Dark religious secret, to tell or not to tell?

[Jazzers]

I am so torn over this, and I'm lost and don't know what to do. My heart says TELL and my brain says KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT.

 

I met Rhonda in the first grade. It was very obvious even at such a young age that her parents were not typical. Think of the movie Carrie. If Carrie's mother was a 10 on the religious fanatical scale, Rhonda's parents are about a 9 (sans the insaneness.) They kept extremely rigid control over Rhonda and her two brothers. Common missteps with their children was using the word "gosh," (which was punishable) and tapping their toes along with any sort of secular music (also punishable.) Please keep in mind these are just 2 small instances and in no way express the breadth and depth of Rhonda's parent's religious beliefs.

 

Rhonda married a guy named Bart, almost right out of high school. They wanted to start a family right away, but she found out she had a medical condition that would prevent her from ever becoming a mother. She told her parents about this even before she told her husband, and said that she was deeply disappointed she couldn't have biological children, but she would discuss adopting with her husband. Her parents became very angry with her and said that if God had intended for her to be a mother, He wouldn't have made her incapable of having children. (I wish I could have been a participant in that conversation ... )

 

Within a day or two Rhonda committed suicide. Two years later her younger brother followed suit and brought about his own demise. It appears they both succumbed to the religious fanatical stranglehold their parents had on them. This all happened back in 1983.

 

With the advent of Facebook and how they relentlessly toss countless people onto your computer monitor ... HEY do you know THIS person?? ... Bart has been floating around on my Facebook page for a couple of weeks. It has been unsettling to me and has brought back a lot of memories of my friend. Finally I decided to strike up a conversation with Bart about Rhonda. I was utterly shocked to discover he has no clue why Rhonda killed herself. He mentioned her having painful cysts which the doctor prescribed a pain killer for, but she didn't want to take them. He's under the assumption the pain was too much for her and she couldn't deal with it anymore. I find it horrifically sad that he thinks she would throw her life away from the pain of cysts.

 

It was incredibly difficult to not just tell him the way that it was, but even after 32 years I'm sure it's hard for him, and I do not want to be an insensitive jerk. He mentioned that he is still good friends with Rhonda's parents even up to today.

 

I don't know what to do. I feel that Bart deserves to know the truth. I also feel that Rhonda's parents have suffered enough from losing two children to suicide. What in the world do I do?

[buck3200]

At this point keep your mouth shut....who knows what he'd do if you told him. If I was him it a minimum it wouldn't be pretty...

[autumnnight]

OP, I am so sorry about your friend. Sadly, the kind of parenting you talk about is not that uncommon, and the kinds of churches and other groups who proscribe this kind of unquestioning obedience are not uncommon either. I know many people who have been hurt by such groups and such people. I am one of them.

 

If you are struggling with this, I encourage you to read the book: The Subtle Power of Spiritual Abuse. It is a very real issue, and it can destroy lives. I am glad that during her short life, Rhonda had a friend like you.

[Jazzers]

I tend to agree with you, truly I do. But I keep thinking if I were in his shoes I would want to know the truth. It seems like such a tragedy for him to think she killed herself over something so trivial. The pain of cysts is pretty bad, but it's definitely NOT bad enough to kill yourself over.

 

I'm so freakin' torn over this. I don't hate her parents, but I don't really care that much about their feelings, either. I want what's best for Bart, and I think the Truth would be very important to him.

 

I'm a long, long way from making any decisions on this. I'm hoping other people will come forward with their input.

[autumnnight]

I tend to agree with you, truly I do. But I keep thinking if I were in his shoes I would want to know the truth. It seems like such a tragedy for him to think she killed herself over something so trivial. The pain of cysts is pretty bad, but it's definitely NOT bad enough to kill yourself over.

 

I'm so freakin' torn over this. I don't hate her parents, but I don't really care that much about their feelings, either. I want what's best for Bart, and I think the Truth would be very important to him.

 

I'm a long, long way from making any decisions on this. I'm hoping other people will come forward with their input.

 

You're a good person, OP

 

Can I ask, did her parents subscribe to the Bill Gothard teachings?

[Jazzers]

Thanks, Autumn. I always try my best to do right by others. I am not familiar with Bill Gothard, and I seriously doubt her parents were familiar with him either. They're Baptist. I was raised Baptist as well, but not anything anywhere near what Rhonda went through. I never quite figured out where they were coming from.

[autumnnight]

Thanks, Autumn. I always try my best to do right by others. I am not familiar with Bill Gothard, and I seriously doubt her parents were familiar with him either. They're Baptist. I was raised Baptist as well, but not anything anywhere near what Rhonda went through. I never quite figured out where they were coming from.

 

I was raised very conservative Baptist, and we spent a lot of time on his teachings. Back then they were called "Institute in Basic Youth Conflicts."

 

There are people for whom legalism has a particular appeal. People who need to be in control, people with addictions or addictive personalities, people who are only comfortable in a black and white world. And it isn't just church. I've encountered even more insidious, invasive, and vengeful versions of it online.

 

It sounds like you friend had a very "people pleasing" oriented personality. I did too. This kind of pressure and threatening legalism is VERY damaging to those of us with that kind of personality. I am so sorry she took her life, but in some ways, it doesn't even surprise me, which is sad.

[pureinheart]

I tend to agree with you, truly I do. But I keep thinking if I were in his shoes I would want to know the truth. It seems like such a tragedy for him to think she killed herself over something so trivial. The pain of cysts is pretty bad, but it's definitely NOT bad enough to kill yourself over.

 

I'm so freakin' torn over this. I don't hate her parents, but I don't really care that much about their feelings, either. I want what's best for Bart, and I think the Truth would be very important to him.

 

I'm a long, long way from making any decisions on this. I'm hoping other people will come forward with their input.

 

If this were me I would pray about this before taking any action. First, the truth you think you have may not be the truth at all- technically you don't know why she took her own life... it's speculation as only her and God know the real reason(s).

 

Bart has to know it runs much deeper than cysts and it's definitely good to play the blame game because no one parents perfectly. I've seen some really horrible parenting, meaning I'm talking of hard core drug users and some radical abuse both physical and mental, yet these 'kids' turned out to be completely fine and very rational.

 

You know, if you really need to talk to Bart... ask him first, 'could there have been something much deeper that would have caused Rhonda to take her own life, do you really think it was 'cysts'?'

 

IDK... personally I say let it go. People over the years have confided in me and I've known certain 'things' about people. I realize this is different than your sitch, although even if I know the knowledge I have might possibly answer some questions or whatever, usually I'll not say a word.

 

This is a load that IMO is not yours to carry...

[LuckyLady13]

I was utterly shocked to discover he has no clue why Rhonda killed herself. He mentioned her having painful cysts which the doctor prescribed a pain killer for, but she didn't want to take them. He's under the assumption the pain was too much for her and she couldn't deal with it anymore. I find it horrifically sad that he thinks she would throw her life away from the pain of cysts.

 

Jazzers, the fact that you care about this says a lot about you. Your heart cares about Bart but your brain is trying to keep your heart from getting you into trouble or causing trouble for others.

 

I was in a similar situation about 24 years ago so I understand how torn you feel right now. It was so hard for me because, at the time, I could not say a word.

 

I understand you not feeling good with the thought of this guy going through life not knowing why Rhonda committed suicide but you have to weigh everything here.

 

If you tell him everything you know, you'll feel relieved at first, it may or may not be an eye-opening experience for him but there will definitely be fallout. There's no two ways about it. And sometimes, we do things with the best of intentions but once other people are involved, things can go totally sideways and not how you envisioned it. You can't guarantee people will do good things with information you give them.

 

You can do good things with the information you have! This situation had a big impact on your life (in a multitude of ways) so you can raise peoples awareness about spiritual abuse. Volunteer with organizations trying to stop spiritual abuse and/or help people who are running from it and need somewhere to go.

 

If you want to continue communicating with Bart, I highly suggest letting Bart do a majority of the talking. Maybe you'll find out he knows more than you think he does. If that's the case, you can let out a lot of things on your mind. If he doesn't know, I wouldn't drop a bomb on him. There's going to be way too much fallout and then you'll feel torn up for new reasons.

[Noproblem]

well you didn't do your friend jusitce

 

it's not about you or Bart or drama or pain

 

it's about this poor soul who her family destroyed her and eventually were the cause of her suicide

 

You should have told him the truth.. what you really gonna lose?

 

an angry call from the parents? or Bart not believing you?

 

Boho to them and to any parents like them!

[BrokenManAgain]

The military man in me says go confront the parents and tell them what you know. Leave two rounds in a pistol and walk away.

 

But that would only add to your friend's pain.

 

At the very least, I would let the parents know that someone else know what they did ... and therefore, God knows.

[autumnnight]

The military man in me says go confront the parents and tell them what you know. Leave two rounds in a pistol and walk away.

 

But that would only add to your friend's pain.

 

At the very least, I would let the parents know that someone else know what they did ... and therefore, God knows.

 

I understand this completely. Sadly, people like these parents will never see it. Never. They incapable of seeing their failings or admitting them. Trying to talk to these kinds of people will just make you want to pick the pistol back up and put yourself out of misery. Seriously.

 

My parents were not this bad, but they were very controlling, and they have never ever apologized to me for anything...ever. I still trigger when I encounter someone who is never wrong, who argues in a circular fashion, and who is incapable of saying "I'm sorry."

[HopeForTomorrow]

... but she found out she had a medical condition that would prevent her from ever becoming a mother.

 

First of all, no single medical condition can prevent someone from becoming a mother. Because giving birth is not the only way to be a mother.

 

He mentioned her having painful cysts which the doctor prescribed a pain killer for, but she didn't want to take them. He's under the assumption the pain was too much for her and she couldn't deal with it anymore. I find it horrifically sad that he thinks she would throw her life away from the pain of cysts.

 

So back in 1983, we didn't understand polycystic ovarian syndrome (PCOS) like we do now - from what you said, I would strongly guess that's what your friend had. Back then, docs just assumed that women with this condition were infertile (and at that time, with no legitimate interventions, many were). Now, we know that many if not most women with PCOS respond to treatments aimed at reducing insulin resistance. In fact many women become fertile just by taking the first-line treatment for patients with type 2 diabetes mellitus (metformin) and don't even need extensive and highly unsuccessful treatments in this population such as in-vitro, etc.

 

This is a terribly sad story. If she were here today she could be easily treated. But the real issue is the lack of understanding projected to her by her parents and others with the black-and-white thinking.

 

It was incredibly difficult to not just tell him the way that it was, but even after 32 years I'm sure it's hard for him, and I do not want to be an insensitive jerk. He mentioned that he is still good friends with Rhonda's parents even up to today.

 

In your place I would have a really hard time not pushing this issue too.

 

I don't know what to do. I feel that Bart deserves to know the truth. I also feel that Rhonda's parents have suffered enough from losing two children to suicide. What in the world do I do?

 

I think you should do nothing. Like autumn says below, you aren't going to change these people, not really. You can't bring her back. And Bart knows at some level that lots more was really going on than what was visible. There is nothing to be gained by doing anything at this point. EXCEPT... for me and maybe for others to understand how these kind of issues and expectations can literally be life or death for people who live to please their families.

 

Even if this woman had gone through this today instead of the early 1980s - but with the same parents - would she still believe the same thing? With the same outcome? If she came into the physician visit and was told that she would need to take certain medication(s) but that statistically her fertility would likely not be an issue if she did, then would she still believe what she did when she committed suicide?

 

I honestly don't know. It's a lot to think about, and it's important.

 

I understand this completely. Sadly, people like these parents will never see it. Never. They incapable of seeing their failings or admitting them. Trying to talk to these kinds of people will just make you want to pick the pistol back up and put yourself out of misery. Seriously.

 

Yes.

Edited October 12, 2015 by HopeForTomorrow

[BrokenManAgain]

I understand this completely. Sadly, people like these parents will never see it.

No, they won't.

 

Never. They incapable of seeing their failings or admitting them. Trying to talk to these kinds of people will just make you want to pick the pistol back up and put yourself out of misery. Seriously.

All they would see and they will back down is that they pissed off a person in authority that they respect ... in this case, a uniform.

 

My parents were not this bad, but they were very controlling, and they have never ever apologized to me for anything...ever. I still trigger when I encounter someone who is never wrong, who argues in a circular fashion, and who is incapable of saying "I'm sorry."

Get over it. Tiger Mothers, etc, did they love you? Did they tried their best for you ... I mean for you, and not their god.

 

The above example read like they were sacraficing their kid to their god.

 

God has his place ... and this thread ain't where my views belonged but my God will never allow this ****! And frankly, neither would I.