JanieQP Posted May 19, 2005 Share Posted May 19, 2005 Background - I've had practically no contact with my parents since Thanksgiving. My ex is mentioned in this letter because they're still trying to control me through him and they send him books and articles. Also we still have a couple of joint work projects. I would really welcome any comments on tone, structure, approach etc you have. ----------------------------------- Dear Parents, Last fall, you asked me what kind of contact I wanted to have with you. When we spoke on the telephone in November, shortly before Thankgiving, I explained to each of you that I only desire contact in which you are actively working on improving the relationship. [Mother]'s answer was that it wasn't worth trying, since nothing would improve the relationship anyway. My response was that this was a simplistic "solution" - based on a pessimistic, untested premise, she needs make no effort at all and has license to remain comfortably in what looks like a self-righteous victim role. [Father] reacted angrily when I said I felt that he expected to reap something different than what he had sown, i.e. that he expected to "sow" treating someone badly in a relationship and to "reap" harmony and nice feelings. He said that my idea of actions and related consequences was "unbiblical", that people reap what they don't sow "all the time". Instead of facing this discussion, he pulled out an "ad hominem" argument (in which you attack the person rather than engaging in the discussion. This is a typical approach when someone can't find legitimate arguments for their side), accusing me of being "bitter". I agreed that I was angry, and he said that this was the same thing, that I should look the words up in the dictionary. A discussion of definition ensued, wherein he accused me of being proud of my knowledge of language. (Ad hominem again!) [Father] also argued that he has changed and that I haven't given him credit for that. Well, I haven't reaped any benefit of this change. The younger kids might well have it better than I did, but this does not recompense the way both of you treated us older kids. After this telephone call, [my ex husband] fervently encouraged me to visit, despite our busy schedule. He thought that this would give both of you the chance to put the new rules into practice. Unfortunately, Thanksgiving was more or less a saccharine charade. Since [Father] recently wrote that he thought we could "at least maintain the previous level of communication", it's clear that he did not understand the point of our conversation in November. So I reiterate: I only want communication with you in which you are actively working to improve our relationship. Forwarding of books or articles does not count as working on the relationship. From my perspective, if the subject matter were really important to you, you would read the book yourself, figure out what exactly you do and don't agree with, and then make an effort to express that by engaging in dialect. Simply giving someone a book involves very little authentic communication of personal values. I get the impression that in reading many of these books, you've received confirmation of what you already believe anyway. With no regard for weak points in the writing or for possible alternative viewpoints, you then pass the book on, expecting that the reader will come to the same conclusion you do. In theory, "evangelizing"-by-book could work - but the chances of this are much better if the book is well-written. The books you've sent us only work against your cause and create further distance. Naturally, both of you have your own unresolved issues, things you have to work through (or not) at your own pace. Many of these, such as your conflict with Gramma, you've transferred to me ever since before I can remember. Now that I've recognized that a lot of the way you've related to me has been about your own past, not about me, it's no longer my problem. I hope that this letter has clarified what I tried to explain last November, and I look forward to hearing from both of you in a constructive, responsibility-recognizing, solution-oriented way. Your daughter, Jane P. S. Enclosed is a "Baloney Detection Kit", a list extracted from a book by Carl Sagan. This might be helpful in knowing what kind of arguments not to even bother trying to use on me if you truly wish to engage in productive, healthy communication. Link to post Share on other sites
Pocky Posted May 19, 2005 Share Posted May 19, 2005 Originally posted by JanieQP I hope that this letter has clarified what I tried to explain last November, and I look forward to hearing from both of you in a constructive, responsibility-recognizing, solution-oriented way. In my opinion, if you really want a constructive, responsibility-recognizing, solution-oriented response then it's probably best not to berate them before you ask for it. Your letter appears to have two purposes - to point the finger and show them what they did wrong and to restate your expectations if a relationship is going to progress. While I can understand the need to 'have your say' I'm not sure you should expect a positive response from them when you approach it this way. You state that their current approach is unacceptable, but you don't elaborate on what you are looking for. What do they need to do in order for you to deem their actions as "actively working to improve our relationship?" All you've done is tell them how they've been approaching this incorrectly, how you dislike their behavior and how things will have to change or the relationship will be gone. What do they need to do? Your tone is very haughty and impersonal and quite condescending. If you didn't state you were writing to your parents I would think that you were writing to strangers. There is no emotion other than anger and your words exude distaste for who they are. If you dislike them so much why have a relationship at all? What really is the point of your letter? What do you really want to come out of it? If you do want a relationship from them then you may need to take a different approach than what you're taking. You either throw stones or you make amends, but trying to do both might not work. Link to post Share on other sites
Author JanieQP Posted May 19, 2005 Author Share Posted May 19, 2005 Originally posted by Pocky you don't elaborate on what you are looking for. What do they need to do in order for you to deem their actions as "actively working to improve our relationship?" You raise a lot of really good points. No, I don't like them. They've physically and emotionally abused all of us (and tolerated sexual abuse by one brother to younger sisters, and made me out to be the villain when I discovered this and blew the whistle). They vastly overstated their income so that my siblings (the middle ones) are ineligible for need-based scholarships, even loans, for college. (OTOH they hate that I went to a big-deal secular university and they blame everything in the family on me having gone there, OTOH they use the name of the hoity-toity school I attended to justify all of their decisions in home-schooling, corporal punishment etc.) Previously I suggested a family counselor, but my mother found excuses not to do that. Most of the sibings who live away from home are sappy-sweet to the parents now. They're pretty happy with me being the bad apple. Ideally I'd like to work on the relationship, since I think I'm somehow emotionally stuck around it. I'm in trouble with some of my middle sibings now, since I gave up the role of ersatz-mama about a year and a half ago. The middle ones have issues with me that you normally have with your biological parents. You're really right about the tone ... I'll try to find a balance here. Thanks very much for reading the letter and putting the time and thought into your reply. I appreciate that. Link to post Share on other sites
Pocky Posted May 19, 2005 Share Posted May 19, 2005 No, I don't like them. They've physically and emotionally abused all of us (and tolerated sexual abuse by one brother to younger sisters, and made me out to be the villain when I discovered this and blew the whistle). They vastly overstated their income so that my siblings (the middle ones) are ineligible for need-based scholarships, even loans, for college. (OTOH they hate that I went to a big-deal secular university and they blame everything in the family on me having gone there, OTOH they use the name of the hoity-toity school I attended to justify all of their decisions in home-schooling, corporal punishment etc.) How will you move forward, even if they start to do what you want them to do, when you haven't come to terms with what they've done? To me, it appears as though you still want validation of their behavior. You want them to recognize what they did, you want them to admit it and take responsibility for it and you want to feel justified in everything you've done. You know, you may never get that. You have to consider that when you take the route of moving forward. Moving forward may not include admission of their mistreatment. Moving forward means letting go of the past and starting fresh. You haven't let go of the past, yet. And I'm not saying you should or that you're wrong for having so much anger, but it's hard to move forward with someone that has so much anger. You may think you want to, but your letter shows that you may not really be ready and regardless of what they do you may find difficulty viewing it as sincere or in a positive way. You may never get your apology. Are you ready to start new without it? Previously I suggested a family counselor, but my mother found excuses not to do that. Most of the siblings who live away from home are sappy-sweet to the parents now. They're pretty happy with me being the bad apple. Are you seeing a counselor for your own issues? Thanks very much for reading the letter and putting the time and thought into your reply. I appreciate that. No problem. And I don't mean to pry too much into the issue, but your actions and your expectations may not align as well as they should in order for this approach to succeed. Link to post Share on other sites
SexKitten Posted May 19, 2005 Share Posted May 19, 2005 honestly, if i were your parents, i wouldn't get past the first few lines. it almost seems like a deposition. i would just say what you're feeling and what you want and leave the rest out. they know what they did and what you did, and they know how they feel about it, and all the fancy talk isn't going to change anything. the point is to get to a place where you can be civil and build on that. rehashing the past in convoluted words isn't going to do that. good luck. Link to post Share on other sites
lindya Posted May 19, 2005 Share Posted May 19, 2005 I'm inclined to agree with the above posts. Education can give us a false sense of power at times - and Janie, your parents will not necessarily listen to you simply because you're able to present your feelings in more sophisticated terms than you used as a child. In fact, it might just drive further distance between you. Changing the behaviour or thinking patterns of someone who is unwilling to change is an impossible task, and the more you try the more you will get caught up in a hellish battle of wills. You needn't feel forever stuck with regard to your family relationships. It's possible for you to move onwards without the assistance of other family members. In fact it's absolutely vital that you do, because it seems very unlikely (from what you've posted) that your family will participate in the sort of "working through things" process you're looking for. It sounds as if you've spent a great deal of time analysing the past, and might not yet feel ready to let go of it - particularly when you haven't had the apologies or the explanations you long for. I hope that counselling can help you here. You may well feel that other family members are as much in need of counselling - if not more so - than you are, but you can't force them to undergo it....and if you tried, it's very likely that it would be counterproductive. Link to post Share on other sites
quankanne Posted May 19, 2005 Share Posted May 19, 2005 ugh, families! can't live with 'em, can't shoot'em! in all seriousness, Janie, you ought to write in very simplistic terms about how you view your relationship with your parents, and don't be afraid to approach it from an emotional standpoint. if you're tired of all the BS and just want to clear the playing field so that everyone gets treated with respect, say so. If you feel uncomfortable about being the black sheep (or inversely see their need to make you one), flat out tell them. Sometimes the best way is to be blunt in a language they understand. It's apparent to me from your letter that while they see themselves as educated/better, they feel threatened by your success. So just get down to a level where they can clearly understand you and can't spit stuff right back at you that's nowhere near related to the problem so they don't have to give a real answer. I'll paraphrase your letter somewhat, if that's all right with you: Dear Parents, Last fall, you asked me what kind of contact I wanted to have with you and I explained … that I am not comfortable with the way things are, but want[ed] to improve our relationship. By which I meant no more negative comments from you, Mom. You say nothing could possibly improve, because I don't see it that way. There's always room for improvement, even if it's not immediately identifiable or you don't feel like it's needed. People grow and relationships grow. At least the good ones do. Dad: I realize that you expect me to be Little Miss Good Daughter despite the fact that I never thought you were a nice/kind/loving father. That's hard for me to do, because that'd be lying, and I don't feel comfortable lying about those kinds of things. You expect people to put up with bad behavior, then "reap" harmony and nice feelings. Ideally, that's how life would work, but one can only take so much bad behavior before it changes how they perceive another person. Attacking me because you don't like where our conversation went last fall only reinforces my thoughts: someone acts like a jerk, then I see them as a jerk, no matter who it is … This is not "bitter," just honest. You say you've changed, and you may well have. But I can't see it, no matter how hard I try to find it, and that saddens me.* You recently wrote (you) thought we could "at least maintain the previous level of communication," (but) it's clear (to me) that you don't/didn't get what I was trying to communicate during our conversation in November. So I reiterate: I only want communication with you if we can change our relationship to a point where all parties are treated respectfully. I'm not asking that we agree on everything, just that there is an underlying respect in our relationship. Forwarding of books or articles does not count as working on the relationship because from my perspective I feel I'm the one who is to make the needed improvements, not ALL of us. … In theory, "evangelizing" by book could work, (but) the books you've sent us only create further distance. I realize that both of you have your own unresolved issues, things you have to work through at your own pace. Many of these, such as your conflict with Gramma, you've transferred to me ever since before I can remember and created a problem in OUR relationship. However, I now realized a lot of the way you've related to me has been about your own past – it's not about me, (therefore) it's no longer my problem. ====== you may want to close with something heartfelt, that you hope that y'all are able to heal the relationship, but for them to understand that the healing has to come from all parties involved, otherwise, y'all are just spinning in circles. No need to put your defense mechanisms in here, just be downright honest, and in a way that cannot be sidetracked. Remember, the best way to appeal to someone is through emotion, when warranted. best of luck to you, quank *never underestimate the power of guilt! Link to post Share on other sites
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