Fear I am not progressing well in coping, 2

[elseaacych]

GC, I saw my ex for the first time in nine months today. I saw him out of the corner of my eye at the event I was at with my date and a few other law students. He skulked one way, and then about an hour later, I saw him skulk back in the opposite direction. Both times, by himself.

 

I did not feel a pain in my chest when I saw him initially. I waited for it to come. Just to sock me in the chest. Twist like a knife. Nothing. It only came when I really thought about it for awhile.

 

I have seen rock bottom. I saw it several months ago, when I was begging my housemates to help me out of bed because I was so depressed that all I could do was lay in my bed and cry. That was about five months ago. I've come a long way since then.

 

GC, I tell you this story, because I want you to know it does get better. It takes days and months of telling yourself you deserve better. It takes days and months of NC, not just from his side, but your side. You choose to stay silent. It takes days and months of telling yourself you will be better, of dragging yourself out of bed, of telling yourself that you gladly accept your new reality over and over again. Days and months of therapy. Years. Telling the same story over, only to realize that the story doesn't change, your perspective does. To make peace with yourself, while not exactly feeling peaceful. Day by day it will change, if you tell yourself of your new reality, aceept it, like a bitter medicine that one day will go down smoothly.

 

It will get better. Just believe. Tell yourself every chance you get.

[Carpe-diem]

No one is giving K more credit. You're right we don't know you and we don't know K but we know that you are in immense pain and can see no way out. We know that K has made no effort to reconcile with you.

 

 

You said his Mum said K had the "Same kind of problems in all his previous relationship". What does that tell you? That he is consistent with his behaviour and is not willing to change". You can't take that personally. I know you want to be the one that he would go the extra mile for (we all wanted that with our exes) but he didn't, he continued his pattern of being unemotionally available and he'll continue to do so.

 

 

He was never right for you and you know that but love has no logic so the heart continues to grieve whilst the brain keeps kicking you into touch. You haven't contacted him (don't you dare do it now) because you know it would be futile and set you back months from progress that (believe it or not) you are making. Start giving yourself some credit.

 

 

xx

[Carpe-diem]

As I typed that the radio played a song that I wrote the lyrics on a Valentines card to my ex. Still get that pang of hurt but I smiled and carried on. A while back I would have had to stop everything and have a little cry. It does get better I promise.

[Zapbasket]

No one is giving K more credit. You're right we don't know you and we don't know K but we know that you are in immense pain and can see no way out. We know that K has made no effort to reconcile with you.

 

 

You said his Mum said K had the "Same kind of problems in all his previous relationship". What does that tell you? That he is consistent with his behaviour and is not willing to change". You can't take that personally. I know you want to be the one that he would go the extra mile for (we all wanted that with our exes) but he didn't, he continued his pattern of being unemotionally available and he'll continue to do so.

 

 

He was never right for you and you know that but love has no logic so the heart continues to grieve whilst the brain keeps kicking you into touch. You haven't contacted him (don't you dare do it now) because you know it would be futile and set you back months from progress that (believe it or not) you are making. Start giving yourself some credit.

 

 

xx

 

Thank you so much, Carpe-diem and everyone.

 

I've been focused on pulling myself out of the pit of the acute depression that had struck me over the past month or so. The meds have seemed to help, or maybe it's just the movement of the grieving process, or a combination of both. Last weekend I joined a volunteer trail-reconstruction group camping in the woods and building water bars on one of our local mountains, and next week I'm going off-grid for 10 days for a combination of car camping and backpacking in some canyons in my and neighboring states.

 

I can feel my heart peeling off of K as I continually remind myself that the "better behavior" I kept believing he was capable of and kept waiting for was clearly an illusion of my own wishful thinking and inability to act decisively in my own best interest based on the messages from my gut. I was feeling good-ish until once again yesterday afternoon I saw his truck on the road, saw him out last night (in his truck), and then saw him leave for the day this morning as I returned from the store where I'd gone to get coffee and a croissant.

 

Once again I am feeling like he's having no trouble moving on, and I'm struggling. I"m going on this solo trip because why? Because it's my birthday next Friday and I have no friends here who even know it's my birthday, and then a few days after my birthday is his birthday and I don't want to have to be around to possibly see him celebrating or just being in the vicinity KNOWING it's his birthday. I hate that K treated me the way he did when he has so much history and such a support network of family and friends here and I was completely new and vulnerable here when we started dating. I've had to start basically from scratch; it's like I just moved here.

 

But the thing that hurts me the most at this stage isn't K and what he did or didn't do or couldn't do or whatever the f*ck it was, it's my own betrayal of myself that is making tears stream down my face. I should have been the one clearly and cleanly to have walked away much earlier. I understand logistically why I didn't, and am beginning to understand emotionally...and that discovery is what is so painful: basically, it's because of deep-seated feelings of unworthiness that lurk all over my psyche and that I never thought were there to such a degree, especially since outwardly I manage to exude such confidence.

 

I'm especially pained by the fact that this pattern precedes K, with the first relationship (from 2007) that originally brought me to LS. I thought I'd surmounted that break up, but it really threw me off balance so much that I think only now am I beginning to get any kind of a grip. Or, I can see the "grip" on the horizon as I continue to doggedly work through this grief.

 

To any of you out there reading this, men or women, don't do what I did--don't ever sell yourself short in relationships or career or lifestyle. The pain of recognizing that despite what another person or people did in relation to you, YOU really were the cause of your pain because YOU failed to stick up for YOU, has got to be the worst pain ever.

 

The issues with K were evident almost from the get-go, and for this person that at the time I only barely knew, I overrode my own discomfort and confusion to make constant excuses for him, at the expense of my dignity, well-being, self-interest, self-love, and self-respect. I spent 3.5 years of a relationship with him waiting for his "better behavior," and then as the relationship faltered and I flailed around trying to right it last summer, I waited for his "better behavior," and then, when he closed off any further communication or contact, I wanted for a whole year for "better behavior" where he'd actually finally show he cared. And guess what? I'm still waiting--only now, I'm actively coaching myself out of that because I know better. He HAS no "better behavior." What I got was what there was.

 

It's pretty awful, what I feel the more clearly I see all this. I wouldn't wish this on anyone, and those of you whom I know can relate, my heart flows with compassion for all of us.

 

I hope fervently that the outcome if this is that I learn never to betray myself again. It's one thing to vow to do so, and another to actually acquire the awareness and tools to ensure the mistake is not repeated, or at least righted immediately upon recognition that I'm falling into old patterns.

 

I know this will pass, but I really wish K dead. I'm not kidding. It does hurt to think of him out there, moved on, not feeling any real compunction for the way he behaved in the relationship with me. He should have been the most minor of minor characters in my life, and instead still, he looms large as a stand-in for all the emotional issues (lack of self-worth, namely) I must deal with in myself.

Edited September 13, 2014 by GreenCove

[Zapbasket]

AAAAAHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!

 

I keep trying to scream it to myself: "HE DOESN'T MATTER! HE DOESN'T MATTER! HE DOESN'T MATTER!"

 

And yet I keep finding my thoughts going to him! So then I try to coach myself in my mind: "GC, you got into this whole years-long mess because you didn't trust YOU. You held on to him in the beginning because you didn't trust that though it would be a lonely, hard road you could make it in this new town on your own. Now, you need to trust in all your attributes. You are beautiful, strong, talented athletically as well as intellectually and artistically. People really like you and that says a lot about YOU even IF many or most of those people can't give you the kind of loyalty and friendship that you truly value. You have been successful before and you will be successful again! You get out there with your head held high and focus on YOU and things WILL HAPPEN FOR THE BETTER!!!"

 

But it's so hard, to dispel that tiny voice, deep deep in there, that doesn't completely believe that.

 

And then I get to worrying about K and what he's doing and how he's feeling and whether he has moved on and whether he ever regrets the way he acted towards me and whether he wonders what I'm up to the way I wonder about him and and and....

 

God da*n it, it's so f*cking hard, people!!!!!!!

 

What do you do to get to the positive end of this thought cycle?

[Carpe-diem]

hey GC,

 

You are sounding much more positive in your last post and that is brilliant. You keep yourself active which is more than I am doing at the moment. I've been stuck in my house these last two weekends with a cold and I have been crying a lot. Hopefully this will soon pass.

 

We've all got regret about not getting out sooner. I remember clearly on my fourth date with ex driving in my car and he said 3 things that made me go RED FLAG....it was like the words were written on my windscreen. I liked him enough at this stage to want to persue this relationship and thought I shouldn't judge someone from their past behaviour. Boy was I wrong. So what you are going through is natural, shifting the blame onto yourself. Wrong. You are loving, caring and emotional. We all are on this thread otherwise we wouldn't be helping each other. Do you think our knob head exes would be on this site? They don't care enough (never has the word enough meant so much to me).

 

I still believe K leaving town will help you immensely. Look what happens when you see him only briefly? I would hate to be running into my ex as much as you do. I last saw my ex 6 months ago on public transport. Stuck on the same carriage as him. I think he was going to say Hello or something but I looked away and kept my head firmly focused on my lap. That lasted for 15mins. I glanced up twice and he was looking straight ahead, deadpan face, no emotion. I was going to a concert that night and I was in tears. I had never had to ignore someone I loved before. I thought he might call/text saying why did you ignore me? No, got nothing. I'm sure he would have turned it round thinking, rude bitch, not 'I guess I really hurt her, she can't even look at me'. I'll never know.

 

Around that time I had started seeing a therapist as we were 7 months split up and I was not over him in the slightest. She said the same to me what you are thinking, I don't think I'm good enough for anyone. This is true. So I have to take the focus off my ex and work on myself. I think these men find out our weakness and prey on it, use it to their advantage. Nice eh?

 

Wishing him dead just means you wish there is an end to all this. There won't be. He will always be a part of your life and a focus on a lot of your regret. But it will ease. It is easing. We just want to close that chapter of our lives but occasionally we can't help going back for a quick read. But hopefully in those quick glances we will read it differently. Like when you watch a film over and over, each time you see a mistake. For me it was watching Lethal Weapon the other night.

 

As I have said before, I respond to your posts because we are in very similar situations with our emotions and the time it has been. I'm sick of crying. I want to meet someone else, I go on dates but nothing comes of it. There is a part of me that wants to talk to my ex but I don't think it's to reconcile, more to get my side of things across but what do you think that would achieve? My guess? F**k all!

 

You're doing great GC and I (like the other great people here) am here for you.

 

Much cyber hugs (well air kisses as I have a chesty cough). xxx

[BC1980]

AAAAAHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!

 

I keep trying to scream it to myself: "HE DOESN'T MATTER! HE DOESN'T MATTER! HE DOESN'T MATTER!"

 

And yet I keep finding my thoughts going to him! So then I try to coach myself in my mind: "GC, you got into this whole years-long mess because you didn't trust YOU. You held on to him in the beginning because you didn't trust that though it would be a lonely, hard road you could make it in this new town on your own. Now, you need to trust in all your attributes. You are beautiful, strong, talented athletically as well as intellectually and artistically. People really like you and that says a lot about YOU even IF many or most of those people can't give you the kind of loyalty and friendship that you truly value. You have been successful before and you will be successful again! You get out there with your head held high and focus on YOU and things WILL HAPPEN FOR THE BETTER!!!"

 

But it's so hard, to dispel that tiny voice, deep deep in there, that doesn't completely believe that.

 

And then I get to worrying about K and what he's doing and how he's feeling and whether he has moved on and whether he ever regrets the way he acted towards me and whether he wonders what I'm up to the way I wonder about him and and and....

 

God da*n it, it's so f*cking hard, people!!!!!!!

 

What do you do to get to the positive end of this thought cycle?

 

GC, one thing I learned is to take accountability, but don't beat yourself up about the past mistakes. If I had listened to my gut, I would have left a year before my ex dumped me. I used to relive the choice a lot, and I was so harsh with myself. I think we should take accountability for what we did, but there is no need to keep reliving the past and allowing it to ruin our futures.

 

As far as wondering what he is up to, I think the intense interest goes away in time. In your case, it might be harder because you are seeing him around town, and your mind automatically wonders what he is doing. I was lucky enough that my ex lived 30 minutes away from me, on the complete opposite side of town in a city of 500,000 people. So there was basically no chance of us running into one another. You are trying so hard to move on, but you are getting triggers left and right. The fact that he is likely moving is great news even though I know it is bittersweet for you.

 

The best advice I can give is to forcibly stop your thought process when you feel yourself spinning out of control and wondering what he is doing. I think that any of us has the potential to spiral down if given the right trigger. If I saw my ex around town today, I don't know how it would affect me. I very much hope that I would simply go on my way and be able to stymie the thought process. I think that when you find yourself thinking about him moving on or being happier, you have to stop yourself, tell yourself that it is normal to think this way but that it's not productive at all. You have been down this road to nowhere, so it's time to focus on something else. Anything else.

 

I'm glad to hear about you volunteering for a trail conservation project. I started volunteering at a free clinic, and I've loved it. I've meet some really nice people too, and it's something I have always wanted to do. It's funny how, nearly a year and a half later, I am actually doing many things that I always wanted to do but never did with my ex.

[chimpanA-2-chimpanZ]

What do you do to get to the positive end of this thought cycle?

 

1) Stop being so hard on yourself. For many people, this is easy, but if you're inclined towards low self-esteem like me then it's damn near impossible. Just remembering my own mistakes made me hate myself so much I could throw up. But that self-kindness is crucial.

 

If there's one thing you can take away from this experience, it's that no one else can be responsible for your well-being. You are the only person who knows absolutely what you need to be happy. So don't be too hard on yourself because you're your own best advocate. Say "okay, I messed that up, I was too accommodating and too unwilling to see the truth. But I'm still a good person and I deserve better."

 

2) Go on some dates. Go on dates with guys even when you aren't sure about them. While sometimes the date will be dissatisfying, and that causes its own depression, you'll also leave thinking "huh, I got back out there again and it wasn't totally awful." There's a lot of truth in "fake it til you make it". Also, free meals are rarely a bad thing.

 

3) Watch Lifetime movies. K was a jerk, but at least he didn't hold you hostage in a burning house with a boxcutter to your throat. I would suggest doing a tequila shot for every yogurt commercial but that would probably lead to liver failure so just take a sip of a good beer.

 

4) Think back to a situation in life (not necessarily romantic) when something completely unexpected happened. I mean TOTALLY out of the blue, utterly unpredictable, and ridiculous. Something you still tell friends about. Think of how many more situations like that have yet to happen to you. Be excited for them!

 

5) Go to the gym. I do Olympic weight-lifting and it is the chief reason why I made it through my last break-up. I hated myself, cried constantly, thought I was useless and stupid and weak and worthless...but then I would go to the gym and lift double my body weight off of the ground. It did wonders for my self-confidence, because I'd think "I'm so horrible I can't do anything", and then I would do something amazing. That forced me to realize I wasn't so bad.

 

A shorter answer to your question would be "wait until you no longer feel like you're walking around with a gaping wound in your chest", but you sadly cannot have doctors induce a coma until enough time has passed for you to recover. (I've considered it.) And even time is not enough to heal our worst wounds. We have to make an active effort to do something, ANYthing, to try. Everyone is different but I found that faking my own healing was enough to start the actual healing process---by going out there and saying "well, this is what a healthy person would do and this is how a healthy person would act", I slowly got better and better until I was in a reasonably healed state.

[Gatema]

Wow, you have truly made a leap of faith, one that seems to be a catalyst for helping you move out of the shadows of K. You are doing something that will provide you with a more positive outlook for your future.

 

I'm going to share a little information about myself that I would not typically do, but for some reason, that I don't even know why myself, except for maybe it will help.

 

I personally know how hard it is to forget about someone that you still love. Even though you're mad as hell for what they have put you through, even though the bitterness keeps getting worse, not better, even though it hurts beyond belief at times, even while working through the disruption in your life;

ya still love them.

 

I guess you are right, the hardest part is trying to understand why their life seems easy breezy, as they causally move about town without a care in the world. It's torture seeing their truck and knowing that you once drove around town in that truck, together, went on trips in that truck, together, drove together to friends' homes for dinner. So now, just the sight of that same truck can bring you to a complete halt, physically and emotionally. That truck, when seen by a happenstance, let's say, now represents a causality, and it's going to be all yours, every time. I get it, believe me.

 

I too, became fearful that I would run in to my ex, I would find myself becoming overly focused with making rock solid plans for going to the store or bank, without being seen, that it started to take on a life of its own. What use to be mindless errands, became strategically planned missions, which were all carried out to lessen the chances of an unwanted encounter, with him. Sigh!

 

When I look back on the years that I wasted, through the time of the separation and eventually, the time until the divorce, I came to the conclusion that all I really did was just circumvent one misfortunate in my mind, and replaced it with a new hardship, in my mind, without merit, just all in my head. I was driven by my own insecurities that .........???! That's just it, I didn't know.

 

I later discovered that I spent more time on the falling backwards than the time that I needed to spend on my investment for moving ahead. Just writing this right now, I shutter to even think about how simply miserable of a person that I must have been, or to even be around.

 

It was totally absurd, but at the time I didn't care. I was desperate to fend off any more heartache, and there was plenty of it , even with my most stellar of efforts to keep it at bay, it was impossible to avoid, but I gave it my best shot. It's funny how things happen when you start out with one purpose in mind, and something totally random happens in the meantime.

 

Anyway, here's what I did and I'm not going to lie, it was the hardest, most mentally challenging experience that I have ever had to endure, but I got through it, and so will you.

 

I stopped doing my favorite activities, stopped going to the bars and restaurants that I loved, gave away my season tickets to the hockey games that were part of my soul, started going to a different health club, stopped going to community events, walked away from relationships with family members and the common friends we hung out with, quit seeing my doctors, my dentist; these were the things that I chose to give up, uncouple the connections with this man that I had been married to for twenty years, from those years that we created, and shared, that lifestyle that we designed together. Since our future together was no longer going to happen, it meant, in my opinion, that one of us had to relinquish the rights to that lifestyle, as I knew it. That's when I decided that it was going to be me, because it had to be me, if I ever wanted to start living again. I gave up everything, but it forced me to rebuild everything.

 

It's been eight years now, and there's not a day that goes by that I have not thought about my relationship with him, in one way or another. There's no escaping the memories, good or bad, but there's certainly nothing stopping you or anyone else from moving on, when the heart and their mind work together.

 

GC, you have mentioned your age in one of your post and you have to understand something, you are still a young, viable woman. As it is right now, and of course, it's been extremely, to the bone, hard for you to comprehend how you'll ever survive this calamity in your life, but you absolutely will prevail.

 

Trust me darling, you have every available opportunity out there today to find the kind of relationship that you are seeking. I don't think you really conceptualize exactly where you stand in this world, just because of your age. I'm sure you haven't given it much thought so you wouldn't know or appreciate the fact that this is the perfect age or time to be single.

 

More importantly even, as an age group, the societal view for women your age are deemed to be the sexiest females, and are also considered to be the cream of the crop, worldwide. Not bad statistics if you really think about it.

 

 

You have the upper hand in almost every social activity that you put yourself in, it's an endless playground for adventures. Try not to spend any more of your precious time worrying or wondering; why K did this, how could K have done that, K was not what I thought. You will never get the answer, ever, ever, never.

 

It's counterproductive and it takes away from what your goal should be, living a much happier life. You mentioned that you are pretty, smart, athletic, adventurous; that's better than 75% of the population that's been put in the position for "starting over". If I were you, and yes, I have been you, I would try to challenge myself to become: knock out pretty, remarkably smarter, even more athletic, and a little bit more daring in a new adventure. I would do it solely for me, a personal best, like a gift to myself.

 

Will you at least think about it? Whatever you draw from those on this forum, the best of luck to you.

Edited September 14, 2014 by Gatema

[Zapbasket]

I'd hoped to have time to reply thoughtfully to these brilliant, thoughtful posts in response to my last post (seriously, THANK YOU), before I left for my solo birthday backpacking / car camping adventure, but I won't be able to do a one of them justice in these few minutes I have.

 

I'm gone for a couple of weeks and will not have internet access a lot of the time, so I don't know that I'll be able to post here much. I expect my birthday will be hard, but at least I won't have any internet access in the deep canyon where I'll be backpacking that day, so I will have no way to know who will contact me and who won't (here's lookin' at YOU, K, ya big f*ckwad). I am scared of how I will feel on his birthday, and hoping I will be distracted enough by the heat of the desert / beauty of my surroundings not to become preoccupied with imaginings of what he's doing on his birthday, and with whom, and whether he ever thinks of me, etc.

 

I'm going on this trip in hopes of beginning to restore myself to myself. I'm bringing a journal in hopes of writing to help suss out what direction I want my life to take next. While I have car camped solo, I've never backpacked alone in the wilderness, and so if I'm successful in this challenge it will be a big confidence boost, not to mention how much I love being out in natural beauty, exerting my body, mind and spirit and exploring.

 

So, until a couple of weeks from now, dear LS friends. You all have made more of a difference in my healing than you can ever know. ((hugs))

[Lostdreams]

Hi Green Cove,

 

I just wanted to wish you happy birthday and hoping that your birthday year ahead will be your best one ever.

 

Blow out the candles and make a wish

All the very best

[Zapbasket]

Since returning from my trip, I haven't been on the computer much, except to upload photos and such. Thought I'd give an update (and thanks for the bday wishes!).

 

Trip was awesome. I backpacked alone for the first time ever, and it was a big success. It made me confident that bit by bit I'm becoming a true outdoorswoman. I'm trying every day to practice gratitude. Things might not be as I wish them to be ultimately, but I do live in a beautiful area and there is no reason why I can't dive in and relish the good in where I live. At times on this trip and in the weeks following I have felt myself gaining some center, maybe for the first time in YEARS. It has occurred to me that perhaps I have been off center since childhood in many ways, and I'm really trying to get in deep to restore ME, that person that I can FEEL in my heart. I actively try to stop apologizing for myself, and to celebrate who I am in all my facets (and I'm appreciating that I have many facets). It's hard work to eliminate that negative self-talk that has accompanied me for most of my life.

 

I know many of you can relate.

 

Of course, K did not wish me a happy birthday, or reach out to me in any way. My birthday was a few days before his, and while I knew better than to expect anything, that pernicious HOPE lurking in the corner held out that "Maybe, just maybe..." flag. It hurt, and I cried, and it was hard to just ignore his birthday (though on his I was deep in a canyon, out of cell range). His mom, of course, wished me a HB both on FB and calling to tell me she had a present for me. On FB she wrote, "Hope your BD is amazing, just like you!" I no longer doubt, based on many things and the consistency of her behavior towards me this past year, and her kindness to me before that, that she really does love me a bunch. I love her, too, and I think we can forge a friendship over time.

 

If I am honest, every moment of every day, even in the good moments, when I am feeling empowered, I feel this deep sadness and disappointment that K felt the need to so utterly sever EVERYTHING between us. It's such a hard pill to swallow, and I keep choking on it. In bad moments, having gone through this same thing with another guy (my 2007 ex), I fear that maybe when you get close to me it's Bad; I fear that despite everything I know, it's MY fault these guys want nothing to do with me. In the not really understanding, it's hard not to swing the blame needle to point at me, even though intellectually I know better.

 

I so yearn for that solid relationship with a guy that I've never managed to have to date. And yet, at the same time I couldn't be less interested in dating or men generally. I WANT to be single at this point, and for a while. There are several guys in my orbit expressing interest, and I just feel NONE.

 

So that's some of what is in my head and heart. Hugs and good thoughts to you all.

[ruhrohcd]

I realize that I’m late to the party, but I want to make a post in this thread due to the emotional impact it’s had on me. My domestic partner of 5 years suddenly left me 2 months ago and this thread has been an incredible resource for my thinking through things.

 

There were times in this thread when GreenCove absolutely annoyed the hell out of me, and I loved it the entire time. I have depression and OCD which lead to me ruminating better than anyone I know, but in Green Cove I think I found something of a kindred spirit. I can talk in circles to the point of making other people leave; just look at my ex-girlfriend. Reading GreenCove’s posts and getting annoyed allowed me to perceive someone in a way close to how I imagine the people in my life perceive me. The answers all seem so clear to other people, but to me nothing is obvious. A friend might think a 3-hour discussion has settled something, only to have me bring up the same topic again the following day or week, even though there’s no new information to be had. The commenters were answering GreenCove, but they allowed me to heal somewhat because I could view the answers as being directed at someone else, which in an odd way I accept more than advice pointed at me. GreenCove and commenters, thank you for the gift you’ve given me through your heartfelt and heartrending honesty.

 

I think I recently turned the corner on the root of my depression and rumination, and the answer appears to be shame. There are three resources I’ve been reading that have helped me enormously. I briefly looked over the posting guidelines to make sure that posting book suggestions is acceptable; if I’ve erred, I apologize and understand their removal.

 

The first is called Free Will and is by Sam Harris. Harris has many views that I disagree with, but in his role as a neuroscientist I think his work can be trusted or at least seen as a valid approach. The main takeaway that I got from Free Will is that none of us has as much freedom as we think we do when it comes to our choices and actions. If we look at the past, what we did at the time was the only thing we could have done. This sounds odd at first, but I find his presentation persuasive. Any choice we make is dictated by our genetics, our environment, and the state of the world at that exact moment. Given those conditions, how could we have done otherwise? As we learn more our environment changes, thus opening up pathways to better adjusted actions. If this sounds at all interesting, I suggest reading the book - it’s not very long and should be a quick read.

 

The second is called Healing the Shame That Binds You by John Bradshaw. I’ve yearned for a book to change my life, and I think I’ve finally found it. Listening to this audiobook has opened my eyes to why I am the way I am and how I got here. It explains why my parents made me this way, while at the same time explaining how they were made the way they are. Understanding is gained while also removing the need for blame. We’re all dealing with pain in the best way we know how, inadvertently hurting those closest to us. I think everyone should read this book, even if shame isn’t a personal issue, as the book has interesting things to say about society at large; both Free Will and Healing the Shame That Binds You say important things about the United States’ criminal justice system.

 

The third is actually a series of Science Fiction books by Lois McMaster Bujold, and I would encourage anyone not interested in Sci Fi to not dismiss the books out of hand. The setting is Science Fiction, but the stories themselves are wonderfully human. The main character in most of the books is a character named Miles Vorkosigan who was born with birth defects due to an attack on his pregnant mother. The books deal with him making his way through life, trying to live in the shadow of his preeminent father, and finally with him finding himself and accepting who he is. I enjoyed the first 8-9 books in the series, but I absolutely fell in love with the books collected in the compendium Miles in Love, consisting of Komarr, A Civil Campaign, and the short story Winterfair Gifts. Bujold really captures what it is to grow up and to grow into who we really are. The afterword to Miles in Love discusses growing up for a second time, something I feel like I’m doing right now and it sounds like GreenCove may be experiencing as well. The books present a wonderful view of what love should look like and how it should feel. I had to put the books down on multiple occasions to dry my eyes, as the desire to have what she presents was so overwhelming.

 

I’ve been doing remarkably well given my depression, shame, and issues with abandonment, but this weekend was hard for some reason. The feeling that this is all unreal has gradually faded, but there are still stabs of disbelief. GreenCove, I empathize with you and hope you find your peace.

 

I’m struggling with acceptance due to not being through with anger, but I think the end result for me will be feeling sorry for my ex - I’m waking up to my true self and working as hard as I can to become me, while she ran away to stay who she has always been. I’m sad for me for my loss, but I think I’m more sad for her loss - I would have stood by her if she had wanted to work on her issues as well, but I’m not even sure that she recognizes that she has any. I’m slowly realizing that I’m a good person, and she threw me away. Why wouldn’t I feel sorry for her?

 

Fred

[lala2001]

I have just learned my ex of 6 years is now with someone else... I just cant bear the thought of her with anyone. I thought we were going to end up together. I feel utterly shattered - we have been on and off for the last 1.5 years ALL my fault bc I thought she would always be there. Now after being off for good for 3 months she is now with someone. I just cannot comprehend how to cope.

[lala2001]

GreenCove... I feel as if I am in the same place as you... how are you doing?

[LivingHalfAlive13]

So sorry your struggling

[Zapbasket]

Hi LS Friends,

 

I hadn't checked this thread in a while and did not realize until today that there were new posts. This post I'm starting might turn out to be a long one, so thanks in advance for reading. I’ll do a Part I and Part II so it’s not *too* long at one glance.

 

The slow process of improvement, recovery and growth continues. Since my birthday backpacking trip--the first time I ever backpacked alone--I went on two more solo backpacking trips. The planning, exertion, exploration, and successful execution of these trips, along with the time to be in deep communion with just myself, has been hugely cleansing, exhilarating, and confidence-boosting. At least where outdoor skills are concerned, I have demonstrated to myself that I make good, trustworthy decisions, that I respond creatively to my environment, that I learn from experience and prepare as best I can for new challenges while understanding that I might be thrown a curveball for which I won't be prepared, and I'll have to deal with it. And what this has suggested to me is that if I can be this way in terms of outdoor skills, then I have the tools to be this way in the rest of my life--my career, achieving my goals, MY RELATIONSHIPS.

 

I'm still seeing my therapist and plan to continue seeing him until I notice a consistent and discernable change within myself and the reflection of that change in my surroundings. Right now the focus is on believing that I have the right to insist that people who are close to me meet me where I am, rather than me always doing a bunch of psychological, social, and emotional gymnastics to get where they are (something I'm too "good" at, a.k.a. codependent). That means accepting--no, embracing--that I am a person of depth; richness; and many facets; that I am sensitive and a thinker and while sometimes these two traits lead me into trouble areas, and I need to be aware of that, they are not in and of themselves problematic but rather huge assets, for which I should NEVER feel I have to apologize.

 

That's what I've come to recognize: that to date I've spent my time in a perpetual state of apology, conscious and unconscious, for everything about me. I've labeled myself a "difficult" person who is "over-sensitive" and have thus attracted people into my life who confirm those beliefs. K., for instance, always concluded that I was difficult and over-sensitive every time I asked him to respect my most basic boundaries. And I am at fault because in allowing that (because it was what I believed about myself), I didn't send him a clear message as to what my boundaries actually are. My sense is that the more you truly embrace who you are, the less drama there is in your relationships, because what radiates from you is clear and consistent, and so everybody (including you) knows where they stand. With K, I would have left him very early on. I don’t think it would have changed anything, except that I wouldn’t have spent 3.5 years in a relationship with him and rather would have been free to pursue relationships with people who are more positive presences in my life.

 

Of course, recognizing all this and putting it into full practice are very different things, but I’m actively working on it, every day.

[Zapbasket]

As far as K goes specifically, and my recovery on that front, I'm doing much, much better and feel some freed energy--energy that has been tied up in grieving about and processing what happened with K.

 

But there's one thing I have not been able to bring myself to do. Please don't come down hard on me on this; I'm working on it and I trust I won't be in this space forever, or even much longer. I've not been able to unfriend K from FB. On the one hand, I feel like it's unnecessary at this point because I'm palpably moving forward and he is palpably receding in my psyche...but on the other hand, if he has the chance to unfriend me first, it will really, really hurt. Because I know the reason I've not been able to unfriend him is because it's all I feel I have left of him, the last thread of connection; I still care a lot about him; and I still, in spite of myself, harbor a [small] hope that he will reach out at some point and I don't want to rock the boat as I want his contact to be solely motivated by him. The hope I feel is not the same as previously, where it was hope and a NEED for him to reach out; now I don't feel as though my well-being depends upon his contact, but I still hope for it.

 

I realize it's a counterproductive place to be, and I realize that unfriending him from FB won't completely kill the hope, but I imagine it would help me continue to move forward. So far there's no indication that he is dating anyone, or that he has dated anyone, but that's an inevitability at some future point and I would hate to have that in my face, or have him suddenly unfriend me because he has started seeing someone new. Since I don't know where his head is these days, I have to assume that's a possibility, even though for some reason he hasn't unfriended me to date.

 

I do still actively keep tabs on him on FB, and I know that’s unhealthy. But the thought of following through and unfriending him makes me feel sick. I don’t know how to work up the courage to do it. It seems like the right thing to do, but it feels very wrong…and I fear I’d be setting something in motion that I couldn’t take back. Also, I feel a bit silly unfriending NOW after a year of no contact and then suddenly unfriending out of the blue. Can any of you relate? I know many of you were able to unfriend almost immediately after the breakup, and for some reason I just find it really, really hard.

[BC1980]

My ex doesn't have social media, but I think there is a reason people say to unfriend, block, return items, ect. immediately. It gets awkward later. In my case, I have several items of my ex's that I don't feel right throwing out. It's sentimental stuff to him. I won't return it at this late date unless he asks. I think it would be really weird to mail him his stuff out of the blue at this point. I think the difference with his stuff is that I never look at it and actually forgot it was there until now.

 

I found it interesting that you said you know it's right to defriend, yet it feels wrong. I struggled with this too. I knew I had to go NC, but it still felt wrong to cut him off. It felt unnatural almost. I think it feels wrong because it goes against nature almost to detach yourself in the abrupt way a breakup requires. You want to keep any little link to convince yourself it mattered. Still, it's foolish for us to think that an artificial link like FB means a damn thing. No, you can't undo it once you defriend him, but that's a good thing.

[Zapbasket]

Yes, in retrospect it would have been good if I'd done it immediately, but at the time I really didn't think it was all a done deal. I kept him on FB because I genuinely believed we'd have a chance to talk things through, probably staying broken up but at least being able to do so with more clarity and courtesy. Until that time came, I thought, I didn't want to unfriend him.

 

Now, with over a year of absolutely no effort on his part to contact me, I've faced the fact that he has shown no indication of wanting to reach out to me. On the other hand, I'm always plagued with that inevitability that we will run into each other, and I think our time has come. We made it a year, which is amazing, but just yesterday I almost bolted into Whole Foods before seeing his truck in the lot, and I promptly went back to my car. Cowardly, perhaps, but I just don't want to run into him when he has never once tried to reach out to me. In a few weeks there's an event we'll both probably be attending, and I just dread the inevitable contact in the restaurant where the event is held. I'm still very hurt, and I still find myself holding on even as I keep moving forward and becoming ever more clear in therapy why he is not the guy for me.

 

I don't know where to find the courage to just...do it. Unfriend, confront him in public. I'm afraid I'll fall apart.

[lala2001]

you will be okay GreenCove... my ex doesnt have Facebook but shes on instagram. I go every day to see if she changed her profile pic as her profile is private.... I think thats just a weening off process for everyone in this day and age. I have to be honest, I never thought we wouldnt be together - its pretty life changing for me. I miss the relationship every day but I read an excellent blog that quoted this and it helped me a lot:

 

“Even though sometimes the world seems about six sizes too small for our pain, the amazing **** is that no matter how deep purple the bruise is, no matter how dark and overwhelming and miserable and worthless it all seems the world will get a fraction of an inch bigger every day.

Really, every ****ing day.

And you won’t notice it for a long time until suddenly, one day, it’s only five times too small for your pain and then four and then the world will just keep getting larger and larger in comparison to your shattered heart and eventually it will be able to hold it and then it will outgrow it.

And your pain will be just a speck in your world.

It is supposed to feel like the end of the world right now. That, my beautiful dearest, is how you know that it was worth it. That is why it was one of the relationships that shook your core and after which you will never be the same. That is how you know that you are growing up and are experiencing **** rather than living safely in risk-free choices….

The world is supposed to feel as though it is ending and you are supposed to know only in the most dormant recesses of the backmost corner of your soul that it will not be like this forever.

You are supposed to feel acutely and lucidly that everything is over that your purpose for life is worthless and that not even cheesy pasta and Molly Ringwald movies are going to make you smile, and you are supposed to know opaquely and elusively and abstractly that everything is not over and that your purpose in life is

so

much huger than you can ever imagine and is still saturated with value and that you will eat pesto and read

Stephen Dunn

and live in Manhattan and have stacks of waffles at corner diners with girlfriends and spend inordinate amounts of money on bath products and sunbathe on the roof reading trashy novels and you

will will will will will will will love again.

I did not think that I was going to be able to ever breathe without shaking again after J broke up with me, let alone successfully love and **** again.

That is what you are supposed to think.

I cried hysterically for months.

I wept

so

much that I had stewardesses on planes ask me if I needed oxygen, I had waitresses refuse to serve me, I had strangers approach me with offers of help.

Then I stopped.

Then I started again and stopped again and started again and then stopped for good…

… I promise you will survive, and with more grace than you can now imagine and that you will have more grit and vision because of it.”

[BC1980]

I don't know where to find the courage to just...do it. Unfriend, confront him in public. I'm afraid I'll fall apart.

 

It took me a year to delete his phone number. I remember just doing it, and it felt sad for a few minutes tops. I was relieved later on. I dread having to see my ex at some point because I know it will bring up memories for me. I'm sure it will upset me, and I don't think that's fair. I don't think think that I should have to keep reliving this effing, awful catastrophic nightmare of a relationship. But there you have it.

 

I would absolutely ignore him at the joint function. At all costs, ignore him. I don't blame you for going back to your car at Whole Foods. Not in the least. There is no reason to knowingly subject yourself to something upsetting. It's not about pride or proving anything. It's about knowing how to protect yourself.

[Zapbasket]

Lala, that's a beautiful quote, and so true. Gradually, the pain does lessen, as a product of time. And the mistake I made in the past, is that I relied solely upon time to make it "better," only to find myself in the same dynamic again, and again. So now, time AND therapy, where my beliefs are continuously challenged, as well as the limits I set upon myself, are my tools. One I have to let happen (time); the other I have to show up for, work at constantly, and that's very hard.

 

I'm glad to know that others struggle with social media in regards to their exes.

[Zapbasket]

It took me a year to delete his phone number. I remember just doing it, and it felt sad for a few minutes tops. I was relieved later on. I dread having to see my ex at some point because I know it will bring up memories for me. I'm sure it will upset me, and I don't think that's fair. I don't think think that I should have to keep reliving this effing, awful catastrophic nightmare of a relationship. But there you have it.

 

No, it's not fair. Hugs to you ((( ))).

 

I would absolutely ignore him at the joint function. At all costs, ignore him. I don't blame you for going back to your car at Whole Foods. Not in the least. There is no reason to knowingly subject yourself to something upsetting. It's not about pride or proving anything. It's about knowing how to protect yourself.

 

I plan to arrive early at the function, and park smack in front of the restaurant, so that when he pulls up, he can't fail to see my car and know i'm there and bow out of attending himself if he doesn't want to face me. But if I pull in and see HIS truck, I can only hope I'll have the courage to go in. It's a small restaurant, and it will be impossible NOT to see him in the room, or him to see me, and people will be milling and mingling and so it's highly likely we'll be thrown into each others' path. I've told myself it's okay if i chicken out, since even though I paid $45 to attend and money is tight, it's for a very good cause--an organization that does very important work. So it won't be money "wasted" either way.

 

I agree with you that it's not cowardly to avoid confronting him in public, but rather self-protective. But lately I've been wondering whether it might be healing to just start letting it go. Yeah, he hurt me unnecessarily in the bafflingly indifferent way he slipped out of our relationship, not to mention how he failed to step up throughout the whole relationship, but I'm still kicking; he didn't crush my spirit because I fought back. So couldn't I try to just forgive him? Is it really letting him off the hook if I just went up to him and said, "Hi, K. How's it going?" (looking absolutely smashing, of course). Again, not sure I'd have the strength to do that, but I'm plagued by this non-talking and sense of things unresolved, and maybe that would be me seizing some power back?

 

I have two weeks and I want to have a plan, so that I'm empowered.

[Michael 93]

you will be okay GreenCove... my ex doesnt have Facebook but shes on instagram. I go every day to see if she changed her profile pic as her profile is private.... I think thats just a weening off process for everyone in this day and age. I have to be honest, I never thought we wouldnt be together - its pretty life changing for me. I miss the relationship every day but I read an excellent blog that quoted this and it helped me a lot:

 

“Even though sometimes the world seems about six sizes too small for our pain, the amazing **** is that no matter how deep purple the bruise is, no matter how dark and overwhelming and miserable and worthless it all seems the world will get a fraction of an inch bigger every day.

Really, every ****ing day.

And you won’t notice it for a long time until suddenly, one day, it’s only five times too small for your pain and then four and then the world will just keep getting larger and larger in comparison to your shattered heart and eventually it will be able to hold it and then it will outgrow it.

And your pain will be just a speck in your world.

It is supposed to feel like the end of the world right now. That, my beautiful dearest, is how you know that it was worth it. That is why it was one of the relationships that shook your core and after which you will never be the same. That is how you know that you are growing up and are experiencing **** rather than living safely in risk-free choices….

The world is supposed to feel as though it is ending and you are supposed to know only in the most dormant recesses of the backmost corner of your soul that it will not be like this forever.

You are supposed to feel acutely and lucidly that everything is over that your purpose for life is worthless and that not even cheesy pasta and Molly Ringwald movies are going to make you smile, and you are supposed to know opaquely and elusively and abstractly that everything is not over and that your purpose in life is

so

much huger than you can ever imagine and is still saturated with value and that you will eat pesto and read

Stephen Dunn

and live in Manhattan and have stacks of waffles at corner diners with girlfriends and spend inordinate amounts of money on bath products and sunbathe on the roof reading trashy novels and you

will will will will will will will love again.

I did not think that I was going to be able to ever breathe without shaking again after J broke up with me, let alone successfully love and **** again.

That is what you are supposed to think.

I cried hysterically for months.

I wept

so

much that I had stewardesses on planes ask me if I needed oxygen, I had waitresses refuse to serve me, I had strangers approach me with offers of help.

Then I stopped.

Then I started again and stopped again and started again and then stopped for good…

… I promise you will survive, and with more grace than you can now imagine and that you will have more grit and vision because of it.”

 

Thank you for this