Rape culture.

[RedRobin]

Did you even read the wording of the law?

 

“Lack of protest or resistance does not mean consent, nor does silence mean consent. Affirmative consent must be ongoing throughout a sexual activity and can be revoked at any time.”

 

If we are all being honest here, many people don't really ask for sex anyway, it just happens. I have never once in my life came out and asked a woman if I can have sex with her. Now, not only must we come out and ask for sex like a child asks for candy, but as the part in bold states, we must continue asking for permission during the act of sex. This law reminds me of one of those stupid laws that have been on the books for 150 years and people laugh about. Except this law is new. Thanks to feminism, I, along with many other men posting in here, are technically rapists, according to their idiotic law.

 

Oh please. Now you are the one sounding ridiculous.

 

 

What they are trying to get to are people who have sex with those who are passed out.

 

 

All this gobbeldy gook you are dreaming up is likely based on overblown fears some guys might all of a sudden start to worry about if they've become accustomed to having sex with strangers or women they pick up in bars.

 

 

There is no crisis here... Just don't stick your d*ck in a stranger, and you are probably A-OK. Sorry. I realize lots of guys have become accustomed to not having consequences for ONS, etc... but you know... fair is fair.

[RedRobin]

Based on how the law is written, the onus is on the man to prove he is not a criminal. This is unlike any other law I can think of, where we are deemed innocent until proven guilty. Luckily, most women are not like the nut jobs that push for laws like this one, so most guys don't have to worry. This is all just another reason to stay away from California. They're doing their best to destroy dating out there.

 

 

haha... 'dating'. You mean, total strangers having sex with each other is called 'dating'... ok.

 

 

California? They invented the hook up culture, lol. Maybe not a surprise that they had to s.p.e.l.l. things out, because, oh... maybe in other states people don't eff randoms with half the frequency that good 'ol CA does.

 

 

Gotta love it.

[sambolini]

don't stick your d*ck in a stranger;)

 

Likewise, women should not consensually accept a stranger's dick. I mean, if they don't know the guy, then who knows what could happen?

 

Like you said, fair is fair.

[sambolini]

Based on how the law is written, the onus is on the man to prove he is not a criminal. This is unlike any other law I can think of, where we are deemed innocent until proven guilty. Luckily, most women are not like the nut jobs that push for laws like this one, so most guys don't have to worry. This is all just another reason to stay away from California. They're doing their best to destroy dating out there.

 

Pretty much. I'm from Oregon, but I never go to California. Have no reason to.

 

Well, I've thought about flying down to southern Cali and staying at a resort, just...because. Why not? But you can be darned sure I wouldn't touch a woman with a ten foot pole while down there. No orgasm is worth that much trouble and a potentially life-changing false accusation.

[jay1983]

Pretty much. I'm from Oregon, but I never go to California. Have no reason to.

 

Well, I've thought about flying down to southern Cali and staying at a resort, just...because. Why not? But you can be darned sure I wouldn't touch a woman with a ten foot pole while down there. No orgasm is worth that much trouble and a potentially life-changing false accusation.

 

You have a better chance of being struck by lightning.

[Rejected Rosebud]

I have been accused of victim blaming on this very website for suggesting that women take practical steps to avoid becoming a victim of rape. Carrying a weapon, avoiding dangerous situations, ect.

If you're suggesting it in a context where the act of rape is being discussed, that's not appropriate. USUALLY, and I have seen it on this site more than once, there is a clear implication that a woman SHOULD have done whatever, and then she WOULDN'T have been raped. That is victim blaming.

 

This is one example of how feminism affects dating:

 

California Love: Only Yes Means Yes For Sexual Consent

 

How is that an example of how feminism affects dating? I think it is an example, and a result of how rape has affected the concept of consensual sex. If rape wasn't such an issue, this would not be necessary. It has nothing to do with feminism. I'm sure glad I don't live in California though, that doesn't sound very sexy to me.

 

Aside from the fact that unlike every other instance of crime in the world, the onus is now on the accused to prove that they committed no crime.

Well ... this has NOTHING to do with the California law. And it's not true.

 

Fortunately, now a rape victim can at least be an "eye witness" to her own rape and her word can count, which is a new development. In very recent history it was quite difficult for a woman to be able to prove that she had been raped. It is a very shameful experience to go through; the steps to PROVE that you've been raped. Believe me, there is a good reason that only 2% of accusations of rape are false, a woman (or a man) would have to be completely nuts to put themselves through that just for revenge or attention.

 

Anyway, there is no way I am going to get into a discussion of false rape accusations in the same post where actual rape is being discussed.

Edited December 17, 2015 by Rejected Rosebud

[RedRobin]

Likewise, women should not consensually accept a stranger's dick. I mean, if they don't know the guy, then who knows what could happen?

 

Like you said, fair is fair.

 

 

Um, lots of them aren't... consensually accepting a stranger's d*ck. That's why they have to spell it out, I guess, because some (usually guys) are THAT clueless.

 

 

'Oh, he/she is passed out, guess I can do whatever I want"

 

 

You forget that men get raped too.

 

 

I get it though... if all of a sudden you (as a guy) have been living life without a care in the world and OMG you actually have to exercise discretion and good judgment for a change. Dang, I'm sure that feels like SUCH an imposition!

 

 

Someone call the whaaaam-bulance...

 

 

... and those guys who are worried about this law changing 'dating' (or whatever they think is 'dating', hardy, har, har)... then, yea, blame the rapists. Its the bad apples that ruin things for the whole bushel.

Edited December 17, 2015 by RedRobin

[Rejected Rosebud]

That being said laws should not be vague and open to interpretation. If it is just a big grey area that nobody really understands then all it does is make every single male into a suspected rapist.

 

THAT IS EXACTLY WHY THAT CALIFORNIA LAW HAPPENED.

 

To eliminate grey areas.

 

It's too bad it had to come to that, but if people having sex can't be sure that the other person is 100% all in favor, then they need to just not have sex. I don't understand why anybody thinks this is "for feminists." It seems to be mostly for people who need to have clear parameters for what consensual sex is.

[RedRobin]

Guys who wanna have sex with randoms??

 

 

Hire an escort if you are that worried about it.

 

 

... and I'm not a fan of casual sex anyway... REALLY not a fan of random guys and strangers trying to pressure me for sex and pretending that is dating.

 

 

So sad too bad for guys who wanna fly down to wherever and pick up someone for a weekend of fun. Don't feel sorry for you. Maybe fly to Vegas or.... Thailand. I hear you can get 'em young there and no one will bat an eyelash. (that's a whole other topic that doesn't belong on a thread talking about 'dating').

 

 

Ok, so here's a question... What DO you consider dating exactly? I've already volunteered that I don't expect guys to pay my share when I am getting to know him... but now I'm getting the impression that some of these guys whining about paying are also whining about consequences of having sex with someone they don't know very well.

 

 

Boy, talk about whining.

Edited December 17, 2015 by RedRobin

[hellohellohello]

All she has to do is say "he raped me", in spite of the fact she enthusiastically gave her consent during. But with no documentation to that effect, it's his word against hers. Who would the courts believe based on how the law is written?

 

This is so ridiculous. First of all, young women today especially don't like to think of themselves as victims, and most refuse to accept that they've been raped even they have been penetrated without their consent (with or without drugs or alcohol). The implication that a woman would thoughtlessly say "he raped me" is just based on the paranoia that "feminists" (by which some people seem to mean women who disagree with them) are out to get men.

 

Second of all, rape is difficult to prove, and the only time a woman won't receive accusations that she's lying (or "asking for it") is if she was a known pious young virgin or was gang-raped, and sometimes not even then. The fact that most women in the western hemisphere have relative sexual freedom puts them at a disadvantage when it comes to being believed when they say they've been raped, because that lifestyle doesn't fit some people's definition of "real rape victim." Just take celebrities like Madonna, Lady Gaga, Kesha, and Lena Dunham. Do you believe them when they say they were raped when they were younger? Do you think you'd find their story more plausible if they'd since abstained from sex, chose clothing that covered everything from the neck down, and acted scared all the time?

 

All the law is trying to do, really, is to bring awareness that lack of no doesn't equal yes. I actually had an encounter recently when someone didn't quite say no to me, but he didn't say yes either. So although I really wanted him, I decided it wasn't enough and I walked away, and then I remembered this law and realized why it was needed in the first place. Of course in an ideal world all people are decent and not try to find loopholes to fulfill their own desires at the expense of someone else's freedom, but this is what our world really is like.

[hellohellohello]

So sad too bad for guys who wanna fly down to wherever and pick up someone for a weekend of fun. Don't feel sorry for you. Maybe fly to Vegas or.... Thailand. I hear you can get 'em young there and no one will bat an eyelash. (that's a whole other topic that doesn't belong on a thread talking about 'dating').

 

I don't support the idea of sex tourism and prostitution since they go hand in hand with human (mostly child) trafficking.

 

Fact: In countries where people who go to prostitute (instead of the prostitutes themselves) are criminalized, the rate of human trafficking goes down.

[Woggle]

Guys who wanna have sex with randoms??

 

 

Hire an escort if you are that worried about it.

 

 

... and I'm not a fan of casual sex anyway... REALLY not a fan of random guys and strangers trying to pressure me for sex and pretending that is dating.

 

 

So sad too bad for guys who wanna fly down to wherever and pick up someone for a weekend of fun. Don't feel sorry for you. Maybe fly to Vegas or.... Thailand. I hear you can get 'em young there and no one will bat an eyelash. (that's a whole other topic that doesn't belong on a thread talking about 'dating').

 

 

Ok, so here's a question... What DO you consider dating exactly? I've already volunteered that I don't expect guys to pay my share when I am getting to know him... but now I'm getting the impression that some of these guys whining about paying are also whining about consequences of having sex with someone they don't know very well.

 

 

Boy, talk about whining.

 

It doesn't matter what people feel about casual hook ups. Like them or not they are not the same thing as rape. Some feminists seem to want treat all men the way Trump treats Muslims or Mexican immigrants. I don't think that women should be blamed for rape either no matter what their lifestyle is like . Enforce the laws on the books instead of creating ones that are just an excuse for some to treat every man as a suspected rapist.

[lollipopspot]

Enforce the laws on the books instead of creating ones that are just an excuse for some to treat every man as a suspected rapist.

 

Yeah, it's not working, hence the need for more clarity in the law.

 

"In a study of undergraduate women, 19% experienced attempted or completed sexual assault since entering college."

 

A significant portion of men seem to not understand consent.

 

If the numbers of women who are sexually assaulted don't indicate that we live in a rape culture, I don't know what would. I mean, change the laws to be that explicit, or change the culture - including objectifying and violent pornography - so that a significant proportion of males don't grow up thinking that violation is sexy.

[joystickd]

Very interesting article written by a woman

The myth of the college ?rape culture? | New York Post

[joystickd]

Yeah, it's not working, hence the need for more clarity in the law.

 

"In a study of undergraduate women, 19% experienced attempted or completed sexual assault since entering college."

 

A significant portion of men seem to not understand consent.

 

If the numbers of women who are sexually assaulted don't indicate that we live in a rape culture, I don't know what would. I mean, change the laws to be that explicit, or change the culture - including objectifying and violent pornography - so that a significant proportion of males don't grow up thinking that violation is sexy.

Rape culture lol

 

RAINN, the Anti-Sexual-Violence Organization, Rejects 'Rape Culture' Hysteria

 

 

A Quote from the article that women like you should think about.

 

By blaming so-called rape culture, we implicate all men in a social atrocity, trivialize the experiences of survivors, and deflect blame from the rapists truly responsible for sexual violence. RAINN explains that the trend of focusing on rape culture “has the paradoxical effect of making it harder to stop sexual violence, since it removes the focus from the individual at fault, and seemingly mitigates personal responsibility for his or her own actions.”

[joystickd]

Another interesting read

Statistics Don't Back Up Claims About 'Rape Culture' - US News

[xxoo]

Rape culture lol

 

RAINN, the Anti-Sexual-Violence Organization, Rejects 'Rape Culture' Hysteria

 

 

A Quote from the article that women like you should think about.

 

By blaming so-called rape culture, we implicate all men in a social atrocity, trivialize the experiences of survivors, and deflect blame from the rapists truly responsible for sexual violence. RAINN explains that the trend of focusing on rape culture “has the paradoxical effect of making it harder to stop sexual violence, since it removes the focus from the individual at fault, and seemingly mitigates personal responsibility for his or her own actions.”

 

I don't think it implicates all men. I think it implicates ideas surrounding consent--for example, that it's just fine to get sexual with very drunk girls who did not want sex with you before getting very drunk, or to push women saying "no" into sexual situations as long as they aren't fighting you off.

 

I had a date-rapey experience in HS which did not involve alcohol, with the boy I was dating (but not willing to have sex with). My "no" was clear. Parents came home unexpectedly and saved me from having to physically protect myself.

 

I had a weird alcohol related experience in college. Got drunk with a few friends. Got sick. One friend offered to accompany me to the bathroom and "help" me while got sick. While I'm puking, he put his hand under my shirt and felt me up This is funny to me, because I'm twisted that way, but it points out just how far some guys will go to take advantage of a drunk girl.

 

Neither of these guys ever got seriously called out on their behavior. The latter, I did verbally confront him in a "WTF?!" way the next morning, but I never labeled it sexual assault. Which I guess it was.

[hellohellohello]

Very interesting article written by a woman

The myth of the college ?rape culture? | New York Post

 

No, what's interesting is that some men like to quote women who share their views as some sort of proof that they're right, and dismiss women who DON'T share their views as "feminists" and all the negative stereotypes that entail.

 

Rape culture isn't the idea that rape happens a lot, or that all men are potential rapists, or that rapists aren't responsible for their personal decisions. Rape culture is just the idea that we live in a culture that trivializes rape and encourages men (at this point it's still men) to use sexual violence against both women and other men to assert their power.

 

Rape culture is the reason people think prison jokes are funny, the reason pimps don't get the bad rap they deserve even though the basis of their business is sketchy if not downright immoral, the reason movies can get away with lines like "does she put up a fight" (Grease) and scenes of a man forcing himself on a reluctant woman (Rocky) and of boy forcing a kiss on a girl who DOES fight back (The Sandlot). It's also the reason we have people like Mike Tyson and Roman Polanski still thriving in their industry despite being convicted of rape, which supposedly is the most abominable crime of all.

 

Of course rapists are fully responsible for their actions, and I don't think ANYONE has been denying that. Acknowledging that we live in rape culture, though, means we're acknowledging a problem and can at least try to take steps to fix it.

[joystickd]

I don't think it implicates all men. I think it implicates ideas surrounding consent--for example, that it's just fine to get sexual with very drunk girls who did not want sex with you before getting very drunk, or to push women saying "no" into sexual situations as long as they aren't fighting you off.

 

I had a date-rapey experience in HS which did not involve alcohol, with the boy I was dating (but not willing to have sex with). My "no" was clear. Parents came home unexpectedly and saved me from having to physically protect myself.

 

I had a weird alcohol related experience in college. Got drunk with a few friends. Got sick. One friend offered to accompany me to the bathroom and "help" me while got sick. While I'm puking, he put his hand under my shirt and felt me up This is funny to me, because I'm twisted that way, but it points out just how far some guys will go to take advantage of a drunk girl.

 

Neither of these guys ever got seriously called out on their behavior. The latter, I did verbally confront him in a "WTF?!" way the next morning, but I never labeled it sexual assault. Which I guess it was.

You don't think it does but it becomes a problem because it widens the divide between men and women. The very fact that it's deemed a culture takes personal responsibility away from that man and woman. Then it makes all men seem like we are looking to rape women. Now everything gets put under the microscope even song lyrics. Women go out into the world now every man is looked at as a potential rapist. How does that help a woman's cause when a male has been indoctrinated since youth about rape?

[joystickd]

No, what's interesting is that some men like to quote women who share their views as some sort of proof that they're right, and dismiss women who DON'T share their views as "feminists" and all the negative stereotypes that entail.

 

Rape culture isn't the idea that rape happens a lot, or that all men are potential rapists, or that rapists aren't responsible for their personal decisions. Rape culture is just the idea that we live in a culture that trivializes rape and encourages men (at this point it's still men) to use sexual violence against both women and other men to assert their power.

 

Rape culture is the reason people think prison jokes are funny, the reason pimps don't get the bad rap they deserve even though the basis of their business is sketchy if not downright immoral, the reason movies can get away with lines like "does she put up a fight" (Grease) and scenes of a man forcing himself on a reluctant woman (Rocky) and of boy forcing a kiss on a girl who DOES fight back (The Sandlot). It's also the reason we have people like Mike Tyson and Roman Polanski still thriving in their industry despite being convicted of rape, which supposedly is the most abominable crime of all.

 

Of course rapists are fully responsible for their actions, and I don't think ANYONE has been denying that. Acknowledging that we live in rape culture, though, means we're acknowledging a problem and can at least try to take steps to fix it.

There is no culture especially since a male has been indoctrinated since youth about rape. Culture in a sense takes away the personal responsibility now the real rapist has an excuse for their behavior. Thanks for taking away personal responsibility

[thefooloftheyear]

No, what's interesting is that some men like to quote women who share their views as some sort of proof that they're right, and dismiss women who DON'T share their views as "feminists" and all the negative stereotypes that entail.

 

Rape culture isn't the idea that rape happens a lot, or that all men are potential rapists, or that rapists aren't responsible for their personal decisions. Rape culture is just the idea that we live in a culture that trivializes rape and encourages men (at this point it's still men) to use sexual violence against both women and other men to assert their power.

 

Rape culture is the reason people think prison jokes are funny, the reason pimps don't get the bad rap they deserve even though the basis of their business is sketchy if not downright immoral, the reason movies can get away with lines like "does she put up a fight" (Grease) and scenes of a man forcing himself on a reluctant woman (Rocky) and of boy forcing a kiss on a girl who DOES fight back (The Sandlot). It's also the reason we have people like Mike Tyson and Roman Polanski still thriving in their industry despite being convicted of rape, which supposedly is the most abominable crime of all.

 

Of course rapists are fully responsible for their actions, and I don't think ANYONE has been denying that. Acknowledging that we live in rape culture, though, means we're acknowledging a problem and can at least try to take steps to fix it.

 

I don't know what culture you live in, but here no one "trivializes' rape....

 

Here is where a problem can arise, though...

 

I found out through a friend that someone we knew got thrown in jail....When I asked this friend what had happened he said he is being held on a rape charge..Seemed surprising to both of us because while I didn't know him too well, he didn't seem like the sexual predator type...In fact, good looking and well built guy that I wouldn't think would need to twist many arms, if that's what he is looking for..he didn't strike me as a player or anything either, but TBH I didn't know him too well..

 

Anyway, here is what happened...

 

He met a woman in a bar...They went back to her place and had consensual sex...typical ONS, that happens in everywhere USA...More so now than ever in the current hook up culture we live in..Well...I don't know if it was a case of him not calling her back the next day or immediately proclaiming them bf/gf,. whatever..I dunno,,,Out of the blue she claims he raped her...He gets thrown in jail...Had to hire an attorney to clear his name and dump the charge..

 

He got exonerated, but the lawyer cost him 25K and he cant do anything about the jail time....I know that some of you all are gonna say "serves him right, he probably took advantage of her"..>That may or may not be the case....And that may make him a douche bag, but doesn't make him a rapist, and aren't feminists fighting for not slut shaming a woman for grabbing some easy dick? ...This gets confusing to some guys..

 

I dunno....I guess its better to err on the side of caution, I suppose...But just like the Duke University rape case...This stuff can wind up causing a guy a world of shyt...

 

Measure twice and cut once, I guess..

 

TFY

[Toodaloo]

I found out through a friend that someone we knew got thrown in jail....When I asked this friend what had happened he said he is being held on a rape charge..Seemed surprising to both of us because while I didn't know him too well, he didn't seem like the sexual predator type...In fact, good looking and well built guy that I wouldn't think would need to twist many arms, if that's what he is looking for..he didn't strike me as a player or anything either, but TBH I didn't know him too well..

 

Anyway, here is what happened...

 

He met a woman in a bar...They went back to her place and had consensual sex...typical ONS, that happens in everywhere USA...More so now than ever in the current hook up culture we live in..Well...I don't know if it was a case of him not calling her back the next day or immediately proclaiming them bf/gf,. whatever..I dunno,,,Out of the blue she claims he raped her...He gets thrown in jail...Had to hire an attorney to clear his name and dump the charge..

 

He got exonerated, but the lawyer cost him 25K and he cant do anything about the jail time....I know that some of you all are gonna say "serves him right, he probably took advantage of her"..>That may or may not be the case....And that may make him a douche bag, but doesn't make him a rapist, and aren't feminists fighting for not slut shaming a woman for grabbing some easy dick? ...This gets confusing to some guys..

 

 

Everyone knows a guy who knows a guy this has happened to.

 

Personally I know more who have actually done it than not.

 

Rapists come in all shapes and sizes.

 

I know a guy who was gang raped by 6 hetrosexual males. He is 6ft6 built like a brick poo house and not a "victim".

 

He was out jogging and they jumped him and did horrific things to him. The physical damage alone took over 6 months to heal. The mental scars a heck of a lot longer.

 

He was brave took it all the way. Case got thrown out because the guys were hetro and smaller than their victim so no one believed him despite all the evidence and scarring.

 

Ask any and every woman and they will all tell you they have been in awkward situations and had to fight etc their way out of them. Some men have too. If you think that rape is a female problem think again my friend. Its not.

 

Anyway I digress and this whole thread has wound me up so I am going to calmer climes...

[xxoo]

You don't think it does but it becomes a problem because it widens the divide between men and women. The very fact that it's deemed a culture takes personal responsibility away from that man and woman. Then it makes all men seem like we are looking to rape women. Now everything gets put under the microscope even song lyrics. Women go out into the world now every man is looked at as a potential rapist. How does that help a woman's cause when a male has been indoctrinated since youth about rape?

 

I didn't go out looking at my HS boyfriend or friend in college as a potential rapist. They didn't think what they were doing was wrong, either. The culture told them it was ok to push past a girl's very clear "no" and keep trying for sex, and to touch a girl who is drunk sexually (even if she is vomiting at the moment). They really didn't see anything wrong with it. Boys being boys. The culture accepted these behaviors, and that's why it is being called a rape culture. We need to teach young men that these things are not consent, and are in fact sexual assault---because the culture taught them otherwise.

[thefooloftheyear]

Everyone knows a guy who knows a guy this has happened to.

 

Personally I know more who have actually done it than not.

 

Rapists come in all shapes and sizes.

 

I know a guy who was gang raped by 6 hetrosexual males. He is 6ft6 built like a brick poo house and not a "victim".

 

He was out jogging and they jumped him and did horrific things to him. The physical damage alone took over 6 months to heal. The mental scars a heck of a lot longer.

 

He was brave took it all the way. Case got thrown out because the guys were hetro and smaller than their victim so no one believed him despite all the evidence and scarring.

 

Ask any and every woman and they will all tell you they have been in awkward situations and had to fight etc their way out of them. Some men have too. If you think that rape is a female problem think again my friend. Its not.

 

Anyway I digress and this whole thread has wound me up so I am going to calmer climes...

 

I won't call you a liar, but if someone my size walked into a police station claiming I was raped by a woman I'd picture every patrolman falling off their chairs in laughter and then asking me if she had any friends..

 

Not buying it, or there is a part of the story you weren't privy to, sorry..

 

TFY

[sambolini]

As a man, I simply haven't observed rape culture. If there is a culture of men who trivialize traitsrape, and if it's as prevalent as feminists claim, then I'd imagine at some point in my 36 years of existence I would have encountered a man who belongs to said rape culture. This man would have said something, such as "Let's go rape some ladies" or "I was raping this chick last night", or even "If you want sex, just take it, even if they say no".

 

At some point, somewhere, I would have encountered another man who has been influenced by this rape culture, and who would have said or done something that indicated he belonged to that culture.

 

It has not happened once. Yes, I also went to college. And not one single time have I encountered this so-called "culture of rape" among men.

 

I have not directly observed evidence to support this claim. And you'd think I would have, since feminists claim is very prevalent.

 

At the end of the day, I cannot accept someone's claim if I haven't observed direct evidence of said claim. It's precisely for that reason why I'm also an atheist.

 

So I can come to only two possible conclusions: 1) rape culture doesn't exist, or 2) it's not nearly as prevalent as feminists claim.