StandingO Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 How accurate are these one rep max Calculators? Maybe a different calculator for different lifts is best. Deadlift seems to be a complicated to judge. I know for myself my grip and top part of my hamstrings give out first while my back etc could go a good chunk more. Which ones do you find most accurate? Link to post Share on other sites
lchf Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 There are too many links in the chain for these calculators to be accurate. They are best used to give a ROUGH idea of what's possible max effort-wise. For example, a 500x3 squat might indicate 530x1 max effort lift, but that doesn't mean your weakest links in the lift can make it happen, low back, upper erectors, abs etc. You're better off gripping and ripping it depending on the day, and filming yourself and working on the weak links. The calculator's not going to tell you what you're going to be able to lift. Link to post Share on other sites
thefooloftheyear Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 about as accurate as those bf calculators... TFY Link to post Share on other sites
introverted1 Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 Why not just do a 1MR at the gym? Link to post Share on other sites
thefooloftheyear Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 Why not just do a 1MR at the gym? Mostly fear of injury..... Its sort of "novel" I suppose to actually have some idea what your potential best could be...without blowing out your back or tearing a rotator cuff trying to figure it out... Plus its really hard to know what the true best max is..Where is that point, where form remains good, you dont get injured, and you accomplish the max weight possible for you? TFY 1 Link to post Share on other sites
introverted1 Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 Mostly fear of injury..... Its sort of "novel" I suppose to actually have some idea what your potential best could be...without blowing out your back or tearing a rotator cuff trying to figure it out... Plus its really hard to know what the true best max is..Where is that point, where form remains good, you dont get injured, and you accomplish the max weight possible for you? TFY Hmmmm. Guess I don't understand the op, then. Isn't a true 1MR that which you have actually done? What is the value in calculating it without verification? I always assume my "best" is whatever I am actually willing and able to do. Link to post Share on other sites
lchf Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 Mostly fear of injury..... Its sort of "novel" I suppose to actually have some idea what your potential best could be...without blowing out your back or tearing a rotator cuff trying to figure it out... Plus its really hard to know what the true best max is..Where is that point, where form remains good, you dont get injured, and you accomplish the max weight possible for you? TFY If you're worried about injury then learn proper technique from people that know. The best of course is having a coach but the internet is so full of amazing information, Westside, EliteFts etc that technique can be worked on your own. Learn to bench properly...the people that blow their rotator cuffs have poor shoulder balance and bench with excessive shoulder rotation from poor benching position. People that blow their backs out deadlifting either lift too much ****ing weight, have horrible abdominal strength, cannot breathe properly, or cannot maintain the effective prone to arched position. Then there's the issue of straining properly.. a lot of people can't strain through the rep. But if you're going to lift in the 90%+ range then be prepared if ***** goes bad. Usually the issue with injury is the individual, not the lift. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
thefooloftheyear Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 (edited) If you're worried about injury then learn proper technique from people that know. The best of course is having a coach but the internet is so full of amazing information, Westside, EliteFts etc that technique can be worked on your own. Learn to bench properly...the people that blow their rotator cuffs have poor shoulder balance and bench with excessive shoulder rotation from poor benching position. People that blow their backs out deadlifting either lift too much ****ing weight, have horrible abdominal strength, cannot breathe properly, or cannot maintain the effective prone to arched position. Then there's the issue of straining properly.. a lot of people can't strain through the rep. But if you're going to lift in the 90%+ range then be prepared if ***** goes bad. Usually the issue with injury is the individual, not the lift. The engine in your car has a redline...The engine, in perfect working order, can operate flawlessly at RPM's below the redline all day long...Push it to the redline and you are now reaching the mechanical limits of the engine...What happens when yu take it to the redline? Well maybe nothing, or maybe you have a mechanical failure...Its the exact same principle.. Pro athletes, pro powerlifters, etc get injured all the time...Injuries are part of ANY serious training regimen and everyone faces injury at some point or another, even under ideal conditions, if you are serious enough,....Go to a powerlifting meet, where form is actually judged and you will see tons of guys getting injured....You don't understand the point. Its like this... I can do 18-20 reps with 225 on the bench....Textbook form..Same for 315... (8-10 reps)..Once I get close to my "theoretical max", I am probably somewhere around 425-440..At that weight, do you know how little it takes for a problem to arise? Heck. the bench press alone is a difficult movement for the human rotator cuff...So injuries to that area are quite common, even with perfect form.. Age also is a factor...I am almost as strong now as I was in earlier years, but far more prone to injury now that I am older...Form and actual strength have nothing to do with it... Point is, just like the engine analogy, no matter what the weight or individual, once you approach that persons theoretical "max" you are pushing the physical limit...There is no, "be prepared if shyt goes bad", ..It happens so fast you never have enough time...While I couldnt care less, some people may want to have some idea how far they can go without actually trying. But what do I know... TFY Edited November 13, 2015 by thefooloftheyear 1 Link to post Share on other sites
lchf Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 The engine in your car has a redline...The engine, in perfect working order, can operate flawlessly at RPM's below the redline all day long...Push it to the redline and you are now reaching the mechanical limits of the engine...What happens when yu take it to the redline? Well maybe nothing, or maybe you have a mechanical failure...Its the exact same principle.. Pro athletes, pro powerlifters, etc get injured all the time...Injuries are part of ANY serious training regimen and everyone faces injury at some point or another, even under ideal conditions, if you are serious enough,....Go to a powerlifting meet, where form is actually judged and you will see tons of guys getting injured....You don't understand the point. Its like this... I can do 18-20 reps with 225 on the bench....Textbook form..Same for 315... (8-10 reps)..Once I get close to my "theoretical max", I am probably somewhere around 425-440..At that weight, do you know how little it takes for a problem to arise? Heck. the bench press alone is a difficult movement for the human rotator cuff...So injuries to that area are quite common, even with perfect form.. Age also is a factor...I am almost as strong now as I was in earlier years, but far more prone to injury now that I am older...Form and actual strength have nothing to do with it... Point is, just like the engine analogy, no matter what the weight or individual, once you approach that persons theoretical "max" you are pushing the physical limit...There is no, "be prepared if shyt goes bad", ..It happens so fast you never have enough time...While I couldnt care less, some people may want to have some idea how far they can go without actually trying. But what do I know... TFY Huh? When did I ever deny that people with good technique get injured? If you want to avoid injury then don't train at all, hell even curlers and golfers get injured. The point was that those with ***** technique are more likely to injure themselves. Have you been to the average amateur powerlifting meet? The guys with the most catatrophic breakdowns in technique are often the ones that come out injured. That doesn't mean it can't happen during your warmup. I've competed in powerlifitng for years, and being prepared for when lifts go bad implies: having your side spotters ready and observant, having your catcher chains ready etc. I doesn't mean react to the lift going bad because as you said, it's not possible; it happens too quickly. Look at Brandon Lilly's injury a year or two ago. Secondly, not many people lift with perfect form. Least of all the amateurs. So your comment on things going wrong even with perfect form is a bit of a misnomer because the average Joe Blow doesn't squat like Melanichev or bench like George Halbert. And that's the risk you take. There are also several other factors to consider: hydration, age, muscular imbalances which can cause isolated movement patterns, poor progamming. The list goes on. Where do top strength athletes like powerlifters get injured? Mainly after they exceed a given number of heavy singles that exceed 90% in training, and then the odd unpredicted injury either during meets, or max testers, or warmups or whatever. For amateurs the issue is exacerbated because their technique is not there yet. There may be physical limitation to their performance that increase risk for injurt that aren't often observed in skilled lifters, like breathing capacity, abdominal strength, erectors etc. And yet top powerlifters STILL make those areas a priority. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
thefooloftheyear Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 Huh? When did I ever deny that people with good technique get injured? If you want to avoid injury then don't train at all, hell even curlers and golfers get injured. The point was that those with ***** technique are more likely to injure themselves. Have you been to the average amateur powerlifting meet? The guys with the most catatrophic breakdowns in technique are often the ones that come out injured. That doesn't mean it can't happen during your warmup. I've competed in powerlifitng for years, and being prepared for when lifts go bad implies: having your side spotters ready and observant, having your catcher chains ready etc. I doesn't mean react to the lift going bad because as you said, it's not possible; it happens too quickly. Look at Brandon Lilly's injury a year or two ago. Secondly, not many people lift with perfect form. Least of all the amateurs. So your comment on things going wrong even with perfect form is a bit of a misnomer because the average Joe Blow doesn't squat like Melanichev or bench like George Halbert. And that's the risk you take. There are also several other factors to consider: hydration, age, muscular imbalances which can cause isolated movement patterns, poor progamming. The list goes on. Where do top strength athletes like powerlifters get injured? Mainly after they exceed a given number of heavy singles that exceed 90% in training, and then the odd unpredicted injury either during meets, or max testers, or warmups or whatever. For amateurs the issue is exacerbated because their technique is not there yet. There may be physical limitation to their performance that increase risk for injurt that aren't often observed in skilled lifters, like breathing capacity, abdominal strength, erectors etc. And yet top powerlifters STILL make those areas a priority. Not for nothing, but you said in the previous post... "If you're worried about injury then learn proper technique from people that know" And in this post you say... "When did I ever deny that people with good technique get injured?" Its a complete contradiction... But most of the rest of the post we are in agreement...The part thats pertinent to the original post is this part I took from your post.. "Where do top strength athletes like powerlifters get injured? Mainly after they exceed a given number of heavy singles that exceed 90% in training, and then the odd unpredicted injury either during meets, or max testers," I agree here and this was why I mentioned that some sort of "theoretical calculator" is what some people seek to get some idea on how much they could potentially lift.....without exposing themselves to a greater risk of injury... Stay strong... TFY Link to post Share on other sites
lchf Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 Not for nothing, but you said in the previous post... "If you're worried about injury then learn proper technique from people that know" And in this post you say... "When did I ever deny that people with good technique get injured?" Its a complete contradiction... But most of the rest of the post we are in agreement...The part thats pertinent to the original post is this part I took from your post.. "Where do top strength athletes like powerlifters get injured? Mainly after they exceed a given number of heavy singles that exceed 90% in training, and then the odd unpredicted injury either during meets, or max testers," I agree here and this was why I mentioned that some sort of "theoretical calculator" is what some people seek to get some idea on how much they could potentially lift.....without exposing themselves to a greater risk of injury... Stay strong... TFY Well for the sake of not arguing, I MEANT to imply that technique should be the number 1 aspect of training people should put their attention to if they wish to avoid being injured, or at least, DECREASE their chance of injury. I thought I'd clear that up. Link to post Share on other sites
Be_Strong Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 I've found that one-rep max calculators are extremely accurate for me on bench press (usually within 5 pounds of max and often dead on the money). However, the one-rep max calculators often underestimate my max with squats by a fair margin. Link to post Share on other sites
lchf Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 I've found that one-rep max calculators are extremely accurate for me on bench press (usually within 5 pounds of max and often dead on the money). However, the one-rep max calculators often underestimate my max with squats by a fair margin. There are a few reasons for this. There is a difference between strength endurance and maximal strength. For example, a set of 8 squats with a weight high enough to reach failure by the 8th is a monumental task for me. Cardiovascularly, I'm not there to go further, but my 1rm is always higher than what the calculator works out for 8 reps. Just another reason why the calculators are to be taken with a grain of salt. I take Wendler's philosophy on calculators: use them to monitor progress for rep records, but don't worry about their value, because it doesn't mean jack. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author StandingO Posted November 17, 2015 Author Share Posted November 17, 2015 I did decide to go for the real lift. I had been avoiding in the DL for fear of injury. My real orm bench is slight under my calculated while my DL real orm is better then calculated. (320 to 335 very close though). For the DL seems I can bare down and get one good DL in but on the otherhand my hamstrings and grip fatigue so I don't as get many reps in as I should. Maybe if it were another body part failing first the result would closer. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
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