How do I avoid making the same mistakes again?

[Itspointless]

I feel like he'll never contact me again even though he looked so sad when I left 2 weeks ago and said he just needed a little space to process with all our fights about marriage, and then we'll talk.

 

So, do you think it's possible that even though we were in a relationship for 2 years, he was just using me & never had any intent of marrying me? Bc he never, ever brought up future in any way unless I kept asking, and he hadn't said "I love you" after 14 months, and when I said this bugged me, he said it back and immediately tried to sneak out w another girl. It was confusing bc he would on occasion spend time w my family, Though he never introduced me to his. Really, right from first date he was trying hard to get me into bed & didn't initiate any sort of meaningful convo beyond our career paths. He never ever called, only texted. For our second date, best he could do was invite me over to watch q movie. But it got confusing bc eventually he did let me hang out around his friends, and you know he let me Move into his place too. So why do those things, but also not seem super interested?

Hi Rams, I do not like to say it, but yes. There are lots of people out there who unfortunately just use others. Fortunately there are also many good people out there, but it is important to protect ourselves for people who do not have our well-being high on their agenda. We can do this by learning about our own motives and how that motives have come about in our own histories. You are just like me insecure attached. Especially when you are attached in this way it is important to be very careful, as we are easy targets for users.

 

I understand that it confusing that he let you in slowly, but you can also look at it as his way to keep the convenient things close that you had to offer to him.

[rams10]

I hated that he couldn't even say basic things like "I can see us getting engaged within the next couple of years," wouldn't ask me any sort of questions about future (like "someday I want a lot of kids, you?"), and only said "whenever I decide I'm ready to get married I'll let you know." But I am so horribly sad without him and I know he said he just needs space to process all the fightibg about getting married eTc and then we'll talk. But every time I go to pick up phone I'm at a total loss for words

[Itspointless]

I hated that he couldn't even say basic things like "I can see us getting engaged within the next couple of years," wouldn't ask me any sort of questions about future (like "someday I want a lot of kids, you?"), and only said "whenever I decide I'm ready to get married I'll let you know." But I am so horribly sad without him and I know he said he just needs space to process all the fightibg about getting married eTc and then we'll talk. But every time I go to pick up phone I'm at a total loss for words

Do not confuse your sadness for love. That sadness is also because of your hopes and besides that also because our bodies are attuned to our attachment figures. Every time that we are near to them our body rewards us with a rush of pleasant hormones. During relationships it causes people to become addicted to each-other. It is why I said in a previous post that you are addicted to him. You body needs to get used to this new situation and it will, but it takes time and that is hard. But you can do it!

[rams10]

You make a very good point but I still want to talk to him, as he said we could do after he had time to process alone, and I just don't know what to say to make him realize I'm sorry. I can definitely wait to get engaged, as I've told him before- all I wanted was a general idea, like "within the next couple of years." But he's always refused, saying "I don't know, I don't know, when I decide I'll let you know, if that's not good enough for you then leave." He's tried to break up w me at least once every 2 months for the last year, citing reasons like "I don't want to hold you back bc you want to get married sooner than me," or "I don't value the same things as you- getting engaged and married- and lots of other men would value you for that."

[Itspointless]

Of-course you do, like I said we are not that different at certain things, I still would like to hear my ex saying I want you back. She did contact me a few times, but I stopped that at a certain point.

[rams10]

This can't be my life. Spending 2 years with a man who kicks me to the curb for what? Well, I told you he tried breaking up w me about once per 2 months because he thought I wanted to get married way sooner than his time frame- which, by the way, he had no time frame- any time I asked he'd say "I don't know, I'll let you know when I'm ready." Ok. What did I do wrong to deserve being tossed aside like garbage? He told me he loved Me and I had to trust that he'd marry me someday, and if I needed a more specific time frame then perhaps I should just leave him. He didn't even care on a daily basis- wouldn't spend 10 minutes a night looking up from his extra work projects to get dinner together, or go for a walk, or come to bed with me. What makes me so horrific that he'd treat his girlfriend like this? And what do I say to him later, since he said he just needs space to process everything w the constant fights about marriage and then we'll talk? I still think it's stupid because they shouldn't have been fights- he couldn't even discuss future in general terms without getting mad and ignoring me for days, staring at wall. It's so wrong to want to know if he thinks a few more years, 5 years, etc before he's ready to get married? He thinks he should just keep me paying half his rent & having sex with him totally indefinitely?

[Itspointless]

This can't be my life. Spending 2 years with a man who kicks me to the curb for what? […] What did I do wrong to deserve being tossed aside like garbage?

This is only part of a period of your life Rams. Life will be different. You though by working hard and accepting a lot that he would change his mind, but it does not work like that. He does not sound like somehow who is open to look and work on himself, which means that he always will be like this. Usually people like that are really good at blaming others.

He didn't even care on a daily basis- wouldn't spend 10 minutes a night looking up from his extra work projects to get dinner together, or go for a walk, or come to bed with me. […]He thinks he should just keep me paying half his rent & having sex with him totally indefinitely?

I think you have all the right to be angry.

 

What does you counsellor say about all this?

[Mondmellonw]

This is only part of a period of your life Rams. Life will be different. You though by working hard and accepting a lot that he would change his mind, but it does not work like that. He does not sound like somehow who is open to look and work on himself, which means that he always will be like this. Usually people like that are really good at blaming others.

 

I think you have all the right to be angry.

 

What does you counsellor say about all this?

 

How are you doing, Rams? I hope you're O.K.

 

I just wanted to say that I agree with Itspointless, people like this always go on with their life blaming others for their horrible behavior. There was really nothing you could have done to change that.

[rams10]

Thank you. Part of me feels like, wasn't it obvious to me that he wasn't really into me when he didn't say "i love you" or talk about future in 14 months, and when I brought this up he finally said it back & then immediately snuck out w another girl? Didn't I know when after 2 years the best he could offer was "I will marry you someday, when I'm ready I'll let you know"- couldn't even give me a general timeline like "it'll happen within the next several years"- that he wasn't serious? Maybe I missed all the signs? Does he realize he's commitment phobic- is that what he meant by "I just need some time alone to process everything w all our fighting about marriage etc, and then we can talk"?

[Itspointless]

Thank you. Part of me feels like, wasn't it obvious to me that he wasn't really into me when he didn't say "i love you" or talk about future in 14 months, and when I brought this up he finally said it back & then immediately snuck out w another girl? Didn't I know when after 2 years the best he could offer was "I will marry you someday, when I'm ready I'll let you know"- couldn't even give me a general timeline like "it'll happen within the next several years"- that he wasn't serious? Maybe I missed all the signs? Does he realize he's commitment phobic- is that what he meant by "I just need some time alone to process everything w all our fighting about marriage etc, and then we can talk"?

The majority of people deny everything about themselves that doesn't seem that great. Yes he is emotionally unavailable, but I don't know if he is commitment phobic.

 

Rams I wonder if you can relate to the quotes below?

 

One of the key features of a ... is their desire to feel like they are in high demand. They like to feel like they have many options and you should be happy they chose you. The ... feels an intense euphoria and a sense of power when they can turn people against each other, especially when it’s over a competition for them. ... will manufacture situations to make you jealous and question their fidelity. In a normal relationship, people go out of their way to prove that they are trustworthy—but the ... does exactly the opposite. They are constantly suggesting that they might be pursuing other options, or spending time with other people, so that you can never settle down into a feeling of peace. And they will always deny this, calling you crazy for bringing it up.

 

[…]

 

They will do anything in their power to make their "significant other" feel insignificant, to maintain their emotional distance and control while continuing the relationship simply for its convenience. You absolutely have no idea what happened for you to become devalued from that "special person" in their lives, to an "insignificant other." It is all terribly confusing. When you try to bring it up, or discuss anything with the … your concerns are belittled or met with outright denial. There is no apparent intent on working anything out, and if you insist on resolving any issues you might have, you'll most likely be punished with a silent treatment aka disappearing act.

Edited September 5, 2015 by Itspointless

[rams10]

I read those things in that link you sent me last week & I think they're dead on. But he wouldn't have stopped caring about me if I didn't want him to say "I love you" or talk about the future (including a general timeline for getting engaged). He stopped caring bc I made it clear his answer of "I'm not ready, I'll let you know when I'm ready, I have no idea if it'll be within a couple years, longer, I don't know" wasn't good enough for me. I need to talk to him and let him know I'll accept that!! I should be able to settle for not getting married any time remotely soon, as long as I have a dream guy

[Itspointless]

I read those things in that link you sent me last week & I think they're dead on. But he wouldn't have stopped caring about me if I didn't want him to say "I love you" or talk about the future (including a general timeline for getting engaged). He stopped caring bc I made it clear his answer of "I'm not ready, I'll let you know when I'm ready, I have no idea if it'll be within a couple years, longer, I don't know" wasn't good enough for me. I need to talk to him and let him know I'll accept that!! I should be able to settle for not getting married any time remotely soon, as long as I have a dream guy

Hi Rams, I do not know exactly any-more which link I sent you last week, except the link to a test for attachment styles which I hope you took.

 

Anyway if those two quotes above are dead-on than for sure your dream guy is a narcissist: Narcissistic "Love" Triangles and Emotional Unavailability - Jacksonville Health Care | Examiner.com I removed the word narcissist from those two paragraphs.

 

You are feeling guilty for being human, his answers also wouldn't be good enough for me. You are idolizing him.

[rams10]

I did look into the attachment styles, thanks, and I'm definitely insecure. I just don't know why it can't work between me and the guy, now that we've had a few weeks of no contact, hopefully it's long enough for him to fully "process everything" with our fights about marriage eTc. he said after he had a little time then we could talk, so what do I say in reaching out?

[Itspointless]

I did look into the attachment styles, thanks, and I'm definitely insecure. I just don't know why it can't work between me and the guy, now that we've had a few weeks of no contact, hopefully it's long enough for him to fully "process everything" with our fights about marriage eTc. he said after he had a little time then we could talk, so what do I say in reaching out?

I hope you use that knowledge to read about that style. Books like: 'How to Conquer Your Self-Destructive Patterns' and 'Adult Attachment Patterns in a Treatment Context: Relationship and narrative'. Reading those is eye-opening. If only that knowledge was taught at schools. Even if you do not see the point start reading them: first the first book by Shirley Impellizzeri and than the chapter about the specific styles by Daniel.

 

If you read those books you will understand why you keep asking this question. An honest answer to your question is: I don't know. We already gave you some ideas. We cannot make others want us, otherwise I would never have come to this forum in the first place. Just like you I was pushed away.

[Drspell12]

Why would you want a horrible jerk like that anyways huh

[rams10]

Update- I called him, he immediately answered and was telling me he misses me, and he doesn't want to rule out us Getting back together in future - but right now, only 3 weeks out, He hasn't had enough chance to fully process everything on his own yet. He doesn't want to "close the door" on us but just feels that seeing me at the moment would make it more complex to finish working through all his own issues in his head first. I told him I've changed since moving out bc I realize I'm happy and fulfilled on my own and not so needy. So maybe I'll just not contact him at all for a few weeks again

[Itspointless]

Update- I called him, he immediately answered and was telling me he misses me, and he doesn't want to rule out us Getting back together in future - but right now, only 3 weeks out, He hasn't had enough chance to fully process everything on his own yet. He doesn't want to "close the door" on us but just feels that seeing me at the moment would make it more complex to finish working through all his own issues in his head first. I told him I've changed since moving out bc I realize I'm happy and fulfilled on my own and not so needy. So maybe I'll just not contact him at all for a few weeks again

Are you not afraid this will happen again somewhere in the future?

[rams10]

Good question. I think it won't if he sees that I've changed- not so needy, happy to live on my own and be separate (he already knows I accepted a job position fairly far away for a year starting next year). Considering this guy responded to any conflict by completely ignoring me and staring at wall- wouldn't respond to a phone call or text- I find it very encouraging that he immediately picked up my call and stayed on phone for an hour discussing"feelings."

[Itspointless]

Good question. I think it won't if he sees that I've changed- not so needy, happy to live on my own and be separate (he already knows I accepted a job position fairly far away for a year starting next year). Considering this guy responded to any conflict by completely ignoring me and staring at wall- wouldn't respond to a phone call or text- I find it very encouraging that he immediately picked up my call and stayed on phone for an hour discussing"feelings."

I guess I would have done that too, even though I really not recommend it to you. Just like my therapist said to me: 'IP, you seriously do not consider waiting for her do you?' But I guess you need to experience it.

 

It is nice he picked up the phone, but I am afraid it does not say anything about how he will be when you two are more close and intimate again.

 

You are a smart women, please educate yourself for example by reading the books I recommended. It is not only for this guy that I hope you will read them.

[rams10]

Thanks so much, IP. It's interesting because I don't usually think of myself as insecure, but when I read those descriptions of attachment styles it seems to be the case, at least with my most recent BF. And I love him too much to think of him as a narcissist or sociopath, but when I read the material you posted for me, it rings true. That he is cold and seems to feel no real emotion. Today was actually an insane amount of emotion for him compared to his usual: stating how he missed me, doesn't want to close the door on us although he isn't ready to see me right now bc he hasn't worked through/processed everything on his own which is the way he needs to do things, answering my call immediately, talking for an hour. That is definitely not his usual.

[Itspointless]

Thanks so much, IP. It's interesting because I don't usually think of myself as insecure, but when I read those descriptions of attachment styles it seems to be the case, at least with my most recent BF. And I love him too much to think of him as a narcissist or sociopath, but when I read the material you posted for me, it rings true. That he is cold and seems to feel no real emotion. Today was actually an insane amount of emotion for him compared to his usual: stating how he missed me, doesn't want to close the door on us although he isn't ready to see me right now bc he hasn't worked through/processed everything on his own which is the way he needs to do things, answering my call immediately, talking for an hour. That is definitely not his usual.

Hi Rams, I though I knew myself pretty well. I had invested a lot in getting to know myself also through coaching and therapy. But adult attachment theory has added for me an extra layer putting things in perspective in a way I did not think was possible. I cannot say that all of those answers made me happy, but I believe that in the end knowledge is power. Although it are not easy lessons as it means changing our brain to react differently under stress. There are some decent websites about attachment, but usually it is the same repeated over and over. Real understanding of those styles I mostly have found in books. Also the book I earlier mentioned on this thread by Young and Klosko is a really a good and insightful read (not on attachment though).

 

You know, my ex also said she needed time, until she closed the door and broke up saying she did not want time. After that she gave me a maybe, I tried to move on but still I waited, as I knew everything was caused by situational stress, I was filled with hope. I can tell you waiting does make you feel awful as your life comes to an halt, it will make you reactive and scared of missing signs.

[CarrieT]

I told him I've changed since moving out bc I realize I'm happy and fulfilled on my own and not so needy.

All evidence to the contrary....

[rams10]

Maybe not, Carrie, but he doesn't know that! Our whole convo I was upbeat, saying I'm doing so well at work and wished I could share it w him, saying in happy in my new place & with my friends, family, and religious services. Told him That given the choice, I certainly wouldn't want to go right back to the way things were while I lived there. Told him i was too needy then and lost myself, and now I'm happy. At end of convo when he said he doesn't process things as quickly as me (always true) and still needs time before considering seeing each other and talking things through, I just said "I respect that. Good luck with everything" and hung up

[rams10]

What do I do when all I want is for him to know I'm sorry and will take him back for who he is

[Mondmellonw]

What do I do when all I want is for him to know I'm sorry and will take him back for who he is

 

Rams, in all honesty I don't think that taking him back/getting back together with him would make you any good.

I know that is what you want at the moment, but I personally think you deserve better, and by the word "better" I mean loving yourself, not a different man.. Right now, what would be the best for you would be to get to know yourself, to respect yourself and love yourself...

 

But that's only my advice, of course.