Do most [affairs] go undetected?

[cocorico]

Ours would have remained undetected had my H (fMM) not disclosed it to his xBW as his motivation for dumping her. Even then, she chose not to believe him. It was only being faced with the continued reality of us marrying and living together in continued happiness, and the kids choosing to live with us, etc, that forced her to acknowledge that it might have been true.

 

I think many As do go undetected - there are several cases of BWs discovering on the reading of their deceased H's will that he made generous provision for his second family that the BW had no idea existed; similarly, cases where friends and colleagues express condolences to someone else at the funeral, and the BW discovers that this is the OW; also cases where children go through the paperwork after a parent's death (to settle the estate) and come across old letters, photos, etc that evidence an affair between the deceased parent and a paramour... It certainly happens.

 

Equally, there are many cases where others know - the extended family, circle of friends or colleagues who provide cover for the A, or act as a sympathetic ear for the conflicted WS or AP, or who legitimise the A in other ways for other reasons - but the BS is kept out of the loop. And, in some cultures, it is considered perfectly OK for men to have As as long as they don't flaunt the or GFs or As in the BWs face, so these would qualify as "undetected".

 

However, whether these amount to *most* As or not is pretty unknowable. There are no reliable stats, for obvious reasons, and any extrapolation from any existing stats is going to be so conditional as to be almost meaningless.

[ASG]

From where I sit, I'd say most infidelities go undetected. Be it the one off hook up or the long standing affair.

 

Just the other day I was talking to a friend about this friend of his. The guy has 3 girlfriends. 2 "serious", one more casual. None of them know about the others. And he has been doing it forever.

 

I know many many other guys who have cheated repeatedly, sometimes with one partner, other times with several partners, as more of a hook up than a proper affair.

They have never been found out.

[minimariah]

When you finish moving from most to many (which you have now done)...

 

sorry -- i'm back to the most again & sticking with that opinion.

 

You have both said that this is in fact what MOST BS's do.

 

we did - in a situation with an undetected A, as in A that are never exposed or discovered. we never said anything about the BSs in general, in every possible situation. & again - sticking with that opinion. when talking about BSs in general (about infidelity in general) than most do pay attention, suspect, dig, look & find -- so the A gets exposed & detected as a result.

 

And I simply do not see any evidence...

 

i do (the only "evidence" you can have in an infidelity is experience, really) -- and my experience with infidelity goes far beyond an internet forum & my own personal one.

 

thank you.

Edited July 22, 2015 by minimariah

[DKT3]

I absolutely didn't mean that BS's are ok with it or turned a blind eye.

 

What I'm saying (and I will use myself as an example) is often a BS will have a gut feeling that something is off and ignore small warning signs that point to infidelity. Then once the proof is there 100% it dawns on you that you've really known the entire time. After taking a few days alone thinking and refecting I could pinpoint the start of her affair as well as the end.

 

I believe (and I firmly stand behind my wording) that its RARE when a BS is totally blindsided by an affair. What we has BS's tend to do is deny the obvious signs until we can no longer deny. So undetected? Rarely.

 

Had lovin cleaned up her act and was able to handle the guilt its very likely I would have never faced what had been so obvious. Blind trust, love and denial are an affairs running mates.

Edited July 22, 2015 by DKT3

[minimariah]

What I'm saying (and I will use myself as an example) is often a BS will have a gut feeling that something is off and ignore small warning signs that point to infidelity. Then once the proof is there 100% it dawns on you that you've really known the entire time. After taking a few days alone thinking and refecting I could pinpoint the start of her affair as well as the end.

 

I believe (and I firmly stand behind my wording) that its RARE when a BS is totally blindsided by an affair. What we has BS's tend to do is deny the obvious signs until we can no longer deny.

 

^^ this is exactly what i meant & tried to say, thank you.

[Furious]

do most As go undetected...?

 

i see folks getting caught all the time, As discovered all the time & a lot of BS who choose to look the other way.

 

 

Can you clarify the above statement.

Edited July 23, 2015 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Fix Quote

[minimariah]

do most As go undetected...?

 

i see folks getting caught all the time, As discovered all the time & a lot of BS who choose to look the other way. /QUOTE]

 

 

Can you clarify the above statement.

 

not sure what is there to clarify...?

[Furious]

do most As go undetected...?

 

i see folks getting caught all the time, As discovered all the time & a lot of BS who choose to look the other way.

 

The above "choose" implies present tense, but if you had used "chose" implies past tense.

 

That is what I would like to be clarified, are you saying that a lot of BS's look the other way after the affair is discovered?.

[fellini]

I think it's completely possible what you say, and I don't doubt it happens.

 

What I think happens I would put more delicately.

 

The BS might experience something off, but NEVER imagine this is an infidelity. Because truth be told, there are lots of things that can be behind a spouse "suddenly" seeming slightly out of character. And I think it's equally true that the BS doesn't JUMP TO THE CONCLUSION that an A is in progress.

 

To this then I say, yes a BS is actually blindsided, but even though, suddenly, looking back, is able to say, like you said, THERE, THERE, and THERE.

But there was never any "ignoring" or "not paying attention" to the signs, if in fact, the very idea of cheating does not enter the BS's mind, it doesn't happen. It's a whole other ball of wax to me that if and when a Dday hits, suddenly the cables connect.

 

One of the much readwriters, I think Glass or Kirschenbaum writes about this very phenomenon, where she says, A spouse is completely in the dark about the affair, but then suddenly, on dday, already knows WHO is the AP.

 

As I have said elsewhere, the wiring in my mind that my WW was totally incapable of infidelity was so strong that when I by chance saw she left her browser open on a search result about infidelity, I automatically assumed she was doing so for a friend. I didn't even bring it up until 2 weeks later when she was about to go out for a faculty dinner and it occurred to me that the person who she was "helping out" of a marital problem would be there. So I asked. EVEN asking I was not prepared to hear "It's me". Nothing, but nothing in my body or my mind was prepared to hear that blow that stunned and paralyzed me once those words came out. And then, I knew exactly who it was.

 

We do not see things that are in front of our eyes precisely because we are always REJECTING a huge % of what we see. If we had to process 100% of what was before our eyes we would be incapable of driving a car. If we had to process 100% of every gesture of a person we have grown to know 100% of the time we would have enormous headaches.

 

If we do not connect small changes in brief instances in our spouses behaviour, unless they are huge red flags, then they pass through our world. It is as if we did not see them. Obviously, when later, their meaning is given a context, we see them clearly. But I do not put this in the category of "ignoring". Ignoring, to me anyways, is a conscious act to disregard meaningful activity. If the behaviour does not appear meaningful, there is nothing to ignore, because there is nothing to process: it goes UNNOTICED.

 

And I do firmly believe that there is a huge space in the lives of a married couple in which one partner can be doing many many many things out of sight of the other spouse, and as long as everything in the focus at home is more or less within a set of parameters of acceptability and routine, even small changes can go unnoticed.

 

 

I absolutely didn't mean that BS's are ok with it or turned a blind eye.

 

What I'm saying (and I will use myself as an example) is often a BS will have a gut feeling that something is off and ignore small warning signs that point to infidelity. Then once the proof is there 100% it dawns on you that you've really known the entire time. After taking a few days alone thinking and refecting I could pinpoint the start of her affair as well as the end.

 

I believe (and I firmly stand behind my wording) that its RARE when a BS is totally blindsided by an affair. What we has BS's tend to do is deny the obvious signs until we can no longer deny. So undetected? Rarely.

 

Had lovin cleaned up her act and was able to handle the guilt its very likely I would have never faced what had been so obvious. Blind trust, love and denial are an affairs running mates.

[minimariah]

i understand, thank you for explaining.

[Timshel]

Long term/marriage relationships become complex; an intertwined dance of obligation, responsibility and love. The layers of work/career, family, friends and children make a haystack of hide and seek for the couple.

 

Sometimes people look away. They honestly don't believe that a tryst will undo the ties that bind: In-laws, aging parents, children, financial and social obligations. I would say this assumption, for better or worse is usually correct.

 

There are some though that truly do not see. The relationship has become so detached and emotionally disconnected that they really do not have a clue. I have seen these situations as the most turbulent on Dday. For them, it has truly come out of left field and no where.

 

It begs the question though.....if you are disconnected from your SO to a point that infidelity is shocking and feel blindsided.......where were you?

Edited July 22, 2015 by Timshel

[fellini]

 

There are some though that truly do not see. The relationship has become so detached and emotionally disconnected that they really do not have a clue. I have seen these situations as the most turbulent on Dday. For them, it has truly come out of left field and no where.

 

It begs the question though.....if you are disconnected from your SO to a point that infidelity is shocking and feel blindsided.......where were you?

 

I only know people who were so in love with their spouses such that their connections prevented them (us) from believing that infidelity was a possibility. And rather than asking, "where were you" asking "how is this possible?"

[fellini]

I'm sorry fellini but in a LTR I do not see this as possible.

 

^^ exactly my thoughts. i don't know how you can possibly be in love with your spouse, connected & NOT see that something is wrong. master manipulators, fantastic actors & soci:psychopaths are actually incredibly rare, so indeed... where were you if the A came as such a huge shock? great points, Timshel.

 

You don't need to look very far. LS is full of such stories. While it might be true that for both of you this is impossible, evidently for others, myself included, it is not.

 

Probably the biggest deception I ever had was precisely that. Believing to the core something about how good our connection was, only to find out it was not about me, but about "him".

[minimariah]

You don't need to look very far. LS is full of such stories. While it might be true that for both of you this is impossible, evidently for others, myself included, it is not.

 

it's not impossible -- i'm never going to be that arrogant to think "OH, that can never happen to ME!" - maybe in future i'll be cheated on & i'll be completely blindsided and & i'll have a different experience and a different opinion. you never know. but IF i'm to be completely blindsided... then i will doubt my own presence and dedication in that relationship.

 

Probably the biggest deception I ever had was precisely that. Believing to the core something about how good our connection was, only to find out it was not about me, but about "him".

 

as far as i know - you weren't completely blindsided. i remember reading your posts because i truly think that some of your views on infidelity are fantastically correct... and if i remember well, you KNEW something was up... no? then there was that little trigger that kind of made you really doubt and you busted the A and i even remember reading how you knew who the OM was before she had even told you.

Edited July 22, 2015 by minimariah

[fellini]

No, actually I was completely and utterly and totally blindsided and floored such that when she told me "I'm seeing someone", I was gone. And I went numb and blacked out trying to block the impact of what I had heard.

 

Just as I was asking who it was, I said, don't tell me, I know. The only man who had entered into her group, and given the improbability that it was someone from outside her work, I knew it had to be him. But to say I knew before she told me is clearly not the case. There wasn't even a speck of doubt in my mind that my wife would ever do such a thing. No, I was truly blindsighted, and those around me were equally in shock that it happened. she had hidden the true extent of their time together for more than 2 years. I thought of him as merely another colleague.

 

 

as far as i know - you weren't completely blindsided. i remember reading your posts because i truly think that some of your views on infidelity are fantastically correct... and if i remember well, you KNEW something was up... no? then there was that little trigger that kind of made you really doubt and you busted the A and i even remember reading how you knew who the OM was before she had even told you.

[truncated]

I think the more someone loves their spouse, the easier it is to fool them into thinking that, while something is going on, it's not an affair.

 

A ws who is acting differently at home can pass off their erratic behavior as stress from work, tiredness, " I love you bt I am not in love with you", etc.

 

 

The last thing that a person in love suspects is that the one they love so much is capable of doing something that could hurt them so much.

 

Look at the ow/om section and there are tons of posts that contain the idea that an ow or om thinks their might lie to their spouse but never to them because they love them so much. If an ow can feel that way, even though they know the ap is cable of lying, then how is it such a stretch to think that a bs can also fall into the same trap?

 

As they say, love is blind.

[jackny123]

Of the first five guy friends of mine to get married, three were cheaters. They all cheated before they got engaged to their current wives. None were ever caught.

 

One of my best female friends cheated. I knew about it but never told her man. He later caught her by putting a keylogger on a computer which they both used. He threw her out of his place and promptly broke up with her. She got away with it for three months before being caught.

 

I once briefly dated a girl who was caught cheating with the same guy but she got away with it for 13 months before she was caught.

 

Just a sampling......I believe most people will be caught.