Affairs and the legacy they leave...

[Cloudcuckoo]

I recently had a conversation with my son and he relayed to me that his lovely girlfriend, an only child, had just discovered that her Father was involved in an affair.

 

My son reiterated how devastated he had been by my husbands affair years ago, and how upset his girlfriend was. He reminded me of the total disillusion he felt when he found out his hero wasn't the man he thought he was.

 

No real question or statement here everyone, just an observation of just how far the fall out of infidelity spreads and how long it can last, especially for our children. What a legacy to give them.....

[The D Train]

I wonder if kids experience that if they will be more likely to be committed or not. Same with divorce, do kids of divorced parents become more committed to staying married? Not sure if I worded that right.

 

 

Different scenario but friend lost his father at young age and then endured a very unhappy marriage. He stayed around until his boys were old enough (out of hs) to limit the affects of divorce - not having a father around consistently.

[Cloudcuckoo]

My son is 30 this year, and at this time is adamant that he will probably not marry, or even have children of his own.

 

It seems terribly sad that the affair fallout might likely alter our children's perceptions, damage their beliefs and leave them with scars of their own, don't you think?

[The D Train]

Well it must have been a humdinger for him to experience. Maybe he can be fortunate to meet the love of his life and raise children and set an example for them.

[Woggle]

They leave lasting damage. I know people who will probably never fully trust the opposite sex because of what they witnessed growing up or what they experienced.

[HereNorThere]

It's taboo [] to mention the life long damage affairs do to children, but I'm glad you brought it up. It is child abuse, period.

 

There's no doubt that divorce harms most children. The statistics show they have higher rates of everything from drug abuse to their own failed marriages. I think for most people that's just a given. Society has long been aware that most undesirables came from broken homes.

 

I think what people fail to mention is that the actual affair hurts the child regardless of whether or not it ends in divorce. The WS takes time from their family to have the affair. The BS takes time from the family to deal with the grief and depression after dday. And I think most importantly, the child has to grow up without knowing who their parents really were. Affairs change both spouses for the worst, forever. A once loving spouse grows up to become a bitter shell of who they used to be. The cheating spouse regresses to almost child like behavior similar to a drug addict and rarely returns to their mature, adult life. The child gets robbed of not only their childhood and home, but also their role models.

 

It's sad all around and I wish people would get called out more for being unfit parents when they get caught. if you can look at your child, the most perfect combination of you and your partner, and betray that child, you don't deserve it in the first place.

Edited January 20, 2016 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Mrs. John Adams]

I am glad that you mentioned that it is abuse.

 

Abuse comes in many forms....MANY....and all of us are effective by choices in life made by others. Alcoholic parents, abusive parents, Molestation, divorce, infidelity...life can be cruel and unfair for the innocent children.

 

In our case, my affair was very brief...and our children were small and never knew about my affair. I am willing to bet that there are many families where infidelity occurred that the infidelity was kept a secret.

 

I have seen kids come from divorced parents who were more determined to keep their marriage together. I have seen kids come from alcoholic parents who have never touched a drop of liquor. So sometimes what doesn't kill us...makes us stronger.

 

Infidelity is a terrible thing that destroys....and while i agree it can have a very negative effect on the children involved...it probably is no more devastating to them or more damaging to them than any other kind of abuse. I am not saying it is not abuse....i am saying any abuse of any kind is unfortunate.

[Cloudcuckoo]

My son (and his three sisters) were forced to bear witness to a Father they felt they could no longer believe would act in their best interests.

 

To this day (and his four year affair ended long ago), they still carry the scars underneath the repaired relationship they have with their Father.

 

Their views regarding marriage are definitely affected forever by their experience of betrayal, despite my enormous efforts to keep the fallout after dday away from them as much as I could.

 

That they have to suffer ANY of the effects of it still makes me feel so sad when I hear the things they say and how they feel when found in a situation such as described by my son. Awful. That my dear boy has to witness this pain in his girlfriend, and feel it all again himself. Sigh......

 

Up pops my guilt for staying, and my husband and I have long since recovered and led an extraordinarily life since ..........

[cocorico]

It's taboo [] to mention the life long damage affairs do to children, but I'm glad you brought it up. It is child abuse, period.

 

I think this varies from case to case.

 

I grew up in a family where warmth and affection were never expressed (if they were even felt) - not between my parents, and not from them to their kids or anyone else. It was a Cold War situation, with occasional outbreaks of open hostility. My mother was a SAHM, disappointed with life, marriage and parenthood, taking her resentment out on us for having ruined her prospects. My father... worked. He'd leave in the morning, return in the evening and tune out with the newspaper, after which he'd disappear into his workshop until bedtime. Weekends he'd tinker in his workshop, or take his motorbike out for a ride - or lie down in his darkened room, alone. He was inaccessible to us. We were at the mercy of our mother - though my brothers less so, as, being boys, they were accorded greater freedoms to escape.

 

In my later teen years, my father had an A. We did not know it at the time; we pieced all the evidence together later. But we did notice the effects, and speculated endlessly. He would arrive home at his usual time, but he would look _happy_. He'd smile, greet us - even occasionally tolerate a hug or a kiss - and talk to us. He'd willingly discuss the paper's headlines with me, or help my little brother with homework, and would eat his supper in the kitchen and allow us to join him if we wished. He'd watch the news or some worthy programme on TV, and chat to us, and weekends he'd be about the house, doing things, accessible. During this time, my mother locked herself away in her bedroom with a bottle, as she'd taken to doing once we had started fleeing from her tyrannical rule.

 

I left home, my little brother finished school, my parents split up and my mother moved away. After a discreet spell, my father started dating - a woman we later worked out had been his OW. They've now been M for decades: longer than my parents had, and far, far happier. He's also far more affectionate towards us - they both are - and they're physically demonstrative toward each other, which I did not once witness between him and my mother.

 

His A taught me that human Rs aren't all destined to be hostile and cold, and that love - when it's there - shares itself with others, too.

Edited January 20, 2016 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Cloudcuckoo]

My only sibling and I were brought up in a loving, demonstrative and supporting environment by two remarkable, devoted and intelligent people.

 

We were given room to grow and learn to respect the feelings of others alongside our parents encouragement to achieve and attain our personal goals.

 

They left behind a legacy of love and respect that inspired me. I do not have one single regret, painful memory, or negative feeling as a result of that dedication from my parents, during the time they were with me on this planet.

 

At the hands of a Father who didn't spare them consideration during his period of self absorption, my children have not been so fortunate.

 

The journey through treacherous waters for them and their Father to recover a loving and respectful relationship was arduous, and those scars are subject to exposure occasionally.

 

Recent events for my son have been a jarring experience for him, for me, and for my husband.

[Httm]

My son is 30 this year, and at this time is adamant that he will probably not marry, or even have children of his own.

 

It seems terribly sad that the affair fallout might likely alter our children's perceptions, damage their beliefs and leave them with scars of their own, don't you think?

 

If he has a girlfriend, then he is fine with relationships. Not everyone desires marriage or kids. He didn't swear off relationships.

[Giggle]

Huh. We watched my mom try and try and try and my dad refuse to change. That gave us a lower threshold for bull**** and limited chances. We saw that both our parents were good people that were not good together. We were glad when they finally got divorced.

 

It greatly depends on the people involved and how they react to it.

[Cloudcuckoo]

If he has a girlfriend, then he is fine with relationships. Not everyone desires marriage or kids. He didn't swear off relationships.

 

That's just the thing, he isn't 'fine' with relationships is he? His perception of a healthy relationship has been affected by his experiences hasn't it, whether he has a girlfriend or not. He hasn't taken a vow of celibacy.

 

I didn't say he had sworn off relationships, neither did I say he was either interested or uninterested in marriage, what I said was that he himself has mentioned that it was unlikely he would marry or have children, because of his experiences, and that saddens me.

[cocorico]

That's just the thing, he isn't 'fine' with relationships is he? His perception of a healthy relationship has been affected by his experiences hasn't it, whether he has a girlfriend or not. He hasn't taken a vow of celibacy.

 

I didn't say he had sworn off relationships, neither did I say he was either interested or uninterested in marriage, what I said was that he himself has mentioned that it was unlikely he would marry or have children, because of his experiences, and that saddens me.

 

I wouldn't put too much stock in that - people change their minds all the time. How many people swear never to drink again in the grips of a bad hangover, but come next weekend... Experiences probably colour what we say (we will do) more than what we actually do. I swore I'd never get married, never have kids... Did both.

[wmacbride]

WE had marital counseling after my spouse cheated, and we also got our children some counseling as well.

 

I can't speak for all families, but I was surprised at just how much of the situation they had absorbed, even though we both thought we did really well at trying to keep the out of it. While they may not have known the nuts and bolts of it as they were very small, they knew mommy was unhappy and daddy was the cause. We hadn't told them anything about the affair, and both did our best to put up a good front.

 

Their counselor told us he saw that quite commonly. There is a fallacy that kids don't pick up on things like that, and that they can't tell when they are being lied to.

 

That's another part of the legacy as well. The lying.

 

Just anecdotaly, I have also heard of children of cheaters who grow up to prefer to get involved with married people themselves. I don't know why that is.

[dreamingoftigers]

WE had marital counseling after my spouse cheated, and we also got our children some counseling as well.

 

I can't speak for all families, but I was surprised at just how much of the situation they had absorbed, even though we both thought we did really well at trying to keep the out of it. While they may not have known the nuts and bolts of it as they were very small, they knew mommy was unhappy and daddy was the cause. We hadn't told them anything about the affair, and both did our best to put up a good front.

 

Their counselor told us he saw that quite commonly. There is a fallacy that kids don't pick up on things like that, and that they can't tell when they are being lied to.

 

That's another part of the legacy as well. The lying.

 

Just anecdotaly, I have also heard of children of cheaters who grow up to prefer to get involved with married people themselves. I don't know why that is.

 

Because, theoretically, we want the cheater to pick us, for once.

 

Personally, I never became an OW and totally dodged that bullet. But the pattern emerged in my actual marriage.

 

My husband being a cheater, reassuring me we had a future and would leave behind the cheating and pick me.

 

I used to read the boards on here and wonder how I could relate to OW emotionally so well, even though I found their choice (and often judgment) to be, ahem, highly questionable.

 

Then it clicked on day. My husband treated me like the OW in my own marriage. He was so focused on getting strange at almost EVERY POSSIBLE OPPORTUNITY that it was more like "cheating" was the "wife" and primary sexual relationship. And I was the side-piece that got the scraps.

 

Even though I was married, "cheater" still didn't pick me.

 

Disclaimer: I had zero idea he was a cheater when I married him.

 

Looking back at my father, he's a classic cheater. So was my mother's father.

 

We marry / relate to patterns. We just do. Unless we become aware of them and confront them.

 

I always found it insulting how my mother tried to "hide" my father's true nature. Not cheating per se. But the fact that he couldn't give two craps about me and was abusive.

 

It would have been much better if she wouldn't have rushed in every time to make some lame excuse about "stress" or "tired." Because in a big way she kept telling me, "this is what love looks like. Always being shown what an inconvenience you are." And if I didn't agree with her (to this day!) she guilts me and comes up with another excuse.

 

My father's one true is alcohol. I think my mother knows that on some level and that's why she refuses to rock the boat about it, despite the fact that my father is losing his vision.

 

Kids know pretty well who cares and who doesn't. I think parents do a nice job of recontextualizing things and it screws them up worse.

[sandylee1]

It affects kids far more than one would think. People say 'kids are resilient..they'll be fine'.... and quite often they act as if they are okay...but the effects are long lasting. For the cheaters and APS. ...they use this rationale to minimise their poor behaviour.

 

One BW told me she overheard her kids talking... saying how they hated their dad for cheating and hated the OW who he was now with even more...but because he was more wealthy and bought them lots of stuff......they had to put on an act and their dad asked/ told them to be nice to the OW. They didn't want to be cut off financially... and dad took them on the more luxurious holidays....

So they abided. They didn't want to be cut off financially.

 

While doing work with high school kids... a few have also said seeing cheating parents has put them off marriage. When I discuss hopes and fears of marriage with them.......infidelity tops the list every time. They're so scared it will happen to them.

 

Many are from divorced homes ...but when it's due to infidelity...they feel differently.

[dreamingoftigers]

It affects kids far more than one would think. People say 'kids are resilient..they'll be fine'.... and quite often they act as if they are okay...but the effects are long lasting. For the cheaters and APS. ...they use this rationale to minimise their poor behaviour.

 

One BW told me she overheard her kids talking... saying how they hated their dad for cheating and hated the OW who he was now with even more...but because he was more wealthy and bought them lots of stuff......they had to put on an act and their dad asked/ told them to be nice to the OW. They didn't want to be cut off financially... and dad took them on the more luxurious holidays....

So they abided. They didn't want to be cut off financially.

 

While doing work with high school kids... a few have also said seeing cheating parents has put them off marriage. When I discuss hopes and fears of marriage with them.......infidelity tops the list every time. They're so scared it will happen to them.

 

Many are from divorced homes ...but when it's due to infidelity...they feel differently.

 

I hate the "kids are resilient" line.

 

It just says, "oh don't worry, you can twist them a lot before they break. You don't have to consider them." Bullshyte.

 

Kids are resilient to a point. But they also aren't stupid and they are developing.

 

I can see what relational instability has done to my daughter and see trouble ahead (even though we are very stable now). Pulling the pin on a kid's security is damaging, I can't understand the people that justify it when there are so so so many stories from so many hurting adults that had destruction in their childhood.

[dreamingoftigers]

I'm kind of the opposite of the financial issue.

 

My father has attempted to manipulate me through finances for well over a decade.

 

To be frank I thought if I ignored it enough, the behaviour would eventually extinguish. But it hasn't. I don't understand WHY it hasn't because I have NEVER taken the bait. He offers to "help" often when I don't need it and tries to talk about how great he is for doing so. And as well, he tries to justify his rampant childhood abuse to me as some kind of "neglect due to having to work so I could offer this help." Its total bull. He was an alcoholic cheater that utterly imploded my self-esteem. His absence would have been kinder. I never accept that crap. Not ever. When I was younger I used to be much more graphic about not accepting.

 

It seems more important to him to be a "financial provider" to give him this sense of, "see I was justified." And, well, that's why I can't accept. I can't validate his abuse of me on any level.

 

I have found this pattern to not be singular to my father. I have often seen former abuser / cheater parents not be able to engage their kids on any other level.

 

My boss for instance split his family due to his adultery. The kids are grown now and his second wife is "so disgusted" that they don't pop over and really visit with their Dad. But he wasn't around much, has trouble connecting to people except for brief, vapid social engagements and doesn't talk to the kids at all socially.

 

He'll pay for birthday dinners and shoot them money, but otherwise doesn't engage them. (I work in his home office and have done waaaaay too many long days there. I also do his bookkeeping and have met his kids etc.)

 

He's talked to me periodically about how he struggled as a father because he "not a social person." But he's a very successful realtor who socializes with people constantly! Whether it be on the job or otherwise.

 

But he chose work as a priority and doesn't engage his kids on any other level.

[MissBee]

If he has a girlfriend, then he is fine with relationships. Not everyone desires marriage or kids. He didn't swear off relationships.

 

Simply having a relationship isn't a marker of anything.

 

The kind of relationship you have, how you are able to experience intimacy or not, the defense mechanisms and coping strategies you use etc. in your relationship say a lot more. And those things tend to be where you see the legacy or influence, not just whether you have a relationship. If emotionally damaged people simply never had relationships life would be far simpler, but they still do, many marry etc and that is where we see dysfunction and the rest coming into play with how they handle their relationships.

[preraph]

Yes, finding out that kind of thing brings up the whole hypocrisy issue and your child loses respect for BOTH parents, the one cheating and the one putting up with it (and not just cheating but any other bad behavior, like not helping around the house and just general disrespect). However you do, that's the way you're telling both male and female kids it's normal to be. Normal to put up with a cheater of someone who doesn't love and respect you enough to help you out, or being that very person. It hurts no matter what happens, but the better long-term message as far as role modeling is to terminate a bad relationship and show your daughter and son that it's not excusable behavior.

[Cloudcuckoo]

Yes, finding out that kind of thing brings up the whole hypocrisy issue and your child loses respect for BOTH parents, the one cheating and the one putting up with it (and not just cheating but any other bad behavior, like not helping around the house and just general disrespect). However you do, that's the way you're telling both male and female kids it's normal to be. Normal to put up with a cheater of someone who doesn't love and respect you enough to help you out, or being that very person. It hurts no matter what happens, but the better long-term message as far as role modeling is to terminate a bad relationship and show your daughter and son that it's not excusable behavior.

 

My son has most certainly never lost respect for me. Ever.

[No Limit]

Well, as the child of two very dysfunctional people...

 

- Never really developed much of an attachment to my father. Funny, the last good memory I have of him is that one time he had to watch me and just took me along to meet one of his OWs. Thank goodness that wasn't one of his batsh-!t crazy OWs, just the naive type (but she was really kind). I'm grateful that he wasn't adamant about wanting to see me and is cut out of my life, I don't think I could handle 2 problematic parents without losing my sanity. I pity the kids who have to stick around bad parents for financial reasons, honestly.

 

- My mother is a different story. Whiny, needy, it's always other people's fault for not helping since she's just a poor helpless woman with a child in tow. Targets married men out of principle because she needs the illusion of being worth more than the betrayed wife, has fallen into a slight depression after her last MM rejected her and now she's stalling/waiting, texting nonstop. Good for me, she leaves me in peace - until she starts her "he'll never find another woman as awesome as me"-monologue. Blocks off immediately when you attempt to encourage her to do things on her own, or threatens suicide. I definitely don't respect her, at all, but remain civil at all times regardless. Seeking conflict isn't in my skillset.

 

 

Personally while I do think that my ability to have 'real relationships' (beyond friendships) has been diminished, I don't consider that a bad thing for now. I don't need a partner for my college degree or university. Having good friendships I can rely on has become more important to me than the poor, half-hearted relationships I get to see on a regular basis.

 

Plus, there just aren't enough crazy cat ladies in the world.

Edited January 27, 2016 by No Limit

[Lobouspo]

Excellent thread

 

 

To this day, my mother who divorced her first husband almost 45 years ago is haunted by the infidelity she endured. It affected my parents marriage and my sister. To this day, the hurt and anger that she feels still comes to the surface at times.