Confused about his American "friend"

[giltedgedgoblin]

I need some advice please.

 

Brief history - I live in the UK & began talking to a guy online a year ago. We exchanged E.mails daily for 6 months & then met in person for the first time in October 2004. We live quite close to each other & since then we have seen each other every week. We go out for dinner & drinks, spend time together, chill out etc, i stay overnight at his place & we've spent full weekends together. We are sexually involved too. He is almost perfect, he treats me like a princess, he frequently tells me i'm wonderful & that he considers himself lucky to have met me. He is thoughtful & considerate, loving & affectionate. I adore him.

 

I am slightly paranoid & insecure as i have been used & cheated on in a previous relationship. However, this guy has never really given me any reason to suspect anything. He says i can phone or text anytime i like (and he usually answers), he doesn't mind me leaving my stuff at his place, and he's never cancelled a date.

 

He tells me he likes our relationship & he refers to me as his girlfriend to all his family & friends, with the exception of one. He has a female friend who lives in southern USA whom he also met on the internet. He has known her 3 or 4 years and visits her maybe twice a year. She still lives with her parents & she is single. He tells me it is a purely platonic friendship & that nothing has ever happened between them. He tells me they are like a second family to him.

 

What confuses me is that, although this girl is aware of my existence, he told her i am his "friend". When i asked him why he didn't tell her i am his girlfriend he said she wouldn't approve. He said it wasn't "the done thing" in that part of the US.

 

Is that correct or am i being unnecessarily paranoid?

[bluechocolate]

I too would feel that there was something strange going on here.

 

he frequently tells me i'm wonderful & that he considers himself lucky to have met me

 

But he won't share his new-found happiness with the people he considers to be

 

like a second family to him.? Very strange indeed.

 

He has known her 3 or 4 years and visits her maybe twice a year.

 

Has he visited her since you two started going out? Does he have plans to do so in the future and still not inform them/her of his status regarding you? Think of it this way: someone says to you that their b/friend has a very good single female friend who doesn't know he's seeing someone & he vacations with her twice a year, leaving the girl friend at home. What would you say to that?

 

When i asked him why he didn't tell her i am his girlfriend he said she wouldn't approve.

 

Sorry, but that is bullsh*t. Why does he need the approval of a platonic friend who lives 000's of miles away?

[giltedgedgoblin]

He's staying with her and her family this week, which is probably what's made me wonder! This is the first time he has visited her since we started physically seeing each other 6 months ago.

 

I kinda guess you're right in asking why would he want to keep our relationship quiet from them if he's so happy about it, but his real family here in the UK know i am his girlfriend so it doesn't make sense to me.

 

I raised the subject of her just before he left for the US and he said "even if we were both available and up for it, i'm not sure it's a good idea to get involved with friends"

[tokyo]

He may not be necessarily a jerk, but someone who is a bit weak around people he likes. He said they were like second family to him, so he probably wants to stay on good terms with them. Southern USA, isn't that part of the bible belt? She might be a very religious person and him having a girlfriend and premarital sex might be something she heavily disapproves. You could ask him what the reason behind her possible disapproval might be.

 

I may add that even though there's a good explanation why he doesn't tell her that he's seeing you, I still don't find his attitude towards his friend a good one. Second family or not, she's just a friend, not someone he needs to have account to for his life. I'm sorry, but he looks a bit weak. Hopefully this is just a single case and not indicative of a whole charakter.

[bluechocolate]

You've been going out with this guy for 6 months & he's flown to the US to stay with a single girl & her family who don't know about you. You're not being paranoid. You have genuine cause for concern.

 

As kooky says, he may not be a jerk, but if his intentions with this girl are nothing more than being friends, then he certainly is a flake. If his real family know about you why on earth does he need to keep you a secret from these people? Is their approval more important to him than his relationship with you? Certainly sounds that way to me.

[tokyo]

If she thinks that him having a girlfriend is not appropiate, then I wonder what she would think that he went to visit a female friend, no matter how platonic she is. When I'm right with my guess that his friends is ultrareligious then this would also deemed to be very inappropiate. Men just don't have female friends and visit them. And if they are committed to another woman it's even more inappropiate. I've revised my opinion, he's very likely a flake.

[giltedgedgoblin]

He did say the reason for their disapproval would be the premarital sex. I don't think she is religious but he said it's just not the done thing where she lives, although it's pretty much the norm here in the UK!!

 

I wouldn't have labelled him as a particularly weak person, although i do know the amount of information about me that he has divulged to his real family & other friends varies depending on the reaction he would have received. For example, he has told his friends i am a very wild and outrageously dressed girl as they would accept that, whereas his rather well spoken family probably wouldn't! He's told his family more about the "nice girl" side of me, which they approve of.

 

I kinda guess we all wear masks depending on who we're talking to. From what i know about him he comes across as a genuinely nice guy who wants to please everyone. Maybe he does simply want to maintain his "nice guy" image with his American friends. Maybe i'm too paranoid for my own good!

[tokyo]

Originally posted by giltedgedgoblin

He did say the reason for their disapproval would be the premarital sex. I don't think she is religious but he said it's just not the done thing where she lives, although it's pretty much the norm here in the UK!!

I don't know how old you are and maybe age plays a role here (I don't think though, because then he wouldn't be visiting here so often, doesn't look like the normal thing to do for teenagers), but if you're over 20, it's not a religious issue and he gives you this line, he must be kidding you and trying to dispel your doubts with alleged cultural differences. Or she is telling him this nonsense. I think you have reasons to be concerned and it's not paranoia.

[giltedgedgoblin]

Oh we're both old enough! He is 30 and i am 38 (even though i'm acting like some lovesick teenager!!) she is around 32 or 33 i believe.

 

I don't believe there are any great cultural differences between the US and the UK either, and i don't have a problem with my guy having female friends nor staying with them for that matter. I do genuinely believe men and women can have purely platonic friendships with members of the opposite sex. I myself have many male friends, and i have in fact holidayed with male friends in the USA and, in fact stayed in the same hotel room with them. Now that may seem odd to others but it doesn't to me.

 

It's not the fact he is visiting her, nor staying with her family that makes me suspicious. They do know about me, they know i exist & they know certain things about me, they just don't know i stay overnight with him every week or that we have a sexual relationship.

 

She, however, has only ever visited him here in the UK once.

[bluechocolate]

There are only two viable explanations for why he's keeping his status with you a secret from this girl and her family:

 

1 - he's ashamed of you, or

 

2 - he has hopes to foster a relationship with this other woman.

 

Which one is it?

 

He did say the reason for their disapproval would be the premarital sex.

 

Sorry again - but that is also bullsh*t. When someone tells friends and family about their new partner they don't go on to tell them that they've been bonking since they met even though they're not married. How is it that him telling them that he has a girlfriend immediately means that they know the two of you are having sex? In my opinion, not only is he spinning you a tale he's also misrepresenting himself to these people whom he considers to be a second family. How does that saying go? -- Try to please everyone and you end up pleasing no one --

 

For what it's worth I would never involve myself with someone who felt it necessary to keep my status in their life a secret (unless there was a mutil-million dollar inheritance riding on it ).

[giltedgedgoblin]

I don't have any reason to believe he is ashamed of me, more the opposite in fact. He has openly told me he is proud to take me out and he is very affectionate towards me in public. He told me just a few weeks ago that he loves going out with me because "i turn heads" (i.e other guys look at me) and it makes him feel good that i am on his arm. That may sound a bit conceited of me but it's what he said!!

 

So, i dunno. Maybe he is hoping to foster some relationship with her in the future, although as i said previously, she doesn't visit him here in the UK. Also, the Christmas & birthday gifts he has received have actually come from her parents and not from her so it doesn't sound as if she has the same intention!

[mental_traveller]

I'm from the UK and once dated a woman in that part of the US, and your bf's excuse is pure BS. There's no reason not to tell her that you are his gf - he could always say you have not had sex and are waiting for marriage, couldn't he? This is a big red flag IMO and I would be suspicious if I were in your shoes.

[giltedgedgoblin]

Precisely!

 

WHY exactly he hasn't told her the truth about us is the mystery. But on the flipside, why, if he intends on attempting to foster a relationship with her, is he seeing me?

 

Surely if he saw any serious future for himself with her he wouldn't have a girlfriend here. It's not like i made our relationship easy for him to get into, we met on an internet chat site and he chased me for 6 months before i'd meet him in person! Since we met, he's stopped using the chat site so it's not as if he's chasing other women too. He talks about OUR future together, things we will do next Christmas or summer etc, he renewed the rental contract on his house specifically because it's close to where i live (he'd talked about moving closer to his place of work) He has even mentioned marriage! (WAY too early for that one!!)

 

I'm sure the potential to lie and cheat is in us all but he doesn't strike me as being the sort.

[SoleMate]

...When i asked him why he didn't tell her i am his girlfriend he said she wouldn't approve. He said it wasn't "the done thing" in that part of the US...

Like bluechoc said, this is ridiculous. It IS true that in rural, especially Southern parts of the US, premarital sex is officially and sometimes sternly disapproved of. (However, those areas have the same or even higher out-of-wedlock pregnancy rates as the rest of the country, so it is safe to assume there are more than a few couples secretly violating social norms.)

 

BUT....if this family is "like family" to him, then why oh why would he be mentioning his sex life to them? If he were on the up and up, he could EASILY say, "Yes, I am seeing a young woman in the UK, and she is my #1. We're fairly serious." No mention of sex is necessary, and these upright Southern Baptists or whatever they are would not dream of asking him. However, this statement would ruin his chances of getting anything on with his special little American friend...be it sexual, or be it just a flirtation that is incompatible with a serious, exclusive relationship.

 

So...this is unacceptable in a 1:1 r/s. Don't stand for it. I would let him know that this is a dealbreaker. The visits (without you) are bad enough, but it is ALWAYS a bad thing when your supposed SO fails to acknowledge you to a member of the opposite sex.

[giltedgedgoblin]

OK, i kinda get the impression you guys think it's a bad thing he hasn't mentioned to her that we're dating and not just friends!

 

So, that point and his reasons for it aside, let's say for example he wants to be or indeed IS more than just friends with her, why doesn't she ever visit him here in the UK? It doesn't strike me as being a mutual thing. Why get emotionally involved with me? (and he is most definitely emotionally involved with me, it's clear from the way he behaves when he's with me) More importantly, why plan a future with me?

[bluechocolate]

OK, i kinda get the impression you guys think it's a bad thing he hasn't mentioned to her that we're dating and not just friends!

 

So, that point and his reasons for it aside, let's say for example he wants to be or indeed IS more than just friends with her, why doesn't she ever visit him here in the UK? It doesn't strike me as being a mutual thing. Why get emotionally involved with me? (and he is most definitely emotionally involved with me, it's clear from the way he behaves when he's with me) More importantly, why plan a future with me?

 

He (and possibly her) are the only ones with the answers you seek. The rest of us can only speculate.

 

You kinda get the impression?? OK - probably just a figure of speech there. My guess is you'll find almost univeral agreement that it is indeed a bad thing.

 

I'm completely with SoleMate:

So...this is unacceptable in a 1:1 r/s. Don't stand for it. I would let him know that this is a dealbreaker. The visits (without you) are bad enough, but it is ALWAYS a bad thing when your supposed SO fails to acknowledge you to a member of the opposite sex.

[giltedgedgoblin]

Yes, it is a figure of speech!!

 

OK, so how about i make the matter even more complicated, and also quite possibly open myself up to massive criticism and branding a hypocrite and admit that i am married.

 

Does it make any difference? Do you think my guy would admit to his American friend he had a girlfriend if that girlfriend was single and it was an exclusive reltionship? Or do you think he's simply covering up to avoid the disapproval of dating a married woman?

[tokyo]

Well, so I find myself wasting my time with giving advice to a situation without knowing all the facts. I don't care if you're married or not, but I don't see the purpose of asking for advice and hiding things of which you are aware that they form an essential part of the situation. Get your advice from someone else.

[giltedgedgoblin]

Jeez, take it easy.

 

The original question i asked advice on was whether states in the southern US frowned upon premarital sex, which is the reason my lover gave me for not telling his friend i stayed overnight with him.

 

I appreciate pretty much everyone frowns upon extramarital affairs and i haven't ever expected my lover to go around telling people he's sleeping with a married woman.

[SoleMate]

I am slightly paranoid & insecure as i have been used & cheated on in a previous relationship....began talking to a guy online...We are sexually involved....i am married....

Well, that DOES change things a bit. I assumed that you and your bf were attempting to have an exclusive 1:1 r/s...but now I understand why it doesn't feel that way to him. If he doesn't object to your having a husband, you have minimal grounds to object to him having another "platonic" girl.

 

...am i being unnecessarily paranoid?

You're afraid of getting cheated on, so you took the bull by your horns and started cheating so you could get yours in first? Help me out here. What is the nature of your r/s with your H?

[alphamale]

Originally posted by giltedgedgoblin

He has a female friend who lives in southern USA whom he also met on the internet. He has known her 3 or 4 years and visits her maybe twice a year.

ask him that next time he goes to see her that u want to go also. his reaction to this will tell u what u want to know.

[tokyo]

Originally posted by giltedgedgoblin

Jeez, take it easy.

 

The original question i asked advice on was whether states in the southern US frowned upon premarital sex, which is the reason my lover gave me for not telling his friend i stayed overnight with him.

 

I appreciate pretty much everyone frowns upon extramarital affairs and i haven't ever expected my lover to go around telling people he's sleeping with a married woman.

You got nine posts from different people trying to help you till you came out with a pretty important detail that changed the situation to a great deal. Think about it. You really should try to give a complete overview of your situation otherwise people lose time with advice that is not even of any use for you.

 

I wouldn't necessarily call your boyfriend weak anymore. I'm more inclined to believe your friend doesn't want to open up a can of worms and admit that you're his girlfriend, because maybe he would get questioned about premarital sex (even when it's not their business) and then he would have to hide the fact that you are married (or maybe he has told them that you were married before he started seeing you). So instead of making up a lot of lies that tend to get a life of their own, he makes up one lie, that you are only a friend. It's a white lie, because he doesn't feel like explaining a complicated situation to people who very likely will not understand it anyway.

[HoldOn]

The original question i asked advice on was whether states in the southern US frowned upon premarital sex,

 

Premarital sex is a whole different thing from being married and sleeping with another person. Infidelity is frowned upon by many more people than pre-marital sex.

[giltedgedgoblin]

I can see why i may have confused the issue somewhat.

 

Regarding my relationship with my husband, technically we are still married, i.e we are not seperated - however, our "relationship" as such does not exist, neither emotionally nor sexually and has not done for many years. As such, i do not consider i am cheating on him and yes, i do consider my relationship with my boyfriend to be exclusive.

 

The comment about the white lie being better than a whole string of lies is a fair & understandable comment. It's not something i had previously considered, so thankyou.

[FolderWife]

If he says, "I'm dating goblin" she and her family will probably say, "ARE YOU CRAZY!?! WHAT ARE YOU DOING, DATING A MARRIED WOMAN?!?"

 

While premarital sex is not necessarily frowned on in the USA, sleeping with a married person DEFINATELY IS!!!

 

Um...DUH! If these people are like a "second family" then he doesn't want them looking down on him by lowering himself to dating a married woman.

 

DUH! Now, if you were single, then you'd have every right to demand that he acknowledge you as his girlfriend...but as long as you are "married" then he has a right to be embarassed that he's dating you.