Exploration of Open/Polyamorous in current Long-Term relationship

[janus63]

I have a great relationship and have a really strong connection with my partner. We have been together for just over 10 years on and off.

 

Not too long ago she came to me with an idea of exploring open-relationships. After a little prodding she then tells me that she shared physical intimacy with another man a few days ago and likes him very much. She told me that she needed to know if this will change how she felt towards me and discovered that it hasn't changed one bit. She still loves me as she always has and I genuinely did not feel her treating me any different. I have had thoughts about an open relationship prior to this situation but nonetheless I was saddened by the betrayal of trust as it was not part of our "unspoken agreement" in our relationship.

 

We love each other very much and will probably continue to do so even if we are no longer romantically connected. I have decided to give this open-relationship a go; because I always wanted this but never had the courage to bring it up in fears of hurting one another.

 

Has anyone else tried open/polyamorous relationships?

 

How do you manage your emotions?

 

How do things work out logistically?

 

How do external parties feel if it is more than just sex?

 

Any general advise would be appreciated too!

 

Feel free to prod and ask questions

 

Thanks for reading

[TX-SC]

My poly friends tell me it is extremely easy for a woman to find guys that are okay with just sex, but men have a hard time finding women who want "just sex" with no relationship. Or they prefer single guys which are easy to pick up anyway. At least that's how it is here in the southern US. I recommend that you seriously think this through. The reality is that she has already cheated on you. Chances are not good that this will work out. For it to work there must be 100% honesty and trust. That has already been destroyed.

 

You can't make a poly out of a monogamous person. You are either wired for it, or you are not. I am not, so I would never try it. Some relationships thrive in a poly situation. Unfortunately, I've seen a high failure rate among my friends. I have known five couples that did this. Four are now separated or divorced. In all instances, jealousy or feelings for the other got in the way.

 

Tread with caution. Opening a relationship is no way to fix it. It has to be strong already or it won't work.

 

She cheated. Dump her and move on.

[mrldii]

I don't know much about open / polyamorous relationships (not my thing), but from what I've read/heard about it, I thought there was a pretty big difference between the two.

 

I thought an "open relationship" means each is free to have sex with others, which may or may not be conducted in the other's presence.

 

I thought "poly" meant that each person is into loving other people, whether they are male OR female and that it often does include men-on-men AND women-on-women AND men-on-women (and vice-versa) at the same time.

 

 

If I am correct (and I soooooo could be wrong), if you DO start looking for it, you might want to be real clear on what the terms mean, rather than thinking they're interchangeable.

[MJJean]

You aren't married and you didn't mention any kids. If it ends badly, no one but consenting adults gets hurt. Presumably you both are aware of the physical and emotional risks and have accepted them, so enjoy your experiment.

[kgcolonel]

Doesn't sound as though you had much of a choice here if you still wanted to see her.....she cheateed, confessed and informed you that she was going to pursue it....

 

BTW, Poly means relationships with more than one person, can be hetero, or mono but that isn't from my understanding, defined.

 

I see bad things here....just my opinion.

[MJJean]

I don't know much about open / polyamorous relationships (not my thing), but from what I've read/heard about it, I thought there was a pretty big difference between the two.

 

I thought an "open relationship" means each is free to have sex with others, which may or may not be conducted in the other's presence.

 

I thought "poly" meant that each person is into loving other people, whether they are male OR female and that it often does include men-on-men AND women-on-women AND men-on-women (and vice-versa) at the same time.

 

 

If I am correct (and I soooooo could be wrong), if you DO start looking for it, you might want to be real clear on what the terms mean, rather than thinking they're interchangeable.

 

Open relationships tend to be one or both partners having sexual contact with other people, either together or separately or a combination of both. Quite typically, the couple will have rules in place to prevent emotional involvement with other people. Things like, they can only "play" together or no having sex with the same person more than X number of times, that kind of thing.

 

In Poly relationships, there is emotional involvement on all sides, but not necessarily romantic.

For example, A and B are a couple. They met C and invited C into their relationship. They both care very much for C and C cares for both of them, too. Now, maybe A,B, and C will all share a bed and each others bodies equally. Or maybe C will only have sex with either A or B, but not both.

 

For Poly people, it's not about just sex. It is also about shared emotional involvement

Edited January 25, 2016 by MJJean

[central]

We've been open/poly for 16 years, and it has worked fine for us because we are completely honest with each other, very considerate of each other's feelings, and have an extraordinarily strong relationship.

 

 

OP, you can consider an open/poly relationship, but your wife cheated on you. This is not a good sign for the future strength and stability of your relationship. Rather than discussing this with you, she simply unilaterally made the choice without your input.

 

 

Perhaps she doesn't feel any different towards you (now), but the bottom line is that she isn't trustworthy. Yes, she did inform you - small kudos for that, at least - but should have before she cheated. Yes, it is cheating in this situation. Perhaps you can recover from this bad start, but to do so you need to establish very clear rules and full disclosure to rebuild trust. In time, you may be able to loosen the rules, but only once she has proved herself trustworthy. You need to figure out what rules make sense under the circumstances - or perhaps nothing will actually make this work for you. In that case, she needs to do the work to rebuild trust and give up the open relationship idea.

 

 

And as some have pointed out, she could easily have new partners every week, whereas you may have trouble finding one or two a year. Is that something you can live with? For open relationship pursuits, we've dealt with that by limiting how many new partners and how often she sees any partners to be more in line with my prospects. It's not ideal for either of us, but it works quite well and avoids envy and resentment and the need to close things down. Problems would certainly develop if either of us spent "too much" time with someone else, thereby taking quality time away from our own relationship.

 

 

The poly side is a little different because those relationships are built on much more than sex, and each situation is negotiable and unique. Neither of us have found any viable poly partners in years, though, so it has not been something we've had to figure out lately. Previously, we each had a poly partner, and those relationships lasted for about the same length of time, so there was no opportunity for problems to develop.

Edited January 25, 2016 by central

[kgcolonel]

I couldn't agree more with Central here......resolve the cheating issue first. I think this needs to be addressed before you can even consider entering into a poly / open relationship that requires more trust and honesty than ever....tough start to begin this.

[jen1447]

mrldii's right about the distinction between open and poly. (And that's significant, bc you're going into two very different things w/each one. Some ppl can tolerate outside sex but not romance on the part of their partner, and if you sign up for poly that's exactly what you could get.)

 

I agree w/central that the cheating is an issue. (You said yourself that it was a problem.) So thinking about going poly/open seems to be jumping the gun here ....you've got other issues to deal with first.

 

Has anyone else tried open/polyamorous relationships?

I'm in both. Multiple for each.

 

How do you manage your emotions?

If you're a 'natural' at it, your emotions manage themselves. If you're not fundamentally good w/it your emotions will be crippling. If you are, they won't really come up at all. So there's little grey area - you're either good w/this or not.

 

How do things work out logistically?

 

You mean like time spent w/each? Ppl often ask me how I have time for everyone but the reality is adult ppl w/adult lives are busy and don't have tons of disposable time to spend w/someone anyway. So most likely your GF's BFs would just naturally spend time when you were already busy, etc.

 

How do external parties feel if it is more than just sex?

Don't understand the Q ....

[dichotomy]

"We love each other very much and will probably continue to do so even if we are no longer romantically connected."

 

 

This is an interesting point.

 

What would you define a relationship where both partners are involved with others, but not really romantically involved with each other anymore ?

 

I mean I assume in and open or poly relationship the married couple are still "primaries" and/or having sex together, but what if they are not ?

 

 

 

 

P.S.

 

By the way, I came to a view (theory I guess) that my wife, when single, was actually poly but did not understand that when she wanted to marry me. I think this caused alot of pain for both of us.. for her to make transition back to monogamy and exclusiveness.

[jen1447]

What would you define a relationship where both partners are involved with others, but not really romantically involved with each other anymore ?

 

I mean I assume in and open or poly relationship the married couple are still "primaries" and/or having sex together, but what if they are not ?

 

Friends with benefits. Srsly, the basics are the same as w/'normal' ppl. (I don't know many married poly ppl btw so the way it would more often work is the former couple just split romantically and go their own ways while keeping up the sex. No years-long divorces and all that. And some other partner or partners would probably take on the primary role.)

 

 

 

 

P.S.

 

By the way, I came to a view (theory I guess) that my wife, when single, was actually poly but did not understand that when she wanted to marry me. I think this caused alot of pain for both of us.. for her to make transition back to monogamy and exclusiveness.

That's interesting. What makes you think she was poly?

[dichotomy]

 

 

That's interesting. What makes you think she was poly?

 

Sigh - okay dont want to step on this thread but its about poly so...

 

I discovered that my wife -from dating, through engagement, till shortly after we married, had remained in an "emotional relationship" with a older MM she had previously been sexual with for years. Basically cheating on me in hidden emotional affair. Because of this I end up spying heavily getting into her emails and really trying to understand WTF was going on - and trying to talk to her and understand this time frame. I discovered for the 3-4 years between marriages she had her on going MM, several on going on and off relationships and dating as well. While some were just causal dating/sex guys, from the emails and later discussions with her - there was the term "love" used for several of the on going (or on and off) partners she was seeing at the same time. She was emotional invested in several men at once - including ones she had sex but stopped and remained emotionally connected. She once mentioned in an argument with me - that for her loving begets loving - it grows and circulates when she can love others.

 

After I forced her to end all contact (of course) with MM and others on DDay - she had a very hard time adjusting and her libido dropped significantly. She loves differently and view sex differently than anyone I know. Things have gotten better years later in our marriage, but still its missing something I think for her.

 

Thats my theory anyway. She stopped going to a sexual and marriage therapist we had seen for a year before we got to the bottom of the issues fully.

Edited January 25, 2016 by dichotomy

[jen1447]

Is that what the therapist thought?

[dichotomy]

Is that what the therapist thought?

 

 

Short answer - she has no idea.

 

Our marriage sex therapist (who by the way kind of looks like your avatar ) spent nearly a year with us as a couple. Towards the very end of our couples work - I offered my theory that she was poly -or simply had issues with monogamy. It was also discussed that maybe she had Madonna whore issues, or issues with her late father (a serial cheater).

 

The therapist in our last couples session finally said to my wife "you have an amazing husband, a rare find, who many women would love to have - I don't understand why have lost your sexual passion and kink you used to have with others - please start seeing me by yourself for now so we can find out whats going on".

 

My wife went for 2 more sessions by herself and stopped. I got tired of pushing and stopped asking her to go.

 

Other than sex - our marriage had improved greatly over the years since we married. We resolved alot of issues and she has grown as a mom, and partner. Also for me - at least I had gotten that it had nothing to do with me and I could drop the self esteem issues I had - and drop the constant efforts to get her in the mood.

 

I went back to the therapist once last time by myself, to see if she had any last advice - and she said she still could not figure out my wife and needed more individual work with her.

 

I will add that our sex life has improved since then - but it had gotten so bad - that even with improvement its less than average. I know my wife is trying, she has a love for me and our life, but she just can't seem to find the passion she had when she was in that 3-4 year life style. Its just my view she was living a poly lifestyle because I don't know how else to classify it.

Edited January 25, 2016 by dichotomy

[jen1447]

Hm ....well fwiw she doesn't sound entirely poly to me. More like she's unsure of herself and/or confused about others. Tho the concurrent relationships thing does suggest some of that ....hard to say from where I'm sitting.

 

Can I ask why you forced her to end all those relationships? I mean I understand to go down monogamy road you don't want her having romances w/a bunch of ppl but it seems kinda harsh to make her ditch a bunch of friends.

 

And btw yes - I'm secretly your therapist and I've been on here for the last year just to spy on you.

[dichotomy]

Hm ....well fwiw she doesn't sound entirely poly to me. More like she's unsure of herself and/or confused about others. Tho the concurrent relationships thing does suggest some of that ....hard to say from where I'm sitting.

 

Can I ask why you forced her to end all those relationships? I mean I understand to go down monogamy road you don't want her having romances w/a bunch of ppl but it seems kinda harsh to make her ditch a bunch of friends.

 

And btw yes - I'm secretly your therapist and I've been on here for the last year just to spy on you.

 

Don't scare me like that. Besides I had a little crush on my therapist. She was wonderfully helpful to me and easy on the eyes.

 

Look my wife was cheating on me with MM, and had been incredibly disrespectful (she let me have a beer with him and her before I knew). MM along with other sex partners who were cheaters, liars to me, or not respecting monogamy and marriage had to go - period. This included her best female friend at that time who set up and encourage relationship with MM. Honestly I could not tell friends from sex partners or lovers at that point. The therapist was more than supportive of this boundary setting.

 

But to be fair, there was were many old time friends, and even 1-2 old time boyfriends whom have remained in our (her) life. I even allowed one of those boyfriends (who she said at one point was just a friend) to our wedding because he was a long time decent friend, who she just slept with during her 3-4 year phase. So I was not asking for complete cut off.

 

 

P.S. I have been here for a while - and don't think I have ever said all this openly.

Edited January 25, 2016 by dichotomy

[jen1447]

Don't scare me like that. Besides I had a little crush on my therapist. She was wonderfully helpful to me and easy on the eyes.

 

Look my wife was cheating on me with MM, and had been incredibly disrespectful (she let me have a beer with him and her before I knew). MM along with other sex partners who were cheaters, liars to me, or not respecting monogamy and marriage had to go - period. This included her best female friend at that time who set up and encourage relationship with MM. Honestly I could not tell friends from sex partners or lovers at that point. The therapist was more than supportive of this boundary setting.

 

But to be fair, there was were many old time friends, and even 1-2 old time boyfriends whom have remained in our (her) life. I even allowed one of those boyfriends (who she said at one point was just a friend) to our wedding because he was a long time decent friend, who she just slept with during her 3-4 year phase. So I was not asking for complete cut off.

 

 

P.S. I have been here for a while - and don't think I have ever said all this openly.

 

Ok that sounds better. Only thing I take issue w/now is the notion of "allowing" or "not allowing" (just bc it sounds domineering), but this probably isn't the thread to analyze your relationship overall.

[dichotomy]

Ok that sounds better. Only thing I take issue w/now is the notion of "allowing" or "not allowing" (just bc it sounds domineering), but this probably isn't the thread to analyze your relationship overall.

 

 

I get you- I was taught by the therapist to establish boundaries instead of make demands.

 

Demand - I won't allow you to do xyz ! I demand you stop this right now.

 

Boundary - If you continue to do XYZ - I will see it as a betrayal and unloving and wont stay with you.

 

Its a fine distinction but it allows freedom of choice and action by both.

 

Taking this to open or Poly - there are rule or boundaries to be established yes? if OP and his wife wish to proceed?

Edited January 25, 2016 by dichotomy

[jen1447]

Taking this to open or Poly - there are rule or boundaries to be established yes? if OP and his wife wish to proceed?

 

Yeah but going to rules and boundaries at this stage is putting the cart before the horse. First he has to figure out if he's a poly candidate at all. (And it kinda sounds like he isn't.)

[SolG]

She once mentioned in an argument with me - that for her loving begets loving - it grows and circulates when she can love others.

 

After I forced her to end all contact (of course) with MM and others on DDay - she had a very hard time adjusting and her libido dropped significantly. She loves differently and view sex differently than anyone I know. Things have gotten better years later in our marriage, but still its missing something I think for her.

 

Thank you for sharing dichotomy. I've grappled with similar issues but from the other side of the coin. When my xH and I met and married we were happily non-monogamous. We both had other lovers; not NSA sex or swinging, but other discreet 'attachments'. With varying degrees of emotion. Some even friends to both of us, some more remote. I don't know how I'd label it... It was what it was. And it was great :-)

 

But then our careers took off... We had a child... We got older... Life got busy. And he, to use his words, 'grew out of it'. (For him apparently he was always at heart a monogamist who was just having his wild phase :-/) And expected that I would too. I didn't. I couldn't; it's part of who I am. I can physically and emotionally love more than one person and am happier when I do. To me it is incredibly loving and joyous to be able to share that with an SO with mutual trust and security. It exhibits great strength and confidence. It's like a gift. It makes me love them more.

 

I know it's probably hard for a monogamist to understand... But for me when my xH started renegotiating our boundaries is when I started to lose respect and attraction for him. It was rock solid when he not only accepted, but embraced me for me. But when he started to change things... To me it appeared weak. He wanted to change due to his insecurity and doubt. It was our death knell. It's ironic really.

 

We stayed together a really long time, but ultimately separated amicably. We still have a lot of love for each other, but know we are at the most fundamental levels incompatible. My marriage didn't fail, it changed. And I'm blessed to have experienced it.

 

OP, I hope there's a least a little insight you can gain from our stories.

[dichotomy]

SolG,

 

Thank you for sharing, I hope OP learns from your post. I did.

 

After so many years with my wife, and being on L.S. i have grown to understand a little better alternative views and practices on love and sex, and even how it can change over a lifetime for someone.

 

OP is dealing with this with his wife. She has all of a sudden changed what type of marriage or love life she wants - but she did it dishonestly by not going first to her husband to discuss her needs and desires.

 

Your husband also changed his mind but I guess he expressed this honestly.

 

My wife was very careful to be dishonest with me. One of the things I struggled with was why she was so open and honest with her numerous partners during these few years - but clammed up when she met me and more important than hiding it - she could not let go fully until it all spilled out.

 

I hope the OP can focus on his wife's dishonesty, and establish boundaries. I suspect he will struggle with poly if is not part of his makeup. I think Poly is harder than swinging or open sex only marriages. I think it takes a rare person to manage and thrive on multiple loves.

 

I can't love more than one woman at a time, I also don't think I can accept love from someone to whom I am one of several. I think this issue remains for me in my marriage even though she has said repeatedly she lost all those feelings long ago after our therapy. Funny thing is - she can be very jealous and insecure if there is a hint another woman fancies me but she also ramps up her passion when that feeling comes over her.

Edited January 25, 2016 by dichotomy

[Mr. Lucky]

I can't love more than one woman at a time

 

Wow, I can barely keep one partner happy. The thought of taking on more than that is mind-boggling.

 

I'm always struck by the gap between word and deed - many open and poly relationships use words like "love" and "trust" and yet the participants (or proposed participants in the OP's case) often act in ways that are neither loving nor trustworthy.

 

I'll admit my views might be biased by my lack of enthusiasm for the life...

 

Mr. Lucky

[janus63]

Thanks for sharing guys, I greatly appreciate the insights.

 

OP, you can consider an open/poly relationship, but your wife cheated on you. This is not a good sign for the future strength and stability of your relationship. Rather than discussing this with you, she simply unilaterally made the choice without your input.

 

 

Perhaps she doesn't feel any different towards you (now), but the bottom line is that she isn't trustworthy. Yes, she did inform you - small kudos for that, at least - but should have before she cheated. Yes, it is cheating in this situation. Perhaps you can recover from this bad start, but to do so you need to establish very clear rules and full disclosure to rebuild trust. In time, you may be able to loosen the rules, but only once she has proved herself trustworthy. You need to figure out what rules make sense under the circumstances - or perhaps nothing will actually make this work for you. In that case, she needs to do the work to rebuild trust and give up the open relationship idea.

 

To clarify, we are not married and we do not have dependents. I totally agree with you central. The breakage of trust was the bigger problem rather than the act itself. Nonetheless I've decided to give this a go. There will be some work required in rebuilding the trust we previously had with each other.

 

"We love each other very much and will probably continue to do so even if we are no longer romantically connected."

 

 

This is an interesting point.

 

What would you define a relationship where both partners are involved with others, but not really romantically involved with each other anymore ?

 

I mean I assume in and open or poly relationship the married couple are still "primaries" and/or having sex together, but what if they are not ?

 

To clarify dichotomy, what I meant to say is that even if we decided to not be in this relationship label of "partners/primary/etc" we will and always have treated each other like family despite our relationship status and would not change our interactions too much aside from sexual activities; and even then I am doubtful.

 

Intellectually, I have always explored the idea of open/poly relationships but never had the gut to talk to my partner about it in depth in fears of hurting her. Though some "trust damage" has been done, I doubt that it is irreparable. Even if things eventually turn sour I have but all to gain as I will learn a lot from this. I suppose my optimism stems from me finding myself being really happy for her when she found a boyfriend in our brief moment of separation to the point of wanting to meet him with no malicious or ulterior motives.

 

I really learnt a lot from everyone and I am grateful for it. It will take sometime for me to process everything.

Edited January 26, 2016 by janus63
Missed end quote

[oldshirt]

Janus, I have several years of experience with swinging and I am generally supportive of consensual nonmonogamy as long as all parties are acting in good faith and sign off on it.

 

From what you are telling us here I see this is a simple case of her feeding you a line of word salad and playing you for a fool and a chump.

 

She is simply seeing and banging another dude on the side and using slick words and smoke and mirrors to sell you a shiny, gold plated turd.

It may shine and sparkle when the pretty words come out her mouth but she is still talking ****. You just need to step in a little closer and take a whiff of her breath and you'll smell that it is a turd.

 

Since you aren't married and don't have kids, my reccomendation is just get back on the dating market yourself and just carry on with your life and let her carry on with hers.

 

She's just playing you for a chump and so far you are falling for it. She's just seeing other dudes but hasn't gotten around to dumping you yet. She's simply seeing other people and keeping you on reserve if they don't work out.

 

This isn't an "open relationship." It's simply multi dating and promiscuity and screwing around while trying to give it a sparkly name.

[TX-SC]

She wanted HIM so much that she was willing to lose YOU for him. She cheated, not knowing if you would buy the open relationship idea or not. There is a simple reality here: you are codependant and making more of this relationship than she is. You are painting your gf as the perfect soulmate. She cheated. That's not a soulmate. That's not even a good gf. All of these connections you feel you have with her meant nothing while she was screwing BF #2. You are simply too naive to see what this really means. This relationship will not last. It might limp along for a while if you open it up, but eventually she will leave you. When she does, you will have invested more time in it than you should have and it will hurt even more.