MOM can't convince MOW it is over

[Liam1]

 

Remember, regardless of if an A is for just sex or not, people don't go around having sex with another person they don't like, maybe not love but at some point he did like her as a person. I know BS don't like to hear that but it's usually true. That's why he cares, I get it. I wouldn't want something bad to happen to a person that I slept, just bc the BS hates them doesn't mean the WS does.

 

Thank you, WhoKnew30, for adding some clarity to the situation.

 

Exactly. I had an affair with this woman. People do not normally have sex with someone they dislike, or hate, or wish harm.

 

Also my wife and I have discussed this extensively. My wife has said that she would be concerned about me, if I were not worried that her husband could become violent with her.

 

Yes, as the attorney, a former DA, told us, people do kill other people over affairs. Their personality type does not matter. Sometimes they just go off he rails and kill their spouse. It doesn't happen often, but it happens enough to be concerned.

[Liam1]

I appreciate yours and your wifes' compassion about not wanting to hurt the OW's husband, but respectfully, your BS is not the one who would be inflicting the pain on him.

 

My wife feels as if she would be inflicting pain on him. So in reality, her own perception is all that matters.

 

She is involved in this situation and her point of view matters to her and to me.

 

With that said, as mentioned within this thread, we have already sent her an attorney letter asking her to cease contact otherwise her husband will be informed.

[Whoknew30]

Except, if she were to be harmed, she would be harmed due to her own actions, not yours.

 

Also, other than the reasons usually stated, if the OW is still fertile I think there is an obligation to tell her H.

 

Stats claim that AP's, being married people and unused to using condoms, tend to forget to use birth control during sex. Others deliberately don't use anything because they don't want to and enjoy the spice of unprotected sex with new partners. If you go through the most trafficked infidelity and marriage forums, you'll come across a decent number of posts from women who have become pregnant during affairs or men who got a woman pregnant during an affair.

 

This man is making decisions every day in ignorance about the nature of his life and his marriage. Decisions he might have made differently if he did know. He could also end up raising a child that isn't his, if he's not already.

 

For so many reasons, he's got a right to know.

 

 

Wait, so if ExOW isn't lying about abuse & she gets beat it's her fault but in the same sentence lets care about her husband decisions? This doesn't make any sense, so bc she had an affair who cares about her safety but let's care about her husband's life, extremely contradictory.

[Liam1]

So here is more of my story in case it helps-

 

 

 

He is like you where it was suppose to be for fun- and she agreed- she even gave him the old "I am just like a guy, I can turn this stuff off in a minute"-

when he uses that as an excuse it makes me upset- try to stay away from the "I had no idea this would happen" the point is, it is happening and trying to explain it away leads to a "how stupid can you be" argument-

Also, try to stay away from the "I never lied to you" thing- that just reinforces how badly you took advantage of her trust and makes her feel stupid for trusting you-

 

 

Thank you for your post and suggestions.

 

Here is the thing.... everyone has different reactions to specific situations. So a one size fits all solution is not available. Best thing: Don't have an affair, they always end badly, IMO.

 

As far as mentioning to my wife that she was so trusting I never had to lie.

 

My wife says that the fact that I have the insight to realize she was too trusting and I took advantage of her trust, actually comforts her.

 

The fact is, I never HAD to lie to her. Although I know I most likely would have if I had to because initially I had no intention of telling her about the affair.

 

I had no intention of divorcing my wife for the OW. The OW presented herself as someone interested in the fun responsibility-free, distracting aspects of an affair, and that was what I was looking for, too.

 

At the time, it seemed that it would be easy to have an affair and my wife would never find out because this woman was not interested in a real relationship, or so she claimed.

 

The fact is that a MAJORITY of affairs are discovered or the guilt eats up the unfaithful person so much that they confess.

 

My wife and I have discussed the "too trusting" part extensively, and she likes hearing that I realize I never had to lie because she was way too trusting.

 

My wife is no longer too trusting. That is fine with me.

[Whoknew30]

Thank you, WhoKnew30, for adding some clarity to the situation.

 

Exactly. I had an affair with this woman. People do not normally have sex with someone they dislike, or hate, or wish harm.

 

Also my wife and I have discussed this extensively. My wife has said that she would be concerned about me, if I were not worried that her husband could become violent with her.

 

Yes, as the attorney, a former DA, told us, people do kill other people over affairs. Their personality type does not matter. Sometimes they just go off he rails and kill their spouse. It doesn't happen often, but it happens enough to be concerned.

 

Ive seen it (I think I wrote it already) my cousin was shot when her H found out about her A, it was absolutely one of the worst things my family has been through. That's why im an advocate for trying not to tell.

 

IMO, true reconciliation comes from the WS cutting it off & owning it to their BS, not babysitting your WS & telling the other BS, if a BS has to go to that point, I think that's extremely sad.

 

You've shown your wife, this woman can be there all she wants you're saying no. I think you're showing your wife more, than most stories I read on here (. She knows she can trust you, instead of her worrying about watching you like a child. That's why she's not gone completely crazy in 3 years, you've earned her trust back.

[Liam1]

You would think right?!

 

The MOW in our situation was being abused, she came into work (for my WH) battered and bruised. My WH felt sorry for her. I too did not want to tell her BS for fear that she would be beat. My WH and MOW broke NC together and at that point I had had enough. I told her BS. I don't know if anything happened to her after that, but I do know she was bold enough to take the A underground with my WH. Some abused women do take a risk!

 

Lady designer:

 

Thank you for adding your experience here.

 

Yes, abused woman will cheat, according to our attorney a former DA. No bruises does not equal no abuse.

 

Also, a nice guy can often go off the rails when he learns of his husband's affair.

 

When the affair was ended, I encouraged her to tell her husband and to seek counseling for any issues that may have led her to feel as if she needed to go outside the marriage.

 

There is obviously a reason why she won't tell.

[Liam1]

 

You've shown your wife, this woman can be there all she wants you're saying no. I think you're showing your wife more, than most stories I read on here (. She knows she can trust you, instead of her worrying about watching you like a child. That's why she's not gone completely crazy in 3 years, you've earned her trust back.

 

WhoKnew30:

 

Wow, thank you for that. Your post brought tears to my eyes.

[ladydesigner]

Ive seen it (I think I wrote it already) my cousin was shot when her H found out about her A, it was absolutely one of the worst things my family has been through. That's why im an advocate for trying not to tell.

 

IMO, true reconciliation comes from the WS cutting it off & owning it to their BS, not babysitting your WS & telling the other BS, if a BS has to go to that point, I think that's extremely sad.

You've shown your wife, this woman can be there all she wants you're saying no. I think you're showing your wife more, than most stories I read on here (. She knows she can trust you, instead of her worrying about watching you like a child. That's why she's not gone completely crazy in 3 years, you've earned her trust back.

 

It is sad. I felt like an idiot the whole time post Dday. My error in thinking was I thought if I did those things I would get my WH back.

 

OP you have genuine compassion and remorse and it is a breath of fresh air to read.

[lftbehind]

Hi All:

 

I am a married other man who had an affair with a married woman.

 

I am now trying to save my marriage.

 

My MOW however will not let go. No matter how many times and how many ways.

 

<snip>?

[]I think that the NC letter and threatening to tell her husband should work.

Edited January 29, 2016 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Editorial comments redacted and member moderated

[Liam1]

Lady designer:

 

In my response to you this sentence below was incorrect:

 

"Also, a nice guy can often go off the rails when he learns of his husband's affair.

 

I meant to say.

 

"Also, a nice guy can often go off the rails when he learns of his WIFE'S affair.

[ladydesigner]

Lady designer:

 

In my response to you this sentence below was incorrect:

 

"Also, a nice guy can often go off the rails when he learns of his husband's affair.

 

I meant to say.

 

"Also, a nice guy can often go off the rails when he learns of his WIFE'S affair.

 

Oh absolutely! I think many have no idea how they would react until they are in that exact situation.

[William]

Morning,

 

Moderation has been discussing the disposition of this thread this morning and, while viewing it for that discussion I noted some drift back into editorial commentary about a now long done affair and the people involved. As a reminder, members who choose that path, as detected, will have their posting privileges removed so please don't go there. One reminder from moderation is plenty and now there are two. Stick to the now and moving forward. Personal experiences are welcomed as long as they relate directly to the topic, which is convincing the former OW it's over and to leave the married couple alone. Thank you!

[Liam1]

.

No offense, but from your post I don't think you really care about the OW. It sounds like you used her for sex, that's pretty much what you said. You act like she did the pursuing and that you weren't even that interested in her. I don't understand if you love your wife why you would even have the A. I don't know why the OW would not let go, especially since you don't want her. Sounds like she doesn't have pride. I think that the NC letter and threatening to tell her husband should work.

 

Leftbehind:

 

In an affair BOTH people are using each other for sex. I don't act like she did the pursuing. It's a fact that she did the pursuing. I showed our attorney her emails and texts, and he mentioned it on his own without prompting. It's something we can used should she try to claim anything nefarious, as some caught OWs sometimes do to save themselves from their husband's wrath

 

I don't love the OW. I never even think about her except when she contacts my wife.

 

Still, I don't want her harmed.

 

I think it's really very simple. You need not love or care about someone to wish the well.

 

I don't know, love or care about in a personal way starving babies around the world, yet I worry about their wellbeing and want them to receive help.

 

As far as why people have affairs. That's really off topic for this thread.

 

Still, the reasons are complex and many and there are numerous books out there that might help answer your question more intelligently than I could.

 

If I gave reasons here for why I felt the need to go outside my marriage. Many people would say they are just excuses.

 

It's a no win situation. So I am not going to engage with anyone other than my marriage counselor regarding those reasons.

Edited January 29, 2016 by Liam1

[gettingstronger]

Sorry I keep coming back to this, it's just so similar to our situation. I think in the end, the best advice I got was from our therapist and that's "every storm runs out of rain". What worked and didn't work for us may or may not be relevant to a different situation, but in the end, my best guess and hope is that the answer to your question is: you can't convince her, she has to decide for herself she's done. Until then, take care of eachother and know you'll make mistakes in the handling of the situation, just keep try to do right.

[carhill]

OP, what steps can you take which you haven't yet taken to eliminate contact means?

 

IMO, with contact means eliminated and contact only through a third party like your lawyer, all the remains, if she knows where you live, is trespassing and that's a complaint which can be sworn out with your local LEO's, should she be so bold as to show up on your front step one day. Same with stalking like if she's parked across the street surveilling or following you/your wife. IMO, accept her lot in life as hers to deal with, focus on your own M and leave the rest to the lawyer or law enforcement. Let it go. You have that power. Good luck!

[privategal]

I just want to comment though, I think you are seeing her actions the wrong way. I do not feel by harassing your wife and reporting more affair details that she feels she would then have a chance by these actions to rekindle the affair and keep it going. She knows you will never forgive her for that and knows you will see her as crazy.

She knows she is burning bridges.

She's very hurt, angry, feels scorned. She has lost control and cannot stop spinning.

I know this because a few years ago when my EAP left me coldly, just up and abandoned the friendship after almost 20 years of friendship then a few years of a close EAP, I couldn't get over it at first. I went totally beside myself, I didn't contact his family but I messaged him in email and text over and over and over. I mean I just lost it. I was like a crazed lunatic. It was nearly an out of body experience. He never wrote back and I got tired and stopped then was humiliated and so ashamed. But it wasn't me, I don't even KNOW that me. It was HURT coming across as anger and rage.

 

 

I feel this is where she is at. She knows you are so mad, sick, and disgusted with her, she knows it but she cant stop right now.

Luckily I was able to get a grip. I went to counseling. He later came back to forgive me, and it was the best forgiveness I ever received. But in those dark moments I hoped he hated me, I almost wished he would tell me to stop or threaten with harassment charges, it might have smacked me into controlling myself sooner. But though I still loved him I was doing anything BUT trying to rekindle. I believed I would probably never ever hear from him again even as I was doing those things I believed it was nailing the coffin shut so to speak, but there was no stopping me, I was just a wreck of pain.

I don't know how you broke it off with her, but if it was coldly and she was embarrassed or felt abandoned and it was sudden, it could almost trigger PTSD symptoms. Not that you are to blame but I do not believe her continued contact is to restart the affair, it is to cause you the same pain!

[Poppy47]

Liam,

 

I strongly suggest you put on your big boy pants and stand up for your wife and marriage. If you don't you will lose everything and it will be on your own head.

 

YOu need to ACT.

 

Tell the husband. The OW will have to face the consequences of her actions. She should have thought of that before harassing your innocent wife.

 

You can always get a restraining order . ANYTHING but don't stand on the side lines and let your wife suffer.

 

Poppy.

[Liam1]

speak, but there was no stopping me, I was just a wreck of pain.

I don't know how you broke it off with her, but if it was coldly and she was embarrassed or felt abandoned and it was sudden, it could almost trigger PTSD symptoms. Not that you are to blame but I do not believe her continued contact is to restart the affair, it is to cause you the same pain!

 

Hi private gal:

 

I sent a no contact letter. My marriage counselor said it was far too kind not cold enough, actually, and that may be in part why she is still attempting contact.

 

I have not talked to her or contacted her in any way since that letter. I really have no idea what she is thinking in reality. I only know what she told me at the time of the affair.

 

As far as her having PTSD. It is my understanding that PTSD is caused by an unexpected trauma. Something one has no control over.

 

The ending of the affair should not have been unexpected to the AP, unless she was deluding herself already and she was lying to herself by claiming she was ONLY looking for an affair and wanted to stay married.

 

The AP had control over the situation or so she claimed. If she had psychological issues, they likely existed before the affair ended. She also knew the outcome as it was discussed ad nauseum.

 

Also I was her third affair partner.

 

Now, my wife, according to the marriage counselor, did have a temporary case of PTSD or as she called it --post infidelity trauma syndrome

 

The reason: She totally trusted me, and the affair blindsided her, destroyed her world as she knew, caused profound distrust, and harmed her self esteem through no actions of her own.

 

My affair was also outside my wife's control and feeling safe going forward with me is still outside her control, unless we suddenly become bonded at the hip and go everywhere together.

[privategal]

Hi private gal:

 

I sent a no contact letter. My marriage counselor said it was far too kind not cold enough, actually, and that may be in part why she is still attempting contact.

 

I have not talked to her or contacted her in any way since that letter. I really have no idea what she is thinking in reality. I only know what she told me at the time of the affair.

 

As far as her having PTSD. It is my understanding that PTSD is caused by an unexpected trauma. Something one has no control over.

 

The ending of the affair should not have been unexpected to the AP, unless she was deluding herself already and she was lying to herself by claiming she was ONLY looking for an affair and wanted to stay married.

 

The AP had control over the situation or so she claimed. If she had psychological issues, they likely existed before the affair ended. She also knew the outcome as it was discussed ad nauseum.

 

Also I was her third affair partner.

 

Now, my wife, according to the marriage counselor, did have a temporary case of PTSD or as she called it --post infidelity trauma syndrome

 

The reason: She totally trusted me, and the affair blindsided her, destroyed her world as she knew, caused profound distrust, and harmed her self esteem through no actions of her own.

 

My affair was also outside my wife's control and feeling safe going forward with me is still outside her control, unless we suddenly become bonded at the hip and go everywhere together.

 

I was not suggesting you caused you xap PTSD...I was saying that she might experience symptoms of PTSD. After my A ended due to feeling abandoned and so coldly suddenly cruelly let go, thats what I went through. I went temporarily crazy and lost my self control. It was so hurt. I reacted in rage.

I lost all sense of control and just wanted to lash out and inflict emotional pain back to him.

Im not saying you haven't handled things well, I am just trying to give you a glimpse of what may be happening with your xap.

She is hurting and has lost control and not thinking rationally.

She started to believe the fantasy was real and changed her mind about 'just sex' and maybe believed you did too.

You don't have to defend yourself. Just giving you some logic that I don't think she wants the A back, but rather to hurt you back.

Edited January 29, 2016 by privategal

[anika99]

I was not suggesting you caused you xap PTSD...I was saying that she might experience symptoms of PTSD. After my A ended due to feeling abandoned and so coldly suddenly cruelly let go, thats what I went through. I went temporarily crazy and lost my self control. It was so hurt. I reacted in rage.

I lost all sense of control and just wanted to lash out and inflict emotional pain back to him.

Im not saying you haven't handled things well, I am just trying to give you a glimpse of what may be happening with your xap.

She is hurting and has lost control and not thinking rationally.

She started to believe the fantasy was real and changed her mind about 'just sex' and maybe believed you did too.

You don't have to defend yourself. Just giving you some logic that I don't think she wants the A back, but rather to hurt you back.

 

But the affair ended 3 yrs ago and if I read correctly the OW comes and goes. She leaves the BW alone for awhile and then pops in from time to time, even now, 3yr out. That doesn't sound like someone who is spinning from a recent trauma, it sounds like someone who just wants to harass and cause trouble.

[MJJean]

Wait, so if ExOW isn't lying about abuse & she gets beat it's her fault but in the same sentence lets care about her husband decisions? This doesn't make any sense, so bc she had an affair who cares about her safety but let's care about her husband's life, extremely contradictory.

 

Umm, yeah.

 

Look, I'm not a heartless b*tch and I've been there. My exH was physically abusive and the last time he left the marital home was in handcuffs for trying to choke me to death on the stairs. I'd started to lose consciousness and control of my bladder when the cops came in. So, really, I get it.

 

And guess what? I was a WW during that marriage. So, I really, really get it.

 

And, no, I never told my AP's about the abuse, in case anyone is wondering. I also didn't lie to or conceal from my exH or my AP's any of my extramarital activity. I'm more of a tell the truth and shame the devil type.

 

The difference is, having been there, I understand better than most the hard facts. And the hard facts are that when you stay with a man who hits you, and you get hit, it is absolutely 100% your own dang fault.

 

A man can't hit a woman who isn't there to be hit. Period. The first time is on him. Anything after that is on the woman who stays. It's not pretty. It's not PC. It's not all warm and fuzzy. It's cold, hard, reality.

 

If her husband is hitting her, he's still doing it because she has decided to stay with him. That choice, just like in the case of an affair, is 100% on her as are the consequences.

 

If she's lying, he has a right to know so he can make an informed decision about how he'll be conducting his life in the future.

 

Either way, I think telling the BH is the right thing to do. But Liam's wife does not, so lets hope the cease and desist letter works.

[MJJean]

nded due to feeling abandoned and so coldly suddenly cruelly let go, thats what I went through. I went temporarily crazy and lost my self control. It was so hurt. I reacted in rage.

I lost all sense of control and just wanted to lash out and inflict emotional pain back to him.

Im not saying you haven't handled things well, I am just trying to give you a glimpse of what may be happening with your xap.

She is hurting and has lost control and not thinking rationally.

She started to believe the fantasy was real and changed her mind about 'just sex' and maybe believed you did too.

You don't have to defend yourself. Just giving you some logic that I don't think she wants the A back, but rather to hurt you back.

 

Yeah, but 3 YEARS after NC?

[MidnightBlue1980]

Yeah, but 3 YEARS after NC?

 

I have to agree. I have a lot of negative emotions towards xMM but as a rational adult, you just have to control your behavior. We all got into this things, we have to get ourselves out.

 

I'm thinking what I would do if H's xOW started contacting me. To be honest, I've already called her right up and we exchanged texts, she knows I know and is frightened of me, even though I am not a scary person if you knew me. I am wondering what Liam's wife said to the OW when she calls her.

[Liam1]

Yeah, but 3 YEARS after NC?

 

MjJean:

 

I agree. Three years is scary. The Attorney said the same thing

 

Apparently, according to the MC, and the attorney, it is not uncommon.

 

The MC is an infidelity specialist and she claims she has cases where the OW tries to contact, or rekindle with the OM, or make trouble for the wife 20 plus after the affair ended, even though there has been no contact or absolutely no encouragement from the OM. The attorney said the same.

 

The counselor claims men can compartmentalize the sex better, but women more often somehow get it in their craw that the OM is her star crossed lover. Even when they are repeatedly told by the OM that the OM will not leave the wife.

 

The OW should have gotten the attorney's letter by now. She is supposed to contact the attorney to discuss the issue.

 

We will see what happens.

[sandylee1]

I'm also wondering what your wife says to her ......probably not something nasty enough to make her stop......I'm guessing your wife is a very nice and sweet person though.

What I would say to the OW in your wife's position would be enough to stop her ever making contact..that's just me.

 

The letter should do the trick though......and if she contacts again ...you need to follow through with telling her H...or she'll never believe you'll go through with it.