Hoping to stop the downhill plunge.... Update.

[veryhappy]

Of course you'll have anniversary sex! If she's complied all her life with you, why would she she do anything different on such a special, carefully planned occasion?

 

I commented on page 8, and I'm bringing it up as it looks that you respond to everyone in case you skipped it by mistake.

 

What kind of tanning are you doing?

[Lion Heart]

 

1. Our marriage is not in jeopardy at this time.

 

2. There are no threats or plans of divorce.

 

3. Now if I find out there is another man,

4. or if in 6 months I look like a hot hunk and

5. (If) I am the perfect husband and father and friend and

6. (If) I have expressed my desire for a more intimate relationship and

7. (If) she completely stiff arms me and wants nothing to do with that, it may (WILL!!!) be a different story.

 

8. But for now, there is no jeopardy.

 

Helloooo oldshirt,

 

I've come across this thread a few weeks late obviously because I have been completely gobsmacked by your approach. And I've tried to catch up and see where it's led you so far. I AM AFRAID for your M and, ofcourse, I'm not IN your M nor a fly on the wall during your interactions. I've always respected the opinions you've expressed on LS but this modus operandii of yours has taken me completely by surprise. It seems counter intuitive to how I think you actually are (on LS at least) and possibly how you are going about this something like a 'secret operation' when your W is unknowingly being tested and could be horribly blindsided. I would be VERY HAPPY to hear that I am wrong on all counts!

 

Before I go on Happy Anniversary to you both! XX

 

Allow me to address this particular post you made.

Sorry for the weird context - typing from my phone.

 

1. I think obviously your M IS in "jeopardy" at this time! Why on earth would you go to such lengths as to reflect and list in fine detail what YOU will change about yourself, with all the onus on your Ws reaction? You've clearly reached a brink of some type to spur on actions and changes but with the onus on HER. Unless you communicate WHY even to say "I'm making changes to myself to SHOW you how much I love you and to improve our M on all levels" then she may just see what YOU ARE doing as for you. My H made plenty of changes to HIS appearance and I never once thought it was for me, and I've been right all along! it was for him to spark interest from OW. I didn't know THAT but I definitely knew it wasn't for me.

 

2. Yes there is BECAUSE you keep reiterating IF I do (blah blah blah) and W does not respond in (blah blah blah) way, THEN I KNOW. KNOW what? I can see your predicament in that she's not a great communicator BUT you complain very little about that. Your complaints seem to be more about the sexual / intimate incompatibility growing you've recognized in the 'recent' past ie not from the beginning of the M? I'm not saying ANYONE should accept a no sex / no intimacy M. No! But from all your posts so far, alot of us would kill to have the ACTUAL LEVEL of sex AND intimacy you guys have. I think you are looking at this critical point of your relationship and saying "see??? Cup half EMPTY" when you could change your perspective and say "wow! Cup half full during menopause. How great is this! " IDK. And I get your love language is sex / intimacy. Mine too. I get that. It's the attitude you convey I am questioning. Does it benefit you..your attitude. (Yeah I'm a born optimist).

 

3. Sure. Affair as a deal breaker may need revisiting!

 

4. Good on you but your W may not care whether you look like a hunk or not. My H is just as hot in his worst state of personal maintenance (tho hygiene is important) as when he's all spruced up. My feelings are constant but that's just me.

 

5. I wrote IF because you are the ONLY one setting the list for this and checking it off yourself too. Ofcourse you're gonna get 100% on an exam you wrote AND marked yourself! Be a little fair and have Ws INPUT on the EXAM and the MARKING. Your list could be ENTIRELY different to hers. IDK.

 

6. IF here too. Still leads back to the fact that you're complaining about things IMO that you ALREADY get! But again I know sh**. Just going off what you've written. You want ice cream. You get ice cream. But you want TWO helpings. And a variety of toppings WHEN you think without asking. No one's a mind reader. Stop assuming she knows everything.

 

7. The IF...THEN dilemma here again. Seriously oldshirt? It's like you've suggested a walk in the park to your W and see an Obstacle Course to the right hand side of the park. You don't set the challenge to your W, you just walk calmly next to her to SEE if she'll jump that high, cross that bridge, hop step through the 20 tyre rings, he** swing from the flying fox! Be brave! Have the courage to TELL her you've set the challenge up. At the very least, she could train for it (fervently seek help through her menopause or book a holiday in Tahiti you've always wanted for just the 2 of you, buy whips and chains IDK!) But IF MY H wanted anything I WOULD WANT HIM TO TELL ME. Hit me with it. I'm a big girl. I care about my M and him and our family. Set whatever he wants. I might disagree that playing poker for money is a good idea. It won't spice up this M! Lol.

Get my drift?

Still I see communication as the MAJOR MAJOR issue here.

 

8. There is. That's why you're posting your secret op here.

 

I applaud you for ALL YOUR efforts. I sincerely do! Just let your blindsided W know. She might just be entirely over the moon you are doing all this for your M.

 

Hope your wishes were fulfilled on your Anniversary. It sounded very romantic even though there was definitely the STANDING OUT LIKE dogs ba**s expectation of sex. No problem there if that's your thing? Sort of contrary to a main message through your thread but your biz brother.

 

Best wishes

Lion Heart.

[dichotomy]

Been away from the board for a while. Tried to catch up on your thread here. Like others I have appreciated your posts and advice.

 

I think all the ideas and steps you have taken or plan to take are well advised. I am glad you also looked into emails and used the VAR.

 

 

Sometimes a spouse (man or women) can make the effort to be super spouse and it still not result in improvements in sexual intimacy in marriage. You have replied to these kind of thread and situations before on LS - including mine.

 

Only thing I can add is what is "actual sex" ??? You used this from a conversation your wife had with you after asking you to Titty F' her. I think some get focused on PIV as "actual sex". If your wife is experiencing the normal vaginal changes that can occur with Menopause perhaps this is on her mind "I can't have actual sex" so forget it. My wife tends to have this view as well. Me on the other hand would be forever happy with oral, hand jobs, or T f'ing as actual sex many times. But not everyone sees it this way.

 

Also I liked the discussion on love languages. I wish that author would just add "sex" as its OWN love language in addition to "touch" in his books. My wife loves lots of touch...and I do to, but its NOT the same as sex for some.

 

Best wishes.

Edited October 28, 2015 by dichotomy

[oldshirt]

Helloooo oldshirt,

 

I've come across this thread a few weeks late obviously because I have been completely gobsmacked by your approach. And I've tried to catch up and see where it's led you so far. I AM AFRAID for your M and, ofcourse, I'm not IN your M nor a fly on the wall during your interactions. I've always respected the opinions you've expressed on LS but this modus operandii of yours has taken me completely by surprise. It seems counter intuitive to how I think you actually are (on LS at least) and possibly how you are going about this something like a 'secret operation' when your W is unknowingly being tested and could be horribly blindsided. I would be VERY HAPPY to hear that I am wrong on all counts!

 

Before I go on Happy Anniversary to you both! XX

 

Allow me to address this particular post you made.

Sorry for the weird context - typing from my phone.

 

1. I think obviously your M IS in "jeopardy" at this time! Why on earth would you go to such lengths as to reflect and list in fine detail what YOU will change about yourself, with all the onus on your Ws reaction? You've clearly reached a brink of some type to spur on actions and changes but with the onus on HER. Unless you communicate WHY even to say "I'm making changes to myself to SHOW you how much I love you and to improve our M on all levels" then she may just see what YOU ARE doing as for you. My H made plenty of changes to HIS appearance and I never once thought it was for me, and I've been right all along! it was for him to spark interest from OW. I didn't know THAT but I definitely knew it wasn't for me.

 

2. Yes there is BECAUSE you keep reiterating IF I do (blah blah blah) and W does not respond in (blah blah blah) way, THEN I KNOW. KNOW what? I can see your predicament in that she's not a great communicator BUT you complain very little about that. Your complaints seem to be more about the sexual / intimate incompatibility growing you've recognized in the 'recent' past ie not from the beginning of the M? I'm not saying ANYONE should accept a no sex / no intimacy M. No! But from all your posts so far, alot of us would kill to have the ACTUAL LEVEL of sex AND intimacy you guys have. I think you are looking at this critical point of your relationship and saying "see??? Cup half EMPTY" when you could change your perspective and say "wow! Cup half full during menopause. How great is this! " IDK. And I get your love language is sex / intimacy. Mine too. I get that. It's the attitude you convey I am questioning. Does it benefit you..your attitude. (Yeah I'm a born optimist).

 

3. Sure. Affair as a deal breaker may need revisiting!

 

4. Good on you but your W may not care whether you look like a hunk or not. My H is just as hot in his worst state of personal maintenance (tho hygiene is important) as when he's all spruced up. My feelings are constant but that's just me.

 

5. I wrote IF because you are the ONLY one setting the list for this and checking it off yourself too. Ofcourse you're gonna get 100% on an exam you wrote AND marked yourself! Be a little fair and have Ws INPUT on the EXAM and the MARKING. Your list could be ENTIRELY different to hers. IDK.

 

6. IF here too. Still leads back to the fact that you're complaining about things IMO that you ALREADY get! But again I know sh**. Just going off what you've written. You want ice cream. You get ice cream. But you want TWO helpings. And a variety of toppings WHEN you think without asking. No one's a mind reader. Stop assuming she knows everything.

 

7. The IF...THEN dilemma here again. Seriously oldshirt? It's like you've suggested a walk in the park to your W and see an Obstacle Course to the right hand side of the park. You don't set the challenge to your W, you just walk calmly next to her to SEE if she'll jump that high, cross that bridge, hop step through the 20 tyre rings, he** swing from the flying fox! Be brave! Have the courage to TELL her you've set the challenge up. At the very least, she could train for it (fervently seek help through her menopause or book a holiday in Tahiti you've always wanted for just the 2 of you, buy whips and chains IDK!) But IF MY H wanted anything I WOULD WANT HIM TO TELL ME. Hit me with it. I'm a big girl. I care about my M and him and our family. Set whatever he wants. I might disagree that playing poker for money is a good idea. It won't spice up this M! Lol.

Get my drift?

Still I see communication as the MAJOR MAJOR issue here.

 

8. There is. That's why you're posting your secret op here.

 

I applaud you for ALL YOUR efforts. I sincerely do! Just let your blindsided W know. She might just be entirely over the moon you are doing all this for your M.

 

Hope your wishes were fulfilled on your Anniversary. It sounded very romantic even though there was definitely the STANDING OUT LIKE dogs ba**s expectation of sex. No problem there if that's your thing? Sort of contrary to a main message through your thread but your biz brother.

 

Best wishes

Lion Heart.

 

 

 

Thanks for taking the time to make such a detailed post of your concerns and comments. Thank you also for the anniversary wishes. I will address some posts that people have made lately and then I will post an update of how things went for our anniversary.

 

 

first off in regards to our marriage being in "jeopardy", I do not feel it is in immediate jeopardy as no one is threatening to leave or making any ultimatums or making any plans or taking any steps to separate. (At least I know I am not)

 

 

Yes we have some baggage and some issues like every other couple but there is no immediate crisis here and no one is contemplating pulling the ejection handle at this time.

 

 

- yes, I realize a lot of guys (and gals) have it much worse than me. We are not in a sexless marriage nor are we dealing with chronic rejection etc. I am just trying to take some preemptive action here in hoping to avoid things getting worse until it does turn into chronic rejection/sexless marriage etc.

 

 

- I get the feeling most of your concerns are over the fact that I am doing some things without discussing them with her first. I get that is an issue for some people and knew some would have an issue with that. Historically I have been a "lets-sit-down-and-discuss-this..." kind of person. What I have learned is that she really hates to talk about things and gets very defensive whenever I try to discuss something. And also that it really doesn't help much anyway. the things that have made a difference is when I have changed my behaviors and did things differently.

 

 

All I am doing is trying to do is be a better person and trying not to pressure her about sex. It's not really a "test" per se but of course I am going to assess her responses and reactions to my actions. If something seems to make it worse, I will shift gears and do something else. If something seems to be making it better, I will emphasize that a little more.

 

 

It's really no more complicated than that and there isn't anything nefarious taking place with it.

 

 

- I am not trying to make changes in myself for her or for the marriage. I am doing it for me.

 

 

 

 

If I am not covering something that you are wondering about just ask.

[lovinDKT3]

Oldshirt, I really get the impression that you have placed your wife in a battle for the marriage and she is unaware she is fighting.

 

I know you said she does not respond to your attempts to communicate your concerns, but your really putting her in a tough position.

[oldshirt]

Been away from the board for a while. Tried to catch up on your thread here. Like others I have appreciated your posts and advice.

 

I think all the ideas and steps you have taken or plan to take are well advised. I am glad you also looked into emails and used the VAR.

 

 

Sometimes a spouse (man or women) can make the effort to be super spouse and it still not result in improvements in sexual intimacy in marriage. You have replied to these kind of thread and situations before on LS - including mine.

 

Only thing I can add is what is "actual sex" ??? You used this from a conversation your wife had with you after asking you to Titty F' her. I think some get focused on PIV as "actual sex". If your wife is experiencing the normal vaginal changes that can occur with Menopause perhaps this is on her mind "I can't have actual sex" so forget it. My wife tends to have this view as well. Me on the other hand would be forever happy with oral, hand jobs, or T f'ing as actual sex many times. But not everyone sees it this way.

 

Also I liked the discussion on love languages. I wish that author would just add "sex" as its OWN love language in addition to "touch" in his books. My wife loves lots of touch...and I do to, but its NOT the same as sex for some.

 

Best wishes.

 

 

 

You bring up a good point in regards to love languages, yes sexuality and sexual chemistry are probably a more accurate love language of mine than simply touch.

 

 

I read these stories of people who have literally gone years without any sexual contact and I have no grasp. after a few months the writing would be on the wall that it was time for me to move on.

 

 

Anyway, that's neither here nor there. I realize that as we age and as we are together longer and longer the flames of passion are not going to burn as bright and I will need to adjust accordingly.

 

 

In regards to the alternative methods, yes I am good with alternative methods and do not always require PIV. My wife also historically has had no issues with doing alternative methods and have never had an attitude of "PIV or nothing."

 

 

Truth be told, I would probably prefer an enthusiastic and engaging encounter of an alternative method vs a disconnected and cold encounter of PIV that entailed mostly looking at the clock and telling me to hurry up.

 

 

But as I've stated multiple times throughout the thread, my issue here is the lack of desire and the concept of "taking one for the team" in general rather than an issue specifically with PIV.

 

 

If somehow the libido and desire could be bumped up enough that the alternative methods could be done with some zest and enthusiasm, I would be ok with that.

 

 

I'm not saying that I could live on a steady diet of nothing but that forever and ever, but it would certainly be a big and much appreciated step in the right direction.

[oldshirt]

Oldshirt, I really get the impression that you have placed your wife in a battle for the marriage and she is unaware she is fighting.

 

I know you said she does not respond to your attempts to communicate your concerns, but your really putting her in a tough position.

 

This seems to be a common sentiment among a number of posters.

 

 

Can you explain a little more?

[Hopeful714]

You need to communicate. You are communicating this all to us, but not her. Right now though may not be the right time to critique the quality of your sex considering its obvious she is trying... by at least giving what she can. Any complaints will put you further in the hole. No pun intended. Try to get her to open up about what she's feeling. We really don't even know what the issue is yet. Painful sex? Problem with you? Just not feeling it? We can't address the real problem if we don't know what it is.

 

I think you are on the correct path of learning to accept that things are changing with the aging process. There won't be "porn star" sex forever, nor should there be. Everything in life evolves and changes....so must your sex life. A 60-70 yr old having porn star style of sex just seems wrong no? What do you picture at that age?

 

Anyhow, I think you need to continue with the support and help around house. Do everything you can to be a good husband at this time. Not because you want better sex, but because that's how you should be. Appreciate her. Communicate. I think that is the only way to get her to desire you.

 

I also think you need to develop a greater sense of intimacy. Closeness. From what I'm reading....boob sex is all fun and games...but im not feeling a real connection there. Just a release, and one for the team. You need to get the "connection" back.

 

She's only 48. This is just the beginning. Its a good thing your taking the time to figure this out now as it will help you in the future.

[OldRover]

..........

 

I think you are on the correct path of learning to accept that things are changing with the aging process. There won't be "porn star" sex forever, nor should there be. Everything in life evolves and changes....so must your sex life. A 60-70 yr old having porn star style of sex just seems wrong no? What do you picture at that age?

 

...............

 

Just FWIW.... there are MANY folks that enjoy porn star or better sex in their 60s 70s and 80s. Nothing wrong with it.

 

In fact I personally know a guy that was in that class in his 90s!

 

Sex doesn't have to stop....ever. Unfortunately a lot of folks have been told that it has to end.... BS.

 

As for OP, he can look forward to a LONG and GREAT sex life. He just needs to get his OP on the same page.

[Hopeful714]

That is great to know! I hope I can have that! However, getting through the 50's is tough enough! I sure hope this gets better:)

[Lion Heart]

This seems to be a common sentiment among a number of posters.

 

 

Can you explain a little more?

 

Oldshirt, my posts here are in NO way to demean your efforts. In fact I read most contributors applauding your efforts. As am I! I think you've done an amazing job at analyzing all elements of your M and both spouse's personalities too.

 

I understand that your W is affronted by talking about your M. My WH was too. He was scared. That's another story. You may need to work on creating a safe space for your W to talk honestly and openly but that could take time. She may just not be a deep person and may NEVER be IDK.

 

If I couldn't get through to my H and have a relaxed banter that lets me know what's inside his head I'd be majorly concerned. I have been. It's changed now. My next step (without the openness) was to take myself off to MC but he was willing to attend also. So I didn't have to go it alone.

 

I think the ultimate issue for you is her level of intimacy during sex / love making. The hurry ups. Looking at the clock. That is horrible. I'd hate to be timed too. But with children sometimes we BOTH have to hurry up and that's funny! But I see not funny in your case.

 

Ofcourse the communication remains a major barrier for your M.

 

Two things:

1) could you write a love letter to her? Not listing her faults or hitting things "hard" but a gentle one. Saying how much she means to you. How you're willing to support her. That she's the woman you love and married to be your life partner. You appreciate all she does. You're making many changes to become the best person you can for you, her and your children. That you would love a shared level of intimacy so you know for sure she's as into you as you are her. That's the rub that last line. But do 99% positive affirmation first!

 

2) Consider taking the load off her by hiring a house cleaner. And a trusted baby sitter. I know you both work outside the home (as we do too) so the pressures on a mother to be a "good wife" can be overwhelming. The kids are EASY IMHO! And we have many. Getting that romantic "ready" feeling is difficult for some people. I think you need more gentle couple time. Rediscover each other. A massage class taken together. More weekends or overnight stays away in a spa type atmosphere. Make sure you do everything you can to prep the house work / kids to allow her time to get herself and her "things" ready.

 

Overall and underlying may be the critical point of difference here. That SHE feels she's giving ALL the intimacy she's capable of. You don't think it's enough. Like I say IDK.

 

I respect you. I applaud your efforts. I'm sure you're both incredible people. I hope neither of you feel like you're settling for less than you want. Sometimes we get a smack in the face with reality.

 

X Lion Heart.

[oldshirt]

What happened for your anniversary? Did you feel connected with your wife?

 

Did you two exchange gifts? And was she genuinely happy to celebrate the day with you?

 

 

 

I'll post an anniversary update in the next day or so when I get time to organize my thoughts and put it in words.

[oldshirt]

I'll post the anniversary update in a moment but first I want to clarify a couple things that people seem concerned about -

 

 

- first in regards to the 'communication' concern, Yes I have not brought things up directly yet, but that is because I want to address some things with myself first. I want to get into better shape/look sharper, be a little more intuned with the household and family etc and make sure that I am not pressuring her or making her more defensive before things come up for full discussion. I just want to be the best I can be and have more credibility and have my ducks in a row before it comes up before the full House and Senate so to speak. At some point things will be discussed openly, I just don't have a day and time set yet.

 

 

- People seem to be concerned that I am going to do this is silence and if things are just right by a certain day I am going to pack up and leave without warning. That is also not true at all. She is not going to be blindsided and I am not going to do anything major behind her back or without warning. If it ever comes to that she will be given more than ample opportunity to discuss and work on the issues and given the opportunity for MC/IC and all other options to work on things before it ever comes down to pulling the ejection handle.

 

 

Now I will say she will be given the opportunity for MC and to work on things. If she opts not to do those things and opts to just call it a day, that is on her. But I am not going to blindside anyone or pack up one day out of the blue without warning.

[oldshirt]

OK so Tuesday we celebrated our 20th anniversary. We both had the day off together and kids were in school so we had a day all to ourselves.

 

 

I was keeping a few suprises but in the days leading up it I had let her know that she needed to pack a swimsuit and "something slinkly," so she pretty much knew that at some point in the day it would involve a motel and pool/hottub and that there was an expectation of some kind of sexy time.

 

 

In the days leading up to it, there was really no hesitation or excuses or any kind of disclaimers or anything like that on her part indicating that she was going to try to avoid any kind of sexy activities or that she was going to come up with any reasons she couldn't.

 

 

When got home Monday evening she had spray tanned during the day and was looking like bronze beauty and her nails were all polished nice and bright and she was looking good. I also saw she had packed a bag that was waiting in the closet and the bag had two wine glasses and some slinky lingerie so I took that all as green lights for Big Daddy Oldshirt to bring on his A Game :-D

 

 

So we got all dressed up and went out for a nice sit down lunch at fine dining restaurant and had a nice talk and reflection on our 20 years together. I one point I said a couple things that I regretted and wished that I had done better during our marriage and that I hoped I was doing better now.

 

 

In that discussion she did get a little choked up and puffy eyed and said she regretted how much she shut me out and neglected me when the kids came and were little. She said she now knows she should have spread the love out a little more and knows that it did do damage to our relationship and marriage which she now regrets.

 

 

I don't know if that is really here or now with current issues but I did take note of that and do appreciate her acknowledging that.

 

 

So anyway getting back to the day. We left lunch, ran an errand and then went to an adult bookstore and picked out a new funky vibrator and some high quality lube and then headed to the motel.

 

 

I had a western ranch themed theme room suite with an inroom Jacuzzi and fire place. she changed into her lingerie and we cuddled up on the couch in front of the fireplace (it was a cold, rainy day here that day so the fireplace was nice) and opened up the wine. We sipped wine and kind of flirted and bantered for awhile and then I broke out a little sexy adult boardgame.

 

 

While I set that up, she got out a little bag of rose petals and spread them on the kingsized bed.

 

 

The game only lasted about 20 minutes or so before one thing lead to another and then another and so on and I am sure you can see where all of this was leading ;-) :-) :-D

 

 

 

 

All in all it was a very nice day. Our little afternoon tryst was quite nice all in all. It wasn't awkward, I never caught her looking at the clock. We used what seemed a gallon of high quality lube but she never had any overt grimacing or outward signs of pain.

 

 

She was able to have a few orgasms which was pretty good because she has pretty much been a 'one-then-done' girl lately. Once she had her last one she was done and basically told me it was my turn as she was done and didn't have anything left in the tank.

 

 

We had a towel in arms reach so she could do an immediate wipe down but I told her not to run off to the shower so we did lay and cuddle and had some pillow talk for awhile but after a handful of minutes I could tell she biting at the bit to get to the shower. I'll give her a little slack on that one as we had used so much lube it had kind of gotten every where and we were both a little sticky and gunked up.

 

 

To summarize, it was a nice romantic, sexy getaway. There were a couple little suprises, there were no problems or hang ups and no significant gigs or issues. It was a good day :-)

[Els]

Glad to hear the both of you had an amazing time.

 

I really hope this shows you that she's wanting to try and salvage your marriage, too. It would benefit you greatly to appreciate these times and accept that perfection isn't possible, instead of getting upset if there is a dry spell here and there. She's trying. You're trying. As long as both of you do that, you're likely to be able to work out a compromise that both of you are happy with. But if you go on the warpath any time there is a drop in her libido, you'll spiral into the vicious cycle all over again.

 

Wishing you all the best.

[turnera]

Nice job. One thing I often forget to advise but I see worked well in your situation is that you are the one to apologize first. Apologies are SUCH a strong weapon.

 

Now keep this stuff up! Don't let your marriage get stale again!

[NewLeaf512]

You did it . I like nice endings

[anna121]

I'm curious. Do you feel that unless she has multiple orgasms she is not "really" enjoying sex with you? Do you need that from her in order to feel satisfied yourself?

[Lion Heart]

OK so Tuesday we celebrated our 20th anniversary. We both had the day off together and kids were in school so we had a day all to ourselves. .....

 

To summarize, it was a nice romantic, sexy getaway. There were a couple little suprises, there were no problems or hang ups and no significant gigs or issues. It was a good day :-)

 

Great news. Almost had a teary at that romantic day but smiled instead. You guys rock.

LH

[oldshirt]

Thanks for the words of support and encouragement. It was a nice day and things went relatively smoothly, but obviously this wasn't a cure-all and I am under no illusions that things are going to be all sunshine and butterflies from here on out.

 

I am going to keep working on things the best I can and am going to stick with my current efforts although I may tweek and update a few parts of my plan a bit.

 

I will respond to a few posts shortly and I will try to post my updated plan going forward in a day or so.

 

I will continue to seek input and pointers as I go forward as this has been helpful for me.

[oldshirt]

 

 

1. Be a more involved husband and father in the home.

 

 

 

 

 

2. Start hitting the gym more regularly and more effectively.

 

 

3. I'm also going to update the wardrobe a bit and bump up the grooming and such.

 

4. I'm going to bump up the snooping to see if there are any 3rd party involvements.

 

 

5. I am going to work on being my happy, smiling self and work real hard on my outcome independence.

 

 

6. I am going to take sex out of the equation for now. In other words I am not going to hit on her, initiate or make any attempts to have sex with her. If she initiates or wants some lovins, I will love her up to the best of my ability. But if she doesn't initiate somehow, I won't either.

 

 

7. Get a little more educated about menopause and learn more about treatment options and ways to adapt and deal with it better in the bedroom.

 

 

8. and finally, while I won't bitch or whine, I will hold her accountable if she does something disrespectful, bitchy or inappropriate.

 

 

 

 

.

 

So it's been a little over a month since I had my little meltdown and instituted the above plan.

 

 

During that time there's been few things I've noticed but I would say that anything was a major breakthrough or anything.

 

 

I do think she has been a bit more comfortable with common every day affectionate things like hugs and drive by strokes and things like that. I do think cutting way back on initiating sexual encounters has made her a little more comfortable with other physical affection.

 

 

Our anniversary last week was nice and the sex wasn't awkward or uncomfortable. I wouldn't call it wild monkey sex by any stretch of the imagination, but at least she wasn't looking at the clock telling me to hurry up and get it over with.

 

 

That was last Tuesday and we really haven't had sex since then. She did give me a BJ last weekend that was kind of a 50/50 initiation between the two of us. She kind of gave me the green light for some kind of lovin's and then she gave me the BJ but didn't want anything back in return.

 

 

She has been sick with a nasty cold (similar to the one I had a couple weeks ago) so I really haven't been around her much this week.

 

 

So anyway, moving forward I do think I am going to tweek my plan a little bit and see how things go from here for now.

 

 

About the only changes are #s 4, 6 and 7.

 

 

With # 4, I am going to continue to keep my eyes and ears open and check her phone, Facebook and email periodically and stay vigilant and dig a little deeper if something trips off the Suspicion Meter, but I'm not going to burn up too much time and energy on it unless I come across something that warrants further investigation.

 

 

With #6, I am going to continue to be a nonpressuring as I can and will primarily try to play off of her signals and only make a definitive move if I am getting some clear green lights, but I will loosen it up a little bit so that we are not going weeks and weeks between encounters. I figure I need to be somewhat proactive if for no other reason than so she doesn't think that I've lost interest. And I will try to not let myself go so long that I start to look towards other women.

 

 

#7 I definitely will bump up and start looking more into menopausal issues and how people deal with menopause and it's effects.

 

 

 

 

So that's my update for now. If anyone has any other ideas or suggestions or anything I'm all ears.

[BlueIris]

Do you have hesitation about #1?

[oldshirt]

Do you have hesitation about #1?

 

 

 

Huh? What do you mean?

 

 

 

 

I am still working on doing #1.