To: 'Unnamed'...question for you.......

[Laurynn]

Hi 'unnamed'...

 

I'm definitely not trying to single you out, or put you on the defensive....I'm just trying to understand a little of where you're coming from in your beliefs on sex outside of marriage, sex AND marriage.

 

On Saturday, Tess posted the following:

 

"If you married someone and someone turned out to be the world's worst lover? What then? Yes,I realize that relationships are based on love..but what separates [our] best friend from a lover? the sexual connection..

 

Can you honestly say you would stick with someone who was horrible in bed??

 

This was your very frank, and abrupt response to her:

 

"Sex does not have to be an essential component to a relationship, or a good relationship for that matter.

 

Not staying with someone for their sexual output is shallow, and would mean that you never did love them.

 

Oh, and by the way, sex is NOT the only thing that seperates a lover and a best friend. Obviously you have never fallen in love."

 

I'm just a little bit confused. It's very clear, from many of your responses here, that you believe that belongs only in a marital relationship, and that sex outside of marriage is wrong/unhealthy/creates problems, etc. I take from this, that you yourself have never had sex (because you're not married).

 

My question is, how can you profess to know, so adamantly, that sex doesn't have to be a component of a good relationship? (in this case, the original poster was specifically speaking of sex within a MARRIAGE)......How can you know this if you've never been in a relationship where you had sex?

 

You don't believe that intimacy is a vital component in a healthy, loving relationship? Maybe it's just me, but I always felt that giving yourself 'fully' to someone you love (particularly your spouse) was the greatest and most intimate gift you can give, out of love. You don't think so? But how do you know if you've never had sex?

 

Do you really feel equipped to express such strong opinions on a subject that you really have no firsthand experience with?

 

I was quite shocked to read the last paragraph of your response to Tess...where you stated, inconclusively, that sex is NOT the only thing that separates a 'best friend' from a 'lover'.......okay, so if you feel that way, what do YOU think are "other" things that separate a best friend from a lover? Are things really so black and white? Obviously there are best friends that don't have sex, right?

 

And what's this, you accused Tess of never having been in love, if she felt the way she did.....though I don't really think she was saying how she felt per se, she was really just asking for some input.

 

Do you honestly think that if you were married, and your wife never wanted to have sex with you........or she did have sex once in a blue moon but obviously could care less about it, or she didn't satisfy you in the least, that you'd still be completely fulfilled in the marriage? Again, it goes back to that special bond of intimacy.

 

I'm just curious how someone who's 17, who's never been married, can have such strong opinions on a subject they don't appear to have any actual experience with.

 

I am not trying to put you down or mock your beliefs....honestly, I'm just trying to gain a better understanding of why you believe what you do.

 

Laurynn

[Rob]

You can be in love with someone and never have sex with her/him, and still be very passionate with that person. On the other hand you can F$$$ someone very "passionately" but not love that person.

 

I used to go out with a girl for 10 months, and we had a great relationship. There was no sex there. But we were more than friends. I also dated a girl who I had sex with, and I did not feel any kind of passion while being with her.

 

So, I guess, sex is not an essential part of a relationship, and you can have a good , healthy relationship without sex. Likewise, you can have a healthy, good sex, without being in love or having a good healthy relationship.

 

Hi 'unnamed'... I'm definitely not trying to single you out, or put you on the defensive....I'm just trying to understand a little of where you're coming from in your beliefs on sex outside of marriage, sex AND marriage. On Saturday, Tess posted the following: "If you married someone and someone turned out to be the world's worst lover? What then? Yes,I realize that relationships are based on love..but what separates [our] best friend from a lover? the sexual connection.. Can you honestly say you would stick with someone who was horrible in bed?? This was your very frank, and abrupt response to her: "Sex does not have to be an essential component to a relationship, or a good relationship for that matter. Not staying with someone for their sexual output is shallow, and would mean that you never did love them. Oh, and by the way, sex is NOT the only thing that seperates a lover and a best friend. Obviously you have never fallen in love." I'm just a little bit confused. It's very clear, from many of your responses here, that you believe that belongs only in a marital relationship, and that sex outside of marriage is wrong/unhealthy/creates problems, etc. I take from this, that you yourself have never had sex (because you're not married).

 

My question is, how can you profess to know, so adamantly, that sex doesn't have to be a component of a good relationship? (in this case, the original poster was specifically speaking of sex within a MARRIAGE)......How can you know this if you've never been in a relationship where you had sex?

 

You don't believe that intimacy is a vital component in a healthy, loving relationship? Maybe it's just me, but I always felt that giving yourself 'fully' to someone you love (particularly your spouse) was the greatest and most intimate gift you can give, out of love. You don't think so? But how do you know if you've never had sex? Do you really feel equipped to express such strong opinions on a subject that you really have no firsthand experience with? I was quite shocked to read the last paragraph of your response to Tess...where you stated, inconclusively, that sex is NOT the only thing that separates a 'best friend' from a 'lover'.......okay, so if you feel that way, what do YOU think are "other" things that separate a best friend from a lover? Are things really so black and white? Obviously there are best friends that don't have sex, right?

 

And what's this, you accused Tess of never having been in love, if she felt the way she did.....though I don't really think she was saying how she felt per se, she was really just asking for some input.

 

Do you honestly think that if you were married, and your wife never wanted to have sex with you........or she did have sex once in a blue moon but obviously could care less about it, or she didn't satisfy you in the least, that you'd still be completely fulfilled in the marriage? Again, it goes back to that special bond of intimacy. I'm just curious how someone who's 17, who's never been married, can have such strong opinions on a subject they don't appear to have any actual experience with. I am not trying to put you down or mock your beliefs....honestly, I'm just trying to gain a better understanding of why you believe what you do. Laurynn

[Laurynn]

"You can be in love with someone and never have sex with her/him, and still be very passionate

 

with that person. On the other hand you can F$$$

 

someone very "passionately" but not

 

love that person."

 

"Never" have sex with them? That doesn't even seem 'natural' or 'normal' to me. Particularly in a Marital relationship.

 

To be honest, you and "unnamed" are the first males I've ever heard, that felt that they didn't EVER need sex to be happy/in love. That's interesting. Just out of curiosity, what is your age, Rob?

 

[/i]

 

10 months without sex, while in a relationship, is a lot different than NEVER having sex in a relationship (years and years).

 

[/i]

 

But could you be in a long term relationship (like one that's 4-5 years) and be content/fulfilled/deeply in love/satisfied, if there was no sex/intimacy? In a marriage? (cuz that's what I was actually asking about).

 

Of course I agree that people can have good sex without being in love/having a relationship. People have one night stands/meaningless sex daily.

 

Interesting outlook on sex, you have.

 

L

[Rob]

I am 23 years old.

 

Marriage is a different story. All I was saying is that not having sex should not interfere with a loving relationship two people can have. Don't get me wrong, I have a very high sex drive, but I will not die without sex. Of course I would not be in a marriage where there was no sex, but my point is that you can have a romantic relationship without having sex, it will fade away eventually faster than if you were having sex, but trust me, there are many relationships out there where sex is the major component, and they end faster than the ones where there is no sex.

"You can be in love with someone and never have sex with her/him, and still be very passionate with that person. On the other hand you can F$$$ someone very "passionately" but not love that person." "Never" have sex with them? That doesn't even seem 'natural' or 'normal' to me. Particularly in a Marital relationship. To be honest, you and "unnamed" are the first males I've ever heard, that felt that they didn't EVER need sex to be happy/in love. That's interesting. Just out of curiosity, what is your age, Rob? "I used to go out with a girl for 10 months, and we had a great relationship. There was no sex there." 10 months without sex, while in a relationship, is a lot different than NEVER having sex in a relationship (years and years). "So, I guess, sex is not an essential part of a relationship, and you can have a good , healthy relationship without sex. Likewise, you can have a healthy, good sex, without being in love or having a good healthy relationship."

 

But could you be in a long term relationship (like one that's 4-5 years) and be content/fulfilled/deeply in love/satisfied, if there was no sex/intimacy? In a marriage? (cuz that's what I was actually asking about). Of course I agree that people can have good sex without being in love/having a relationship. People have one night stands/meaningless sex daily.

 

Interesting outlook on sex, you have. L

[unnamed]

First off, I take no offence to you questioning my opinion(s). Now, onto the beef...

I'm just a little bit confused. It's very clear, from many of your responses here, that you believe that belongs only in a marital relationship, and that sex outside of marriage is wrong/unhealthy/creates problems, etc. I take from this, that you yourself have never had sex (because you're not married).

Wrong. In fact, I have had sex before, but I am not married. It was a mistake I made (many times, I might add). It is wrong (a firm believer, follower and born-again Christian, sex before marriage is wrong.) It is also unhealthy, in the sense that it can be used in the wrong context, such as casual sex with multiple partners. And it can also create problems; I think the above example justified this statement best. Also, sex with someone you don't love, although her or she may be your partner, causes nothing but pain in the end.

My question is, how can you profess to know, so adamantly, that sex doesn't have to be a component of a good relationship?

Because I'm in a relationship that excludes sex. I know what its like to go from having sex in a relationship, to not having sex in the same relationship. It is difficult indeed, but it has in no way affected my love towards my partner. I admire or love her no less. In fact, I was the one who decided to stop having sex. As Rob said, many people can have healthy, loving relationships without sex. Its called communication, trust, etc.

a MARRIAGE)......How can you know this if you've never been in a relationship where you had sex?

Again, you were assuming something.

[Maybe] it's just me, but I always felt that giving yourself 'fully' to someone you love (particularly your spouse) was the greatest and most intimate gift you can give, out of love.

Well, I disagree. Although sex is a very, very sacred and special gift to give, true love offers better benefits and more satisfaction. To those who have been in love, is giving your heart to someone more gratifying than giving your body? In the end, they are both awesome, but your love should prevail.

Do you really feel equipped to express such strong opinions on a subject that you really have no firsthand experience with?

Yet again, your whole argument relied on the basis that I have never been in a relationship and had sex.

I was quite shocked to read the last paragraph of your response to Tess...where you stated, inconclusively, that sex is NOT the only thing that separates a 'best friend' from a 'lover'.......okay, so if you feel that way, what do YOU think are "other" things that separate a best friend from a lover?

Full trust, honesty (in some cases), communication, faithfulness (rarely these days...), intimacy, sharing of sexual satisfaction, etc.

 

Sure, friendships can contain some of these, but usually not the the extent that a loving relationship provides.

And what's this, you accused Tess of never having been in love, if she felt the way she did.....though I don't really think she was saying how she felt per se, she was really just asking for some input.

Well, obviously she was feeling something similar to it, or heard it from a friend. Either way, she's (or a friend) has a problem.

 

Now, when your get married you *should* have unconditional love for your partner. If, by chances, your partner is horrible in bed, the thought of leaving him/her should never cross your mind. If it does, then unfortunately, you are not loving your partner fully. When I say love, I am referring to unconditionally loving your partner.

 

True love does not consist of judging your partner's faults, but rather working on them until they become better. If you have a complaint with your partner, true love will allow you to work on it. If you choose to love, however, you are not in love.

 

Be sure to distinguish between the type of love where you are simply dependant on the person, and the type of love where you truly care for them and are not concerned with their faults.

Do you honestly think that if you were married, and your wife never wanted to have sex with you........or she did have sex once in a blue moon but obviously could care less about it, or she didn't satisfy you in the least, that you'd still be completely fulfilled in the marriage?

Ultimately, no I wouldn't. For myself, sex [will be] an essential component in my marriage to my girlfriend.

 

The problem here is you are using a different example than in Tess's post. Your saying without sex, she was saying bad sex.

 

However, if my partner never wanted to have sex with me I would definetely have to understand where she was coming from, but I would not consider leaving her nor would I love her less. I love her for who she is, not her sexual output.

I'm just curious how someone who's 17, who's never been married, can have such strong opinions on a subject they don't appear to have any actual experience with.

Your right; I do not have any experience with marriage, although I do have with the other.

 

The reason I have such strong beliefs is because, one, I grew up in a family with both parents and got to view some of what marriage was like, and two, I'm in a relationship that is heading towards marriage and my partner and I have in-depth discussions about it.

 

Overall, your argument lacked proof. You went on the assumption that I have no experience in either relationships or sex.

 

Anyway, I may be 17 but it does not mean I lack in understanding or knowledge as compared to a 27 year old. Trust me. :-)

[unnamed]

Intimacy holds numerous dimensions, such as communication. Sex is not defined as intimacy, but rather a form thereof, and intimacy is not defined as sex.

 

It seems to me, from what your opinions on here, you have never been in a serious relationship where there was no sex.

 

Without sex in a relationship, if you cannot be fulfilled, then you are missing out on what true love can be like.

[unnamed]

nt

[Ed]

Hi Laurynn,

 

I missed out on the previous post by Tess. I did go back and read it. Since this is the active discussion on the topic, I would like to add my comments here.

 

I have often pondered this myself. Most of the time I have wondered what I would do if I found myself married to someone and then something extreme happened. For instance, my partner became ill or was in some kind of accident that prevented us from ever having sex again. I just don't know how I would handle something like this if it happened while I was still interested in being sexually active. Obviously, I would have three choices: no sex, masturbation or find a willing and able partner.

 

I have also wondered about what it might be like later in life. How important will sex be to me (and my partner if I have one then) when and if I live to a ripe old age? What would I do if I found myself at 65, 70 or 75, still interested and able to have sex, but married to a partner that isn't? Here again, I would have the same choices I mentioned above.

 

Both of the above scenarios assume that I once had an active sex life with my partner. Neither of them can pinpoint how important sex is now or will be to me at another time or under certain circumstances. At this point in my life, I cannot imagine myself committing to a relationship without the possibility of sex.

 

Love, sex and commitment are important parts of any relationship, but at the same time they are mutually exclusive of each other. They can exist separate and apart or in different combinations. Hopefully, all three will come together at the same time. It all boils down to the amount of weight or importance that is placed on each part. And I guess that will vary from one individual to another, from one circumstance to another and from one time of life to another.

[Tess]

You said," my point is that you can have a romantic relationshipwithout having sex, it will fade away eventually faster than if you were having sex, but trust me, there are many relationships out there where sex is the major component, and they end faster than the ones where there is no sex "

 

Can you tell me why it will fade away eventually faster than if you were having sex??

 

And How about marriage??

[Laurynn]

There you go again with your accusations, and rather unfounded, I might add.

 

You originally told Tess that because of the feelings/thoughts she expressed, that according to YOU, she couldn't possibly be in love (or has never really been in love, something to that affect).

 

Now you wrote to me:

 

"It seems to me, from what your opinions on here, you have never been in a serious relationship where there was no sex."

 

I was once in a serious, long term relationship for well over a year. No sex during that time. But then we did, and ooh la la, it was good! *wink*

 

You still never answered my question (wonder if that was an oversight or intentional? hmmm)....have YOU ever had sex?

 

Judging by YOUR opinions, it would appear that you haven't, and are waiting for marriage before doing so. So if that's the case, how can you truly be so 'informed' on a topic you know NOTHING about? (first hand...SEX)

 

Yes, there are different forms of intimacy, but I personally can't think of one MORE deep/special/selfless/intimate than sex. To me, it's deepest expression of love...an EXTENSION of your love. It's about making oneself completely vulnerable, giving yourself freely, fully and totally. I know that communication is important in a relationship, so are hugs and kisses and Hallmark Cards, but none of these, IMO, top the intimacy of giving yourself (mind, body and soul) to your partner, when making love.

 

How do you know that Sex isn't the ultimate act of Intimacy, if YOU have never had sex? Doesn't make much sense to me.

 

L

[Laurynn]

You wrote: "However, if my partner never wanted to have sex with me I would definetely have to understand where she was coming from, but I would not consider leaving her nor would I love her less. I love her for who she is, not her sexual output."

 

Ah ha! Very easy for you to say what you *would* do, seeing how you're not in that situation. I could sit here and say that if a man every cheated on me, I'd dump him in a heartbeat, but who's to say what I'd REALLY do.....I think there are some things in life that you really can't possibly know, with any certainty, what you'd *do* until you're smack dab in that situation.

 

Being a born again Christian that you are, you must realize that God speaks very clearly in the Bible, that husband and wife are SUPPOSED to give unto each other (have sex)....To God, that is PART of marriage. I didn't write it, God did. (don't ask me to quote which passage, I haven't the foggiest)....so would you really stay with a wife who was frigid, did not want sex at ALL? Come on. Even Christian men have hormones and needs. So do you think that masturbation is okay? Is that how you'd deal with a wife who never, ever wanted to have sex?

 

I do agree that you're rather wise for your age, but I think that perhaps you're a little too opinionated when it comes to situations you've not been in. I don't think you can possibly, with even a degree of accuracy, sit and tell me that when you marry one day, that if your wife has NO use for sex, doesn't ever want it....that you'll gladly accept that and things will all be fine and dandy.

 

Lastly, I commend your convictions, that you're going to stay 'true' and not have sex again til your married.....but I think it's VERY unChristian of you (not to mention judgmental) to be so scornful of those who do not feel the same way. To that one girl last night, you responded with something like, "I have no sympathy for you or your problem." That doesn't seem very Christ-like to me. Maybe that girl didn't grow up in a Christian family like you did, being taught what you've been taught. Isn't there a verse that goes:

 

"Judge not lest ye be judged"

 

or how about:

 

"Let he who is without sin, cast the first stone"

 

Be a little more careful how you respond to people who don't see things the way you do. Christ is anything but judgmental.

 

Laurynn

[Laurynn]

..so obviously ignore where I asked you WHY you hadn't addressed my question.

 

L

[Laurynn]

Okay, correct me if I'm wrong...but aren't you the 17 yr old "unnamed" who posted her a few months ago, that your g/f had made you aware that she'd had oral sex with a couple of guys (on different occasions) in the past, and that it was causing you some major distress?....to the point where you were fantasizing about brutally killing these men she'd been with in the past?

 

Hadn't you mentioned that you were practically suididal with her revelation? That you couldn't deal with the fact that she was basically, "used"? Heck, I thought you'd even broken up with her, becuz of the fact that you couldn't put this behind you. But it seems you're back together. Are you?

 

It seems to me, that you have some extremely strong beliefs......which are fine......but when your beliefs cause you to hold things against a girlfriend (her past, BEFORE YOU), and cause you to be sooo filled with rage and anger that you envision yourself killing her ex's, that's got to be at LEAST as bad as sex before marriage......or judging those who don't live their lives with your beliefs (you know, tolerance)

 

L

[unnamed]

Ah ha! Very easy for you to say what you

*would* do, seeing how you're not in that situation. I could sit here and say that if a man every cheated on me, I'd dump him in a heartbeat, but who's to say what I'd REALLY do.....I think there are some things in life that you really can't possibly know, with any certainty, what you'd *do* until you're smack dab in that situation.

Here's something from my original reply:

 

"Because I'm in a relationship that excludes sex. I know what its like to go from having sex in a relationship, to not having sex in the same relationship. It is difficult indeed, but it has in no way affected my love towards my partner. I admire or love her no less. In fact, I was the one who decided to stop having sex."

 

I do not know exactly what I would do if she NEVER wanted to have sex with me, but I do know what it is like to have someone not want to have sex with you. Your right in saying that I cannot possibly know everything; I make no claims to know-it-all.

in the Bible, that husband and wife are SUPPOSED to give unto each other (have sex)....To God, that is PART of marriage. I didn't write it, God did. (don't ask me to quote which passage, I haven't the foggiest)....so would you really stay with a wife who was frigid, did not want sex at ALL? Come on. Even Christian men have hormones and needs. So do you think that masturbation is okay? Is that how you'd deal with a wife who never, ever wanted to have sex?

One question: it says in the Bible, "give unto each other." Did it, afterwards, say that it was "referring to sexual actions" and nothing more? Dig a bit deeper. Maybe he's referring to showing affect and love, and not just through sex.

 

I was watching a television program one time on extremely overweight women. At one point, they showed a woman who went from 300lbs to over 1000lbs. Her husband remained with her throughout the entire process. They spoke to him, and he said, "my father told me to stick with the women you marry."

 

Now, the problem here is we have both been brought up differently; it seems you find no negative aspects to leaving a wife. Myself, on the other hand, view it as both disrespectful and against God's will.

 

Anyhow, I would never leave my wife unless I was in a physically abusive situation (which is often rare, considering I'm male). Even if she cheated on me, I would remain with her because I love her, but things would never be the same as they once were.

 

As for masturbation, no, I do not agree with it. Before my current relationship, I did. My girlfriend dissapproved of me doing it, and provided reason: something like masturbation is meant for two people to share, not just a singular experience. But, I can see it as a reasonable means to keep sexually satisfied. But, what about foreplay, oral sex and such? Its something to consider...

I do agree that you're rather wise for your age, but I think that perhaps you're a little too opinionated when it comes to situations you've not been in. I don't think you can possibly, with even a degree of accuracy, sit and tell me that when you marry one day, that if your wife has NO use for sex, doesn't ever want it....that you'll gladly accept that and things will all be fine and dandy.

I never said I would. In fact, "ultimately, no I wouldn't. For myself, sex [will be] an essential component in my marriage to my girlfriend."

 

If I had a wife who refused to have sex with me, I would certainly be bothered by this. But, I wouldn't think of leaving her just because I am not having sex. That is selfish and disrespectful.

Lastly, I commend your convictions, that you're going to stay 'true' and not have sex again til your married.....but I think it's VERY unChristian of you (not to mention judgmental) to be so scornful of those who do not feel the same way. To that one girl last night, you responded with something like, "I have no sympathy for you or your problem."

As I mentioned earlier, the reason I am so direct and "scornful", as you put it, is because people fail to realize that what they are doing is only hurting them. You can simply say, "you shouldn't be having sex", which may or may not have an effect on them. Or, you can be stern and direct about it, saying its "wrong" and will hurt you.

 

Maybe I have been too scornful with those who have not grown up the same way as I, but I do not look at is as being mean. Consider it this way: you have a bully at school, always picking fights with smaller kids and beating them up bad. To prevent this from happening, a simply "please don't do it again", or a "its bad what your doing" will do nothing. Instead, one must use their fists to knock some sense into them. You show them, directly, what its like to feel pain. From this, they will either stop bullying, or continue on.

 

My point is sometimes you have to be direct to prevent a problem from occuring. That's the way I see it, concerning sex.

 

Many people have casual sex with multiple partners these days. There are so many risk involved, and not just disease, but emotional hurt as well.

 

The problem is, Laurynn, I could come on here and rant about how I dissaprove of your methods. You posted to me on the basis that I had never had sex nor been in a relationship. Indeed, you were wrong. But I will leave your methods of argument and opinion alone. I certainly commend you for arguing my methods with justification.

 

Anyway, I'm losing where I'm going here.

[Miss Mojo]

i couldn't imagine being in love with someone (married or de-facto or just plain boyfriend/girlfriend) and sex not being a part of that relationship.

 

to me, when you are in love, sex is a healthy component of that relationship. it is an expression of that deep love you feel for that person. it is not dirty or disgusting or wrong to make love to someone. it is the ultimate expression of love and i don't understand how someone could say it's normal to not have sex unless one or both partners can't for health or psychological reasons. when in love, it is a normal and natural physical and emotional expression of that love (i think i'm repeating myself here).

 

So, I guess, sex is not an essential part of a relationship, and you can have a good , healthy relationship without sex. Likewise, you can have a healthy, good sex, without being in love or having a good healthy relationship.

 

so there's nothing wrong with sex then??? i'm a little confused.

[unnamed]

Yes, that is me you speak of. I have been lucky twofold, though; one, I am finally starting to come away from the problem of her past, and two, the fantasies no longer remain. They are a rare occurence.

 

We did break up, but we are back together. Things are running a lot more smoothly; I guess it was only a matter of time before the phase passed.

[Laurynn]

I feel exactly the same way as you, Miss Mojo..in regards to sex. I can't IMAGINE loving someone and not having sex.

 

I've never been promiscuous, I've never had one night stands, never had casual sex, never had sex on the first, second or third or even 4th date. To me, there has to be a 'best friendship' there first...mutual respect, LOVE, trust, commitment....but when these are in place, I don't think wild horses could keep me from wanting to make love.

 

As I've gotten older (I'm 33), I've found that I do prefer to wait longer before having sex......mostly because I've learned over the years that a lot of guys are players, aren't very 'trustworthy'..so I take longer....til I know in my heart that things are right between us....and it's a committed, monogamous relationship.

 

Yeah, some people have sex just for kicks. To get their rocks off. Will go home with a stranger, pick someone up in a bar.....that's not for me, never will be. I don't judge them (try not to) but I sure don't understand them.

 

To me, sex is love.

 

L

[unnamed]

Yes, that is me you speak of. I have been lucky twofold, though; one, I am finally starting to come away from the problem of her past, and two, the fantasies no longer remain. They are a rare occurence.

 

We did break up, but we are back together. Things are running a lot more smoothly; I guess it was only a matter of time before the phase passed.

[Laurynn]

You admitted above, that you HAVE had sex in the past..even going so far as to admit that you had it 'many times.' Was it with the girlfriend you're with now?

 

I have a hard time understanding why YOU had such a hard time dealing with the fact that your girlfriend had had oral sex with guys prior to dating you, yet you yourself were no virgin yourself (had sex in the past).

 

Seems to be a bit of a double standard there. (Though you say that you and your g/f have worked things out and are back together, so that's good.)

 

L

[clia]

I don't want to get involved in this, but I have to comment...

 

You said: "As for masturbation, no, I do not agree with it. Before my current relationship, I did. My girlfriend dissapproved of me doing it, and provided reason: something like masturbation is meant for two people to share, not just a singular experience."

 

Huh? What? How can you not 'believe' in masturbation? (You must be awfully tense.)

 

From Webster's Dictionary: masturbation is the stimulation or manipulation of one's own genitals, especially to orgasm.

 

How is that not a singular experience? You don't need anyone else around to do it. Sure, it's fun to do that with/for your partner, but the whole point of it is to be able to do it without a partner. (And hey, no threat of disease or pregnancy, don't have to worry about someone not calling the next day, no sneaky exits, even better!)

 

You are completely entitled to your opinion, but from reading your posts I get the idea that someone along the way convinced you that sex is dirty and wrong.

 

And I can't believe your girlfriend told you that you can't masturbate. Come on, it's the ultimate form of self love! (I'd hate to hear what else you can't do.)

[Miss Mojo]

To me, sex is love.

 

i totally agree.

 

you see, a couple of years ago i went through a phase (thank god it was only a very short phase)after a disaterous relationship where i thought, "stuff it, i will have a few one night stands. these guys obviously think i'm special right?". hmmmm, nuh uh. sex is special when it's LOVE. and if there's no love there, they aint getting a bar of me. and love takes time. i can understand how some people can fall so easily into bed with another person - sometimes it's for kicks, sometimes it's insecurity, sometimes it's empowering. but as long as it's safe and no one gets hurt.

 

after being lucky enough to experience my first loving relationship, the way a relationship should be (even though it has ended), i have learnt that NOTHING compares to MAKING LOVE. and i won't settle for anything less.

 

having plain old sex and making love will just never, ever compare to me. and i know which one is special....and that's what makes it so great.

[Miss Mojo]

i couldn't have said it better myself, clia.

 

it seems unnamed has been subject to so much social stigma regarding sex and that sex is somehow 'taboo'.

 

there is nothing dirty or wrong with masturbation at all. it's a pleasure outlet (for want of a better expression). and like you said, it is 100% safe.

 

people have massages, relaxing baths, excercise....all because it feels good. people also masturbate because it feels good. just because it's a part of your body that is tucked away doesn't make it wrong.

 

as for unnamed's girlfriend telling him not to masturbate....get a grip girl!!! he was doing something TOTALLY normal and natural and she made out as though it wasn't. if you ask me, she probably felt threatened that while he was masturbating, she possibly wasn't on his mind at the time....or else she's been brought up to think that way.

[Laurynn]

Personally, I'm not even sure WHY he would have told his g/f that he masturbated in the past. What business is that of hers? None. And for her to 'disapprove' of it? Who is she, his mother? It's not her place to approve or disapprove. She doesn't own him. Heck, even if she was married to him, she'd still have no right to 'disapprove' in this regard. Maybe Unnamed and his gal are Quakers?

 

L

[clia]

By now, I just assume that all guys masturbate. My guy friends tell me about it in excrutiating detail. Most of the time it's too much information, but that's just how they are. No, but seriously, I've never met a guy in my life who doesn't do it from time to time. (You know, girls don't talk about it like guys do...wonder why.)

 

I can't even imagine a guy who is 17 years old who doesn't do it! Or any guy for that matter! Or any girl for that matter! You must be a saint, unnamed. Truly. It's not evil to masturbate, and believe me, I don't feel guilty to the Almighty Father for a second when I have to do it. (Like I said, it's much better than giving it up to some guy who doesn't give a crap about me.)

 

What's the big deal????

 

Am I missing something here?

 

Will someone please tell me the evils of masturbation? Am I going to go to Hell?

[Miss Mojo]

I'm not even sure WHY he would have told his g/f that he masturbated in the past.

 

i would honestly EXPECT that a boyfriend had and more than likely still does. i wouldn't care at all because it is soooo normal!!!!! i'd probably even laugh if he told me (the imagery would be enough to make me laugh).