Having a hard time going through with divorce and filing papers

[sandylee1]

I agree with your therapist.... you have contributed to it by tolerating the verbal abuse he's dished out. People treat you how you allow them......... by taking him back while he has no remorse you made a huge mistake.

 

I hope he's not back until you hit the 10 years mark and you end up paying spousal support. He thought so little of you that he left via text message... you should have filed within those few months.

 

Did you even get to see him beg and plead in asking forgiveness? Or didn't he even ask your forgiveness?

 

The day my friends husband threw water on her.. she called the cops on him. The message was loud and clear ....she wasn't tolerating it.

 

You need a therapist who will build your self esteem

[cja]

 

I hope he's not back until you hit the 10 years mark and you end up paying spousal support.

 

Sandylee1,

 

Wow, why do you HOPE that happens? Seriously, why would you wish ill on a stranger who has never done anything to you? I can understand offering advice or even saying that what you are doing is stupid, but to HOPE that I end up having to suffer through paying spousal support? Seriously, what are you the judge and adjudicator handing out what you feel are righful retributions for crimes you've decided on? Sorry hoping and wishing suffering on strangers who have done you no harm, well I don't think that's the purpose of this forum.

[66Charger]

I didnt get that either Sandy. That's not like you.

 

?

[velvette]

OP you are clearly in an abusive relationship.

 

 

There is no point dealing with your H infidelity until he deals with the fact that he is an abuser.

 

 

Not going to weigh in on whether or not you should stay married.

 

 

But, you should not be going to M counseling with him. There is research on this and most competent therapists who specialize in domestic abuse of any variety will tell you not to go to counseling with someone who is abusing you.

 

 

As you have likely seen and experienced, the M counseling is giving him license to abuse you further. He's conned the inept therapist into agreeing that you are causing his abuse.

 

 

Do you ever feel after you sessions that his abuse increases? Because that is usually what happens.

 

 

Separate from him. The only chance you have to have a happy M with this man is if HE chooses to address his abusiveness in individual therapy and then tackle whatever issues the two of you have other than that. You need to demand that he do that if he wants to stay married to you.

 

 

Odds he will do that are not very good unless he finds a very good therapist that calls him on his BS.

 

 

You can't change him. Nor can any therapist. He has to be able to admit that the way he treats you is wrong and work hard to fix that. Most abusers are not able to do that.

 

 

The counselor you have now is dangerous to your mental health.

Edited November 25, 2015 by velvette

[cja]

To clarify, my therapist and MC are the same person. Also my therapist has seen my husband on an individual basis as well. He used to have another therapist of his own, but he stopped going after about six months as he said that he had taken all he could from that therapist and had grown a lot from him so then he asked if he could start going to mine with me and then to mine on his own.

 

Yes, actually, I do seem to think that after joint therapy sessions I feel tension building and there is a fight sometime later. Most of the times it comes down to his belief that I overreact to things like when I moved back out after the whole f8ck you fight where he slammed the door on my face. He quibbles about the details of it like he didn't really 'slam' it in my face, he just closed the door and my face was really a foot away from the door so it's not really as bad as I make it out to be.

 

Another more recent fight started from me expressing some insecurities. I know that it is very hard for him to hear my insecurities without feeling like I'm harshly blaming him and I do admit that maybe I should've framed my insecurity better than I did, but in response to this he told me to 'get the fuc8 out. go back to your sad little apartment and cry alone'. Mind you this is our home, that I paid for too that he's telling me to get the f out of.. I started to leave when he told me to stop and calm down. When I turned and started to break down right there in front of him, explaining that his (and this time I did use the word) abuse had been breaking me down so much over all these years, that's when he looked me dead into my crying, red eyes and said, "let me ask you a question, have you EVER taken accountability for anything in your life?". This truly hurt because I have taken accountability over the years for my faults, etc. I've not only admitted my flaws but worked really hard to change into a better person and partner. So after he said that, I walked out the door and left. He called me from the drive home, and said that he was sorry things went so far and we need to find better ways to communicate etc.

 

Also, my husband has said that he was sorry for his affair, his name calling, etc many times, it just doesn't feel like genuine remorse to me especially given that the fu'k yous and snotty bit'chs' kept flying, although there have been times that it has felt genuine over the last year.

 

Often it feels like conditional remorse, like he's sorry but I need to own my part too for leaving him vulnerable to having an affair (he said I worked too much, I didn't listen to him or connect with him like he needed and I didn't have an open heart), for making him angry etc. And I actually have said that I could have been better and I've never said I was a perfect partner. Still I think he is more resentful that his own self image was hurt than he is sorry for my pain over the last year.

 

I'm visiting family right now and haven't talked to him in a few days. I'm trying to figure things out. He did take me to the airport though and we took a nice walk the day before I flew out here. He can be very loving and nice to me, I just think his ego is so sensitive to any percieved criticism, even if it is constructive or not meant as criticism, so even though things can be good and there really is a lot of very good about him and us together, I know the other side is lurking in the shadows...

Edited November 26, 2015 by cja

[velvette]

Wow, I'm sorry, I missed the part about throwing gasoline on you.

 

 

You should have called the police when that happened.

 

 

You need to accept that you are being abused emotionally, verbally and physically and your H is your abuser. Doesn't matter how nice he is when he is not abusing you.

 

 

Listen you what others have said....everything you need to know about abuse in online. Google it, read it accept whats going on in your M.

 

 

Stay away from him so you can hear your own voice again. You know what he is doing is wrong and there is no excuse for it. Even if you are the most awful person on the planet which I'm sure you're not, he doesn't have to abuse you, he could just walk away. There is nothing you are doing other than acting as his victim that causes him to make the CHOICE to abuse you. PTSD or not, (from what if you don't mind my asking?), be aware that every time he chooses to abuse you he is making the choice to do so.

 

 

Does your therapist know about the gasoline? If so I would report them. If not, just fire them and find a competent therapist. Someone who specializes in abuse. Check with your local domestic violence agencies.

 

 

I would strongly encourage you to tell your family and a friend(s) what is going on so you have some support to help you deal with this.

 

 

Please don't engage with him anymore on issues related to your R. You will not resolve anything and likely just be further abused. Its no different than trying to have a healthy R with an alcoholic who is still drinking, a drug addict still using etc.

 

 

Either leave or make it clear to him that there is no R to discuss until he is willing to get treatment for his abusiveness.

 

 

Be aware that leaving an abuser is the time you are most at risk for physical violence to occur. Also, know that many abusers escalate over time especially if they begin to feel they are losing control of you.

 

 

His abuse is about controlling you.

 

 

BTW don't try to educate him about abuse other than calling it what it is and saying you wont accept it or interact with him as long as its going on.

[dreamingoftigers]

To clarify, my therapist and MC are the same person. Also my therapist has seen my husband on an individual basis as well. He used to have another therapist of his own, but he stopped going after about six months as he said that he had taken all he could from that therapist and had grown a lot from him so then he asked if he could start going to mine with me and then to mine on his own.

 

Yes, actually, I do seem to think that after joint therapy sessions I feel tension building and there is a fight sometime later. Most of the times it comes down to his belief that I overreact to things like when I moved back out after the whole f8ck you fight where he slammed the door on my face. He quibbles about the details of it like he didn't really 'slam' it in my face, he just closed the door and my face was really a foot away from the door so it's not really as bad as I make it out to be.

 

Another more recent fight started from me expressing some insecurities. I know that it is very hard for him to hear my insecurities without feeling like I'm harshly blaming him and I do admit that maybe I should've framed my insecurity better than I did, but in response to this he told me to 'get the fuc8 out. go back to your sad little apartment and cry alone'. Mind you this is our home, that I paid for too that he's telling me to get the f out of.. I started to leave when he told me to stop and calm down. When I turned and started to break down right there in front of him, explaining that his (and this time I did use the word) abuse had been breaking me down so much over all these years, that's when he looked me dead into my crying, red eyes and said, "let me ask you a question, have you EVER taken accountability for anything in your life?". This truly hurt because I have taken accountability over the years for my faults, etc. I've not only admitted my flaws but worked really hard to change into a better person and partner. So after he said that, I walked out the door and left. He called me from the drive home, and said that he was sorry things went so far and we need to find better ways to communicate etc.

 

Also, my husband has said that he was sorry for his affair, his name calling, etc many times, it just doesn't feel like genuine remorse to me especially given that the fu'k yous and snotty bit'chs' kept flying, although there have been times that it has felt genuine over the last year.

 

Often it feels like conditional remorse, like he's sorry but I need to own my part too for leaving him vulnerable to having an affair (he said I worked too much, I didn't listen to him or connect with him like he needed and I didn't have an open heart), for making him angry etc. And I actually have said that I could have been better and I've never said I was a perfect partner. Still I think he is more resentful that his own self image was hurt than he is sorry for my pain over the last year.

 

I'm visiting family right now and haven't talked to him in a few days. I'm trying to figure things out. He did take me to the airport though and we took a nice walk the day before I flew out here. He can be very loving and nice to me, I just think his ego is so sensitive to any percieved criticism, even if it is constructive or not meant as criticism, so even though things can be good and there really is a lot of very good about him and us together, I know the other side is lurking in the shadows...

 

Just so you know, I wasn't trying to insult you by saying you would have PTSD by now.

 

I meant that the abuse would cause it.

 

My childhood caused PTSD and I needed EMDR therapy to sort it out.

 

I found my relationship very traumatic as well.

 

And I found like an idiot and tried so very very hard to help him through his issues and understand his problems etc.

 

To him, it just made me look weak and naggy and manipulative. He took all of my efforts as one big "manipulation to try to control him or make him feel bad."

Counseling became a place to lie and minimize for him. It was so irritating. As soon as the therapist started having him face his own actions and own feelings, he no-showed.

 

If he no-shows to MC on me ever again I am completely finished. Its been over a year since that happened, thank goodness.

 

Perhaps check out chumplady . com it gets pretty bitter on there, but I found the blogs helped a bit.

[Oberfeldwebel]

Often it feels like conditional remorse, like he's sorry but I need to own my part too for leaving him vulnerable to having an affair (he said I worked too much, I didn't listen to him or connect with him like he needed and I didn't have an open heart), for making him angry etc.

 

You may very well have worked too much or not listen to him and that is on you. However, his reaction is his own responsibility. He could have chosen to leave you, he could have taken out an ad in the newspaper for all to see, he could have sought out counseling. He instead chose to have an affair, this is firmly on him. I believe most relationships can be saved if both parties work to fix the problem. In the case of infidelity, the offending party has to confess their transgression and be contrite. If they are unwilling to do so, there is really nothing to forgive.

 

I am also very troubled by a counselor that suggests that you have to just suck it up, because they think you are stronger. This sets up a parent-child relationship, not a relationship of equals.

 

PS: What is the supposed source of his PTSD?

[66Charger]

CJ I am going to give my opinion as to why this cant be fixed. The things you say your husband makes you feel is what he wants you to feel. Weak, small, fkung stupid. Why, you may ask. Because a truly weak man resents a woman that is better than him. He has to tear her down, not just to his level, but below him, so that he may feel superior. This is not PTSD. This is a character flaw. Think about it. Its projection pure and simple. Masters degree does not equal fing stupid. Strong and independent is the opposite of weak and small. He had his A because he had to prove to you that he could get someone else. And when he returned, it was you who forgave.

 

The only way you can be compatible is to change to a stupid, uneducated, subservient barefoot and pregnant inferior type of woman. This is because thats how he needs to be in a relationship. Superior. He will always put you down in order to lift him up and if it isnt successfull, he will destroy you.

 

That cannot be fixed. There is nothing you can do here. Its not about you and will never be about you.

 

The right man for you would care less that you make more money or are have a higher education, because he is comfortable with himself and is always moving forward. He would be happy in all of your sucesses. One of the main things a man wants to see in his woman is that she is happy and content. I dont need to understand half the stuff a woman talks (and talks) about as long as I can hear the end and it ends with a hug and a thanks for listening. (Then sex, because after listening to yall we deserve it)(JOKING!!!)

 

regardless

 

This guy wants the opposite for you. It appears your sucesses make him feel bad. So if you continue to exceed he will feel worse.

 

Your choice is to dumb yourself down or put up with it.. If you choose to go in one direction, years down the line you will lose yourself and lose the most precious thing you have....time.

[oldshirt]

First off, thank you again everyone. I appreciate the continued dialogue more than you understand. These are not things I can talk with my family or friends about (I know not a good sign) so just the simple dialogue is wonderful. Dreamingoftigers especially your insight hits me hard, though I cringe everytime I read the words that it is abusive. What does that even mean? and if so why doesn't my therapist, and marriage counselor or his therapist agree? I'm being advised by professionals that because my husband has PTSD I need to be more undersanding and forgiving of the behavior (and he truly does have PTSD and I have tried very, very hard to be understanding of this and I haven't even written the half of some of our worst fights when he used to threaten my safety etc. one time going as far as pouring gasoline on me etc...). So I just don't know which way is up. My therapist straight out told me that I was the stronger person and because I was the stronger of us both I needed to bear the weight and burden of my husbands pain if I really loved him, or if I don't love him to just accept that and leave though it may break him?

 

 

 

Are you fng serious?????? That is what is called in the legal system as intent to commit serious bodily injury or even attempted murder!!!

 

 

I gotta tell it to you straight so that hopefully it gets through - you are being dumb and naïve and gullible. You are being weak. This is completely nuts.

 

 

I am not saying that to be mean or to rub salt in your wounds. I am trying to swat you upside the head to jar some sense into you.

 

 

The reason you can't tell your friends and family these things is because they have been swatting you upside the head for years to get away from this abuser. You are simply sick of hearing them say that over and over and over and over again so you stopped telling them all the sick and horrific sht he does.

 

 

This is on you now. You know that he is a bad seed and you know he isn't any good. But yet you keep going back. That's your fault. You are responsible for your safety and your well being and if you keep associating with a person that abuses you and mistreats you and poses a risk to your very life, then that is on you and you are responsible for what ever happens to you. The signs have been clear as day and yet you make up excuses and justifications to keep putting your head on the chopping block.

 

 

Here is the clincher and the part that is completely insane - he has tried to get away from YOU!!!! :-O

Most abusive husbands try to hold their abused victims hostage in their own home. This guy left you but you kept going to him. How can anyone help you when you when you actively and intentionally put yourself in the line of fire?

 

 

Yes FIRE YOUR MC! and get a legitimate shrink on your own that will help you to understand why you subject yourself to this kind of abuse and treatment.

 

 

Here is a simple screening tool to help you determine if a therapist or a counselor or shrink is a crackpot or not - if you spend two minutes telling them what you've gone through and they aren't pleading with you to get as far away from him as humanly possible and never allow any contact with him again.... they are a QUACK!!!!!!!

[cja]

Are you fng serious?????? That is what is called in the legal system as intent to commit serious bodily injury or even attempted murder!!!

 

 

I gotta tell it to you straight so that hopefully it gets through - you are being dumb and naïve and gullible. You are being weak. This is completely nuts.

 

 

I am not saying that to be mean or to rub salt in your wounds. I am trying to swat you upside the head to jar some sense into you.

 

 

The reason you can't tell your friends and family these things is because they have been swatting you upside the head for years to get away from this abuser. You are simply sick of hearing them say that over and over and over and over again so you stopped telling them all the sick and horrific sht he does.

 

 

This is on you now. You know that he is a bad seed and you know he isn't any good. But yet you keep going back. That's your fault. You are responsible for your safety and your well being and if you keep associating with a person that abuses you and mistreats you and poses a risk to your very life, then that is on you and you are responsible for what ever happens to you. The signs have been clear as day and yet you make up excuses and justifications to keep putting your head on the chopping block.

 

 

Here is the clincher and the part that is completely insane - he has tried to get away from YOU!!!! :-O

Most abusive husbands try to hold their abused victims hostage in their own home. This guy left you but you kept going to him. How can anyone help you when you when you actively and intentionally put yourself in the line of fire?

 

 

Yes FIRE YOUR MC! and get a legitimate shrink on your own that will help you to understand why you subject yourself to this kind of abuse and treatment.

 

 

Here is a simple screening tool to help you determine if a therapist or a counselor or shrink is a crackpot or not - if you spend two minutes telling them what you've gone through and they aren't pleading with you to get as far away from him as humanly possible and never allow any contact with him again.... they are a QUACK!!!!!!!

 

Thank you. You are right, of course, about why I no longer tell my family or friends. I'm here surrounded by my family and yet I'm on a forum. So that's true. I know I'm being dumb, gullible etc.

 

I haven't actually actively gone back to him. He left, yes, but I did nothing to try to make him come back or go to him. Really, I was almost relieved and I didn't even call him after he texted his I've had a transformative journey and I'm leaving message. I moved out and started the process to separate our lives. He came back, and then has been the one actively trying to get me to come back to him. He gets on to me all the time for not treating him like a human being by not always talking to him or taking his calls. Yes, I did return for two months, but I do believe people can change and he'd been in therapy for six months and I thought maybe he had truly changed. But I did leave again after I realized that he the f yous and name calling would continue. and I haven't moved back though he still is trying very hard to get me to want to return. So it really isn't as though I have been trying to get him back or running back to him. And I have grown a bit stronger, as there were times that I accepted the f'ck yous and door slaming on the face as a normal way people fight. He was quite shocked that I left over something as small as that (his words).

 

Then I sought out a therapist and I guess I didn't get a good one as I told him about the gasoline and lighter incident but it happended many years ago and NOTHING like that has happened since that time so my therapist did not seem to think it was a current problem connected to the namecalling and mean rants he goes on. Because my sense of self-worth is already so fragile, this set me back and I started to feel as though maybe that is something that I should have to work with him on and that it has nothing to do with his past abuses. I start to question my truth. I know again I deserve everything that happens to me at this point and it's all my fault.

 

For those asking, my husband's PTSD came from his time in Iraq as a contractor. He really did suffer through a lot and carries a lot with him. I know it doesn't excuse things but it does put it in context. I think I have some PTSD as well. I was sexually abused as a teen and though I've done a lot of therapy to overcome that I still carry a guilt that I'm not worthy of being treated with respect.

 

It's funny in a sad way that no one around me would know how weak and pathetic I really am. I'm always complimented on my strength and intelligence at work and in my life. In my old job, I made and saved a lot of money, and bought my first house outright without a mortgage. So many people tell me how smart I must be to be able to make such good financial choices and career moves, and sometimes I am able to look at that and make better choices in my life. I'm trying and perhaps I will look for another therapist when I return home.

Edited November 26, 2015 by cja

[velvette]

There was a lighter involved with the gasoline???!!!!

 

 

And your counselor knows this???!!!!

 

 

Get away from him AND that counselor.

 

 

Here's the thing. Abusers(esp those who may seem like mostly avg good guy) can be very clever about there abuse.

 

 

He probably shocked himself with what he did AND when his rage subsided realized he could be in big trouble. Hence back off physically dangerous abuse and get in your face with door slamming, yelling, name calling and other pushing of your emotional buttons.

 

 

But, you need to realize that someone with enough rage to pour gasoline on you is not totally in control of what they are doing. Meaning he could stop himself from doing it for 5 yrs, 10 yrs, 20 yrs and then when the lesser abuse doesn't work to control you then BAM he makes the choice to let himself go out of control and you are in a serious world of hurt or DEAD.

 

 

Do not be fooled that he is any different than he was when he poured gas on you the first time.

 

 

And look, it doesn't matter how strong or smart you are in other areas. Everyone has weaknesses. And, strong smart women rich or poor are abused everyday.

 

 

Find a counselor who will help you. And, really consider telling your family and friends so they can support you.

[oldshirt]

 

 

Because my sense of self-worth is already so fragile,

 

.

 

 

 

How do you think people get a good sense of self worth? Do you think they get it by sitting in a therapist's chair talking about their problems and paying the therapist 10s of thousands of dollars over years and years by having the therapist say they are a good person?

 

 

Or do you think they get a good sense of self worth by doing the right thing in spite of the hardships and in spite of the periods of insecurity, fear and self doubt?

 

 

Self esteem and self worth all come from doing the right thing and reaping the long term good outcomes from that.

 

 

Self doubt and self loathing and damaged self worth comes from compromising your own values and your own well being by doing things that you know you should not or failing to do what you know you should.

 

 

Your self worth is in the toilet not because your abuser calls you names and tells you you are dumb and worthless. Your self worth is shot because you have compromised your own integrity and failed to do what you have known you should do all along.

 

 

Your husband is a bad person and of poor character. You have known this for a long, long time but yet you have continued to accept his abuse. Your acceptance and tolerance of his abuse is what has compromised you and damaged your self worth and has caused you to question your ability to cope, not his abuse itself.

 

 

Start doing what you know you are supposed to be doing and in time you will reap those rewards and that will give you the confidence in yourself.

 

 

Continue to compromise your own integrity and you will continue to do dumb things due to your feelings of inadequacy and low self worth.

[oldshirt]

 

 

 

It's funny in a sad way that no one around me would know how weak and pathetic I really am. I'm always complimented on my strength and intelligence at work and in my life.

 

 

In my old job, I made and saved a lot of money, and bought my first house outright without a mortgage. So many people tell me how smart I must be to be able to make such good financial choices and career moves, and sometimes I am able to look at that and make better choices in my life.

 

 

.

 

Never confuse intelligence with smarts. Never confuse low intelligence with stupidity.

 

 

 

 

Having the intellect to do math and to calculate interest rates has nothing to do with being smart. Smart is all about doing the right things.

 

 

Forest Gump was of low intelligence but understood, "stupid is as stupid does."

 

 

What that means is that you are only stupid if you do stupid things (or knowingly fail to do smart things).

 

 

Are you seeing a pattern here? If you do smart things, you are smart regardless of what a standardized intelligence test says. And if you do stupid things you are stupid, regardless of what a standardized intelligence test says.

 

 

Stop doing stupid things and you will no longer be stupid.

[oldshirt]

In regards to PTSD, that is his responsibility to address and his doctor's and therapists responsibility to work with him. you are under absolutely no obligation to endure danger, abuse or maltreatment from him or anyone else for any reason, including mental illness .

 

 

Are you a Walking Dead fan? In the TV show Walking Dead, the zombies are former normal people that got infected with a pathogen and died. The pathogen reanimated their lizard brain so all they do is wander around and eat living people.

 

 

Even though they people who got infected and sick through no fault of their own and even though they are friends, family and loved ones, they are still dangerous and they still pose a great risk to anyone that they encounter.

 

 

Your abuser may have some bona fide PTSD but he is still dangerous. He is still abusing, mistreating and endangering your life and safety. If he sets you on fire and puts you in the burn hospital for the next 6 months and scars you and disables you for life or even kills you, he may feel bad about it afterwards but that still leaves you disabled or dead.

 

 

You have an obligating to protect yourself even if he does have a condition with a catchy name.

 

 

your relationship with him is toxic and harmful to you regardless of what started it or what mental or medical conditions are contributing to it.

[Quest]

CJ - this relationship really does sound abusive and your self esteem will only improve if you close the door on it. The very act of deciding to do this and then doing it is a big vote for yourself as a worthwhile person who is deserving of a lot better. The longer you stay in this situation, the worse you'll feel about yourself. It's not enough that he's nice to you sometimes or that occasionally you have a good time together. You've got more than enough proof that he always reverts back to abusive behaviour or speech.

[sandylee1]

Sandylee1,

 

Wow, why do you HOPE that happens? Seriously, why would you wish ill on a stranger who has never done anything to you? I can understand offering advice or even saying that what you are doing is stupid, but to HOPE that I end up having to suffer through paying spousal support? Seriously, what are you the judge and adjudicator handing out what you feel are righful retributions for crimes you've decided on? Sorry hoping and wishing suffering on strangers who have done you no harm, well I don't think that's the purpose of this forum.

 

No no no. You have misunderstood me here. I said I hope he's NOT back purely to stay in the marriage longer and then he plans to leave you, but you end up paying SS. I DON'T WANT that to be the case and I hope it's not the reason he came back. That's why you should dump him.

 

I would never wish for that to happen to you.... that's not me at all.

OP - I just read about the gasoline! Surely you don't think this is normal behaviour? Don't you have any family at all? Mine would have me out of there in no time.

 

You don't deserve any of this....but he'll continue only as long as you allow it.

 

You will not achieve the happiness you desire with a man like this . Sometimes we are afraid of leaving a marriage because we think it represents failure.....it does not. Accepting our spouse changed or had us fooled is no shame ..... it just says more about their behaviour.

 

You should be the one in the position of power here for now........ after all he came crawling back..... I'd keep reminding him of that as well....but honestly..... He's not worthy of you and he takes advantage. ........how many women do you think would still be there after the gasoline incident.

 

You need to value your life....if you don't why will anyone else?

 

I'm pro marriage... but when abuse and violence are there... No way.

[velvette]

CJ

 

 

I'm going to suggest a couple of other things that might help you.

 

 

I'm a little surprised that you don't seem angry at all about how your H has treated you.

 

 

Find a picture of yourself when you felt strong, smart, accomplished and just generally good about your life. Put it on the fridge or somewhere you will see it all the time. That woman is still a part of you.....waiting for you to come to your senses, get angry and say enough, I wont accept this anymore.

 

 

Then get a notebook and write down every horrible thing this man has done to you. You could type it online, but the physical act of writing is very cathartic. If you are not angry now, you will be by the time you finish. And fair warning, you will probably be angry with yourself as well. Get all that out because it is suffocating you now most likely and beating you down.

 

 

Then think about what you want your relationship or M to look like. One with honesty, trust, civilized communication, respect, caring whatever is important to you. Resolve that you are never having a relationship with this man or any other unless it includes these things that are important to you.

 

 

I pretty much guarantee that if you do this, you will feel a strong resolve to move forward on your own in the direction you need to. It will also give you a measuring stick to apply to his behavior and anyone elses. If it doesn't live up to your standard reject it, plain and simple. No excuses for their weaknesses.

 

 

If your H makes some miraculous effort to get intense professional help for his issues and works hard with a therapist to the point you can feel safe around him then you can reconsider him as a partner. For now, he is not a safe partner for you or anyone else.

 

 

You are not responsible for whether or not he breaks. In fact, you may be preventing him from taking action to help himself by tolerating his behavior. He may have to break and hit bottom before he is willing to get the appropriate help and he may never get help even if that happens. You cannot control that and need to let go the belief that you can change him in any way.

[cja]

I'm about to go to bed though I wanted to say I have done a good amount of reflecting on my choices and the perspectives you all have given. Thank you.

 

One thing I do realize is that I spent entirely too much of my time and headspace trying to figure out how to solve a problem that isn't mine to solve. So I need to try to solve MY solvable problems and making healthy choices should be on the forefront.

 

Continuing to subject myself to situations where I know verbal meanness is a real liklihood is not a good choice for my mental health and well being. Plus I give SO much headspace to obsessing over what I did wrong, or how I could have brought up what are really normal issues and concerns in a less threatening manner is all pointless and takes away from the joy I should be sharing with my family.

 

Instead of enjoying my much needed vacation, I obsess over whether I'm being fair to my husband, whether I take enough accountability for not communicating in fair way, but at the end of the day I think the things he does when he is upset or angry are unacceptable for the simple reason that I would never and have never done them. I've never even called him a mean name even when I first learned of his affair. And if I don't give even myself a pass to be mean just because people are doing not nice things to me, why the he'l do I constantly give serious consideration to his excuse that I somehow bring him to this point? I don't call anyone names, it's an immature reaction usually to an EGO 'threat', be it real or simply perceived.

 

And tearing others down to build youself up solves nothing, and isn't a healthy way to communicate. He has tried to convince me that I do the same to him, just in a different way with out being mean or namecalling, but the thing is when I really look at it: I don't. I just don't. I try to gently tell him how I feel, taking ownership for my feelings, purposefully tyring not to blame him, and look for ways we together can work to solve these issues. I'm not perfect at ALL but I do try and I don't attack and even if he seems to think I do, it is absolutely no reason to go ahead and give himself permission to verbally degrade and belittle me.

 

Because he feels expressing my concerns is an 'attack' he can't hear me because that would take vulnerability which he is not willing at this time to risk, and he DEFINITELY can't hear me simply repeat back to him what he has done over the years. For example, me saying to him that he left me via a text message or that he said fu'k you to me over and over again before ranting about how my sh't is disgusting etc is to him me attacking' him and being 'so unfair and cruel'.

 

It is literallly unbearable for him to simply hear his own words and actions repeated or talked about. And how could we ever move past such large hurdles if we can't even really talk about them? I remember years ago I was on some other forum talking of these same issues and a woman said to me 'honey, trying to get a man to see that he can be abusive is like trying to teach a pig to sing: all it does is waste your time and annoy the pig.'

 

Well, I can see now that becuase I could never accept that my husband could sometimes be abusive, I cringe even as I type the word and I really still don't feel like it's the right descriptor as my husband is deep down a good person (I know I'll get push back for that but only I actually know him), he is just very insecure and unwilling to truly look inside himself with real vulnerability. But that would take admiting that he has a real issue that is deeper than just our relationship problems, but I can't be the one to bring him to that understanding. Not that I haven't tried but he is a very poor communicator and I can be too and then he resorts to mean and cruel language to 'win' which have only hurt me over the years and has not significantly changed the way I always have to live on edge of setting him off.

 

At any rate I have patently been doing just that: wasting my time while annoying my husband. And no one has learned to sing

Edited November 27, 2015 by cja

[sandylee1]

I can guarantee you that he never treated his OW the way he treats you with all the name calling....if he did. ..that's when she dumped him and he came back to you.

 

His behaviour isn't love... so my question from you to him would be "exactly why did you come back?" Because from where I'm standing there's no love or remorse or even regret.

 

Affairs are intense with all the sneaking around and clandestine meetings... in the cold light of day.. The majority end and the spouse comes back grovelling ..... in your case it doesn't sound like he even did that.

 

People with a kind nature like you get taken advantage of. That's your nature and you don't need to change who you are...... just wisen up to his nonsense and if you don't want to get into a huge fight. ... simply say.. "I don't think we are compatible. We don't bring out the best in each other and I think we'd be much happier apart"

 

You don't have to call him names and tell him he's abusive... he knows he is... don't stress yourself with a huge confrontation where your heart doesn't stop racing a million to one. Just amicably go your seperate ways.

 

He's not the man that any woman will want.... Never ... until he gets help.

[Oberfeldwebel]

First remember that you can’t fix him, only he can do that for himself. Secondly, men do not talk to ladies the way that he does. I am not going to tell you that I never curse, but it is not directed at them the way he has, this shows a complete lack of respect to you. This is ironic in that he seems to think that you disrespect him, when in reality it is he that is being disrespectful. I asked about the PTSD because as you have stated, it puts it in to context. Did you know him before his deployment? Did he exhibit this behavior before the deployment?

[66Charger]

Have you any idea how painfull death by fire is?

This man threatened to burn you alive.

 

I will take my leave and let the women on here talk to you. Especially those with DV history. I guarantee that if you stick around and continue to post, they will have you filing divorce papers by Christmas.

 

May you have a Happy Holiday season. Without the drama.

[RightThere]

Question: Anyone happy on the other side?

 

Answer: Yes, my wife cheated and left for other guy, she came back, then left again for new guy. I divorced her, found a woman who loved and appreciated me, for me and have lived happily ever after. I believe that most relationships can be fixed, but you have an individual that is verbally abusive to you and probably a bit narcissistic. Additionally, the guy that is supposed to be helping you is excusing his behavior. I don't normally do this, but I think you need to very seriously consider cutting your lose and finding someone who truly loves you.

 

Just wanted to say I love hearing this story.

 

I also took my ex back more times than I can even count anymore. Once I finally decided enough was enough, my life has never been better.

 

Met another girl, fell in love, and working on the happily ever after part.

 

Thinking about getting out and being on your own is scary, but once you finally decide to do it, everything works out. It so liberating to be back in control of your own happiness.

[dreamingoftigers]

if you are waiting to get angry about everything; it may not happen until you are further out from the situation.

 

If you are scared to get angry at him because you might totally lose it, I can relate to that. You can protect yourself and love yourself without having to "hate him" or "betray him" or be really angry about it.

 

Just a big piece of you needs to see that staying in the cycle isn't benefitting either one of you and that enabling him in ANY way doesn't show that you are supportive of him. At this point on his life, he will either view it as a manipulation or a surrender from you. I doubt he sees many interactions with you as much more than that.

 

Honestly, having truly truly been there with a prideful husband that didn't understand sharing and taking responsibility for his own feelings and actions, you every careful thought of how yo best consider him will be wasted on him.

 

He's not "hopeless" BUT I honestly believe that man like him don't do much self-inventory until they start to truly lose things. It can't just be words because he just views those as temporary weapons to restore the balance of power to his favor. Then it becomes "see I had to use those words because you were getting out of control."

 

I am willing to bet he twists your words to portray himself as the victim anyhow.

[cja]

if you are waiting to get angry about everything; it may not happen until you are further out from the situation.

 

If you are scared to get angry at him because you might totally lose it, I can r

 

I am willing to bet he twists your words to portray himself as the victim anyhow.

 

Dreamingoftigers, first I am very, VERY, VERY f*9ng afraid of EVER being mad at my husband. I know that seems rediculous to most, but slomehow I don't think it does to you. It's hard, being in the negative sound cycher for so many years, I sart to feel it is normal, nothing more or less than I deserve. I know to most people with a good sense of self, you think I'm a piece of ****. And you are right, really, I am, but I AM TRYING to change. I know that's not worth much, but I do try. And the thing is my husband is not a piece of **** or a 'bad seed' as some have said. He's a person, a human being, and really we are all just lost people looking for love, fulfillment and excitement. I know my husband went about it in the wrong way (an affair) but I don't even really have anger there. He found later his affair was not fulfiling. actually the meanest thing I've said to him was to go back to her, to his affair partner but he won't.