Is it possible to trust again?

[Sandy43]

BetrayedH, we have both read the thread pinned at the top, actually I found it on another site not too long after dday and it helped both of us. I reread it again this morning and he is doing everything on there as well as showing remorse. He doesn't talk about the A as he is ashamed of himself and just wants to move on and forget that it happened. But I cannot forget and I never will but I have also learned through MC that I can't dwell on it either. There are times when I think he would never do that again but then again I thought he never would have done it in the first place. Time will tell I guess.

CD I am very sorry what you have been through, I hope that one day you will find someone who will make you happy and will treat you well, there are people out there like that, maybe just a little harder to find but definitely worth the wait.

[malvern99]

Hi Sandy. I am sorry you are going through this. In my experience, trust is directly linked with the actions of the wayward. If the wayward is truly remorseful, they will gladly be 100% transparent. Transparency over a long time helps rebuild some of that trust. Unfortunately though, the trust will never be the same as it was pre A.

[Celestial-dreamer]

CD I am very sorry what you have been through, I hope that one day you will find someone who will make you happy and will treat you well, there are people out there like that, maybe just a little harder to find but definitely worth the wait.

 

Thanks for the words Sandy <3 but here's the thing. I've come to realise there isn't anyone for me. Everyone in my life let's me down. No matter how good I am to them, they always treat me like i'm trash. All nice to my face when they get what they want, behind my back...well you know the story. I'm done with being hurt all the time. I thought life was more, love was real and lasted forever. How wrong I am. I now know life is all about how much booty a man can get, who cares if he hurts a woman who loves him, it doesn't matter. He's *the man* when he cheats, all back patting from his mates. Whereas me, I was called a slut, for sleeping with ONE man ONCE in 10 yrs. No matter what I do, i'm always in the wrong. I gave up. I just can't do it anymore. I'm a real person, I don't play games, I don't cheat, I don't mess around. Yet i'm not good enough. So yeah I am that past it, there isn't one man out there who could change my mind on this. I used to think there was. Not anymore.

[Lois_Griffin]

He is completely transparent and has been since dday, I think when I read about others situations (how some people continue their A underground and pine for their AP's and continue to decieve after dday etc) it makes me start to wonder if he could be doing something like that eventhough he would have to be houdini to get anything by me at this point.

He wouldn't have to be Houdini at all. He could have a prepaid burner phone or one she gave him that she took out on her family plan - and that he keeps hidden from you. He could also have a secret email account you don't know about, he's also able to talk to her every day at work, have lunch with her, chat in each other's office, email each other using their company computers, and they could be using any of the many apps out there that let you communicate with others but don't leave details of it on your cell phone or your cell bill (SnapChat, WhatsApp, Kik, etc. etc. etc.) Hell, one betrayed wife came to find out that her husband had continued the affair after D-day and he and his OW were communicating through the chat function in some game app (Words with Friends? Can't remember which game it was). Hell, even the Trivia Crack game app has a chat function in the top toolbar.

 

Sadly, you really don't have to be Houdini in today's day and age to secretly communicate with someone. Not anymore.

 

BH I have a hard time with that myself but I do know that he never worked late, and was with me after work and on the weekends so I think it didn't progress that far however I think that it was heading that way and there was no opportunity for it to happen.

Said every betrayed spouse whose husband/wife had an affair at work but since they never came home late and were always home on the weekends, they must not have had any opportunities.

 

Wrong.

 

What you're NOT factoring into the equation is all the time they had together that you DON'T know about. Lunch hours, extended lunch hours, days where they may both have called in 'sick' and spent the entire day together, both getting into work late every now and then because she had "babysitter/kid problems" and he had a "flat tire," or both of them leaving work a couple hours early because she had to "take her invalid mother to therapy" and he had a "dentist apt," etc. etc.

 

You'd be surprised at how much cheaters can get away with during the day and still make it home at the same time every single night. And many betrayed spouses HAVE been amazed when they found out their cheating spouses were doing exactly what I wrote.

 

He's not remorseful. Anyone who doesn't want to talk about it and tries to constantly rugsweep it claiming he's oh so 'ashamed' just wants to avoid having to deal with your anger, hurt and disgust because it's unpleasant to deal with. That's NOT remorse. And it has precious little to do with shame or he would have ended it LONG before 7 months had gone by. He managed to play for 7 months and NOW he suddenly feels shame? Doubtful. he's just using that lame excuse to avoid having to deal with your anger.

 

He swears (of course) that the only physical contact between them was kissing a few times (which was at work) and she confirmed this, he offered to take a polygraph without me asking.

LOL. Of course he swears to that. They ALL do. Is there a cheater on this planet that DOESNT make this claim on D-day? None of them will admit it was physical unless you have proof in your hand. And according to a cheater, if you don't have solid proof then guess what? It didn't happen. And his OW 'confirmed' his story? Most cheaters already have their stories straight LONG before there's a D-Day. She'll tell you whatever he wants her to tell you. Her loyalties lie with him, not you. Hmmm...I guess there really is honor amongst thieves.

I didn't make him take one because of the cost and after reading about them and hearing that they weren't always reliable I found that it was not worth the cost if I wasn't going to be 100% sure I could trust the results.

And that's what he was banking on when he so generously offered to take a poly. Sorry, but that's another common ploy cheaters use as a show of trying to prove how 'honest' they're being with you. But make no mistake - they throw that offer out there thinking you'd never in a million years actually take them up on it. It's just another check their lying mouths don't want to cash when it's time to pay up.

 

Go ahead. Screw the cost and set up that polygraph. I can almost guarantee you he'll do his very best to talk you out of it using the exact reasons you listed. Plus, he'll also try to guilt you into canceling it by saying how he can't believe you'd reduce him to doing this and has your marriage really come down to this and blah blah blah. He'll use every trick in the book to try to get you to cancel. Or, he'll readily agree but as the day draws near, start giving excuses as to why you should cancel. In other words, some protest immediately and some wait until the day draws near. In either event, he'll try to get you to cancel it.

 

And that's because he's still lying. You can take that to the bank.

Edited August 29, 2015 by Lois_Griffin

[nightmare01]

I am 14 years out from Dday. WW had a long EA that eventually led up to a 3 year EA&PA.

 

In my opinion, trust never comes back to what it was before the affair. And I don't think it should.

 

What has our WS shown us that is beyond question? They have shown us that they are accomplished liars. They are good at lying, and will lie whenever it suits them. Other than affair lies, there are the small lies where they conceal selfish acts from us. White lies these are called, and unless your WS starts being radically honest about everything, I would imagine those white lies will continue.

 

Remember that lying is only about control - they lie to control us, by limiting what we know - by controlling what we know, they control our actions. They lie to control how everyone sees them, how they are perceived by everyone around them.

 

Remember also, that a WS who decides to have another affair will be better at keeping it covered up than they were the first time.

 

So we are living with these accomplished liars, that have become practiced in covering up an affair. Why should we trust them? Why would anyone in their right mind trust them?

[bobwhite007]

No I really don't think you can ever trust again not fully any way. The folks here don't help much either. It's been two and a half years for me and I don't trust her. I have decided after much grief to be happy, you can't control what your partner does , you just gotta take it day by day. Sooner or later they gonna slip up, it's all gonna come out eventually. Try and be happy but remain vigilant.

[Sandy43]

He wouldn't have to be Houdini at all. He could have a prepaid burner phone or one she gave him that she took out on her family plan - and that he keeps hidden from you. He could also have a secret email account you don't know about, he's also able to talk to her every day at work, have lunch with her, chat in each other's office, email each other using their company computers, and they could be using any of the many apps out there that let you communicate with others but don't leave details of it on your cell phone or your cell bill (SnapChat, WhatsApp, Kik, etc. etc. etc.) Hell, one betrayed wife came to find out that her husband had continued the affair after D-day and he and his OW were communicating through the chat function in some game app (Words with Friends? Can't remember which game it was). Hell, even the Trivia Crack game app has a chat function in the top toolbar.

 

Sadly, you really don't have to be Houdini in today's day and age to secretly communicate with someone. Not anymore.

 

 

Said every betrayed spouse whose husband/wife had an affair at work but since they never came home late and were always home on the weekends, they must not have had any opportunities.

 

Wrong.

 

What you're NOT factoring into the equation is all the time they had together that you DON'T know about. Lunch hours, extended lunch hours, days where they may both have called in 'sick' and spent the entire day together, both getting into work late every now and then because she had "babysitter/kid problems" and he had a "flat tire," or both of them leaving work a couple hours early because she had to "take her invalid mother to therapy" and he had a "dentist apt," etc. etc.

 

You'd be surprised at how much cheaters can get away with during the day and still make it home at the same time every single night. And many betrayed spouses HAVE been amazed when they found out their cheating spouses were doing exactly what I wrote.

 

He's not remorseful. Anyone who doesn't want to talk about it and tries to constantly rugsweep it claiming he's oh so 'ashamed' just wants to avoid having to deal with your anger, hurt and disgust because it's unpleasant to deal with. That's NOT remorse. And it has precious little to do with shame or he would have ended it LONG before 7 months had gone by. He managed to play for 7 months and NOW he suddenly feels shame? Doubtful. he's just using that lame excuse to avoid having to deal with your anger.

 

 

LOL. Of course he swears to that. They ALL do. Is there a cheater on this planet that DOESNT make this claim on D-day? None of them will admit it was physical unless you have proof in your hand. And according to a cheater, if you don't have solid proof then guess what? It didn't happen. And his OW 'confirmed' his story? Most cheaters already have their stories straight LONG before there's a D-Day. She'll tell you whatever he wants her to tell you. Her loyalties lie with him, not you. Hmmm...I guess there really is honor amongst thieves.

 

And that's what he was banking on when he so generously offered to take a poly. Sorry, but that's another common ploy cheaters use as a show of trying to prove how 'honest' they're being with you. But make no mistake - they throw that offer out there thinking you'd never in a million years actually take them up on it. It's just another check their lying mouths don't want to cash when it's time to pay up.

 

Go ahead. Screw the cost and set up that polygraph. I can almost guarantee you he'll do his very best to talk you out of it using the exact reasons you listed. Plus, he'll also try to guilt you into canceling it by saying how he can't believe you'd reduce him to doing this and has your marriage really come down to this and blah blah blah. He'll use every trick in the book to try to get you to cancel. Or, he'll readily agree but as the day draws near, start giving excuses as to why you should cancel. In other words, some protest immediately and some wait until the day draws near. In either event, he'll try to get you to cancel it.

 

And that's because he's still lying. You can take that to the bank.

 

 

Thank you for the well though out reply Lois, everything you said here is nothing that hasn't gone through my mind before in regards to him being able to communicate with her or anyone else for that matter behind my back. I guess that's where the trust factor will come in, I do have some measures in place so I don't think it will take me as long to find out if something happens again however as you have said if someone is determined enough there is always a way.

[ladydesigner]

I now trust no one....seriously. It's been THAT bad for me in the 3 long term relationships i've had. All 3 of them screwed me over either mentally, physically or emotionally. It must be me, only thing I can blame it on.

 

One of my ex told me I wasn't worth anything to anyone, I am the one who people go with because they can't get anyone else or they are just waiting for a someone else better to come along. Also said they were too embarrassed to be seen out with me. Thanks for that. He was physically abusive, pinned me against a wall hands around my throat with my feet off the floor, hit me and bit me. Tried to stab me too. It was my fault apparently. Not just a one time thing either, I eventually stood up for myself and got out.

 

Another turned out to be a pathological liar, they were oh so convincing.

 

The other one tried to rape me, that was awful, how I managed to get away i'll never know.

 

I'm done with relationships. Over and out. And i'm only 41. Sucks.

 

Sorry for t/j but I can relate (((Celestial-dreamer))) all 3 of my relationships were the same but it is not YOU!

 

I have been working on this in therapy a bit, many times we pick someone because we are trying to change the outcome of something bad that happened in childhood. For me it is true, not sure if it is for you too but is something to think about.

 

end t/j

[ladydesigner]

He wouldn't have to be Houdini at all. He could have a prepaid burner phone or one she gave him that she took out on her family plan - and that he keeps hidden from you. He could also have a secret email account you don't know about, he's also able to talk to her every day at work, have lunch with her, chat in each other's office, email each other using their company computers, and they could be using any of the many apps out there that let you communicate with others but don't leave details of it on your cell phone or your cell bill (SnapChat, WhatsApp, Kik, etc. etc. etc.) Hell, one betrayed wife came to find out that her husband had continued the affair after D-day and he and his OW were communicating through the chat function in some game app (Words with Friends? Can't remember which game it was). Hell, even the Trivia Crack game app has a chat function in the top toolbar.

 

Sadly, you really don't have to be Houdini in today's day and age to secretly communicate with someone. Not anymore.

 

 

Said every betrayed spouse whose husband/wife had an affair at work but since they never came home late and were always home on the weekends, they must not have had any opportunities.

 

Wrong.

 

What you're NOT factoring into the equation is all the time they had together that you DON'T know about. Lunch hours, extended lunch hours, days where they may both have called in 'sick' and spent the entire day together, both getting into work late every now and then because she had "babysitter/kid problems" and he had a "flat tire," or both of them leaving work a couple hours early because she had to "take her invalid mother to therapy" and he had a "dentist apt," etc. etc.

 

You'd be surprised at how much cheaters can get away with during the day and still make it home at the same time every single night. And many betrayed spouses HAVE been amazed when they found out their cheating spouses were doing exactly what I wrote.

 

He's not remorseful. Anyone who doesn't want to talk about it and tries to constantly rugsweep it claiming he's oh so 'ashamed' just wants to avoid having to deal with your anger, hurt and disgust because it's unpleasant to deal with. That's NOT remorse. And it has precious little to do with shame or he would have ended it LONG before 7 months had gone by. He managed to play for 7 months and NOW he suddenly feels shame? Doubtful. he's just using that lame excuse to avoid having to deal with your anger.

 

 

LOL. Of course he swears to that. They ALL do. Is there a cheater on this planet that DOESNT make this claim on D-day? None of them will admit it was physical unless you have proof in your hand. And according to a cheater, if you don't have solid proof then guess what? It didn't happen. And his OW 'confirmed' his story? Most cheaters already have their stories straight LONG before there's a D-Day. She'll tell you whatever he wants her to tell you. Her loyalties lie with him, not you. Hmmm...I guess there really is honor amongst thieves.

 

And that's what he was banking on when he so generously offered to take a poly. Sorry, but that's another common ploy cheaters use as a show of trying to prove how 'honest' they're being with you. But make no mistake - they throw that offer out there thinking you'd never in a million years actually take them up on it. It's just another check their lying mouths don't want to cash when it's time to pay up.

 

Go ahead. Screw the cost and set up that polygraph. I can almost guarantee you he'll do his very best to talk you out of it using the exact reasons you listed. Plus, he'll also try to guilt you into canceling it by saying how he can't believe you'd reduce him to doing this and has your marriage really come down to this and blah blah blah. He'll use every trick in the book to try to get you to cancel. Or, he'll readily agree but as the day draws near, start giving excuses as to why you should cancel. In other words, some protest immediately and some wait until the day draws near. In either event, he'll try to get you to cancel it.

 

And that's because he's still lying. You can take that to the bank.

 

Lois_Griffin I love your posts, they are always so spot on. In fact I thought I was reading about my WH in your post!