've been stripped of this bias, your partners flaws become ever present and a lot harder to ignore. Over time resentment builds and eventually it becomes one big obligation.

 

It sounds to me stbxh is a saint. He's lived an emasculated, tormented, painful existence for the better part of a decade. He put your child's welfare above his own at points in your life where you were incapable of it. Want to do something redeeming? Don't add insult to injury by taking him to the cleaners in the divorce. Take your half and walk away a better person. I'm sure you have learned and experienced personal growth over the last 8 years, but unfortunately this looks like something you aren't going to be able to put back together.

 

Godspeed and I do hope that you have healthier relationships in the future. Some people really do learn their lesson and I hope you're one of them.

[nightmare01]

A betrayal on this level NEVER goes away, and it plays a part in many decisions you make going forward. As wrong as it maybe, I've found myself using it as an excuse for things I've done since. This sh*t doesn't go away, sure you may think it does, you want it to but it doesn't. Things can be going great then she gets a wrong number call, or it takes her 2 hours to go to the store when she said she would be back in 1. Sitting down to enjoy some down time and finding that the women on the show is cheating on her husband. When there is something sexual she doesn't want to do and you ask yourself "did she tell him no".

 

All the best intentions in the world WS or BS doesn't make this sh*t go away. 8 mo or 8 years. No one here can truly claim it does or they wouldn't be here.

 

I agree.. it never goes away - but I think that some WS have this concept of "over it"... in that they believe their BS can be "over it". And when a WS believes this, they get sloppy.. and old habits resurface.. and the newly founded boundaries can become weak, or dissolve all together.

 

And maybe this is what happened to the Remorseful_Tab's BS.

 

A revival of old habits can trigger old memories in the BS.. and that leads to suspicions. If the Remorseful_Tab got lazy.. maybe she got too familiar with another man. Maybe she did something that made him she is still thinking of her OM.. and maybe he went into detective mode.. and found this letter..

 

A letter would be bad - but she could have confronted that situation and eased it by saying it was in the past and was filled with self delusion.. It would still hurt and take some time to get over, but it could have been handled.

 

But couple the letter with a revival of old habits and you have the perfect storm.

 

I am 14 YEARS beyond Dday, and there isn't a single day that passes that my WW's LTA doesn't cross my mind. Most of the time it's a fleeting memory tinged with regret and some small amount of pain, and I can handle it. But it never goes away, and I will NEVER be "over it".

 

Trust NEVER comes back completely. And without trust emotional intimacy will never be what it was. After Dday I was diagnosed with PTSD, and to this day I still have triggers and flashbacks. I'm better than I was, but still..

 

We ARE reconciled, and many people - even some close friends that know of my WW's affair, think we have this great marriage. And we kinda do... but KINDA a great marriage isn't really a great marriage.

 

And I hold that trump card - should my WW do something that makes me even suspect something is up.. that she is seeing her OM again, or someone new, or if she is even holding on to happy memories with him - our marriage is over and I am out the door and down the block so fast it will make her head spin.

 

Is that unfair? maybe. But it was really unfair that she went and screwed this OM for 3 years while I took the care of the kids and earned all the money needed to keep our lifestyle going. That was unfair... and me leaving should I suspect something or if I just have enough.. that's not unfair.. it's a consequence.

[TrustedthenBusted]

I agree.. it never goes away - but I think that some WS have this concept of "over it"... in that they believe their BS can be "over it". And when a WS believes this, they get sloppy.. and old habits resurface.. and the newly founded boundaries can become weak, or dissolve all together.

 

And maybe this is what happened to the Remorseful_Tab's BS.

 

A revival of old habits can trigger old memories in the BS.. and that leads to suspicions. If the Remorseful_Tab got lazy.. maybe she got too familiar with another man. Maybe she did something that made him she is still thinking of her OM.. and maybe he went into detective mode.. and found this letter..

 

A letter would be bad - but she could have confronted that situation and eased it by saying it was in the past and was filled with self delusion.. It would still hurt and take some time to get over, but it could have been handled.

 

But couple the letter with a revival of old habits and you have the perfect storm.

 

I am 14 YEARS beyond Dday, and there isn't a single day that passes that my WW's LTA doesn't cross my mind. Most of the time it's a fleeting memory tinged with regret and some small amount of pain, and I can handle it. But it never goes away, and I will NEVER be "over it".

 

Trust NEVER comes back completely. And without trust emotional intimacy will never be what it was. After Dday I was diagnosed with PTSD, and to this day I still have triggers and flashbacks. I'm better than I was, but still..

 

We ARE reconciled, and many people - even some close friends that know of my WW's affair, think we have this great marriage. And we kinda do... but KINDA a great marriage isn't really a great marriage.

 

And I hold that trump card - should my WW do something that makes me even suspect something is up.. that she is seeing her OM again, or someone new, or if she is even holding on to happy memories with him - our marriage is over and I am out the door and down the block so fast it will make her head spin.

 

Is that unfair? maybe. But it was really unfair that she went and screwed this OM for 3 years while I took the care of the kids and earned all the money needed to keep our lifestyle going. That was unfair... and me leaving should I suspect something or if I just have enough.. that's not unfair.. it's a consequence.

 

 

Great post.

 

Reminded me of a moment we had in MC once. At some point or another I said something like " I would have taken a bullet for my wife" and the therapist immediately picked up on it and said " would you take a bullet for her today?"

 

I looked at her like she was crazy and said " no...are you fu*ck1ng kidding me?!?

 

Then of course she looked at my wife and asked her how that made her feel. After the tears, she said it made her feel sad, mostly because she ruined such a great thing.

 

The therapist asked if I ever thought I could get to the place where I'd take a bullet again. I said " I dunno...maybe a wiffle ball...then someday, perhaps maybe a bb or a nerf dart....but otherwise no. I already took the bullet, and that's why I'm here.

[oldshirt]

Remorseful Tab, just shifting gears a little bit here; What have you done to start preparing for the next steps?

 

Have you consulted an attorney yet?

 

Have you taken an assessment of your financials?

 

Have you taken any steps to protect your financial assets so he doesn't clear out the bank accounts etc and leave with with nothing?

 

Have you started taking an accounting of what personal property is yours and what is his so he doesn't start taking your stuff when he makes his permanent move?

 

Are you planning on staying in your current home or have you started looking for a new place?

 

Have you been working on a plan on get to get your son to and from school every day etc?

 

Are you currently employed or do you need to get some job training or get the resume' updated and start looking into employment possibilities?

 

What have you done thus far to start preparing for the divorce and start preparing for your post-divorce life?

[Sastrugi]

Great post.

 

Reminded me of a moment we had in MC once. At some point or another I said something like " I would have taken a bullet for my wife" and the therapist immediately picked up on it and said " would you take a bullet for her today?"

 

I looked at her like she was crazy and said " no...are you fu*ck1ng kidding me?!?

 

Then of course she looked at my wife and asked her how that made her feel. After the tears, she said it made her feel sad, mostly because she ruined such a great thing.

 

The therapist asked if I ever thought I could get to the place where I'd take a bullet again. I said " I dunno...maybe a wiffle ball...then someday, perhaps maybe a bb or a nerf dart....but otherwise no. I already took the bullet, and that's why I'm here.

 

 

Nightmare and Trusted, right on man. I get it too.

I have got to figure out how to inject trusteds quote into mc today:cool:.

 

OP, your husband may have triggered badly. The anger you describe is the anger I felt right after my trigger, many year later. This trigger happened 25 years after the fact. I was making exit plans. Some how i found myself in IC, from there MC. it took a lot of work on my part to tamp the anger back down. Was it fair to my wife after 25 years, hell no. Totally caught her blindsided. Yet my pain was real and my determination to exit our marriage was real. I am in a much better place today.

 

If you guys are not to far gone I have a suggestion-

I know your husband doesn't want to do mc, but negotiate with him, tell him if he goes to 3 MC sessions you will process the divorce as smoothly and as fairly as possible if that is what he wants.

 

It is probably a long shot, but for my wife and I, the MC was able to get us to have a conversation that we would not have had otherwise. Which made me reconsider all of my plans...

 

Good luck and all the best.

 

S.

[ladydesigner]

Great post.

 

Reminded me of a moment we had in MC once. At some point or another I said something like " I would have taken a bullet for my wife" and the therapist immediately picked up on it and said " would you take a bullet for her today?"

 

I looked at her like she was crazy and said " no...are you fu*ck1ng kidding me?!?

 

Then of course she looked at my wife and asked her how that made her feel. After the tears, she said it made her feel sad, mostly because she ruined such a great thing.

 

The therapist asked if I ever thought I could get to the place where I'd take a bullet again. I said " I dunno...maybe a wiffle ball...then someday, perhaps maybe a bb or a nerf dart....but otherwise no. I already took the bullet, and that's why I'm here.

 

Great post!

 

I would never take a bullet for my WH now. I would have pre-Dday though.

[TrustedthenBusted]

Great post!

 

I would never take a bullet for my WH now. I would have pre-Dday though.

 

Yep. Now this isn't to say that I don't love her, and want good things for her and I still work very hard to protect and provide, and show love, and care and all the stuff that goes with being a good husband and partner to her.

 

But.... it's just different now.

 

Where before I NEVER would have considered divorce under any circumstances, I now see it as a potential reality, and I understand why so many people choose it.

 

Affairs do one thing. They let you know that your partner doesn't put YOU first. They put themselves first. And it forever calls into question whether they'd actually take that bullet for YOU.

 

I got my answer on D-Day.

 

I'm ok with the situation the way it is now, because the chips are on the table, and we both know that it takes work, honesty, and commitment if we want to keep this going. It no longer survives on blind trust and faith.

[World's.Edge]

And I hold that trump card - should my WW do something that makes me even suspect something is up.. that she is seeing her OM again, or someone new, or if she is even holding on to happy memories with him - our marriage is over and I am out the door and down the block so fast it will make her head spin.

Yeah, doubt it. I've read your story and followed some of your posts. Your wife had a 9-11 year affair (6+ emotional, 3+ physical).. which is actually longer than some marriages last. You've said she's shown little remorse, blameshifts and that what she did still haunts/is with you all the time to some extent. If you haven't left by now, accept that you're never going to leave.

[Clay]

Yeah' date=' doubt it. I've read your story and followed some of your posts. Your wife had a 9-11 year affair (6+ emotional, 3+ physical).. which is actually longer than some marriages last. You've said she's shown little remorse, blameshifts and that what she did still haunts/is with you all the time to some extent. If you haven't left by now, accept that you're never going to leave.[/quote']

 

Wow that is harsh. Each person has to choose there own path in life.

 

C

[ladydesigner]

Yeah' date=' doubt it. I've read your story and followed some of your posts. Your wife had a 9-11 year affair (6+ emotional, 3+ physical).. which is actually longer than some marriages last. You've said she's shown little remorse, blameshifts and that what she did still haunts/is with you all the time to some extent. If you haven't left by now, accept that you're never going to leave.[/quote']

 

He can leave at any time and yes the BS holds the trump card in R, always!

[Noirek]

I agree.. it never goes away - but I think that some WS have this concept of "over it"... in that they believe their BS can be "over it". And when a WS believes this, they get sloppy.. and old habits resurface.. and the newly founded boundaries can become weak, or dissolve all together.

 

And maybe this is what happened to the Remorseful_Tab's BS.

 

A revival of old habits can trigger old memories in the BS.. and that leads to suspicions. If the Remorseful_Tab got lazy.. maybe she got too familiar with another man. Maybe she did something that made him she is still thinking of her OM.. and maybe he went into detective mode.. and found this letter..

 

A letter would be bad - but she could have confronted that situation and eased it by saying it was in the past and was filled with self delusion.. It would still hurt and take some time to get over, but it could have been handled.

 

But couple the letter with a revival of old habits and you have the perfect storm.

 

I am 14 YEARS beyond Dday, and there isn't a single day that passes that my WW's LTA doesn't cross my mind. Most of the time it's a fleeting memory tinged with regret and some small amount of pain, and I can handle it. But it never goes away, and I will NEVER be "over it".

 

Trust NEVER comes back completely. And without trust emotional intimacy will never be what it was. After Dday I was diagnosed with PTSD, and to this day I still have triggers and flashbacks. I'm better than I was, but still..

 

We ARE reconciled, and many people - even some close friends that know of my WW's affair, think we have this great marriage. And we kinda do... but KINDA a great marriage isn't really a great marriage.

 

And I hold that trump card - should my WW do something that makes me even suspect something is up.. that she is seeing her OM again, or someone new, or if she is even holding on to happy memories with him - our marriage is over and I am out the door and down the block so fast it will make her head spin.

 

Is that unfair? maybe. But it was really unfair that she went and screwed this OM for 3 years while I took the care of the kids and earned all the money needed to keep our lifestyle going. That was unfair... and me leaving should I suspect something or if I just have enough.. that's not unfair.. it's a consequence.

 

That's not a trump card. Thats a deal breaker if the affair behaviour is continued. A trump card is what you use to always have the moral high ground and to throw down and "win" even if it is unrelated to the affair or really your own behaviour. Anything and everything negative that happens in the marriage will always point back to the affair. And giving that up one day isn't about "getting over it". It is about letting the marriage be between equal partners again. Anybody at anytime can exit a marriage. It is the beauty of divorce. But in true R, one doesn't sit on the affair card as there wAy out at any point without personal responsibility for their negative actions that mAy have contributed to the deciline of the marriage ten years after DDay. And that is my point that was being twisted into "get over it" by people. It has nothing to do with the hard work of R, a return of affair behaviour, or even experiencing pain of the A for the rest of your life. But I know we will never agree on this. I only hoped to clarify that "get over it" and having deal breakers.

[Noirek]

 

If you guys are not to far gone I have a suggestion-

I know your husband doesn't want to do mc, but negotiate with him, tell him if he goes to 3 MC sessions you will process the divorce as smoothly and as fairly as possible if that is what he wants.

 

It is probably a long shot, but for my wife and I, the MC was able to get us to have a conversation that we would not have had otherwise. Which made me reconsider all of my plans...

 

Good luck and all the best.

 

S.

 

I think this would seem like a threat. If there is to be any counselling it should be IC and coparenting. If he has had no interest for the last 8 years though, I doubt he will now. Some people don't believe in therapy. And some people don't think they need it.

[bigman1]

I don't want to get off track but I had to reply to the comment that the BS holds the trump card in R, always. That is patently false.

 

R only happens if both parties want it. Both of them have equal power. If the BS wants to quit, then its over. If the WS wants to quit, then its over. Marriage is a contract, legally speaking. IF one party does not wish to continue, then its over. They each have equal rights of negation.

 

If the WS gets tired of that, R ends. If the WS goes underground, R never began. If the WS says its got to stop or they are walking, the BS relents. At the same time, the BS may decide its a deal breaker and R ends. The BS may decide that the WS is not remorseful enough, R ends. The BS declines to relent on policing the WS and forces the WS to leave. In either scenario, each party has equal rights of rejection of R.

 

No one has the upper hand, as a practical matter.

[TrustedthenBusted]

 

No one has the upper hand, as a practical matter.

 

Totally agree with this. There is no real upper hand. And any BS who expects his WS to suffer with mistreatment for the rest of their lives together will learn this the hard way.

 

That said, in the majority of cases, it is the Wayward spouse who is more on the hook if the marriage is to be saved. I would suspect more BS' pull the plug down the line like the OP is experiencing than the other way around.

 

In that sense, it's as if the WS has to hand the BS a loaded gun, and just hope they never pull the trigger.

 

I know my wife feels this way. She is concerned that I may decide way down the line that enough is enough. And I think she is more concerned about that than she is about her own choice to call it quits.

Edited July 23, 2015 by TrustedthenBusted

[ladydesigner]

I don't want to get off track but I had to reply to the comment that the BS holds the trump card in R, always. That is patently false.

 

R only happens if both parties want it. Both of them have equal power. If the BS wants to quit, then its over. If the WS wants to quit, then its over. Marriage is a contract, legally speaking. IF one party does not wish to continue, then its over. They each have equal rights of negation.

 

If the WS gets tired of that, R ends. If the WS goes underground, R never began. If the WS says its got to stop or they are walking, the BS relents. At the same time, the BS may decide its a deal breaker and R ends. The BS may decide that the WS is not remorseful enough, R ends. The BS declines to relent on policing the WS and forces the WS to leave. In either scenario, each party has equal rights of rejection of R.

 

No one has the upper hand, as a practical matter.

 

Well my WH sure as hell doesn't have the upper hand

[World's.Edge]

He can leave at any time and yes the BS holds the trump card in R, always!

 

There shouldn't be a 'trump card' in a marriage. A trump card is used to gain an advantage over an opponent, not your husband or wife.

 

You (plural) and your spouse are supposed to be a team. The relationship should be one of partnership, not adversarial.

 

If there is a need for a trump card in the marriage then the relationship is broken and there is an imbalance, animosity, resentment or unresolved issues. You either address these issues, work through them and commit to a better marriage for both of you, or you end it.

 

A situation like nightmare01 's is... well, a nightmare. His marriage is basically a prison of quiet torment and outrage and he is his own warden.

 

He bears the pain and suffers the actions of his wife while she is unaffected and unencumbered. She had a romantic love affair for years and when it ended, she still maintained the security, lifestyle, comfort and concenience of marriage.

 

If your spouse cheats (especially a decade [+] long affair) and you can't hold them accounable, administer any significant consequences or communicate to them you despair and indignation and work on the marriage, then chances are that you don't have the mettle and resolve to be out the door and down the block so fast it will make her head spin at the slightest infraction.

 

It's all just boast and false bravado.. holding a "trump card" that will never be in play.

Edited July 23, 2015 by World's.Edge

[ladydesigner]

If there is a need for a trump card in the marriage then the relationship is broken and there is an imbalance' date=' animosity, resentment or unresolved issues. You either address these issues, work through them and commit to a better marriage for both of you, or you end it..[/quote']

 

Yes you could say I have a lot of animosity and resentment after being in False R for 2 years, it's a little hard to come back from.

 

Most likely I will end up pulling the plug or my WH, either way it was HIS actions that caused the demise of our M.