I need some help here

[whichwayisup]

What I am saying, is that I think JMargel is obsessed.

 

Uhmm, I don't think so...Guess you haven't really read Jeff's posts. HELLO, the measures he is going through to SHOW HOW MUCH HE LOVES HIS WIFE...That's love, not obession. People FIGHT with all they have when they get scared their worst fears are coming true.

 

Sorry. I think he's nice. I am sorry for his pain. But after pages and pages and pages of the same old same old where he does not want to take any suggestions whatsoever unless they are the pre-imagined correct answers he had in mind - I can see where his wife might feel like she's sometimes talking to a brick wall.

 

Again, you've not really read what he's been saying...I think you've put your own personal spin with all your emotional baggage and compared it to your own life. Everybody has opinions but I still think YOU are missing the point New Wife. Sorry, not meaning to sound harsh.

[Debster]

I think Jmargel is obsessed too. And I have read his threads. All of them. I've given him the same advice many, many times. This is not the first time he's had to fight to try to make it work. heck, they needed counselling to make it down the aisle and she at one point wanted to put the marriage on hold.

 

I think not only is he obsessed with his wife he is stubborn.

 

There comes a point where it doesn't matter how much you show your love and try to make it work if your partner has emotionally left the marriage.

[billybadass36]

I think Enigma's onto something. J-you might be a "rescuer". Like your father "rescued" your mother from her then-fiance', you want to save this damsel in distress that doesn't particularly want to be rescued.

[New_Wife]

No worries - we both have our opinions. Most likely based on our own unique experiences. But I think it does illustrate how two folks can read the very same thing and get two completely different takes on it. Clearly, JMargel and Brandy are doing this in their communications as well.

 

I hold to my belief that he is wound too tight over this and can't see the forest for the trees. Yours is different and I can respect that without resorting to calling your thought process "baggage." I left mine at the airport (aka counselor's office) but thanks for your concern.

[Debster]

I agree, billybadass.

[MWC_LifeBeginsAt40]

Hi Jeff. Whew I'm all caught up on today's posts. If she truly wants to move out I don't think you should stop her. I also would like to issue a small warning....as Moose said, DO NOT under any circumstances let her father or her ex help her move. Do this yourself if you must.

 

I know of a situation where the wife got caught in bed by her husband. The OM took off and she started hitting her husband. He didn't defend himself cuz he knew better, but she called the cops anyway and my friend ended up in jail for a few days and couldn't see his kids for over a month.

 

Please do whatever you can do to avoid having things turned around on you.

 

While not everyone here agrees with your methods of trying to keep your marriage together, it is very obvious that Brandy has offered nothing in the way of helping the marriage.

 

One other point, and this is just my thoughts, I would never in a hundred years want to marry someone whose family refused to make me a part of their family, no matter how much I loved the person, that definitely would be a deciding factor.

 

Best of luck Jeff.

[jnel921]

Jmargel,

 

It's understandle why you are upset. Just because a relationship failed does not mean your father-in-law should treat you differently. If anything he is being less supportive and respectful of his daughters decision to break off with the guy no matter what the reason was. Now if he wanted to continue a relationship with him there shouldn't have been a problem as long as you werent treated differently.

 

Your wife sounds like she is trying to please her father by joining the team. Not necessarily so much because the ex is there. If she wanted to be with him...She would have never married you. You have to trust in her that she will do the right thing. Allow her to go to her pool tournaments, and dont bring up the subject of the ex with her father.

 

Some people live in small towns where no matter what they can't escape their ex's. The more you get angry and suspect the further you push her away.

 

I always have maintained friendships with some of my ex's. I've always been honest with my husbabnd because he doesnt flip out about it or think that I will run off. I chose him!

 

As a matter of fact we are supposed to spend fathers day with one of my ex's family jun 19th. My husband doesnt feel threatened at all and think his family is cool.

 

Not everyone is running off to the bedroom. Have faith that your wife truly loves you and meant it when she chose you to spend the rest of her life with.

 

Good luck.

[jmargel]

I've read all your posts. One comment before I tell you an update is that the one poster brought up the fact about me not letting her leave when she was angry the other week. I have admitted many times to her & myself that I was WRONG in doing that. Unless there was someone out there waiting to kill her, I shouldn't have stood in front of the door. Everyone has made mistakes and the important part is that I learned from it.

 

Second, I'm not like your ex-husband, New_Wife. I don't call her everyday, in fact yesterday was the first time I called her in months at work. I might send her a small email maybe once a week if that. I don't believe I am obessed more like concerned. With my ex-fiancee she left mainly because I ignored her. Maybe I am over-compensating now with something with Brandy, that's something that I will be thinking about.

 

Last night she came home around 7:30 and went to bed. I let her sleep, she got up around 9:00. Didn't say much. I wrote a letter with alot of the suggestions you all had and gave it to her. She didn't want to read it, saying she didn't have time. Well, I was going to read it for her then. She took it & read it. She then said that didn't have any effect on her. So, something just changed in me. I told her then 'I hope you start looking for a place soon', she said 'I already have'. I then asked her where she was going & she told me she didn't know. I then told her 'As long as you live under this roof and your my wife I have every right to know, I'm tired of you just taking off like this leaving me wondering'. She then told me she was going to Wal-Mart. I then told her these past few weeks you have been treating me extremely bad and the reason why I act the way I do is because of your actions. Her reply was 'Well, you just keep thinking that'.

 

As she was going to leave, I told her 'I really hope you find another place fast', then it struck her. Like a deer in headlights. She said 'You want me to leave quickly?'. I walked upto her and said 'Yes, I am tired of these games. It's either you want to work on our marriage or not'. She was silent, didn't say a word and left. It wasn't something she was expecting me to say. I didn't yell or scream but I said it in a tone that I meant it. I have done everything I could, we can't goto the next step in solving our problems until she shows signs that she wants to.

 

So, she went to the store came back an hour or so later. Came back with a nice attitude. Asking me questions about the training on that I had on Monday with our dog. She talked about work and other things. We didn't talk about the situation, I said my peace and I'm giving her time to think about things. We stayed up on the couch watching a movie until 1:30am. Went to bed & told each other we love you. Woke up this morning, kissed & said the I love yous again.

 

I don't want to jinx myself but I hope at least this might be the point where things start to turn around for good. As we get through each hurdle together it will make our marriage stronger. I know now that the only way to get respect is to not run into the corner or pleading with her. No one would respect that.

 

I appreciate all the advice everyone has given. I'm just hoping things will start to get better from here.

[Bronzepen]

Originally posted by jmargel

I've read all your posts. One comment before I tell you an update is that the one poster brought up the fact about me not letting her leave when she was angry the other week. I have admitted many times to her & myself that I was WRONG in doing that. Unless there was someone out there waiting to kill her, I shouldn't have stood in front of the door. Everyone has made mistakes and the important part is that I learned from it.

 

Second, I'm not like your ex-husband, New_Wife. I don't call her everyday, in fact yesterday was the first time I called her in months at work. I might send her a small email maybe once a week if that. I don't believe I am obessed more like concerned. With my ex-fiancee she left mainly because I ignored her. Maybe I am over-compensating now with something with Brandy, that's something that I will be thinking about.

 

Last night she came home around 7:30 and went to bed. I let her sleep, she got up around 9:00. Didn't say much. I wrote a letter with alot of the suggestions you all had and gave it to her. She didn't want to read it, saying she didn't have time. Well, I was going to read it for her then. She took it & read it. She then said that didn't have any effect on her. So, something just changed in me. I told her then 'I hope you start looking for a place soon', she said 'I already have'. I then asked her where she was going & she told me she didn't know. I then told her 'As long as you live under this roof and your my wife I have every right to know, I'm tired of you just taking off like this leaving me wondering'. She then told me she was going to Wal-Mart. I then told her these past few weeks you have been treating me extremely bad and the reason why I act the way I do is because of your actions. Her reply was 'Well, you just keep thinking that'.

 

As she was going to leave, I told her 'I really hope you find another place fast', then it struck her. Like a deer in headlights. She said 'You want me to leave quickly?'. I walked upto her and said 'Yes, I am tired of these games. It's either you want to work on our marriage or not'. She was silent, didn't say a word and left. It wasn't something she was expecting me to say. I didn't yell or scream but I said it in a tone that I meant it. I have done everything I could, we can't goto the next step in solving our problems until she shows signs that she wants to.

 

So, she went to the store came back an hour or so later. Came back with a nice attitude. Asking me questions about the training on that I had on Monday with our dog. She talked about work and other things. We didn't talk about the situation, I said my peace and I'm giving her time to think about things. We stayed up on the couch watching a movie until 1:30am. Went to bed & told each other we love you. Woke up this morning, kissed & said the I love yous again.

 

I don't want to jinx myself but I hope at least this might be the point where things start to turn around for good. As we get through each hurdle together it will make our marriage stronger. I know now that the only way to get respect is to not run into the corner or pleading with her. No one would respect that.

 

I appreciate all the advice everyone has given. I'm just hoping things will start to get better from here.

 

 

Don't want to jinx it either but I also want to keep it real to all possibilities.

 

She could be doing a 180 on you because she has plans to move out but not immediately. When you told her to move out ASAP, you threw her a curve.

 

OR

 

She doesn't want to be with you BUT has no where else to go, at the moment. So she will "put up" with you for now and put up a front.

 

 

Last,

 

You could be right and maybe she is starting to turn around.

 

 

I hope the last is true.

[jmargel]

If she really wanted to go, she could be moving in with her dad at least temporarily. They have a room and would give it to her along with her dog. Not too many apartments would even take pets to begin with and I know she wouldn't go anywhere without that dog.

 

As for putting up a front, I doubt that. She's the type to say what's on her mind.

 

I still need to be working on some of my changes, but she needs to as well. Otherwise nothing is going to change. I'll see how the next few days go, then ask her on what she wants to do.

[Mz. Pixie]

J-

 

Perhaps she is getting it. My ex did not get it- no matter how many times I said I'm unhappy, things need to change, let's go to counseling. He didn't get it until I said, I want to separate. By that time, it was too late.

 

I don't agree with what's said about not being one when you marry. I truly believe that is what it should be. Some people have different concepts of marriage than others.

 

I believe she's avoiding being at home with the other job and her pool activities- and that cannot be good.

[jmargel]

The other job she started back in October. She wanted extra money for herself. She also enjoys waitressing but it's stressful for her especially on Fridays, when she goes from one job to the next.

 

As for the pool, I agree. It has been too much. When it comes to any sort of game or sport she gets too competitive. She needs to put us first before that.

[Moose]

I'd be very leary. I know I said I wouldn't post again......but first, congrats on, "standing your ground", sorta, with the hint dropping about finding a place soon.

As for putting up a front, I doubt that. She's the type to say what's on her mind.

Let me caution you again. For the first 10/11 years of my marriage.......I drank like a fish......ignored my wife and family and was in my own world where the only thing that mattered to me was....me. Once I woke up and broke the circle I was in.........and became my wife's best friend.......she clued me in on the manipulation tactics she used during my long fog. Though I was waisted most of the time, I couldn't tell whether or not she was sincere with some of the things she would say or do......even in the few times I was sober. The main weapon, she said, were my emotions. She said she could play on my emotions like Beehtoven could play a piano. Whenever she wanted something, she would use my mood to get it. She said she could change my moods too. She knew what to say, when to say it.

 

She's admitted to reverting back to these tactics even recently.......it's in her nature.

 

Based on your first post this morning.......it sounds like a situation where Mrs. Moose would pull that weapon out of her arsenal.

 

I know this isn't a game show.......far from it.......but I'd bet my money on manipulation here.........

[MWC_LifeBeginsAt40]

I would also question her "nice" behavior. Is she just being nice to avoid talking about the problems? Find out for sure - you need a YES from her, not just actions, to show that she wants to work on the marriage. You both need to work out a plan to make this happen, rather than just change the way you are acting.

 

My ex and I did this - we would avoid issues, and be nice-nice but in the end the issues are still there, and one little thing happens, and all that resentment comes back.

[jmargel]

Maniuplation? Why? Like I said I will give her a day or two and then ask her if she wants to work on this marriage. If she doesn't then I still want her to leave quickly, if she does then we need to lay out the groundwork to accomplish this.

 

If she continues to keep doing what she has done, then it is over. Action speak louder than words and I told her that last night.

[Moose]

Like I said I will give her a day or two and then ask her if she wants to work on this marriage.

No offense dude.......that's gotta stop. I don't understand why you don't get it. That phone call at lunch yesterday should've been it. When I say it.....I mean IT! Mrs. Moose would be pulling her clothes out of a suitcase in her Mom's living room this morning if she said to me what your wife said to you.

 

She'll never realize you mean business if you keep giving her slack.

[jmargel]

Moose,

 

I can't act like a psycho just because she is not acting the right way. I made my point clear and I am sticking with it. I'll be talking to her tonight about what she wants to do. If I start throwing her clothes out the door that's just going to make me look nuts. I'm not going to soften up on my stance. She has to want to stay and work out these issues.

[billybadass36]

Originally posted by jmargel

I can't act like a psycho just because she is not acting the right way.

 

It's not acting like a psycho. It's being a man. My soon-to-be wife tells me that she doesn't think she loves me anymore after a pattern and practice of disrespecting me and running rough-shod over my marriage with her ex boyfriend, and her belongings would be in a box on the curb at her dad's house and the locks would be changed. She knows you don't have the stones to do anything about her routinely trashing your marriage. She knows who's running the show here, and it ain't you.

 

Your conduct is reinforcing to her that she can keep engaging in this conduct and it will be okay because you will wait and wait and wait and talk and talk and talk, but you won't follow through with the ultimatums you set. You'll get plenty pissed and you'll moan about it till your blue in the face, but you won't pull the trap door on her. She's been calling your bluff all along and will continue to do so.

[jmargel]

So I am suppose to take her things and throw it out on the curb? That's the tactic to make her change her ways? Sorry, but I would do that if I acted out on my emotions but I am trying to be rational here. Like I said before if she wants to leave then I want her to go right away. If she wants to work on this marriage then she needs to start doing her part. If she tells me she doesn't want to work on this marriage she will be leaving by this weekend.

 

I love her but I want her to know that I am serious about this.

[whichwayisup]

As she was going to leave, I told her 'I really hope you find another place fast', then it struck her. Like a deer in headlights. She said 'You want me to leave quickly?'. I walked upto her and said 'Yes, I am tired of these games. It's either you want to work on our marriage or not'. She was silent, didn't say a word and left. It wasn't something she was expecting me to say. I didn't yell or scream but I said it in a tone that I meant it. I have done everything I could, we can't goto the next step in solving our problems until she shows signs that she wants to.

 

So, she went to the store came back an hour or so later. Came back with a nice attitude. Asking me questions about the training on that I had on Monday with our dog. She talked about work and other things. We didn't talk about the situation, I said my peace and I'm giving her time to think about things. We stayed up on the couch watching a movie until 1:30am. Went to bed & told each other we love you. Woke up this morning, kissed & said the I love yous again.

 

Now she really knows you mean business. I really honestly believe that she thought she could continue doing what she is doing and just let you do your thing - get mad at her, be disappointed and she'd let it roll on by. Well, I'm really proud of you for pushing her into a choice. s*** or get off the pot basically. She now KNOWS that that she has to shape up or ship out. Which has made her think. She chooses to stay, then she MUST go to councilling. No choice in the matter!

 

I still think you should go away for the weekend, give her space and you go get some RnR. You got nothing to lose here Jeff.

 

Expect the worst, hope for the best. And yes, actions speaks louder than words.

 

No you don't wanna throw her out like that. Maybe slowly bring home boxes, ask her what she needs, offer to help. Being nice about it may actually MAKE her realize even more what she's giving up.

[EnigmaXOXO]

I agree Jeff.

 

There's no "follow through" with you.

 

She's got you better trained than your puppy, and her rare displays of kindness are nothing more than throwing the poor dog a bone.

[jmargel]

I disagree with bringing home boxes. I'm *not* trying to push her out. I am trying to make her realize what she will be losing. As for counseling I can't make her or anyone goto counseling. That's something she has to do for herself. What she has to do is respect me, put our marriage first and to stop the behavior of what she was doing before. There's a fine line I have to walk in regards to all of this. If I go over too far one way I push her out, if I go the other I get walked over. There is only so much I can do. The rest is up to her.

[Moose]

I can't act like a psycho just because she is not acting the right way.

Telling her in a calm voice to get her things and leave isn't being a physco..........she's the one that wanted to test your waters by telling you she thinks she needs to move out........you should've made her act on it and put her in her place........

 

You seem to think I'm talking about rampin' and ravin' while foaming at the mouth throwing crap through walls and windows.......I'm talking about calmly showing her the error of her ways.

 

I know it sounds hatefull......the reality is that it's really tough love. We'll see if you stand your ground.......I have a feeling that your couple of days will turn into the end of next week.....then she'll promise to be out by the end of the month......then it'll be in the fall........yada....yada...yada......

[jmargel]

Moose, I told her last night that I want her out quickly. This was a shock to her, let her absorb what I said and then make a decision. If I demand an answer now by asking or pushing her out the door, she could easily tell me she will stay but then leave. I want her to actually *think* about this rather than giving me an answer based on fear or emotion.

[whichwayisup]

Sorry, I meant that if she makes the choice to leave, that is when you bring home boxes...My mistake on that one there.

 

I didn't mean for you to do that now with everything up in the air as it is now. No way... And I know you don't wanna push her out the door, but if she wants to go, let her go. Once somebody decides it's over there isn't much more the other hurting person can do to stop them or make the marriage work. But you know that already.

 

I agree with Moose eh. She is used to not really standing up to her and sticking to your guns. That isn't bad, but she uses it against you and in this situation she is in total control, not you. That is part of the problem too, not only the EX and her dad but control.

 

Giving advice is so much easier than taking it...