I take ownership for the death of my marriage

[ProdigalMe]

Married 9 years. No kids. She's 35. I'm 45. She asked for a divorce this summer. We have filed legal separation paperwork. We will be legally separated before the end of the year. She plans to move out soon. We plan to be divorced by next year. It's an extremely painful time. Ours was a low-conflict marriage (no physical violence, no cheating, no drugs, etc.). But, she will be a walk-away wife. She's not in love with me anymore. There's no one event to pinpoint the end, instead it was an accumulation of things that I neglected. There's a lot of ways I was unkind, mean and inconsiderate. There's many ways in which I betrayed her trust and demeaned what was once a special relationship for her (e.g. infrequent sex, sarcastic criticism, looking at porn). She knows I love her, but that's not enough. She says we are roommates with little in common. She said that if she was going to feel lonely and rejected all the time, she might as well be alone. She says I'm her best friend, but a marriage must be based on more than just friendship. I don't blame her for being too exhausted to try anymore. She just doesn't feel anything for me anymore. She says the hardest thing for her in all of this is losing her best friend, but that she deserves better, so she's ready to let me go.

 

In a weird way, it feels good to put it down on "paper" like this. It allows me to see things from her perspective and make sense of it all. I once was one of those people who asked how a marriage could end when there are no "serious" problems. But I get it now. Neglect can slowly poison a relationship. It's just as serious as physical abuse or drug abuse. You guys out there reading this, take note. Don't be lazy and neglectful. This is your life. You can save yourselves a ton of heartache if you really listen to your wife. She'll tell you directly what is bothering her. Take that seriously. Take that to heart. Don't get defensive, even if she approaches you angrily or in an accusatory manner. There's a lot of things that compete for your attention (your career; your kids; your hobbies; your friends). But there's nothing more important for your life or for your future happiness than your relationship with your wife. I learned this too late, but it's not too late for you.

Edited November 9, 2015 by ProdigalMe

[chew123]

Prodigal Me,

 

It is nice that you are able to reflect back on what the issues were. However I will caution you on taking all of the blame. She is responsible for the demise of your marriage as well.

 

I will also tell you not to be surprised to there is another person involved. Not that that really matters at this point. If its over its over. I heard the same things from my waw. And to my shock she was involved with and still is with another man.

 

Good luck with your situation. And i wish you a smooth transition out of the marriage.

[ProdigalMe]

Thank you for the reply. I do acknowledge my part in its demise, and I agree that I will not take all the blame. I considered whether she is involved with another person already. I don't know, I don't think so. I've told myself to prepare for the time (maybe soon) that she announces she is dating and has found someone. I know I will be hurt, and I know I will have to deal with it. My motto is, take the high road, every time, even if it's painful, because years from now I won't regret acting dignified.

[T-16bullseyeWompRat]

I'm sorry you are going through this. The neglect has been on her end in my M. Did you always know you put your wife on the back burner? Or did you do it without making any conscious thought on it and only realize now that it's over? Did she ever try and communicate her issues with you? If yes, what do you wish she would have done different to make you care again, and stop the neglect? Is there anything she could have done better on her end to get you to snap out of your funk? How long would you say she lived with this resentment before she just couldn't take it anymore and walked?

 

This site offers lots of advice for infidelity. I dont see much given other then "walk away" or "divorce" when it comes to emotional and physical neglect.

[ProdigalMe]

T-16bullseeyeWompRat, I knew I was neglecting her. She told me. Repeatedly. She complained about a lack of intimacy, communication, and togetherness. I would blow off her requests to go do stuff together, she would wind up going to events by herself. I was one of those guys who thought well if the marriage didn't have "serious" problems like physical violence or drug abuse, then it's not serious enough to be addressed. Wrong. Neglect, even in small doses, when it accumulates over a long enough period of time, just poisons everything. It flips a switch to where she sees only the negative and not the positive. To where she can only see the differences between the two of you and not the similarities. To where she forgets why she even married you in the first place.

 

A reasonable wife (most are) will only raise legitimate, reasonable concerns. Pay attention to those. She's giving you clues on how to fix the relationship. If she sounds angry, that's ok, don't get defensive. Her passion means she really cares about something. She's not harping on you, she's not being selfish, she's not highlighting your bad qualities and ignoring your good qualities. She's just trying to address a problem she has. Don't think, "well that's her problem, not mine" or "I pay the rent and the bills, isn't that enough?" or "she just thinks about her own needs." Guess what, if you meet her needs, you are the beneficiary too. Her happiness will result in your happiness. Guaranteed. You are not just doing it for her, you're doing it for yourself too. And she doesn't need you to meet her material needs. Most times, she can do that herself. You have a responsibility to tend to the relationship and nurture it, even if you're tired, or cranky, or bored, or whatever. A lot of husbands (like me) don't understand that until it's too late.

 

I admit I was in a funk for about 2 years. There were plenty of stressors (job; taxes; family deaths), and to her credit, she gave me space, to be withdrawn a little bit (that's how I deal with things), to be neglectful a little bit. But over time, she grew impatient that I was still in a funk. Can't blame her. You should make haste to emerge from a funk. Don't be withdrawn too long. And let her help you get out of the funk, she'll me more than willing to help you. My problem was I let the problems fester for too long (2 years). I was withdrawn and neglectful and this is where it got me. Separation and the brink of divorce. I finally snapped out of it when she filed for legal separation. I vowed to change, and actually did make changes, but it was too late for her. She was angry that it took this long for me to finally get it. She had wanted to separate earlier in the year, but I didn't take that seriously either.

 

Bottom line, don't be ignorant like me. Pay attention. If you let problems fester for too long she will become resentful and withdrawn. That's when she gets her first thoughts about exiting the relationship. And if this pattern keeps repeating itself, she will finally get exhausted of trying, and the result is a walk-away wife. Don't let that happen. She will give you at least 6 to 12 months of lead time, giving you clues that she's unhappy and that she wants changes made. So, make those changes, early and permanently. Don't make her make the same requests every 6 months.

 

I'm sorry you're on the receiving end of the neglect. I know it's not a nice place to be, and the loneliness and rejection can seem overwhelming. Let her know what you feel. Let her know that you're not attacking her or criticizing her, but that you have serious concerns and want them addressed. Don't say the D(ivorce) word or the S(eparation) word. That will only inject extreme instability into the conversation. Just let her know you're extremely unhappy and don't know what to do. Tell her that you miss her and wish she would rejoin you in the relationship. Ask her what you can do to get her out of her funk. I advise patience and understanding. It may take repeated, gentle prodding. You may get frustrated and resentful. It may be she just needs to change her worldview. Her attitude may be like mine (if I'm not slapping you around, what's the problem?). See if you can tease that worldview out of her. It may be the key to understanding why she's been neglectful.

Edited November 10, 2015 by ProdigalMe

[T-16bullseyeWompRat]

Just trying to figure out maybe what could have worked for you. If there was anything she wasnt doing right in bringing these issues up with you? What she could have done better? I notice a pattern developing in our relationship. Times are good at the moment, but im almost sure the neglect will come back at some point. I don't ever want to feel like ive done all i can.

[Majormisstep]

Sorry you are going through this PM. You sound so heartbroken. But it is commendable you have taken ownership in your part of the breakdown. It usually does take both parties to make it or break it.

 

It isn't officially over yet. Have you tried communicating to her what you've written in this post? I ran out of words and gave up in my M - same as your W did I suppose. I would have absolutely melted and cried with joy if my stbxh would have said SOMETHING, anything to me....instead of remaining silent.

[ProdigalMe]

Majormisstep, we've talked about the issues. She's told me many times over the years that she's lonely, that she misses me, that we don't do anything together, that I'm there only in body and not in spirit, that I'm distracted, that I seem down and angry all the time. I'd make changes, but they wouldn't last. She's talked about separation/divorce at least 6 times since we've been married. I, being ignorant, didn't take it seriously.

 

She's told me it's definitely over. We went on a vacation recently and afterwards she said she did not feel anything for me during the vacation. That was hard to take. She's a very affectionate person (hugs; kisses; holding hands) but that part of our relationship has been gone for about 6 months. It's hard to feel anything for a person when there's no physical intimacy or emotional connection. So I understand why she doesn't feel anything for me and believes the marriage is over. I also understand why she's tired of trying and just wants to move on. Once you enter room-mate status with your wife I think it's difficult to get back to your initial romantic husband/wife status. And I think that's where we are. The spark is gone.

 

Here's some questions for all of the walk-away spouses out there.

 

Once you announced it was over, was there anything your Ex could have said/done to change your mind? I'm at a loss as to what to do now. Should I "fight" for my marriage (whatever that means)? Or should I simply accept her decision and exit gracefully?

 

Also, for you walk-away spouses who walked away because you were tired of being your Ex's room-mate, was there any possibility of regaining the spark between you and your Ex? If so, how?

Edited November 10, 2015 by ProdigalMe

[ProdigalMe]

T-16, that's a good question. I think she did all she could. She was clear and unequivocal about what she needed. She even mentioned separation/divorce multiple times to get my attention. And I would improve, temporarily. But then I would recede back to my old, neglectful ways. I guess that says a lot about me.

 

I know you're extremely concerned about your wife neglecting you again. There must be some way to reach her to finally get her to become self-aware about why she repeats her neglect. I'm not sure what the answer is (counseling? some other treatment? support group?). Here's some hope, though, she's aware that she is being neglectful. That's a good first step. And at least she makes an effort to improve, even if temporarily. In my case, it took a shock (separation filing) for me to finally snap out of it and take this seriously. But it is also apparently too late for me and my wife.

[ProdigalMe]

Majormisstep, maybe your STBXH is incapable of expressing what he feels. Some men (maybe most) are incapable of expressing what they feel (there could be a vast ocean of feeling underneath, but you won't know it because he can't express it). Maybe there's a way to draw it out of him. Maybe once he is able to articulate what he feels, you will hear what you've been longing to hear.

 

For you walk-away spouses out there, is your Ex or STBX a silent type who has difficulty expressing emotion? What do you do? Is that a dealbreaker? Or is there a way to accept that difference and embrace it as part of the relationship?

[grammiann]

Hey PM - I'm so sorry about what's happened. Although it may seem too late, what would happen if you insisted on intensive marriage counseling before throwing in the towel?

[ProdigalMe]

Hey PM - I'm so sorry about what's happened. Although it may seem too late, what would happen if you insisted on intensive marriage counseling before throwing in the towel?

 

I'll give that some thought. Something tells me that when a woman says she's done, she just absolutely done (particularly when you've gone on vacation to a beautiful part of the world, with plenty of romantic sights, and wife just can't muster any romantic feelings for husband). We've been to couple's counseling before. I discontinued it after about 2 sessions. She was a bit frustrated by that and sometimes reminds me that I didn't try hard enough then. I suspect that she will say I probably won't try hard enough now, so what's the point of going to marriage counseling?

 

I hope that a separation could clear the air, give us both some much-needed perspective. I hope that she sees that giving up her best friend is not worth ending the marriage (she's said that this is the most difficult part of the breakup: she knows she will lose her best friend). I hope that she sees the totality of what she is really giving up. Flat out, I hope she misses me and for romantic reasons, not because she misses my best friend companionship.

 

Then again, as the old adage goes, "out of sight, out of mind." The separation could simply cause more drifting apart, more loss of connection.

 

So, that raises another good question for you folks out there. When a separation begins, and one spouse looks at it as the first step in divorce, and the other spouse looks at it as the first step in reconciliation, which old adage then holds true? "Absence makes the heart grow fonder?" Or "Out of sight, out of mind?"

[schiller]

So, that raises another good question for you folks out there. When a separation begins, and one spouse looks at it as the first step in divorce, and the other spouse looks at it as the first step in reconciliation, which old adage then holds true? "Absence makes the heart grow fonder?" Or "Out of sight, out of mind?"

 

All the power and control lies with the one who has less feelings invested in the relationship, who has one foot out the door. Since she's the one who wants out and is looking at the separation as one step towards divorce, the writing is on the wall. It doesn't matter what you think or feel about any of it because the decision is no longer yours to make.

[ProdigalMe]

We have almost finalized the separation papers. Once we submit them, the judge usually takes about 3 weeks to issue the separation order. Then we will be legally separated. The last of the paperwork needs to be signed and filed, but she has not asked about them lately. Strange, because she was very gung-ho about getting it done. She had been keeping steady tabs on the progress of it since we initially filed in August.

 

During our vacation she even said that she wants it filed when we get back from vacation and she want to move out by the end of November. She also told me that she doesn't want to take it day by day anymore. Instead, she wants to forge forward, get the separation done, then move out, then get the divorce done.

 

I suspect she will tell me tonight that she has found an apartment, and then will ask that we file the last of the paperwork with the court this week. Ugh, the dread of it all is just roiling my stomach and making my mind race. I'm sure you guys (and gals) know what I'm going through. I'm exhausted these days because I don't get more than 3 to 4 hours of sleep each night. I keep hoping I sleep through the night to get at least 7 hours in, but that rarely happens these days. And this fog of melancholy just follows me everywhere. I go online here to vent. I will provide updates from time to time. Maybe sharing my dreadful journey will provide some comfort to someone out there who is going through the exact same thing.

Edited November 11, 2015 by ProdigalMe

[schiller]

She couldn't possibly be more done.

[MvilleMan]

PM, sorry that you are going through that. Sounds a lot like what I have been going through. I as well can look back and see several times where she basically was trying to tell me what was wrong. I am the type of person that will live with the remorse and regret of having the chance and blowing it.

[oldshirt]

 

So, that raises another good question for you folks out there. When a separation begins, and one spouse looks at it as the first step in divorce, and the other spouse looks at it as the first step in reconciliation, which old adage then holds true? "Absence makes the heart grow fonder?" Or "Out of sight, out of mind?"

 

The only time physical separation can be a benefit to reconciliation is if there has some kind of severe conflict or fighting and the separation can help the dust settle and help defuse the fighting and allow people to cool off and think a little more clearly.

 

 

Other than that, separation is a major step towards divorce and a major step away from reconciliation.

 

 

Assuming there is no abuse or violence or the like, if reconciliation is the goal, it is almost always better to remain in the home together. If people are physically separated, then it becomes easier for each to move apart and carry on with their own lives.

 

 

Separation is a big step towards divorce, not reconciliation.

[ProdigalMe]

MvilleMan, thanks for the kind words. You and I face the same hard road. It sounds like we were both given plenty of warning signs. Plenty of discussions from wife about something wrong in the relationship that needs fixing, and fast. Call it my ignorance, or stubbornness, stupidity, or inconsideration. Whatever it is, I regret it. To me, that's a lack of my own relationship skills. I suspect a lot of us guys have the same lack of skills. We ignore the signs, we get defensive because it feels like a personal attack, or we prefer to take the easy route and hope the problem goes away. Big mistake.

 

Look, I'm sorry you're going through it too. I know it feels bewildering, and unfair, and lonely, and heart-wrenching. I'll try to follow your thread and feel free to follow mine. You are not alone.

[ProdigalMe]

The only time physical separation can be a benefit to reconciliation is if there has some kind of severe conflict or fighting and the separation can help the dust settle and help defuse the fighting and allow people to cool off and think a little more clearly.

 

Then it sounds like it's curtains for me. For the last 12 months, my wife has been complaining about the lack of intimacy, the lack of togetherness, that I've become her room-mate with whom she occasionally has sex (about 2 or 3 times each month). Also, we were getting into these petty fights over inconsequential things, and she would complain that I seemed angry all the time. I agree, I was impatient and bull-headed over stupid things, and she took it personally, which I never intended, but hardly matters at this point.

 

She wanted to separate for a trial basis back in February 2015, but changed her mind when she saw that I had improved. She moved out once before, in 2005, before we were married. She came back 2 months later because she said she missed me.

 

This year we limped along from February to July, occasionally fighting over dumb things, and occasionally getting irritated with each other because of some slight or another. The straw that broke the camel's back happened in July. At our 9th anniversary dinner, she made a joke about her dress, and I joked that it wasn't the right color. Stupid of me. She got really angry. She asked me why I never just complimented her, and why she could never do anything right in my eyes. Days later she asked for a divorce. She said she just had enough. That the marriage had run its course, that she wishes she had left me earlier. She loves me as a best friend, but nothing more.

 

So here we are in November. The conflict has subsided a lot. She's filed paperwork with the court for a legal separation. We occasionally get irritated with each other, but no big blow-ups like before. We even manage to hang out and laugh sometimes. We still go out to lunch, to dinner, to drinks, to movies, to hang out with friends, etc. But she remains steadfast that separation and divorce are in order. Beneath the surface of our apparent civility, she has anger and resentment towards me (understandably). So that's where I am. On the brink of physical separation (we still live together, but that will change soon). Who knows what the future hold.

[ProdigalMe]

MvilleMan, I will comment on your thread

Edited November 12, 2015 by ProdigalMe

[burnt]

I cannot tell you how refreshing it is to read what you wrote. So truly insightful, honest, and self-reflective.

 

I'm sorry that your relationship is ending--I won't try to give you hollow cliche 'fluff' talks, but honestly, I hope you find some solace in knowing that you have come to this profound realization; because many people don't.

 

There's not a single point you made that I disagree with.

Yes, it's the small tiny almost invisible sense of rejection and invalidation that adds up over the years--and finally when you see the sum of all those, what you see is apathy, mind numbing apathy.

And yet, the warning signs were there for years.

 

I see it as an incredible and admirable quality in a person when he can look at this own actions and reflect and is willing to see the flaws and is willing to acknowledge the mistakes, even if it takes years to get to that point.

 

I know what it feels like to be at the receiving end of what you are describing. I don't fight anymore, no complaints--just silence--I feel nothing. It's a pity, it's a shame all I was asking for was ONE apology for too many years--just one honest apology, one acknowledgement.

How sad, that one single 'I'm sorry' never came.

 

I can always accept mistakes, however grand or horrific the mistakes are, so long as the person is willing to own up to it.

 

What I can't tolerate is when there's the ABSOLUTE absence of any self awareness, absolute unwillingness to listen when someone's pointing out a mistake.

 

I hope whether verbally or in written form your wife has heard/read what you have written in these last few posts; it won't undo the emotional damage, but it may provide at least some peace.

 

Thank you for posting.

Edited November 12, 2015 by burnt
typo

[ProdigalMe]

It's a pity, it's a shame all I was asking for was ONE apology for too many years--just one honest apology, one acknowledgement. How sad, that one single 'I'm sorry' never came.

 

I can always accept mistakes, however grand or horrific the mistakes are, so long as the person is willing to own up to it.

 

burnt, thank you for the kind words. For many years, I had trouble giving a sincere, heartfelt apology for the times I hurt my wife's feelings. I chalk it up to my immaturity/pride. It's always difficult for a guy (for everyone?) to admit that they made a mistake. Instead of simply admitting the mistake and apologizing for it, I would find some way to deflect it ("I didn't do that," "I didn't mean it," "it's not that serious," "you're blowing it out of proportion," "that's silly, you shouldn't be mad"). I didn't do this all the time. I would apologize, sincerely, sometimes. Other times I would deflect.

 

But it must get tiresome when you are owed an apology, and it doesn't come. My wife's attitude was just like yours. If you made a mistake, just own it. Admit it. And make sure the apology is swift, sincere, and specific.

 

I wish I was more than just self-aware. It's one thing to "review the videotape" in slow motion and make notes of the things you can improve. It's another thing entirely to execute those improvements in the heat of the next difficult moment that comes. That's where I fell down. I failed to execute in crunch-time, when it matters.

 

I'm sorry you've been on the receiving end of it. I'm sure it hurts, and it really is a shame. Something starts with such promise, and love, and hope, and then slowly devolves into something almost unrecognizable and unpalatable. Some couples pass these difficult tests and survive and thrive (they're a wonder to behold). Some couples (most couples?) fail, sooner or later, then are left to ponder how the crash happened.

Edited November 12, 2015 by ProdigalMe

[ProdigalMe]

How do I go about "uncoupling?" We still live together, but she's announced she wants a divorce and has already filed paperwork for separation.

 

Until we separate physically, do I still hang out with her? Do I act friendly around her, or do I act aloof? I feel better when I act aloof in that I don't give myself hope. When I act friendly around her, I just get my d*mn hopes up. Last night we went to dinner, and it was really nice, until we ran into a patch when we both got a little sad. Maybe we shouldn't go out to dinner with each other anymore?

 

She still wants to hang out. But is that the healthy thing for me to do? Why act like a couple if, in the very near future, we won't be one?

 

Part of me thinks, if we're going to go out, let's go out with a bang. Be the best us we've ever been. Better to say goodbye forever with a kiss instead of a shove.

 

What do you all think? When you began the "uncoupling" did you act cold, or did you try to savor the last days being good to each other?

[dreamingoftigers]

You sound a lot like my husband.

 

He is just now grasping the intimacy thing. Its extremely frustrating.

 

We have been together for 10.5 years, 5 of them were rocky (from my perspective) because he withheld sex and viewed porn.

 

He would say many of the same deflections you did.

 

Despite many other issues in the marriage, the biggest piss-off was the lack of intimacy.

 

One thing that has helped us is marital counseling.

 

But we've also been in pretty dark places where other than resources have worked better.

 

1. Divorce Busters. I recommend them to nearly everyone that is trying to work things out.

 

2. Five Love Languages helped him "get it" a little more. His "love language" is Quality Time. Mine is Physical Touch (specifically sexual touch).

 

So to him "hanging out with me all day" is just the most awesome, well I would spend the day feeling a little teased knowing that he would be jumping me and would probably say something like "we're in the middle of the movie" if I tried to jump on him.

 

3. Five Languages of Apology.

I am betting you're saying you're sorry and probably even trying to cling to time with her. She's a different animal than that. Its going to seem fake to her. Like you "feel bad" but don't care about her needs.

[ProdigalMe]

dreamingoftigers

 

I'm glad you and your husband are both trying to work on it. Me, I'm the only one in the life raft rowing.

 

I think my wife and I are similar in terms of love languages (touch and words of love), but we've devolved into such a cycle of resentment and recrimination that we don't "speak" the languages to each other anymore.

 

I said sorry to her back in August. We had a lot of heartfelt discussions. I apologized for a lot of the insensitive things I said and did. But for her it's too little, too late.