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How do I avoid making the same mistakes again?


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Was it weird that after a year, I brought up possibly Living together and my ex became furious and threw a card at me that he'd been planning to give me with a key to his place? He wasn't even asking me to move in- just giving me a spare key After a year and calling it a "step." He yelled that he was "done with me" but took back the breakup the next day, pretended like nothing had ever happened after he watched me cry for hours

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He yelled that he was "done with me" but took back the breakup the next day, pretended like nothing had ever happened after he watched me cry for hours

We keep repeating...

 

WHY do you want to be with someone that does and says things that causes you to "cry for hours?"

 

Why do you want that much pain?

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Well maybe somehow it was my fault... That he broke up w me... I just don't know how... He dumped me almost any convo I wanted to have about a serious topic, even in general terms

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I just don't know how

I keep answering because of your anxiety, but seriously Rams you do know how. All the possible answer have been answered in this thread. Just one thing we did not mention this far: one of you is mentally ill and therefore sees another reality than the other person. In that case there is no reason to be found. You have to accept this situation for what it is, like many of us here who have to accept their situation for what it is.

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  • 2 weeks later...
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I don't even want to date again because I'm so sure I'll just mess it up.

Yes I know my ex was (by many people's accounts ) not normal. Everyone who knows him/us IRL will tell me, "it was messed up of him to respond to you asking about the future for the first time by temporarily breaking up with you/ warning you that if you keep talking about it he/ll dump you again... Let alone him sneaking and flirting with another girl right after." A few friends were having a side convo at the bar one night- had no idea I was listening and they mentioned how everyone hates him at work bc he ignores some of the lower-levels' emails, phone calls, etc and just doesn't seem to care much about his job -- and is very arrogant. My family said "when he did spend any time with us, he just seemed cold and like he had no emotion, was just going through the motions." His sister begged me (online) to try to make him care more about their family bc she feels forgotten, and he didn't visit them in over a decade despite having enough $$ to do so. YET I just love him and want him back all the time. I can't stop!!! He says he doesn't care about me or love me (he only said "I love you" maybe 5 times when we were together, and almost never on his own accord). But I can't stop thinking if I'd have been "better" then he'd love me. So I don't even want to date again for fear I'll just screw it all up again

 

My ex always says he doesn't care what people think of him, didn't come to this country to make friends or be liked, once told me "I don't care if I die alone, so be it, everyone dies alone anyhow, the world isn't a rosy place where love conquers all"

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Not dating for a while is smart. I hope you will investigate what we talked about in the threads. And he is right, the world isn't a rosy place. But there are pretty great people out there, they are just not going to save us: that (unfortunately) is our own job. So do not adopt his negativity.

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I think taking a break from dating for a while might be smart too.

 

Someone suggested I make a list of the good and bad ways he treated me. What do you think of this?

 

Good Ways: He took me to his work events and friends' weddings, occasionally traveled to a family event with me, occasionally spent time with my friends, lived with me, sometimes got dinner with me, wasn't possessive/jealous/controlling. He was (in my opinion) really handsome and sexy because he dressed well, had a high-standing job, and didn't give a care what anyone thoguht about him (including me, including his friends -- this was said by him). I loved the thrill of being "chosen" by a person who genuinely didn't seem to care about anyone else (didn't visit his family in 12 years, had his sister sadly telling me on computer "I think he's forgotten us all"). When he told me "I will marry you someday when I decide the time is right," I was thrilled bc I felt I was breaking down a barrier of someone who was generally pretty cold... Even though he immediately tried to sneak out with a girl w/whom he'd been flirting to a bar at midnight, after he said it and I went out for my girls' night plans with my best friend.

 

Bad Ways:

-Didn't ever seem to care about my day, responded to most texts or stories with "Cool," never asked follow-up questions. Early on in our RL I assumed he didn't really like me because he never kept convo going OR opened up about himself (I knew zero about his family after a year)

-was rarely affectionate, when he was working on an optional work project I'd ask once in a while "can you come to bed and cuddle for like 10 min while I fall asleep as your work break?" and he'd say "no, what are you, 5 years old?"

-lied (we had a date night and said he had to stay late at work beyond his control, when really a single female coworker asked him to come out for drinks w/other coworkers)

-had a stone-cold facial expression most of the time (my parents noticed this towards them too - my mom said "I felt weird bc he was doing the 'right' things, came for Christmas dinner and brought me flowers, but he handed them to me with a stony chilling facial expression"

-he talked like my job was "beneath" his even in front of my parents (and my coworkers also picked up on it) towards them)

-he either dumped me or threatened to do so any time I wanted to talk about the future ("hey have you thought about us moving in together?" "do you think you'll be ready to get engaged in the next few years?" etc)

-he once asked a girl for photos behind my back adn told same girl that he'll definitely come over her apartment to drink with her once she's back in town

-declared he'll never live anywhere near the town that my family does "so you can get that out of your head right now," would always refer to future as "Well I'll likely live in X, Y is a close second" - never asking what I thoguht or wanted, ever

-told me to my face "You're not my priority -- work is my priority,"

-he never said "I love you" first. after a year, he had never said it back at all. the first time he said it back, he immediately tried to sneak out with girl as described above

-never asked about my long-term goals or beliefs or wants in life

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That list should show you that the bad far outweighs the good, both in terms of volume and emotional depth.

 

Your list of positives for him is basically that he was good looking and well paid and sometimes did nice things for you. To me, it sounds like you were mostly enticed by the superficial aspects of him, along with viewing him as a challenge to be conquered.

 

I've gone down the rabbit hole of trying to break down the barriers of an emotionally cold person. It's a thankless, futile, soul-sucking experience. The only things that keep you going after a while are pride and the occasional sense that you're making progress. But this process is usually like finally opening a door and finding that there's a brick wall behind it.

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Yet I'm still trying to figure out ways to make him want me back and realize he doesn't want life without me. Even as I acknowledge all the facts I just did. Why??? I'm scared I'll never be happy ever

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Good list Rams, now stick that list on your refrigerator and keep adding things you remember. Just like this man has:

see his list here, click on the little blue arrow next to the name

 

Notice also how even with the positive things you wrote a few times words you wrote occasionally and sometimes, making me think you actually put also a negative of that like on your list.

 

Make also an additional list what you feel you want instead of what you have gotten. And repeat those to yourself everyday. 'I want ... because I am worth it and deserve it without working hard for it'.

 

Sometimes feelings fade away really slow. I sometimes still wish I could turn back time, but then I read some things that made me see the truth. Use your lists for that. Write down your fears and see if they are realistic, they probably are not.

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I know that list is bad. I'm not delusional - I believe I could find another guy who cares more (both about me and about family, friends, people in general). but the intensity of how my ex made me feel in the good moments... That high is, to me, a happy feeling I'm scared I'll never replace. I'm dcared I'll go thru life now w some other guy and end up bored. Wishing I had the intense thrill again. So I want my ex back whatever it takes

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I know that list is bad. I'm not delusional - I believe I could find another guy who cares more (both about me and about family, friends, people in general). but the intensity of how my ex made me feel in the good moments... That high is, to me, a happy feeling I'm scared I'll never replace. I'm dcared I'll go thru life now w some other guy and end up bored. Wishing I had the intense thrill again. So I want my ex back whatever it takes

You are not the only here facing that problem Rams. I am too. But lets be real, even if people who appear to be a 9 or 10 in the beginning are better avoided, then it leaves us with a lot of 8's. These boring people might actually surprise you how great and exciting they can be.

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dated 2 years. From the very first dates, I always felt like he was an emotional brick wall you couldn't penetrate. Example: for 2nd date he suggests last minute that I come over his place and watch a movie. I respond, just FYI, I'm not looking for a hookup type of thing. He ignores that text, but soon changes plan to ice cream. We get ice cream, sit talking for 10 minutes - nothing deep- and he says &"let's get out of here," THEN has me over his place and bangs me. After 1 year he'd never said I love you back, said it took him 25 years to even say the words to his mom. I knew Zero about his family- he never talked about them, hasn't seen them in a decade. (They live in a poor country overseas. Eventually his sister whom I've never met begs me, in a message online, to try to make him care more about their family bc she feels he's forgotten them.) if I said "do you miss your family?" He'd just say with a stone cold face ";it is what it is. I'm fine." He never got emotional about ANYthing. Made comments like ";the world is not a rosy place where you can be happy. I learned that long ago"Any time I brought up future (ex. "Have you thought about us living together? I think it'd be fun";), he'd end up dumping me, staring at wall for hours or even a few days while I cried, and eventually start talking to me again like all was normal but would never bring up the incident. first time I brought up marriage he said "I'll marry you when the time is right but I'm warning you if you keep bringing up the topic I'll dump you," then immediately tried to sneak out to a bar with this single coworker he'd been flirting with. if I asked what sort of time frame he thought for his life, he would say "I don't know." Always man of very few words.

 

One of his only close friends had a going away party but my BF missed it completely BC he wanted to work more on some work presentation. Which didn't surprise me, once he told me "work is my priority. Not you. That's why I came to this country. Also I didn't come here to make friends or be liked" So I went, and the friend ended up telling me "we tried to get him to go to therapy for his issues... You know, like his past and family stuff or whatever." No, I had no idea. later my BF kept flirting w the same girl and said he'd definitely come over her apartment to drink w her once she came back in town. I confronted him when I found the messages in a very innocent way. He literally acted like I was insane, "what messages? I don't know what you're taking about." The few times he agreed to be around my family, my mom said "it was odd bc he'd do the right things- like bring me flowers- but would have such a cold facial expression and no warmth, like a robot, that I knew I was supposed to feel happy but really didn't."Funny she said that bc that's how I felt most of my relationship w him.

 

After 2 years he dumped me for good bc, "I warned you not to keep wanting to talk about the future." Funny bc he told me he'd dumped his ex after 4 years ";bc she wanted to talk about getting engaged then and I didn't so we fought and I dumped her." fast forward a few months. Tonight I call him. He answers immediately. Stayed on phone for 1.5 hours saying very little. I'd ask "are you going to see your family again soon?l and he'd say in a flat voice "maybe. Don't know. Haven't thought about it." Even though he has tons of time off now. I said "well do you miss them" and he'd say "such is life." At one point I was like "hey if you want to get off the phone that's totally fine , you don't have to keep talking to me if you have nothing to say" but he said nothing to that and refused to make up an excuse to get off phone. Finally I had to. I asked about holiday plans and he basically said he has none and will likely spend them alone and, "it's fine." In an emotionless, flat voice. The way he always talked about everything. No life, no happiness or excitement. I don't get it?? Why he sat on phone for 1.5 hours, getting off only when I said bye, but like usual said very little and just seemed closed off

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I jeez, Rams... NOT AGAIN!?!??

 

You have three threads of 20+ pages each telling you what is wrong and you start a fourth?

 

Nothing has changed so why did you even go there? Were you hoping for some epiphany from him that he missed you? He hasn't changed. And you are still grasping at straws.

 

What is wrong with him/me/us? There is not "us!" What is wrong with "me?" The fact that you keep going back and hoping for a different answer...

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"Just got off phone with my ex- what's wrong with him/me/us?"

 

You have to look at yourself now (me) because there is no "us" any more. That has to be obvious to you. You are not in a relationship with him.He does not want to be in a relationship with you again.

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There is no way to express how badly I want him back and to penetrate his emotional brick wall. Isn't it encouraging that he stayed on phone w me all that Time the other night and sounded sad?

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There is no way to express how badly I want him back and to penetrate his emotional brick wall. Isn't it encouraging that he stayed on phone w me all that Time the other night and sounded sad?

I have an idea as I wanted the same the last two years. But no.

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There is no way to express how badly I want him back and to penetrate his emotional brick wall. Isn't it encouraging that he stayed on phone w me all that Time the other night and sounded sad?

 

He might sound sad because he has moved on and senses that you are not. I'm sure he was just trying to be polite in talking with you, but you can tell by the conversation he was not excited to do it.

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There is no way to express how badly I want him back and to penetrate his emotional brick wall. Isn't it encouraging that he stayed on phone w me all that Time the other night and sounded sad?

 

No. By your own accounting he didn't say much and he didn't seem to care one way or the other. Anyone who was genuinely interested would have suggested getting together to meet and promised to call you again later. None of that happened here. For all you know he just set the phone down and played Xbox the entire time.

 

You cannot make him love you. You can't even make him care about you. And you will be stuck in this dreadful cycle forever until you realize you are clinging to a relationship that has long since ceased to exist. You are choosing to exacerbate this pain every time you reach out. Give it up, Rams. Choose you.

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I'm sure he was just trying to be polite in talking with you, but you can tell by the conversation he was not excited to do it.

 

This isn't your average guy. after over a year, he'd never said "I love you" back. Then he finally said it only bc I was getting bummed that we "didn't seem to be on the same page." And immediately after he said it back, he tried to sneak out to a bar with a girl. He hadn't seen his family in 12 years and when I asked if its hard, if he misses them, he'll just say "it's fine. It is what it is" in a flat voice and his sister messaged me online saying she feels he's forgotten the family. So he's not a normal guy in terms of emotion and expression. So if he wants me back it's not going to be obviously expressed the way others think true do it. I'm just trying to figure out how to make him want me

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I'm just trying to figure out how to make him want me

<screaming at the top of my lungs> YOU CAN'T!!!! </screaming at the top of my lungs>

Seriously. As I have asked before: After multiple threads of dozens and dozens pages, you are back to this same question that has been answered so many times by so many people?

 

 

You.Can't.Make.Him.Want.You.

 

PERIOD.

 

END OF SENTENCE.

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This isn't your average guy. after over a year, he'd never said "I love you" back. Then he finally said it only bc I was getting bummed that we "didn't seem to be on the same page." And immediately after he said it back, he tried to sneak out to a bar with a girl. He hadn't seen his family in 12 years and when I asked if its hard, if he misses them, he'll just say "it's fine. It is what it is" in a flat voice and his sister messaged me online saying she feels he's forgotten the family. So he's not a normal guy in terms of emotion and expression. So if he wants me back it's not going to be obviously expressed the way others think true do it. I'm just trying to figure out how to make him want me

 

There were typos in my previous post which I've corrected in this version.

 

Hey Rams, in addition to all the advice in this thread, I just want to assure you that there is nothing wrong with you. I know your self esteem has taken a battering and you might be doubting your worth and value, questioning why he didn't open up to you emotionally etc and taking his failure to do so as a personal indictment, making you feel unworthy or unlovable, but you really need to understand that it's got nothing to do with you. An angel could drop from heaven today and he'd probably still treat her the same way. He treated his ex the same way, treats his colleagues in the same manner as well as his FAMILY members. You need to accept that you're dealing with a troubled soul... this is beyond your control and it's not about you or anything you did ok the relationship ie bringing up the topic of marriage after 2 years of dating. I certainly would do the same after dating for two years.

 

You might receive some peace when you start to digest this fact. You can't fix him, you can't transform him into a loving, vulnerable and emotionally transparent man. He probably needs a lot of therapy, but needs to come to this decision on his own accord. I'm so sorry for your pain, but you need to realise that your persistence in trying to "crack him" is extremely detrimental to your well being and to your health and will be futile. The lost you're going to get out of this is a deeply unsatisfying and painful affair (which will still end!).

 

I also noted something troubling you mentioned, you said "you don't like stability because stability is boring". I think you're wrong: you can only build a loving and fulfilling relationship with stability. Your attraction to emotionally ambivalent men is something you need to examine and disassociate from, if you want to enjoy a mutually loving and fulfilling relationship. Very best wishes to you and keep posting.

Edited by Sunshine2016
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