How do I avoid making the same mistakes again?

[elaine567]

If I tell him I got praise from a boss at work, he responds "cool" with a flat voice and face, later tells me "what are you a 5 year old? Are you expecting me to pat you on the back?"

 

 

That is because he actually hates that, he hates you doing well.

[rams10]

Rams with your guy there seems to be something really off, being him a narcissist - as he seems to not have empathy - or something else.

 

maybe? i found texts on his old phone from his ex-gf. she said she was upset that he would sleep with her, then immediately go message other girls "hey beautiful" and flirt. my bf says "I'm a liar. I like to flirt. What makes you think those things are going to change?" When i was hurt by him sneaking around my back, he said "keep effing waiting for me to apologize. Never going to happen." And sometimes he'd agree to do something with me, like go to the mall, but the whole time he'd be withdrawn and never make any real conversation or respond to what I said (this is always, not just in fights). Once I texted "hey can you come over by the women's dresses section" and tried on a dress I was considering for his work party but wasn't quite sure about - wanted another opinion. He glares, says "I don't know why I have to be up here - pick out your own dress. Can i go now?" then retreats back downstairs to wander through men's items himself. Just never seems to have awareness or care about where I am, what I'm doing. Does that make sensE?

Edited July 28, 2015 by rams10

[Itspointless]

maybe? i found texts on his old phone from his ex-gf. she said she was upset that he would sleep with her, then immediately go message other girls "hey beautiful" and flirt. my bf says "I'm a liar. I like to flirt. What makes you think those things are going to change?" When i was hurt by him sneaking around my back, he said "keep effing waiting for me to apologize. Never going to happen." And sometimes he'd agree to do something with me, like go to the mall, but the whole time he'd be withdrawn and never make any real conversation or respond to what I said (this is always, not just in fights). Once I texted "hey can you come over by the women's dresses section" and tried on a dress I was considering for his work party but wasn't quite sure about - wanted another opinion. He glares, says "I don't know why I have to be up here - pick out your own dress. Can i go now?" then retreats back downstairs to wander through men's items himself. Just never seems to have awareness or care about where I am, what I'm doing. Does that make sensE?

Well to me he doesn't make sense as I am the opposite of him. Having said that, perhaps you recognize him in this description: https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/evolution-the-self/201311/6-signs-narcissism-you-may-not-know-about or https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/stop-walking-eggshells/201112/interpersonal-exploitation-typical-narcissists

 

The most important thing though is that he is unhealthy to be around.

[rams10]

He certainly seems to have no empathy- stares at me when I seem upset or cry- no warmth, zero ability to articulate that he's proud of me or happy for me or loves me. As I said I have a very high standing job and for whatever reason I'm stuck that I can't "settle for" a man whose job is exactly the same (of course in his arrogant mind he thinks he's slightly "better"). I'm willing to put up w the emptiness bc at least on paper I have what looks good. Gives me a rush & makes me feel excited whenever he "chooses" me and I feel like I'm making progress. I tell myself I must be super special if a man who clearly "needs" no one (as evidenced by the fact that he went over 10 years without bothering to see his family ) has selected me

[Itspointless]

He certainly seems to have no empathy- stares at me when I seem upset or cry- no warmth, zero ability to articulate that he's proud of me or happy for me or loves me. As I said I have a very high standing job and for whatever reason I'm stuck that I can't "settle for" a man whose job is exactly the same (of course in his arrogant mind he thinks he's slightly "better"). I'm willing to put up w the emptiness bc at least on paper I have what looks good. Gives me a rush & makes me feel excited whenever he "chooses" me and I feel like I'm making progress. I tell myself I must be super special if a man who clearly "needs" no one (as evidenced by the fact that he went over 10 years without bothering to see his family ) has selected me

Being there, listening, empathy and communication are the basis of a good relationships. As I wrote before you seem to have some really strong convictions that do not do you a great service. In therapy you can work on these. Schema therapy goes a step further than cognitive behavioural therapy by also looking in depth why you have these convictions. We people always think we know ourselves so well, but that is a fallacy.

 

You know many people who are accomplished in business do often not get there because there are so smart. In research it is found that among top dogs they are many narcissists, psychopaths or sociopaths, because it is easy for them to be ruthless, callous and superficially charming, while having little or no regard for the feelings or needs of others.

 

Love shouldn't be a picture that you just present to the outside world and we all should be weary about people who say they do not need other people. You are triggered by red flags. I cannot say that I am not guilty of that, and therefore we need to work on that.

 

That rush you describe is the warning-sign that you must remember as your red-flag-detector. You need to push yourself to date boring people and people who perhaps seem not that accomplished to you. What seems and feels as boring really is stability.

Edited July 28, 2015 by Itspointless

[rams10]

You know many people who are accomplished in business do often not get there because there are so smart. In research it is found that among top dogs they are many narcissists, psychopaths or sociopaths, because it is easy for them to be ruthless, callous and superficially charming, while having little or no regard for the feelings or needs of others.

 

Great post and it makes me think if this is my boyfriend. He has MANY female friends with whom he'll go out for drinks or brunch, but when I met one of them recently, she mentioned he oftrn forgets all about her -- goes many weeks without responding to a single message of hers. I brought this up later and my BF declared, "She knows the way I am and accepts me for it." This friend also told me "jokingly", "We were talking about shark attacks earlier and your BF here said he'd run up to shore and save himself and not rescue his wife/kids! So you'd better watch out!!"

 

My BF may be a narcissist when his only comment to his best friend about us moving in together was "it'll be nice to only pay half rent." He led me to believe, when I asked many times over many months, that my name had been added to his apartment lease. Forwarded me a very official-looking lease. Then I find out, from talking to the online lease company, that my landlord had never even signed that document and I wasn't even on the lease. Yet my BF would collect half rent from me each month, including payment for HIS parking space, which is part of the lease -- he prohibits me from using it at any time, saying I should "Deal with my own parking" -- I pay hundreds of dollars extra for my own spot but don't ask him for $ for that.

 

I confronted him about the girl with whom he was sneaking behind my back adn flirting last summer. He said, "the funny part is you're all upset about her and she meant absolutely nothing to me. she was just someone for me to get attention from. I don't care about her anymore, she's old news, it's on to the next one to flirt with."

Edited July 28, 2015 by rams10

[Itspointless]

Great post and it makes me think if this is my boyfriend. [...] He said, "the funny part is you're all upset about her and she meant absolutely nothing to me. she was just someone for me to get attention from. I don't care about her anymore, she's old news, it's on to the next one to flirt with."

He is your boyfriend Rams, but he doesn't deserve to be.

 

All the examples you gave tell me he only cares about himself. In the one above he admits the way he thinks. If he says so than we better believe him! You noticed that the examples in the articles resembled your boyfriend? I cannot diagnose him, but this man only cares about himself and what you can add to that materially. If you want to give away money than you can better donate to a charity, than you at least know something useful is done with it.

[rams10]

Do you think people's posts on my earlier threads, about relaxing and trusting him to marry me/etc, would've been different if they'd known the full, honest truth about him and how he seemed pretty disinterested and didn't care much for me? Bc I'm starting to think I only brought up those topics bc I was desperately seeking affirmation that he cared much more about me than he did.

[Itspointless]

Do you think people's posts on my earlier threads, about relaxing and trusting him to marry me/etc, would've been different if they'd known the full, honest truth about him and how he seemed pretty disinterested and didn't care much for me? Bc I'm starting to think I only brought up those topics bc I was desperately seeking affirmation that he cared much more about me than he did.

Yes I am sure of that. I think organizedchaos wrote that some people already warned you in another thread, I haven't read those thread so I do not dare too say if they have.

 

I am sure though that in your insecurity you wrote a very negative image about yourself as clinging and demanding and probably leaving his faults, his weaknesses and most importantly how he has been treating you out of the picture. I understand thought that you wanted some relieve, but seeing the honest picture does help you more.

 

The way he treats you is not how people should be treated in a relation, not even for a platinum ring. I think everyone agrees with that.

[rams10]

I never felt we had great emotional chemistry, from the very beginning. Thought it was odd that he didn't care to really get to know me, ask any questions. Thought he seemed very closed off himself too. It was around the 9-month mark that I said "I love you," he said he "needed more time." But he hadn't said anything else emotional or positive about the relationship either unless I "prompted" it. He always seemed to just coast. And everything I said in first paragraph was true right from beginning.

[Itspointless]

I never felt we had great emotional chemistry, from the very beginning. Thought it was odd that he didn't care to really get to know me, ask any questions. Thought he seemed very closed off himself too. It was around the 9-month mark that I said "I love you," he said he "needed more time." But he hadn't said anything else emotional or positive about the relationship either unless I "prompted" it. He always seemed to just coast. And everything I said in first paragraph was true right from beginning.

That certainly wont change if did not put any effort into this so far. That means that he does and will not fulfil your emotional needs and I doubt he is capable of it to begin with. For me that is one of the most important things in a relationship: facing the world together, you are together alone

[rams10]

Should I have just let it go? When he finally told me he loved me after a year and said he wanted to marry me, then immediately texted another girl and tried to meet up w her at a bar at midnight, then kept flirting w her for a while? And deleted her texts/saved them under a guys name..

 

And he'd done the same thing once before when he delayed our date night to meet up w a single girl friend who asked him to come get a drink at work event and texted "was hoping you'd take me home after ;)". I was bothered then that he lied and said he'd come right from work, and that he deleted the texts - he felt they were something to hide?

[CarrieT]

It boggles the mind that you would *want* to marry someone who does the things he's done to you....

[Itspointless]

Should I have just let it go? When he finally told me he loved me after a year and said he wanted to marry me, then immediately texted another girl and tried to meet up w her at a bar at midnight, then kept flirting w her for a while? And deleted her texts/saved them under a guys name..

 

And he'd done the same thing once before when he delayed our date night to meet up w a single girl friend who asked him to come get a drink at work event and texted "was hoping you'd take me home after ;)". I was bothered then that he lied and said he'd come right from work, and that he deleted the texts - he felt they were something to hide?

Well it seemed he knew what to say to keep you with him to make use of your resources. You were under his spell due to his games and he knows how to use your anxiety. This man is not going to make you happy rams.

 

You still can let him go, you deserve so much better.

[rams10]

I felt like if a hotshot, successful, but cold guy who clearly didn't seem to "need" anyone (including his own family, in over 10 years!) began to show me any amount of attention or affection then it meant I was special and "chosen"

[mtnbiker3000]

It's clear that OP suffers from:

 

• Low self-esteem
  
• Low self-worth
  
• Low self-value
  
• Low self-confidence
  
• No boundaries
  

[Itspointless]

I felt like if a hotshot, successful, but cold guy who clearly didn't seem to "need" anyone (including his own family, in over 10 years!) began to show me any amount of attention or affection then it meant I was special and "chosen"

I understand that way of thinking Rams. In 2013 I met someone who was very independent and living far from her family. I wanted her to see that I would stand by her whatever happened. She was the dreamer of the two, but instead when her illness came back she pushed me away. It was not just the illness, it apparently was how she always dealt with stress. it blew my mind. It does not seem that he needs you in the way you want him to need you. Just as with me, I cannot change her. She made clear that she thought her way of doing things was normal. She told me enough that I knew that she did not want to change, just as your guy.

 

You seem to have a lot going on for you that you could be very proud of. You have to learn to see that, you do not need the challenge of making gold out of lead. He cannot change, he is like that.

[rams10]

I think you're right. I mean, a guy who really never makes plans with me, goes along for the ride, doesn't really tell me much about himself /family/his life or ask me about mine... It got confusing after a year though, because we were still together and then he finally said "I love you and I do want to marry you" back. But he only said it bc I had been upset and told him "I don't think we're on the same page." could he really have meant it when he immediately tried to meet up with another girl at a bar and continued to flirt/ask her for pics/ said they'll drink at her apartment together when she's back in town, for weeks??

[Simon Phoenix]

You need help that's above this board's paygrade. You sound like an obsessed cult member. Best of luck.

[rams10]

Look I know he was emotionless and truly didn't seem to care whether I was around or not and he snuck/deleted texts, flirting with other girl. But anything is possible right? Will he regret it and miss me if I just act completely indifferent for a while and move out? Because last time I Did this and he had competition he decided not to stay broken up w me. (Reason for that breakup was he said he doesn't value the same things as me, ie getting engaged, and he wouldn't want To do that for another 5 years. Later he went back on that and started claiming it would've been sooner if I just didn't keep bringing marriage up.)

[MidwestUSA]

Six figures? I'm gobsmacked. But this means you can afford therapy, right?

 

Oh, and move out. It's empowering to be able to grab your own toothpaste any time you like. Honestly, you're like a broken record, repeating the story of him going out with a girl after that talk. If I recall, you went off in a huff yourself, with a girlfriend. In all of two years, you have a few very specific (and minor, I might add) incidents that you're obsessed with.

 

Do you grovel for crumbs at your job as well?

[rams10]

If he'd texted a girl to go out that night, fine. But you really think it's fine for him to continue flirting, asking her for pics, and saying he'll definitely come over and drink at her apartment with her Once she's back in town? And he kept deleting the texts or changing her name to a guy friends. All this after telling me "I love you" for first tiMe which I think may ha e been just to play along since he'd never said it, or anything nice like it, in over a year of dating

[MidwestUSA]

If he'd texted a girl to go out that night, fine. But you really think it's fine for him to continue flirting, asking her for pics, and saying he'll definitely come over and drink at her apartment with her Once she's back in town? And he kept deleting the texts or changing her name to a guy friends. All this after telling me "I love you" for first tiMe which I think may ha e been just to play along since he'd never said it, or anything nice like it, in over a year of dating

 

See, you did it again. Forget that and look at the big picture.

 

And move out!

[rams10]

I just need to figure out what I did to deserve him turning on me so badly. From the beginning it was maybe 1 text a day from him, no calls, I planned and initiated the vast majority of activities. But I was unhappy from the first time he lied about working late & thus being late for our date night... When he actually met coworkers up for a drink when this one single girl friend texted him (and she also said "was hoping you'd take me home after ). The fact that he lied repeatedly to my face, "oh I came right home after work," and then deleted her texts behind my back... I felt like, if he was lying and sneaking about something minor, then maybe he'd do it with major things later too.

 

By the time we'd been dating over a year and he wouldn't say "I love you" or even anything else nice really, and refused/got mad about having any sort of discussion about future... I just couldn't help but be insecure I'm sorry :(

[lana-banana]

As the saying goes, the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. But by that definition this thread is insanity incarnate because your every post is almost exactly the same:

 

This guy (insert abominable behavior). And then when I said my feelings were hurt he (insert other abominable behavior). Is that okay? I feel like it's not okay. I just really need him to love me and want to marry me. But then the other night he (insert outrageous thing no one in their right mind would put up with). Am I right to be upset?

 

You avoid making the same mistakes by not repeating the same behavior. Unfortunately, you appear physically incapable of pattern recognition. This man does not love you now and probably has not ever loved you, which may be music to your ears since you seem to cherish your victimhood above being his girlfriend. I have no doubt a year from now you'll have a similar thread up asking if it's normal for your boyfriend to ignore you for weeks at a time.