Emilia Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 I don't know if you can say it's "normal". My Dad never caved. My parents are still married now almost 60 years, and my Dad never disappeared on us for even one day. He had plenty of stress, enough to make him physically ill, but he was always there for his family. Men still cave even when physically present. My former boss put a shed in his garden and called it mancave. When a man realises that he is allowed to be the way he wants to be because he is compatible with you, he will disappear less. My current boss drives to work more when he needs time away from his family. The drive is 3 hours each way. That's the only time he gets for himself. Link to post Share on other sites
losangelena Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 Men still cave even when physically present. My former boss put a shed in his garden and called it mancave. When a man realises that he is allowed to be the way he wants to be because he is compatible with you, he will disappear less. My current boss drives to work more when he needs time away from his family. The drive is 3 hours each way. That's the only time he gets for himself. I will second this. My dad was addicted to Tetris (the video game) for a while when I was a kid. Physically present, but mentally elsewhere. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
katiegrl Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 I will second this. My dad was addicted to Tetris (the video game) for a while when I was a kid. Physically present, but mentally elsewhere. I don't recall my dad ever retreating, but my mom told me that there were times he did so.....BUT that he would explain to her beforehand, so she didn't take it personally and become upset by it. He was very considerate of her feelings in that regard....plus I also think he told her so she would know to essentially leave him be ....so he could deal with whatever he was dealing with privately ....which is what he needed for himself. He never neglected us kids though. She said it only lasted for a couple days though.....then he would be back to his usual loving self. Link to post Share on other sites
Emilia Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 I think most people see their parents through rose tinted glasses. You need more objective examples. Link to post Share on other sites
losangelena Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 And I think too it's a learning experience for both parties. I mean, if we're going to get into parents, mine are actually a really good example. My parents got engaged a week after they met, married after 4 months. Needless to say, they didn't actually know each other very well. My mom told me this story once, of when they were newly married, my dad would come home and be distracted about work or upset about something, and he'd be so in his head about it that he wouldn't even acknowledge my mom. It made her distraught, thinking he was mad at her, thinking why won't he talk to me, etc. One time she got so upset that she left the house and went for a walk, and when she got back, my dad hadn't even realized she'd left! At that point, she was like, "what the hell is going on?," and that's when my dad explained that if he's distracted or bothered by something, it didn't have anything to do with her, but that he also didn't want to talk about it. So, I guess you could look at that situation and say, boy my dad was really rude! And that's true, maybe, but point is, people don't always think about how what they do might affect others. And specifically, I really don't think men instinctively know to give a woman a head's up like that. To them it doesn't feel pertinent, because they don't think what they're doing is rude. They're just doing what they need to do to solve whatever problem they have. Women see it as inconsiderate, and that's very innate, too, because that's what a woman would do. But the man is like, "I'm trying to solve this problem so I can get back to being the boyfriend/husband/whatever." Anyway, point being, I think both genders would do well to bend a bit in this regard. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Gaeta Posted January 16, 2016 Author Share Posted January 16, 2016 Now that I think of it, I remember this. When I met my ex (of 4 years) we dated for 3 weeks then he disappeared. I tried to contact him a few times and nothing. About 3 weeks later he gives me a call and tells me he had lost his job so had decided to go back to his hometown for some time to concentrate and make decisions. We started dating again and it lasted 4 years. That was back in 2000. I knew nothing about dating I was barely a year divorced. I remember just being happy he was back. In our 4 year relationship he never did that type of caving again. He did his caving in his garage. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Amelie1980 Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 There seems to have been a grand shift in dating... It used to be the man grabbing the woman by the hand & joyfully telling HER to date HIM & be HIS for eternity. Now it's the women feeling the need to wait in the shadows for him to even text her... whilst she is respectful of his need to cave, if it even is that. There's so much missing....there's no relationship or courtship or communication. There's just no direction. No order. No consistency. This guy is an ass. Link to post Share on other sites
Emilia Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 There seems to have been a grand shift in dating... It used to be the man grabbing the woman by the hand & joyfully telling HER to date HIM & be HIS for eternity. that's because it was the only way a lot of people could have sex. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
lana-banana Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 (edited) There seems to have been a grand shift in dating... It used to be the man grabbing the woman by the hand & joyfully telling HER to date HIM & be HIS for eternity. Plenty of men still do this. As of late my boyfriend likes to sing "I like it so I'm gonna put a ring on it". He dances, too, but I don't think Beyonce needs to worry about the competition. Now it's the women feeling the need to wait in the shadows for him to even text her... whilst she is respectful of his need to cave, if it even is that. Again, this isn't true for everyone or even a general trend. Sure, the first few months are always weird, but there's no rule saying you have to wait around for a guy to decide whether he's interested enough to respond. If women are waiting weeks on end for men to get their acts together, that's on us. We deserve better. I know I do. There's so much missing....there's no relationship or courtship or communication. There's just no direction. No order. No consistency. I don't think this is necessarily true. Dating will always change with generations but the general order of things remains the same. I am convinced that relationships today are just as good, bad and ugly as they were 30 or 300 years ago; they're just good, bad and ugly in different ways. If Loveshack existed in 1780 there would probably be a whole subforum about coping with neurosyphilis. This guy is an ass. Yeah, probably. Edited January 16, 2016 by lana-banana 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Maggie4 Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 Men still cave even when physically present. My former boss put a shed in his garden and called it mancave. When a man realises that he is allowed to be the way he wants to be because he is compatible with you, he will disappear less. My current boss drives to work more when he needs time away from his family. The drive is 3 hours each way. That's the only time he gets for himself. Yeah, I know. Some men use the business trip to get away. And then there's the fishing trip with the boys, or tinkering in the garage. Men had these gentleman's clubs where no women are allowed. My Dad's thing was his chess club. The difference between these mancaves and what Gaeta's beau is doing, is that when a man just wants to be away, no one is left wondering if the relationship is still on, employers are not left wondering if the guy is coming back, there is no disappearance. Link to post Share on other sites
tuxedo cat Posted January 17, 2016 Share Posted January 17, 2016 Did he ever respond? Link to post Share on other sites
xxoo Posted January 17, 2016 Share Posted January 17, 2016 I will second this. My dad was addicted to Tetris (the video game) for a while when I was a kid. Physically present, but mentally elsewhere. Don't women do this, too? I workout, or I get on LS. Sometimes I just go into our room and lay on the bed for an hour before dinner, hoping no one knocks Everyone needs time for themselves. Men aren't special in this regard. It doesn't exempt anyone from communicating and being a decent, caring partner. Link to post Share on other sites
losangelena Posted January 17, 2016 Share Posted January 17, 2016 Don't women do this, too? I workout, or I get on LS. Sometimes I just go into our room and lay on the bed for an hour before dinner, hoping no one knocks Everyone needs time for themselves. Men aren't special in this regard. It doesn't exempt anyone from communicating and being a decent, caring partner. I never said women don't do this ... I was simply trotting this out as an example of a parent who's physically present but mentally absent. FWIW, I understand the difference between needing alone time and being checked-out. You think I used the term "addicted" lightly? My dad played Tetris so much that the shape of the playing field was burned into our TV screen. It was a real problem in our family. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Gaeta Posted January 17, 2016 Author Share Posted January 17, 2016 Did he ever respond? No he didn't :-( I got myself to delete all of his texts and pictures today. I made a profile online but my heart isn't in it yet. I feel like why bother it's always the same story. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
losangelena Posted January 17, 2016 Share Posted January 17, 2016 No he didn't :-( I got myself to delete all of his texts and pictures today. I made a profile online but my heart isn't in it yet. I feel like why bother it's always the same story. Oh, chin up, Gaeta. Don't rush things, the men will still be there if you want to take a bit of a break. Some of them hit us harder than others. A couple of years ago I went out only three times with this guy, but he absolutely stole my heart in that time, there was just something about him. Took me a few weeks before I was up for going on another date with someone else. 7 Link to post Share on other sites
xxoo Posted January 17, 2016 Share Posted January 17, 2016 I never said women don't do this ... I was simply trotting this out as an example of a parent who's physically present but mentally absent. FWIW, I understand the difference between needing alone time and being checked-out. You think I used the term "addicted" lightly? My dad played Tetris so much that the shape of the playing field was burned into our TV screen. It was a real problem in our family. I didn't mean only your post, but also the one you were quoting and "seconding": Men still cave even when physically present. Everyone does this to some level. Healthy "caving" isn't a problem, but avoiding and neglecting is. And it's no more a male trait than a female trait, although I suspect men get more allowance to "cave", esp as fathers. What would happen to the kids if dad and mom spent all their hours after work in the garage or in front of the tv? Addiction is abnormal and destructive. It isn't normal. Link to post Share on other sites
losangelena Posted January 17, 2016 Share Posted January 17, 2016 I didn't mean only your post, but also the one you were quoting and "seconding": Everyone does this to some level. Healthy "caving" isn't a problem, but avoiding and neglecting is. And it's no more a male trait than a female trait, although I suspect men get more allowance to "cave", esp as fathers. What would happen to the kids if dad and mom spent all their hours after work in the garage or in front of the tv? Addiction is abnormal and destructive. It isn't normal. Mmm, I have a pretty good idea. xxoo, I think bottom line we agree, just our semantics are different. You're quite right about addiction not being normal. Didn't think about it that way when I wrote it. C'est la vie. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Eternal Sunshine Posted January 17, 2016 Share Posted January 17, 2016 I didn't mean only your post, but also the one you were quoting and "seconding": Everyone does this to some level. Healthy "caving" isn't a problem, but avoiding and neglecting is. And it's no more a male trait than a female trait, although I suspect men get more allowance to "cave", esp as fathers. What would happen to the kids if dad and mom spent all their hours after work in the garage or in front of the tv? Addiction is abnormal and destructive. It isn't normal. I am surprised that there is whole theory on men and caving. I also think that women do it too, depends on a person. I certainly don't think that men should be excused for dropping out of contact because the need to "cave" is in their nature. Women tend to make too many excuses for disrespectful behavior. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
jen1447 Posted January 17, 2016 Share Posted January 17, 2016 No he didn't :-( I got myself to delete all of his texts and pictures today. I made a profile online but my heart isn't in it yet. I feel like why bother it's always the same story. Did you ever watch The Martian? Link to post Share on other sites
Author Gaeta Posted January 17, 2016 Author Share Posted January 17, 2016 Did you ever watch The Martian? Yep I did! It was pretty good entertainment! I watched Police Academy I & II this afternoon, how bored to you think I am !! lol 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Emilia Posted January 17, 2016 Share Posted January 17, 2016 My examples - eg when men physically present but cave - specifically referred to adult children posting about their parents. I think women do it less often because they look after the children, make sure everyone is ok. I also think women are often more emotionally resilient - or aren't afraid of coming across needy. I think the difference between caving and having time to yourself is how you respond when your presence is required. They are not the same thing. As for how much of it anyone puts up with is a different conversation. I think some of the more old school marriages survive because the men provide the space that's good for the couple in general. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
jen1447 Posted January 17, 2016 Share Posted January 17, 2016 Yep I did! It was pretty good entertainment! I watched Police Academy I & II this afternoon, how bored to you think I am !! lol It's not a crisis til you start watching entire seasons of tv shows in one day. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
xxoo Posted January 17, 2016 Share Posted January 17, 2016 My examples - eg when men physically present but cave - specifically referred to adult children posting about their parents. I think women do it less often because they look after the children, make sure everyone is ok. I also think women are often more emotionally resilient - or aren't afraid of coming across needy. I think the difference between caving and having time to yourself is how you respond when your presence is required. They are not the same thing. As for how much of it anyone puts up with is a different conversation. I think some of the more old school marriages survive because the men provide the space that's good for the couple in general. In the case of caving, would it mean neglect when presence is required? If that's the case, I would recommend avoiding anyone who "caves" as a romantic partner, man or woman. When our kids were small, I was a stay at home mom. I had to stand up for myself and insist on my time to myself, or else I'd go nuts. I took an hour between putting the baby to bed and focusing on my H. I started exercising by myself in the afternoons when H was home early. I took a couple hours on Saturday afternoon to see a movie or go window shopping by myself. H had to be home those times to watch the kids. Of course, we made sure that he also had similar time for himself each week (although he wanted time with me as soon as the baby went to bed, and I had to hold that line. I made it up to him after.). Obviously, if at any point the baby woke up or H really needed me, I would suck it up and take care of my family. The flip side of this is a partner who allows the space with grace and love, making it unnecessary to disappear without explanation. People may be more likely to "cave" in the negative way if they don't feel they can get the time they need for themselves. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Gaeta Posted January 18, 2016 Author Share Posted January 18, 2016 OMFG !!!! PARDON MY FRENCH He just called !!! HIS PHONE DIED LAST TUESDAY He lost his contact list, he couldn't remember my last name. He went around to buy a phone but didn't want to spend a fortune on a new phone or get locked in a long contract. Anyway a company lend him a phone today, they switched the chip. He could not retrieve his contact list but my text from Thursday came through so he got my number that way. He said several times he thought of driving by but was not sure, but had decided if it was not solved by this weekend he was coming over today and would have waited at my door. GGGRRR !!! Link to post Share on other sites
tuxedo cat Posted January 18, 2016 Share Posted January 18, 2016 OMFG !!!! PARDON MY FRENCH He just called !!! HIS PHONE DIED LAST TUESDAY He lost his contact list, he couldn't remember my last name. He went around to buy a phone but didn't want to spend a fortune on a new phone or get locked in a long contract. Anyway a company lend him a phone today, they switched the chip. He could not retrieve his contact list but my text from Thursday came through so he got my number that way. He said several times he thought of driving by but was not sure, but had decided if it was not solved by this weekend he was coming over today and would have waited at my door. GGGRRR !!! Does this not sound a little fishy to you? Remember we predicted he'd return with some outlandish excuse? 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts