Marriage and Infidelity

[RySant]

Another college classmate of mine is getting married this week (Yayy!!) and she and I are very close, and because of that, I think she got "contaminated" with my skepticism in terms of "True Love" and today's definition of "commitment" or the lack there of.

 

Last night, we have talked about what to expect in the future, her eventual role as a wife etc etc. until we dropped to the topic of Infidelity. Actually, we were browsing LS last night while I was trying to respond to the threads here and now, I don't think it was such a good idea of her reading with me the horrible stories of Betrayed Spouses and "Snooping-around" stories as it gave her a sudden doubt if she's ready for this kind of stuff. And the conversation goes along the lines of:

 

Friend: "What if it happens to me?"

Me: "What?"

Friend: "What if I found myself in the situation of being betrayed?"

Me: "Then dump him?"

Friend: "That easy?"

Me: *Thinks a bit* Yeah. He'll break the very vows that you will be saying on your lavish wedding on Wednesday, why would you want him to stay?"

Friend: "Because I love him?"

 

And this is the bit where I said things I am not proud of:

 

Me: "Maybe. I guess in every marriage, expect that one way or another, you or him will go astray. He'll fall in love with someone else just as all men do, and they will womanize like most men do. I guess don't believe on the forever thing. Just prepare yourself that one day, this will happen and you should be ready for that day to decide which action you will do."

 

But honestly, I don't know. I don't think I helped. But a part of me knew what I said was right. I am sad that I am not the perfect person to give her a good answer to this as I have severe phobia of being betrayed and being abandoned and left hanging (as some of you here are already well aware) but my question is, did I make the right advice to her? Or am I robbing her the opportunity to trust his eventual husband fully? But I don't want her to be stuck with the idea that once they got married, everything will go smoothly. I just want her to be on guard, not to lose herself of the "marriage bliss" then one day, her world will crash down because of shock and pain.

 

Or do I have a very screwed outlook in regards to marriage?

[dichotomy]

Many marriages dont last.

 

I don't know that you should expect adultery, but certainly it prevalent for both sex's to cheat in marriage. I am glad you mentioned her or him cheating as the instances of women cheating are growing faster then ever before. Your "as men do" comment was a bit sexist however.

 

When I went through marriage counseling the did spend some time on the "for worst" part of marriage vows. This included a long list of "for worse" thing that could happen - you know - drinking, drugs, gambling, money. They only skipped "wont have sex with you anymore" which is huge here for both wives and husbands.

 

Anyway they had everyone (all couples) stand up in a room - then they began to mention the long list of "for worse things" and said sit down when you here something that you would not stay married (divorce). I sat down when they said "your spouse abuses your child".

 

 

I think its good to discuss this - the potential bad stuff that can happen. I think its also good for two engage people to discuss all this including "what do you consider cheating or betrayal?" "how much sex do you need at a minimum", money, and other issues divorce happens.

 

Hopefully your friend is getting premarital counseling.

[TaraMaiden2]

Yup, pre-marital counselling is a great idea.

Secondly, I used to work in an organisation that ran pre-marriage workshops. An obligation, condition and requirement imposed by the Church, on couples wishing to get married there.

As far as I can recall, there wasn't a single relationship that wasn't affected by the workshop, in a positive way, even if it meant the couple delayed, postponed or cancelled their wedding altogether.

 

It was positive in the sense that it opened their eyes to what marriage should really be all about.... and some people were simply not ready to go for it.

[LivingWaterPlease]

Although many people cheat when married there are still many who choose not to.

 

My father and both of my brothers are examples of fidelity in marriage. My dad was a very good looking charismatic man who had many opportunities to cheat and never did.

 

Don't know about my brothers' opportunities but one is very charismatic and the other had a great way with the ladies when he was single.

 

So, I do wish you'd given your friend the advice to go into her marriage believing her husband will be faithful to her. I personally believe that's the healthiest way to enter into a marriage.

[TaraMaiden2]

Although many people cheat when married there are still many who choose not to.

 

My father and both of my brothers are examples of fidelity in marriage. My dad was a very good looking charismatic man who had many opportunities to cheat and never did.

 

Don't know about my brothers' opportunities but one is very charismatic and the other had a great way with the ladies when he was single.

 

So, I do wish you'd given your friend the advice to go into her marriage believing her husband will be faithful to her. I personally believe that's the healthiest way to enter into a marriage.

No, it isn't.

Statistically, a good 50% of marriages will end. The reasons are many and varied, but primary in those, is infidelity.

From either spouse.

The secret is knowing WHAT to do, and HOW to reduce the likelihood of that happening.

 

In our Workshops we taught about the vital, indispensable stalwarts of any relationship:

Communication, Respect and Trust.

 

But to go blase into a marriage, being told that her husband will be faithful to her, is just as bad as being told he will cheat within the first 3 years.

[TX-SC]

Cheating is a choice, not an obligation. As an adult, she and her husband will have a LOT of choices to make throughout their marriage. Some, such as what's for dinner, are very easy. Some, like whether to have children, and how many, can be very difficult. Cheating isn't something that "just happens" in a marriage. A series of choices lead up to it. If he and she make the right choices, there's no infidelity. It's really as easy as that.

 

1) Communicate with each other. If he or she feels something is lacking, talk and listen. Work it out.

 

2) Respect each other. If you love and respect each other, you won't hurt them. Also, build each other up with compliments and acts of love.

 

3) Have date nights. Even after kids are in the picture. Go out and have some fun!

 

4) Give up most of the Girls Night Out or Guys Night, stuff. It's good to have friends, but consider other hobbies that don't include going dancing and to bars.

 

My marriage is only 20 years old so far, but still no adultery on either part. To my knowledge, my brother's 35 year marriage, my parents' marriage, nor anyone in my immediate family has had an affair issue.

 

Sometimes we let forums like this and SI get us in a funk and ruin our perspective. Yes, my fiancé and two different GFs cheated on me, but that didn't ruin my outlook on relationships. Now I'm in a happy, long-term marriage. Let up some on your friend. You and she both should be happy!

[RySant]

Sometimes we let forums like this and SI get us in a funk and ruin our perspective. Yes, my fiancé and two different GFs cheated on me, but that didn't ruin my outlook on relationships. Now I'm in a happy, long-term marriage. Let up some on your friend. You and she both should be happy!

 

Thank you so much TX-SC. I haven't been in a relationship as I have abandonment and betrayal issues to solve. My father left us with another woman and the reason why I participate in forums like these is for me to get insight on why my father did it, why the other woman chose to participate in breaking my family. But instead of me gaining insight, I let the stories here get into me, and mess my perspective in love and commitment and trust with other people. Sigh, I bailed on a lot of "going to be serious" dates as I always think their attraction or feelings for me will vanish, anyway. Never gave it a chance as I feel like every relationship will end up just like what my parents had.

[dichotomy]

To the list of successful marriage attributes I would add

 

- Sacrifice and Compromise - understanding what the other needs or wants and being willing to put their needs a ahead of your own sometimes.

- Wanting to please your partner - find joy in their joy

- Having their back - this is trust but its more than that.

- Sex. I have come to understand both women AND men forget to "just do it" - it bonds people. Too many marriages posted her involved the women OR THE MAN dropping off in this area.

- Laugh together.

 

 

A comment about date night. Both parties should really remember what "a date" was like before the wedding - how they acted and what they did when it was exciting - and try to from time to time recapture that in the "married" date nights.

Edited January 31, 2016 by dichotomy

[lucy_in_disguise]

Im sure your frend is already aware of the possibility of infidelity. I cant imagine its the first time shes hearing that men (or women) are capable of cheating. I dont really think the things you said could shake her trust, unless it was already shaky to begin with.

 

Yes, 50% of marriages end- but thats 50% that dont. Hopefully your friend falls into the statistical groups for whom divorce is less likely- older, more educated.

 

A lot of people cheat but many others do not. One thing is for sure, bad things will happen, in one form or another, over the years. Hopefully the bad does not outweigh the good in her marriage, and she is able to weather the trying times.

 

I think it can be important to put infiedlity in context. One way or another, most people are able to move past it, emerge stronger on the other end- either together, or alone. And with time, it recedes into memory, an event long ago that makes up the fabric of your life. Its not the worst thing that can happen.

[Whoknew30]

Yes 50% of marriages end in divorce & some of it is due to deception but IMO, it's also bc people now a days have a bull**** perspective of marriage. The problems marriages face have never changed, people use to realize that people weren't perfect & marriage isn't easy. Now (& you read it here a lot) all you hear is, "I thought my marriage/spouse was perfect"...no marriage or person is perfect & to go into with this "fairytale" image is just ignorant.

 

I see nothing wrong with what you said. The reality is you will never stay the same exact person you were when you get married time, kids, jobs ext...always changes things. You have to a maintain a marriage, just as anything else in life.

[ShatteredLady]

My friends Andy & Jack met in their early 20's. Of all of my gay friends & aquaintances (most of the straight ones too!) they had the strongest most monogamous relationship at such a young age....still do nearly 30 years later!!

 

I remember the subject coming-up at a party & the most common response from gay men was "I want a true partner to share my life with. I don't want to be clubbing, partying & playing anymore!". Jacks response was "Then WHY do you do it?".

 

It's sounds so simple but the truth is most of us don't talk about it. Most ONS type infidelity happens because of location as much as boundaries....you're far more likely to get in trouble drunk & partying half the night than you are walking around the botanical gardens!

 

Most affairs are step by step, sooner or later knowing EXACTLY what you're doing nonsense! Maybe if we all talked about it more & read forums like these we could avoid so much pain.

 

So very few people say, "I'm so glad I had that affair. It was brilliant!!". Most deeply, desperately regret what they've done. Maybe if we were more honest with eachother & ourselves, rather than living in fairy 'soul mates' land leading up to the wedding, all that agony could be avoided.

 

I don't know! I loved my happy little fantasy land. I truly did! I'd sacrifice my innocence to avoid the unspeakable pain any day...

[13Hearts]

I'm not sure what you mean by "screwed outlook" regarding marriage but I didn't disagree with anything you said. I think many people are naive when it comes to marriage, especially in their 20s. I was naive about it too. My perspective came from my parents, and they are very old-fashioned; and from TV, which gives a very romanticized view of marriage. It took me a lot of pain and heartache to come to realize the truth of the matter.

 

You seem realistic to me. Sure, maybe you are pessimistic about it, but you sound reasonable. I know what you mean about reading this web page. Sometimes it is overwhelming to read all the stories of cheating spouses; sometimes it gives me anxiety.

 

Anyway, I wouldn't worry that you've ruined things for her; you don't have that much power. She'll learn on her own; just be there when she needs you.

[ShatteredLady]

Stories, books, movies etc. end with "And they lived happily ever after". We yearn for the "ever after" but many love the drama, thrills & excitement that are the story. The 'normal' of everyday marriage can make some yearn for the high again...that's where the "I love you but I'm not....blah, blah, bollocks" comes in!

 

 

I was truly naive, or maybe I was just addicted to my own love story. Would I sacrifice my innocence for all those years, my blind happiness within the warm blanket of my little family & my delusions? Reality would of saved me an element of my agony. Note I said "an element". Even a realist would have to endure most of the same pain & anguish.

 

I believe that for every weak person who devastates & betrays the people they claim to love there are others who NEVER, in a whole lifetime, even come close to adultery. Regardless of my own life experiences I truly believe that. I KNOW that to be true.

 

Even with 20/20 hindsight I don't think it's worth a life of 'less', a loss of blissful innocence, just in case he's one of the weak ones at some stage in forever.

 

What I do wish is that someone had warned me of the signs & the cheater script. Now I can see so clearly when my H started to drift towards infidelity. I could of stopped it before it really took off...or at least tried to.

 

I have to confess that I'm the kind of pathetic looser who was soooo happy that my H had made a nice friends to hang-out with at work. He was happy & didn't hate his job for the first time! I was desperately lonely in a new country but moving was a GREAT idea because my H was enthusiastic leaving the house in the morning. His happiness was more important to me than my own..... Oh so very many lessons to be learnt there!!

 

You NEVER know how you're going to react until it happens to you. I promised myself I'd be on the first plane home if he ever did it again. I'm still here!!

[ShatteredLady]

As you can tell I've been thinking about this a lot since my first post!

 

OP. You've also posted "Never be a SAHM!". Do you really believe that? I don't think I'd sacrifice the start in life I gave my kids for my own success & independence now... I like you & understand what your doing on these forums. I do think it's increasing your already negative views. Don't forget there's a whole other world out there filled with people who never know the agony...

 

I don't think it's possible to protect your heart AND truly know how wonderful marriage can be.

Edited February 1, 2016 by ShatteredLady

[Parannonx]

The potential for pain is the cost of joy.

 

Simple as that, to feel real happiness you have to open yourself up to and accept the possibility of pain. Trust means that betrayal is possible. But life lived closed, paranoid and in fear is not a life worth living.

 

I've been cheated on and once I even cheated, a lesson learned through much pain. I am now someone who would never cheat, honesty is too important to me. At the same time I understand that we can all be weak and stupid under the right circumstances.

 

You can not stop someone from cheating on you, because the reason they cheat isn't about you (no matter what bull**** they spew) it's about their own character and insecurities.

 

I do believe that people can change, but only if they decide that they don't like what they have become.

 

Infidelity doesn't have to be the end of a relationship. But it is a sign of something deeply wrong with the cheater that they need to figure out and fix.

 

Relationships require a regular investment of time and energy. The common thread in most stories of broken relationships is that the parties grew apart, they found other interests or spent to much time at work or with colleagues.

 

What you never hear is someone saying that they just had too much together time. I mean sure I suppose that it is possible, if you are wealthy enough that you have no job or responsibilities but for us mere mortals that is seldom the case.

 

So my advice is to be brave enough to risk pain and stay engaged enough that there is no minimize the risk. Then if you are still hurt, understand that it's not your fault and that the pain is only temporary.

[RySant]

 

OP. You've also posted "Never be a SAHM!". Do you really believe that? I don't think I'd sacrifice the start in life I gave my kids for my own success & independence now...

 

I don't think it's possible to protect your heart AND truly know how wonderful marriage can be.

 

Actually, for some reason, even if I will never be a "SAHM" (because I am a gay guy haha) I just CAN'T take it when I see mothers/wives who were asked by their husbands or they mutually agreed that one of them will stay at home so that the other can work and the other can take care of the house/family. I know what you're getting at. I know that you'll never exchange the quality time and the sacrifice you gave to take care of your kids full-time. I am not looking down on you for your choice.

 

But my major concern for you guys is, when these kinds of situations arise. There is a thread in the Other Woman section where this OW successfully got her AP, and now the SAHM for 10 years is being abandoned and the OW is trying to be involved in the payment of alimony etc. stating that she can work. I mean, who would accept that SAHM when she has a 10-year gap in her resume? Shes's 10 years outdated in MS Office tools, does she even know how to operate a post-Windows XP machine? If she got a work right now, will her lifestyle be at par with what she's getting when she is married? Her husband has 10 years ahead of her in terms of work experience. She has none. But since he found someone else, who cares if the SAHM will live in poverty?

 

I work as a recruiter in a big, multinational company, and as much as I symphatize with this SAHM, I would never hire her as it will betray my role in the company. This poor woman who's only fault was to stay at home with the kids, while the husband is out and about, working his career off and, has chances of meeting new other people (which, obviously, he did) and now, he's leaving.

 

If there's no SAHM, she'll have much better options and choices if things like these happen. She might have self-capability to take care of her kids AND herself just in case her husband stopped giving child support (it happens). She'll have much confidence in herself that she have the option to walk away. For me, in this day and age, women must always have a back-up plan. It's hard for me to see people like these who became helpless because of their husband's selfish betrayal. And divorce rate is rampant nowadays. Women must really have their individual power to live on their own.

[BettyDraper]

Actually, for some reason, even if I will never be a "SAHM" (because I am a gay guy haha) I just CAN'T take it when I see mothers/wives who were asked by their husbands or they mutually agreed that one of them will stay at home so that the other can work and the other can take care of the house/family. I know what you're getting at. I know that you'll never exchange the quality time and the sacrifice you gave to take care of your kids full-time. I am not looking down on you for your choice.

 

But my major concern for you guys is, when these kinds of situations arise. There is a thread in the Other Woman section where this OW successfully got her AP, and now the SAHM for 10 years is being abandoned and the OW is trying to be involved in the payment of alimony etc. stating that she can work. I mean, who would accept that SAHM when she has a 10-year gap in her resume? Shes's 10 years outdated in MS Office tools, does she even know how to operate a post-Windows XP machine? If she got a work right now, will her lifestyle be at par with what she's getting when she is married? Her husband has 10 years ahead of her in terms of work experience. She has none. But since he found someone else, who cares if the SAHM will live in poverty?

 

I work as a recruiter in a big, multinational company, and as much as I symphatize with this SAHM, I would never hire her as it will betray my role in the company. This poor woman who's only fault was to stay at home with the kids, while the husband is out and about, working his career off and, has chances of meeting new other people (which, obviously, he did) and now, he's leaving.

 

If there's no SAHM, she'll have much better options and choices if things like these happen. She might have self-capability to take care of her kids AND herself just in case her husband stopped giving child support (it happens). She'll have much confidence in herself that she have the option to walk away. For me, in this day and age, women must always have a back-up plan. It's hard for me to see people like these who became helpless because of their husband's selfish betrayal. And divorce rate is rampant nowadays. Women must really have their individual power to live on their own.

 

A SAHM can always take courses part time while she is home with her kids.

She can also do volunteer work to keep her resume current. There's also the option of part time work.

 

I stay at home and I don't even have any kids. However, I have an education, my own investments and money in the bank that my husband can't touch. We also have a postnuptial agreement. There's no way I would stay at home if I couldn't cover my own ass. My confidence to walk away has not been eroded. I feel much for fullfilled volunteering my time to improve the world than being in the cutthroat corporate world.

 

I agree that a woman should not stay home if she has no education, work experience or any savings to rely on.