Consolidated Discussion: Height in Dating

[JuneL]

'I'd like to meet you' is a summary paraphrase. But it is the point of my first messages. In my first messages I include a few sentences remarking on why I noticed the woman's profile and what I see that makes me think we'd enjoy at least meeting each other. And yes, I get positive responses. Plenty? I've sent less than 200 messages total (including those that were simply ignored), received more than 60 responses, and have met about a dozen women in person. In my youth (I'm 64 and ended a 30-plus year relationship with a divorce a bit more than a year ago), a 'busy' year would have been one where I met three or four women. Up until the last couple of days I explicitly avoided sending messages to women who wrote in their profiles that they were seeking men taller than me.

 

Your response rate is pretty good. Guys in their 20s would kill to have nearly as high a rate. How come you only had 1/5 as many first dates?

[nospam99]

Your response rate is pretty good. Guys in their 20s would kill to have nearly as high a rate. How come you only had 1/5 as many first dates?

 

Some of my messages, especially when I was a newbie, were just compliments. I'd write a geographically undesirable (GUD) but otherwise interesting woman to tell her although I didn't think we'd meet, I thought she had a lot going for her and to wish her luck. She'd respond with a 'thank you and good luck to you, too'. For some of the GUDs, I'd invite them to a friend date if they were ever 'up my way'. I would warn them to bring a date if I was seeing someone at the time and to not bring a date if I wasn't. None of those friend dates have materialized and I really don't expect they will. Several of the non-GUDs were polite enough to send ME messages saying that they thought I had a lot going for me and wishing me good luck. Several women flaked or ghosted during the exchange of messages, texts, or phone calls but before meeting in person.

[nospam99]

You also need to consider filters since you're using Match. It's possible those women never saw your messages because they set their Inbox to filter out men below their desired height.

 

Interesting .... I forgot about the filters because I don't use them. You are correct - women (or men) can filter on height. LOL because there is NOT a weight (or dress size) filter. I hope the ladies appreciate the extra 'feature' that Match has provided for their convenience

[nospam99]

A 'cute' height anecdote to report. After this, I'll stop since I think I've made as much of a point as one 5'8'' guy can.

 

Had a Daily or Other Match (forget which) on match.com today. I viewed the lady's profile. We're HIGHLY compatible (on paper) EXCEPT she's 5'9'' seekiing 5'11'' and up. With a 3-inch 'shortfall' and the woman being taller than I am, I chose not to send her a message at that time. Match gets an 'aw s--t' for even presenting her to me as a match. Match also tells everyone, her included, when another person views their profile. So later today, she viewed me, I'm guessing because she saw I viewed her. I sent her a message to explain why I had viewed her previously but hadn't already sent a message. I thought it appropriate to offer an explanation because, aside from height, we're so compatible. I offered to meet just in case height was not a deal-breaker, made a gentle joke about leading her around the dance floor since we are both into ballroom dancing, and wished her success. She responded, thanking me for my honesty and well wishes and offering her own wishes for my success. She also noted (I'm quoting here) 'I don't want to waste your time as height is an issue for me.' Her willingness to respond to me, a man she will almost certainly never meet, indicates to me that among the compatible personal values she shares with me is respect for the sincerity of other people.

 

Of course height being a deal-breaker will not be true 100% of the time. But it definitely illustrates the importance of height as a physical selection criteria used by women and may partially explain the relative lack of success 'shorter' men may have getting dates.

[thefooloftheyear]

A 'cute' height anecdote to report. After this, I'll stop since I think I've made as much of a point as one 5'8'' guy can.

 

Had a Daily or Other Match (forget which) on match.com today. I viewed the lady's profile. We're HIGHLY compatible (on paper) EXCEPT she's 5'9'' seekiing 5'11'' and up. With a 3-inch 'shortfall' and the woman being taller than I am, I chose not to send her a message at that time. Match gets an 'aw s--t' for even presenting her to me as a match. Match also tells everyone, her included, when another person views their profile. So later today, she viewed me, I'm guessing because she saw I viewed her. I sent her a message to explain why I had viewed her previously but hadn't already sent a message. I thought it appropriate to offer an explanation because, aside from height, we're so compatible. I offered to meet just in case height was not a deal-breaker, made a gentle joke about leading her around the dance floor since we are both into ballroom dancing, and wished her success. She responded, thanking me for my honesty and well wishes and offering her own wishes for my success. She also noted (I'm quoting here) 'I don't want to waste your time as height is an issue for me.' Her willingness to respond to me, a man she will almost certainly never meet, indicates to me that among the compatible personal values she shares with me is respect for the sincerity of other people.

 

Of course height being a deal-breaker will not be true 100% of the time. But it definitely illustrates the importance of height as a physical selection criteria used by women and may partially explain the relative lack of success 'shorter' men may have getting dates.

 

I'd fully expect a 5'9" woman to have a height disclaimer...She is way outside the norm....But that's probably more to deter the possible 5'4" guys from responding...Unless she was a Goddess(in which case she probably wouldn't be OLD), I can't see a scenario where a guy she really liked and thought was the "be all" in terms of everything else, would be disqualified over being only slightly outside her proverbial "sweet spot" so to speak..

 

Point is, I don't think any guy can really draw a hard conclusion about it...It's like a guy could say he prefers petite brunettes with D breasts, yet a petite blond with C breasts responds and is dog ugly or dresses and wears her hair like she's stuck in the 80's....He's not going to respond and tell her she's dog ugly or has no style, he's going to give her the same answer that the woman in your example did..

 

(before you get defensive, I am not necessarily saying this one woman doesn't carry a tape measure in her purse, and she really is super rigid about it...maybe she is...I just haven't experienced any of it in my life, and if you go to a place where couples meet, you see quite a few guys that are equal to or even a bit shorter than their SO...Not that many where the women towers over the guy, but the other examples aren't really rare either)

 

.02

 

TFY

[thefooloftheyear]

You're a smart guy but it's obvious you didn't spend much time using OLD. It's like a completely different world on there, and even your most basic, run of the mill girl can have a long checklist of things a guy has to do in order for him to be worth her time, with tall being high up on the list. I've seen quite a few OLD profiles where ladies listed their height with 5 inch heels as if that was their actual height, because they just love their heels, and a guy has to be taller than they are in those heels or else they just aren't attracted to him. It's not even the really hot ladies that are usually being the picky ones, either. That's the weird thing. Another reason I suggest that most average dudes stay off OLD altogether. Not worth the headaches.

 

Never used it(OLD), so you guys can certainly be right about it and I stand corrected..

 

TFY

[nospam99]

Never used it(OLD), so you guys can certainly be right about it and I stand corrected..

 

TFY

 

sigh .... This doesn't need to be 'about OLD' but ...

 

- I happen to be meeting women via OLD so all the OLD 'peculiarities' apply to my anecdotes

- I started a new thread about male height in PFHWM several days ago that got merged/moderated here into Dating. When I started that thread the context was 'short' male newbies coming to LS complaining they couldn't get dates. And I was at least 'inspired' by many of those newbies mentioning OLD.

- TFY, yes I have seen couples where the guy is the shorter partner. But rarely and I can't remember any recently. (Was out dancing last week and not a one.) I assume that they have already cleared the 'hurdle' of the guy having 'something else' (personality? money? talented tongue?) that offsets any height requirement the lady had. But clearing the hurdle still takes time. Even if the guy did not meet the gal on OLD, he still had to deal with any height requirement she had when they first met and he, most likely, made the first 'approach'.

[thefooloftheyear]

sigh .... This doesn't need to be 'about OLD' but ...

 

- I happen to be meeting women via OLD so all the OLD 'peculiarities' apply to my anecdotes

- I started a new thread about male height in PFHWM several days ago that got merged/moderated here into Dating. When I started that thread the context was 'short' male newbies coming to LS complaining they couldn't get dates. And I was at least 'inspired' by many of those newbies mentioning OLD.

- TFY, yes I have seen couples where the guy is the shorter partner. But rarely and I can't remember any recently. (Was out dancing last week and not a one.) I assume that they have already cleared the 'hurdle' of the guy having 'something else' (personality? money? talented tongue?) that offsets any height requirement the lady had. But clearing the hurdle still takes time. Even if the guy did not meet the gal on OLD, he still had to deal with any height requirement she had when they first met and he, most likely, made the first 'approach'.

 

 

Big assumption there.....HUGE, actually...

 

You are still not getting the point....

 

You seem to have it in your mind that your height is a disadvantage....And you have it in your mind that a lot of women find it a deal breaker..Now think about that for a minute...That would mean that practically every guy under like 5'9" would have massive problems attracting women...Just not true..

 

No guy I know walks around with his net worth, cock size, or sexual prowess tattooed on his forehead, so I can't see how those things would help "clear that hurdle" or "offsets the height hangup"..as you say...Those things wouldn't be evident until long after the initial attraction takes place..

 

TFY

[carhill]

Physical factors thin the dating pool, all else being equal. Fewer interviews means fewer opportunities to shine in other areas of attractiveness. It's not good or bad, just numbers. If it wasn't numbers, there'd be no data field entry for height and no cliche of tall dark and handsome.

[Andy_K]

I've been unmatched on Tinder before for being 5'11". A friend, meanwhile, consistently gets glowing reactions when he reveals he's 6 foot exactly. A small difference makes a big difference, it seems!

[nospam99]

You seem to have it in your mind that your height is a disadvantage....And you have it in your mind that a lot of women find it a deal breaker..Now think about that for a minute...That would mean that practically every guy under like 5'9'' would have massive problems attracting women...Just not true..

 

 

I totally agree with the part of your statement that I bolded. The problem, such as it is, is NOT 'massive'. Do you disagree that a lot of women find a man's height a deal breaker?. The practical impact is that the guys under 5'9'' (or any specified height) 'do much better' with shorter women - and there are still plenty of them. All I'm saying is that my height, or any guy's, is a relative disadvantage in that the shorter 'we' are, the more women will simply not consider 'us' as dating candidates. My solution is to consider a woman's height and her stated 'seeking men' height in my own selection criteria.

[JuneL]

Such is not a convincing example: targeting a woman taller than yourself on OLD would be a long shot. But there are plenty of women quite a few inches shorter than you who state that they want a guy at least 5.9 or 5.10. You would think those shorter women in your age group wouldn’t want to wear 6” stilettos and hurt their body, no?

 

Personally, I never understand why some women (especially the short ones) have such a hangup on a guy’s height. My ex-bf is 6.2 and he’s a little too tall for me practically; for starters, I don’t wear 6” stilettos. In fact, my current bf’s height 5.10 is quite ideal for me. My first bf was only 5.7 and I felt taller when I was wearing 2” heels. But I never felt his height was an issue.

 

That said, I do agree that OLD is very superficial by definition: You have nothing more than those superficial traits on paper to go by as first impression.

 

A 'cute' height anecdote to report. After this, I'll stop since I think I've made as much of a point as one 5'8'' guy can.

 

Had a Daily or Other Match (forget which) on match.com today. I viewed the lady's profile. We're HIGHLY compatible (on paper) EXCEPT she's 5'9'' seekiing 5'11'' and up. With a 3-inch 'shortfall' and the woman being taller than I am, I chose not to send her a message at that time. Match gets an 'aw s--t' for even presenting her to me as a match. Match also tells everyone, her included, when another person views their profile. So later today, she viewed me, I'm guessing because she saw I viewed her. I sent her a message to explain why I had viewed her previously but hadn't already sent a message. I thought it appropriate to offer an explanation because, aside from height, we're so compatible. I offered to meet just in case height was not a deal-breaker, made a gentle joke about leading her around the dance floor since we are both into ballroom dancing, and wished her success. She responded, thanking me for my honesty and well wishes and offering her own wishes for my success. She also noted (I'm quoting here) 'I don't want to waste your time as height is an issue for me.' Her willingness to respond to me, a man she will almost certainly never meet, indicates to me that among the compatible personal values she shares with me is respect for the sincerity of other people.

 

Of course height being a deal-breaker will not be true 100% of the time. But it definitely illustrates the importance of height as a physical selection criteria used by women and may partially explain the relative lack of success 'shorter' men may have getting dates.

[JuneL]

I've been unmatched on Tinder before for being 5'11". A friend, meanwhile, consistently gets glowing reactions when he reveals he's 6 foot exactly. A small difference makes a big difference, it seems!

 

This is not surprising for girls in their 20s on Tinder.

[JuneL]

I totally agree with the part of your statement that I bolded. The problem, such as it is, is NOT 'massive'. Do you disagree that a lot of women find a man's height a deal breaker?. The practical impact is that the guys under 5'9'' (or any specified height) 'do much better' with shorter women - and there are still plenty of them. All I'm saying is that my height, or any guy's, is a relative disadvantage in that the shorter 'we' are, the more women will simply not consider 'us' as dating candidates. My solution is to consider a woman's height and her stated 'seeking men' height in my own selection criteria.

 

But what do you have to lose by sending first messages to shorter women whose desired height range is an inch or two taller than your height? You should do this unapologetically without mentioning the height thing. It shows confidence.

Edited August 20, 2018 by JuneL

[nospam99]

But what do you have to lose by sending first messages to shorter women whose desired height range is an inch or two taller than your height?

 

Nothing to lose. But as I posted elsewhere, I'm getting ZERO responses to those messages (so far) which is much worse than my overall 'batting average'.

 

Also keep in mind, June, that we're using ME as a singular 'experiment' of the overall phenomenon of women 'generally' having height preferences, if not requirements, for their dating partners. If I 'get lucky' it only applies to me: my height, her height, her 'arguably unreasonable' height criteria.

[Shining One]

But what do you have to lose by sending first messages to shorter women whose desired height range is an inch or two taller than your height?

Time. Time spent messaging women whose requirements you don't meet is time not spent messaging women whose requirements you do meet. Of course, if the total supply of women is low, then it's worth a shot.

[Els]

A 'cute' height anecdote to report. After this, I'll stop since I think I've made as much of a point as one 5'8'' guy can.

 

Had a Daily or Other Match (forget which) on match.com today. I viewed the lady's profile. We're HIGHLY compatible (on paper) EXCEPT she's 5'9'' seekiing 5'11'' and up. With a 3-inch 'shortfall' and the woman being taller than I am, I chose not to send her a message at that time. Match gets an 'aw s--t' for even presenting her to me as a match. Match also tells everyone, her included, when another person views their profile. So later today, she viewed me, I'm guessing because she saw I viewed her. I sent her a message to explain why I had viewed her previously but hadn't already sent a message. I thought it appropriate to offer an explanation because, aside from height, we're so compatible. I offered to meet just in case height was not a deal-breaker, made a gentle joke about leading her around the dance floor since we are both into ballroom dancing, and wished her success. She responded, thanking me for my honesty and well wishes and offering her own wishes for my success. She also noted (I'm quoting here) 'I don't want to waste your time as height is an issue for me.' Her willingness to respond to me, a man she will almost certainly never meet, indicates to me that among the compatible personal values she shares with me is respect for the sincerity of other people.

 

Of course height being a deal-breaker will not be true 100% of the time. But it definitely illustrates the importance of height as a physical selection criteria used by women and may partially explain the relative lack of success 'shorter' men may have getting dates.

 

 

But how many women are 5'9" AND require men to be taller than they are? If you take a look at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_average_human_height_worldwide , you'll see that the average female height is typically less than 5'5" in most countries. So no, I don't think the average 5'8" man is finding that his height is such a huge impediment to him in dating (I don't mean OLD, just plain ol' dating/relationships).

 

 

FTR, the SO is 5'7" and already verges on the upper end of my height preference. To kiss him, I have to stand on tiptoe, AND he has to crouch a bit, lol. I had an ex who was 5'10", it was almost impossible to do anything fun with each other standing up.

[thefooloftheyear]

I totally agree with the part of your statement that I bolded. The problem, such as it is, is NOT 'massive'. Do you disagree that a lot of women find a man's height a deal breaker?. The practical impact is that the guys under 5'9'' (or any specified height) 'do much better' with shorter women - and there are still plenty of them. All I'm saying is that my height, or any guy's, is a relative disadvantage in that the shorter 'we' are, the more women will simply not consider 'us' as dating candidates. My solution is to consider a woman's height and her stated 'seeking men' height in my own selection criteria.

 

Yes....I disagree.....(a lot? Nope...some or a small percentage?? eh...maybe)..

 

Look...Maybe I am just absolutely irresistible..I dunno...

 

Here's something to ponder...

 

I belong to a family where all of my male first cousin's are all between 5'5" and 5'10" tall...Including me, we are 16 total guys..Never in the history of my memory did any of us struggle to find women...If you lined up all of the women who we married or were in relationships with Id say none would rate less than a 7.5 and there are a few 9+'s...More than one taller than their male spouse as well..

 

No woman has ever told me anything like "well...you are great and all, but a bit too short for my taste"...As a matter of fact, I have been with taller women(one 5'10" that I broke it off with), and more than one has mentioned that while they generally have been with taller guys they had no issue with my height at all..I am far taller(and far bigger) than most women on the street, and presumably, so are you...

 

We are always being told by women that there are far more important factors in determining attraction than just looks(or other physical characteristics) in men...Alpha qualities, confidence, intellect, humor, etc...

 

But somehow you guys just refuse to believe them....

 

TFY

[JuneL]

Yes....I disagree.....(a lot? Nope...some or a small percentage?? eh...maybe)..

 

Look...Maybe I am just absolutely irresistible..I dunno...

 

Here's something to ponder...

 

I belong to a family where all of my male first cousin's are all between 5'5" and 5'10" tall...Including me, we are 16 total guys..Never in the history of my memory did any of us struggle to find women...If you lined up all of the women who we married or were in relationships with Id say none would rate less than a 7.5 and there are a few 9+'s...More than one taller than their male spouse as well..

 

No woman has ever told me anything like "well...you are great and all, but a bit too short for my taste"...As a matter of fact, I have been with taller women(one 5'10" that I broke it off with), and more than one has mentioned that while they generally have been with taller guys they had no issue with my height at all..I am far taller(and far bigger) than most women on the street, and presumably, so are you...

 

We are always being told by women that there are far more important factors in determining attraction than just looks(or other physical characteristics) in men...Alpha qualities, confidence, intellect, humor, etc...

 

But somehow you guys just refuse to believe them....

 

TFY

 

To be fair, if you’re a guy who’s very short (5.5 or below in the US), then you do need to have an impressive overall package for women to relax their usual hard requirements. Just having genuine confidence will go a long way.

[Els]

To be fair, if you’re a guy who’s very short (5.5 or below in the US), then you do need to have an impressive overall package for women to relax their usual hard requirements. Just having genuine confidence will go a long way.

 

 

Sure, but being at the extremes of anything tends to make things a bit tricky or narrow your pool. A 6'8" guy or a 6'2" woman would likely encounter the same problem.

 

Nospam99 is 5'8" though, which appears to be well within the middle of the bell curve, and still taller than the majority of US women. I really doubt the problems he is encountering with relationships are primarily due to height.

[JuneL]

Sure, but being at the extremes of anything tends to make things a bit tricky or narrow your pool. A 6'8" guy or a 6'2" woman would likely encounter the same problem.

 

Nospam99 is 5'8" though, which appears to be well within the middle of the bell curve, and still taller than the majority of US women. I really doubt the problems he is encountering with relationships are primarily due to height.

 

Agreed.

 

I have a neighbor who must be 6.3 or 6.4. He seems like a pretty nice guy (and is pretty religious, if it matters). But his beta vite is a big turn off for me.

[nospam99]

Yes....I disagree.....(a lot? Nope...some or a small percentage?? eh...maybe)..

 

TFY, congratulations that the males in your family's gene pool have 'something else going for them' that they overcome what is apparently a strong preference for taller men when human females choose a mate.

 

When I (soft of) reopened this discussion I said that I recalled (but can't cite) a study on PBS that asserted that the single most significant physical factor in females' perception of male attractiveness was height. So 'inspired' by your disagreement, I did a little googling. I didn't find that old PBS study. But I did find this https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0003347213001590?via%3Dihub and this Women find height and strength most attractive in men | Daily Mail Online in about five minutes. FWIW, the sample size is larger than your family.

[thefooloftheyear]

To be fair, if you’re a guy who’s very short (5.5 or below in the US), then you do need to have an impressive overall package for women to relax their usual hard requirements. Just having genuine confidence will go a long way.

 

No argument...

 

But id say it's more at the lower end....Like 5'2"/or 3...

 

 

I was watching a show on TV yesterday, and one of the guests was Cody Garbrandt...I am sure most people never heard of him, but he's an MMA fighter..

 

He's listed at 5'7" and 135...I don't think he's even that tall...Seems like more 5'6"..But whatever..

 

When he walked out the women in the audience went nuts...Practically every time he opened his mouth they screamed ...

 

He's not like some A level star...Id imagine most of those women in the audience screaming never heard of him or seen him before...

 

TFY

[Els]

TFY, congratulations that the males in your family's gene pool have 'something else going for them' that they overcome what is apparently a strong preference for taller men when human females choose a mate.

 

When I (soft of) reopened this discussion I said that I recalled (but can't cite) a study on PBS that asserted that the single most significant physical factor in females' perception of male attractiveness was height. So 'inspired' by your disagreement, I did a little googling. I didn't find that old PBS study. But I did find this https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0003347213001590?via%3Dihub and this Women find height and strength most attractive in men | Daily Mail Online in about five minutes. FWIW, the sample size is larger than your family.

 

 

You do realize that one of the links you posted is the Daily Fail and doesn't even provide references, whereas the other link only studies speed dating. If you take Megan Fox and put her through a speed dating study, probably 99% of the men in that speed dating study will want to see Megan Fox again. Does that mean that women who AREN'T Megan Fox have no hope of finding a compatible partner?

 

 

You can blame your height all you want, but plenty of men your height and under have good relationships (and same goes for the rest of the women in the world who aren't Megan Fox). Your choice.

[nospam99]

Nospam99 is 5'8'' though, which appears to be well within the middle of the bell curve, and still taller than the majority of US women. I really doubt the problems he is encountering with relationships are primarily due to height.

 

At the risk of sounding defensive, I don't recall stating that any problems I may or may not be having with relationships have anything to do with height. What I can say is that I rarely contact a woman on OLD whose height preference is not satisfied by my body. This eliminates about one third of the women who would otherwise appear to be potential matches from my consideration.

 

FWIW, according to https://tall.life/height-percentile-calculator-age-country/ I am at the 32.9 percentile so about two thirds of adult males in the US are taller than I am.