Joint custody not working out

[jakrbbt]

I've posted here before. Ex and I separated over a year ago, divorced almost a year ago. We have a 2.5-year-old. Settled for joint custody and 50-50 parenting. I usually have child about 60% (used to be far more). Ex is still basically unemployed. He somehow pays rent by pawning things and working a few days per month on-call.

 

Ex is, in a nutshell, very difficult to deal with.

 

I have two problems I need to figure out how to deal with: school, and sleep.

 

Joint-custody means both parents have legal say over school, religion, and non-emergency medical decisions. But also, if joint custody isn't working, either parent can move to modify and then court has to grant sole legal custody to one or the other (parenting time is separate from custody).

 

Toddler is in day care mondays/tuesdays. I have him those days. I work from home those days. But I typically wake him by 8, because of day care's schedule (lunch at 11:30, nap at noon).

 

Ex has toddler Wed-Fri.

 

I'd like to switch him from day care to an excellent preschool that also has after-care. I toured, then set up second tour and invited ex. Ex liked the school, but reserved discussing further.

 

Ex now says he has no objection to my putting son in school on my two days (still not sure he could legally object anyway-- depends on whether it's considered "school" or day care at this point.)

 

But ex isn't ok with son being in school on any of his days, even if I pay for it. He says he does not know whether he'll get a job down the road, and if he does, then he can't commit to getting son to school. I said I could get him to school but ex still declined.

 

I know that the real issue is, ex absolutely does not want to have to wake up and get child ready for 8:30 school even one day a week. He hates mornings and has always gone to very great lengths to sleep as late as possible.

 

Here's the sleep issue:

 

I have son on an 8 to 8:30, with 1:00 nap (these are all approximate), schedule.

 

Ex prefers to have son nap late afternoon/early evening, bedtime at 11 or later, and then he likes son to sleep in until at least 10 in the morning. Son then wakes up still-sleeping ex, and they snuggle for (ex says) about 40 minutes each morning before getting up.

 

It's a pretty big variation. I've tried letting son sleep in on my days, but then he ends up getting to day care when they're about to lunch (son having breakfasted at home)-- and then, kids all nap while son sits in the dark with a book.

 

Typically I am not inclined to worry about sleep schedules. But 2 pediatricians and one early-child therapist I visit have all said it's very important to have son on a more regular schedule. Especially since he lives in 2 different houses-- consistency and some basic routine will give him a lot more sleep health and stability. The therapist says children do far better in school when they spend toddler years waking at normal school-age hours. Plus, son will present with mammoth sleep issues that disrupt things for weeks on end.

 

I told ex I'd like us to get toddler on a more regular sleep schedule.

 

He refused. He said, "Why should I accommodate your schedule?" But I don't have a schedule when I work from home. I told ex I was really accommodating son's schedule-- with day care and soon, school.

 

Ex said it's not his fault son's in day care. "Day care is your thing. That was your doing, not mine."

 

At first I was thinking, it makes no sense to try to tell the other parent when to wake the child. But, here we are, two parents who cannot even set up a fairly consistent body-clock schedule and stable situation for our child's week. That tells me we should not have joint custody and 50-50 time.

 

And I don't like the idea of my child not attending school except on my 2 weekdays, just because we're all waiting to see whether my ex will get a job (he's 42, has never had consistent regular work for any significant length of time, hasn't been full-time employed in 6 years). Especially when I'm happy to pay for school anyway!

 

But I loathe the idea of returning to court.

 

I could just put son in 2-day school program, not worry about the sleep for now, and then in the fall, try to enroll him in 4-day or 5-day school (when he's 3 and a half). If ex still says he can't be bothered to take child to school, then I might be more ready to go to court over it.

 

Or I could go now, because ex isn't even employed and is still saying he won't agree to take child to school even though he has no problem with the school.

 

And how big a deal is this sleep thing? I'm starting to feel I have to listen to the people saying not to ignore it. Son displays some issues with sleep (beyond normal toddler sleep resistance)-- but he's physically and mentally thriving, healthy, extraordinarily verbal, polite, happy child. Maybe I get him to several physician visits with pointed task of assessing whether he's affected by sleep changes? I mean, it's kind of like one of us traveling every week to the east coast and back, and switching bedtimes/wake times.

Edited November 26, 2015 by jakrbbt

[juicygirl]

Your ex probably feels like you're trying to control him even now you are not together.

 

On his days let him do his thing, as long as he isn't harming the child.

Pre school is not a necessity, especially with a parent at home and I'm sure your child would rather spend time with daddy than a bunch of strangers.

I had many parents telling me I needed to send my children to preschool to learn and socialize.My oldest went to preschool at 4 and the following year started school. She's is now out doing all her friends academically and recently had a party with 30 plus kids.

 

So, on your days the child goes to preschool and on daddy's days he doesn't, no big deal, plus saves you loads of money. If your ex hasn't had a job all these years don't hold your breathe on that front. With the sleeping thing, kids adapt fine. My kids grandma like to keep the kids up all hours too, but once they're home it's back to the routine.

 

It's annoying but you to have two different parenting style and you can't except him to follow your lead. I doubt the court would do anything in this case either.

[candie13]

I have no children. My advice is to think with your head, not with your heart and think of your son's best interest. Your ex prefers to sleep in late rather than have his son in a decent pre-school. Basically, he is selfish and is harming your kid. What sort of influence is he to your toddler? Inspiration?

 

As a woman with no children (but really hoping to have some one day) and unaware of how the dynamics between the parents influence the child development, I say do the adult thing and go to court ASAP. The more you keep that man away from your son, the better. At 42, he's not even a full grown up, he's still a teenager. I hope you want your son to become a better person than that. That starts with shielding him from bad influence...

 

Your call,OP. My strong advice is: go to court and change the joint custody. "Because he likes to sleep in late" does not sound like decent parenting to me...

[basil67]

I think 2.5yrs is too early to be worrying about school. Two days per week is great and so is having time chilling with his father. Give it a year or more before you make any waves about it.

 

I find the variation in sleep patterns more concerning. As your son is showing signs of the sleep changes being a problem, then I think it's worth following up with a paediatrician and enforcing in court if necessary.

 

As your husband sounds like he's willing to even get his son to proper school when the time comes, you may as well start the ball rolling now.

[jakrbbt]

I'll clarify-- it's not that "I want sole custody because ex sleeps in." (I tried pretty hard-- too hard, according to some on LS, to make joint custody work and I don't take it lightly)--

 

it's more that son is split 50-50, switching schedules by too much every few days, and the pediatritians say that's detrimental, and the co-parents cannot work out a basically consistent schedule for him. It wouldn't be such an issue if he was with his dad on weekends only.

 

But also I'm concerned about the school issue...

[Tayla]

a court liason is best able to resolve this. I've yet to read any court ruling that says the "courts have to decide on sole custody when either party is playing power games". The purpose of custody does impact guardian decisions.

 

He is the childs father and has remained in contact. Your opinion of him is off the table. The direct concern is the childs' future schedule and social abilities.

 

There is no court that will mandate pre school attendence unless its one for disabled or therepy inclined. This is not the scenario that is being conveyed.

 

Have you considered other options? What makes preschool a necessity?

These questions will be asked in the courts.. be prepared.

 

My sons were raised by a single parent. What you are dealing with is not being handled well, seek an unbias third party that can guide you both to better resolutions. I think you both have good intentions for the child.

[candie13]

you know when the best time to become a great parent is? Not when the kid is 3 or 4. Not when he goes to school. It starts now. You KNOW what you need to do. Worse, your not acting and being a coward will actually play against the development of your son. Yes, life is a b*tch, if you don't take active measures, it'll take them for ya. One poor parent is enough, in one family, ain't it, OP ?

[mystikmind2005]

Wow, i think your doing well, my ex won't allow any overnight stay with my daughter, i just get one Saturday, and even then she sometimes decides to go on a weekend trip and i get no custody.

[jakrbbt]

It's pretty clear that I should also add 3 things:

 

1. If both parents can't agree on school (and have joint legal custody), they bring the school issue before the court. So, court doesn't mandate school, but neither does it mandate not-school. It basically arbitrates.

 

2. If even one party stops stipulating to joint custody, the court MUST grant sole custody to one or the other parent. It's not allowed to impose joint custody.

 

3. I'm overwhelmingly likely to be the one to get sole custody.

 

 

When we first separated I supported my ex and basically (for several months) walked him through being able to keep in contact with our child. I even let him stay with me when he was functionally homeless, rather than him not see our child. He's been a deadbeat dad in the past (never visiting or paying support for now-20-yr-old daughter) and I wanted to really help avoid that scenario here.

 

Alright, # 4: school is important to me. It's at least more important than one parent who's unemployed sleeping in.

 

Courts don't look at "fairness" between the parties or "who deserves what." They look at best interests of the child.

 

But I'm trying to weigh how worth it is the stress and aggressiveness of court now (I'd likely prevail) versus giving it more time. Some people think I've already given it too long...

[jakrbbt]

Wow, i think your doing well, my ex won't allow any overnight stay with my daughter, i just get one Saturday, and even then she sometimes decides to go on a weekend trip and i get no custody.

 

Well I don't know what your situation is but I strongly believe that plenty of contact with both parents is best, unless one parent is neglect or abusive-- even if one parent is sub-par.

 

But then if only one parent can/will make constructive decisions for child's upbringing, the other parent shouldn't interfere. And that's what joint versus sole legal custody is about-- it's different form parenting time.

 

Also, for me selfishly, sure it would be easier if ex was out of the picture. But I'm thinking of my child...better for him that his father be ariund...(even if he has great step father too) Problem is when I have to "help" ex be present, to the extent where son loses out.

[Tayla]

It's pretty clear that I should also add 3 things:

 

1. If both parents can't agree on school (and have joint legal custody), they bring the school issue before the court. So, court doesn't mandate school, but neither does it mandate not-school. It basically arbitrates.

 

2. If even one party stops stipulating to joint custody, the court MUST grant sole custody to one or the other parent. It's not allowed to impose joint custody.

 

3. I'm overwhelmingly likely to be the one to get sole custody.

 

 

When we first separated I supported my ex and basically (for several months) walked him through being able to keep in contact with our child. I even let him stay with me when he was functionally homeless, rather than him not see our child. He's been a deadbeat dad in the past (never visiting or paying support for now-20-yr-old daughter) and I wanted to really help avoid that scenario here.

 

Alright, # 4: school is important to me. It's at least more important than one parent who's unemployed sleeping in.

 

Courts don't look at "fairness" between the parties or "who deserves what." They look at best interests of the child.

 

But I'm trying to weigh how worth it is the stress and aggressiveness of court now (I'd likely prevail) versus giving it more time. Some people think I've already given it too long...

 

1: contact your lawyer.

2: yes courts can order a child to attend school and fine the parents for truancy. Your scenario of pre school does not qualify.

3: no, its not a given that you'll get sole custody. Would be nice to think that way.

4: contact a lawyer.

Again I think you may need a third party that has no bone in this fight to resolve it. The idea that you are using this as a way to garner sole custody is disturbing. The courts can help. utilize them .

[jakrbbt]

The legal parameters I've mentioned are specific to my state.

 

I'm a lawyer myself, and I've also consulted one about this. It's not legal guidance I'm looking for here, but instead, some idea on whether I'd be pulling the trigger too soon, or (if I give joint custody more chance) dragging out the inevitable while my child loses out.

 

By way of background, I've been too conflict-averse from the start (even before the divorce). But also, there's plenty to say for giving joint custody more than a year to see if it can work out.

[mystikmind2005]

Well I don't know what your situation is but I strongly believe that plenty of contact with both parents is best, unless one parent is neglect or abusive-- even if one parent is sub-par.

 

But then if only one parent can/will make constructive decisions for child's upbringing, the other parent shouldn't interfere. And that's what joint versus sole legal custody is about-- it's different form parenting time.

 

Also, for me selfishly, sure it would be easier if ex was out of the picture. But I'm thinking of my child...better for him that his father be ariund...(even if he has great step father too) Problem is when I have to "help" ex be present, to the extent where son loses out.

 

Well, i don't drink or smoke or swear or any of those crappy things, i have a full time job.

 

The problem is that i am just an average dad i guess... i will put a shirt on back to front, i will get her dirty, i will play with her in the park, i do try to be careful, but she will get scratched and bruised while having tons of fun.

 

My ex hates it, complains about it, then refuses custody because of it. Honestly, i cannot live up to my ex's standards, that's a fact, she is the type of mom who keeps a record of how many hairs are on our daughters head, and counts them every day. I don't know, all i can do is love my daughter and give her a fantastic upbringing, even if a few hairs are going to get out of place in the meantime.

[juicygirl]

The ex sounds like a bum, but the problem is you pick him. You pick him to be the father of your child so not you're stuck.

 

As he is present and the child isn't in harms way, I wouldn't drag him to court over this issues. Your ex sounds flaky and dragging in to court would probably push him away even give him an excuse to stay away and then your son would miss out. I've seen a lot of father throw the towel in because they couldn't deal with the ex anymore and her ever ending list of demands. I'm not saying it's right but it does happen.

 

I think in your gut you know it's not a good idea.

[BetrayedH]

I don't like to harp. And as a father, I'd be mortified if my exwife tried to gain sole custody.

 

But in your case, I think you've got no cause to think that your ex will ever become reasonable and make decisions that are in the best interests of the child. He makes decisions that are in the best interests of himself - most of them seems to revolve around whatever is the least work for him. This problem will just persist and worsen as the child gets older. At some point your son will be old enough for "real" school and will be required to be there early in the morning. I have been here with you since you came here thinking about leaving this man. His "need" to sleep in, even while unemployed, trumps everything. Your H can barely seem to keep a roof over his head and you're routinely providing food, diapers, or whatever else the man and child might need. Does your exH appreciate those efforts? Nope. Instead, you get lies about the keys being locked in the car and arguments about the definition of "morning."

 

I do not believe that what you're doing is sustainable. I believe it is only a matter of time before you are back in court to gain sole custody and clarifications about time sharing. My gut says you should just do it sooner rather than later. Stop postponing the inevitable.

 

That said, I would defer to your attorney as to the right time to pull the trigger. Your attorney may want a more compelling reason (I don't believe the sleep schedule will suffice) and your attorney may want the failure of the current approach to be documented for a longer period.

[jakrbbt]

I don't like to harp. And as a father, I'd be mortified if my exwife tried to gain sole custody.

 

But in your case, I think you've got no cause to think that your ex will ever become reasonable and make decisions that are in the best interests of the child. He makes decisions that are in the best interests of himself - most of them seems to revolve around whatever is the least work for him. This problem will just persist and worsen as the child gets older. At some point your son will be old enough for "real" school and will be required to be there early in the morning. I have been here with you since you came here thinking about leaving this man. His "need" to sleep in, even while unemployed, trumps everything. Your H can barely seem to keep a roof over his head and you're routinely providing food, diapers, or whatever else the man and child might need. Does your exH appreciate those efforts? Nope. Instead, you get lies about the keys being locked in the car and arguments about the definition of "morning."

 

I do not believe that what you're doing is sustainable. I believe it is only a matter of time before you are back in court to gain sole custody and clarifications about time sharing. My gut says you should just do it sooner rather than later. Stop postponing the inevitable.

 

That said, I would defer to your attorney as to the right time to pull the trigger. Your attorney may want a more compelling reason (I don't believe the sleep schedule will suffice) and your attorney may want the failure of the current approach to be documented for a longer period.

 

This is a more organized and eloquent description of what my concern really is.

 

Thanks for the clarity and objective long term view...

 

For now I guess it's still worth my time and money to visit my attorney, visit the early-child therapist, slog through nights of sleep issues, and try to document. All the while giving my ex reasonable opportunity, of course, to step up.

 

When I went to pick up my son last week my ex was sitting outside. He had son (2 years old) shut inside the house with a cartoon on, but no way to monitor or see or hear him. Ex was smoking a cigar. I bought him a $150 baby monitor but he can't be bothered to use it. I didn't say anything. I always aim to check with an expert and let stuff go that the expert says won't really hurt son.

 

Filling out application now for 2-day school program.

[StBreton]

Situations like yours are why I don't believe in 50/50 custody when kids are so young. I don't think any pediatrician would advocate for such a hectic schedule as you describe. Love is very important but Consistency is very important also for the best development. Your ex's negative influence will forever be a part of your child's psyche. Your ex is like some hippie. What kinds of people is your ex friends with and does he bring those people around your child?

 

I'd document as much as possible and go for weekend visitation and a few evenings a week with you as the primary.

[testmeasure]

What is your response going to be when your ex says:

 

 

I'm available and I think it is in the child's best interest to be with a parent as opposed to being in daycare. That my ex is not just trying to take our child away from me and put him in daycare, but that she is trying to use my disagreement with this as a basis for taking away joint decision making is beyond belief and certainly not in the best interest of our son.

 

 

If consistency is a concern, I'm available all the time and I would like to request that I be given more time and primary custody. I would like to at least add first right of refusal to our plan so that when she tries to put him in daycare during her time, I can take him to be with me as opposed to having to be with strangers.

 

 

What you've said is a gold mine for your ex. If you file anything like what you've written here with the court, you're basically giftwrapping evidence against yourself for him and filing it with the court yourself at your expense.

 

 

You'll notice I didn't use the word school anywhere. I think most people do not perceive anything at that age to be anything other than daycare, no mater how fancy or "school" like it tries to make itself look.

 

 

I'm not a lawyer, this isn't legal advice. It's just opinions for entertainment. Think of it as just something you read somewhere on the internet, which actually is what it is.

Edited December 2, 2015 by testmeasure

[jakrbbt]

What is your response going to be when your ex says:

 

 

I'm available and I think it is in the child's best interest to be with a parent as opposed to being in daycare. That my ex is not just trying to take our child away from me and put him in daycare, but that she is trying to use my disagreement with this as a basis for taking away joint decision making is beyond belief and certainly not in the best interest of our son.

 

 

If consistency is a concern, I'm available all the time and I would like to request that I be given more time and primary custody. I would like to at least add first right of refusal to our plan so that when she tries to put him in daycare during her time, I can take him to be with me as opposed to having to be with strangers.

 

 

What you've said is a gold mine for your ex. If you file anything like what you've written here with the court, you're basically giftwrapping evidence against yourself for him and filing it with the court yourself at your expense.

 

 

You'll notice I didn't use the word school anywhere. I think most people do not perceive anything at that age to be anything other than daycare, no mater how fancy or "school" like it tries to make itself look.

 

 

I'm not a lawyer, this isn't legal advice. It's just opinions for entertainment. Think of it as just something you read somewhere on the internet, which actually is what it is.

 

I dealt with above too-common misconception (that judges complain about) early in the divorce: No, courts do not consider it better to support a stay-at-home unemployed single parent. Courts consider day care to be taking care of the child. I'll say it again: Sending your child to day care is part of legitimate parenting, in the court's eyes. Just like a court would not consider home schooling to be more responsible than a parent who sends child to school. Socialization and parental employment are just two reasons.

 

Legally, this school is school, not day care, I wonfeeee the sane thing and so I checked.

[testmeasure]

I dealt with above too-common misconception (that judges complain about) early in the divorce: No, courts do not consider it better to support a stay-at-home unemployed single parent. Courts consider day care to be taking care of the child. I'll say it again: Sending your child to day care is part of legitimate parenting, in the court's eyes. Just like a court would not consider home schooling to be more responsible than a parent who sends child to school. Socialization and parental employment are just two reasons.

 

Legally, this school is school, not day care, I wonfeeee the sane thing and so I checked.

 

 

I didn't suggest having strangers take care of a 2.5 year old was neglect, particularly if they are paid professionals.

 

 

Nor did I suggest that anyone "support" his choice to be stay at home and not seek a job.

 

 

Given that he is stay at home, is available, and he is an actual parent of the child, not a stranger, he is well situated to take advantage of the situation you are seeking to create.

 

 

You do understand what "right of first refusal" is? It's in a lot of plans to begin with. The idea behind it and why it is so common is that it's in the best interest of the child to be with and be raised by the parents as opposed to strangers or even other family members.

 

 

That isn't the same thing as saying that it's not " legitimate parenting" to have someone else take care of a child on a regular basis.

 

 

But if your position is that you want to take time away from your ex so that non-parents can take care of your 2.5 year old child meanwhile at the same time you can't make use of all of your time and need to rely on non-parents to take care of your child during your time while he is available all the time, that has the potential backfire on you.

 

 

However low his quality of parenting is, he is a parent with a right to parent the child. However high the quality of those non-parents is, they have no rights in the mater. All he has to do is ask for right of first refusal, something which to my understanding is very common, and your whole thing backfires.

 

 

Edit: I should also add, how ever high quality a parent you are, you're apparently not available during the time you are having others take care of a 2.5 year old. You're not available. This "school" for a 2.5 year old isn't a parent. He's a parent and is available. You want to go after his time specifically to put a 2.5 year old child with strangers more of the time? What if he responded by going after some of yours time to keep a 2.5 year old child with parents more of the time? You think he's such a bad parent that you don't see how this could backfire on you?

 

 

 

I'm not a lawyer, this isn't legal advice. It's opinion for entertainment. Think of it as having about as much weight as something you read on the internet, which is what it actually is.

Edited December 2, 2015 by testmeasure

[jakrbbt]

I didn't suggest having strangers take care of a 2.5 year old was neglect, particularly if they are paid professionals.

 

 

Nor did I suggest that anyone "support" his choice to be stay at home and not seek a job.

 

 

Given that he is stay at home, is available, and he is an actual parent of the child, not a stranger, he is well situated to take advantage of the situation you are seeking to create.

 

 

You do understand what "right of first refusal" is? It's in a lot of plans to begin with. The idea behind it and why it is so common is that it's in the best interest of the child to be with and be raised by the parents as opposed to strangers or even other family members.

 

 

That isn't the same thing as saying that it's not " legitimate parenting" to have someone else take care of a child on a regular basis.

 

 

But if your position is that you want to take time away from your ex so that non-parents can take care of your 2.5 year old child meanwhile at the same time you can't make use of all of your time and need to rely on non-parents to take care of your child during your time while he is available all the time, that has the potential backfire on you.

 

 

However low his quality of parenting is, he is a parent with a right to parent the child. However high the quality of those non-parents is, they have no rights in the mater. All he has to do is ask for right of first refusal, something which to my understanding is very common, and your whole thing backfires.

 

 

Edit: I should also add, how ever high quality a parent you are, you're apparently not available during the time you are having others take care of a 2.5 year old. You're not available. This "school" for a 2.5 year old isn't a parent. He's a parent and is available. You want to go after his time specifically to put a 2.5 year old child with strangers more of the time? What if he responded by going after some of yours time to keep a 2.5 year old child with parents more of the time? You think he's such a bad parent that you don't see how this could backfire on you?

 

 

 

I'm not a lawyer, this isn't legal advice. It's opinion for entertainment. Think of it as having about as much weight as something you read on the internet, which is what it actually is.

 

I didn't mean to sound like I was attacking your post-- I did post my reply in a huge hurry and on a phone.

 

But let me say this. When my child is in day care, and we're talking two days, I'm working from home and he's having a pretty short day. It's not like "some stranger" is "raising my child" (not your exact words I know, but I read that kind of concern all over the internet so wanted to address it for other readers as well). I know these people, and their center, pretty well. The school would be even more homey and intimate, and I'd participate for 2 hours each week. It isn't just "fancy" day care, it's school (ugh, on the internet, quoting sounds combative but I don't mean to be! I'm clarifying.)

 

But also, I do not choose to have a stay-at-home-raised, or a home-schooled child. Those are choices some parents make, but it's not mine. I have definitely done a very large amount of research (partly my personality), and I've also called in more than one expert who knows me and my child, and the day care center, and evaluates us.

 

It's actually an interesting issue, day care and how it affects children. There is more than one way to do it right, and different children respond differently. But day care at a good center is usually a positive experience, and better for later education. It is also been shown not to interfere, even a little, with parent-child bond. Not even a little. That, I already knew, just from my own past as a nanny and from custody evaluations in cases I've seen in my career. Parental influence is strong. It's not based on number of hours, but more on frequency of contact and also how constructive the influence is.

 

People do get pretty passionate about whether to work and put child in day care or whether to stay at home. I don't want to get into that debate in this thread, but there is a section for overall debates (like that one) here on LS I believe.

 

But I guess more to the point of this thread, no court is going to use that choice as a reason to take custody away from one parent and give it to the other. I already know that I am overwhelmingly likely to get sole custody IF either parent goes to court challenging the joint-custody situation. Courts cannot "keep" joint custody for us. Once one person objects to joint custody, sole goes to someone. And I know that's likely to be me. The position of "I don't work so I can spend time with the child" never works, but my ex already learned that early on in the parenting-plan stage so he likely wouldn't even try it this time.

 

The question is more, whether it makes sense to keep trying joint custody. It's pretty important to me to try to make things work, and to stay out of court. But it isn't working. The question is what to try, and whether trying is worth the time/effort/money.

 

Some people would just let ex fall on his face. He is applying for jobs and has (literally) $9 in his bank account. He says he has no idea how he'll afford day care if he gets a job. Some people would say, "Then too bad, let's give me more parenting-time since I can afford to both work and pay for day care or live-in nanny or flexible work hours." But, instead, I'm considering figuring out some pro rata payment system for day care when we both need it. But ex won't even talk to me about that. He gets emotional and feels cornered and has some maturity issues. I'd like to know how to work with someone like that, but I also have to live my own life and work and care for my son...

[jakrbbt]

And testmeasure, when you ask "how high quality a parent are you," I am guessing you're angry. Either at me for posting something that sounded short (I'm sorry for that, if it did, shouldn't post in a hurry). Or at another situation you've known of where a parent perhaps was not very attentive to their child.

 

But it's pretty serious to attack a mother's quality of parenting, esp one who's done what I have. Please, read some of my old threads where I was considering leaving my then-husband. I had a full-time job AND was a full time parent and house keeper except for a few hours twice a week when my ex would basically babysit . . . I breast fed, did all the overnight care, et c et c. The custody evaluator and three lawyers I talked to all said I had one of the strongest cases and was one of the best parents they'd seen (one said "dream client," one said "exquisitely strong case"), I had the head of a children's care and research center to testify about my parenting, judges and professors with well-adjusted children who knew me well, early-child therapist (whom I ran my decisions by-- including the decision to put child in day care).

 

All that and I'm still feeling the need to reply to someone on the internet attacking my parenting . . . psychology is remarkable. But there it is. I know this is the internet and you can sort of say things that you would not say in person, but go read some of my other threads first so it's at least founded. It's a pretty extreme comment to make to someone, and I would not make that comment to you. If you are basing it only on the fact that I have my son in two short days of day care, then you may want to go start a "rants and raves" thread instead on the day care issue because it just means you have an ideology that every parent should stay home with their child. That's not a basis though, for individually attacking the parenting of each individual who does not parent according to that ideology of yours.

[testmeasure]

I didn't mean to ask how high quality of a parent you are.

 

 

It sounds like in your own mind you are very high quality and he is very low quality. With nothing other than that to go on, what can I possibly say about that subject?

 

 

Also, suppose someone did ask whether you are a high quality parent. That would be kind of a trap, what is the right answer to a question like that?

 

 

Pretty much my whole position has been to accept everything you say, describe, and ask for, except for your end conclusion and then substitute the question of whether all of your own stuff could be used to support the opposite conclusion.

 

 

This seems like a question worth considering because pretty much all it takes to turn all of your whole position against yourself is to place more value on a parent because he is an actual parent.

 

 

Apparently your books, research, experience and personal knowledge of your ex all definitively tell you all tell you what I'm suggesting is impossible. Try and step outside of however high quality you are in your mind and reality, and however low quality he is. Try and step outside of all of your research and experience. I'm asking one simple question. What if the fact that he is an actual parent trumps all of that?

 

 

I had not considered how putting "stuff" in "quotes" comes across. I do that a lot and I'll have to think about it. Thanks for raising the subject.

 

 

 

 

.

Edited December 4, 2015 by testmeasure

[jakrbbt]

I hear you and that's why I wouldn't necessarily want to limit actual parenting time (visitation) even if we modified joint custody to sole custody (meaning legal right to make decisions re school, religion, medical). At least not unless there's neglect or abuse. I'd also actually welcome ex's input on custodial decisions if he'd be willing to give input. The problem is when one parent basically uses their end of joint custody to play games with and try to manipulate the other parent ("I won't agree to school unless you deliver diapers in middle of night and say we're best friends" etc etc), or otherwise makes it very difficult to even discuss or implement custodial plans.

 

There's just a lonnnnng history of that but granted, at this point I wouldn't expect anyone to have time to slog through my fifty thousand posts about ex's difficult behavior... Possibly I should have posted update on old thread rather than start new one.

 

So it would take a lot for me to want to limit actual visitation/time spent with child. That's different from joint versus sole custody, I should clarify.

 

Still a difficult decision and it will be hard for some time. My inclination is always to try to make things work. I'm doing that for now, and then when things quickly get weird or there's a flare-up, I often turn to people here on LS to check in.

 

Thanks for thoughtful reply.

[jakrbbt]

Situations like yours are why I don't believe in 50/50 custody when kids are so young. I don't think any pediatrician would advocate for such a hectic schedule as you describe. Love is very important but Consistency is very important also for the best development. Your ex's negative influence will forever be a part of your child's psyche. Your ex is like some hippie. What kinds of people is your ex friends with and does he bring those people around your child?

 

I'd document as much as possible and go for weekend visitation and a few evenings a week with you as the primary.

 

That's the rub with joint custody and 50-50 versus sole custody and 70-30... How to also have consistency.

 

I could compromise or navigate disagreements about schools/screen time/ nutrition and stuff. But it's a lot harder for me to "compromise" on something that we both think benefits our child when the only reason ex objects is "I'd rather sleep in" or "I'd rather not get a job."

 

Especially when I'm happy to then just take over the parts that take effort and money... Without going to court or reducing his visitation.

 

That's why I think he's not just unwilling to work, but also trying to maintain some relevance and hold over me by being obstinate and unforthcoming.

 

Also hard to do 50-50 when I don't know some basics because ex is unforthcoming. That would not bother me nearly as much if we weren't 50-50... But again, I'm concerned about too much inconsistency.

 

Still, he might come around and get a more stable situation. I hope.

 

Hippie is close-- I'd describe my ex as dry drunk. He's a long-time covering alcoholic and (since stopping going to AA years ago) acts like he's drinking but he's not. Treats his excessive sleep and cigars like he'd treat alcohol. I still hope he can work on that and function more.

Edited December 4, 2015 by jakrbbt