Consolidated Discussion: Height in Dating

[NJ123]

Lots of women on dating sites have crummy long-term experiences because their unrealistic height preferences lead to a tiny pool of men who are already deluged with women and consequently love being players. Lots of women have found that they can improve their experience by changing their height restrictions online (which is a way of changing their preferences). By losing an artificial limiting fixation on Titan height they widen their pool of possible dating partners and meet better men. So yes, we do need to "whine" about many girls only dating men 6 feet tall or over. It would benefit everyone. There's really nothing wrong with what I'm advocating here.

 

My friend told me almost the same exact thing a little while ago. He has a good job, has a really fun personality & is confident. He's only about 5'8'" or 5'9" though. Even he has trouble due to women's expectations being overboard at least with online dating. It's scary how that's how it is out there & it's why so many people are jaded.

[lightfoot]

oh ok, i can see you are just one of the ones that wants to complain about what is. Instead of wanting to do anything about it. It's not insensitive and you do want a PC answer.

 

I'm not complaining about anything. If anything I'm warding off uninformed and unconcerned views of this issue.

 

Of course it's insensitive to shrug off people who have a serious problem you don't.

 

I don't want a PC answer, I want to help people learn.

 

This is not really an "ethical" issue.

 

Marginalization of a large segment of the male population based on a genetic trait sounds like an ethical issue to me.

 

People like what they like. Research the facts: it is a biological preference.

 

Yes, preferring a greater height was always natural -- but nothing like now. Online dating, high heels, mass media and popular culture, are what gave us the mantra that the ideal height of a man is 6 feet. What does that make the vast majority of the male population then? -- non-ideal. There is no biological force that could encourage women to be hesitant about 85% of the males. This is social. And since society made it, society can change it.

 

I'm trying to give you reasons that it should not matter to you as in IN SPITE of that, there are ways around it, that YOU can apply specifically, which is no less ridiculous than trying to convince an entire gender that their preferences should evolve. If you want YOUR particular situation to change (which I pretty much think it would the moment you had a gf) then do something about it with what you have.

 

I understand, but your solution is to urge short guys to become "Extraordinary Gentlemen" and make up for their height. It works for some short guys, and Tom Cruise and Elijah Wood, but not all or even most short guys can do this. Not everyone can shine. I say the problem isn't with them. If a short guy is perfectly average, why should he be completely alone because he doesn't have any amazing attractions? Besides, you're assuming that most short guys who can't get dates because of their height are basically doing nothing to increase their status or appeal. That's not true. Plenty of them do and see it doesn't work very well.

 

BTW, I just got back from spending time with my gf who has been away and her new guy that she really really likes is 5'6". So maybe there is another reason you are not having success? As this thread was on my mind, I asked what his personality was like, she said super confident, assured and smart. Has his sh*t together. So height isn't stopping her.

 

She's trying to look good. Women are as visual as men... if not more so because they have much more choice.

 

Believe me, men of short stature are judged as soon as they are seen, and they aren't only treated differently in dating.

 

I still don't find the other poster remark in the least offensive.

 

Yes, but you're not a short man. We found it very offensive. I'm not very offended by black jokes because I'm not black -- but they're still wrong.

 

What you can 'do about it" is develop the rest of yourself and stop harping on it and worrying about "shoulds"; it comes of as bitter which will definitely hurt you in the dating world. In other words you are not doing yourself any favors by being hung up on something you cannot change.

 

Well, this is the first time I'm participating in a discussion of height in relationships. I don't harp about it anywhere else. I'm aware of it though.

 

Not trying to trivialize anything you are going through--just trying to make you see the light; your height isn't going to change, so you attitude about it better. It's you that sees yourself as "less than" with because you are worried about women's preferences. It will stop you some of the time but not all of the time. It only takes one to be your gf/wife. Be the best you and put that forth and the right girl will appreciate you for you.

 

Thank you. I appreciate that you've validated my past experiences. But there is no right girl, it is what it is and there's nothing wrong with trying to change it.

 

BTW, if you had read all my posts on this thread you would know i personally don't mind if a guy is shorter. That's not me being PC--because I never would be since it is not necessary on this thread. I'm just stating my preferences. Height would not be a deal breaker for me, while other things would. No one is trying to offend you by stating their dating history:sick:

 

Are you saying you don't mind if a guy is shorter than a certain level, or if a guy is shorter than you? I have zero issue with women refusing to date anyone shorter than them -- I'm 5'7" and most women are shorter than me.

[LD1990]

You're taking two things of completely different magnitudes and details and making them equal. Most women are well-endowed; women who are not can become well-endowed; most men are much more open-minded about breast size than women are about height.

 

Once again you completely miss the point. I'm not comparing the difficulties of having small breasts with the difficulties of being short. I'm not making them equal. I'm saying that education doesn't change what someone finds physically attractive, and using large breasts as an example. If a guy only finds large breasts (or small breasts) attractive, no amount of education will change that. If a woman only finds tall guys attractive, no amount of education will change that.

 

Now you're insulting just about everybody here. At least half a dozen other guys in this thread are "whining about how women prefer men above 6 feet."

 

Well don't I just feel terrible. Mean old me interrupted 20 pages of complaining.

 

Education and awareness can help women who are dreaming of a guy in the 14 per cent to make more balanced and realistic choices. Preferences can be learned. A hundred years ago, dating a black man was enough to send society into a rage.

 

Or those women could just decide what they find attractive and men could focus on what they can control in regards to attraction.

[lightfoot]

I'm a normal guy and I find women with large breasts more attractive than women with small breasts. The difference is, I'm aware that this is superficial and dumb. It didn't control my dating.

 

Honestly, when it comes to looks average or slightly above average has always been enough for me. I'm much pickier about personality these days.

 

It can't be socially acceptable for women to practice extreme height discrimination anymore.

 

Preference is partially the result of social conditioning. Social conditioning can change. Once upon a time, no woman would ever consider dating a black man. Now many do.

 

You're expending all this energy on saying something's impossible when it's never been tried.

Edited October 16, 2016 by lightfoot

[NJ123]

So you're saying every woman I come across whether it's at my job judges me right when they see me just due to my height? Almost every single woman I've had to interact with at my job over the past year has been really nice to me. So are they just being superficially nice to me where they're belittling me in their minds when they see me? I just think that's way too far fetched to be true.

[Gr8fuln2020]

So you're saying every woman I come across whether it's at my job judges me right when they see me just due to my height? Almost every single woman I've had to interact with at my job over the past year has been really nice to me. So are they just being superficially nice to me where they're belittling me in their minds when they see me? I just think that's way too far fetched to be true.

 

NJ123. There's nothing you can do. Just keep trying. Don't give up on asking taller women and seek out those just as tall or shorter. Preferences are preferences and people oftentimes don't budge on some. Just keeping at it. I'm sorry, but have you ever had a relationship?

[Versacehottie]

 

I'm not complaining about anything. If anything I'm warding off uninformed and unconcerned views of this issue.

 

Of course it's insensitive to shrug off people who have a serious problem you don't.

 

I don't want a PC answer, I want to help people learn.

 

 

 

Marginalization of a large segment of the male population based on a genetic trait sounds like an ethical issue to me.

 

 

 

Yes, preferring a greater height was always natural -- but nothing like now. Online dating, high heels, mass media and popular culture, are what gave us the mantra that the ideal height of a man is 6 feet. What does that make the vast majority of the male population then? -- non-ideal. There is no biological force that could encourage women to be hesitant about 85% of the males. This is social. And since society made it, society can change it.

 

 

 

I understand, but your solution is to urge short guys to become "Extraordinary Gentlemen" and make up for their height. It works for some short guys, and Tom Cruise and Elijah Wood, but not all or even most short guys can do this. Not everyone can shine. I say the problem isn't with them. If a short guy is perfectly average, why should he be completely alone because he doesn't have any amazing attractions? Besides, you're assuming that most short guys who can't get dates because of their height are basically doing nothing to increase their status or appeal. That's not true. Plenty of them do and see it doesn't work very well.

 

 

 

She's trying to look good. Women are as visual as men... if not more so because they have much more choice.

 

Believe me, men of short stature are judged as soon as they are seen, and they aren't only treated differently in dating.

 

 

 

Yes, but you're not a short man. We found it very offensive. I'm not very offended by black jokes because I'm not black -- but they're still wrong.

 

 

 

Well, this is the first time I'm participating in a discussion of height in relationships. I don't harp about it anywhere else. I'm aware of it though.

 

 

 

Thank you. I appreciate that you've validated my past experiences. But there is no right girl, it is what it is and there's nothing wrong with trying to change it.

 

 

 

Are you saying you don't mind if a guy is shorter than a certain level, or if a guy is shorter than you? I have zero issue with women refusing to date anyone shorter than them -- I'm 5'7" and most women are shorter than me.

 

sigh.......i can see we are going to get nowhere quickly. While I understand your experience and need to vent about it AND/OR even the desire to change the perspectives of all women, I certainly won't agree that it's the best use of your own particular effort. Therefore on that note, I'll will stop responding to your posts so you can focus on changing the world. Good luck with that.

 

ps 5'7' guy I have dated AND was completely into. I didn't feel great about wearing heels around him but none of that was a deal breaker. Lots of girls liked him as well.

[Buddhist]

So 21 pages boils down to 'I want women to prefer short men because I am one of them'. Okay, it's about as useful as a large woman starting an 'education' campaign to have all men prefer large women because she is one. Not going to happen.

 

Once again I'll repeat for those not yet clued up about this little gem of life...

 

If you are waiting for the world to change before you can be happy you will be unhappy your entire life.

 

There are whole countries where the predominant height of men is well below 6ft and they're not having trouble getting laid. There are short men in westernised countries having no trouble getting laid. Clearly this is not some universal injustice, it's a problem existing mainly in the minds of short men in certain social cultures who feel inadequate for whatever reason. Someone's personal insecurity is not something we need to educate the world about.

[LD1990]

It can't be socially acceptable for women to practice extreme height discrimination anymore.

 

So what are you saying should happen? Should women be shamed for what they find attractive?

 

Preference is partially the result of social conditioning. Social conditioning can change. Once upon a time, no woman would ever consider dating a black man. Now many do.

 

You're expending all this energy on saying something's impossible when it's never been tried.

 

OK, but what change can really happen here, and more importantly, why should it? Women, and society in general, consider certain physical traits attractive. We can't equalize everything. You could literally apply your complaint to any physical trait. A chiseled jawline, blue eyes, abs, a great smile. Some people are born with certain attractive physical features, some aren't, that's life.

[lightfoot]

So 21 pages boils down to 'I want women to prefer short men because I am one of them'. Okay, it's about as useful as a large woman starting an 'education' campaign to have all men prefer large women because she is one. Not going to happen.

 

Once again I'll repeat for those not yet clued up about this little gem of life...

 

If you are waiting for the world to change before you can be happy you will be unhappy your entire life.

 

There are whole countries where the predominant height of men is well below 6ft and they're not having trouble getting laid. There are short men in westernised countries having no trouble getting laid. Clearly this is not some universal injustice, it's a problem existing mainly in the minds of short men in certain social cultures who feel inadequate for whatever reason. Someone's personal insecurity is not something we need to educate the world about.

 

Please don't pretend you read anything I wrote because I wrote plenty and if that's all you gathered from it then you're certainly trying to straw man me.

 

A straw man is a common form of argument and is an informal fallacy based on giving the impression of refuting an opponent's argument, while actually refuting an argument that was not advanced by that opponent ("I want women to prefer short men because I'm one of them").

[NJ123]

So what are you saying should happen? Should women be shamed for what they find attractive?

 

 

 

OK, but what change can really happen here, and more importantly, why should it? Women, and society in general, consider certain physical traits attractive. We can't equalize everything. You could literally apply your complaint to any physical trait. A chiseled jawline, blue eyes, abs, a great smile. Some people are born with certain attractive physical features, some aren't, that's life.

 

A lot of guys that are short likely feel the woman will be settling for them since a lot of women in general prefer tall over short. If you notice, whenever a woman states she dated a short guy there's always some negative sort of comment that goes along with. It's like "I dated a guy that was 5'6" & he was very attractive BUT it sucked wearing heels when with him." And I've stated this before but usually whenever a woman states she dated a shorter guy in the past, those same women seem a lot of the time to wind up with some 6'2" guy anyway as their current boyfriend or husband. I just feel maybe some women give a few shorter guys a chance but still don't feel that same level of attraction towards them as taller guys.

[lightfoot]

Might be time for me to quit this thread. Only short men understand the pain, limitations, and stigma of being a short man. Women (even very picky ones) and men who don't have this problem pretend the problem doesn't exist or is inevitable and doesn't deserve criticism, and try to convince short men it's all in their heads or they just gotta deal. We won't get anywhere.

[Buddhist]

Please don't pretend you read anything I wrote because I wrote plenty and if that's all you gathered from it then you're certainly trying to straw man me.

 

I read everything you wrote that is why I bothered to reply. In effect you are trying to sell the argument that there is some wholesale discrimination going on against short men. Yet there's less than 5 short men on this thread actually attesting that to be true for them. I know plenty of short men (shorter than me 5ft 3) to be in positions of power and influence. I know many short men who have no trouble at all obtaining relationships. There are whole countries of short men who do not experience this mysterious discrimination you claim exists.

 

Until you can back up your claims with some kind of evidence besides your personal opinion, it will remain a personal opinion. Discrimination occurs where there is evidence of wholesale prejudice that is measurable.

[Gr8fuln2020]

NJ123. What do want the ladies or anyone else to say to appease you?

 

1. Women, many, do discriminate against shorter men. GIVEN.

2. There are exceptions as I said, I've dated women up to 4 inches taller than myself. My sister is seriously dating a shorter, balding guy. :-) My brother is married to a beautiful red-head who is 3+ inches taller than he is.

3. It is cultural, not evolutionary as some ladies would erroneously claim as an excuse.

4. There's nothing you can do about it, so get out there and look for that special lady.

5. You can't change a thing venting here...unless you need to vent, then okay.

[NJ123]

NJ123. What do want the ladies or anyone else to say to appease you?

 

1. Women, many, do discriminate against shorter men. GIVEN.

2. There are exceptions as I said, I've dated women up to 4 inches taller than myself. My sister is seriously dating a shorter, balding guy. :-) My brother is married to a beautiful red-head who is 3+ inches taller than he is.

3. It is cultural, not evolutionary as some ladies would erroneously claim as an excuse.

4. There's nothing you can do about it, so get out there and look for that special lady.

5. You can't change a thing venting here...unless you need to vent, then okay.

 

1. Yes, they do. I can't tell you how many times I've seen women on their dating profiles stating to please be tall.

2. Of course there's exceptions but it's not the norm. I rarely see the guy being shorter than the woman.

3. Agree

4. This is true, but the shame in it is that due to something I have no control over I'll have a way more difficult time.

5. True, people vent though due to being frustrated.

[Versacehottie]

A lot of guys that are short likely feel the woman will be settling for them since a lot of women in general prefer tall over short. If you notice, whenever a woman states she dated a short guy there's always some negative sort of comment that goes along with. It's like "I dated a guy that was 5'6" & he was very attractive BUT it sucked wearing heels when with him." And I've stated this before but usually whenever a woman states she dated a shorter guy in the past, those same women seem a lot of the time to wind up with some 6'2" guy anyway as their current boyfriend or husband. I just feel maybe some women give a few shorter guys a chance but still don't feel that same level of attraction towards them as taller guys.

 

lol, if you are referring to my comment that was similar, that was qualifying it for the sake of the discussion going on here. Like some of the women have said on this thread, it's not necessarily a reflection of the guy when a girl feels taller or bigger than him, it's often the way we want to feel about ourselves. Plus I like wearing heels just as an expression of myself. There are a ton of compromises and considerations people make within a relationship. Neither the reason I chose him or the reason I was with him was related to his height--nor was it on the next one. I thought he was gorgeous. Period, end of. I thought next one, a different height, was gorgeous--period, end of.

[NuevoYorko]

The problem isn't with short men, the problem is with discrimination and those who practice it.

I think you must be kidding. "Discrimination" does not happen in dating. We all end up with who we like the most, who also likes us back. Nobody is obliged to go out with someone to whom they aren't attracted or else be accused of discrimination.

 

This concept actually is insulting to the real, serious problem of discrimination.

 

Work with what you've got, man. Plenty of short men are married, dating, partying with the women of their dreams while others are sitting at their computers outraged at the unfairness of it all.

[NJ123]

lol, if you are referring to my comment that was similar, that was qualifying it for the sake of the discussion going on here. Like some of the women have said on this thread, it's not necessarily a reflection of the guy when a girl feels taller or bigger than him, it's often the way we want to feel about ourselves. Plus I like wearing heels just as an expression of myself. There are a ton of compromises and considerations people make within a relationship. Neither the reason I chose him or the reason I was with him was related to his height--nor was it on the next one. I thought he was gorgeous. Period, end of. I thought next one, a different height, was gorgeous--period, end of.

 

But I'm not even exaggerating. I can't tell you how many times I've heard that whenever someone stated they dated a shorter guy, almost every time it turns out they wind up with some tall guy as their current boyfriend or husband. It just can't be a coincidence. There must be a reason why that happens.

 

And it's just funny how women want guys to not be insecure/not confident, yet a lot of women always state about being insecure with being taller since it doesn't make them feel feminine enough. I really can understand if the woman was like 4 or 5 inches taller, but if it's just a few inches more I really just don't get it. And than factor in the whole heel thing, I don't mean it to be a slight at you, but it's an in general statement where a lot of women still want to be shorter than the guy even in 4 inch heels. How are many shorter guys going to stand a chance with that type of mentality so many women have?

[Versacehottie]

But I'm not even exaggerating. I can't tell you how many times I've heard that whenever someone stated they dated a shorter guy, almost every time it turns out they wind up with some tall guy as their current boyfriend or husband. It just can't be a coincidence. There must be a reason why that happens.

 

And it's just funny how women want guys to not be insecure/not confident, yet a lot of women always state about being insecure with being taller since it doesn't make them feel feminine enough. I really can understand if the woman was like 4 or 5 inches taller, but if it's just a few inches more I really just don't get it. And than factor in the whole heel thing, I don't mean it to be a slight at you, but it's an in general statement where a lot of women still want to be shorter than the guy even in 4 inch heels. How are many shorter guys going to stand a chance with that type of mentality so many women have?

 

Yes I hear you and gave you my personal reasons which match some of the reasons other girls have (I don't like feeling bigger than the guy; stylistically i like to wear heels to feel like myself some of the time). Contrary to the arguments against that it isn't a biologically/evolutionary motivated thing, i think if you research it, you will find evidence that will back up the fact that it is. I have read it many times. It's probably that women want to feel protected; as outdated as that notion is in this time. It doesn't mean it goes away in our genes. Same as a preference for blondes, an ideal hip-to-waist ratio and so on and so forth. Say ANYTHING you want to find in a girl looks wise and you have your preference and what you might accept and still be quite happy. You can't really help what you find most attractive so it's quite silly to argue about it or try to change people's minds about it.

 

I have a feeling even if I did the legwork for you guys and post the link from a prominent researcher (oh say like harvard or something), those of you who don't think things "should" be like that will continue to insist that it's something cerebral that can be talked out of. Not so, my friend. Embrace your height it's your best chance.

[NJ123]

Yes I hear you and gave you my personal reasons which match some of the reasons other girls have (I don't like feeling bigger than the guy; stylistically i like to wear heels to feel like myself some of the time). Contrary to the arguments against that it isn't a biologically/evolutionary motivated thing, i think if you research it, you will find evidence that will back up the fact that it is. I have read it many times. It's probably that women want to feel protected; as outdated as that notion is in this time. It doesn't mean it goes away in our genes. Same as a preference for blondes, an ideal hip-to-waist ratio and so on and so forth. Say ANYTHING you want to find in a girl looks wise and you have your preference and what you might accept and still be quite happy. You can't really help what you find most attractive so it's quite silly to argue about it or try to change people's minds about it.

 

I have a feeling even if I did the legwork for you guys and post the link from a prominent researcher (oh say like harvard or something), those of you who don't think things "should" be like that will continue to insist that it's something cerebral that can be talked out of. Not so, my friend. Embrace your height it's your best chance.

 

But if it's truly biological than what you're basically saying is that women that wind up with shorter men are only getting with those guys because they can't find a taller guy for whatever reason like their just settling. Only 14% of men are 6 foot or taller, so this whole wanting a tall guy thing is pretty ridiculous if you ask me. I've even heard a few tall guys themselves state they think it's lame that a lot of women only want tall & leave out short guys.

[xxoo]

Why not focus on the women who are attracted to you, rather than those who are not?

 

It seems like a huge waste of time, not to mention depressing, to focus on the opinions of those who aren't interested. I see hot family men (married, successfully reproduced) who are less than tall every single day. This one dad at my kid's school...omg so hot...not over 5'7", and bald too (shaved head). He's got that Jason stratham thing going on. I'm married, so I have to look away

[NuevoYorko]

I see hot family men (married, successfully reproduced) who are less than tall every single day.

One of my oldest friends is a hair under 5'4. He is married to a beautiful woman who has to be 5'9. He is a successful doctor and a musician in his spare time, which is pretty scarce; he also does a lot of charity work (doctors without borders). The guy is a juggernaut.

 

I'm sure some of you who feel so done wrong will say that his wife only likes him because he's a doctor. They married before he went to medical school.

 

In any case, he hasn't spent any of his life bemoaning his fate of being short, and thinking about how women should be influenced, through some type of education program, to go for him. He went for what he wanted out of his life and continues to do so in his 50's.

[xxoo]

One of my oldest friends is a hair under 5'4. He is married to a beautiful woman who has to be 5'9. He is a successful doctor and a musician in his spare time, which is pretty scarce; he also does a lot of charity work (doctors without borders). The guy is a juggernaut.

 

I'm sure some of you who feel so done wrong will say that his wife only likes him because he's a doctor. They married before he went to medical school.

 

In any case, he hasn't spent any of his life bemoaning his fate of being short, and thinking about how women should be influenced, through some type of education program, to go for him. He went for what he wanted out of his life and continues to do so in his 50's.

 

He sounds dreamy

[joseb]

Not sure if this thread has helped all that much for the short guys out there. But for women complaining about not being able to find guys online, and who are stating a preference that rules out 4/5th of the population, it might be worth reconsidering that requirement and perhaps even reconsidering the choice to artificially increase their height with extreme high heels. Not to mention the good this will do to their long term health!

[duncsvoice]

I'm 5'5'', met a girl on tinder who was 5'10'' which she said was a bit of a deal breaker. No worries, I expect that being a shorter fellow.

 

Didn't stop her keep wanting to see me and snogging my face off all Friday night.