My Girlfriend's Stonewalling Me!

[tronprogram]

This could probably make an appearance on several boards here, but the heart of the matter--communication amongst partners--places it here.

 

So my girlfriend, Satine, is a MW in a mutually-unhappy marriage that has revolved more around divorce and mutual respect/care than love. We met because we were both in similar situations, in terms of being married to people that we cared for deeply, but didn't love. Since we've been dating, we've been discovering that we're made for each other pretty thoroughly and we do love each other, so we'd like to have a life together. The only issue that's given us most of our problems has been when that's going to happen, due to sorting out her immigration issues. I'm more heartened that this is an external issue that wouldn't exist once we're married (as opposed to a personality issue), but there's a still peripheral issue that could cause us trouble: she stonewalls me about immigration.

 

Here's her situation. She's a non-immigrant on a temporary visa that is dependent on her husband's and it expires at the end of the year. Before then, they plan to transition to a different kind of visa that would allow them to stay in the country while they apply for their green cards. She thinks it would be early 2017 by the time they got the green cards, but she's not positive about that estimate. Through a free consultation, I've asked an immigration lawyer how long it could take and he said it could actually be late 2018/early 2019 before they got those green cards. This is the plan she wants to do.

 

Since we've been dating, I've been trying to acquaint myself with immigration policies that relate to her to better understand her situation and understand how we might be able to make our relationship happen sooner than 2017. (At least be out in the open about it.) The problem I'm facing with that is I'm having to research this on my own because she won't talk about it. It's pretty much the only thing she doesn't talk about with me. She tells me that she doesn't want to change from her plan and that I knew this when I opted to have a relationship with her.

 

The reason she avoids immigration as a whole is because it overwhelms and intimidates her. She's also had a traumatic experience in the past where a past visa ran out and she had to leave the country immediately with only what she could pack into her bag.

 

Since she doesn't talk to me much about this, I just try to extract as few details as I need from her to form the basis of my own research. What I've discovered from the attorney and also culled from other sources is that she can divorce her husband anytime and once it's finalized, we can get married and she's immune from deportation/removal because I'm a US citizen. From there, we can apply for her green card and get it within 2.5-3 months because the government expedites the process for married couples more than they do employment-related green cards, which is what she wants.

 

What doesn't make sense is that my plan accomplishes the exact same things as her plan in just a fraction of the time and with a fraction of the effort, too. But she doesn't want to talk about it or even consider it.

 

Anytime I try to open a dialogue about it, she gets annoyed and stops talking to me unless I drop it almost immediately. In the process of shutting down, she does indicate that she feels like this is all really complicated, even though it appears simple, and that she needs time to get her things in order so that she can get her green card.

 

Also, she's never seriously considered my proposal long enough to really go through and show me what's wrong with it. I don't think she could find anything wrong with it, but even if she just didn't like it, I'm not being told why she doesn't like it. The plan she's using is just the default one that's been in place since before we met. With her fear of immigration, she's just been too intimidated to really explore any other options on her own. Until I showed up, she hasn't had a reason to do that, either. My thought has been that since she's got so much riding on this and it's so stressful for her, then it would be helpful if I researched this since I don't have that much riding on it other than her.

 

This is about as big of a red flag as she could give me and that's why I press her to talk about it so often because I want to know I'm not making a mistake by letting her string me along indefinitely. Aside from this, I don't really know that there are any other red flags about her. She doesn't seem to have much attachment to her husband and he doesn't seem to have much attachment to her, either. This has been going on for years. If anything, I worry more about her hanging onto the security of her current situation than him. It could be that there's no overriding motive behind the immigration stonewalling and she's really just deathly afraid of immigration. At some point, she might open up and decide my plan actually works and she wants to do it.

 

I'm trying to not rush into breaking up with her over this. Our relationship is still young by most standards and I'm in no hurry to get married other than to keep her here in the US. However, I do want to date her immediately without hiding it from her husband. To me, I think we've got a good chance of survival if we had to get married today, but I think the relationship still needs time to grow and get its feet under it. It's possible she just needs time to get to a place where she can talk about it. I feel like I'm pressing her a little too much on such a tough issue and I know I should be patient and give her space rather than forcing the issue all the time. What I'm trying to figure out is how long do I give her to come around and talk about this before I walk?

 

With my first marriage, my ex and I dated for seven months before I proposed to her and got married roughly 10 months after that. It was probably around 2-3 months into dating that I decided that I thought the relationship had some lasting power, even though I had doubts about whether I loved her or not. (I thought that was normal, so that's why I went through with marrying her.) With Satine, I don't have those doubts and I think we've got that lasting power if we can do something about my red flag. I do feel like she would want to work through that red flag rather than lose me, though. So we'll see what happens.

 

In the meantime, what advice do you guys have? I know some of you will say, "Run!" (Seems like there's always a few who say that in these threads.) However, I'm not ready to run yet and I want to handle this with grace, patience, and love while also trying to persuade her to open up and maybe reconsider her plans.

[Rorocher]

what steps are you taking to dissolve your own marriage? Are there any kids involved in this arrangement?

[pteromom]

Her immigration issue is HER problem and she has a plan in place.

 

I understand your desire to do this quickly, but she doesn't share your desire, for some reason.

 

She wants to do this her way, and since this is HER life, you need to give her the time and space to do it her way.

 

I can't understand though, if you can't both talk through a situation like this and come to an agreement, how you expect to make it being married.

[Mr. Lucky]

You're married and she's married - and her green card status is your biggest issue?

 

Not only are you putting cart before the horse, as Grandma used to say you haven't even planted the hay yet. When both of you are single, that's the time to start thinking about matrimony...

 

Mr. Lucky

[tronprogram]

what steps are you taking to dissolve your own marriage? Are there any kids involved in this arrangement?

 

Well, my wife already took some of them by contacting a lawyer herself and moving out and separating our bank accounts. Last night or two nights ago, I contacted one myself finally (at least the group that helps you find a lawyer for a reduced rate).

 

My wife is actually pregnant right now with our only child together and we're trying to figure out custody a little bit right now. For the first year, I'm just going to visit on my days off, since my wife will be living with her mom 45 minutes away. It was a tough decision, but I thought it best to go ahead and divorce now instead of waiting until our daughter was older. This way, she doesn't experience the separation herself, but is just born into it instead.

 

Her immigration issue is HER problem and she has a plan in place.

 

I understand your desire to do this quickly, but she doesn't share your desire, for some reason.

 

She wants to do this her way, and since this is HER life, you need to give her the time and space to do it her way.

 

I can't understand though, if you can't both talk through a situation like this and come to an agreement, how you expect to make it being married.

 

Yeah, I'm absolutely convinced that if we can't talk about ANYTHING eventually, then we've got problems. It bothers me that she's being so passive about this, too. Her plan isn't really her plan. It's just the plan that was in place. Now that she's in love--especially with a citizen--it's not changing anything because she's too scared to let it be changed.

 

She says she really loves me and regularly mentions our future together with certainty, but whenever I suggest making that happen sooner than what she has in mind, then she just refuses to listen to it. Even if her husband divorces her first--which he very well could--then she plans to get with me immediately. However, on her own, she's just laying down and letting the government have its way, regardless of me. DMNS. (Don't make no sense.)

 

You're married and she's married - and her green card status is your biggest issue?

 

Not only are you putting cart before the horse, as Grandma used to say you haven't even planted the hay yet. When both of you are single, that's the time to start thinking about matrimony...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

Well, my wife and I both are slowly starting the divorce process. We're already separated, have separate bank accounts, so it's a matter of just going through the legal paperwork. Since we're pregnant and still trying to establish ourselves, this has become less of a priority.

 

Satine needs to stay married as long as she can or else she'll lose her visa and become an illegal. When she does get the divorce, it's one of those things where we'd have to leave the judge's chamber and run down the hall to the Justice of the Peace to cut down the time she's illegal. Once we're married, then the government can't do anything about it because she's my immediate relative.

[Mr. Lucky]

Well, my wife already took some of them by contacting a lawyer herself and moving out and separating our bank accounts. Last night or two nights ago, I contacted one myself finally (at least the group that helps you find a lawyer for a reduced rate).

 

My wife is actually pregnant right now with our only child together and we're trying to figure out custody a little bit right now. For the first year, I'm just going to visit on my days off, since my wife will be living with her mom 45 minutes away. It was a tough decision, but I thought it best to go ahead and divorce now instead of waiting until our daughter was older. This way, she doesn't experience the separation herself, but is just born into it instead.

 

 

 

Yeah, I'm absolutely convinced that if we can't talk about ANYTHING eventually, then we've got problems. It bothers me that she's being so passive about this, too. Her plan isn't really her plan. It's just the plan that was in place. Now that she's in love--especially with a citizen--it's not changing anything because she's too scared to let it be changed.

 

She says she really loves me and regularly mentions our future together with certainty, but whenever I suggest making that happen sooner than what she has in mind, then she just refuses to listen to it. Even if her husband divorces her first--which he very well could--then she plans to get with me immediately. However, on her own, she's just laying down and letting the government have its way, regardless of me. DMNS. (Don't make no sense.)

 

 

 

Well, my wife and I both are slowly starting the divorce process. We're already separated, have separate bank accounts, so it's a matter of just going through the legal paperwork. Since we're pregnant and still trying to establish ourselves, this has become less of a priority.

 

Who's pregnant :eek: ?

 

Mr. Lucky

[tronprogram]

Who's pregnant :eek: ?

 

Mr. Lucky

 

My SBTX. I'm still around for her, though, and I'm helping her get through the pregnancy.

[SleeplessIn]

.... Satine needs to stay married as long as she can or else she'll lose her visa and become an illegal. When she does get the divorce, it's one of those things where we'd have to leave the judge's chamber and run down the hall to the Justice of the Peace to cut down the time she's illegal. Once we're married, then the government can't do anything about it because she's my immediate relative.

 

Unless immigration matters have changed a *lot* recently, it's not as simple as you make it sound here. Some years ago, I married a man from another country who had come to the US on a student visa, then applied to get a green card. After we married, we changed his green card application to one based on marriage to a US citizen, but that didn't automatically make him "legal" here in the US, he still had to get a green card in order to stay here. It took several years for that to happen.

 

If she wants to become a US citizen, the process might be shorter than going for a green card after marrying a US citizen, but I don't know about that path.

[tronprogram]

Unless immigration matters have changed a *lot* recently, it's not as simple as you make it sound here. Some years ago, I married a man from another country who had come to the US on a student visa, then applied to get a green card. After we married, we changed his green card application to one based on marriage to a US citizen, but that didn't automatically make him "legal" here in the US, he still had to get a green card in order to stay here. It took several years for that to happen.

 

If she wants to become a US citizen, the process might be shorter than going for a green card after marrying a US citizen, but I don't know about that path.

 

A lot of this came from an immigration lawyer. I don't suppose the fact that it was a free consultation changes the accuracy of it. He's got plenty of stellar reviews across several sites, too. I also checked what he said against multiple sources, even the immigration documents themselves, and it all seemed to check out. It just doesn't pass my old lady's approval.

[tronprogram]

Well, she'd still be illegal, but she couldn't be removed. She also couldn't work legally. If you're married, you can apply for the I-130 and I-485 simultaneously and I think this is the only instance where you can do that. Within 90 days, you automatically get work authorization too.

[SleeplessIn]

Sounds like maybe the best plan would be for her to stay with her H until the visas are changed over to applications for green cards. Once that application is in place, she could proceed with divorce and after the divorce could marry you and if she doesn't yet have her green card, simply change her application to seek green card based on your marriage. She can legally stay in the country while the application for a green card is in process, she wouldn't be deported as long as an application is in process.

 

What I'm saying though is that marrying a US citizen doesn't automatically stop the green card application and make her legally here on the basis of marrying a US citizen. There still has to be the green card application process.

[lucy_in_disguise]

Maybe she is just not ready to marry you, given that:

 

1. She is stll married to someone else

2. You are stilk married to someone else

3. You have a child on the way with your wife

 

How does your wife feel about you divorcing her while she is pregnant?

[ShatteredLady]

If she changes to your plan you have a tremendous control over HER life. If you dump her she can be deported. If she follows her plan for her life no-one controls her ever again.

[qubist]

is her visa a diplomat visa that she got through her husband? if yes things are more complicated than what you think. in this case once she is divorced the visa is revoked.in addition many countries would require her to go back or would loose her original passport privilege and who knows may be other privileges too. so there's a big chance that she would have to leave the country if her husband files for divorce before you get a chance to do your plan, unless she is not planning on going back to her country ever.specially that you are not ready yet you are still married and D takes time.

[tronprogram]

Sounds like maybe the best plan would be for her to stay with her H until the visas are changed over to applications for green cards. Once that application is in place, she could proceed with divorce and after the divorce could marry you and if she doesn't yet have her green card, simply change her application to seek green card based on your marriage. She can legally stay in the country while the application for a green card is in process, she wouldn't be deported as long as an application is in process.

 

Well, now you have me intrigued. Originally, Satine thought she'd be able to leave her husband in October 2016 with her H-1B--which I was kind of okay with. Then she realized it would be a H-4 visa instead and she thought it might take until early 2017 to get the green card. However, this suggests that maybe she could get her H-4, apply for her green card, then leave her husband. Part of me worries that this wouldn't fare too well for her in the interview process, but if it's not a marriage visa, then it may not matter, either. Or if we switch it to a marriage visa, it might work more in our favor because why else would we want to switch green card applications if not for a genuine marriage?

 

I'm at least willing to explore her plan more on the basis of your suggestion! I feel like that's a step toward compromise on my part. Hopefully it doesn't go unnoticed.

 

What I'm saying though is that marrying a US citizen doesn't automatically stop the green card application and make her legally here on the basis of marrying a US citizen. There still has to be the green card application process.

 

No, I understand that. I'm just saying that--at least, according to the lawyer--that once you're married, she's not vulernable and susceptible to ICE removal and we can wait indefinitely to apply for her green card. Although, I'd want to apply for it soon after we got married under my plan just so she can get work authorization and so we can get it done and over with.

 

Maybe she is just not ready to marry you, given that:

 

1. She is stll married to someone else

2. You are stilk married to someone else

3. You have a child on the way with your wife

 

How does your wife feel about you divorcing her while she is pregnant?

 

Satine says she's ready to marry me as soon as her immigration is sorted out and she doesn't mind the prospect of being a stepmother. She is a bit hesitant to leave her current situation, but I don't get the impression she intends for this to drag out. Whether it does unintentionally, we'll see.

 

My wife is understandably upset and devastated by this, but she's handling it with grace and composure, for the most part. She's been resisting a lot of temptation from people around her to really thrash me and give me what-for.

 

If she changes to your plan you have a tremendous control over HER life. If you dump her she can be deported. If she follows her plan for her life no-one controls her ever again.

 

I'll have to check into this more, but if it's true then I could see that.

 

is her visa a diplomat visa that she got through her husband? if yes things are more complicated than what you think. in this case once she is divorced the visa is revoked.in addition many countries would require her to go back or would loose her original passport privilege and who knows may be other privileges too. so there's a big chance that she would have to leave the country if her husband files for divorce before you get a chance to do your plan, unless she is not planning on going back to her country ever.specially that you are not ready yet you are still married and D takes time.

 

No, it's not a diplomatic visa. It's a J-visa because her husband is a professor. However, they're not subject to returning to their home country, so if she gets divorced and loses her status, she's just overstayed her visa. That's still illegal, but it's not like ICE strictly enforces that. Some people overstay for YEARS, maybe decades, without being touched and they can still get married, become eligible for adjusting status, and have no problems getting a green card.

[qubist]

If she changes to your plan you have a tremendous control over HER life. If you dump her she can be deported. If she follows her plan for her life no-one controls her ever again.

Absolutely, If she asks me for advice I would be like unless you are 1000000% this guy is marrying you do not change your plan, specially that she was burnt once and had to leave the country.

tronprogram: as long as you are still married you can't blame her, and even if you file for Divorce today it will take time to finalize. by then she should be ready to file with her H.

why haven't you filed yet? she probably sees that as hesitation from you

[tronprogram]

Absolutely, If she asks me for advice I would be like unless you are 1000000% this guy is marrying you do not change your plan, specially that she was burnt once and had to leave the country.

tronprogram: as long as you are still married you can't blame her, and even if you file for Divorce today it will take time to finalize. by then she should be ready to file with her H.

why haven't you filed yet? she probably sees that as hesitation from you

 

I haven't filed because my original plan was to just come back from my September rendezvous with Satine and just be separated under the same roof and stay that way until the Spring, when our daughter was a little bit older. However, my wife moved out the night after I got back and it just felt like the divorce/separation was in full-swing. Then a few weeks later, my wife, under pressure from her family, separated the bank accounts. Since then, I've just been trying to stabilize myself. In the last couple of weeks, I've been able to do that and I think my wife and I will be able to take care of most of the divorce except for custody before our daughter is born in February.

[lucy_in_disguise]

Another consideration that i woild have if i were her, is the rsk that your feelings toward your marriage will change once the baby is born. People often say women become mothers when they get pregnant, while men become fathers when the child is born. You will be spending more time with ur ex and seeing her in a new light when the baby comes. You migt find it more difficult than you expected to be away from her and may start to question your decision to leave your family. You cant really predict how youll feel. If i were sabine i would want to wait until after the baby to make any type of decision.

[tronprogram]

Another consideration that i woild have if i were her, is the rsk that your feelings toward your marriage will change once the baby is born. People often say women become mothers when they get pregnant, while men become fathers when the child is born. You will be spending more time with ur ex and seeing her in a new light when the baby comes. You migt find it more difficult than you expected to be away from her and may start to question your decision to leave your family. You cant really predict how youll feel. If i were sabine i would want to wait until after the baby to make any type of decision.

 

Despite all the hell I've seen my wife go through and all the hell my parents have put me through and all the hell I've put myself through, I still feel like this is the right decision. Yes, Satine constantly teases me that I'll go back to my wife at some point, but I don't think that would be true to myself. Even when my wife and I have had meals together before/after doctor's appointments, I haven't felt any kind of interest or chemistry for her at all. I empathize with her, but I don't feel like that's any reason to re-enter a relationship with her. For six years, I've never really loved her. Especially not like I love Satine. I always felt like I should've loved my wife that way, but I never did and after a while, I realized I was just unhappy.

[qubist]

I guess the obvious reason is she doesn't want to jeopardize her immigration status. your suggest plan is on hold because you are not divorced yet therefore you can't offer to marry her.

[tronprogram]

I guess the obvious reason is she doesn't want to jeopardize her immigration status. your suggest plan is on hold because you are not divorced yet therefore you can't offer to marry her.

 

It could be, but she doesn't really harp on wanting me to finalize my divorce. Sometimes when we talk too much about immigration, one thing that she does that isn't quite as bad as stonewalling is getting us just to focus on what we have today and change the subject. Nearly everytime I allow myself to calm down on focus on this, it works. We reconnect and everything's good again. Even the immigration anxiety.

[tronprogram]

lol I'm probably crazy for this, but I just texted her and straight-up asked her if she was nervous about me not divorcing my wife very quickly and she said no.

 

Anyway, she had a F-1 student visa before when she had to leave the US and wasn't able to switch it to anything else. She didn't leave in a hurry, she just felt like it was kind of cold that she couldn't transition to another visa from the F-1. But she wanted to make sure she followed the law perfectly so that she could come back here someday. I'm kinda glad she did that.

 

Also, I tried talking to her about setting up another rendezvous and I think she's really just petrified of immigration. She's pretty set on getting her H-visa and she feels like she's so close to getting it now and doesn't want to make the wrong step or else she's done.

 

Guess I'm maybe figuring out how to talk to her about this.

[qubist]

It could be, but she doesn't really harp on wanting me to finalize my divorce. Sometimes when we talk too much about immigration, one thing that she does that isn't quite as bad as stonewalling is getting us just to focus on what we have today and change the subject. Nearly everytime I allow myself to calm down on focus on this, it works. We reconnect and everything's good again. Even the immigration anxiety.

I don't think she is going to push you to divorce, it is your decision not hers.

what I'm trying to say is your plan does not stand because you are still married. if you were single you would have the right to question why she wouldn't consider it but as of right now I don't see anything wrong with her sticking to her plan

[ShatteredLady]

Quote - "I haven't filed because my original plan was to just come back from my September rendezvous with Satine and just be separated under the same roof and stay that way until the Spring, when our daughter was a little bit older."

 

Really? REALLY? If a man wanted me to risk my future on blind faith in him & then he gave THAT as a reason for not filing for divorce???? REALLY? A man with a PREGNANT wife, having an affair with me gave me 'I want a RENDEZVOUS with you' before I file...'I want my daughter to be (a completely random length of time) older before I file'. REALLY?

 

You don't seem to understand the magnitude of faith you are expecting from this woman! A number of months ago you managed to produce a baby with your wife. You're not exactly the most trustworthy of men. All she has is your word. You've stood before (god, family..don't know what kind of marriage you had) people & made sacred vows. I wouldn't gamble my life on your word no matter how I felt about you. You haven't earnt it!

[tronprogram]

Quote - "I haven't filed because my original plan was to just come back from my September rendezvous with Satine and just be separated under the same roof and stay that way until the Spring, when our daughter was a little bit older."

 

Really? REALLY? If a man wanted me to risk my future on blind faith in him & then he gave THAT as a reason for not filing for divorce???? REALLY? A man with a PREGNANT wife, having an affair with me gave me 'I want a RENDEZVOUS with you' before I file...'I want my daughter to be (a completely random length of time) older before I file'. REALLY?

 

You don't seem to understand the magnitude of faith you are expecting from this woman! A number of months ago you managed to produce a baby with your wife. You're not exactly the most trustworthy of men. All she has is your word. You've stood before (god, family..don't know what kind of marriage you had) people & made sacred vows. I wouldn't gamble my life on your word no matter how I felt about you. You haven't earnt it!

 

This plan went out the window the night after I got back from the rendezvous when my wife moved out. After that is when Satine and I started getting more serious and talking about marriage.