Self worth and self fulfilling prophecies

[T-16bullseyeWompRat]

So, self worth issues. I have for a long time done this where i set up self fulfilling prophecies which seem to prove to myself that im not worth a damn to anyone around me. I recognize i do this, yet i keep doing it and i keep getting hurt by the outcome predictably. Its like Im trying to prove myself wrong, but i keep proving to myself that my feelings of being worthless and unimportant to anyone else are true.

 

Any one else battle this, or self worth particularly that maybe have some tips or something? I recognize im burting myself, but i dont seem capable of putting a stop to it. ANY advice is appreciated.

[scooby-philly]

I can relate to your post OP

 

I don't think I set up self fulfilling prophecies. But I end up failing because I don't listen to my heart or to my head (or to my gut) when it tells me something isnt right. I'm not sure if you feel comfortable enough to share more detail. I'm sure other can relate more directly to the self fulfilling prophecies thing. But just today I got a letter from the IRS stating I owed $1500 in taxes from 2013 because of some side work I did for an employer after I left. I remember thinking at the time that I should report it since the company would be audited but I didn't. I don't think I should owe that much but the point is that I sometimes find myself not living the life I want or dream of because of fear of judgement. I sit and wait for people to give me things instead of realizing they are mine for the taking.

 

If you want to share more I'd be happy to offer whatever I can

[LuckyLady13]

T-16, before responding in any type of detail, I'd like to ask one question? Were you treated badly by a parent or parents? Told you're worthless or not going to amount to anything or something similar?

[camillalev]

I feel you. I do the same thing about 80% of the time even though I can see it coming. I have been trying to change but habits are hard to quit.

 

And to lucky lady's point, I was told I was worthless/unlovable consistently while growing up.

[T-16bullseyeWompRat]

T-16, before responding in any type of detail, I'd like to ask one question? Were you treated badly by a parent or parents? Told you're worthless or not going to amount to anything or something similar?

 

I was in a broken home. My parents split when i was very young. My mom got remarried, but he was an abuser. Although i never got abused physically, but my sister was sexually abused. When found out, he killed himself in my backyard two days before my 14th birthday. My mom is a saint but she had to leave for weekends at a time for work to support 3 kids. So we were left home a lot by ourselves for long periods of time. Idk if that has something to do with this or not. Im happy to answer any questions btw, so feel free to ask.

[LuckyLady13]

Oh, wow T-16. I'm sorry you went through such a tough situation when you were young. I'm sure that wasn't easy to deal with.

 

Okay, so this guy was an abuser. The reason I asked the question I did is because, a lot of times, when we're growing up, if a parent (or in your case step parent) calls us names, it gets ingrained into our minds and becomes the chatter we hear in our heads.

 

I'll give you some examples. When my sister and I were growing up, our parents were severely abusive. They had a favorite question to scream at us: "Are you an idiot?!". This could be over the slightest thing like dropping something on the floor accidentally. I didn't even notice for years I'd call myself an idiot over the slightest mistake and my younger sister was even worse. If she dropped something or forgot about something like...left her keys in her car, she'd smack herself on the head, close her eyes, get very visibly upset and say "I am such an idiot!".

 

I found out through research and a therapist that this negative self-talk came from our upbringing.

 

Do you think some of your negative self-image (feeling worthless) may have actually come from your step father? And feeling unimportant could be a remnant from your past when your mom wasn't able to be there for days and long periods of time?

[burnt]

T-16, before responding in any type of detail, I'd like to ask one question? Were you treated badly by a parent or parents? Told you're worthless or not going to amount to anything or something similar?

 

OH GOD.

My very first thought exactly.

 

Although i never got abused physically

 

The emotional/psychological/verbal abuse and neglect are in many ways FAR worse than actual physical abuse. Simply because the abused doesn't even know or recognize that he has been abused. While in the mean time all those damaging experiences become more and more engrained. By the time, you finally connect the dots, it's almost like trying to change your very being and the way you think and process emotions.

 

I'm afraid I don't have any suggestions for you.

All I can say is I relate to what you're describing.

 

OP, with all my heart, I wish you DO find a way to address it.

I don't struggle with it anymore. In my case, I'm there at the finish line--I have successfully convinced myself of my worthlessness. No joke here.

Edited November 20, 2015 by burnt

[T-16bullseyeWompRat]

Oh, wow T-16. I'm sorry you went through such a tough situation when you were young. I'm sure that wasn't easy to deal with.

 

Okay, so this guy was an abuser. The reason I asked the question I did is because, a lot of times, when we're growing up, if a parent (or in your case step parent) calls us names, it gets ingrained into our minds and becomes the chatter we hear in our heads.

 

I'll give you some examples. When my sister and I were growing up, our parents were severely abusive. They had a favorite question to scream at us: "Are you an idiot?!". This could be over the slightest thing like dropping something on the floor accidentally. I didn't even notice for years I'd call myself an idiot over the slightest mistake and my younger sister was even worse. If she dropped something or forgot about something like...left her keys in her car, she'd smack herself on the head, close her eyes, get very visibly upset and say "I am such an idiot!".

 

I found out through research and a therapist that this negative self-talk came from our upbringing.

 

Do you think some of your negative self-image (feeling worthless) may have actually come from your step father? And feeling unimportant could be a remnant from your past when your mom wasn't able to be there for days and long periods of time?

 

The thing is im not fully sure i did deal with it back then. I remeber my dad came to pick me up to go play golf the morning before my birthday. He didnt know anything until he showed up and saw my mom had left a note on the door for a repairman saying to reschedule for a death in the family. I told him what happened, and he looked shocked obviously. He asked if i was OK, and i said im fine, lets go. We played our round. He asked me a couple times if i was ok. Kept looking sideways at me to see if i had any emotional expression i guess. Nothing though. They put me in a counseling group at school. I didnt want to go back after the first two days. Told everyone im fine, im not coming back. Never did.

 

As far as my mom, i dont know. For a long time if you asked me what i wanted to be when i grow up, it was a simple answer... I wanted to be a hermit. I always dreamed of living in complete solitude in the mountains. Liviing off the land and composing music, or writing poems or novels, or something creative. And that people wouldnt know of my existence, yet someday it would be discovered how incredibly talented I was. I would never receive any praise, as by the time people find out how valuable i was, i would already be long gone.

 

I still feel this. Its like I do things for people and dont want any type of reaction towards me. Its like i work hard to make sure people will miss me when im gone. But only when im gone. I dont like praise, its uncomfortable. I wish to be invisible, yet my impact to be undeniable to others. It doesn't really make sense at all.

 

My wife, long before marriage, knows of my hermit dream. She will playfully bring it to light when im ultra reclusive at times. She has made a difference in my thoughts, but i feel my struggles are starting to have an impact on our relationship. I know im getting worse in my thoughts after a recent event. Now i seem determined in my mind to prove im nothing, a POS not worth anyones time. I keep proving myself right

[LuckyLady13]

T-16, not being able to accept praise comes from low self-esteem.

 

In your particular case, since a lot of our self-esteem is derived from childhood and you said your mom wasn't able to be there because she worked a lot, she wasn't there to teach you to build a healthy self-esteem.

 

Now, the thing about this is, when someone praises you, you either don't accept in your mind what they are saying (believe it's untrue) or you feel pressure to live up to that persons expectations now.

 

Being that you said you have a dream of being a hermit, the only persons expectations you'd have to live up to are your own!

 

You also sound like you have social anxiety because people who have social anxiety can't stand the feeling that the attention is on them. And when someone praises you, it's too much attention for you and creates a sense of pressure.

 

Obviously, from everything I said, if you wall yourself off from people, this situation will actually get quite a bit worse. It will become like a monster feeding itself.

 

Maybe back in school when you tried to go through with the counseling group, it either wasn't the right environment for you or (not faulting the counselor), the person trying to help may have just been ill-equipped to help. What happened to your family doesn't happen to everyone so you would have been best off to see someone who specializes in trauma.

 

If you see yourself getting worse and it's having a negative impact on your marriage, maybe now, as a grown adult, you can do yourself a huge favor and find a therapist or psychologist who specializes in trauma and abuse. They would understand you much better and have the correct tools to set you on the right path.

[T-16bullseyeWompRat]

Idk about social anxiety. I work in sales. If you ask me am I confident, I feel I am. Im very flirtatious for example. I have no issue meeting new people. I like social events amd gatherings. Its wierd really. Like i hate being the center of attention, yet i strive to gain everyones admiration and praise. But when its given, its like i dont want to believe them. Maybe it is where i feel i cant live up to expectations.

 

In sales they teach you to leave an impact. To give that person reason to always come back to me, and tell their friends and family to only work with me. I strive to be forgettable. Like that line from oceans 11 where he says something like "he has to like you, then immediately forget you exist." or something like that. Maybe im dealing more with abandonment issues?

 

My wife emotionally abandoned me for a few years. You can read my thread to get a better idea. I feel like I was important at one point, or at least a lot better off then i was before. Then that happened and im back ten times worse then where i was before. Maybe im trying to justify her reasons for not wanting to be there for me is because im not worth it. I dont have any close friends either. I mean, how many people dont have a best friend? I dont have any friends i dont work with. When i leave this job some day, these friends will disappear like everyone else in my past.

[truthtripper]

The emotional/psychological/verbal abuse and neglect are in many ways FAR worse than actual physical abuse. Simply because the abused doesn't even know or recognize that he has been abused.

Which explains why so many people are suffering from depression/anxiety/mental illness/suicidal thoughts and have no idea why.

[truthtripper]

I was sexually abused by my grandfather. My family still continue to abuse me, as they don't believe me, so I get scapegoated and ostracised. They treat me like I'm dumb and good for nothing.

 

When I keep reminding myself about all the pain I've suffered as a child and the unacknowledgement and ridicule by my family, I realise, this is why I feel so s*** about myself. When I make the connections and I'm able to understand where my feelings of worthlessness come from, I don't feel worthless anymore. But it's not a constant feeling, so it's something I'm still working on too.

[LuckyLady13]

Like i hate being the center of attention, yet i strive to gain everyones admiration and praise. But when its given, its like i dont want to believe them. Maybe it is where i feel i cant live up to expectations.

 

That's actually the hallmark of the reaction of a person with low self-esteem to praise.

 

You've said you were (not intentionally) neglected when you were growing up, then later for years in your marriage. That's a lot of years of neglect.

 

You're okay with being around people short-term but anything long term is where you're having problems and again, that's when expectations rise significantly. Strangers or acquaintances, coworkers don't have super high expectations of you on a personal level but in your marriage or long term friendships people expect a lot from you.

 

While it's very admirable of you to step back after your kids were born and take a back seat while your wife was working hard and went through school, you are a guy coming from a traumatic childhood (even if you still don't fully realize it) and have had serious self-esteem issues.

 

These self-esteem issues have led to you having fantasies of a hermit type of lifestyle (not good for the kids), having serious issues in your marriage (not good for the kids ever and also a bad role model for their future relationships) so you need to seriously take care of yourself finally. A happy dad will lead to happier kids and a happier marriage. Taking care of you is taking care of them too!

 

When your mom and sister had to deal with the abuse and then suicide of your step father, did you feel they were hurt more than you? And took a back seat then too?

 

In your other thread you mentioned being depressed and drinking quite a bit (congrats on stopping that). Depression does nothing good for self-esteem and you said you've seen things with you getting worse. You also mentioned IC, though. If you hadn't made the connection previously with your self-esteem and your behavior, if you make the connection now, you can focus your therapy sessions on this big issue and make a lot of progress with it.

 

I'm glad you can come to a place like LS for some opinions because sometimes we can't see what's going on with us like people can from the outside. Personally, I look forward to finding out anything anyone else on LS might see going on with you.

 

The only other thing that stands out to me like a sore thumb from your posts is your marriage is rife with communication problems. You have wished your wife would read your mind and realize you want her attention (she's not a mind reader) and when your wife has told you how she feels, you've discounted her words quickly with "she said ____ but I did _____ so she's wrong".

 

Your wife hasn't been wrong about her feelings. In your other thread you said yourself she's told you straight out how she feels and why. Acknowledge her feelings! She feels neglected too, was upset you made no effort to have sex with her for weeks and told you that you don't touch her in those really fun, flirtatious ways you used to back in the beginning. Your counter to that was you took her to a restaurant? Her feelings are very valid and since you're not listening to her honestly with your heart, she's threatened to pack up and leave as a last ditch effort in hopes you'll finally listen. Talking to you about her feelings gets her discounted and ignored and shown what a great guy you are.

 

You said you're very flirtatious but your wife is saying not with her. Ouch.

 

 

 

- You have to do something about your depression.

 

- Learn to understand how your self-esteem is tied to your issues.

 

- Do your best to honestly communicate with your wife.

 

There's an excellent article at the psychologytoday website by Guy Winch Ph.D. "Why some people hate receiving compliments". You can also just Google up a search on "praise makes me uncomfortable" and read article after article on reputable websites. There are also books on this very subject.

[T-16bullseyeWompRat]

When your mom and sister had to deal with the abuse and then suicide of your step father, did you feel they were hurt more than you? And took a back seat then too?.

 

Yes. Ive always felt my needs aren't as important as others. My older sister lost her youth, and is far more damaged then i am. My younger sister lost her father. My mom was left to try and support 3 kids, and help as well with my step brother, though he didnt live with us. My suffering pales in comparison.

 

My wife's needs are being met as far as I know. My first post thread was at a particularly low point for us (not uncommon for a first post on LS), although maybe more me personally then us. My wife is good at communicating her needs, because i make it a point to ask her for them. Im very conscious of my actions in our relationship as well as being a father. Dw and I are in a much better place today. Dont worry, i flirt with her all the time That is why after just 2 weeks of not doing it, she was in pain enough to say something serious about it. We are back on track there, as well as my wanting to be around her as much as possible. We went on a little weekend trip just us for her birthday. Really reconnected and put my mind in a better place. As far as us. However this thread was started because i know I was at a low point personally which cause that rift between us where it could have been avoided.

 

With that said She knows i deal with my issues by wanting to be alone a bit and work out my feelings. I just dont comminucate them to others, i guess cause i have never really felt they are a big deal compared to the issues of others. Specifically my loved ones. The point of this thread is i feel ive identified the underlying issue with myself that ive never really dealt with. Had a talk with my wife during our last big fight, and told her a lot of the things ive said in this thread about myself and feeling abandoned. We have been together 15+ years and married 9. She said she never knew i dealt with this all this time. This hasnt cause huge issues for us before this one instance, but probably has contributed to minor ones.

 

Thank you so much everyone for all the input. And yes, i do need to work on my communication with her. Im working on it. Everytime there is a rift, i usually try and look at myself to fix what im doing wrong to correct it. I dont look much at correcting things that seem to be only damaging, or most damaging to me.