Sex has dried up

[LonelyLou]

Hi all

 

I know I'm far from alone, I know lots of other people (on this board as well) have had similar issues, but I'm still going to post as it will be cathartic and each case is unique, so maybe I can get advice that is specific to me?

 

Anyway.

 

I'm early 30s, as is my wife. We've been together 14 years and married 4. When we first were together she was very naive re sex and associated things, so I took things slow with her. We would still have sex a couple of times a week though, which is fine with me.

 

Now I haven't had sex in over a month, and it was over a month before that. If I ask for sex I get turned down about 75% of the time, and then when I get 'lucky' I generally feel/wonder that she is just doing it to stop me asking. Which feels wrong, I would rather not do it than her do it when she isn't 100% into it.

 

Contrary to what I have read on here as being often the case, it isn't that she isn't getting the due amount of attention beforehand (I can see why that would make her not want to do it again, so I am always super attentive, but see below).

 

Our sex goes:

- She lies on the bed, fully clothed.

- I sometimes try and play with her before taking anything off, this in no way affects her.

- So we take her trousers off, then I get to rub her panties for about 10 minutes usually, whereupon she asks if I'm ready (yes, that was MY foreplay apparently), then spends about 5 minutes taking off clothes and tidying the bed, which kills any... excitement I might be experiencing.

- I am then in charge of restoring said excitedness to myself with minimal assistance.

- We then have an awkward minute or so of very gradual penetration as she is almost never more than slightly damp.

- Sex is then over quickly as a) I never get any so... and b) she is very friction-y.

- I do get a little attention while we are in the act, but it is done mechanically (she will kiss my neck).

 

Sometimes (very sometimes) the above 'foreplay' will illicit actual honest to goodness wetness, and a sort of glazed look on her face. This is good, this makes the sex better as things go easier, she is more amourous (by her standards) and I am happier as she has clearly had some fun.

 

But there is no discernable pattern and no clues are given as to what is being enjoyed and what is boring her, I suspect she... refuses to allow herself to enjoy it 99% of the time (that sounds harsh, but I'm speaking as I feel).

 

I really really want her to enjoy sex, more than I actually WANT sex. I can take care of myself (and do), what I really want from the act is for her to enjoy it, I'd be happy to only attend to her needs (and sort myself out after if need be).

 

However the above is all I am allowed to do, there is to be no kissing during sex, no touching of anything other than aforementioned panties, no deviation from pattern.

 

I want intimacy, I could get the same results from a sex doll (or pillow). It is very very frustrating!

 

I can't tell her how I feel, as she will get upset (I have tried to come at it from the side before and she has looked like she is about to have a panic attack). Also if I say we need to have sex more I will assume she is then only doing it out of duty.

 

I broke all intimacy with her last week for a few days, just treated her like a friend, no kissing or affection. She at least noticed, but she just asked why I was so sad.

 

I won't cheat, but I am having more fantasies about seeing a lady purely for the affection. It would solve the problem in a way.

But I won't (truly), I'd rather be miserable than deal with the guilt.

 

I know we are all different but... ok, as a parting comment, this might sound callous but (speaking my mind), it is minimal inconvenience for her, we have no children, jobs that mean we are home for 6, bed at 11. That is 5 hours every weeknight plus the weekends. She might not enjoy it, but it isn't doing her any harm. If she said she enjoyed us folding laundry together I wouldn't think 'woo hoo! folding laundry!' but I would think 'this will make her happy, it will cost me nothing but a little time and it will be spent with her, there is no downside'. So I feel in a way she is being selfish... which I know isn't fair.

 

Someone tell me chin up, it'll make me feel better about this being how it will be for the next 50 years :S

 

#Edit# After a re-read I want to add, her lack of enjoyment of foreplay is not my fault (honest!), she has carte blanche to ask for anything, but only wants the above. ANy attempts to do anything else are met by indifference or refusal. She once let me sort of go down on her, by which I mean I got about 3 seconds before being told I 'don't like it' and it can never be mentioned again. Some audition!

Edited August 5, 2015 by LonelyLou
A thought

[SycamoreCircle]

What is your dating life like with your wife?

[MJJean]

Get her to a psychiatrist. Any adult, sexually active, woman in her age range that damn near has a panic attack talking about foreplay and sex that involves things like kissing and touching has problem that needs to be addressed.

[pondhawk]

I am sorry you're going through this. It would be so difficult to endure a marriage with one person hating sex. Even though it makes you feel unloved, undervalued, that may not be they way she feels at all.

 

Can you buy her the book, "For Women Only", by Shaunti Feldhahn?

 

I NEVER realized how important sex was to a man until I read that book. I had no clue!! Maybe she will see how vital sex is to you after reading and be willing to change.

 

Shaunti also wrote, "For Men Only". Maybe if you read that one while your wife is reading the other one, she'll be more likely to stick to it?

 

Also, what your wife ever sexually abused before? Just wondering why she's so young but hates exploring sexually?

[OldRover]

Lou,

 

You're wife has some SERIOUS problems and needs the help of a professional. Get her there.....

[understand50]

Lou,

 

You're wife has some SERIOUS problems and needs the help of a professional. Get her there.....

 

I would also be prepared to some extent to what you may find out about why she is this way. Just be prepared. When you ask questions, sometime the answers are hard things to hear. I hope that this is nothing caused by another, but just keep it in mind. In any case, please read and heed OldRover. She needs help. Your love will go along way in this, remember that.

 

I wish you luck

[JADIE]

 

Can you buy her the book, "For Women Only", by Shaunti Feldhahn?

 

I NEVER realized how important sex was to a man until I read that book. I had no clue!! Maybe she will see how vital sex is to you after reading and be willing to change.

 

 

Great suggestion! I love love love that book and re-read it or parts of it frequently. No matter how my SO and I are getting along or what issues I'm having with him, it all gets left at the bedroom door. As much as he irritates me sometimes or unknowingly hurts me, after reading Shaunti, I cannot bear to shoot him down when he needs physical attention. Now to get him to read "7 Ways to be Her Hero" by Doug Fields, so he can feel the same way about me!

[oldshirt]

This will require professional help and intervention and even then it is highly unlikely there will be any kind of major breakthrough where she becomes a very sexual person.

 

Since you haven't indicated that you used to have hot, nasty, porn sex, I am assuming she has always been a dud and your sex life has always been very lackluster.

 

I really don't see this changing for the better much even with professional intervention. I would bet the farm that it will mostly definately get WORSE over time as time goes on.

 

Professional intervention and sex therapy might make her reject you less and you may pick up a little more frequency and it may help you not get too resentful and bitter about it, but I doubt if it can ever turn her into a sex kitten.

 

Some people are simply duds in bed. And some couples are just incompatible.

 

Marital and sex therapy might be able to figure out if there is something about you that is turning her off like if you have put on weight or she doesn't like your beard or if your approach and seduction are inadequate.

 

Therapy may even be able to help a little if she has been abused in the past or has had some kind of sexual trauma.

 

If you used to have hot, passionate, exciting sex in the best, I would be more optimistic about therapy and counseling.

 

But here is my take on it. Let's say that on a 1-10 scale your sex life is currently a 2/10.

 

With weekly therapy for a couple years and hundreds of hours of discussion and 'homework' at home and tens of thousands of dollars paid for treatment and therapies, your sex life might improve to a 3/10 or 4/10. But then as all sexual relationships tend to flatten out over time, I think the main thing therapy would do in the long run is to keep your marriage from being completely sexless altogether.

 

The sad news here is the time and energy and money spent to get your sex life a wee bit less dismal, will probably be better spent on a divorce and finding another woman that has a healthy libido, a positive outlook on sexuality and is attracted to you.

[autumnnight]

You said she was naive when young. Did show grow up in a strict household or strict religious upbringing?

 

My take would be that there is either guilt from skewed shame due to twisted teaching about sex....or she was likely abuse or traumatized in some way.

 

I echo the need for therapy.

[elaine567]

I am sorry but this sounds almost worse than being sexless.

This is all just so awkward and weird. I cannot imagine how this must make you feel.

 

Your wife has serious problems and I would not be surprised if she is the victim of abuse or is the product of a very repressed view of sexual relations.

 

What are her objections to kissing or touching?

And what is this rubbing of the panties all about???? and the

bed tidying...

Sounds almost like the whole process is a staged event.

Is she obsessed with cleanliness.

[MJJean]

I am sorry but this sounds almost worse than being sexless.

This is all just so awkward and weird. I cannot imagine how this must make you feel.

 

Your wife has serious problems and I would not be surprised if she is the victim of abuse or is the product of a very repressed view of sexual relations.

 

What are her objections to kissing or touching?

And what is this rubbing of the panties all about???? and the

bed tidying...

Sounds almost like the whole process is a staged event.

Is she obsessed with cleanliness.

 

Never thought about being obsessed with cleanliness, but if she is than she might think sex is icky. Lets face it, sex is messy. Sweat, juices, saliva exchange through kissing, etc. Maybe she has issues with germs or just feels sex is too physically ...well...dirty.

 

Just from OPs post, though, I suspect she is either asexual, homosexual and unwilling to admit it even to herself, or has a warped view of sex due to her upbringing and sex education or lack thereof.

 

What confuses me is, if she has always been like this, surely the OP knew something was wrong over the years. So why wasn't this addressed earlier? The original post was painful to read. I couldn't imagine loving and marrying someone who doesn't want kissing, fondling, foreplay, or anything that we commonly associate with a normal sex life and drive. It must be so painful and frustrating for OP.

Edited August 5, 2015 by MJJean

[Hope Shimmers]

Wow. This would be very difficult to deal with.

 

As another poster said, I suspect that even if you go to therapy, she will only improve a slight amount and that would be her effort in doing so rather than her innate desire (and she seems to have none, which is the problem). That effort would only be minimal and would be false and temporary. I don't see her suddenly becoming sexual and desirous of intimacy. Yet you can't live without it and you should not be expected to.

 

Time to take a hard look at things, think about what you want for your future, and decide if this is good enough. You don't have any kids so a divorce would be relatively easy in that way. She sounds asexual and there are people like that. The reality is that it won't get better over the years and it will likely get worse, therapy or not.

[LonelyLou]

Wow, more replies than I expected! I will try and reply to questions:

 

- I assume by 'dating' you mean like do we go out and wine and dine. No, we don't. She (and TBH I) is socially nervous (not to say we are shut ins, but we won't be going to restraunts and drinking while linking arms or similar). We go out, but it isn't romantic, it's practical (God I know how that sounds... lol)

 

- I suspect this will cover a few replies: I know, I am in therapy for... things, mainly self confidence and depression. I know she has the same/similar issues, but she doesn't want help. Also my wife comes up from time to time at therapy, and my therapist keeps saying I think we need to dicuss her, but I know what the answer will be (it's what people have said here, begins with D). My therapist has said she would like to see my wife as she feels she might have some form of autism or similar, which I am tempted to agree with.

 

But there is no way at all she would go, whatever is wrong with her she is in denial.

 

(Ok I need to say this, I have 'Fear is the mind killer' etc... in my notebook journal thing, I took exams recently and used to recite it to keep me focused and calm, just an aside thought, back to the bad stuff)

 

- In a similar vein she wouldn't read a book, especially not one on sex/feelings.

I meant to add in my post, I wondered about abuse (her dad is lovely, but he has said odd things over the years, but I think it's his sense of humour. Nothing bad I should say, just odd!). BUT if she had been abused, she wouldn't have ever wanted sex would she? She even used to ask for it back in the day.

 

I think she came from a bit of a prudish household (but not in an enforced way, just in a... well my mum was a hippy so everyone looks prudish to me! They never voiced an opinion on us and sex, other than keeping us in seperate beds after we first met (and before we were having sex so...) and never really messed around with anyone, so doesn't get the whole sex thing. Though her sister used to bring guys home as a teenager and, though she has awful taste in boyfriends, doesn't seem to have the same hangups. She has even, in so many words, said she would take sex at least daily if offered (hmmm, hope that wasn't a hint, that would be such a cliche...) and has sat reading 50 Shades (albeit in a 'this is stupid funny' way) at her parents.

 

My opinion tends to be, she was naive, never had her sexual awakening and experimented or whatever when younger. She has dipped her toe, tried vanilla sex, found she was ok with it, but never reached and now finds it dull. She used to have friends back when we had regular sex, they even shared the house (students), and they were much more sexually awakened. I think having them around maybe normalised it for her, but now she is cut off she, for whatever reason, has gone prudish.

 

Conversely, I made my entry (albeit solo) into the awakening much younger, though I was still very naive for actual sex. So by the time we met, I knew what I liked, I'd had the internet/dads magazines/that video that went round school and so was more desensitized. Even now, a good 20 years after I started, I'm still pushing my boundaries and trying to find new pleasures. Next I'll be sticking pins in my head and having people solve puzzle boxes...

 

Just to address one more then sum up (as I seem to have written an essay...), it hasn't always been like this, it was gradual and accompanied by life changes, like moving cities, trouble at work, changes in hobbies, all of which made me think 'well of course she won't want it as much atm, this and that is happening'. Then before you know it, it's been a looong time.

 

I know I said 'never cheat', but I did (long ago) go to a professional lady, after my wife was at her worst (no sex for months, barely any affection at all, she was insanely stressed by exams and so was I, things slipped). I was pretty much suicidal, and just wanted affection, so I bought it. My only regret is actually having sex, the kissing and touching was plenty really, my horemones got the better of me. But never again, the guilt drove me insane. And yes my wife knows, I told her. And no, this didn't trigger a change, there was next to no sex before the admission, then a rocky period, then next to no sex after (and a proposal and marriage).

 

Oh! In her defence! On our wedding night I was having mental issues, it was just a horrid time (aside from the wedding!) and I don't do well in crowds, I was hugely stressed and would have gone straight to bed. She pretty much insisted on sex. That is the last time she ever instigated it though.

 

I know what I need to do, back to therapy and make this the topic. Discuss it to death, work out a plan. See what happens.

 

If I use the D word around her it would blow her mind. She wouldn't say 'I know, I've been thinking that too', I suspect she has zero idea (hence my feelings she is... I don't know the term, lets go with 'has issues') that she is causing me such issues, I suspect talk of divorce would make her suddenly become willing in bed, with the net effect I would be abusing her.

 

If we broke up, there is no-one else. Women have never been interested in me, even when I was younger and more confident.

 

Maybe I should become a fundamentalist of some religion, nothing would change but at least then the home life would be par for the course! That was almost entirely a joke btw, with no offence intended.

 

I'd welcome you opinion (if you aren't asleep after reading all that), me and her sister are fairly close, we never say 'in law' when refering to each other. We joke around and, well, get on. She can be... loud and maybe doesn't always have that voice in her head that says 'don't say that' though. She has obviously grown up with my wife, she is obviously more in my way of thinking, do you think a serious message to her preceded by 'can I talk to you and this stay between us?' followed by a 'this is the state of play (sanitised of course), what do you think?' would be a good idea? I doubt she would get overly embaressed, I doubt she would just go straight to my wife and grass me up, but I don't know whether bringing her sister in is going to make my wife feel betrayed. Also her sister will feel compelled to help and might say something or hint... What do you think?

 

Sorry for the long post, thank you all again for your advice and kind words. If I can get her to therapy I will.

[autumnnight]

First, I would not go to your wife's sister.

 

Second, your wife sounds so very much like my ex. Basically, he was asexual. Sex was fine in the beginning because it was something new to "investigate," then once it had been investigated to his satisfaction, it was no longer on his radar. He also came from a very strict family/church.

 

I do think you need to be very frank with her about your concerns and how it makes you feel.

[LonelyLou]

First, I would not go to your wife's sister.

 

Second, your wife sounds so very much like my ex. Basically, he was asexual. Sex was fine in the beginning because it was something new to "investigate," then once it had been investigated to his satisfaction, it was no longer on his radar. He also came from a very strict family/church.

 

I do think you need to be very frank with her about your concerns and how it makes you feel.

 

I wasn't sure what I would say to my sister in law anyway lol

 

I worry that telling her 'we need to have sex' will make her do it out of duty, and she will then have actual sexual issues to add to whatever is going on.

 

Also I wish my wife was from a strict background, at least I would understand why she is like this.

[truncated]

First, don't let your therapist diagnose your wife ( or even mention something like autism) without even meeting your wife. It's not right for her to do so.

 

Second, it sounds like you both have issues, and the sex issue is just one of them. It does sound like you do both love each other, but it also sounds like these issues get in the way,and they are very deeply rooted.

 

You indicate that she was the way she is now even before you proposed to her, so this is not something new. It also sounds like you are assuming certain things about her without even knowing if they are correct.

 

If you sat down with her and had a very rank and open discussion with her about how you feel and way she feels the way she does about sex, you might learn more about what is going on in her mind instead of just taking a shot in the dark about it.

 

You see like someone who communicates well through the written word, so maybe it would be easier to write her a long letter about how you feel and why. Ask her to think about what you have said and respond. |see what she has to say.

 

If all else fails, and you are miserable, then you may find that you need to take charge of your life and look at ending things before you end up hurting her in a way that you can't take back. You say you will never cheat, but you admit you already have, and I can't expect that you want to find yourself in a position where you would consider doing so again.

 

(btw, if she is as unresponsive as you say, sex may be painful for her. ave you tried any lubrication to help with that?)

[RecentChange]

Oh boy - well, I am pretty much the opposite of your wife, so I am going to have a hard time really empathizing, but here are some thoughts.

 

She sounds like she has NEVER had an orgasm - and well, sex without them, "mechanical" sex no less - does sound like a chore.

 

It also sounds like you two never "make out" - you know, serious kissing, caressing, body contact (and no, I am not taking about rubbing panties).

 

If I were you, my goal would be to try to establish some intimacy with the goal of making HER FEEL GOOD. There needs to be something in this for her.

 

To me "foreplay" is a lot more than warming up the genitalia.

 

Will she allow you to give her a back massage? Could you be open enough to tell her that you want to give her pleasure?

 

I don't think telling her to go to a therapist, or to read some books on sex will be the answer.

 

My advice would be for YOU to read some books on sex / pleasure / intimacy. Because from what you have told us, I don't think you have a good idea of how to push her buttons (and she doesn't even know what they are!).

 

Read up on how to TOUCH someone else. Not how to have sex with them, but how to caress and bring physical relaxation and pleasure. There are many other parts of the body that when touched can turn someone on - besides what is in their pants!

 

Any way - from what you have told us, my unprofessional advice would be to try to initiate some more physical contact WITHOUT the goal of "sex". Cuddle on the couch while watching TV. Give her a gentle scalp massage. See if she will let you be close to her... give her gentle kisses on her shoulder and neck as you. Tell her she is beautiful and you desire her... ASK her if what you are doing feels good.

 

See if you can start building some intimacy. Don't force it, or push to fast, she obviously has a wall up for some reason.

 

But my advice comes down to - a nice massage with gentle kisses, warm breath and attention to bringing pleasure to her body is "fore play" not making the bed and rubbing on her panties...

 

As for abuse - no, you can't assume because she wants sex occasionally that means that she wasn't abused. But you can't assume that she was either. If she is on "the spectrum" reading her responses to things can probably be difficult - but do try to open up the communication without saying "I need more sex" - I think the goal should be "I want to bring you physical pleasure" and how to get to that point.

[oldshirt]

Do not talk to any family members about your marital issues. That is never a good idea.

 

 

IMHO both of you have trouble with interpersonal relations and both of you have trouble expressing romance and intimacy.

 

 

As another poster has suggested, not only is she very sexually unresponsive and disinterested, but you may also be fairly inept at seducing and arousing women. I don't say that to be mean or to put you down but rather to point out that this is a very multi-faceted problem that goes down many layers and involves dynamics between both of you.

 

 

My recommendation to bypass all the self help books and go directly into professional marriage counseling as well as marital sexual therapy if you are dead set against divorce.

 

 

You problems go deeper than what self help books can help and talking to relatives on this personal of a matter is never a good idea. You need the help of trained, board certified professionals.

 

 

If she refuses to go to therapy or refuses to participate fully, then there is no hope and divorce is likely your only option if you ever want to have an even remotely active and satisfying sex life.

 

 

As bad as your issue are, I think you are well in right to approach her about mutual therapy nicely the first time and if she refuses, then offer it is the form of picking what is behind door #1 which is remaining married and seeking professional therapy and working on your issues together as a couple for the mutual benefit and enjoyment of both of you.

 

 

Or she can pick Door #2 which is divorce and you finding someone else.

 

 

I know that Door #2 is scary for you because you believe that you will have great difficulty finding another woman who is any better. But I want to challenge you to consider that if you continue with your own counseling and possible sexual therapy, you may learn to better interact with women and learn more about how they tick and what turns them on and you can learn to better interact with and attract women and employ better seduction and arousal strategies.

[LonelyLou]

No-one is diagnosing anyone without meeting them, my therapist suggested her behaviour could be a sign of a few things and said she would be happy to see her if she wanted to come. I am not trying to treat her for conditions I don't know whether she has, don't worry.

 

Of my many issues, intimacy isn't one of them, but it is clearly one of hers.

 

And as for the 'you need to do better' comments, I'm surprised they came so late, they are normally what people lead with

I am aware of various techniques and things that can be done to arouse a woman, I have been with other women. I've also read plenty of things online and in self help type books. Most everything I have ever tried has been met with either indifference, her asking what I'm doing (and what do you say to that? 'A book said you would like it'?) or confusion why I have stopped doing what she wants (see above).

 

I was going to come up with a clever metaphor/simile, but I don't think one is needed: I am aware that she doesn't enjoy sex (yes I have tried lube, no I'm not allowed to do it again, "It's cold and feels weird"), yes I am aware there are things she might like (with no guarantees, everyone is different), yes I've tried most of them (as much as I can without forcing her to let me do things she doesn't want me to do).

 

Thank you all for your advice, both kind and harsh (both were appreciated in almost equal measures). I think I know what I need to do, I have booked into my therapist and I will talk it all out with her and go from there.

 

If anyone wants to reply again for posterity feel free of course. But I think me returning will just upset me more (at least until I've seen my therapist) and so I won't be reading the responses.

 

Thank you all again.

[HurtOfGlass]

I know I said 'never cheat', but I did (long ago) go to a professional lady, after my wife was at her worst (no sex for months, barely any affection at all, she was insanely stressed by exams and so was I, things slipped). I was pretty much suicidal, and just wanted affection, so I bought it. My only regret is actually having sex, the kissing and touching was plenty really, my horemones got the better of me. But never again, the guilt drove me insane. And yes my wife knows, I told her. And no, this didn't trigger a change, there was next to no sex before the admission, then a rocky period, then next to no sex after (and a proposal and marriage).

 

Read this again. Exams are just an excuse. She is cheating on you and the hot sex she is having with her AP has killed any libido for you.

 

Thats why "Sex has dried up"....

[Lois_Griffin]

I wasn't sure what I would say to my sister in law anyway lol

 

I worry that telling her 'we need to have sex' will make her do it out of duty, and she will then have actual sexual issues to add to whatever is going on.

 

Also I wish my wife was from a strict background, at least I would understand why she is like this.

It doesn't sound like you need to have more sex. It sounds like you need to have GOOD sex because your description of what you two do is pretty snooze worthy.

[elaine567]

Read this again. Exams are just an excuse. She is cheating on you and the hot sex she is having with her AP has killed any libido for you.

 

Thats why "Sex has dried up"....

 

I would guess the fact he visited a prostitute and she knows about it, is a pretty good reason for sex to dry up.

[peterd51501]

I'm in the same boat as you, ever since she had her Hysterectomy she hasn't been interested in sex at all. In fact she told me out of the 10 most important things in life, sex is like number 13. so that tells me not to even try. But the bad thing is we get along great we do things together and in general, things look great on the outside. But I find it really hard to sleep next to her and know I'm not wanted physically or desired. Like you I won't cheat because I really do have too much to lose but more important I'm not sure I could find someone I get along with as well as we do. I feel sex is very important but it is only a small part of a relationship.

We are in our early 60's but still it is hard. I like treating her like queen but also tired of giving and not getting anything back. I know this don't help you any but I just wanted you to know your not the only one with this problem BOTTOM LINE IT HARD TO SHOW LOVE WHEN NON IS RETURNED

[autumnnight]

I would guess the fact he visited a prostitute and she knows about it, is a pretty good reason for sex to dry up.

 

And this is another reason cheating is never a good idea. Because no matter how unhappy or starved or miserable someone might have been before they cheated, once they cheat,m THAT will be the irrefutable excuse dujour as to why they should continue to starve....

[vrj]

somebody need that because it have time