Domestic Violence against women

[OldRover]

All,

Does anyone besides me read Woman's Health and Men's Health? Often they have pretty good articles worth reading.

 

The recently published an article on domestic violence:

 

The Terrifying Truth About Domestic Violence in 2015 | Women's Health

 

A few things that I found appalling.....

 

One in 3 women in the United States will experience physical violence by an intimate partner in her lifetime.

 

Fifty-three percent of women killed by men die at the hands of a gun, and simply having a firearm in a domestic violence situation increases the risk of homicide by 500 percent.

 

Fortunately, things have gotten better over there years, but I find this pretty shocking.

 

(Don't get me wrong, I'm a gun advocate diehard, but in the wrong hands can be devastating)

 

This is one abuse that I personally feel is one of the worst, and unfortunately a lot of woman accept this and think they will change.

 

Now, there is also physical violence with women doing it to men, but MUCH less.

 

Thoughts?

[Tayla]

As someone who endured child abuse, and then grew into relationships that carried physical abuse and a gun incident, I'd say my dues were paid to the abuse membership club.

 

Lets face it, a generation ago, parents beat the kids, and sent the message that there bodies were worthless... a beating simply set the stage for alot of us women, that those who love you can and will harm you. That IS the message, plain and painfully true. Those who are abused more often were conditioned... I know I was....

 

The article indicated that its even more common amongst various ethnic groups or financial woes.

 

I recall a male neighbor being abused by his wife. The sounds of the beatings ... and the officers insinuating he started it. He was truly a victim twice over.

Men are less likely to report it because its stygmitizing for him... and shaming.

Who does a guy tell?? His buddies would tell him to "man up!" , whatever that trite statement means is beyond my scope of empathy.

 

Odd to say thanks for the article... since it delves into violence... yet the message needs told.

Edited October 25, 2015 by Tayla

[mrldii]

While it is plausible and even probable that DV on men is under-reported, there's an underlying presumption that the numbers and percentages cited regarding DV on women reflect ALL the women who've experienced it.

 

Those numbers don't, either, because not ALL women report it EVERY time it happens.

 

 

In any event, since this thread is about DV against women, yes OP...the numbers are shocking and staggering, even when confined to just "domestic" violence...that is, the number of women who experience physical abuse in their own homes and/or at the hands of someone who "loves" them.

[carhill]

Considering that most people have relationships or marriages starting in their teens and continuing throughout their lives until dead, IMO 33 1/3% experiencing domestic violence at any one point in 60-80 years of life is exceedingly low. IMO, it's probably much higher than that. Then again, I've been around men all my life when their 'love the wife' filters aren't in play and know how violent they are. If the numbers are indeed that low, that's a testament to men compartmentalizing their violent tendencies.

 

IMO, this is where fathers can shine, teaching their boys from age zero that violence isn't a healthy solution to anything, especially with people we say we love. Of course, none of us are ever going to get that kind of cooperation, at least not in my lifetime anyway. Maybe someday.

 

I first became involved in women's issues back in my teens when exposed to adult domestic violence (not in my home!) and that formed the basis for such activism, often in the face of, yep, male opposition, for many years. I simply didn't like the way men treated women in my generation but, well, the more I experienced, the more I saw the women didn't do anything about it nor even seemed to mind and stayed with those men so my interest waned, pretty much analyzing it as my caretaker personality gone amok. After that, yeah, it happens and people make choices and we're all responsible for our choices. If I had to place a wager I'd bet that there isn't a single woman I've known personally in life who wasn't whacked around at some point. I would hope that was lessening markedly with the younger generations but apparently the article indicates otherwise. Sad.

[OldRover]

While it is plausible and even probable that DV on men is under-reported, there's an underlying presumption that the numbers and percentages cited regarding DV on women reflect ALL the women who've experienced it.

 

Those numbers don't, either, because not ALL women report it EVERY time it happens.

 

 

In any event, since this thread is about DV against women, yes OP...the numbers are shocking and staggering, even when confined to just "domestic" violence...that is, the number of women who experience physical abuse in their own homes and/or at the hands of someone who "loves" them.

 

 

Mrldii,

 

Good point about abuse against men, which I believe is way under reported. Men are support to be the stronger of the sexes, but there's some pretty tough ladies out there, even the small ones.

 

I've been beaten a few times that would be totally domestic abuse. Had frying pans thrown at me that went through a wall, hit hard enough to keel over, kicked hard enough to break bones... but rarely. I never reported it, and never retaliated... NEVER, EVER hit a lady, and see no reason for that. The man can take more abuse (not that he should).

 

Yes, I've slapped a few that were abusive, but to get the point across that I wasn't going to accept abuse... but never hurt them. I've spanked a few (but for totally different reasons <g>). I don't believe ever hurting a lady, no matter what. And, I don't condone a lady trying to hurt a man.

 

But, I was shocked in how many woman are hurt by DV, especially if it continues.

[Mrin]

Someone told me this the other day and it really gave me pause - especially because I am the father of two girls. Every single woman I went out with and was in a private setting felt or knew she was 100% vulnerable to me. That is to say, she knew, with certainty, that if I wanted to beat her up - I could. If I wanted to rape her - I could. I'm physically fit but certainly not a NFL linebacker fit. But - compared to them - I guess I could easily overpower them though I've never thought about it that way.

 

And it made me think - first I have never felt threatened or vulnerable by a woman I've dated. Ever. Second, and more importantly, there is a special level of Hell for men who abuse women. I know from statistics such as in the article and personal experience that a good 33% of the women I've dated have been assaulted in some fashion. And I think about the courage it must take to put themselves back in a situation where it could happen again. And my mind boggles. I certainly hope there is a very painful end for men who abuse this trust.

[carhill]

While it might be a nice vengeful thought to hope such abusers die horrible and painful deaths, most die just like the rest of us do and have well-attended funerals with all the niceties uttered just like the rest of us might. That they smacked their wife around a bit or 'disciplined' the children is one tiny part of a big life with lots of other positive things in it and, generally, people focus on the positive stuff, especially when someone dies.

 

When one identifies one such male, one could also be identifying scores of women they've abused, which is part of why I think the numbers are low. It's not one on one, rather ingrained behavioral sets that impel one on many throughout life. Even if that that one woman was only abused by that man and no one else, if he abused a few dozen women over his lifetime (most likely when younger), that's a lot a women who'd be reporting in that 33 1/3% number, just for that one guy. A great example of the 'one bad apple' concept.

[OldRover]

While it might be a nice vengeful thought to hope such abusers die horrible and painful deaths, most die just like the rest of us do and have well-attended funerals with all the niceties uttered just like the rest of us might. That they smacked their wife around a bit or 'disciplined' the children is one tiny part of a big life with lots of other positive things in it and, generally, people focus on the positive stuff, especially when someone dies.

 

When one identifies one such male, one could also be identifying scores of women they've abused, which is part of why I think the numbers are low. It's not one on one, rather ingrained behavioral sets that impel one on many throughout life. Even if that that one woman was only abused by that man and no one else, if he abused a few dozen women over his lifetime (most likely when younger), that's a lot a women who'd be reporting in that 33 1/3% number, just for that one guy. A great example of the 'one bad apple' concept.

 

Carhill,

 

You make a good point. It's usually a very small minority of the people that cause the vast majority of problems, and this situation fits.

 

Personally, I don't know any man that was (or was accused of) a woman beater, but I know MANY woman that at one time in their lives or more, were abused.

 

One of the BIG problems, it that the women who get abused more than once, just don't recognize when it's time to get out. Sure, perhaps once could be a forgivable mistake, in a fit of anger, ever perhaps defending himself, but repeat offenses, especially for no reason signals a chronic abuser that needs to be separated from ANY women.

[carhill]

One question which came to mind, actually while watching an old movie from the 40's last night....

 

Have media and entertainment messages regarding domestic violence changed and have those changes, if any, influenced either the abusers and/or abused?

 

That includes all forms and formats of media and entertainment. I mention it because we're now awash in such stuff. Back when that movie was made that I watched, just after the war, think about it...... To see that entertainment, one had to go to a movie theater and sit there with a bunch of other people and watch it. There was next to no television, home movies were for the rich, and what we take for granted today as media didn't exist. Our messages and images regarding domestic violence came, largely, from people; our families, friends and fellow citizens, in everyday life. A lot has changed. For the better? IDK.

[Taramere]

And it made me think - first I have never felt threatened or vulnerable by a woman I've dated. Ever. Second, and more importantly, there is a special level of Hell for men who abuse women. I know from statistics such as in the article and personal experience that a good 33% of the women I've dated have been assaulted in some fashion. And I think about the courage it must take to put themselves back in a situation where it could happen again.

 

I think it's also very commendable that you, as a non abusive man, persevered with those women rather than giving them the bodyswerve that a lot of men will.

 

A question commonly asked on here is "why do women prefer bad boys?" and I think there's a darker mentality underpinning that question - along the lines of "do women like being abused?" One of the things you'd probably find is that women in abusive relationships as adults were often abused as children.

 

Maybe it's a self esteem thing, but I also think that people who have been the victims of violence visited on them by family members/people they trusted tend to give out very defensive signals. These are picked up on by others who will often avoid them as a result. An abuser, on the other hand, will often be attracted to those defensive signals - recognising where they come from.

 

So the woman who has been victimised in some way during her childhood may unwittingly repel decent men with these defensive signals. From her perspective, good or "nice" guys don't want her. But the abusers do. They signal their strong interest in her (at the start at least) and indicate "I'll satisfy all these unmet emotional needs of yours. I get you in a way that other men won't. I want you in a way that other men won't..."

 

From where she's sitting, it's not that she doesn't want the nice guys. It's that they don't want her - so it becomes either a case of settling for the abusive or dysfunctional men who do seem to want her (though once they've got a relationship going, they'll do further damage to her self esteem), or staying single.

 

I think women are often quite well aware of the warning signs of an abusive man, but not necessarily so aware of the self protective non verbal communication they themselves are giving off, that are screening out decent guys and drawing in abusers. But unfortunately at the moment a popular approach to this problem involves a lot of people putting forward the explanation that "women like bad guys...women like being abused" - which, in itself, may feel like a form of abuse to the ears of women who have been abused as children and are finding it a struggle to avoid abusive relationships as adults.

[Tayla]

But unfortunately at the moment a popular approach to this problem involves a lot of people putting forward the explanation that "women like bad guys...women like being abused" - which, in itself, may feel like a form of abuse to the ears of women who have been abused as children and are finding it a struggle to avoid abusive relationships as adults.

 

Thank you Taramere for this well versed statement.

 

 

 

The Statistics are as variable as the income and the couple. I recall a lady in our group who was a VP of a company, had worked her way and married late in life...She Sat in the group and refused to acknowledge that she was anything like the rest of us. She had a degree! She had a beautiful house....then we each looked at her and said, you have the scars and the broken ribs....We think you belong here.

 

Womens Shelters are for after wards.....We need something to prevent it before hand....

 

My sons were not raised to abuse, they were raised to defend themselves.

Both Genders would fair well to understand the difference and how to respect where their arms/legs end.

 

makes me wonder how domestic abuse is any different then child abuse...Same actions being committed by an adult or other person against someone....

[Keats]

Just like society and a media that refuses to address DV against men.

 

So does it actually refuse to address DV with women.

 

I'm from the UK and I've seen more advocacy in the media regards anti smoking in my lifetime than I ever have DV regards women. I'm 31, and I remember one advert, one TV show about male victims of DV and crappy poster in the ladies loo. I've seen even less on rape meaning absolutely nothing.

 

I also just have to look at society and am gob smacked that it still thinks rape is sex and not violence.

 

I think it's unfair to say women accept these standards. Violence is about control and intimidation, and breaking a persons will and just many other things. They are just stuck. Despite however many times they want to go back or whatever they say, it is never a choice to stay.

[buck3200]

Well said Tayla....I've had both eyes blacked by a thrown steel toed boot....fingernails dug into various body parts....and a couple bites thrown in to boot. The boot to the face was because I ate the last 2 Hotlinks....

[OldRover]

Well said Tayla....I've had both eyes blacked by a thrown steel toed boot....fingernails dug into various body parts....and a couple bites thrown in to boot. The boot to the face was because I ate the last 2 Hotlinks....

 

Buck,

 

When I hear stuff like this, it boils my blood. Violence for such petty things is just ridiculous! This seems like the kind of behavior that's chronic and continues. Often it's where the abuser feels dominant over the abused and punishes according to their wants to keep the abused person subservient. Sucks.

[Chris516]

All,

Does anyone besides me read Woman's Health and Men's Health? Often they have pretty good articles worth reading.

 

The recently published an article on domestic violence:

 

The Terrifying Truth About Domestic Violence in 2015 | Women's Health

 

A few things that I found appalling.....

 

One in 3 women in the United States will experience physical violence by an intimate partner in her lifetime.

 

Fifty-three percent of women killed by men die at the hands of a gun, and simply having a firearm in a domestic violence situation increases the risk of homicide by 500 percent.

 

Fortunately, things have gotten better over there years, but I find this pretty shocking.

 

(Don't get me wrong, I'm a gun advocate diehard, but in the wrong hands can be devastating)

 

This is one abuse that I personally feel is one of the worst, and unfortunately a lot of woman accept this and think they will change.

 

Now, there is also physical violence with women doing it to men, but MUCH less.

 

Thoughts?

I have a major problem with both articles. Because, These articles where the woman is the 'survivor', help sell magazines'. But domestic violence is more than physical, and women are not the only ones' subjected to domestic violence.

 

Organizations like the National Center on Domestic & Sexual Violence, National Domestic Violence Hotline, and the Duluth Abuse Intervention Project. In Duluth(Minnesota; where the 'Duluth Model' was created) only support women. The Domestic Violence Wheel is seemingly to represent both sexes. But only women matter. Men are expendable, and society loves it that way.

 

My developmentally disabled (ex)wife blamed me for all the problems' in our marriage. She accused me of not letting her do things like being involved in the finances, and taking care of the kids. When I relented, she called the finances a 'heavy issue' and did not want to be involved. When it came to the kids, she would scream at them.

 

My mentally ill (ex)fiance has a history of accusing every guy she has been with, of raping her. Which is a lie she dupes authorities into believing.

 

So, I had to be 'controlling' in those relationships.

[OldRover]

I have a major problem with both articles. Because, These articles where the woman is the 'survivor', help sell magazines'. But domestic violence is more than physical, and women are not the only ones' subjected to domestic violence.

 

Organizations like the National Center on Domestic & Sexual Violence, National Domestic Violence Hotline, and the Duluth Abuse Intervention Project. In Duluth(Minnesota; where the 'Duluth Model' was created) only support women. The Domestic Violence Wheel is seemingly to represent both sexes. But only women matter. Men are expendable, and society loves it that way.

 

My developmentally disabled (ex)wife blamed me for all the problems' in our marriage. She accused me of not letting her do things like being involved in the finances, and taking care of the kids. When I relented, she called the finances a 'heavy issue' and did not want to be involved. When it came to the kids, she would scream at them.

 

My mentally ill (ex)fiance has a history of accusing every guy she has been with, of raping her. Which is a lie she dupes authorities into believing.

 

So, I had to be 'controlling' in those relationships.

 

Chris,

 

Agreed, and your right, women aren't the most abused, and there's many forms of abuse.... and very little if any is acceptable.

 

I found the article surprising on how much abuse is out there, and a lot of it unreported.

 

Abuse shouldn't be tolerated from anyone....men women or kids.

 

However, the man is thought to be the stronger of the sexes and can cause more damage and be more forceful that the woman, and often has more power. However, when the man is abused, often his story may be questioned as he could have "prevented" it. Well, maybe.

 

I've gone through abuse, more that once. However, it was minor and I was physically able to restrain the abuser.... pretty much, but occasionally suffered a minor bruse. I didn't report it, only because drinking was involved and once sober, it was not much of a factor. I hate to get the authorities involved unless there's just no other option because once that's done, you have absolutely NO control.... and often the authorities are worse than the problem.

 

Hard to fight and solve abuse problems.

[ufo8mycat]

Someone told me this the other day and it really gave me pause - especially because I am the father of two girls. Every single woman I went out with and was in a private setting felt or knew she was 100% vulnerable to me. That is to say, she knew, with certainty, that if I wanted to beat her up - I could. If I wanted to rape her - I could. I'm physically fit but certainly not a NFL linebacker fit. But - compared to them - I guess I could easily overpower them though I've never thought about it that way.

 

And it made me think - first I have never felt threatened or vulnerable by a woman I've dated. Ever.

 

Thank you, thank you, thank you for showing understanding of what women sometimes mean when we talk about privilege. It isn't a bad thing, not at all - despite how it is discussed sometimes. But it does mean understanding that because something doesn't affect one person (or group) doesn't mean it isn't an issue.

 

I am newly back on the dating scene and I am cautious. My experience is that guys get miffed, offended and feel that I am accusing them of all sorts of things by wanting to be in public places with essential strangers. But that is because I DO feel vulnerable. Not always, but right at the this point, yes.

 

In Australia one woman is killed a week at the hands of her intimate partner. I understand the "what about the menz" argument" but the power difference is stark and the outcomes very, very different. In an eight year period here six men were killed by their intimate partner. Five were in same sex relationships, the sixth was a woman who killed her partner. A relationship that had a long, long history of domestic violence with her having many hospital admissions at the hands of her partner.

 

I really admire Carhill's stance on this and I think it the solution is lead by men, by not accepting violence - ever.

 

*I am not saying that violence against anyone is okay. It isn't but I am discussing the fact that domestic violence kills more women.