What does a frustrated old codger do?

[elaine567]

 

Any woman who withholds and uses sex as a weapon this way gets zero sympathy from me.

 

Yes but has she really used it as a "weapon"?

She may have thought sex every 2-3 months was adequate in their 50s 60s.

[xxoo]

There is a use it or lose it principle when it comes to sex and aging. It's been years, she's well past menopause and sex is undesirable for her. No surprise there. My grandmother wasn't much older when her husband died, and she never had sex again despite offers. SHe told me about them as a teenager, haha!

 

I understand that this is a desire for you, but it simply isn't for her. That doesn't make her a villain. This problem maybe could have been solved 20 years ago, but there was pesky affair in the mix then.

 

Your only hope, imo, would be to simply court your wife like a girl again and get back the trust and intimacy. Intercourse will probably never come back and may be very painful for her if she tried after all this time past menopause. But you might have some hope of reincorporating skin on skin cuddling, passionate kisses, and sexual touch.

[NessunoDorma]

Really you love her? Than why are you treating her so poorly. There is no way I'd be having sex with you if you ever spoke to me that way. You are emotionally abusive to your wife. I am shocked that you would kick your daughter out of her home so you can move in join a dating website in order to get sex. Absolutely disgusting. I live in Aust and I really hope I don't bump into you on the street.

 

You need to see a therapist about your obsession with sex. Tell your therapist that you want to kick your own daughter out of her home, so you can have a root there from someone you meet on an Internet site. That is just so bizarre, who treats their daughter this way?

 

Please don't join an Internet site here in Aust, us women don't want to meet you. Look how you treat your own wife!

 

Firstly Holy Terror has lived there all during university. That's 5 (FIVE) years. Rent free. She is now a highly paid professional. As a parent, it would be a disservice to let the situation go on any longer. She needs to be able to stand on her own two feet & get the life experience she needs to go out in the world. Nothing, but nothing, pisses me off more than Helicopter Parents who hover over their kids & do them a real disservice by coming to their rescue at every little crisis. I was there for all the big crises: alcohol abuse, self harm, sexual misadventures with abusive boyfriends to name but a few. Madam, I am the one with 4 successful, productive kids. How many do you have?

 

 

Secondly, wanting sex more than 4-5 times a year for about 2 decades makes me obsessed? I'm sorry but most therapists regard that as celibacy. Gee, what's it like for you to be married to a monk? Oh! Wait a minute, are you dating? How's that working for you?

 

 

Thirdly, I'm emotionally abusive? What do you call offering a trial separation as response to a conversation about sex?

 

 

Have no fear girlie, if I encounter someone like you, I'll run faster that you can.

[soleilesquire]

OP, I truly so wish you the best.

 

Please NEVER believe the lie that sexual intimacy is trivial, that it is fine to withhold it, that it MUST be your fault if your spouse starves you, or that you just oughta suck it up and be glad for what you got. Actually, that is more than one thing.....and they are all lies.

 

As a woman, I am embarrassed and ashamed when I encounter fellow "sisters" who have abnormal views and hangups about sex and consider it to be silly, being intentionally ignorant about how much it means to a man.

 

Soldier on, and do what is best for YOU. Your wife certainly has NOT considered that for the past 2 decades.

[xxoo]

Thirdly, I'm emotionally abusive? What do you call offering a trial separation as response to a conversation about sex?.

 

Her offer of a trial separation is called honesty. She is happy with sexless marriage, but she's wiling to separate so that you can pursue sex with others. She is not willing to have (more) sex with you.

[NessunoDorma]

Breakfast!

 

 

I made her scrambled eggs.

 

 

She made me an offer!

 

 

Her: How about we schedule 2 nights each week for sex?

 

 

Me: BTDT. At least 6 times. Each time it lasted 2-3 weeks then same old same old. Each time my self esteem got flushed down the toilet. Look I was horrified at your offer of a trial sep. But I'm beginning to see it as a viable option. I don't want a divorce. We are sustained by a superannuation fund I manage that will automatically convert to a trust for our kids when we die. I have no desire to change that. Not divorcing will ensure that happens.

 

 

Her: That's a relief! I'm having nightmares about you burning half the kids' inheritance. Please consider my offer.

 

 

 

 

Later that morning, she calls me to the PC. She's on eBay shopping for lingerie! OMG! PARADIGM SHIFT!

 

 

Her: I'm assuming you prefer red? *It's a satin corset*

 

 

Me: Yeah, red. Do we get the model that's wearing it too?

 

 

Her: You dirty old man!

 

 

She looks up & smiles. I see the girl I married & melt.

 

 

Her: Please consider my offer. I promise to be interested & interesting. I only ask one thing: don't put pressure on me to orgasm. If I do, thanks. If I don't that's my problem.

 

 

Me: OK. Done deal. You offered me a trial sep. I'm going to counter-offer you a trial New Marriage. The freeloader in our apartment has said she will move out in 3 months. We should have a result/answer by then.

 

 

Her: Yep! That's fair.

 

 

So I will log out now for a month or two but will report back then.

 

 

To quote Dirty Harry: "I know what you're thinking." Why did he wait so long to make a stand? I work in a field where I see 1st hand how kids are hurt when parents stuff up. It's awful! This can still go either way. But now my kids are able to handle the fall out if it goes belly-up.

 

 

Thanks to all! Even the Aussie lady []

 

Ya gotta love the 'net!

Edited February 21, 2016 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Language

[soleilesquire]

I only ask one thing: don't put pressure on me to orgasm. If I do, thanks. If I don't that's my problem.

 

Please take this to heart. We women can enjoy without "getting there," and a man thinking we have to get there makes it almost impossible.

 

Other than that, I am glad for this turn of events.

[Dolfin80]

I'm reading your posts from the perspective of a young women, your daughters age. If my father kicked me out of my home because he wants to have sex in there, I'd be mortified. If my father spoke to my mother the way you speak to your wife, I'd be mortified. My mother deserves more respect. I really hope your daughter doesn't read your post because it will hurt her.

[soleilesquire]

I'm reading your posts from the perspective of a young women, your daughters age. If my father kicked me out of my home because he wants to have sex in there, I'd be mortified. If my father spoke to my mother the way you speak to your wife, I'd be mortified. My mother deserves more respect. I really hope your daughter doesn't read your post because it will hurt her.

 

If my mother had starved my father for 2 decades, laughed at and belittled his needs, and I was mooching off both of them, I'd be mortified.

 

But, it sounds like the OP's wife DOES have some empathy. compassion, and love after all, and wants to try to met her husband halfway.

[Dolfin80]

If my mother had starved my father for 2 decades, laughed at and belittled his needs, and I was mooching off both of them, I'd be mortified.

 

But, it sounds like the OP's wife DOES have some empathy. compassion, and love after all, and wants to try to met her husband halfway.

 

She hasn't been starving him, he said they have sex every few months. That's when she feels like having sex with her hubby. So now he is going to have sex with her when she doesn't want to due to emotional blackmail. That's called coercion. This is horrible.

 

Poor women, imagine her lying there not wanting it, she will be dry. It will likely hurt her. This is cruel. She will feel objectified, what is he going to do if she starts crying because it hurts her?

 

Will he say "you must give me sex now otherwise I will leave you"?

 

Where's the respect in this marriage?

Edited February 21, 2016 by Dolfin80

[soleilesquire]

She hasn't been starving him, he said they have sex every few months. That's when she feels like having sex with her hubby. So now he is going to have sex with her when she doesn't want to due to emotional blackmail. That's called coercion. This is horrible.

 

Poor women, imagine her lying there not wanting it, she will be dry. It will likely hurt her. This is cruel. She will feel objectified, what is he going to do if she starts crying because it hurts her?

 

I understand that for a woman who does not feel sex is important, does not like men, and has never been starved for year (and yes, every few months IS starved), this doesn;t make sense.

 

For those of us who have been in the OP's shoes, I can tell you that having the person who is supposed to love you withhold intimacy is like a slow death.

[Dolfin80]

I understand that for a woman who does not feel sex is important, does not like men, and has never been starved for year (and yes, every few months IS starved), this doesn;t make sense.

 

For those of us who have been in the OP's shoes, I can tell you that having the person who is supposed to love you withhold intimacy is like a slow death.

 

So you are saying that you would have sex with your parter even if they didn't want it? How would you get them aroused if they didn't want it?

 

It would hurt for the unaroused person, male or female.

[xxoo]

I understand that for a woman who does not feel sex is important, does not like men, and has never been starved for year (and yes, every few months IS starved), this doesn;t make sense.

 

For those of us who have been in the OP's shoes, I can tell you that having the person who is supposed to love you withhold intimacy is like a slow death.

 

There is more to intimacy than sex.

 

Very often the problem is that real intimacy died, but one partner still expects sex and calls it intimacy.

 

Sex will likely be painful for this woman, but I guess she's willing to grit her teeth and bear it for her kids' inheritance :/

[Dolfin80]

There is more to intimacy than sex.

 

Very often the problem is that real intimacy died, but one partner still expects sex and calls it intimacy.

 

Sex will likely be painful for this woman, but I guess she's willing to grit her teeth and bear it for her kids' inheritance :/

 

Yes I agree. Women need intimacy to feel comfortable to have sex. Once that intimacy dies you simply can't get aroused. Please apply plenty of lubricate to this women otherwise she will get bruised and perhaps even bleed. The skin is quite fragile down there for a women in her 60s.

[wmacbride]

I wonder if YOU were the only one having an EA in this marriage. she is really eager to get you out of the way. have you done any snooping? Her emails, her phone, credit card bills....you do know that one sign a woman is cheating on you is that the sex drops off to nothing.

 

 

and about the hall pass, that would be a much more practical way for you to have sex than a separation or divorce. and by separation, exactly WHO leaves the house to live in a crappy apartment? You? guess again, kick her azz out the door.

 

I could be way off base here, but it sounds as if she has had a lot of resentment of the OP's EA , and let it build for years. She may have been looking for a way out, and now she has one.

[wmacbride]

I don't think we have read this same thread. This woman has starved her husband for 20 years, and she outright belittles his needs. This is a selfish woman with truly sad character.

 

Any woman who withholds and uses sex as a weapon this way gets zero sympathy from me.

 

 

I'm not disagreeing with you, but we are only getting access to his side of the story. what is his wifes?

 

I don't know if it would chnage anything, but there are so many factors at play. I have a feeling he is presenting the best view of himslef here possible, which is what one would expect.

[elaine567]

I'm not disagreeing with you, but we are only getting access to his side of the story. what is his wifes?

 

I don't know if it would chnage anything, but there are so many factors at play. I have a feeling he is presenting the best view of himslef here possible, which is what one would expect.

 

See the more recent update. #81

 

"Her: How about we schedule 2 nights each week for sex? "

[wmacbride]

Firstly Holy Terror has lived there all during university. That's 5 (FIVE) years. Rent free. She is now a highly paid professional. As a parent, it would be a disservice to let the situation go on any longer. She needs to be able to stand on her own two feet & get the life experience she needs to go out in the world. Nothing, but nothing, pisses me off more than Helicopter Parents who hover over their kids & do them a real disservice by coming to their rescue at every little crisis. I was there for all the big crises: alcohol abuse, self harm, sexual misadventures with abusive boyfriends to name but a few. Madam, I am the one with 4 successful, productive kids. How many do you have?

 

 

Secondly, wanting sex more than 4-5 times a year for about 2 decades makes me obsessed? I'm sorry but most therapists regard that as celibacy. Gee, what's it like for you to be married to a monk? Oh! Wait a minute, are you dating? How's that working for you?

 

 

Thirdly, I'm emotionally abusive? What do you call offering a trial separation as response to a conversation about sex?

 

 

Have no fear girlie, if I encounter someone like you, I'll run faster that you can.

 

I can't understand why someone;s first response to your question would be offering you a trial separation.

there is something deeper going on here.

 

How did the two of you deal with the Ea you had? Did you actually address it , or was it swept under the rug? I'm asking because sometimes people do rug sweep, but resentment builds and festers for a long, long time, until hey finally reach a tipping point.

Is it possible this was hers? Maybe she thought she needed to stay and make the best life she could for her kids and herself, until she just couldn't do it anymore.

 

I'm not trying to sound rude, but is it possible you broke her heart and she's never really gotten over that?

 

When you has the ea, was was the SOP for dealing with marital events like that at the time?

 

Have you sat down with her and discussed how she feels about the EA without the lack sex element being involved in the discussion? Have you ever asked her if your ea was aprt of the reason she went off sex?

 

I'm not trying to minimize your feelings or blame you, but it does sound like you love her and would, if you could, want to remain married. If that is part of why she went off sex, you can't begin to address the issue unless you address that first. Is it possible she's too embarrassed to admit that it hurt her as much as it likely did? Did she allow herself to be angry about it?

 

It sounds like you have had therapy, but not every therapist meets every need of every couple. Sometimes, you need to try more than one.

[waterwoman]

I totally agree with wmac. You had an affair. Do you know hoe damaging that is to a spouse? That is something that needs to be addressed even more than the sex. I really hope you do so as part of this new marriage.

[wmacbride]

See the more recent update. #81

 

"Her: How about we schedule 2 nights each week for sex? "

 

Ah I see.

 

In his words, I also think I see part of the problem.

 

I had a friend who went off sex with her husband. We were talking about it after she'd had a few drinks, and the reason was that he wnated her to orgasm every time. Not for her but because it bruised his ego if she didn't.

 

She finally got up the serve to talk to him and explained that she couldn't have one every time, and she was okay with that. She explained it wan;t his fault and she still loved him, and liked just being close to him like that.

 

Made a world of difference to both of them.

[Liam1]

 

Me: Yeah, red. Do we get the model that's wearing it too?

 

 

Her: You dirty old man!

 

NessunoDorma:

 

I think we found the problem of why your wife is no longer interested in sex.

 

IMO, most women would find your interest in the model to be a major turn off.

 

She is showing you lingerie to interest you and you show interest in another woman.

 

Also, you said you had an emotional affair. Well, that's another turn off to women.

 

According to my marriage couselor, women find an emotional affair to be more damaging whereas men find a sexual affair to be more harmful to their ego.

 

IMO, you need some heavy duty counseling.

 

In counseling, I learned that my wife likes to be romanced. She is a scientist and works hard all day and to get revved up sexually she needs romance.

 

So maybe try romancing your wife.

 

With that said, I had an affair and truthfully, the woman had a really high sex drive.

 

After awhile it was a huge turn off. She reminded me of a cat in heat. As soon as I would walk in the door she was climbing all over me. Ugh.

 

She seemed to sit around and think about nothing else but getting laid all day.

 

It sounds great right. Like every guy's fantasy, but it became a major turn off. It seemed like anyone would do because she was just hot and horny all the time.

 

Also, sex in a want, it's not a need. Food and water and air is a need for survival but sex is not.

 

Some scientists claim it is only an urge rooted in the imperative to procreate. Once that is past many men and women lose interest in sex.

 

Think about it. What will you do if your libido cools down. Will you enjoy your wife hounding you for sex?

 

Try to romance her. It worked for me.

 

But in the end, there is more to a marriage than sex and you may end up eating your words someday.

 

If you love your wife, get counseling. As others have pointed out, a person doesn't just lose interest in sex. It's likely somethin you are doing that is turning her off, if there is no physical issue.

Edited February 22, 2016 by Liam1

[soleilesquire]

I have a question:

 

Was your EA twenty years ago, and did the EA precipitate the disappearance of sex? OR did the EA occur after several years of a sexless marriage?

 

Either way, the EA was absolutely wrong. However, there seems to be a NEED to paint you as a cheating horndog who is completely to blame for your wife's withholding. I'm trying to get some context.

[carhill]

In the opening post, the OP wrote:

 

Apart from tension about the paltry amount of sex, the marriage was conflict free except for my short EA in my late 50's with a much younger divorcee.

 

From reading, that appears to be around ten years ago, so midway into their period of greatly diminished or missing lovemaking.

[Liam1]

In the opening post, the OP wrote:

 

Apart from tension about the paltry amount of sex, the marriage was conflict free except for my short EA in my late 50's with a much younger divorcee.

 

From reading, that appears to be around ten years ago, so midway into their period of greatly diminished or missing lovemaking.

 

Yes, it is interesting that he had an EA rather than a PA.

 

The EA indicates to me that there may be something deeper going on. Most men want a PA.

 

In any case, An EA is more emotionally damaging to a woman.

 

Soleil Square:

 

No one is painting him as a horndog.

 

We are trying to tell him that he is obviously not blameless in his wife's lack of sexual interest. I romance my wife and that turned things around sexually.

 

I am curious. Soleil, you seem very quick to paint the wife as selfish and withholding, when you know nothing about her.

 

Does your husband dislike sex? Perhaps you are projecting your anger at your husband toward this woman.

 

Obviously this man did things in the marriage that could destroy intimacy.

 

It is my understanding she offered him a trial separation. So, why not try that. Maybe she would be happier and so would he?

 

I am curious about why he does not take her up on her offer

Edited February 22, 2016 by Liam1

[carhill]

One example in the EA/PA realm has to do with personal boundaries and the OP can elaborate. Some people, like myself, retain sexual contact for committed relationships, in his case a long marriage, so what are now known as emotional affairs (this was unheard of back when I was an OM) can occur without any sexual contact and stay in that realm. IME, most MW's perfered it that way if they could have it.

 

OP, what is your perspective on this issue? Did you know, back when you were having an EA, what an emotional affair was/is? How did that contact reconcile with your perspective on your M at the time and how does that reconciliation compare with the current marital dynamic?