Married guy with secret relationship with female friend

[MightyPen]

How do you avoid temptation? You make a choice and stick to it. It may not be easy, but it is simple.

 

This is a secret relationship right now. If you truly want it to be real, and continue, then take it above board. Tell your wife, tell your friends, tell your family. If you don't want to do that, that in itself says a lot. It's showing disrespect not only for your wife, family, and marriage, but also for your EAP.

 

There is also a strong addiction element here. I can attest to it. I realized that I was completed addicted to the rush I felt when xAP emailed me, chatted with me, texted me. I even got that rush from visiting his FB page. But I stopped. I took it one day at a time. Using phrases like "never ever hearing her reply" doesn't help, it only feeds the drama...but say, "I will not do it today," and then those days turn into weeks into months into years.

 

How do you want to live? Hiding things, lying, disrespecting the people you claim to care about? Or do you want to live honestly and with integrity? It is totally up to you.

 

Wow. You're spot on with the addiction analysis. I still feel that chemical rush in my head when we chat or talk on the phone. And like you said, even looking at her FB page sends my brain into some sort of chemical frenzy.

 

I had suggested this break because I really thought that a month with no contact would let my brain settle down, and that I could use the time to picture her in a new more platonic way. And I'm being honest when I say I wish I could introduce her into my "real world," but it seems like that would require me (us) to create additional lies. Where did we meet? How did we become friends? That sort of thing. She is a few years younger and from a different state and works in a totally different industry. Our paths never would have crossed in regular life.

[MightyPen]

Oh, and one more question...how do you know that your EAP isn't emailing with someone else in addition to you? You did meet her on an adult chat site.

 

I ask because, in my situation, xAP had this amazing connection...I thought he was my soulmate...then he said he had another girlfriend. Other than his wife. And I was so invested in our "connection" that I refused to believe it...

 

Ouch. I'm sorry you went through that (all of it, I mean, but also the part you just mentioned).

 

And the short answer is: I don't and I'll never know for sure. So I try not to worry or think about it, because I can't control it anyway. I indulged in a few inappropriate chats with other people myself, but those were a while back and have totally ended. I don't even visit the adult chat site anymore. She's the only person from the site I still talk with.

 

When we started our break, she hadn't signed onto the site in a few weeks and she told me she had grown tired of it too.

 

We both deleted our old "stealth" email accounts about a month ago and created new ones. I haven't used it for anyone but her. She told me the day of our break that she had never used it for anyone but me. I believe her. But yes, when push comes to shove, we've both obviously being shady with our partners, so it's odd, and perhaps hypocritical, to expect total honesty from each other.

 

All this being said, if she is carrying on relationships with other guys that are like ours, I'm not sure how she gets her job done. We both have professional jobs and our communication happens during the work week. We go silent on weekends. On average, we probably spend 2 hours per week on emails, chats, and calls, usually during lunch but sometimes in the afternoons. If I devoted more time to her, it would impact my job.

Edited October 2, 2015 by MightyPen

[Popsicle]

I think that you're starting to see the light, so that's good, your break was good. Hopefully she is too. Was she feeling like you two needed a break just as much as you did? Because that would be a good sign and would make it easier for you.

 

I don't recommend being friends. It won't work.

 

I do understand that it's really hard telling someone that you no longer want to talk to them or be friends anymore...

Edited October 2, 2015 by Popsicle

[MightyPen]

I think that you're starting to see the light, so that's good, your break was good. Hopefully she is too. Was she feeling like you two needed a break just as much as you did? Because that would be a good sign and would make it easier for you.

 

I don't recommend being friends. It won't work.

 

I do understand that it's really hard telling someone that you no longer want to talk to them or be friends anymore...

 

 

No, she didn't want the break. However, she admitted to being stressed at work, so although she was sad about it, she didn't fight me. And I honestly suggested the break as much for her as for me. I want her to have a clear head about things.

 

I think we're both "seeing the light" to the extent that we both feel very guilty about the status quo and recognize it needs to change.

 

But I can't bring myself to "pull the trigger" on NC, at least not yet. As you said, it's really hard. Last night, I brainstormed different ways of saying goodbye, all of which were much more personal than just saying, "I need to concentrate on my family. We can't talk any more."

[Bittersweetie]

May I suggest reading "Not Just Friends" by Shirley Glass? It's commonly recommended on here, and was the first book I read after my d-day. It's very insightful on how outside friendships/relationships can undermine a marriage.

[Gloria25]

May I suggest reading "Not Just Friends" by Shirley Glass? It's commonly recommended on here, and was the first book I read after my d-day. It's very insightful on how outside friendships/relationships can undermine a marriage.

 

If the marriage/RL was strong enough in the first place, then NOTHING could undermine it.

[purplesorrow]

If the marriage/RL was strong enough in the first place, then NOTHING could undermine it.

 

You keep the marriage strong by protecting it. Secret relationships do nothing to build the marriage and therefore should be avoided.

[MightyPen]

May I suggest reading "Not Just Friends" by Shirley Glass? It's commonly recommended on here, and was the first book I read after my d-day. It's very insightful on how outside friendships/relationships can undermine a marriage.

 

 

Thank you for the suggestion. I'll check it out!

[Gloria25]

You keep the marriage strong by protecting it. Secret relationships do nothing to build the marriage and therefore should be avoided.

 

I know that, but if the marriage was strong enough in the first place, nothing could weasel its way in.

 

In other words, if the marriage is strong enough, if either party was in a situation were a "friendship" with someone beside their spouse was starting to get questionable, they would have put a stop to it ASAP and no secret RLs wouldn't even have formed.

 

I was listening to the radio like a month ago. This woman said that one time a neighbor of the couple - who knows both the husband/wife - asked to come over to view literally the "view" from the couple's patio. But she came over when the wife wasn't there. The husband immediately asked the neighbor to come back over when his wife was home.

 

No, neither the neighbor and/or the husband had the hots for each other, secret friendships, etc. It simply was inappropriate for a strange woman (neighbor or not) to be at the home when the wife isn't there - doesn't matter if she was also a friend of the wife.

 

I'm using that example to show what happens in marriages that are strong. You don't set up/end up in situations where "something" can happen. And, that's what the husband did. He politely asked the neighbor to come back when wife was home. In a weaker marriage, he probably would have let the female neighbor come over - wife home or not cuz who cares about appearances and/or a strange woman in their home w/o the wife being there.

 

Same thing in a thread I responded to like a month or so ago where a female's boss/coworker was putting the moves on her. He'd invite "her" to this/that after work. If her marriage was strong, her immediate - without even thinking response - would have been to let the boss know that she'd accept if her husband was to come along...PERIOD. When you started reading the thread, there were already holes in the marriage before the boss started working on the woman, hence, her allowing the bird (the EA) to make nest between her and the boss and her posting about it on LS.

Edited October 2, 2015 by Gloria25

[Gloria25]

 

How can I keep this going without damaging her life (or mine)?

 

I see....the key here is to keep your outward appearances of happy wife/life - while your ego gets stroked by playing the emotions of this other woman.

 

Ever consider that damage is already done? That the other woman emotionally is dependent on you too?

 

Oh, who cares about the other woman and/or your wife - what matters here is how long you can play both of them to keep your ego stroked.

 

Good job, classy people in this world...

[purplesorrow]

I know that, but if the marriage was strong enough in the first place, nothing could weasel its way in.

 

In other words, if the marriage is strong enough, if either party was in a situation were a "friendship" with someone beside their spouse was starting to get questionable, they would have put a stop to it ASAP and no secret RLs wouldn't even have formed.

 

I was listening to the radio like a month ago. This woman said that one time a neighbor of the couple - who knows both the husband/wife - asked to come over to view literally the "view" from the couple's patio. But she came over when the wife wasn't there. The husband immediately asked the neighbor to come back over when his wife was home.

 

No, neither the neighbor and/or the husband had the hots for each other, secret friendships, etc. It simply was inappropriate for a strange woman (neighbor or not) to be at the home when the wife isn't there - doesn't matter if she was also a friend of the wife.

 

I'm using that example to show what happens in marriages that are strong. You don't set up/end up in situations where "something" can happen. And, that's what the husband did. He politely asked the neighbor to come back when wife was home. In a weaker marriage, he probably would have let the female neighbor come over - wife home or not cuz who cares about appearances and/or a strange woman in their home w/o the wife being there.

 

Same thing in a thread I responded to like a month or so ago where a female's boss/coworker was putting the moves on her. He'd invite "her" to this/that after work. If her marriage was strong, her immediate - without even thinking response - would have been to let the boss know that she'd accept if her husband was to come along...PERIOD. When you started reading the thread, there were already holes in the marriage before the boss started working on the woman, hence, her allowing the bird (the EA) to make nest between her and the boss and her posting about it on LS.

 

A person continuing down that path is doing so by choice. The marriage is only as strong as the two people in it. If one person makes a detrimental choice on their own, they are in fact weakening the marriage. A strong marriage doesn't keep one from straying no more than a weak one forces someone to. It is personal responsibility and choices. If I decided to become a liar and sneak around that is on no one but me. I protected my marriage. I always carried myself like my husband was right beside me. He thought he could handle secret friendships. He was wrong. Secrets cause intimacy to die a slow death.

[salparadise]

If the marriage/RL was strong enough in the first place, then NOTHING could undermine it.

 

I know that, but if the marriage was strong enough in the first place, nothing could weasel its way in.

 

Platitudes like this do not ring true except in the imaginative/theoretical realm. It's like the concept of happily ever after... fairy tale fantasies for children.

 

But for the sake of argument... what if his marriage is theoretically imperfect... how is this uber sophisticated insight going to be helpful? Are you telling him to divorce his wife based on what everyone should see as a self-evident truth? Or is there a vitamin supplement he should be taking?

 

The OPs problem is that he's already up to his ears in fantasy. It's sucking his time, attention, affection and all of the good stuff that should be flowing to his very real wife... earth calling Mr. MightPen... time for your shock therapy.

[Gloria25]

A person continuing down that path is doing so by choice. The marriage is only as strong as the two people in it. If one person makes a detrimental choice on their own, they are in fact weakening the marriage. A strong marriage doesn't keep one from straying no more than a weak one forces someone to. It is personal responsibility and choices. If I decided to become a liar and sneak around that is on no one but me. I protected my marriage. I always carried myself like my husband was right beside me. He thought he could handle secret friendships. He was wrong. Secrets cause intimacy to die a slow death.

 

Platitudes like this do not ring true except in the imaginative/theoretical realm. It's like the concept of happily ever after... fairy tale fantasies for children.

 

But for the sake of argument... what if his marriage is theoretically imperfect... how is this uber sophisticated insight going to be helpful? Are you telling him to divorce his wife based on what everyone should see as a self-evident truth? Or is there a vitamin supplement he should be taking?

 

The OPs problem is that he's already up to his ears in fantasy. It's sucking his time, attention, affection and all of the good stuff that should be flowing to his very real wife... earth calling Mr. MightPen... time for your shock therapy.

 

Did ANYONE not see my post late last nite?

 

I no longer have "empathy" for guys who are in marriages and/or RLs who are two-timing their wives - EA or not.

 

I think he should leave his EA alone, stay with his wife. It's the bed he made, lie in it already and stop whinning. Geesh.

[MightyPen]

Platitudes like this do not ring true except in the imaginative/theoretical realm. It's like the concept of happily ever after... fairy tale fantasies for children.

 

But for the sake of argument... what if his marriage is theoretically imperfect... how is this uber sophisticated insight going to be helpful? Are you telling him to divorce his wife based on what everyone should see as a self-evident truth? Or is there a vitamin supplement he should be taking?

 

The OPs problem is that he's already up to his ears in fantasy. It's sucking his time, attention, affection and all of the good stuff that should be flowing to his very real wife... earth calling Mr. MightPen... time for your shock therapy.

 

I know there is a large fantasy element to my relationship with the OW. And I've said (repeatedly) that we are not trying to meet, replace each other's significant other, or anything like that. But she does receive a good amount of my affection. I know that has to change.

 

I'm still trying to figure out if I reach out to her now and try to figure things out, or wait a few more weeks for our "break" to end.

[purplesorrow]

I know there is a large fantasy element to my relationship with the OW. And I've said (repeatedly) that we are not trying to meet, replace each other's significant other, or anything like that. But she does receive a good amount of my affection. I know that has to change.

 

I'm still trying to figure out if I reach out to her now and try to figure things out, or wait a few more weeks for our "break" to end.

 

On a very basic level, do you not see the absurdity in being married but declaring being on a break with someone else? What are you breaking from?

[MightyPen]

On a very basic level, do you not see the absurdity in being married but declaring being on a break with someone else? What are you breaking from?

 

 

We're just taking a break from talking with each other generally. We've shared a boatload of personal, intimate thoughts and feelings for so long, and it became very intense for both of us. I was hoping the break would let the romantic feelings cool down, and maybe cooler heads would prevail and we could transition into a true friendship that we wouldn't have to feel guilty about. We're both rational people. But even rational people let their emotions get the best of them at times.

[purplesorrow]

We're just taking a break from talking with each other generally. We've shared a boatload of personal, intimate thoughts and feelings for so long, and it became very intense for both of us. I was hoping the break would let the romantic feelings cool down, and maybe cooler heads would prevail and we could transition into a true friendship that we wouldn't have to feel guilty about. We're both rational people. But even rational people let their emotions get the best of them at times.

 

You have already damaged your primary relationship because of your interactions with her. A friendship would only continue the detriment. It will be too easy to use her as a wife bashing confidant when things aren't good at home. She isn't a friend of your marriage.

[MightyPen]

You have already damaged your primary relationship because of your interactions with her. A friendship would only continue the detriment. It will be too easy to use her as a wife bashing confidant when things aren't good at home. She isn't a friend of your marriage.

 

 

In our current situation, I agree it's not good for my marriage or her relationship with her SO. There is too much of a romantic/sexual undercurrent (even though it's fairly limited - see below).

 

That's why I'm hoping it evolve into a true friendship. Even now, we don't badmouth or bash our SOs to each other. Those things are off limits. We focus on the positives, like the incredible conversational and intellectual chemistry we share. Our phone conversations are absolutely incredible and they are 90% platonic already anyway.

 

(Some) people have formed lasting relationships with their exes that are truly platonic and meaningful. I don't see why we can't attempt to do the same. If it doesn't work out, then we realize we'll have to call it quits.

[Mrs. John Adams]

this thread combined with the others you have started...are very revealing.

 

this is not an innocent pen pal...this is a full blown emotional affair.

[purplesorrow]

In our current situation, I agree it's not good for my marriage or her relationship with her SO. There is too much of a romantic/sexual undercurrent (even though it's fairly limited - see below).

 

That's why I'm hoping it evolve into a true friendship. Even now, we don't badmouth or bash our SOs to each other. Those things are off limits. We focus on the positives, like the incredible conversational and intellectual chemistry we share. Our phone conversations are absolutely incredible and they are 90% platonic already anyway.

 

(Some) people have formed lasting relationships with their exes that are truly platonic and meaningful. I don't see why we can't attempt to do the same. If it doesn't work out, then we realize we'll have to call it quits.

 

Because this is a relationship formed while having another relationship. Huge difference. When I was married, my h knew my exes and me his. Can you introduce her to your wife as your ex?

[Bittersweetie]

 

(Some) people have formed lasting relationships with their exes that are truly platonic and meaningful. I don't see why we can't attempt to do the same. If it doesn't work out, then we realize we'll have to call it quits.

 

Yes, when the relationships were completely above board and open. Your affair with this woman is not only secret, but you are both married. What you are hoping to get...a lasting friendship with your EAP...is just not possible. You are trying and trying to put a square peg in a round hole and it will not happen no matter how much you rationalize it.

[MightyPen]

Because this is a relationship formed while having another relationship. Huge difference. When I was married, my h knew my exes and me his. Can you introduce her to your wife as your ex?

 

I wish I could introduce her as an "ex" and try to bring the whole thing aboveground and stop the hiding, but that would involve more lying, and probably quite a bit of it, considering the OW's background is different than mine. And then every time my wife might ask me something about her, more lies would be needed. I'm trying to lessen my guilt, not add to it.

 

And the final nail in that coffin would be age. She's eight years younger than me, and I've been with my wife for a long time, so I would had to have dated the OW when I was in college and she was in middle school for the timeline to make any sense.

[purplesorrow]

I wish I could introduce her as an "ex" and try to bring the whole thing aboveground and stop the hiding, but that would involve more lying, and probably quite a bit of it, considering the OW's background is different than mine. And then every time my wife might ask me something about her, more lies would be needed. I'm trying to lessen my guilt, not add to it.

 

And the final nail in that coffin would be age. She's eight years younger than me, and I've been with my wife for a long time, so I would had to have dated the OW when I was in college and she was in middle school for the timeline to make any sense.

You've now answered your own question as to why you too can't be like exes who now have a friendship. Make a choice, you can't have her and your marriage.

[MightyPen]

The last few weeks have helped me clear my head, although I'm sure many folks here would say I need to clear it some more.

 

I admit that I'm still trying to make the "Let's be friends" thing work. But at least I've confronted that fact that our current relationship has been less than platonic and that must change.

 

I'm torn about whether I should keep posting here or perhaps take a few days off.

 

On one hand, I think posting on these boards has been healthy for me and very helpful in admitting things to myself. On the other hand, every time I post, I necessarily think about her. So I'm not sure if that is a good thing or not.

 

I've thought about her every day for almost a year. I feel that part of the transition to either friends or nothing will require me to have some days where I don't think about her at all. To move her down my list of priorities, if you will. Any advice?

[MadJackBird]

Mighty Pen,

 

I've read your threads. Your story intrigues me, because it reminded me of my life as a BH. My former wife carried on long term online emotional adultery. (I also hate the word affair it sounds so fun and light hearted, we had an affair to remember,) Let's call it what it really is, It's adultery. Her's progressed to on again/off again emotional and physical affair. After reading your 4 threads here's my take on most of it.

 

I also had kids and tried to stay together for the kids. To answer your questions in this thread I don't think you can transition your Emotional Adultery partner to a friend. Not if you want to maintain your marriage with your wife. How would she like it you continued to be friends with the person you had emotional adultery with?

 

For me, trying to stay together the first time I discovered the adultery was done really poorly. We talked to our pastor, but didn't really get to the root of the problem. Neither one of us did counselling, either for ourselves or for our marriage. Things seemed better for a while, but old patterns resurfaced and four years later she had fallen into another full blown adultery, this time someone local. For her, addictions ran deep, and seeking out inappropriate relationships gave her a similar feeling of high that she got when she was abusing narcotic pain pills. Replacing one addiction with another. The point of the story is we never got to the root of the problem for either one of us, or for our marriage.

 

My number one advice is to seek counselling.

 

I'm a firm believer in honesty in your marriage. I think you need to tell your wife you've been having a secret emotional adultery, and what steps you plan to give her to ensure it doesn't happen again. (i.e. complete NC for life with AP, let her read the NC letter, and allow your wife complete and total transparency.)

 

Good Luck