Woggle Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 I would have been better off raised by wolves than the household I grew up in and even then I knew from a young age that trying to force myself on a woman or touching her without her permission was wrong and so did most of my friends. No decent man is against punishing men who do these things but what these new feminists you see on campuses seem to want is for every man to be suspected rapist and to blur the line between sex and rape so much that literally any intimate interaction between the genders can be considered rape if she thinks it is. A lot of men including myself just sense a hidden agenda with a lot of these modern SJW kind of feminists. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author sambolini Posted December 17, 2015 Author Share Posted December 17, 2015 I would have been better off raised by wolves than the household I grew up in and even then I knew from a young age that trying to force myself on a woman or touching her without her permission was wrong and so did most of my friends. No decent man is against punishing men who do these things but what these new feminists you see on campuses seem to want is for every man to be suspected rapist and to blur the line between sex and rape so much that literally any intimate interaction between the genders can be considered rape if she thinks it is. A lot of men including myself just sense a hidden agenda with a lot of these modern SJW kind of feminists. Precisely. This is why I don't date feminists. I'm not interested in a woman who views all men as potential rapists. It's no different than women who don't date men who believe that all women will clean him out in divorce. They have that right, as do I. There is absolutely a hidden agenda. Link to post Share on other sites
lollipopspot Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 (edited) Very interesting article written by a woman The myth of the college ?rape culture? | New York Post I don't care who it was written by, it's irrelevant. Here's a response though Rape Culture Is Real - TIME My réponse has to do with an industry that has managed to be almost wholly separate from social analysis - pornography - which often glorifies rape and abuse of women as sexy. As soon as you put it in the realm of sex it seems to be off limits to social analysis. Edited December 17, 2015 by lollipopspot Link to post Share on other sites
PrettyEmily77 Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Any law enforcement related to (non) consensual sex affects anyone, man or woman, of any sexual orientation - a good thing, surely - so I don't quite get this fixation some men have about being viewed as potential rapists. Not very many women think that way, and those that aren't necessarily 'feminists' anyway... It's a fact that rapes are mostly perpetuated by hetero males, but the law is appplicable to all. If you're not a potential rapist then it doesn't apply to you. Simples. Link to post Share on other sites
Author sambolini Posted December 17, 2015 Author Share Posted December 17, 2015 Any law enforcement related to (non) consensual sex affects anyone, man or woman, of any sexual orientation - a good thing, surely - so I don't quite get this fixation some men have about being viewed as potential rapists. Not very many women think that way, and those that aren't necessarily 'feminists' anyway... It's a fact that rapes are mostly perpetuated by hetero males, but the law is appplicable to all. If you're not a potential rapist then it doesn't apply to you. Simples. Tell that to the FBI. Males Can't Be "Forcibly Raped"-- According to the FBI | Colorlines Link to post Share on other sites
Woggle Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Most people have no issue with laws against rape but many don't trust the agenda of those who push these types of laws. They seem like things designed to trap men who fall off a very thin tight rope. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author sambolini Posted December 17, 2015 Author Share Posted December 17, 2015 Most people have no issue with laws against rape but many don't trust the agenda of those who push these types of laws. They seem like things designed to trap men who fall off a very thin tight rope. It really all comes down to choice. You have the choice to not engage in sexual congress with any woman whom you are not comfortable doing so. Don't have sex in California, and don't have sex with a feminist. Don't have sex with a stranger if drugs and/or alcohol has been consumed by either party. No orgasm is worth the consequences. Link to post Share on other sites
lollipopspot Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 It really all comes down to choice. You have the choice to not engage in sexual congress with any woman whom you are not comfortable doing so. Now if only women could have the choice not to be raped and not to be targeted for rape. It would be great if women could move as freely in society as men. Stranger rape may not be as common, but it is always a threat. It isn't as common because women have generally already taken themselves out of danger and in the process curtailed their freedom. Link to post Share on other sites
Author sambolini Posted December 17, 2015 Author Share Posted December 17, 2015 Now if only women could have the choice not to be raped and not to be targeted for rape. It would be great if women could move as freely in society as men. Stranger rape may not be as common, but it is always a threat. It isn't as common because women have generally already taken themselves out of danger and in the process curtailed their freedom. Based on stats I posted earlier in this thread, men are the most victims of homicide. I can just as easily say that I am not any more free than you are, because I don't want to be shot and killed. There are many places I don't go based on that premise. In any case, your argument doesn't invalidate mine in any way. If you're a man, don't have sex in California, don't have sex with a feminist, and don't have sex with a stranger under the influence. Link to post Share on other sites
PrettyEmily77 Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Tell that to the FBI. Males Can't Be "Forcibly Raped"-- According to the FBI | Colorlines So that makes it a societal issue rather and a 'feminist' one, I would think... 1 Link to post Share on other sites
lollipopspot Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Based on stats I posted earlier in this thread, men are the most victims of homicide. I can just as easily say that I am not any more free than you are, because I don't want to be shot and killed. There are many places I don't go based on that premise. It would be complete denial to say that men are just as careful as women, or need to be. There are relatively safe areas in my city. Men walk around them with ease at night (really everywhere in my city). Yet, no solo women to be found (and when they are, they're not that comfortable but can't find other means of transportation - you can bet it's not just taking an evening stroll). Women often ask for escorts to their cars...by solo men. Men are often victims of homicide because they get into fights. Men also actually use their freedom and walk around in areas alone at night where no woman would even dare. Link to post Share on other sites
BlueIris Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 I see no problem with men deciding not to date feminists or women that they believe view them as rapists or potential rapists. That’s good, smart. Don’t date people you don’t like or trust. That’s dating 101. I didn’t date men that said things or did things that I didn’t like or feel comfortable with either. So it all works out. A guy put his hand between my legs from behind at a party in college. Actually he was a guy like TFY described, “good looking and well built,” the kind that lots of guys think “should be” getting sex easily, “shouldn’t have to” rape or assault anyone. He was a sports star at our school. And he sure believed that he “should” be getting whatever he wanted. So anyway, I grabbed his hand, yanked his finger back hard and sharp, and crack! Tell a guy he should be getting sex easily and girls should be falling into his lap and you end up with one entitled and dangerous guy who ALSO believes he should get sex easily. He missed the rest of the season. Oh, and CA isn't the only state that has a "Yes Means Yes" law. NY does too. Many other legislatures have introduced similar bills. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author sambolini Posted December 17, 2015 Author Share Posted December 17, 2015 Men are often victims of homicide because they get into fights. Pure speculation. Prove this assertion. Link to post Share on other sites
Author sambolini Posted December 17, 2015 Author Share Posted December 17, 2015 So that makes it a societal issue rather and a 'feminist' one, I would think... You'd think, but... https://toysoldier.wordpress.com/2015/09/05/mary-koss-doesnt-think-women-can-rape-men-and-boys/ Link to post Share on other sites
Author sambolini Posted December 17, 2015 Author Share Posted December 17, 2015 Pure speculation. Prove this assertion. In addition, your post completely minimizes the fact that innocent men are being killed. As in, deprived of life. And you still expect me to believe that feminists care about men? Your attitude clearly indicates you don't give a ****. Which is fine, you don't have to. Just don't blatantly lie and tell us you care about men's issues when you obviously don't. Feminism doesn't give a damn about men. You've clearly proven that. Which has been my assertion all along. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
lollipopspot Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 In addition, your post completely minimizes the fact that innocent men are being killed. As in, deprived of life. And you still expect me to believe that feminists care about men? Your attitude clearly indicates you don't give a ****. Which is fine, you don't have to. Just don't blatantly lie and tell us you care about men's issues when you obviously don't. Feminism doesn't give a damn about men. You've clearly proven that. Which has been my assertion all along. Men are not targeted for assault because they are men. Rape is the equivalent of a hate crime against women. Notice that it's men who are both killing other men and raping and killing women, for the most part. I'm not sure why you think it's some slur or speculation to state that men are more aggressive and get in more physical fights than women - how is this something you are unaware of? https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-scientific-fundamentalist/200807/why-are-almost-all-criminals-men-part-i You sure use a lot of hyperbole though. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author sambolini Posted December 17, 2015 Author Share Posted December 17, 2015 Men are not targeted for assault because they are men. Rape is the equivalent of a hate crime against women. I'm not sure why you think it's some slur or speculation to state that men are more aggressive and get in more physical fights than women - how is this something you are unaware of? https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-scientific-fundamentalist/200807/why-are-almost-all-criminals-men-part-i You sure use a lot of hyperbole though. That in no way suggests that men are killed because they fight. Lollipop, you're a misandrist. Plain and simple. And a perfect example of why feminists who claim feminism cares about men too is a complete and utter lie. You don't care about men. Like I said, that's fine. It simply illustrates how feminists who say feminism cares about men too are liars. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
xxoo Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 As a man, I simply haven't observed rape culture. If there is a culture of men who trivialize traitsrape, and if it's as prevalent as feminists claim, then I'd imagine at some point in my 36 years of existence I would have encountered a man who belongs to said rape culture. This man would have said something, such as "Let's go rape some ladies" or "I was raping this chick last night", or even "If you want sex, just take it, even if they say no". At some point, somewhere, I would have encountered another man who has been influenced by this rape culture, and who would have said or done something that indicated he belonged to that culture. It has not happened once. Yes, I also went to college. And not one single time have I encountered this so-called "culture of rape" among men. I have not directly observed evidence to support this claim. And you'd think I would have, since feminists claim is very prevalent. At the end of the day, I cannot accept someone's claim if I haven't observed direct evidence of said claim. It's precisely for that reason why I'm also an atheist. So I can come to only two possible conclusions: 1) rape culture doesn't exist, or 2) it's not nearly as prevalent as feminists claim. 3) the men who are raping don't consider it rape, because rape culture has taught them that it's ok to pressure girls past "no" and to take advantage of drunk women. The men don't consider it rape. We understand that. That's part of the rape culture. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author sambolini Posted December 17, 2015 Author Share Posted December 17, 2015 3) the men who are raping don't consider it rape, because rape culture has taught them that it's ok to pressure girls past "no" and to take advantage of drunk women. The men don't consider it rape. We understand that. That's part of the rape culture. You missed the point. If there was a prevalent culture of rape among men, then as a man, why haven't I encountered it? 1 Link to post Share on other sites
xxoo Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 You missed the point. If there was a prevalent culture of rape among men, then as a man, why haven't I encountered it? Because men don't see what they're doing as rape. They don't say, "I'm going to rape this girl." They, "I got laid" after what they did was rape. Or they say nothing. If they don't see their actions as rape, why would they tell you that they are raping women? 3 Link to post Share on other sites
jay1983 Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 3) the men who are raping don't consider it rape, because rape culture has taught them that it's ok to pressure girls past "no" and to take advantage of drunk women. The men don't consider it rape. We understand that. That's part of the rape culture. I really don't think they were taught that it was okay. I think they know it's not okay, but they don't care. Kinda like smoking crack. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
xxoo Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 I really don't think they were taught that it was okay. I think they know it's not okay, but they don't care. Kinda like smoking crack. I honestly don't know if they know and don't care, or if they don't consider it sexual assault/rape. I have 2 sisters. All 3 of us has had a situation where a boyfriend tried to force intercourse in HS or college. I doubt we are unusual. I also doubt any of those guys would call what they tried to do "rape". They were trying to get laid. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
PrettyEmily77 Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 You'd think, but... https://toysoldier.wordpress.com/2015/09/05/mary-koss-doesnt-think-women-can-rape-men-and-boys/ I really don't want to dismiss your point outright, but the source you are referring is a blog. The guy has his own personal bias but it's not really well-researched. He takes one example of a feminist who, like the FBI (which, to my knowledge, isn't a feminist institution) doesn't think man can be raped. You are amalgamating a bunch of things and,for some unknown reason, are putting it all down to the 'feminist movement'. I'm no feminist but even I can see the flaw in your argument. Don't date a feminist if you don't want to, that's entirely your prerogative - it's just that 'feminists' probably aren't what you think they are. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
jay1983 Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 I honestly don't know if they know and don't care, or if they don't consider it sexual assault/rape. I have 2 sisters. All 3 of us has had a situation where a boyfriend tried to force intercourse in HS or college. I doubt we are unusual. I also doubt any of those guys would call what they tried to do "rape". They were trying to get laid. What I'm to tell is that we can't teach not to rape anymore than we can teach not to kill. Link to post Share on other sites
PrettyEmily77 Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 I honestly don't know if they know and don't care, or if they don't consider it sexual assault/rape. I have 2 sisters. All 3 of us has had a situation where a boyfriend tried to force intercourse in HS or college. I doubt we are unusual. I also doubt any of those guys would call what they tried to do "rape". They were trying to get laid. Most girls I know have had a similar experience. I don't recall anyone thinking that 'all men must rapists' as a result,nor they they guys themselves saw anything wrong in what they were doing. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
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