Is he lying? MM takes his wife out on excursions.

[Ms. Faust]

I am sorry, Limeblue, but at least he is helping you make some key decisions in your life.

[LimeBlue]

I keep reading this thread over again. I will probably need to read it another 2000 times before I finally see this situation for what it is, rather than what I hope.

 

Things at home are not going well. I do not wish to leave for another man, but having another man DOES make it easier to leave because it highlights all that is wrong in my marriage.

 

My MM won't even stand up to his wife and say he wants a divorce, let alone actually follow through on a divorce. And now they are planning a festive trip away. Yet I keep wanting him? I am willing to chuck it all away for him, whilst he plans life with his wife even though he keeps telling me he wants a life with me?

 

His latest excuse is that he is proving to me how much he loves me, but he knows he cannot follow through on it. WHAT? So then why even bother to "prove" it? That is not proving it, that is just being a sociopath.

 

He is an idiot. I am a fool.

[sandylee1]

I keep reading this thread over again. I will probably need to read it another 2000 times before I finally see this situation for what it is, rather than what I hope.

 

Things at home are not going well. I do not wish to leave for another man, but having another man DOES make it easier to leave because it highlights all that is wrong in my marriage.

 

My MM won't even stand up to his wife and say he wants a divorce, let alone actually follow through on a divorce. And now they are planning a festive trip away. Yet I keep wanting him? I am willing to chuck it all away for him, whilst he plans life with his wife even though he keeps telling me he wants a life with me?

 

His latest excuse is that he is proving to me how much he loves me, but he knows he cannot follow through on it. WHAT? So then why even bother to "prove" it? That is not proving it, that is just being a sociopath.

 

He is an idiot. I am a fool.

 

How exactly is he proving it?

 

The thing is..even if (and it won't happen) he left her for you.....you will end up looking like a bad person...because she was your friend. No matter how many affairs she's had...people will still say that you shouldn't have gone there.

 

Don't wait for an affair to leave your marriage..... you truly can't reconnect with your H...after trying to seriously rejuvenate things ...after counselling and after you both put in 100%.....then you should consider leaving.....but don't mess up your marriage for this man.

 

Do you still find your H attractive?

 

Do you have a reasonable or good intimate relationshipwith him?

 

I really like a married couple to make a real go at things. ...but you have to both want that and you have to both work at it.

 

If you blocked MM out .....you may see things differently.

[LimeBlue]

How exactly is he proving it?

 

Him (MM) and I first connected over a year ago. He was going to leave her, but she cried, he felt bad, and he stayed. I then removed myself from the picture and told him to sort out his life and marriage. Now a year later, things between them are no better, and she told him she is happy to coexist (but I already see signs that she is in fact NOT happy about it), and that he is a free man to see me whenever he likes. This is when him and I reconnected. So his "proving" it to me involves seeing me freely. We have seen a lot of one another over the past month. He no longer has to ask permission (his wife is a control freak of note), and he now tells her he will be with me on so and so day etc. His version of proving also includes introducing me to co-workers, his family, his church members (even though I am not religious), and planning time with me. However, that is his version. My version of proving it would be to divorce his wife.

 

Do you still find your H attractive?

 

Do you have a reasonable or good intimate relationshipwith him?

 

If you blocked MM out .....you may see things differently.

 

No, I battle to find him attractive. He does little to care for himself anymore. Our intimate relationship is not even reasonable, let alone good. I have tried blocking the MM out (we had little contact over the last year), but it did not change how I saw things in my marriage, and MM and I keep on reconnecting no matter what gets thrown at us. We are both constantly drawn back to one another again and again. I should be seeing him in about two weeks time, I hope to have a good chat to him about everything.

[Midwestmissy]

I have to just chime in about the mm wife. He didn't stay because she cried. He stayed because he wanted to. If his wife's feelings were what guided him, he wouldn't cheat. He's doing what he wants, and you unfortunately are falling for his lines as much as his wife is. He's manipulating and abusing you both - not because of the wife's tears, not because of your desire to be with him - because his needs and wants come first.

 

If you and his wife were to simultaneously cut off the ego supply he's getting from doing this, he wouldn't be upset for very long - he'd find a new supply. My cheating husband told me that the mow was a mynah bird who repeated back anything he said, so it seemed like they were so in sync. She'd agree to anything, there was never conflict. In fact, neither gave the other anything, it was a matter of how much each could take. Only their own selfish needs mattered.

 

I'm so sorry you hurt - please focus on dealing with your marriage - ending it or mending it. You only hurt yourself by avoiding that issue and bringing bigger ones in. My h affair was exactly that - getting some strange on the side was easier than dealing with his problems and our marriage. It's conflict avoidance, something cheaters have in common. But it keeps you from having an authentic and complete life.

[sandylee1]

It's a shame that your own marriage seems beyond repair...at least from your perspective.

 

So effectively.....your MM is in an open marriage...good for him. But I take it your marriage is not open?

 

If yours isn't open..what happens when your H finds out.. I mean if his wife decided to tell your H.

 

Neither of you have kids and that's usually a driving force to reconcile. Although the fact she hasn't worked in decades probably has something to do with it. No wonder she time for affairs.

 

She's happy he provides financial support and she can have an open marriage... no wonder she doesn't want a divorce. Even if she doesn't openly cheat..if he finds out...he can't really say much as he's kind of doing the same. Thinking about it...why would he want a costly divorce when he has it this way?

 

All he doesn't get from you is sex..but his wife still has a sexual relationship with him...so he's not missing anything.

 

The gets sex from her and emotional affection from you.

[minimariah]

My version of proving it would be to divorce his wife.

 

he's not trying to leave his marriage - he is trying to turn this mess into some kind of open relationships slash polygamy.

 

if you're trying to leave your marriage - why on earth would you keep bonding with your spouse and hanging out with them, spending time with them...? i'd understand if he had kids with her so he needs to have a good relationship with her but THIS...? makes no sense. he can leave her and not see her ever again.

 

he told her about you, she agreed and these trips are probably him showing her that she's still his number one.

[Ms. Faust]

Oh. So he is in an open marriage... And while the wife may not 100% be happy it sounds like she is on board for her lifestyle (understandable). In that case I could understand why he has no guilt of taking his wife on vacation.

 

Now why would he divorce his wife of 30 years and leave an already open marriage where he would take a financial hit? It's not in his favor to divorce his wife for you, especially if you are willing to stay his mistress.

[ladydesigner]

I keep reading this thread over again. I will probably need to read it another 2000 times before I finally see this situation for what it is, rather than what I hope.

 

Things at home are not going well. I do not wish to leave for another man, but having another man DOES make it easier to leave because it highlights all that is wrong in my marriage.

 

My MM won't even stand up to his wife and say he wants a divorce, let alone actually follow through on a divorce. And now they are planning a festive trip away. Yet I keep wanting him? I am willing to chuck it all away for him, whilst he plans life with his wife even though he keeps telling me he wants a life with me?

 

His latest excuse is that he is proving to me how much he loves me, but he knows he cannot follow through on it. WHAT? So then why even bother to "prove" it? That is not proving it, that is just being a sociopath.

 

He is an idiot. I am a fool.

 

No you are not a fool! You are in love with someone who cannot give you what you want although neither can you, as you are still M'd?

 

A's are highly addictive and cause a lot of obsessive thinking where it normally would never take place. Your mind does mental gymnastics trying to figure it all out.

 

Try to look as it as an addiction.

[LimeBlue]

I have come to realize that I am holding back so much because I cannot trust what my MM is saying. He says he wants a life with me, but his actions say otherwise. He tells me that he is free to see me when he likes, but he makes excuses during the week because his wife has told him she wants time with him during the week too (he has not told me this is the reason why, but I have worked it out for myself). He knows if he sees me in the week as well as weekends, then his wife will have an issue.

 

The craziest thing is that she has said if they divorce, that she will still want to do things with him (MM) and that I must just accept it. Am I the only one who thinks this is just completely crazy? Even if he starts a relationship with me whilst they are seperated (and then divorced), she says I would have to accept him doing things (excursions etc) with his ex-wife? I have told him outright that I would not be accepting of this because I would expect him to start building a life with ME and not continuing a life with her. His wife says that if I cannot accept this, that I am the one with the problem.

 

Help me out here, I need a point of reference to work from and I need to know if my thoughts are warped, or if I am well within my rights of my own self respect to be feeling and thinking what I am. There is just no way I would find it acceptable that he does things with her, whilst supposedly building a new life with me.

 

I have never heard of people divorcing, then continuing doing sports, movies, dinners, or whatever with the ex-spouse. Yet I am being asked to accept this even before he has left her?

 

Please don't advise me to cut it off because I will be doing that shortly anyway. I need help or validation or something to help me get to grips with what I find unacceptable, yet somehow acceptable to MM.

[Ms. Faust]

This is actually what happened with my husband's grandparents. Grandpa left Grandma for Grandma's BFF. Grandpa married BFF. The three of them continued to wine, dine, vacation, travel, shop together. For 30+ years, up until Grandma died a couple of years ago. The women bickered and Grandpa seemed annoyed with both of them all the time... But, it worked for them I guess.

 

Believe me, everybody thought it was odd, but it was an unusual norm. Honestly, I think there was some guilt involved with the cheaters: the BFF for doing that to her friend and Grandpa because he brought Grandma from another country and dumped her with two very young kids.

 

Edit: I take that back.... My husband and his siblings thought that it was quite alright, because that is all they had known. They also referred to both women as grandma.

Edited November 16, 2015 by Ms. Faust

[whatatangledweb]

My version of proving it would be to divorce his wife.

 

You want him to do something that you have not done. Why are you waiting for him before you divorce? Are you planning to move straight in together? You should never plan your actions based on something else's. If you are ready to divorce then go do it, don't wait for him.

 

Does your husband know about MM ? You say you are open with people about it so I would think he does. Are you introducted as MM's GF or his friend?

 

You appear to have had a very short relationship as an affair. I don't see someone leaving a 30 year marriage for a short term affair.

 

You don't appear to be happy with either man. I'm sorry you are hurting.

[Gigi2015]

Sounds like you and the wife would simply flip positions if he divorced....this guy has his cake and eats it too, It has nothing to do with you. You have signed up to be a willing participant. In no time you'll be the one labeled a "narcissist" for having the audacity to expect commitment ....

[Gigi2015]

I doubt he's in an open marriage. Imagine being his wife...all the sexual frustration ( except on vacation).. She thinks he gets so stressed about work. She's probably frustrated but thinks it's her duty to be a loyal, respectful wife...I bet she's CHOKING on her libido and has for years. Simply so she can be a good wife. Also--she can't pinpoint the reason as why she feels he's disconnected and blames herself....how cruel!!!

[LimeBlue]

I doubt he's in an open marriage. Imagine being his wife...all the sexual frustration ( except on vacation).. She thinks he gets so stressed about work. She's probably frustrated but thinks it's her duty to be a loyal, respectful wife...I bet she's CHOKING on her libido and has for years. Simply so she can be a good wife. Also--she can't pinpoint the reason as why she feels he's disconnected and blames herself....how cruel!!!

 

No, this is very far from the truth. I know her personally. She is a malignant narc, and I had cut off my friendship with her long before him and I became an item. She likes to control people like puppets, and when they do not do her bidding, she becomes extremely malicious. She is a piece of work like no other, and she is making it hell for him to leave. However, he has no spine and will not stand up to her so he won't be leaving.

[gettingstronger]

No, this is very far from the truth. I know her personally. She is a malignant narc, and I had cut off my friendship with her long before him and I became an item. She likes to control people like puppets, and when they do not do her bidding, she becomes extremely malicious. She is a piece of work like no other, and she is making it hell for him to leave. However, he has no spine and will not stand up to her so he won't be leaving.

 

 

 

This type of rationalization will probably impede your healing- if only.... if only she wasn't so awful, if only she would make it easy- this isn't really about her- its about him- people leave all.the.time- the fact he has someone that loves him and could help would only make it easier- he has decided to stay and not only that, he enjoys her company enough to go out and do fun things with her-he is not miserable, he is living his life as he chooses- you should do the same- stop blaming the wife, blame him-see him for what he is and move forward-

[LimeBlue]

This type of rationalization will probably impede your healing- if only.... if only she wasn't so awful, if only she would make it easy- this isn't really about her- its about him- people leave all.the.time- the fact he has someone that loves him and could help would only make it easier- he has decided to stay and not only that, he enjoys her company enough to go out and do fun things with her-he is not miserable, he is living his life as he chooses- you should do the same- stop blaming the wife, blame him-see him for what he is and move forward-

 

Thank you. This is exactly what I need to read, again and again and again and again... I need this brutal frankness told to me, in order to see past the fog and actually see the damn reality.

 

However, I do blame her a lot for what has happened. She was pushing him out a year ago, she was the one who told him to go if he wanted to be with me, yet when he asked her for divorce she dug her claws in and won't let go. This would cost him LOADS financially and she knows it, so she wants him to abandon her in the eyes of the law.

 

But you are quite right - people leave all the time, no matter what. If they want out, they leave. Nuff said.

 

Thank you again. I am saving your post to my phone.

[LimeBlue]

An update, which I'm posting here instead of starting a new thread:

 

We (MM and i) have since been away for a weekend which was fantastic. We really connected and spoke a lot about a way forward. He claimed that he was "all in" with me and we agreed we have tough times ahead both getting divorced so we can be together. He said he will move out in the new year. However he is on leave from work for 3 weeks and instead of taking the time to look for a place, he instead tells me he is going to "rest, read, and relax" because it's been a tough year...

 

He has also been taking me to friends of his to introduce me, and word is getting around about his "lady friend" (me). I have introduced him to a few of my friends and family too.

 

However, he still continues his life with his wife. When they go out for the day together I do not hear from him at all. It is as if he drops off the face of the earth. I find this very upsetting. Especially after we have discussed spending the rest of our lives together, even down to where we will go for our first weekend away as a legit couple.

 

MM does make time for me and wants to put in a plan to ensure we see one another over the holidays (next 3 weeks), but then he buggers off for the day with his wife and I hear nothing. When I challenge him on making changes for US, and I tell him that I doubt his words, he tellsme that I must be careful that it doesn't turn into a self fulfilling prophecy (that I don't believe he will leave his wife). Having him say that to me hurt me greatly .

 

As for me as I'm sure many of you are wondering, I'm moving out next week. I have found a place and my husband agrees it's best and we will see where it takes us, even though we both know it may well lead to divorce.

 

I'm confused about everything going on in my life. I have no point of reference. Is my MM genuine or is he just using me?

[S2B]

Your MM is not genuine.

 

If he intended to do the things he's promised you'd be seeing him taking action to that end - but he's not.

 

Expect him to change nothing.

[LimeBlue]

Your MM is not genuine.

 

If he intended to do the things he's promised you'd be seeing him taking action to that end - but he's not.

 

Expect him to change nothing.

 

I think you are right.

 

I cannot believe he will be at home for 3 weeks "resting" when he could be proactively using the time to find an apartment and start the moving process. This to me is very hurtful and the cherry on the top of why I don't trust him. Then he has the nerve to blame it all on me because I don't have faith in him. It hurts so much.

[whichwayisup]

Divorce and live your life for you since it seems your H is on board with divorcing. It's good that you are doing this, your H deserves a woman who will love only him.

 

Stop putting MM first! You're obviously not first in his life right now, he's focusing on himself and family. Shocker - NOT. It's like he's setting you up for failure by treating you poorly and he knows how you'll react and he'll react back by pushing you away and blaming you for it not working.

[LimeBlue]

He just ended it. It seems every time he has a nice day out with his wife, I become forgotten. I asked him about it and he said he can't do this anymore. It hurts like hell, especially when two weeks ago we had a fantastic weekend away and were discussing our way forward so we can be together. We agreed we were "all in", and now this a mere 14 days later? I love him so much and now I've lost him.

 

Just to add salt to my pain, he uploaded a video clip of his day with his wife on Facebook. I was online at the time so I viewed it. The next thing I know is he had changed the privacy settings of the video so I could not see it any longer

Edited December 19, 2015 by LimeBlue

[Lovetoohard]

Sorry to hear that you're hurting but this outcome was inevitable. There are pretty much two endings to every story regardless of all the other variation in facts: OW/OM comes to their senses and ends it or MM/MW goes back to their status quo and the reasons for sticking with their status quo are irrelevant.

 

We've all analyzed over and over again the various reasons they are not leaving in spite of the words that they uttered to us but it's a waste of time and will only prolong the agony of ending it. And you didn't lose him - he was never yours to begin with. What he effectively did was help you gain back your life. Be thankful for that.

 

Work through the pain and healing, keep your dignity intact and stay away from him, focus on yourself and figure out what you want your life to be. It's time to make some positive changes in your life.

Edited December 19, 2015 by Lovetoohard

[dreamingoftigers]

I think you are right.

 

I cannot believe he will be at home for 3 weeks "resting" when he could be proactively using the time to find an apartment and start the moving process. This to me is very hurtful and the cherry on the top of why I don't trust him. Then he has the nerve to blame it all on me because I don't have faith in him. It hurts so much.

 

Imagine the mindf*ck he gives his wife.

 

She has probably been told something along the lines of suspecting him of cheatingbis making it a self-fufilling prophecy.

[dreamingoftigers]

He just ended it. It seems every time he has a nice day out with his wife, I become forgotten. I asked him about it and he said he can't do this anymore. It hurts like hell, especially when two weeks ago we had a fantastic weekend away and were discussing our way forward so we can be together. We agreed we were "all in", and now this a mere 14 days later? I love him so much and now I've lost him.

 

Just to add salt to my pain, he uploaded a video clip of his day with his wife on Facebook. I was online at the time so I viewed it. The next thing I know is he had changed the privacy settings of the video so I could not see it any longer

 

Time to tell the wife LOL