Can't get my wife off the phone and engaged in meaningful talks...

October 4, 2015

Just curious about one thing--have you ever had that ability to talk about the "deep stuff" with your wife? Do you guys have comparable levels of education?

I'd think that if you guys weren't intellectually compatible then that would've surfaced prior to marriage. Some people just aren't "thinkers" and conversations with them flow accordingly.

A couple other questions--do you genuinely like to hear other peoples' point of view? When you learn something new that challenges your worldview, do you embrace it as an opportunity to expand your knowledge or do you get argumentative and need to prove that you're "right." If a discussion always devolves into you pontificating the same opinions that your wife has already heard and knows will never change, then what's the point? I wouldn't blame her for diddling on the phone instead.

I'd love to hear more from you. I posted a few things about this issue this morning. I probably did recognize the intellectual disconnect between us, but for some reason I disregarded it. Perhaps I thought "nobody is a perfect match" (which is true, I suppose).

And yes I learn and tweak my opinions based on information and evidence. I'm a learner. I'm not arrogant enough to think I know everything, and I realize that opposing viewpoints can teach you much more than the murmurs of agreement.

October 4, 2015

and you just answered your own question....

your number one priority has changed ......

and because it has changed to something you do not believe your wife can obtain...you have given yourself a reason to pursue the other woman.

Your wife's intellect was not your number one priority when you married her....so you honestly cannot place ANY BLAME on her.

This is all on you.....

I hope you and your intellectually stimulating girlfriend live happily ever after....

October 4, 2015

You sound like a kindred spirit.

And yeah, it's a legitimate question. I think I am pretty open-minded and curious about other viewpoints. I'm not trying to "debate" her. I'd kill to have a deep conversation.

The more I think about how much I value intelligence and deep thinking, the more I ponder that maybe on some level I don't respect her because of what I view as a fatal deficiency. Crap, I need to think about that more.

Sorry but I have found that I am usually underestimating someone else's intelligence as I compare it to mine just because they see things differently than me. Watch that it isn't your ego underestimate her and an actual true and fair assessment.

I know that my husband's ex wife has viewed him as less intelligent. I see that as a grave underestimation. He just picked his battles differently and let go of the things he didn't care enough about. Not the same as being intelligent.

I still say you may have broad brushed her and actually don't know her as well as you think you do. Just a thought to think about.

October 5, 2015

Not everyone is into deep intellectual conversations. Your wife may not be into those, especially at the end of long days.

You should be able to have these kinds of conversations with other people without trending anywhere near the area of affair....

October 5, 2015

If you need "intellectual stimulation," go to lectures.

Bring your wife and then engage her in discussion about the lecture over a cocktail or dinner after the lecture.

My husband and I do this all the time; from World War I to the Italian Renaissance to "Other Earths, Other Life" by astronomer Sara Seager. I recently attended one about Food in the Golden Age of Sail.

You never know; your wife might surprise you and rise to the occasion.

October 5, 2015

If you need "intellectual stimulation," go to lectures.

Bring your wife and then engage her in discussion about the lecture over a cocktail or dinner after the lecture.

My husband and I do this all the time; from World War I to the Italian Renaissance to "Other Earths, Other Life" by astronomer Sara Seager. I recently attended one about Food in the Golden Age of Sail.

You never know; your wife might surprise you and rise to the occasion.

This ^^ what I highlighted in bold.

If I was in a RL and my SO didn't give me an opportunity to fix what I wasn't doing for him, then I'd be upset that I was blind sided.

So yes, I think he should try to develop in his wife what the OW provides for him.

October 6, 2015

Thread reopened after clean-up with the reminder that this is the Marriage & Life Partnerships forum so discussion in this thread should be limited to Mighty Pens efforts in regards to his marriage.

If he wishes to discuss the other topics that have been discussed here, they can be discussed in the other threads he has posted in their appropriate forums. ~Thank you

October 6, 2015

Good morning,

And yes it is. I'm being as blunt and honest with myself (and you folks) as I can possibly be.

It was vitally important to me through my school years. I think I married her because she was caring and funny and cute and responsible, and for some reason I totally disregarded the problem with lack of intellectual compatibility. But I can't rewrite history. I can only look forward.

You said she was sweet, cute, responsible and funny.

So you married her, made a family, now your not intellectually stimulated. I mean...if its your #1 thing...you gotta consider splitting if you'll never truly be happy.

But the Harvard intellectual you marry next could be a wench..demanding...not sweet or funny...and you will miss your sweet simple wife and mother of your kids.

I wish you could love her for who she is...the differences in my hubby and I is what makes our marriage great.

October 6, 2015

You said she was sweet, cute, responsible and funny.

So you married her, made a family, now your not intellectually stimulated. I mean...if its your #1 thing...you gotta consider splitting if you'll never truly be happy.
But the Harvard intellectual you marry next could be a wench..demanding...not sweet or funny...and you will miss your sweet simple wife and mother of your kids.
I wish you could love her for who she is...the differences in my hubby and I is what makes our marriage great.

I get what you are saying and I agree that differences can be turned into positive for a couple, but I gotta say dumbness and indifference for anything intellectual is unbearable for me. I do want someone around me who will be cute, funny, make me laugh and enjoy life, but if this happens on the expense of having a philosophical conversation or even any serious conversation at all, it doesn't matter. In my opinion fun people should be friends and not spouses.

MightyPen, you didn't comment on the last post I made so I was wondering whether you read it and you had nothing to comment or maybe you missed it.

October 6, 2015

First of all the OP has stopped all contact with the OW (who she had only talked to via the internet, never actually met her) so it's pointless to demand from him to start NC with the OW.

Second of all, I am happy that you could find the problem and try to solve it. From what I get from you, your wife was always the beautiful, popular girl who didn't have the need to develop any intellectual skills in order to find a SO. You married her because of this, her physical beauty, even her responsible attitude as you said, and at the time you loved it. You haven't talked about other issues in your marriage so she is perfect or near perfect at everything else and this is good for her. You were doing fine for all the years of marriage until a new need was born for you; the intellectual stimulation need, which you sought and found in an online site, thus the OW. You admit you don't want this particular OW, you can fall for any woman who fills this gap you have. The first step is to communicate this matter with your wife. Drop the attitude though, it won't help. I get that you are more intelligent than her in some matters but it's not nice to be rude. Talk to her. Tell her you have discovered this need for intellectual stuff to discuss. Take it from there. Tell her you feel close to her so you want to share this need you have only with her. Do that and tell us what happens.

My cousin has the same issue like you do. Her husband is handsome, works a lot to provide for the kids, he is a great father, he is social and makes her laugh, but God he can never be serious. Sometimes this is a good thing cause he deals with everything without that much seriousness, they always have fun in their house, they do things together as a family and so on. But sometimes she feels like screaming when she wants to have a more serious talk and he just doesn't care. His interests are football, cars and horses. Period. That's it. He is not interested in anything else. The world can be destroyed around him but he will just keep his habits. It's really frustrating. But you know what? Nobody is perfect. If in a relationship you lose more than you win, then it's time to leave.

In all the flurry of responses and the bit of drama in the thread, I think I missed it or just forgot to respond.

And your analysis is almost frighteningly accurate. I feel like your cousin might feel. Don't get me wrong, I can be silly with the best of them. In fact, I'm probably the practical joker of the household, but there's a time and a place for everything. I should have realized before we were married that this was going to be a problem, but again I can't afford to look back. It doesn't do much good at this point.

I still thinking getting out of the house more holds some of the answer. It would get us out of the "watch tv/play with phones" rut and it will give us more things to talk about. Last night, we talked about a upcoming concert and an upcoming play and started plans to attend both. And while this is a step in the right direction, it's a long way from getting her to go to a lecture at the local university (which I would love). We'll see how it goes...

October 6, 2015

In all the flurry of responses and the bit of drama in the thread, I think I missed it or just forgot to respond.

And your analysis is almost frighteningly accurate. I feel like your cousin might feel. Don't get me wrong, I can be silly with the best of them. In fact, I'm probably the practical joker of the household, but there's a time and a place for everything. I should have realized before we were married that this was going to be a problem, but again I can't afford to look back. It doesn't do much good at this point.

I still thinking getting out of the house more holds some of the answer. It would get us out of the "watch tv/play with phones" rut and it will give us more things to talk about. Last night, we talked about a upcoming concert and an upcoming play and started plans to attend both. And while this is a step in the right direction, it's a long way from getting her to go to a lecture at the local university (which I would love). We'll see how it goes...

In addition to trying to educate your wife, what are you doing to make yourself an honorable man that she would want to be intellectual and honest with. Honesty is one of the building blocks of intellect. Do you have that building block down yet?

October 6, 2015

This might sound like a "first world problem" but I assure you it's real.

Every night after we put the kiddos to bed, it's the same routine. We flop on the loveseat and sofa (separately) and she studies her phone like it holds the mysteries of the universe within. I try to engage her in conversation, but it rarely works. I end up turning on the TV or working on the computer, so admittedly I know I need to try harder to engage her. I probably give up too easily.

She plays those silly little time-wasting farm games and a trivia game. To add insult to injury, she will frequently ask me the answers to the trivia questions, but she doesn't seem interested in actually learning new things; she just wants to tap the right button and "beat" her friends at the game. I feel like Google.

Over recent years, I've come to realize that deep, thoughtful conversations, the exchange of ideas and options, all these things are REALLY important to me. After having so much of that in college and graduate school, I feel like a huge hole has opened up and I need to fill it.

My wife is not unintelligent, but she's not naturally inclined to talk about "deep" things. Most of our talks involve the mind-numbing logistics of daily life. On the rare occasion I'm able to engage her in thoughtful discussion, she'll frequently just give up and say, "I don't know."

How do I resolve this? Does anyone have any advice? I know some people might say, "Just get your intellectual stimulation elsewhere," but when it's the #1 on my priority list (way above sex, looks or even sense of humor), I'm not sure it would be sustainable to just "get it elsewhere" for the rest of my life.

(EDIT: I want to point out that my wife has many great qualities, is sexy and funny, hyper organized and responsible, and is a great mother to our children. We treat each other well and our household runs smoothly - no financial issues, substance abuse, battles about religion, or any of that stuff.)

What kind of deep interests do you have as an example for what is intellectually meaningful to you?

What do you and your emotional affair partner discuss from each other's computers outside the realm of the sexual interest in you have in each other?

How much time do you spend in chatting with your on line female "friend" as opposed to your wife playing silly trivial games on her phone.

How comfortable would you be to show your wife the communication you conduct with your secret "friend" and would your wife agree that it's only intellectually deep discussions that transpire between you and her.

October 6, 2015

What kind of deep interests do you have as an example for what is intellectually meaningful to you?

What do you and your emotional affair partner discuss from each other's computers outside the realm of the sexual interest in you have in each other?

How much time do you spend in chatting with your on line female "friend" as opposed to your wife playing silly trivial games on her phone.

How comfortable would you be to show your wife the communication you conduct with your secret "friend" and would your wife agree that it's only intellectually deep discussions that transpire between you and her.

I think William made it clear that we are to only talk about my original question in this thread. This discussion about my wife needs to be kept separate from the "secret friend" discussion.

However, if you want to paste your post onto my other thread, I'd be glad to address it. You ask good questions.

October 6, 2015

I think William made it clear that we are to only talk about my original question in this thread. This discussion about my wife needs to be kept separate from the "secret friend" discussion.

However, if you want to paste your post onto my other thread, I'd be glad to address it. You ask good questions.

But you didn't answer my question and is an extension of this one; "how can I get my wife to have meaningful talks" and your need for intellectual stimulation...

Have you considered attending lectures (which would provide the intellectual stimulation) and bringing your wife? Have you spelled it out to her that you need more of an intellectual connection with her?

October 6, 2015

I think a meaningful talk might begin with honesty....and disclosing what you are talking about with another woman....while she is playing games on her phone.

She might really open up to you and tell you exactly what she thinks...it might even be extremely intellectual and stimulating....which is exactly what you are looking for...right?

October 6, 2015

But you didn't answer my question and is an extension of this one; "how can I get my wife to have meaningful talks" and your need for intellectual stimulation...

Have you considered attending lectures (which would provide the intellectual stimulation) and bringing your wife? Have you spelled it out to her that you need more of an intellectual connection with her?

I need to mention this to her. I would love to go to lectures. I'm not sure if she will be pumped about the idea, but I'll try to find a topic that I think she would find at least somewhat interesting. I'll scan the university lecture boards during lunch.

October 6, 2015

What kind of deep interests do you have as an example for what is intellectually meaningful to you?

To add to the above, as to your intellectual interests, has it been something that has always been an interest or something new you are exploring?

In what way do you communicate the importance of your intellectual interest to your wife and how much it means to you to share it with her?

Edited October 6, 2015 by Furious

October 6, 2015

I need to mention this to her. I would love to go to lectures. I'm not sure if she will be pumped about the idea, but I'll try to find a topic that I think she would find at least somewhat interesting. I'll scan the university lecture boards during lunch.

Same way you discussed upcoming concerts/plays "with" your wife and you "both" agreed on considering them...do the same thing with the lecturing.

Cuz, remember, you two are a "team" - it's not up to you to pick and choose this/that for her. Also, since you are trying to "stimulate" her interests in things that are new to her and you're not sure how she's gonna take it, last thing she needs is for you to be like "oh, I signed us up for a lecture on X next week" as if she's your slave or child.

I'm all for men taking the lead on things (i.e. setting up dates, ordering at the restaurant for us both) - especially if it's a surprise for me But, for this type of thing, I believe you should bring it up with her, get her input and "ask" her to help you chose one that might be interesting.

BTW, I would allow a man to order for me in a restaurant cuz before the waiter comes, either I already told him what I'd like and/or my man simply "knows" me and I trust he'll order my fav plate.

But good job on putting your energies into "stimulating" your wife. Again, I wouldn't like my man to blind side me if there are issues in our marriage/RL w/o even giving me an opportunity to address and/or repair it.

October 6, 2015

Same way you discussed upcoming concerts/plays "with" your wife and you "both" agreed on considering them...do the same thing with the lecturing.

Cuz, remember, you two are a "team" - it's not up to you to pick and choose this/that for her. Also, since you are trying to "stimulate" her interests in things that are new to her and you're not sure how she's gonna take it, last thing she needs is for you to be like "oh, I signed us up for a lecture on X next week" as if she's your slave or child.

I'm all for men taking the lead on things (i.e. setting up dates, ordering at the restaurant for us both) - especially if it's a surprise for me But, for this type of thing, I believe you should bring it up with her, get her input and "ask" her to help you chose one that might be interesting.

BTW, I would allow a man to order for me in a restaurant cuz before the waiter comes, either I already told him what I'd like and/or my man simply "knows" me and I trust he'll order my fav plate.

But good job on putting your energies into "stimulating" your wife. Again, I wouldn't like my man to blind side me if there are issues in our marriage/RL w/o even giving me an opportunity to address and/or repair it.

So true! A team!

So she needs to be fully aware of your needs before you decide she won't meet them.

Also how about a fun challenge you both make a pact together to do...2 weeks...no tv or social media.

Or even simpler...one night my husband directly said we are in 2 seperate corners of the couch on our phones or the computer and I miss you.

I was shocked. Here I assumed he didnt notice or care.

I barely pick up my phone in the evening now.

Let her know you want to connect, you want to talk and date and that you want to learn together.

Trips and documentaries and such expand the mind.

Not if you make it a chore though.

If her passion was knitting and she couldn't live without it...would you pick it up too in order to be a stronger couple? You might but you may not love it.

I have all kind of wordly weird views that I dont share with hubby cause its not his thing...hes more black and white and simple.

But hes also so loving, caring, supportive...so I CHOOSE to love him for who he is and not change him or fix what isn't broken. If he's gonna get interested its gonna be organic.

And it might be because I inspired him by my own excitement on a topic. She loves you, is a good wife and mother, talk to her. Open your heart.

But also allow a window for you each to have your own agenda and interests and no matter hers....respect it.

Amd make her WANT to put that phone down and share your world!

October 7, 2015

Well, yesterday at dinner we were talking about getting out more, finding a reliable babysitters, etc. There's actually a young lady at work (19) that would be perfect. She even lives nearby. So we start discussing things we can do - a play, a concert, and then I toss in that I was skimming the university boards and found some lectures (and they're free, so that's a plus, right?!?)

My wife sorta playfully rolled her eyes and laughed and said, "Wellll...that doesn't really sound like my thing." She did later add, "But if you really want to go."

So I guess I'll see. I went out of my way to find topics I thought she might find interesting but I'm not overly optimistic.

October 7, 2015

Well, yesterday at dinner we were talking about getting out more, finding a reliable babysitters, etc. There's actually a young lady at work (19) that would be perfect. She even lives nearby. So we start discussing things we can do - a play, a concert, and then I toss in that I was skimming the university boards and found some lectures (and they're free, so that's a plus, right?!?)

My wife sorta playfully rolled her eyes and laughed and said, "Wellll...that doesn't really sound like my thing." She did later add, "But if you really want to go."

So I guess I'll see. I went out of my way to find topics I thought she might find interesting but I'm not overly optimistic.

What was she interested in doing for a date night?

A spouse can't fulfill everything for us. There are some areas that they may do to humor us but we need to find our own outlet for them. For myself, my horses. My husband supports them but it isn't his greatest passion. So will help when I need help but isn't banging down the door to go spend days at a show or go riding in the muck and rain. And that's fine. I have friends that I ride/compete with and do it alone. For him, it's soccer. I humor it but it isn't my greatest passion. He watches it a lot, referees, etc. I will go watch him to support him but not something that hits my top 10 list.

Are you expecting too much out of her? Do you have appropriate resources where you can share your different passions/hobbies independent of her?

October 7, 2015

Well, yesterday at dinner we were talking about getting out more, finding a reliable babysitters, etc. There's actually a young lady at work (19) that would be perfect. She even lives nearby. So we start discussing things we can do - a play, a concert, and then I toss in that I was skimming the university boards and found some lectures (and they're free, so that's a plus, right?!?)

My wife sorta playfully rolled her eyes and laughed and said, "Wellll...that doesn't really sound like my thing." She did later add, "But if you really want to go."

So I guess I'll see. I went out of my way to find topics I thought she might find interesting but I'm not overly optimistic.

What are the sort of topics that interest her? You might want to start by finding those interests in the online TED talks (of which there are thousands!). Lots of them are now on Netflix; everything from sex to food to design to entertainment to global issues. Watch one or two together. Put on PBS shows and documentaries (the recent American Experience on Walt Disney was fascinating!) and get her used to the idea of having more intellectually stimulating information on as a general practice.

Listen to NPR in the car and engage in conversation about the stories that might interest you.

It can be baby steps; you don't need to jump right into live lectures. Once you start seeing what interests her or what topics she might be engaged in, then it will be an easier step to go to a live TED talk versus a hard-core university lecture.

October 7, 2015

What was she interested in doing for a date night?

A spouse can't fulfill everything for us. There are some areas that they may do to humor us but we need to find our own outlet for them. For myself, my horses. My husband supports them but it isn't his greatest passion. So will help when I need help but isn't banging down the door to go spend days at a show or go riding in the muck and rain. And that's fine. I have friends that I ride/compete with and do it alone. For him, it's soccer. I humor it but it isn't my greatest passion. He watches it a lot, referees, etc. I will go watch him to support him but not something that hits my top 10 list.

Are you expecting too much out of her? Do you have appropriate resources where you can share your different passions/hobbies independent of her?

She suggested a concert and a play. Neither the musical group nor the particular play being performed are "my bag" but I'm willing to be flexible to get out of the house and get some momentum going behind date nights.

And am I expecting too much out of her? I don't know. I don't want it to sound like I'm giving up, especially since much of the advice on this thread has been to "take her to the lectures" or "engage her in the types of conversations you're having with the OW," but I'm just not sure my wife will ever been super into this sort of thing.

I totally understand and agree that spouses can have different "interests," such as the horse and soccer examples you gave (come to think of it, horse soccer might be awesome to watch). But I think my gripe is more than different interests. I guess I feel like there's a whole area of her brain she either doesn't use or doesn't use very often.

Edited October 7, 2015 by MightyPen

October 7, 2015

What are the sort of topics that interest her? You might want to start by finding those interests in the online TED talks (of which there are thousands!). Lots of them are now on Netflix; everything from sex to food to design to entertainment to global issues. Watch one or two together. Put on PBS shows and documentaries (the recent American Experience on Walt Disney was fascinating!) and get her used to the idea of having more intellectually stimulating information on as a general practice.

Listen to NPR in the car and engage in conversation about the stories that might interest you.

It can be baby steps; you don't need to jump right into live lectures. Once you start seeing what interests her or what topics she might be engaged in, then it will be an easier step to go to a live TED talk versus a hard-core university lecture.

The TED talks are a great idea! My only concern with watching online stuff together is that she might fall into her rut of breaking out the cell phone and "multitasking" and not really paying attention to it.

And I listen to NPR all the time in the car (probably no surprise there) but to be honest, most of their discussions would bore her to death. I'll keep on the lookout for something that that might tickle her fancy. Did I sound weird using that phrase?

October 7, 2015

The TED talks are a great idea! My only concern with watching online stuff together is that she might fall into her rut of breaking out the cell phone and "multitasking" and not really paying attention to it.

That is why you will have to do some legwork to find something that will interest her and then engage her in conversation about it. The cool things with TED talks is most of them are less than 15 minutes long.

Have you specifically talked to her about putting the phone down? It is something my husband and I struggle with - together and with his kids. So meal times are always without electronics. And an evening walk - at least 20 minutes - is without the phone and just for discussion.

Right now, the cell phone *IS* an addiction so it takes some time and work to break the habit.

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