Should I do anything or ride this storm out

[Bigdaddyt]

I am a long time viewer of LS and I don’t even know where to begin or if this is really anything that I should stir up, but I have been triggering badly for the last several months and I would like some advice so that I don’t do somethingstupid. My story I am a survivor of infidelity in that my first wife cheated onme and I actually caught her in the act and it was all that I could do not to physically hurt my XW and her AP, when I caught them in our marital bed. I didtry a short R however, I just couldn’t do it and we divorced.

Now to the present, I am currently married to a beautifulwoman for 20 years who I adore and have severely spoiled over the years. I guess I was trying to insure that this type of betrayal never happened to me again. I worked a lot of hours to insure that my wife and children are wellcared for and I have been very fortunate that with a lot of hard work I have moved up in my company and provide them with a very nice life style.

Now the bad: My wife has always been a terrible flirt withother men and on more than one occasion I had to ask her to stop what she was doing (especially when she was drinking). She would always tell me that it wasn’t anything and that I need to stop being so jealous. She would say this but if I even looked at or talked to another woman my wife would become very angry and showed her jealous side. About 9 years ago my wife and I met a couplewith a daughter that was the same age as our youngest son and we all became closefriends. My wife would go out at least once a week with this girlfriend while I stayed home with our children. I just thought that being a SAHM she needed abreak from the children. The girl’s nights out started to become more frequentand started to play games on Facebook with guy friends on the PC at home. I didadvised her that I didn’t like her talking to these men on the PC and I thoughtthat some of their comments were inappropriate. Wife responded with anger andsaid that there are times that she needs a break and she isn’t doing anythingwrong. It is all in my head.

On the GNO she would always come home and wake me up to havesex, so I never thought that she would ever cheat on me. This type of behaviorcontinued for about six months until her Mother confronted her and told herthat she was behaving inappropriately and that she wasn’t her daughter if shecontinued to act like a tramp and run around on her husband and children.Honestly I just thought that she was going through a phase and would get overit. I finally told her that I was no longer okay with her going out as much asshe was and it finally came to a head when I went to pick her and this GF up ata upscale bar near our house and instead of texting her that I was there, Ijust walked in and found her and her GF sitting at the bar with two men. I musthave looked extremely upset because the one guy with my wife looked terrifiedwhen she told him who I was. I am 6’2” and at the time weighed 250 lbs

We fought and she said that it was nothing she was just there to support her friend. I told her that next time I walk in on her with another man there is going to be trouble.

My wife stayed home for some time after this and the GNO stopped for a while, I told my wife if she had so much free time she needed to do something with her life and I paid for her to go back to college and get a degree. I worked full time and paid all of the bills and did everything around the house. She attended college full time and I took care of everything to allow her to study. One night we were at a friend’s party and I was inside andcould not find my wife so I went to look for her and found her in a hot tubwith another man and his wife and my wife and the OM wife here in their pantiesand bras making out. They did not see me. I was stunned and I didn’t know whatto do, I stood there for a moment then I walked up to the hot tub and the twowomen split up and the OM told me to relax they are just fooling around. Icalmly asked my wife (who was extremely drunk) to get out and that we weregoing home. My wife said that she wasn’t leaving and that I should go home. I thenreached into the hot tub and picked her up and wrapped her in a towel and tookher home.

I forbid her from ever hanging out with this couple againand told them that they were evil doers and I don’t want them around. The nextday the wife apologized and said that she was so drunk and could not drink inthe hot tub. I said that this was BS that she made a choice and that I am tiredof her pushing the boundaries. I started doing the 180 hard and joined afitness club and became a gym rat for the next 2 years. I lost over 30 poundsand became extremely physically fit. So much so that my wife started showing me attention again and wanting to fix our relationship.

In a recent fight my wife said that she was sorry for goingout with other men and that she just thought that I knew. I was stunned by this comment; I asked her if she had sex with them she swore that she had not. I just am starting to wonder if this is even true. I recently triggered when my gut screamed that she is cheating. I have not caught her, but our sex lifestopped to twice a month, she is very critical of everything that I do, the GNO have started with other married girlfriends who all seem to be unhappy withtheir spouses. My wife has also said in anger that when she completes college things are going to change. She also has told me that she would never keep the children from me if we divorce. Some days are great others make me wonder. I am venting here and wondering if there is something to all of this smoke

Edited August 21, 2015 by Bigdaddyt

[LifesontheUp]

Sorry for what you are going through, what looks like for a second time.

 

Your wife has some serious boundary issues. Can I ask why she has to go out for GNO's and flirt and be with men? She's married, why isn't she going out with her husband?

 

My advice is that you need to get into marriage counselling?

[Clay]

I think Life is right. There are serious boundary issues and honestly what real consequences have you set up for her actions. Telling her she can't go out just is like a punishment and she will just resent you over time for that. I am not saying end your marriage but sometimes people have to know that is where this will go when they continue to do these things. Just like you said it was her choice to join in with the thing in the hot tub. I am a firm believer in making it very clear that when they cross a line like that they are agreeing to a divorce and I don't believe in bluffing.

 

I think for your sake and your family GNO's go away and so does drinking. She needs to make this choice on her own. I would tell her honestly your considering divorce as a option at this point. She will either want to fix things or she wont. If she wakes up and realizes what she looses in all this then marriage counseling is on the path for the both of you if not then your just going to have to draw a line in the sand or tolerate her behavior.

 

I know it seems a bit extreme and I am not saying you should divorce her but you need to make it clear her actions have consequences. If you don't she will just continue to do them again.

 

I would also tell her if she wants to go out on GNO's and hang out with other people you will do the same. Let her wonder who your with while she is at home with the kids.

 

C

[Bigdaddyt]

Lifeson the up, Yes I know that she has boundariy issues. Her Father was a bad alcoholic and a homicide detective and was never available for her growing up. She has always craved mens attention. Clay, I haven't posted every detail but there is alot more to this story. we have talked divorce and it was started when our middle son was having melt downs saying he hates his Mother and shows no respect to me. It finally dawned on me that our son was angry with his Mother not being around for years when he was young and he is upset that I didn't make her stay home as a Mother should. This is when she apologized for running around on me with this girlfriend, who is now divorced and lost custody of her children. I am not trying to villianize my wife, she is now a great mother and she has alot of close friends that are constantly calling her and are at the house visiting. I recently told her she is a great Mother, a great friend, a great Daughter, but a lousy Wife.

[LifesontheUp]

So are you going to get marriage counselling?

 

Past is just an excuse in my honest opinion. Its like saying my father beat me so its ok if I beat my kids.

[Bigdaddyt]

Lifeson the up, No we haven't I have brought it up and she has said that she does want to go and that we don't need it. My wife was involved in a severe car accident two years ago and her recovery is the reason I didn't push to confront this issue. I have been taking care of her and our children. We did meet with a counseler about her phyiscal injuries and I did bring up all of this information. Just to note: if I determine that she has cheated on me in the past, that is a deal breaker for me I am a former Marine Officer and I cannot accept betrayal.

[Clay]

If you have already talked to her about this and yet the behavior is still going on then you already know your answer. Your wasting your good years to be with someone who doesn't want to change.

 

I know its gotta hurt to think about that but the fact that you have always put your kids first you might want to consider doing that again and push for custody of them. My xW was a serial cheater as well. I did keep custody of my kids. A woman that goes out with other men while her husband is at home with the kids is not a good mother.

 

I would push for marriage counseling right away and get into these issues. If that doesn't work out for you I think you need to think of you and the kids first.

 

 

Sorry.

[LifesontheUp]

I'm struggling to see how you are going to get past this if she will not go to counselling.

 

Having re read what you wrote, it seems that she is threatening things are going to change to you. So:

 

I think for your marriage to stand a chance you need someone outside of it like a counsellor to talk things through with. Her behaviour is disrespectful and her boundaries are too.

 

Perhaps its time to tell her marriage counselling or she goes? Think you may need to take a stand.

[Bigdaddyt]

Clay, I have recently taken steps to protect my self financially and I am setting up an account to be there if I decide to bail. She adores the children so she would never do anything to knowingly hurt them. I just don't think that she has any desire for me anymore. Lifesontheup, I am currently balancing her physical recovery with the marriage recovery. The Marriage recovery took back seat when she was severely injured. By the way I have read both No More Mister Nice Guy (I am the poster child) and MMSLP. I cannot even believe that I am here I am a two time loser in this area and I know that I am 50% responsible for the condition of this marriage, but honestly I always believed that I was doing the right things as a Husband. I an fit, attentive, and provide for my family which has allowed her to be a SAHM for twenty years.

[Clay]

Your not a two time looser. The woman you chose are the losers. They are the ones that are choosing to step out and not deal with there issues like a adult. There cheating is not reflection on the problems you added to the marriage. Just like you they had ever chance to come forward and talk about the issues before stepping out.

 

If she is unwilling to help herself then there is nothing you can do to help her. Its not your job to be her mother. While she may feel grateful for you taking care of her she clearly is not demonstrating she respects you enough to re invest in the marriage. Its your job as a father to protect and take care of your children. While she might not want to intentionally hurt the children she is hurting them none the less indirectly.

 

I did what I felt was right for me and my kids when it all went down for me. I have never regretted kicking her out. I only regret choosing her as a mate in the first place. She continued to cheat and now she has put herself in such a bad place my kids don't see there mother anymore. Its not because I am blocking her from calling them or seeing them its because she ran off with another guy and she is living in a truck with him from state to state.

 

Like you I pressed for her to go into counceling and she chose not to.

 

Continue to prepare yourself It sounds like your going to need all the support you can get when it all goes down.

 

C

[Bigdaddyt]

Clay and Lifes on the up, Thankyou for your support and your kind words. I am so sorry Clay that you are going through this with your Xw. I also had two children with my XWW and I went through the divorce from He__ and I know the pain that you are going through, I lived it for over twenty years. I am now well off and my XW is also failing living alone in an apartment, while I live a very blessed lifestyle. I know that this is not my fault, however I am a people pleaser. I always tried to make peace and fix problems. I akways seem to pick people that need fixing. It a character flaw in me.

[elaine567]

I know that this is not my fault, however I am a people pleaser. I always tried to make peace and fix problems. I akways seem to pick people that need fixing. It a character flaw in me.

 

Now you know, it is time to stop it and change. That flaw is not doing you any favours.

[Clay]

Now you know, it is time to stop it and change. That flaw is not doing you any favours.

 

That was great:) I have not seen that one before.

 

Imagine just how many times that should have been used on these sites. Perhaps this should be a tag in the OM/OW Part of this site lol.

 

 

C

[Bigdaddyt]

elaine567, I know that this is my problem; however I have come long way in my life, my parents divorce when I was very young and I never saw my Father again, I was more of a Father to my Mother than a Son, I was really beat down by my Mother and I guess that made me the way I am. Outside of my relationships I have done well for myself. I always tell my children that Life is a journey not a destination.

[bubbaganoosh]

Just to note: if I determine that she has cheated on me in the past, that is a deal breaker for me I am a former Marine Officer and I cannot accept betrayal.

 

Honestly your doing a pretty good job of accepting it. You can't accept betrayal. How long did you watch your wife and that other couple in the hot tub? How long did you watch your wife making out with that guys wife?

 

How long do you think it would have gone on and how far it would have progressed before you stopped it? Ever think that maybe the guy in the tub would have been satisfied just watching? The next step groping and then after that?

 

It's bad enough that you had to drag her ass out of the bar while she and her friend were with two other guys. Now you have the hot tub issue so you tell me where you haven't seen betrayal because I've seen at least two.

 

My advice is this. Let her pay for her college. let her know that if she wants changes after college, then change them now. Tell her to get a job, get student loans and earn her way through on her own dime.

 

So far you see the handwriting on the wall bur refuse to do anything about it. What's it going to take for you to see what she's doing, actually seeing her having sex with another person? If she's making out with a woman and some guy watching then it seems like she's game for a whole lot more so you damn well better start swinging a big hammer and bring it down hard because from what I'm seeing, your losing this battle big time and if you lose the battle, you lose the war. Wise up friend.

Edited August 21, 2015 by bubbaganoosh

[sandylee1]

GNOs are not the problem. Your wife is the problem. Just because one is married doesn't mean you can't go out with your friends anymore. I go on GNOs and girl's weekends and I would never cheat.

 

Her drinking is a problem too. If she can't hold her drink, then she should only drink at home or when she's with you.

 

You're doing right to protect your finances. If she doesn't have the desire, then she'll continue to seek the outside attention.

 

You need to let her know what you expect and want of her as a wife and she does the same and ultimately determine if you are able to meet each others needs. Otherwise, go full steam ahead with planning your exit.

[Buckeye2]

In a recent fight my wife said that she was sorry for going out with other men and that she just thought that I knew. I was stunned by this comment; I asked her if she had sex with them she swore that she had not.

 

What is your wife’s definition of “going out with other men?” It sounds to me that your wife assumed that you had an open marriage because you were so comfortable with her girls’ night out. People commonly assume crazy things to make themselves feel less guilty. For example: My husband is probably having an affair so I can too, etc.

 

Then she saw how upset you were and that her assumption was wrong. That’s when the damage control started. So her story is that there was no sex but she was “going out.” What exactly is “going out with other men?”

 

It’s not sitting at a bar talking to a man because of the following, so what is it?

 

I just walked in and found her and her GF sitting at the bar with two men. I must have looked extremely upset because the one guy with my wife looked terrified (because he was trying to pick her up) when she told him who I was (he didn't know she was married). I told her that next time I walk in on her with another man there is going to be trouble.

[Mr Mind of Shazam]

I am venting here and wondering if there is something to all of this smoke

There's a forest fire, not smoke.

[bigman1]

I also had two children with my XWW and I went through the divorce from He__ and I know the pain that you are going through, I lived it for over twenty years. I am now well off and my XW is also failing living alone in an apartment, while I live a very blessed lifestyle. I know that this is not my fault, however I am a people pleaser. I always tried to make peace and fix problems. I akways seem to pick people that need fixing. It a character flaw in me.

 

Big,

 

You need help. You also need to really ask yourself why your opening post is so tepid. You caught your second wife kissing another woman while her husband watched. She later told you that she went out with other men and thought that you knew??!!!!!

 

Stick a fork in this marriage. Its done. If you are unsure of what to do in light of this, then you really need to get to a counselor for some individual counseling. No books for you, you need live help. Not a slam against you.

 

Say those words out loud to yourself. "She thought I knew" and she thought I was fine with it. How open and brazen was she to believe that I knew? Why would she do it anyway? Why is she worth one more day?

 

You keep picking the same kind of broke. Fix you.

[Try]

if I determine that she has cheated on me in the past, that is a deal breaker for me I am a former Marine Officer and I cannot accept betrayal.

Stripping down to her panties and bra to make out with someone in a hot tub is cheating. The fact that it was another woman does not matter. Also, after she refused to get out of the hot tub with the person that she was cheating with, and told you to go home by yourself, had you done as she told you, can your really say they would not have taken if farther or that it would not have turned into a threesome? She did this at a party that you were at. Image what she has done when she was "going out with other men" and what she meant when she said "that she just thought that I knew". One more thing, I find it amazing that your wife's mother told her to stop tramping around with other men before you did. Edited August 21, 2015 by Try

[sandylee1]

Does her mom know more than you do?

[Bigdaddyt]

Bubba,Buckeye and LS forum, OUCH! the 2x4s do hurt but I am really thick skinned. I know that I have issues being a former doormat, it has taken me time to understand where I am at. I was raised in and out of fostercare and really grew up with no concept of what a good relationship was. I lost my first family to infidelity, it will not happen again. My wife and I do get along and spend time together, we were best friends. I do believe that she had boundary issues and low self esteem and this along with her unhappy toxic friends led us to where we are now. As far as her telling me about that she thought that I knew about the other men is the problem and I plan to talk with her over the weekend after we drop our daughter off at College.

[Bigdaddyt]

Sandylee, My wifes Mother is an absolute doll. I could not ask for a better MIL. She has told me that she loves me like her son and we have a great relationship. My MIL if she knew something she would have confronted my wife and has in the past.

[Bigdaddyt]

Try,

I did breakup the hot tub trio and I told her she could not have any contact with this couple again. Would it have gone any farther probably if I hadn't caught them. Is she remorseful Yes, is she trying to fix things between us sometimes. I have tried VAR trying to catch new activity but I have captured anything. I did tell my wife that if I catch her being unfaithful to me with a man or another woman we are done.

[Sandy43]

It sounds to me like your wife has some serious issues, she definately needs IC and possibly AA. I rarely do GNO, I would rather go out with my husband or he and I will go out with a group of our friends.