A year and a half later, an update.

[betrayedandhurting]

I have been through hell. The extent of my wife's betrayal was titanic, documented on this site and I've been lied to about the extent over and over again as she tried to protect herself and save the marriage. I found out even more for months after I stopped updating my thread. I doubt I will ever know the 100% truth. I would have sworn on a stack of bibles I would leave in an instant for half of what I found but I have stayed.

 

I stayed because I'm 100% sure she ended it instantly when I found out. She never blamed me, not once, and has been on her knees trying to save the marriage ever since. She has been in constant therapy for more than a year and a half and shows deep, deep remorse and has taken and accepted levels of anger on my part I simply didn't know I was capable of. She treats me like an entirely different woman now and is full of warmth and respect and I hope real love. I know some of the reasons I truly believe it happened and know it wasn't me. Despite daily pain for me our marriage has reached a very different place then it was before and frankly is all I've ever wanted if not for the knowledge of what has occurred weighing on me everyday.

 

It's the daily pain I want people to understand. Please don't stay unless your spouse turns their own 180. My wife now is incredible in the way she treats me. Daily affirmations of how lucky she is I stayed. Incredible attention to me and the children and running our household with happiness she even has the chance to do it rather than the previous resentment thinking she wasn't appreciated enough. A complete surrender to my need and desires in the marriage and in the bedroom with excitement and genuine desire. Date nights, vacations away from the kids, long household projects we have built together over months etc. have me looking at my wife with new found appreciation. Despite all this a year and a half in... my heart aches every single day. Every single day. It's so bizarre to love your wife so deeply, to genuinely be so amazed at how great you find your marriage but then instantly have your mind go back and torture you with the absolutely knowledge that this woman who seems so amazing and promised you so much is still the greatest liar you've ever known. It makes all the good stuff so much less. I hope it changes, it has to, but you know the 2-5 years they claim it takes. Sigh. Like I have said I honestly believe my wife's betrayals were among the worst I've heard of but she has also done many, many "right" things (other than the need to protect herself from the consequences of her betrayals by trickle truth which has been a big block obviously) and we are in a great place but I'm not truly happy. My kids are great and that's important to me.

 

That said... where is my line? Easy. Never, ever again. Anything. Any secret moving forward. A secret phone call with any man, an email... anything... doesn't have to be physical, doesn't have to even have a history... the slightest mistake tomorrow or 30 years from now I walk away. I don't care how much money I lose or the consequences on my kids, I know I can have a clean conscience I have done all I could and more than I ever should have to try and save this. The line in the sand going forward is nothing short of perfection. Hopefully in a year or two I can somehow say I've moved beyond this and I respect my marriage again, who knows.

 

Just an update. I'm still here.

[Krashi]

Amazing. I hope things improve. No one deserves abuse like this. I cannot wrap my puny brain around how someone that claims to love you could be so cruel.

Best to you , fellow.

[ShatteredLady]

Oh, I'm not having a good day! I'm sorry! I said that!!! I promised myself NEVER, NEVER not in the slightest would I ever take that abuse again! NEVER! N.E.V.E.R.!!!!!

 

Fast forward 12 years. So much life. So much living. 2 kids later. My brothers suicide, his mothers death. So very much life. Then he does it again!!!!! Same woman!!!! Just (OMG you can't say 'Just' it's so much worse!) an EA.

 

I want to say....NEVER say NEVER, you never know!

 

Ok. Stop my crap!!!

 

I got over it 12 years ago. I truly did. Time & life really can heal those wounds. A few years ago a friend of ours was caught by his W having online sex. My H said "Stupid, stupid man! He's risked everything for nothing!". OMG that meant the world! Then my friend had what I call "Itchy knicker syndrome" & got divorced. My H truly apologized to me. He recognized how hard it must be for me...he predicted triggers for me!! God I LOVED him!!! Words can express how WONDERFUL that healing felt!

 

Forget that the A-Hole screwed-up again...for those years it was worth it! Pretend I'm writing 11 years after his A & nothing I've posted on this forum happened.....the pain does fade & eventually vanish. I TRULY believe that things can be better after (never the same. I HATE that I lost my innocence & my love story) but there's something...if you squint a little & are prone to glass half full fantasy life...something to be said for surviving & working through the worst.

 

You KNOW that your love can survive torture....many don't KNOW that!

 

It does fade. The pain can be twisted & reformed into something different given time. Don't waste life & love "Just in case it happens again". Live today & everyday with love.....just don't make promises to yourself you might not be able to keep...it's a killer!

 

Say "I LOVE! & I will handle anything in the best possible way for ME, my life & my family!".

[Mr Mind of Shazam]

Sorry to hear of your enduring pain.

 

I honestly think nobody is worth bearing this burden. Nobody.

[betrayedandhurting]

Thanks Shattered, I sure am trying. My wife's daily efforts really are very, very visible and very different. I would have told you I had a "great" marriage before I discovered her affair but it's obvious now not only by what I found out but how our marriage is today that it was far from great. The honest truth is our marriage has become about us and now our kids revolve around us not the other way around. It really is a profound change and it feels so right it just is a daily kick in my nuts and knife in my heart to know what was the cause for change. My family is together. A beautiful home ready for the holiday, a wife calling and texting me every moment I am on the road to ask about my day and tell me all about hers, simple things like our whole family getting excited for our reserved IMAX seats to Star Wars etc. all would be lost if I hadn't stayed and if my wife didn't stop. But my God what I've lost that I can't get back. The two sides of this coin are pulling me hard in every direction but so far I believe I've made the right choice. Like I said it's just an update and I know now life has no guarantees.

Edited December 4, 2015 by betrayedandhurting

[66Charger]

A line made of dust.

[betrayedandhurting]

I really, really don't think so. I agree that I have no lines in the sand when it comes to the past betrayals and I still don't think I know 100% truth but I feel confident I will not hesitate to end my marriage if I ever go through any further betrayals.

 

Anyway my point in posting was just to give a status update and give an example of the pros and cons of trying to rebuild a crumbled marriage even with a remorseful partner giving their best. I've made my choice now it's just learning to live with the consequences.

[Horton]

I'm not familiar with your story so maybe I'm misunderstanding your initial post, but you appear to believe that she's still lying to you about the details of her affair correct? If that's the case then I don't understand how she can also be genuinely remorseful as well, doesn't one negate the other? Do you believe that she's only lying to you for your own good? I'm assuming you've already sat her down and explained to her how much more damaging it is for you to be TT'd in the long run. Could you possibly elaborate on this if you feel like doing so? If not then I understand.

[66Charger]

Horton, you dont want to read it.

 

For curious OP, exactly what kind of example do you think your update is?

 

Pro or Con?

Edited December 4, 2015 by 66Charger

[betrayedandhurting]

I absolutely believe at this point I know the full extent of timelines etc. I don't know that I'll ever hear the full truth of what was for example said negatively about me to each other, I know she downplays how into the sex etc. she was etc. I honestly believe I would do the same if I was in her position trying to save my marriage and reduce the pain of my spouse. I know what I need to know and when it comes to what I don't know, well sadly I know that too don't I? Assume the worst because it was.

 

At some point I needed to move forward and that took just over a year to decide to stop the all night question and answer sessions. I try to focus on my marriage as it is today and frankly I love how it is today, I'd be crazy happy if not for the knowledge that never goes away. I honestly think about it constantly even in the same moments I marvel at something awesome my wife is doing for me or the kids etc.

 

I didn't post to tell everyone "stay! You can fix your marriage like me!" or to say I think I've failed. Instead I am just painting picture of a marriage in healing with some very good progress but yep pain and fear that the damage may never allow life to be truly great again. Who knows, again it's just a status update, I've been silent for nearly a year here.

[Horton]

I absolutely believe at this point I know the full extent of timelines etc. I don't know that I'll ever hear the full truth of what was for example said negatively about me to each other, I know she downplays how into the sex etc. she was etc. I honestly believe I would do the same if I was in her position trying to save my marriage and reduce the pain of my spouse. I know what I need to know and when it comes to what I don't know, well sadly I know that too don't I? Assume the worst because it was.

Do you believe it would change your decision to reconcile if she eventually does someday reveal new details like you mentioned, the negative things said about you, her enjoying the affair sex more than she initially owned up to or is that just the "cost of doing business" at this point?

 

I didn't post to tell everyone "stay! You can fix your marriage like me!" or to say I think I've failed. Instead I am just painting picture of a marriage in healing with some very good progress but yep pain and fear that the damage may never allow life to be truly great again. Who knows, again it's just a status update, I've been silent for nearly a year here.

 

I'm sorry if my question was too brash, it just seemed like you were describing something akin to rug sweeping in my mind, but I suppose that just about every reconciliation probably has some element of the BS accepting living without the entire truth, even if it's only due to forgetfulness on the part of the WS. Thanks for the answer btw.

[betrayedandhurting]

No problem with the question. In a way I came back here to post what it looks like to reconcile after a bad LTA and it isn't always pretty.

 

Bottom line is this... If I found new details now I'd be furious and crushed just like every single time I'd learned more trickle truth but the truth is *I* know. I know if she admitted sleeping with the guy in my old bed a few times it really means all the time. I know that when she says she didn't talk about me much what it really means is she ripped me to shreds. It's what cheaters do in long affairs. I know how bad it was, it was every bit as bad as you can imagine. The only thing I believe is that neither was planning their affair as an exit, they were just narcissists living an attention fantasy that their real "humdrum" home life couldn't compete with.

 

Anyway I have spent a lot of time already talking about the past but honestly so many great things have happened now. I mean my wife is working so hard to make things better, incredible stuff. We can talk about all the bad stuff but if we do that you can't just ignore that good stuff is happening NOW.

 

My main issues now are finding away to be happy with the good stuff knowing the old bad stuff. I'm not really concerned about the future of her cheating because I honestly have the plan to just leave so it makes it simple. It's *living* happy with her I'm working on.

[drifter777]

Do you think your wife feels shame and guilt for what she did to you? If you think she does, do you suppose it hits her, painfully, every day - even the good days?

 

Yeah - I didn't think so. She got everything she wanted and is now enjoying a good marriage and family life. Who says a girl can't have it all?

 

Waiting for time to magically heal you is irrational but this is your path. You've settled for staying with the one who betrayed you. I don't know how you get used to that. I guess you just make the most of the good times and fake it when you have to.

[betrayedandhurting]

Do you think your wife feels shame and guilt for what she did to you? If you think she does, do you suppose it hits her, painfully, every day - even the good day?

 

My God, YES!!!! In particular the good days. We will just be sitting on the couch watching TV, out to dinner, playing with the kids... happy... nothing bad being talked about and she will become overwhelmed with emotion and tears and self loathing and tell me how sorry she is, how she would do anything to take it all back and to tell me how lucky she is I stayed. We could be having sex and she will suddenly become equally overwhelmed with emotion and just lose it. She writes me letters and tells me out of the blue how lucky she is etc. this isn't just her responding to my bad days but she sure does that too. You couldn't be more wrong.

 

That doesn't mean I'm happy. It doesn't do a damn thing to take it away. Maybe I have made the wrong choice, whatever... but I won't beat the woman down for anything other than what she is actually guilt of of. Remorse she has.

[Horton]

No problem with the question. In a way I came back here to post what it looks like to reconcile after a bad LTA and it isn't always pretty.

 

Bottom line is this... If I found new details now I'd be furious and crushed just like every single time I'd learned more trickle truth but the truth is *I* know. I know if she admitted sleeping with the guy in my old bed a few times it really means all the time. I know that when she says she didn't talk about me much what it really means is she ripped me to shreds. It's what cheaters do in long affairs. I know how bad it was, it was every bit as bad as you can imagine. The only thing I believe is that neither was planning their affair as an exit, they were just narcissists living an attention fantasy that their real "humdrum" home life couldn't compete with.

 

Anyway I have spent a lot of time already talking about the past but honestly so many great things have happened now. I mean my wife is working so hard to make things better, incredible stuff. We can talk about all the bad stuff but if we do that you can't just ignore that good stuff is happening NOW.

 

My main issues now are finding away to be happy with the good stuff knowing the old bad stuff. I'm not really concerned about the future of her cheating because I honestly have the plan to just leave so it makes it simple. It's *living* happy with her I'm working on.

 

I'll just quickly explain my thought process in asking you about your potential reaction to new information being revealed sometime in the future. Not to elicit a response from you now, but simply to elaborate on where I was coming from so you hopefully won't misunderstand my motives which I know can be hard to decipher in the written word and then I'll talk about less negative subjects in the rest of my post if that's acceptable.

 

What I sometimes wonder about is the potential dangers of a BS getting a new revelation dropped on their head(through confession or otherwise) years, sometimes decades later and this new revelation being seen as a "game changer" in the mind of the BS so much so that it unravels all of the hard work both the BS and WS have done together. If you don't feel like that's an issue you're worried about then fair enough.

 

Your other thread is 31 pages long so I figured I'd just ask you this now if that's alright, though I intend on reading your thread when I have more time so please forgive me if this has already been covered. What brought about this 180 in your wife's behavior toward you and the children? From the little bit of the first page of your previous thread that I quickly skimmed over it appears you're both Catholic and were in some sort of counseling together. Are you still in counseling now? Has your faith had a large role to play in the recovery of your marriage?

 

Edited: for misspelled word

Edited December 4, 2015 by Horton

[understand50]

betrayedandhurting,

 

Your story goes to show, that reconciling is not for the faint of heart. In someways, I feel that divorce for you would have been the easier path. I hope that what ever you are hoping and looking for happens. Your relationship will never be the same from before, but you still may find and do find happiness.

 

I wish you luck in your goal.

[merrmeade]

What I sometimes wonder about is the potential dangers of a BS getting a new revelation dropped on their head(through confession or otherwise) years, sometimes decades later and this new revelation being seen as a "game changer" in the mind of the BS so much so that it unravels all of the hard work both the BS and WS have done together. If you don't feel like that's an issue you're worried about then fair enough.

This is so speculative as to be meaningless. Is this a hypothetical question? Is your entire understanding of the process of recovery from betrayal and reconciliation based on an assessment of the affair? It's possible to understand why it happened and to believe that your spouse understands the important factors and will not repeat them. Sometimes that's enough.

[ShatteredLady]

Maybe it's my weakness. I'm still very confused in my life. I can't shake this belief that life & people are so much more complex than we like to believe on the forums I've visited. I truly believe you can't know anything really unless you're the person, living that moment, with all of their history, with all of their nature/nurture, romance, realism, delusions & dreams.

 

My brother committed suicide. I became forever changed & an only child in 1 telephone call. During the wake it was disclosed that my cousin had been sexually abused by her step father from the age of 11 & that's why he took his own life years before. Carrying my first baby I tripped & fell. When I tried to stand my left leg wouldn't 'work'. It was completely numb. As if the floor was a mirage AND it was agony! I learnt that I have an untreatable spinal degeneration condition. My H cheated on me twice with the same woman.

 

I don't list these things for pity. They were ALL very traumatic, life changing events. Think about how psychologically complex each of those events are for ALL of the people involved. It's called LIFE! We make choices. So many things happen that are completely out of our control...my 99 year old GreatGrandmother was hit by a bus & killed just over a month before her 100th birthday! She survived the London Blitz!!!

 

Stuff happens!! We can analyze it all we want. We do what we need to do to get us through the day. We choose what we want to believe in. We make a choice & do our best to make it work.

 

We should do our best not to hurt anyone & stay true to who we are. When those we love & trust & have FAITH in betray us it's life changing, it's huge. That doesn't change with our choices after D-Day. We are forever changed by someone's actions & we will never know how much thought & true emotions went into those 'choices' that cripple us so much.

 

It's still just *LIFE* & no-one can say what's right or wrong for us in these 'paths diverging in the woods' situations....

[Mr Blunt]

My main issues now are finding away to be happy with the good stuff knowing the old bad stuff. I'm not really concerned about the future of her cheating because I honestly have the plan to just leave so it makes it simple. It's *living* happy with her I'm working on.

 

 

 

 

You have made the decision to stay in the marriage and make the best of it. Take actions that keep you focused as much as possible on the “good stuff” Keep all thoughts and triggers away from you even if you have to be fanatical about that. That is one way to increase your happiness but remember to bury the “bad stuff” as much as possible.

 

 

Do not allow your mind to worry about her cheating again because you already have a plan to cover that if it happens. You will never be able to reconcile a healthy emotional state to your life by allowing the “bad stuff” to keep entering your mind and emotions.

 

 

Accentuate the positive eliminate the negative

 

 

You may think that the above is too simplistic to work but I ask you have you tried it for a long time?

[qubist]

is she still on IC? where is she as far as identifying her weakness and working on them? I hope you both realize that narcissism is not easily cured.

good luck

[Horton]

This is so speculative as to be meaningless. Is this a hypothetical question? Does your entire understanding of the process of recovery from betrayal and reconciliation consist of the fact of the affair? It's possible to understand why it happened and to believe that your spouse understands the important factors and will not repeat them. Sometimes that's enough.

 

I wasn't attempting to speculate with hypothetical questions so much as to understand OP's acceptance of never having been given the whole truth about what occurred and what this might entail for the potential success or failure of his attempts to reconcile with his wife. I've witnessed BS receive new(damaging) revelations, sometimes years later and it generally seems to lead them right back to square one, undoing most of their previous efforts to recover their marriage which I think is a real shame. I believe that's why TT has such a bad reputation and is typically considered to be a continuation of the same behavior/mindset that "allowed" the WS to justify having an affair in the first place. If this is not a concern for the OP then fair enough.

[aliveagain]

How have you been able to accept or live with the imbalance of power that was created by the humiliation your wife brought on you when she had her affair? How have you made intimacy special again after she misused your very special sex and freely gave it away to others? How special is sex to you now that you know that your wife traded it so easily for cheap attention from another man? Do you think you put a higher value on your intimacy than she did? Do you feel safe knowing that if the opportunity arouse and she thought she could get away with it she is more then willing to act on it?

Edited December 4, 2015 by aliveagain

[Krashi]

I really, really don't think so. I agree that I have no lines in the sand when it comes to the past betrayals and I still don't think I know 100% truth but I feel confident I will not hesitate to end my marriage if I ever go through any further betrayals.

 

Anyway my point in posting was just to give a status update and give an example of the pros and cons of trying to rebuild a crumbled marriage even with a remorseful partner giving their best. I've made my choice now it's just learning to live with the consequences.

 

I have read that 2-3 years in, a lot of folks who stay figure out they just can't do it. Apparently, some do, though. Leave yourself the option.

[Krashi]

This is so speculative as to be meaningless. Is this a hypothetical question? Is your entire understanding of the process of recovery from betrayal and reconciliation based on an assessment of the affair? It's possible to understand why it happened and to believe that your spouse understands the important factors and will not repeat them. Sometimes that's enough.

 

I think many of us have read stories that bear him out. I know I have seen many of them.

[Krashi]

How have you been able to accept or live with the imbalance of power that was created by the humiliation your wife brought on you when she had her affair? How have you made intimacy special again after she misused your very special sex and freely gave it away to others? How special is sex to you now that you know that your wife traded it so easily for cheap attention from another man? Do you think you put a higher value on your intimacy than she did? Do you feel safe knowing that if the opportunity arouse and she thought she could get away with it she is more then willing to act on it?

 

These are exactly the types of questions that would eat at me. People ,apparently, can get over some amazing things. I do not have that ability.