When do A's become M's and last?

[OneLov]

This is the kind of guidance I was looking for. I feel like She is pretty steadfast in how she feels about me and what she wants with me, but since I'm further along, it's hard for me to reconcile that in my head.

 

Today was a tough day because her husband was being kind of mopey and she was afraid that he was onto us. So, to protect her stay in the country, she decided to mostly go NC for the day and try to head off his suspicions. It's tough when she's got to put on a show like that and act like I don't exist. It's even worse because she won't even talk about trying to make this easier for us. I don't get it. Please tell me the secret of how to be patient with her through this.

 

 

No offense but this does not make sense. She is unwavering in that she wants you exclusively on her terms. She turns it on and off. Do you really want this for the next five years? If so, the only secret is to find a way to be ok with that. But I do not think you want that.

 

Seriously man, I am only telling you this because it really does not sound like an honest, loving relationship based on mutual respect. You have to ask yourself are you looking for guidance or are you looking for someone to confirm that your relationship will be an exception to the "rule?"

 

I think the hundreds of people in this forum can provide you with enough empirical data to suggest the odds are stacked against you. You may think I am being unsupportive or even pessimistic, but I am trying to save you, and everyone else around you, from going down a road of serious pain brother. If you think the fact she always has to defer to her husband bothers you now, it only becomes unbearable.

 

If any OW/OM were screwed over by their AP please like this post to show how common WE are.

Edited November 9, 2015 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[tronprogram]

She is in a very precarious position. She's on another dependent visa which means everything depends on him. She's not getting her green card through her employment, but relying on the circumstances that he maintains his job and marriage until he secures his green card. Then he can petition for her. What happens if her husband finds out?

 

Initially, I thought if he found out and divorced her, she could just get a J-2 waiver with the help of the State Dept. and be able to stay in the country without incurring the unlawful presence status. (Death and divorce are two reasons that allow you to stay. Once you're waived, I guess you're not considered to have overstayed, either.) However, since they're not subject to the HRR, she can't get the waiver and will have overstayed her visa if they got divorced.

 

I'm not trying to pick on you. You sound like a smart guy, and I'm sure have thought about this many times. But if your ultimate goal is marriage, you have some enormous obstacles. I'm only trying to point out that going down this road may take extra patience and dedication. I think it is prudent to make sure she is on exact same page as you before you proceed. Also, be extra cautious because if she is caught that could unravel everything.

 

At this point, the biggest obstacle is getting her to consider other options than the one she's using now.

 

i thought both the OP & his AP are foreigners who came to the US? so i figured he was talking about the divorce in his country, i guess i got it wrong?

 

Nope, I'm pretty sure my family has been in the state since before the white settler part of the family came.

 

i don't really think you can. it seems like she doesn't really trust you to talk to you about it yet. i understand her being nervous and trying to be careful but if she's making plans about your future life together, why can't she open up about her immigration plans to you?

 

Exactly! She opens up about nearly everything else. I mean, when we talk about our future together, it's not just in dreamy ways. It's pretty realistic ones, like how she's going to be a stepmother, how we'll deal with my SBTX and my parents, where we'll live.

[acrosstheuniverse]

My wife and I think we can have everything but custody worked out by the time our baby's due in February.

 

Wait a second, does your wife know all about the affair now, then?

[OneLov]

At this point, the biggest obstacle is getting her to consider other options than the one she's using now.

 

I agree. I think she owes it to you to at least let you in on what she is thinking. She needs to understand in order for you to invest in "waiting" for her, you have to have the assurance her long term goal is the same as yours.

 

But the fact remains she could divorce (she'd be legal until divorce is final). And that divorce and any illegal presence accrued will NOT count against her for a family based green card (married you). She would never have to leave and could get her green card immediately after she marries you. BUT YOU MUST HAVE A PLAN. Force the conversation by saying you don't want her to jeopardize her status, so you need to make sure her current plans will not do so.

 

As of now, she (and you) will continue be at husbands mercy. What happens if he loses his job and can't find another sponsor? She's going to have to go back to wherever immediately. Poof. All gone. That is not fair to you. Please communicate and do not continue this relationship if she doesn't give you the respect to honor that very reasonable request.

[tronprogram]

Wait a second, does your wife know all about the affair now, then?

 

She always did. We started an open relationship for a few weeks back in May, she wanted to quit it and I wanted to keep going because I met someone. Things didn't work out with that person because my wife never consented to it. After that, I still felt like I needed to find someone else and was just waiting for my wife to give her approval. When she didn't, that's when I met my AP (after trying to connect with the original MW). It started out online, but then we decided to meet up. The whole time, I kept my wife in the loop and stayed open about what I was doing and why.

[MissBee]

My girlfriend is the MW and I am the OM. We both feel like we were too inexperienced in relationships when we married our spouses and have always had doubts about our respective M's. Soon after we met online and then in person, we both felt like we'd found someone we knew we wanted to marry. We share many commons interests, opinions, bad hygiene, life goals, and, most importantly, affection for each other!

 

Neither of us are particularly attached to our spouses, but we both have reasons that prevent us from divorcing. She's a non-immigrant whose stay in the country depends on her husband and my wife is pregnant so we can't get a divorce in our state. Despite this, my GF and I still consider a future together to be more of a matter of when than if. She's willing to move 300 miles and be a stepmother to make it happen.

 

It's doubtful we're cake-eating and future-faking because at the core of it, I really do believe that we both intend to follow through with taking our A/R to a M. It might take a while, but we're both believers in the plan.

 

Given our feelings about the situation, will our R/M happen or are we fooling ourselves? The only things keeping us apart at this point are circumstances and physical distances. Does any body have any good tips on this?

 

 

I think many As, if not most, are shortsighted. It may not necessarily be that people are plotting and scheming to never leave, but they may genuinely be excited about the prospect of a future, and those kinds of dreams and plans, but never truly thought of how it would really happen....or they change their minds. Humans can be fickle beings, add sex, clandestine affairs, your brain on dopamine and it doesn't help. It's like agreeing a month ago to go to an event. Maybe you had every intention of going, but a month from when you agreed seemed far away, life got in the way, things happened and then before you know it it's the day of the event and you have no desire or plan to go. I think many affairs are like this. Situated in the now or an imagined future that seems far away so you don't really make any plans....then when push comes to shove you realize wow...I made no plans and I can't now /don't want to.

 

I think being intentional and proactive is what makes a difference between those who make it and those who don't. It feels good to imagine the future and talk the talk. Most of us have been there and done that. It costs NOTHING to make elaborate plans and say what you would do in the hypothetical future...yes I'll move 300 miles and be a stepmom and this that and the third....that's fine....but saying it and doing it are two different things. How are you two actually doing concrete things to set it in motion? Your wife is pregnant...for example, how exactly do you plan to leave and be with this MW with a pregnant wife? What's the time frame within which you see this happening?

 

Your situation seems to have a lot of other obstacles that promote more fantasy plans than reality plans.

 

BTW: did I read correctly when you said your common interests include bad hygiene? Also, relationships are more than common interests. What about your actual values and worldviews and lifestyles?

Edited November 9, 2015 by MissBee

[acrosstheuniverse]

She always did. We started an open relationship for a few weeks back in May, she wanted to quit it and I wanted to keep going because I met someone. Things didn't work out with that person because my wife never consented to it. After that, I still felt like I needed to find someone else and was just waiting for my wife to give her approval. When she didn't, that's when I met my AP (after trying to connect with the original MW). It started out online, but then we decided to meet up. The whole time, I kept my wife in the loop and stayed open about what I was doing and why.

 

I'm still confused sorry... so you wife wouldn't give her approval for you to find another AP, but you also kept her in the loop and stayed open with her the whole time? So, she didn't want you to find someone else, you decided to do it anyway, she didn't want you to but you did it and kept her in the loop? Sorry if I misunderstood, just trying to figure it out! Very confused by this lol.

[eye of the storm]

Tron. you asked several times how to get her to see things your way and to talk to you about what she is doing and I can see in your writing how desperately you want her to take the same kinds of actions you are taking.

 

You are talking to lawyers about her immigration. You have no legal standing regarding her. She needs to be talking to immigration lawyers. She currently is content to just stay with her H. She is giving you information you claim is inaccurate. You want to know how to get her correct information. She knows how. She chooses not to.

 

You are obviously in an exit affair. Your W knows about it. You are discussing divorce. Your AP is not.

 

When your AP thought there was a possibility of her H suspecting, she dumped all contact with you until she got him settled back down. This showed where her priorities are.

 

I am sorry. From what you write, I think she is future faking with you and you are going to get your heart broke. Many APs here will tell you how detailed their MM/MWs were when they future faked. I am very sorry.

[tronprogram]

As a surprise to no one, myself included, AP decided that she wants to stay with her husband and not break up with me. I'm not rushing it, but I'm pretty sure I'll be dropping her pretty soon.

[Ms. Faust]

As a surprise to no one, myself included, AP decided that she wants to stay with her husband and not break up with me. I'm not rushing it, but I'm pretty sure I'll be dropping her pretty soon.

 

Wow, what exactly happened? Less than 24 hours ago you were proclaiming her the one, and saying that both you and she were willing to see it through. Your confidence about the issue was pretty unwavering. Now you say: "Meh, I'm dropping her".

 

Sounds kind of fickle.

[carhill]

This is normal. One party changes their mind and poof, done. I ran into this all the time with MW's, so much that I came up with the name 'poof' to describe it. The key is in accepting things as they are, quickly and fluidly, and moving on, finishing the business of today.

 

Will the MW change her mind again in the future? Maybe! Then a whole new set of parameters enter, otherwise known as 'timing'. Scary version? This can happen many times, becoming what I came to call a 'rubber band relationship'. Of course each person is entirely in control of their relationship choices so each snap of the rubber band takes two and choices freely made and with attendant responsibility.

[tronprogram]

Wow, what exactly happened? Less than 24 hours ago you were proclaiming her the one, and saying that both you and she were willing to see it through. Your confidence about the issue was pretty unwavering. Now you say: "Meh, I'm dropping her".

 

Sounds kind of fickle.

 

Well, I don't want to, obviously, but I mean she's blatantly cake-eating. I mean if there's any reason I should put up with that, I'm all ears. Otherwise, I'm considering an exit. However, for now, I'm just not being exclusive with her since she can't do it for me. Time to loosen up the collar.

[tronprogram]

This is normal. One party changes their mind and poof, done. I ran into this all the time with MW's, so much that I came up with the name 'poof' to describe it. The key is in accepting things as they are, quickly and fluidly, and moving on, finishing the business of today.

 

Will the MW change her mind again in the future? Maybe! Then a whole new set of parameters enter, otherwise known as 'timing'. Scary version? This can happen many times, becoming what I came to call a 'rubber band relationship'. Of course each person is entirely in control of their relationship choices so each snap of the rubber band takes two and choices freely made and with attendant responsibility.

 

So are you saying that all hope is lost or I should hang in there?

[olivebranch]

i definitely would not hang in there… because that is what you will be doing- "hanging."

 

i'd rather not, personally. in or out, i don't want to be anyone's delayed-response ' love ' / second (third, fourth, umpteenth) option.

 

it's either real and so are they, or it isn't ..and they ain't. (my perspective.)

[lftbehind]

You have a lot to deal with right now and your wife will need you, since she's pregnant. I know that you want to move on, but she shouldn't have to go through the pregnancy and birth alone. She will feel vulnerable and lonely, I know because I was in a similar situation. If there's any way to work on the marriage, it would be the best thing for the child.

[Got it]

So are you saying that all hope is lost or I should hang in there?

 

This isn't uncommon. It doesn't mean both parties are wanting to be together but are meeting at the wrong time. Stick with what you need to do with your life and make the best decisions there and stick with your timeline/dealbreakers with your AP. She may change her mind, she may not. You cannot force that hand and you can't be the one to handle her divorce. The onus is on her.

 

It may require walking away and without the fence to sit on she may reassess where she wants to be. If she can catch up with you, great, but if not, then that is on her. Don't put your life any further in limbo than you are comfortable with in the hopes that it will pay off in the future. It just isn't worth it.

[tronprogram]

I just wish I could put this part of my life on the backburner while I tend to the more immediate stuff. That way, I'd burn off a whole lot of time without burning years off the end of my life. Oy.

[tronprogram]

AP's making it pretty clear that she can't leave her husband for emotional reasons, but admits that a life with me would be ideal. Is that the ultimate mixed signal or what? It's like everything else feels right with how she feels about me, except...she can't leave her husband. What an awful nightmare. The girl of my dreams, we connect in the most amazing way, wants to spend the rest of her life with me, but...she can't leave her husband.

 

Earlier this afternoon, I tried initiating a short-term NC because I felt like maybe my silence and absence would speak louder than my words. I also wanted to show her what it would feel like to live without me and live with the fact that her marriage was the best thing she had to look forward to. I sent her a long email explaining this and tried to sympathize with her for not wanting to leave her husband. I also just tried making the best rational case possible.

 

She kind of called my bluff on the NC when she said that she didn't think I understood where she was coming from and that the NC would hurt her but it wouldn't change her situation. I asked her to elaborate on where she was coming from and she said that she felt trapped in her situation and accepted it. She felt like I was seeing this only in terms of her making the decision to be with me or not, but she didn't feel like that was a possibility. She also got offended because she felt like I was using the NC as punishment and to act superior.

 

I don't know that she's fickle so much as conflicted. Right now, she says she's just expressing her feelings and has no idea how she wants this to play out. When I asked her last night if she could see herself leaving him, she said, "She doesn't know if she'll stay with him, but she doesn't feel like she has a choice. On the other hand, her husband could just as easily say he wants a divorce and that would be it.

 

For the most part, I know the writing's on the wall, but I can't get how over how much I think she really loves me. If she wasn't that interested, that'd be one thing. But she really is and she's conflicted. How can I summon the patience to just give her time but not stress out about it in the meantime?

[olivebranch]

Focus on your baby and his or her mother... I think that is what a real man would do- sorry, truth.

[Got it]

AP's making it pretty clear that she can't leave her husband for emotional reasons, but admits that a life with me would be ideal. Is that the ultimate mixed signal or what? It's like everything else feels right with how she feels about me, except...she can't leave her husband. What an awful nightmare. The girl of my dreams, we connect in the most amazing way, wants to spend the rest of her life with me, but...she can't leave her husband.

 

Earlier this afternoon, I tried initiating a short-term NC because I felt like maybe my silence and absence would speak louder than my words. I also wanted to show her what it would feel like to live without me and live with the fact that her marriage was the best thing she had to look forward to. I sent her a long email explaining this and tried to sympathize with her for not wanting to leave her husband. I also just tried making the best rational case possible.

 

She kind of called my bluff on the NC when she said that she didn't think I understood where she was coming from and that the NC would hurt her but it wouldn't change her situation. I asked her to elaborate on where she was coming from and she said that she felt trapped in her situation and accepted it. She felt like I was seeing this only in terms of her making the decision to be with me or not, but she didn't feel like that was a possibility. She also got offended because she felt like I was using the NC as punishment and to act superior.

 

I don't know that she's fickle so much as conflicted. Right now, she says she's just expressing her feelings and has no idea how she wants this to play out. When I asked her last night if she could see herself leaving him, she said, "She doesn't know if she'll stay with him, but she doesn't feel like she has a choice. On the other hand, her husband could just as easily say he wants a divorce and that would be it.

 

For the most part, I know the writing's on the wall, but I can't get how over how much I think she really loves me. If she wasn't that interested, that'd be one thing. But she really is and she's conflicted. How can I summon the patience to just give her time but not stress out about it in the meantime?

 

NC isn't a tool to use to manipulate someone to do something. So of course it didn't work. NC is for you because you need the space and silence to move on. You are going to need to work through the emotions that you can love her and she can love you but she is not looking to take the leap off the cliff into divorce. It is a hard thing to realize with someone but fear and other reasons can far outweigh the love. And that is something that you will have to work through.

 

She may never come to the conclusion to divorce. You need to look at, can you be happy with status quo now, you divorced and single and her still married or if there is an expiration date on that.

[tronprogram]

NC isn't a tool to use to manipulate someone to do something. So of course it didn't work. NC is for you because you need the space and silence to move on.

 

Yeah, I've had this kind of thing done to me more than I've done it myself. I definitely apologized to the AP for this and we kiss[-texted] and made up.

 

You are going to need to work through the emotions that you can love her and she can love you but she is not looking to take the leap off the cliff into divorce.

 

Indeed. My biggest problem is patience. The thought of not being guaranteed a future with my AP has really made the divorce real to me the last few days. Today's been a good day, though. I just tried to stay as busy as possible on my day off. Went and saw the new James Bond movie, treated myself to Chinese buffet for lunch, shopped for nerdy onesies for my daughter, went to a meeting at work, and now I'm at the coffee shop to work on my screenplay [eventually ].

 

It is a hard thing to realize with someone but fear and other reasons can far outweigh the love. And that is something that you will have to work through.

 

This is where I struggle to understand her. She'd be the first to admit that I'm the rational one and she's the emotional one. Since I'm rational, I thought it was just logical to leave my wife. I weighed all the options and it just seemed like the best, and toughest, decision was to leave.

 

She's a little defensive about discussing this, so I'm going to try and give it some time.

 

She may never come to the conclusion to divorce. You need to look at, can you be happy with status quo now, you divorced and single and her still married or if there is an expiration date on that.

 

This is what I'm trying to sort out now. I'm wrestling with two parts of me right now. There's Fearful Tron and Confident Tron. Fearful Tron is annoying, he wants to find a new wife tomorrow, won't take no for an answer, is extremely anxious, cries a lot, and doesn't find the humor in a lot of things. Confident Tron isn't bothered by much, he's patient, focuses on the big picture, tends to all parts of his life, and kills it in everyday life.

 

I could easily see Confident Tron giving the AP quite a bit of time to sort things out because he loves her and he's got plenty of other things to occupy his time rather than fretting about her. He's in no hurry to remarry, he'd enjoy being single again for a while, exploring fatherhood on his own, exploring himself more, and just take it one day at a time with the AP. Sure, if she's not ready to leave her hubs after a while, then it might be time to move on. But this would be after the better part of a year, not the better part of a week like Fearful Tron would do.

 

Fearful Tron would just freak out if AP couldn't give an answer today and then would be depressed and shut down afterwards. Basically, Fearful Tron needs to get the hell outta Dodge. How do I do that?

 

Got It--I've really treasured your insights. Thank you. You seem to have the cautiously-optimistic outlook that I was hoping to find here.

[Got it]

Tron, I would look at why unconfident Tron feels the way he does. Why the driving need to have a replacement wife set up? Is there a fear of being alone that is causing that? I would suggest IC to help. I was in a similar boat, I was very certain of my divorce but my AP had more things to work through. We had a dday after he started discussing divorce and ultimately, for my peace of mind, I had to walk away.

 

My mindset was, he needed to concentrate on what was going on at home. I had said many times, if there was even a flicker of love he had for his wife he needed to focus on it. I also couldn't/wouldn't continue the affair after she found out. I could not be part of actively gaslighting, etc. I also was not there as a bandaid or allowing him to fence sit. He had had legitimate reasons to need a year to get things in order to divorce, I gave the year, and so when everything hit the fan the best thing was to walk. I figured, as well, maybe seeing what life was like without me would also add to perspective.

 

But having grown up with two parents who were miserable together but stayed together I knew that even a dysfunctional relationship can still keep people there. I knew that leaving, no matter how much it "made sense", was still hard to do, and that jumping off that edge is scary for everyone and some people do it, some don't, and some do it at different times.

 

I also knew, that even though it hurt very badly, and I loved him at a level I have never loved anyone, I also knew what I brought to the table, I knew I was a good partner and I knew that I would find love again. Maybe not the same but I would be okay. I look to all the silver linings in life and while I was very angry at him at times , I also understood.

 

So I figured I would walk, if he caught up great, but if he took too long, then that was my choice to accept him back or not. I would have the power to make the decision that was best for me and I knew that I had given my allotted time to the affair and that was all I had always known I could give.

 

Focus on you. Focus on what your life looks like without leaning on someone else. She is icing on the cake but she can not be your main support or your reason for being able to do this. You have to move forward as if there is no one. You have to be at peace with your decision as the last thing you ever want is to regret divorcing especially with children involved.

 

I have never regretted my divorce, my ex and I are very amicable and very happily in second marriages. I did marry my AP, but there was a lot of years and a lot of work that we did after the decisions to divorce. That is only the starting point of the relationship and take a deep breath and just focus on you right now. Get to know you again, and figure out what he is like. Don't fear being alone, start to discover the joys of it.

[LimeBlue]

@GotIt - Is your story on here? I would love to read about it.

[tronprogram]

Tron, I would look at why unconfident Tron feels the way he does. Why the driving need to have a replacement wife set up? Is there a fear of being alone that is causing that? I would suggest IC to help. I was in a similar boat, I was very certain of my divorce but my AP had more things to work through. We had a dday after he started discussing divorce and ultimately, for my peace of mind, I had to walk away.

 

Was this another A or was this with the AP that you eventually married?

 

My mindset was, he needed to concentrate on what was going on at home. I had said many times, if there was even a flicker of love he had for his wife he needed to focus on it. I also couldn't/wouldn't continue the affair after she found out. I could not be part of actively gaslighting, etc. I also was not there as a bandaid or allowing him to fence sit. He had had legitimate reasons to need a year to get things in order to divorce, I gave the year, and so when everything hit the fan the best thing was to walk. I figured, as well, maybe seeing what life was like without me would also add to perspective.

 

So was this an actual NC or did you stay in touch while giving him a year before you parted for good?

 

But having grown up with two parents who were miserable together but stayed together I knew that even a dysfunctional relationship can still keep people there. I knew that leaving, no matter how much it "made sense", was still hard to do, and that jumping off that edge is scary for everyone and some people do it, some don't, and some do it at different times.

 

AP and I both had parents who were happily married for decades and I think we both sense that we'd have that kind of marriage if we got together. One of our running jokes whenever we talk about health issues is that we'll have to put up with each other for the next 59 years. (I dunno why 59...some arbitrary number she picked lol.) But you're right, no matter how much it "makes sense", it's still hard and scary to do. That's why I want to give her a lot more time to maybe sort it out if she's going to or give the marriage more time to fail. We haven't been dating that long and right now the relationship's been built on the immediate things, like chemistry and attraction and attachment. Once endurance and history play into it, I'm sure it's going to be tougher for her to be without me.

 

I also knew, that even though it hurt very badly, and I loved him at a level I have never loved anyone, I also knew what I brought to the table, I knew I was a good partner and I knew that I would find love again. Maybe not the same but I would be okay. I look to all the silver linings in life and while I was very angry at him at times , I also understood.

 

I can relate to this.

 

So I figured I would walk, if he caught up great, but if he took too long, then that was my choice to accept him back or not. I would have the power to make the decision that was best for me and I knew that I had given my allotted time to the affair and that was all I had always known I could give.

 

Was one year arbitrary or were there some factors that went into it? Did your AP have children to consider or was it just he and his spouse?

 

Focus on you. Focus on what your life looks like without leaning on someone else. She is icing on the cake but she can not be your main support or your reason for being able to do this. You have to move forward as if there is no one. You have to be at peace with your decision as the last thing you ever want is to regret divorcing especially with children involved.

 

Before she told me she was okay with the situation (which wasn't new--she told me on the rendezvous; I'm just hardheaded), I was starting to lean on her too much. Now I'm trying not to while still trying to enjoy what we have. I've always known a relationship is better when two people can stand on their own and come together rather than leaning on each other. If you lean on each other, there has to be balance or someone gives way and you both fall.

 

I have never regretted my divorce, my ex and I are very amicable and very happily in second marriages. I did marry my AP, but there was a lot of years and a lot of work that we did after the decisions to divorce. That is only the starting point of the relationship and take a deep breath and just focus on you right now. Get to know you again, and figure out what he is like. Don't fear being alone, start to discover the joys of it.

 

So the big question on my mind right now is...should I consider local extracurricular activities as long as I avoid any commitments? It could be months before I could meet AP again. At first, I was considering looking into this quite a bit, but the more I think about it the more I feel like I'd be missing the point of this new season of my life. Plus, I'm not sure the AP would like it. On the one hand, I feel like she doesn't have room to talk, but then again if she's going to be hurt then she does have that room.

[OneLov]

Tron,

 

My suggestion is to stay within the parameters of the open relationship you agreed upon with your wife and try to see if that really meets your needs. If it does not then realize divorces is your only option or your child may grow up in a dysfunctional home if he or she senses mommy and daddy do not love each other.

 

But remember your situation with the MW is more of a legal obstacle than anything right now. Her H4 will not permit her to work (except in very very very limited circumstances) and her stay in the US is entirely dependent upon her husband. Upon the finalization of their divorce, her stay in the US will become unlawful.

 

The only way she could stay is the US without leaving is marrying a US citizen or permanent resident. That is a huge step for any couple. But what makes your situation particularly impossible is you are married. You would need to be divorced before both of you could even contemplate marriage.

 

These are very very very big decisions with enormous permanent consequences. What is her country/culture's view on divorce? What happens if she has to go back? There are some countries and cultures where men kill their sisters/daughters out of shame when found she was cheating on her husband.

 

I am not saying it is impossible but this would take a lot of planning and coordinating to achieve this relationship. After truly considering the undertaking, are you both ready to make this commitment that will result in permanent consequences regardless of its success? You may right now. But if she is not even willingly to talk about it that says a lot of where she is at mentally about her ability to commit her effort/life to doing this.

 

For all of those reasons, I think you should focus on you. If you realize you want more than an open relationship then divorce your wife. Always put your child first in any future considerations. But if she is ready down the road, you can decide if you are still there at that time. But the time is now to set yourself up for your future and prepare for the birth of your child. You can only hope she follows. I am sorry it turned out this way.

 

Best of Luck,

OneLov