I'm new. Both an BS and a OW

[MidnightBlue1980]

Hello there. I honestly never thought I would find myself here. In my first marriage, I had an affair which led to my own divorce and a really bad relationship with my affair partner. It was 3 years of hell - he did separate but never divorced, I was kept a secret and although we lived more of a real life than a typical affair, I was under 35 and it was not enough for me. After many tears, fights and heartache, I moved on. I then met my now husband and we have been married for 8 years and have two little children, a boy and a girl.

 

This past summer we both were so distracted from each other and our marriage that we each met other people. Ironically, we both started our relationships in the end of July 2015. His was with a single girl and mine with a married guy I know in a group of mine. We each knew them for about 3 years as casual friends. He busted me in late August and I busted him in mid September. He did not come clean when he caught me but put me and the OM through hell. After we discovered we were both cheating on each other, we decided to try an open marriage as we had developed strong feelings for these other people. Needless to say, it was a pretty big disaster. We had strong feelings of jealousy and each contacted the other person repeatedly. In each relationship, the other people held on and put up with our craziness. In his case, she wanted him to leave me and marry her, which he had no intention of doing, and by December it had whittled away to a mutual hatred.

 

In my case, he did not care that my husband knew as they had no sex life (or who knows, everyone lies in these things) and he just wanted an affair. It was confusing to me as for the 5 months, I had constant "I love you" texts and "I'm in love with you" etc. but I kept the physical stuff to a minimum to protect myself. There was some but it messed up my head. So two weeks ago tonight, I had a huge fight with my husband and went to a motel. I had emailed OM about the trouble and was sure that he would worry about where I was.

 

Nope.

 

I was actually the one to email him the next day as I forgot my phone and called him. Turns out my husband was going crazy trying to find me and they had already spoken a few times. OM was not even concerned about me, only about himself and his wife finding out - and he blamed me for all this drama, believing himself to be innocent and claiming we were doing nothing wrong. He said I need to pull it together and stop being so honest about him in my house. So I put it out there - I said, are you going to leave your wife? I mean, I am in a motel, my life is falling apart. I need to know the stakes. He said no. He wanted us to keep our marriages and for us to develop a relationship to see if it would be strong enough for the future. His fear was that he would leave and we would not last and he would have left for nothing. I said, you cannot jump from one to the other, and I said, this has to end, my life is falling apart and I don't want to be in an affair.

 

Long story short, I reaffirmed this decision the next day as I see him weekly and that night he told his wife. Whether he told his wife because of me ending it or he was afraid of my husband, I don't know. But his wife called my husband and OM had told her a pack of lies about him being a victim of my pursuits and so on. My husband set her straight as much to OMs dismay, I have told H everything. The wife was happy the OM was giving her another chance to fix their marriage (even though he was the one to cheat, ok)

 

OM broke off all contact immediately. We have things we need to communicate on but he would not respond to me. His big thing was that I never hate him or it be awkward when we see each other weekly, he wanted to be friends but everything he has done over the last two weeks has said otherwise. It was unbelievably brutal. I felt I handled the breakup with dignity and respect for both of us as it was not fair for him to ask me to stay in an affair, and he said he understood completely. I understand I was wrong in what we did, but I did not deserve what he did to me these two weeks. When my husband found out in August, I actually consoled OM who was so freaked out about his wife finding out. Looking back, he never cared about me at all. Honestly, the motel was the telling point. He did not even care if I was okay. Only my husband cared.

 

Anyway, so I am working on things at home and my husband is fully aware of my emotional pain with OM as he went through it with OW. My problem is that although intellectually I know OM is all bad for me, it still hurts. 5 months of I love yous and so on and then he turned on me. And I'm not some chick he picked up in a bar. I'll see him in two days and we will see each other weekly. I was prepared to handle it like an adult and I still will but I was not prepared for this emotional pain. I understand he stayed with his wife (after all, my husband did not leave me, most men just like being married) but I deserved to be treated with more respect and not lied about. I am not even sure why he told her if he was not going to tell her the truth anyway. I thought she would make him never see me again but I guess not.

 

If you read this far, thank you. It's just been a horrible two weeks. I know I got into this myself and deserve no sympathy.

 

MidnightBlue

[Ms. Faust]

Just giving a bump so others can come and advise. I have no advice really, other than it sounds like you got caught up in your emotions. You wanted the MM to be your knight in shining armor, and he was not having it. For his part, the MM sounds like he was thriving on the limerence, but when sh*t got real he balked at the reality.

 

I know it hurts the ego to be treated with such disregard. Hopefully when you see him you will get the closure that you want.

[whichwayisup]

Just the choices you and your H have made, aren't healthy... Each of you chose to cheat on each other (and this isn't your first affair) so really it seems there is no real loyalty or desire to be committed to one person, stay faithful and build a life with just one person.

 

MM and you had an A, just that you fell deeper than he did. He seems more like the typical MM, not looking to leave his marriage, was able to stay detached and 'act' the part, enjoy it for what it was, an A and you thought it was more meaningful and possibly someone you'd end up with in the future.

 

Why do you see him weekly? Do you work with him? IF so, consider looking for another job as there's NO way you two can be 'friends'.

[bathtub-row]

First of all, I'm sorry you're hurting so much. Basically, you were betrayed by xMM and that is a pain like no other. He is not who you thought he was and that is always a difficult thing to come to terms with. Yet, it is also unforgettable and unforgivable.

 

I know this is going to seem impossible but my advice to you would be to do the exact opposite of what xMM expects you to do the next time you see him. Turn off your emotions when you're around him and don't even act like there's anything significant between the two of you.

 

The truth is, no matter how much he has hurt you, there is no sense in behaving like a wounded victim when he has chosen to act as he did. He doesn't deserve to know how hurt you are. What he deserves is indifference and no personal conversations with you ever again. Do it for yourself, for your own self-worth. You'll be proud of yourself if you don't let him see that he got the better of you.

[Poppy47]

Id like to echo what Bathtub has said.

 

Why do you want to see him again and pretend nothing has happened to hurt you.

 

You have been hurt and although you cannot blame him for his actions, you will get even more screwed up in the head if you keep seeing him.

 

Get out from all the dysfunctionality you have been living with. Get back to an authentic life with your husband if you can. If you can't then leave for your own sake.

 

It's never too late to start afresh.

 

Kind Regards,

Poppy.

[spice4life]

I havent posted in a long time but wanted to jump in and offer some insight. Like you I have been on both sides, saw the light and will never get involved in such a soul destroying experience ever again. I feel horrible for actively participating in hurting innocent victims with my VERY poor choices. There is no excuse in the world that can justify my actions. Not one!

 

The first thing you need to do is quit worrying about what the OM is thinking and focus solely on your marriage. Google surviving infidelity and read about the devastating effects affairs have on families. You and your husband's AP's are inconsequentual at this point because they are not in your marriage. Only you your husband and innocent children are in it. There is no hope for your marriage as long as you are allowing your AP's to take up space in your head. Step back, and give yourself the space and time you need to gain clarity regarding your choice to cheat. Both tou and your husband need to feel true remorse for your actions in order to begin the road to recovery. If you don't then there is no hope and your marriage will be vulnerable to more infidelity in the future.

 

Block your OM and avoid him at all costs and focus on healing your marriage. It can be done. Think about your children and how much energy this is taking away from them! They deserve healthy parents who are making good choices.

Edited January 4, 2016 by spice4life

[sandylee1]

Time to focus on your marriage and consider how the actions of you and your husband are putting your kids at risk of a very unsettled childhood.

 

The OMS behaviour is no suprise at all. You got the ILYs to keep the sex and ego kibbles coming his way. He has no intention of leaving his wife.

 

I suggest you seek counselling and dig into why you continously cheat on men.... your first marriage ended because of it and you risked the same with this marriage. It was probably your husband's guilty conscience that made him not divorce.

 

If you are having marital problems.. find better ways to cope than having affairs. I don't know if your MM knew how your first marriage ended.. but if I were him. .. I WOULDN'T leave my faithful wife for a two time cheat.. doesn't make ANY sense and appears like you can't be satisfied by any man. Men don't like to think of their wife sleeping with other men ... and your MM knows you have no problem doing so.

 

He's a cheater too.... but probably feels entitled like a lot of men do.

 

You and your H have lots of work to do. Your on a level playing field....so give it your best and get the connection back with him.

 

There are a few organisations that do couples retreats to help reconnect. This would be after some sessions of MC though.

 

Above all... do you both want to work on the marriage?

Do you still love each other?

Is the mutual attraction still there?

 

Don't waste time with counselling if you're not both committed to turning this around and trying to be stronger for it all.

[burnt]

I'm usually the one to scream the loudest when I hear people judging other people. I'm sorry for the pain you're feeling, but I must say I'm having a hard time understanding your behavior.

 

If you already knew the pain and the damage of having an affair from your first marriage, then why do it again during your second marriage?

 

In your current marriage, if you knew how much it hurts be the OW for your xMM they why lash out towards your husband's OW?

 

If you see how your own husband apathetically ditches his OW and forgets her existence and sticks by your side, then why fuss about your xMM ditching you and sticking by his wife's side?

 

I'm sorry, but I can't help but see it as a game involving 5 players and

the ultimate winners being your husband and your xMM, both having wives on one side and having fun on the other;

 

you winning the second prize, with your husband standing by your side, and you not completely feeling betrayed by your H's cheating since you did it too;

 

your xMM's wife the 3rd, with her husband standing by her side, but feeling betrayed for no good reason;

 

your husband's OW in the last place, losing everything, absolutely everything, with no support and no recognition from anyone and a broken heart.

 

Understand your xMM's marriage will take the hardest hit--simply because his wife won't be able to forgive.

 

You and your H have the best chance at working on your marriage because the cheating was mutual.

And therefore, you two get the biggest benefit out of this entire big mess.

 

Forgive me,

but I must say, while you are trying to heal, I truly hope you save some compassion for your xMM's wife and your H's OW.

 

I hope those two women find a way to find solace somehow.

[MidnightBlue1980]

First of all, I'm sorry you're hurting so much. Basically, you were betrayed by xMM and that is a pain like no other. He is not who you thought he was and that is always a difficult thing to come to terms with. Yet, it is also unforgettable and unforgivable.

 

I know this is going to seem impossible but my advice to you would be to do the exact opposite of what xMM expects you to do the next time you see him. Turn off your emotions when you're around him and don't even act like there's anything significant between the two of you.

 

The truth is, no matter how much he has hurt you, there is no sense in behaving like a wounded victim when he has chosen to act as he did. He doesn't deserve to know how hurt you are. What he deserves is indifference and no personal conversations with you ever again. Do it for yourself, for your own self-worth. You'll be proud of yourself if you don't let him see that he got the better of you.

 

Somehow I missed all the responses. I was very upset back then. I really like your advice! I admit I was not that calm, cool, collected person in January and showed how upset I was, but everyday is a new day. I am going to follow your advice here. I certainly don't want to act like a victim because that makes me helpless and gives away all my power. Thank you for your response.

[13Hearts]

but I deserved to be treated with more respect and not lied about

 

Whenever I find myself saying "I deserve..." I have to stop and check myself.

 

I don't want to sound harsh or mean or judgmental because that is not the place where I'm coming from. What I know is that when I want to be respected, I have to act respectfully. And it sounds like no one in this foursome is acting respectfully of anyone, not even themselves.

 

Why did you go to a hotel? Because you really needed to be away from your spouse, or because you wanted to spend the night with the OM?

 

I think your expectations of OM are too high. He does not want to leave his wife and he is not going to tell her more than he has to.

[MidnightBlue1980]

Whenever I find myself saying "I deserve..." I have to stop and check myself.

 

I don't want to sound harsh or mean or judgmental because that is not the place where I'm coming from. What I know is that when I want to be respected, I have to act respectfully. And it sounds like no one in this foursome is acting respectfully of anyone, not even themselves.

 

Why did you go to a hotel? Because you really needed to be away from your spouse, or because you wanted to spend the night with the OM?

 

I think your expectations of OM are too high. He does not want to leave his wife and he is not going to tell her more than he has to.

 

I wrote that a month ago when I was literally dying of pain. It was so strong that it defied whether it was right or wrong. I never felt pain like that before.

 

I did not go to a hotel with OM. It was mainly an EA with a little PA. MM wanted to go to a hotel, he was mainly there for physical needs not being met. I was just looking for something that didn't exist with him.

 

Everyone posted a lot about my prior marriage. I really didn't feel like going into it, replying and all, but my affair did not cause my divorce. My ex hit me and I should have immediately left but I didn't. I just regret the affair because it sucked up year of my life as I thought he was separated but he never filed the papers. It's all ancient history now as I remarried a much better person. He;s not perfect but he certainly doesnt hit me.

[sandylee1]

In your first post you clearly said your first marriage ended because of your affair? Now you say your ex hit you....which is it? Or did he hit you when he found out you had an affair?

 

It just looks like fidelity is not your thing. You either didn't learn from the first time or you are quite simply incapable of being faithful.

[MJJean]

I understand he stayed with his wife (after all, my husband did not leave me, most men just like being married) but I deserved to be treated with more respect and not lied about. I am not even sure why he told her if he was not going to tell her the truth anyway. I thought she would make him never see me again but I guess not.

MidnightBlue

 

He's a liar. He was lying to his wife the whole time. I don't understand why you were upset that a liar lied.

 

 

Everyone posted a lot about my prior marriage. I really didn't feel like going into it, replying and all, but my affair did not cause my divorce. My ex hit me and I should have immediately left but I didn't. I just regret the affair because it sucked up year of my life as I thought he was separated but he never filed the papers. It's all ancient history now as I remarried a much better person. He;s not perfect but he certainly doesnt hit me.

 

I, too, had an exH that was abusive. I, too, stayed. I had multiple affairs when I was in that marriage. Then I left the marriage, remarried, and have been faithful to my DH for 16 years. I say these things so that you know I am not judging you. I've been there.

 

I don't see how you've changed and become a better person considering you have cheated in the 2nd marriage, too. The only thing that changed is the name of the guy you cheated on.

[minimariah]

your husband's OW in the last place, losing everything, absolutely everything, with no support and no recognition from anyone and a broken heart.

 

i agree and i must say - in the entire situation, i feel for her the most.

[Parannonx]

i agree and i must say - in the entire situation, i feel for her the most.

 

The only one I feel for is the OM's BW as she was the only one who did not know what she was involved with, she's the one who never had the opportunity to consent to this dysfunctional situation. The OW knew that the OP's husband was married so she knew what she was getting into (or at least should have)

 

The amount of entitlement and disrespect these 4 individuals showed to each other and especially to the one faithful spouse leaves me short on sympathy.

 

Midnight Blue, get yourself into counseling, find out what in your personality makes you think that you should be immune to the consequences of your choices.

 

Once you find that and address it you can start making better choices and stop leaving a trail of broken hearts and busted psyches behind you.

 

More importantly you will learn to have the self respect to not involve yourself in such situations again and thus not suffer from the pain that is inherent in such screwed up relationships.

 

BTW, there is nothing wrong with having an open relationship, but the key is honesty. Everyone involved needs to understand the boundaries and nature of the relationship otherwise it's not really an open relationship.

[Miss Clavel]

Hello there. I honestly never thought I would find myself here. In my first marriage, I had an affair which led to my own divorce and a really bad relationship with my affair partner. It was 3 years of hell - he did separate but never divorced, I was kept a secret and although we lived more of a real life than a typical affair, I was under 35 and it was not enough for me. After many tears, fights and heartache, I moved on. I then met my now husband and we have been married for 8 years and have two little children, a boy and a girl.

 

 

In my case, he did not care that my husband knew as they had no sex life (or who knows, everyone lies in these things) and he just wanted an affair. It was confusing to me as for the 5 months, I had constant "I love you" texts and "I'm in love with you" etc. but I kept the physical stuff to a minimum to protect myself. There was some but it messed up my head. So two weeks ago tonight, I had a huge fight with my husband and went to a motel. I had emailed OM about the trouble and was sure that he would worry about where I was.

 

Nope.

He said I need to pull it together and stop being so honest about him in my house. So I put it out there - I said, are you going to leave your wife? I mean, I am in a motel, my life is falling apart. I need to know the stakes. He said no. He wanted us to keep our marriages and for us to develop a relationship to see if it would be strong enough for the future. His fear was that he would leave and we would not last and he would have left for nothing. I said, you cannot jump from one to the other, and I said, this has to end, my life is falling apart and I don't want to be in an affair.

 

Long story short, I reaffirmed this decision the next day as I see him weekly and that night he told his wife. Whether he told his wife because of me ending it or he was afraid of my husband, I don't know. But his wife called my husband and OM had told her a pack of lies about him being a victim of my pursuits and so on. My husband set her straight as much to OMs dismay, I have told H everything. The wife was happy the OM was giving her another chance to fix their marriage (even though he was the one to cheat, ok)

 

OM broke off all contact immediately. We have things we need to communicate on but he would not respond to me. His big thing was that I never hate him or it be awkward when we see each other weekly, he wanted to be friends but everything he has done over the last two weeks has said otherwise. It was unbelievably brutal. I felt I handled the breakup with dignity and respect for both of us as it was not fair for him to ask me to stay in an affair, and he said he understood completely. I understand I was wrong in what we did, but I did not deserve what he did to me these two weeks. When my husband found out in August, I actually consoled OM who was so freaked out about his wife finding out. Looking back, he never cared about me at all. Honestly, the motel was the telling point. He did not even care if I was okay. Only my husband cared.

 

I deserved to be treated with more respect and not lied about. I am not even sure why he told her if he was not going to tell her the truth anyway. I thought she would make him never see me again but I guess not.

 

 

 

MidnightBlue

 

 

Hello there. I honestly never thought I would find myself here. In my first marriage, I had an affair which led to my own divorce and a really bad relationship with my affair partner. It was 3 years of hell

 

 

really?

 

work on yourself. figure out why you keep doing what you did and why you keep getting what you got. your guts kick in.

 

it's almost like you're a genius at: "im no good and just to prove it im going to f myself into next year".

 

he made a choice, and, unfortunately, you still have to see him.

 

summon up some dignity and face this mess squarely, chin up.

 

it's over. he's a pig. we all know what happens when you lie down with pigs.

 

good luck.

[elaine567]

Miss Clavel makes a good point.

First marriage you had an affair with an unsuitable man that turned into a nightmare, and second marriage you have another affair with an unsuitable man that also turned into a nightmare.

Why?

Seems like you are setting yourself up to fail here.

[dreamingoftigers]

So how are things with your husband going?

[sandylee1]

Why are people feeling sorry for the OW..who knew she was seeing a MM? Have I missed the bit where he lied to her about being married? Sorry if I have...if so I sympathise. If not. ...then she went pain shopping when she got into the affair.

 

I feel the BW is an INNOCENT victim here.

 

Midnight. .

You're on a level playing field now.. you are madhatters..The question is...are you committed to the marriage and is your H?

[Jersey born raised]

Wow Midnight, you are getting a lot of tough love. I sense some of the posters are posting though their pain. Take the remarks not as an attack (hard to do) but rather as the challenges to be me. When you can read these remarks and say the person they are talking about is not who I am, you will be in a much better place.

 

In the eighties I read an article that stated that in some ways men and women experience intercourse very differently. For a man, he felt a sense of ultimate acceptance and validation that had nothing to do with any physical pleasure.

 

So, that is what your husband got from his OW and your OM got from you. I saw you liked my post on another thread about how a player thought I had found. Have you considered the other post, how an EA develops ? I will repost here. I suspect if you edit it to change from two ex's reconnecting to a work place enviroment you will begin to see the why of your choices

[Jersey born raised]

Emotional affair*

 

 

Right now, the texts/conversations may very well be just two old friends catching up but soon, if left unchecked, may very well morph into:

 

Their lives since they parted

Their relationships since they parted*

Their families

Their spouses

You

How you're an excellent father

How you're a great husband

How you're a wonderful guy

Your job

How your job keeps you busy

How your job keeps you away

How she sometimes feels a little lonely when you're away

How she sometimes feels a little overburdened at home

How she sometimes feels a little taken for granted

How she feels that you don't ALWAYS listen to her

How she feels that you don't ALWAYS understand her

How she feels that sometimes you're just "not there" for her

How, okay... you're not ALWAYS such a wonderful guy

How she loved hearing from him again

How she looks forward to his texts/calls/e-mails now

How she feels young again

How she feels appreciated again

How she feels attractive again

How it's so nice to have someone who just LISTENS to her again

How it's been so, so long since you made her feel that way

How her eyes have now been opened

How she now realizes what she truly wants and needs

How she now realizes that you could NEVER give her that

How insensitive you can be some times

How you can be a real jerk sometimes

How she wonders if they would have stayed together

How she now realizes that she never really loved you

How she now realizes that she really loved him all along

How she ever could have fallen for a jerk like you

How you're the biggest a++hole she's ever known

How you're standing in the way of her true happiness

How you ruined her life

How she made a big mistake marrying you

How she made an even bigger mistake letting him go

How now she sees that they were really meant to be together

How she desperately has to get away from you

How she's definitely going to leave you

How she's talking to divorce lawyers

How they're going to live happily ever after...

[MidnightBlue1980]

Wow Midnight, you are getting a lot of tough love. I sense some of the posters are posting though their pain. Take the remarks not as an attack (hard to do) but rather as the challenges to be me. When you can read these remarks and say the person they are talking about is not who I am, you will be in a much better place.

 

In the eighties I read an article that stated that in some ways men and women experience intercourse very differently. For a man, he felt a sense of ultimate acceptance and validation that had nothing to do with any physical pleasure.

 

So, that is what your husband got from his OW and your OM got from you. I saw you liked my post on another thread about how a player thought I had found. Have you considered the other post, how an EA develops ? I will repost here. I suspect if you edit it to change from two ex's reconnecting to a work place enviroment you will begin to see the why of your choices

 

Hi Jersey. Yes, I liked that repost about the player. It's hard for me because I do not see xMM as a player. It's as if my female brain does not see xMM for what he is. I can't really tell. All I know is he did contact me this week and put a big sad story out about his achy, breaky bleeding heart. I was not mean but I was not friendly. He certainly was not there for me the last 8 weeks, let him go see a therapist like I did. He made his choice in December and so did I. It's his journey now. He's on his own.

 

I actually would like to delete this thread but I don't know how. It's from a place of pain that I am not in right now. I do see people posting angry comments. It's interesting how people pick a person to feel sorry for. No one here is a victim, even the BS. She told xMM that their child was first and they have a sexless marriage for years. I don't think she really cares what he does. They are together because of money. There are other ways to hurt a marriage besides an affair. As for the OW, she knew my H was married, they knew each other for years. She texted me and continued to see him. SHe wanted him to leave me - I told him to go but he had no intention. Trust me, I would have driven him there. Of course she was unemployed living with her parents. And H is unemployed. So. There you go.

 

As for people saying nasty things about me. That's okay. No one can possibly post anything that would come close to the pain I was in the last 8 weeks. It is interesting that people post nasty things about cheating. This is a board for that purpose.

[MidnightBlue1980]

So how are things with your husband going?

 

They are going very well. I told him the 100% truth and he believes everything is his fault, he spent the last 8 years totally wrapped up in his own stuff. Not that I am any victim here, not at all, but he is committed to being a good husband. SO we'll see.

[MidnightBlue1980]

Why are people feeling sorry for the OW..who knew she was seeing a MM? Have I missed the bit where he lied to her about being married? Sorry if I have...if so I sympathise. If not. ...then she went pain shopping when she got into the affair.

 

I feel the BW is an INNOCENT victim here.

 

Midnight. .

You're on a level playing field now.. you are madhatters..The question is...are you committed to the marriage and is your H?

 

OW knew he was married. She was dating other guys at the same time, married guys too. I really wouldn't feel sorry for her or any of us. The 4 of us are equal. The BS is not a victim, she is having her own affair. They have a marriage in name only.

 

To answer you, YES, both my H and I am committed to our marriage.

[imsosad]

Midnight,

Im glad you are feeling better.

It must be hard to read some of the comments. I think in your situation there are really no good guys and bad guys, just people realising they made bad choices.

Hopefully, you and your H can take on this mess and lead yourselves to.a good place.

Good luck