Should I do anything or ride this storm out

[Bigdaddyt]

I'm sorry, BigDaddy, for what you are going through.

 

I am a woman who was involved in a relationship with an alcoholic with BPD. The ending of that relationship is what brought me to this site in 2008. I tried to work things out with my guy. Believe me, I tried everything. But I didn't have kids.

 

That said, in your shoes I would move forward with the divorce.

 

Marriage vows were constructed back when people didn't live past thirty-five years old, so 'till death do us part, had an entirely different meaning than it does today! People raised a gaggle of kids to be farmhands, and tend to the family's food crops or livestock business. Couples were more dependent on each other, and a single woman was unable to support herself. This is no longer true in our world.

 

The continuous stress of emotional/psychological warfare affects the human condition more than physical abuse, and some men develop serious ailments during their time in these relationships. Prostate problems, heart conditions, blood disorders, herpes breakouts, migraine headaches and glaucoma are a few of the souvenirs men have retained from these relationships -- regardless of how physically powerful they were, before they met the Borderline. If you've repressed your anger in this marriage and felt long-term resentment, you may start having physical ailments as well.

 

How a Borderline deals with relationships is almost textbook: Many do not treat marriage as a new beginning--but rather, an end-game. You work hard to please and get a crumb or two in gratitude, but are abused for your efforts. That will not stop! And for your own well-being, end the cycle. You can be there for your kids and - yes! - even for your STBXW, but not as her husband, but as her friend.

 

You do not have a healthy marriage and it is unlikely that it would EVER be a healthy marriage. You deserve that, at least. There is no reason you can't help and support her through a diagnosis and treatment plan, but do so as a compassionate friend. If you step away from the nurturer/husband role, you both have an opportunity to thrive and succeed.

 

I believe if you stay married, you will - in a sense - be agreeing to forego your own future and well-being for your wife's potential sanity. And that is not fair to you.

CarrieT, I am sorry for the pain that you went through with your XH,you are a survivor. Your post is spot on and is is almost as if you were reading my mind when you wrote this. I am physically very healthy now, but this constant upset is really taking a toll on my mental health. I am depressed and angry at the same time and I dont sleep more than a few hours a night. I havent had anything to drink in several weeks and have started to take melatoin to help me sleep. My WW does drink too much but I dont consider her an alcoholic. I did monitor this.

We are currently living seperately but she comes over daily to put the youngest on the bus in the morning.

I haven't decided on what I should do, a lot of the LS members will tell me to go forward with D. The D is on going but it will take months.

Edited September 24, 2015 by Bigdaddyt

[SpokenFor]

Hi BigDaddy,

 

It is a tough call -- and I find it hard to understand why your family is all over you if they know what she's been up to recently. Hope you can find some space to make your decision your way. I get that folks like her father will see that it is better for her interest that she stay married to you. That makes sense from their perspective.

 

My advice? Well, I think if you weren't moving forward with the divorce she would still be bad-mouthing you, sleeping with men and women, partying, etc. as she did in Vegas right up until you moved forward. That says you have to keep some pressure on or she will not do the work.

 

That's the key for me -- she has to be doing the work. She has to understand that BPD or whatever is a condition, not an excuse, and that this does not join the long list of excuses she has at hand for bad behavior. In some sense the future betrayals you will need to prepare for and probably endure will be worse if she can just say something like "I have a condition that can control me, it isn't my fault so you have to forgive me."

 

For now I'd suggest telling her that you will continue the process and watch to see how she does the work, whether she means it, whether she is doing everything she can to give you good reasons to stay married to someone who has done what she has already done and who will require your constant support and understanding in the future.

 

I think you need to tell her these things directly. Once she understands and agrees (if not, divorce at full speed), the two of you must go together to the people who are pressuring you in both families and in your circle of friends and lay out in whatever detail you feel necessary the extent of her previous betrayals. You both need to tell them to back off and let the process go forward, that she is dedicated to doing the work and you are ready to believe her but will take the steps to also be ready to end things if she cannot or will not do the work.

 

Best of luck, you are being compassionate in a tough spot and I hope you are rewarded. I doubt the rewards will be unambiguous or pain-free, but I hope they are worth it and think that they have a chance to be just that.

[Bigdaddyt]

Hi BigDaddy,

 

It is a tough call -- and I find it hard to understand why your family is all over you if they know what she's been up to recently. Hope you can find some space to make your decision your way. I get that folks like her father will see that it is better for her interest that she stay married to you. That makes sense from their perspective.

 

My advice? Well, I think if you weren't moving forward with the divorce she would still be bad-mouthing you, sleeping with men and women, partying, etc. as she did in Vegas right up until you moved forward. That says you have to keep some pressure on or she will not do the work.

 

That's the key for me -- she has to be doing the work. She has to understand that BPD or whatever is a condition, not an excuse, and that this does not join the long list of excuses she has at hand for bad behavior. In some sense the future betrayals you will need to prepare for and probably endure will be worse if she can just say something like "I have a condition that can control me, it isn't my fault so you have to forgive me."

 

For now I'd suggest telling her that you will continue the process and watch to see how she does the work, whether she means it, whether she is doing everything she can to give you good reasons to stay married to someone who has done what she has already done and who will require your constant support and understanding in the future.

 

I think you need to tell her these things directly. Once she understands and agrees (if not, divorce at full speed), the two of you must go together to the people who are pressuring you in both families and in your circle of friends and lay out in whatever detail you feel necessary the extent of her previous betrayals. You both need to tell them to back off and let the process go forward, that she is dedicated to doing the work and you are ready to believe her but will take the steps to also be ready to end things if she cannot or will not do the work.

 

Best of luck, you are being compassionate in a tough spot and I hope you are rewarded. I doubt the rewards will be unambiguous or pain-free, but I hope they are worth it and think that they have a chance to be just that.

Spoken for, Thankyou for your detail response, I agree that this condition does not give her a free pass for her past or future bad behavior. I will set boundaries with her whether we stay together or not.

Family and friends did not ever see her bad side we kept it hidden, they only saw the good Mother and Wife. I should have exposed this when it was happening.

I am trying to make a good decision based on what is truly best for everyone including myself.

[Bigdaddyt]

#2

 

 

My situation was somewhat similar to yours.

 

I couldn't control him. I couldn't control what others thought...or said.

 

 

I made decisions based on MY boundary, principles and integrity.

 

If I stayed I would forfeit my self respect. If I left I had a chance for freedom.

 

Even IF she eventually gets well/better - it's no guarantee that she suddenly grows a conscience/becomes a decent person.

 

 

 

Look after or oversee her care for a long while, if needed? Yes.

 

Take her back under the guise that she's changed? No.

 

 

You can t lol family and friends to quit trying to tell you to accept the unacceptable.

 

You have every right to be happy - to have peace of mind. To not feel guilty for things YOU didn't create/do.

 

 

Do what's best for yourself.

S2B, Your story that you shared and mine are very similar. I want to make the right decision for everyone, but I also want to be happy. I do deserve this and came back here becuase I was second guessing my decision to D. I will tell my family and friends that I can no longer accept the unacceptable and I also deserve respect and happiness. I guess that if I can divorce and take care of everyone that would be the best outcome, but not likely. Someone always wins and someone looses.

[OldRover]

I too have some experience with BPD. My SO (former GF) had it and I tried like crazy to solve it. She wasn't willing to get help and it was just impossible to deal with. She went from black to white with wild swings in her mood, and her relationship with me. Never knew what was next and the stress finally got to me after I was under a doctors and counselors care.

 

I would have given anything to make it work, but it's hard to fight someone that doesn't want to improve.

 

I know it IS possible to heal, but will take a LOT of effort.

[turnera]

kgcolonel, I know that I will have to soften my heart to attempt R, I do remember how my wife really did save me when I was young and made me a better person. I am currently on track to D, wife is begging for a chance at R, will do or sign anything (post nuptial) to get us back together.

That is when you tell her that you WILL be divorcing and that if she still wants to pursue you after the divorce, she is welcome to, and if you do end up remarrying, it will be with a prenup, not a (weaker) postnup.

[Spectre]

Of course she is begging, but don't give in man, divorce her. If she loved you she WOULD NOT of done these things to you. You deserve to be with someone who actually loves and respects you and most importantly..someone who has respect for themselves. Your wife has none of these qualities.

[CarrieT]

Also BPD is not an excuse for cheating nor should it be a Get Out of Jail Free card.

[bigman1]

Also BPD is not an excuse for cheating nor should it be a Get Out of Jail Free card.

 

This is such a true statement. Earlier, I discussed BPD. I think that while it is not an excuse, it is a reason that changes how things are assessed.

 

If one's spouse was on AM and cheating and did not have BPD, or was in a LTR, or whatever, it would make me think that they had bad intentions or disregard and don't deserve a second look. On the other hand, if they did the same and had BPD, I would look at it differently. Medication would have given them impulse control. Does it mean that they deserve a second look? No. It just means that the evaluation process might be different. Neither lessens the pain and insecurity.

 

An undiagnosed BPD condition vs. unmanaged BPD sufferer vs. non compliant BPD sufferer are all different from each other and all different from a plain old cheater.

 

End TJ.

[qubist]

I wantto thank Qubist for pointing out this as a possibility;

Please don't mention it, I'm glad I was able to help, that's what these kind of forums are all about. every thread is a lesson for me . without yours I would never have heard about BPD. Thank you for sharing your story

]The questions Iwant to ask this forum: If you were me knowing what I have dealt with overthe last few years, by reading my thread with my WW/STBXW with her infidelities and verbal abuse. Now with the possibility that she has BPD along with the TBI and depression: 1) would you stop the divorce and work with the medical professionals to make sure that she gets the treatment she needs and try to put the marriage back on track with counseling and medical care. If you choose this option, what requirements would you want in place to make sure that you are protected in the future? 2) Continue with the divorce, and if so what would you do to make sure that you are not perceived as the bad guy and remembering that I will be tied to this woman for life because of the children and possibly grandchildren?

bigdaddyT: before I tell my with POV i want to point out to something important, nobody here can/should tell you what to do, you and only you must do it, we all give you different POV to make you see some details that you might not be aware of.

you gave 2 options and asked us which one we would recommend, in my opinion if she is diagnosed with BPD you should consider an option 3 that you didn't list.

Option3: stop the D process for now ( if possible), make it clear that you haven't abandoned the possibility of D, help her get stabilized and more more importantly get yourself back on your feet. it will be some sort of break from this ordeal.

If you do that she will get an additional emotional boost that she desperately needs at this time, your family will appreciate the sacrifice specially your kids, and you will get a period of relative peace to work on yourself.

do you have the right to just walk away and leave her on her own? absolutely, I read carrieT post and she made complete sense, but I'm afraid that if things go really bad with your W which would affect your kids too, you will regret not stepping up when you could. you are also in depression that I can read between the lines of your posts you haven't had much sleep, you need to take a break from all this and take care of yourself.

lastly, what i also read between the lines of your posts is that you are a great man with good heart and mental strength. regardless of what option you choose you will make it at the end.

[TX-SC]

Please don't mention it, I'm glad I was able to help, that's what these kind of forums are all about. every thread is a lesson for me . without yours I would never have heard about BPD. Thank you for sharing your story

 

bigdaddyT: before I tell my with POV i want to point out to something important, nobody here can/should tell you what to do, you and only you must do it, we all give you different POV to make you see some details that you might not be aware of.

you gave 2 options and asked us which one we would recommend, in my opinion if she is diagnosed with BPD you should consider an option 3 that you didn't list.

Option3: stop the D process for now ( if possible), make it clear that you haven't abandoned the possibility of D, help her get stabilized and more more importantly get yourself back on your feet. it will be some sort of break from this ordeal.

If you do that she will get an additional emotional boost that she desperately needs at this time, your family will appreciate the sacrifice specially your kids, and you will get a period of relative peace to work on yourself.

do you have the right to just walk away and leave her on her own? absolutely, I read carrieT post and she made complete sense, but I'm afraid that if things go really bad with your W which would affect your kids too, you will regret not stepping up when you could. you are also in depression that I can read between the lines of your posts you haven't had much sleep, you need to take a break from all this and take care of yourself.

lastly, what i also read between the lines of your posts is that you are a great man with good heart and mental strength. regardless of what option you choose you will make it at the end.

 

Good post! There's not a lot I can add to this. I'll only say that you need to follow your best judgement about what is right for you. If she is diagnosed with BPD, seek a second opinion. Your wife is manipulative and you don't want to be manipulated into staying. If you DO stay, do so because you want to and because it is right for you and your family. Doctors can misdiagnose. Get a second opinion.

 

I am somewhat of a softy and tend to lean toward R if the WS shoestring remorse. We do not know your wife so we can only judge her through your descriptions of events. You know your wife so you are better capable of determining where she stands.

[Bigdaddyt]

All: I took my wife to meet with a pyschiatrist yesterday and he spent about an hour and a half with her in private. He then met with me for about 25 minutes, also in private. I told him a very condensed version of her infidelities and behaviors, as well as her sleep disorder. He said that based on all of her conditions prior to the accident and post he would diagnosis her as having BPD. He also said that she is suffering from severe depression; which is his current focus for her care. I asked him how severe her BPD was and he said that he would rate it as moderate and advised a holistic approach to her treatment.

I have reread my posts and I am all over the board with my emotions, I am functioning but am severely stressed. I am dealing with my boys who are acting out and my oldest is starting to be disrespectful and aggressive with me, they are children and are starting to act out becuase their Mother isn't home. If I sound crazy, I assure that I am not just been burning my candle at both ends trying to work and deal with all this drama.

The D is still on going but I am working with WW to get her treated and I may allow her to come back to the house in the to help me with the boys. I haven't made a choice on what I am going to do long term, it will depend on the WW and if I am able to heal. Infidelity the gift that keeps on giving.

[Bigdaddyt]

Please don't mention it, I'm glad I was able to help, that's what these kind of forums are all about. every thread is a lesson for me . without yours I would never have heard about BPD. Thank you for sharing your story

 

bigdaddyT: before I tell my with POV i want to point out to something important, nobody here can/should tell you what to do, you and only you must do it, we all give you different POV to make you see some details that you might not be aware of.

you gave 2 options and asked us which one we would recommend, in my opinion if she is diagnosed with BPD you should consider an option 3 that you didn't list.

Option3: stop the D process for now ( if possible), make it clear that you haven't abandoned the possibility of D, help her get stabilized and more more importantly get yourself back on your feet. it will be some sort of break from this ordeal.

If you do that she will get an additional emotional boost that she desperately needs at this time, your family will appreciate the sacrifice specially your kids, and you will get a period of relative peace to work on yourself.

do you have the right to just walk away and leave her on her own? absolutely, I read carrieT post and she made complete sense, but I'm afraid that if things go really bad with your W which would affect your kids too, you will regret not stepping up when you could. you are also in depression that I can read between the lines of your posts you haven't had much sleep, you need to take a break from all this and take care of yourself.

lastly, what i also read between the lines of your posts is that you are a great man with good heart and mental strength. regardless of what option you choose you will make it at the end.

Qubist, Thankyou for this post it is spot on and you are always a voice of reason. I am considering an option 3, but I do not have to stop the D, I would just delay it when the time to do so is necessary to extend the marriage.

The children are my concern and I was told that suicide is fairly common with this condition, which scare the life out of me. I could not live with that guilt and my children would never forgive me the WW did this. I have gotten away from my faith over the last several years but I am trying to pull myself and family back into it, it can't hurt.

[m.snow]

(((( bdt ))))

 

bdt take it one step at time.

don't burn yourself out.

 

breath deep and exhale

calm your self down no need to rush anything.

 

eat and sleep well ok!

 

trust in your 19 and 17 yo

 

wishing you the best! and just take it slow and steady.

[Clay]

All this makes me think you need to get custody of your kids and divorce here. You are not going to be able to save her. She is going to need help from professionals. If you stay with her your not only going to have to live with her new condition but your going to have to tolerate her cheating. This not only punishes you over and over but it teaches the kids that is ok to do this when your sick.

 

I know that would be hard for your kids but realize they are just kids. They do not know what is always right for them. It is not like they still can't see her often and maintain a good relationship with her but you need to be the primary custodial parent.

 

Damn what a mess. Sounds just like my xW. She was taken to jail two days ago for failing to appear on a possession charge.

 

Sorry man.

 

C

[turnera]

Two thoughts. Can you bring in a family member or close friend to start spending more time with you and your kids? Kids will adapt to any kind of 'family,' and having other people spending more time with them will help them feel safer and less reactive.

 

Also, if you do reach out for the church, if it's one you've been with for a while, consider asking for their help, too. Even for your wife.

[Bigdaddyt]

(((( bdt ))))

 

bdt take it one step at time.

don't burn yourself out.

 

breath deep and exhale

calm your self down no need to rush anything.

 

eat and sleep well ok!

 

trust in your 19 and 17 yo

 

wishing you the best! and just take it slow and steady.

M.Snow, I am taking it one step at a time but my 17yoa had a major meltdown last night and took his dirtbike out at 9:00pm at night for a ride, no lights. I had to go and get him physically and bring him back I lectured him on how dangerous and immature his actions were. My youngest of course told my WW this morning who berated me like she is mother of the year. I told her I am handling this it is of no concern of yours.

[CarrieT]

I agree with Clay. Look at the big picture; kids are resilient and learn by example.

 

Exposing them to their mother's erratic behavior may cause more damage than giving the kids the illusion of a two-parent family.

 

I look at my husband of two years and his kids (now teenagers). I have heard stories about how the kids acted up when the divorce was happening (over ten years ago). Many who are involved in the kids' lives tell me how much happier and more stable they are now that their father is involved in a healthy, loving marriage versus the PsychoWard scenes that used to exist.

[Bigdaddyt]

All this makes me think you need to get custody of your kids and divorce here. You are not going to be able to save her. She is going to need help from professionals. If you stay with her your not only going to have to live with her new condition but your going to have to tolerate her cheating. This not only punishes you over and over but it teaches the kids that is ok to do this when your sick.

 

I know that would be hard for your kids but realize they are just kids. They do not know what is always right for them. It is not like they still can't see her often and maintain a good relationship with her but you need to be the primary custodial parent.

 

Damn what a mess. Sounds just like my xW. She was taken to jail two days ago for failing to appear on a possession charge.

 

Sorry man.

 

C

Clay, I am on the fence but would like to be free of her honestly, but I know we will be bound together for life becuase of the children. I am going to focus on helping her and raising the children and see where this progresses. I am also sorry for your pain with your XW, she is reaping what she sowed.

[Bigdaddyt]

Two thoughts. Can you bring in a family member or close friend to start spending more time with you and your kids? Kids will adapt to any kind of 'family,' and having other people spending more time with them will help them feel safer and less reactive.

 

Also, if you do reach out for the church, if it's one you've been with for a while, consider asking for their help, too. Even for your wife.

turnera, I could ask my younger sister she is an ER Nurse and is tough as nails to come stay with me. She has always been my go to person in a crisis. I have belonged to the same Catholic Church for 11 years, but they really don't have the outreach programs that protestant churches do. I will ask.

[Bigdaddyt]

I agree with Clay. Look at the big picture; kids are resilient and learn by example.

 

Exposing them to their mother's erratic behavior may cause more damage than giving the kids the illusion of a two-parent family.

 

I look at my husband of two years and his kids (now teenagers). I have heard stories about how the kids acted up when the divorce was happening (over ten years ago). Many who are involved in the kids' lives tell me how much happier and more stable they are now that their father is involved in a healthy, loving marriage versus the PsychoWard scenes that used to exist.

CarrieT, I am considering everything in regards to this mess, I know that Clay is not wrong with his assesment. I just want to make sure that I dont make a mistake that effects my kids.

[m.snow]

has the shrink prescribed your WW with medications ie anti-depressant?

 

remind her to be careful with those anti-depressants, they don't go well with alcohol!

 

that's how movie stars go!

[Bigdaddyt]

has the shrink prescribed your WW with medications ie anti-depressant?

 

remind her to be careful with those anti-depressants, they don't go well with alcohol!

 

that's how movie stars go!

m snow, The pyschiatrist did prescribe meds for her depression and he told her that she cannot drink while taking them and should not drink at all with this condition. I honestly do not see her following his advice. I spoke to her parents about this and her BFF's. I wish that I had a spouse that took care of me, like I do her, it would be great!

Edited September 25, 2015 by Bigdaddyt

[m.snow]

m snow, he told her that she cannot drink while taking them and should not drink at all with this condition. I honestly do not see her following his advice. I spoke to her parents about this and her BFF's. I wish that I had a spouse that took care of me, like I do her, it would be great!

 

good job! great that was quick thinking of you! to inform people around her!

 

if you can take some time of work.

you need some Rest and Relaxation.

do what you must.

[turnera]

Honestly, you're in no rush. Doing the right thing is more important at this stage, if you're up for it.