katiegrl Posted March 20, 2016 Share Posted March 20, 2016 @MidwestUSA Wad I tell ya? Huh? What did you tell MidwestUSA? Link to post Share on other sites
jay1983 Posted March 20, 2016 Share Posted March 20, 2016 I have no words....just gonna wait for Jabron to respond. Except to say ...SM, what the HELL were (or are) you thinking?? You should have walked out the SECOND she said she needed your help collecting rent! And then to find she is a scammer? And you still want to be *friends* with this person? Wow, just wow. That it's a scam. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
katiegrl Posted March 20, 2016 Share Posted March 20, 2016 That it's a scam. Okay...then you were right. Originally, I called her a manipulator. It appears I was right too. This entire situation is just so sad and pathetic.. And gets more so with each and every update. SM, please block her and go no contact...please! Best of luck moving forward. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
preraph Posted March 20, 2016 Share Posted March 20, 2016 She's definitely showed you some shady behavior. That rent thing wasn't cool. I don't think being raped is her biggest problem. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
insert_name Posted March 20, 2016 Share Posted March 20, 2016 Wow. P***y is one hell of a drug. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
scorpiogirl Posted March 20, 2016 Share Posted March 20, 2016 Wow. P***y is one hell of a drug. Rapunzel, save me from my prison tower p***y. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
katiegrl Posted March 20, 2016 Share Posted March 20, 2016 (edited) Wow. P***y is one hell of a drug. P**sy? Hell, she refuses to even hold his hand! Edited March 20, 2016 by katiegrl 1 Link to post Share on other sites
insert_name Posted March 20, 2016 Share Posted March 20, 2016 P**sy? Hell, she refuses to even hold his hand! Exactly! I've never seen someone work so hard just to try and get a kiss on the lips. I hate to put the boot in but I really am expecting an update where the final nail in the whole sorry coffin turns out to be that she was having sex with some other guy the whole time (which is what I suspect the score was when she was cagey on the phone- having problems with her chrrent lover boy). "I need you to be my debt collector"- unreal 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Smoothman Posted March 20, 2016 Author Share Posted March 20, 2016 It doesn't matter whether she was or wasn't doing this or that with anyone else. I can't ever know that..so it's irrelevant. All I DO know is how she treated me, reacted to me. Frankly...it's just not good enough...you can't keep someone at a distance...yet expect them to treat you like a future partner... Her behaviour was erratic, misleading, and irrational. Yes...maybe part of that stems from her past...but the reasons don't matter. Whether me, or someone else..she is a long, long way from being able to form a healthy, loving relationship. At this stage, I'm simply not going to call her again... Plenty of amazing people in the world. Why waste my time on this one? 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Jabron1 Posted March 20, 2016 Share Posted March 20, 2016 I told you days ago: Learn the lesson. When a stranger gives you a sob-story, they are trying to manipulate you. Don't think with your emotions - use logic, always. You are being hustled – and it's getting worse and worse. I'm really trying to help, but you need to listen. Look, most guys don't seem to understand what the friend-zone is. When a girl friend-zones you, she doesn't want to be friends at all. She wants a one-sided relationship with you where she will exploit you for something. Often that something is fairly innocuous such as attention. But in this case, she is finding all sorts of different ways to use you. You are proving to be a good utility for her. She doesn't have to do much to get what she wants from you. She will dangle just enough carrot in front of the donkey to get him to pull the cart. I'm not sure how old you are, but you need to wise up fast. You seem to be very naïve and lacking in street smarts. This thread has transcended the issue of dating, and we are now talking about life skills. First thing's first: you need to be happy being alone. We are ultimately alone in this world. That means you put yourself first – above anyone. If you don't, no one else will. It also means that you should be happy to walk away from users, and you only accept people that will add to your life in a positive way. Secondly, accept your own part in this. I don't think you were being completely honest with her, us, or yourself throughout this thread. It's almost as if you are ashamed of your own sexuality. That is a weakness, and that weakness has been exploited. This is the main reason guys get freindzoned. Thirdly, stop worrying about what other people think of you. If a woman acted like this with me, It would have been over on the first date. If people here, or elsewhere, thinks that makes me a bad person, I don't care at all. Caring about the opinions of others is another weakness that has gotten you hustled. You have fed off of the opinion that you are 'nice' in order to build a delusion. Stop basing your reality off of the opinion of others. You have a lot of work to do on yourself. A lot of self-reflecting, and self-improvement. I think you need to define for yourself what it is to be a man. And stop letting others define this for you. Tear everything down and start again. Yes, I really think things are that bad. I suggest you read the 48 Laws Of Power (get the audiobook; it's really good). 4 Link to post Share on other sites
katiegrl Posted March 20, 2016 Share Posted March 20, 2016 (edited) It doesn't matter whether she was or wasn't doing this or that with anyone else. I can't ever know that..so it's irrelevant. All I DO know is how she treated me, reacted to me. Frankly...it's just not good enough...you can't keep someone at a distance...yet expect them to treat you like a future partner... Her behaviour was erratic, misleading, and irrational. Yes...maybe part of that stems from her past...but the reasons don't matter. Whether me, or someone else..she is a long, long way from being able to form a healthy, loving relationship. At this stage, I'm simply not going to call her again... Plenty of amazing people in the world. --- ***Why waste my time on this one? You're asking us? This is precisely what many of us have been trying to get you to understand pretty much from the get go!! It took you "this" long to figure it out ...better late than never I suppose. Frankly, me thinks you need to grow some cajungas so as to avoid this ever happening again! Best of luck. Edited March 20, 2016 by katiegrl 4 Link to post Share on other sites
jen1447 Posted March 20, 2016 Share Posted March 20, 2016 No offense Smoothman but is this for real? Aside from the implausibility of the 'rape survivor is a landlord and enlists me to be her collections guy' thing, the deets are really odd. - $3500 claim turns into a $13000 claim by doubling. - Who ever owes 13 thousand dollars in rent? They should have been kicked out 10 months ago. - You undermined her scheme to rip the girls off, and she "wasn't too worried about that"? You just cost her $9500, and possibly a criminal inquiry if it can be shown what she was up to. - The one thing I do understand is her reaction - not that she wanted you to become her collections guy to begin with, but the fact is landlords have to be hardasses and it is business. - Really odd that she'd be in that line of work and be a hardass while being a rape survivor and most likely prone to a lot of empathy/sympathy w/ppl who struggle. - Also can't blame her for still wanting friendship since that's what you were offering anyway. Thanks everyone... UPDATE OK, so this Saturday date...turns our she wanted me to help her collect money from some tenants she had kicked out. Yeah, you heard me... So I do...two young Chinese girls, basically she is telling me they owe here $13000... They end up bursting into tears, try adn explain to me their side of the story, and I listen, and look into the paper work I have been given, and the paper work the girls had,.. Without going into all the details, it SEEMS that she had misrepresented the facts to turn a legitimate $3500 claim into $13,000 by asking for this same amount from both the girls... I told them to pursue the matter through the tribunal, and reported back to her that the girls are doing this... She wasn't too worried about that, when I questioned the doubling up of the amounts, she told me a load of baloney...Again, details aren't important. After a that we go off to have our "fun date"...I had planned to teach her how to shoot pool... In the car I said something like: "I;m not comfortably doing that, I'm a caring person, my life is about helping people, not making young girls cry" I'm simply expressing my opinion, I was VERY uncomfortable being a debt collector for her... WOW Her reaction to that simple statement was incredible... "...this is business, you may think I'm a b!tch but I deal with things like this all the time. My partner has to be able to deal with this." "I can't believe you told me that...'you're uncomfortable'! If i did this for you I'd never tell you that" And on and on... I did reply that I was simply airing my feelings, not that I wouldn't or couldn't do that again... I asked her what did she want...if she wants a "big soft heart" then that's all part of it... We talk more at my place, but she has totally withdrawn, clinging to her handbag, sitting pushed up against the edge of the couch... She tells me: "I'm a mess, all over the place...I think I'm better off single" And a few more statements along these lines... "I don't think I'm the right girl for you...you deserve better" I drive her home...As I approach her house I tell her: "What I deserve, is someone who appreciates me" She replied: "If you don't think I appreciated you, then you you don't understand me at all" To which I answered: "If you appreciate me you sure got a funny way of showing it" At home we exchange a few texts...and I call her (OK, you're all probably thinking why I bothered, but I'm still in that emotional state) She repeats that she isn't ready for a relationship... I tell her we'll take a week to think and have space... She asks: "Can we still be friends if you decide you don't want me?" I say yes... But I can see that she really is just after my friendship... I have to think if I can accept her in that light... I lost a lot of my attraction to her...she showed me a temper and irrational behaviour I DO NOT want in my partner. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
katiegrl Posted March 20, 2016 Share Posted March 20, 2016 (edited) No offense Smoothman but is this for real? Aside from the implausibility of the 'rape survivor is a landlord and enlists me to be her collections guy' thing, the deets are really odd. - $3500 claim turns into a $13000 claim by doubling. - Who ever owes 13 thousand dollars in rent? They should have been kicked out 10 months ago. - You undermined her scheme to rip the girls off, and she "wasn't too worried about that"? You just cost her $9500, and possibly a criminal inquiry if it can be shown what she was up to. - The one thing I do understand is her reaction - not that she wanted you to become her collections guy to begin with, but the fact is landlords have to be hardasses and it is business. - Really odd that she'd be in that line of work and be a hardass while being a rape survivor and most likely prone to a lot of empathy/sympathy w/ppl who struggle. - Also can't blame her for still wanting friendship since that's what you were offering anyway. Agree with everything you said jen ...except she isn't interested in *friendship* with OP and probably never was. She is interested in finding an errand boy or whipping boy, and sorry SM, but up till now today after this latest fiasco.... you fit that role to a resounding "T"!! Glad to hear you have finally seen the light though.....lesson learned for next time you encounter a chick or situation like this... Edited March 20, 2016 by katiegrl Link to post Share on other sites
Emilia Posted March 20, 2016 Share Posted March 20, 2016 BPD for sure 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Smoothman Posted March 20, 2016 Author Share Posted March 20, 2016 No offense Smoothman but is this for real? Aside from the implausibility of the 'rape survivor is a landlord and enlists me to be her collections guy' thing, the deets are really odd. - $3500 claim turns into a $13000 claim by doubling. - Who ever owes 13 thousand dollars in rent? They should have been kicked out 10 months ago. - You undermined her scheme to rip the girls off, and she "wasn't too worried about that"? You just cost her $9500, and possibly a criminal inquiry if it can be shown what she was up to. - The one thing I do understand is her reaction - not that she wanted you to become her collections guy to begin with, but the fact is landlords have to be hardasses and it is business. - Really odd that she'd be in that line of work and be a hardass while being a rape survivor and most likely prone to a lot of empathy/sympathy w/ppl who struggle. - Also can't blame her for still wanting friendship since that's what you were offering anyway. Hi Jen, I will explain...I didn't go into detail because it wasn't the crux of the post... She's not collecting rent, but what she considered is owed to her after she booted two tenants out of one of her properties. The total included back rent $900, various cleaning tasks, new door locks (keys weren't returned), and new carpet because apparently they had spilt hair dye... We use a tribunal for matters like this, they made a ruling in her favor of $3700 odd dollars. She then uses gets that to get an order for payment...this has teeth, in that it is listed as a debt with creditors..etc. They had long since moved out, she located them, and asked me to tell them they owe her this money, and use the official order for payment. However, she instead gave me another document, no signature, which suggested both the girls owed $3700 EACH. (Which is simply wrong), as well as an entirely different document that had a further amount of $2800 odd dollars, for which I could not find any order, and again asking EACH girl to pay this amount. I soon as the girls told me they only thought $3700 was owing, I had a look at everything, and realized something didn't add up. I told the girls to ask the Tribunal for the original documents and orders made. I DID NOT TELL HER that I did this! God, I'm not stupid!! I simply said they were seeking advice from the tribunal with no details as to WHY. I asked about the duplicate amounts, not to suggest the girls had asked this, but because I was seeking clarification myself. She said that she went back again to the Tribunal, so I think she started with the $2800 amount, and had something added for the new total. She then presented BOTH these documents, even though one superseded the other (the dates match this theory too), and suggested that BOTH girls owe EACH amount, when in fact the total ruling is $3700, and THAT'S the amount I saw on the final, signed, official order for payment, the other documents being various court paper that are only informational, and can't be used to compel payment. Whew, you can see why I didn't go into details. The reason she reacted to me wasn't because she thought I told the girls anything. She was OK as she thought I had done what she asked me to do, which was to simply tell them about the court order...I wasn't there to break any knee caps, I can ONLY tell them about the order, and ASK for the payment. We had already left to go and have our "fun date" and a while later I said that I felt uncomfortable about the whole thing...and that's when she had her reaction, until that point she was fine and happy. I do agree her portrayal as a woman who "can't say no" to men (her words exactly, which she used when I tried to take her hand "It will lead to other things, once I start I can't say no...") doesn't sit with this ball-busting business woman. The strangest thing, as she is telling me she "can't say no" she said "no" quite easily and readily to me... I decided to simply delete her number from my phone. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Smoothman Posted March 20, 2016 Author Share Posted March 20, 2016 BPD for sure My ex wife suffered this, I can assure you this is not the same thing. Her problems are of a more complex nature. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Smoothman Posted March 20, 2016 Author Share Posted March 20, 2016 I told you days ago: You are being hustled – and it's getting worse and worse. I'm really trying to help, but you need to listen. Look, most guys don't seem to understand what the friend-zone is. When a girl friend-zones you, she doesn't want to be friends at all. She wants a one-sided relationship with you where she will exploit you for something. Often that something is fairly innocuous such as attention. But in this case, she is finding all sorts of different ways to use you. You are proving to be a good utility for her. She doesn't have to do much to get what she wants from you. She will dangle just enough carrot in front of the donkey to get him to pull the cart. I'm not sure how old you are, but you need to wise up fast. You seem to be very naïve and lacking in street smarts. This thread has transcended the issue of dating, and we are now talking about life skills. First thing's first: you need to be happy being alone. We are ultimately alone in this world. That means you put yourself first – above anyone. If you don't, no one else will. It also means that you should be happy to walk away from users, and you only accept people that will add to your life in a positive way. Secondly, accept your own part in this. I don't think you were being completely honest with her, us, or yourself throughout this thread. It's almost as if you are ashamed of your own sexuality. That is a weakness, and that weakness has been exploited. This is the main reason guys get freindzoned. Thirdly, stop worrying about what other people think of you. If a woman acted like this with me, It would have been over on the first date. If people here, or elsewhere, thinks that makes me a bad person, I don't care at all. Caring about the opinions of others is another weakness that has gotten you hustled. You have fed off of the opinion that you are 'nice' in order to build a delusion. Stop basing your reality off of the opinion of others. You have a lot of work to do on yourself. A lot of self-reflecting, and self-improvement. I think you need to define for yourself what it is to be a man. And stop letting others define this for you. Tear everything down and start again. Yes, I really think things are that bad. I suggest you read the 48 Laws Of Power (get the audiobook; it's really good). Jabron, you write often and loudly about your thoughts on manhood... I think for a start you have to accept that there is more than one definitive type of "man" in the world... I am perfectly comfortable in my own skin, I have rejected people who were unable to show me their dedication to me, when I had done this for them... I was married for 20 years, raised two children to adulthood, and only left her because her BPD and suicide attempts forced my hand, I had to protect my children. What does this mean? I know how to have a long, healthy relationship. I'm not seeking endless sexual conquests, I discovered to my surprise that sex is easy, very easy, heck I was interviewing girls to live in my flat and had an 18-year old naked on my bed IN THE INTERVIEW (Massage that went a bit far, we stopped before anything happened). If a woman doesn't kiss me on the first date I don't ditch her as a wasted effort, I take time to get to know each person, it takes a HELL of a lot longer to know someone than a few dates... Yet so many people here, not just you, condone this superficial, "kiss or ditch" attitude... You and others are possibly missing out on meeting amazing people because you are too quick to make a judgement call. Sure, in this example, you were correct, she wasn't ever going to work out...but I gave it a good shot, and when sufficient evidence mounted I let her go. But what if she had turned out to be my future partner for life? I've PROVED I can sustain a long term, multiple-decades relationship, warts and all... Have you? 1 Link to post Share on other sites
jen1447 Posted March 20, 2016 Share Posted March 20, 2016 Hi Jen, I will explain...I didn't go into detail because it wasn't the crux of the post... .......................... Ok thanks, that makes a lot more sense. Guess that's that then no matter how you slice it. Link to post Share on other sites
todreaminblue Posted March 21, 2016 Share Posted March 21, 2016 it was in really bad taste that she asked you to be a debt collector...i can honestly say i cant understand her actions at all now.....ill be honest...it depresses me a bit..and confused..that i just dont get her..... i would like to say just because she has done these fantastical things and asked of you things she shouldnt have asked....does not mean she wasnt raped.... as far as telling you her history and trauma....its easier to to often tell strangers than people close to you...its why sites like this flourish.....why group therapy is popular...anonymity of both these sources often makes it easier for non judgement to come into play...... sharing sensitive information without having to face the person the next day... i dont care what anyone says .....making up a rape story......is abhorrent in my mind .more so my heart........in most peoples minds and hearts i believe this would be true........and just not done.....its the lowest of the low..it puts down women who were raped and doesnt respect the actual survivors of rape....does everything to throw doubt at true survivors..........and that is the reason why i will always stand by and up for a woman who says she is raped...front and center.........even when the world questions it...doubts it...i am one who cannot.. as far as this woman goes.....you have done the best thing.....for you...and i hope she receives the help she truly needs.... im out.......deb Link to post Share on other sites
Author Smoothman Posted March 21, 2016 Author Share Posted March 21, 2016 it was in really bad taste that she asked you to be a debt collector...i can honestly say i cant understand her actions at all now.....ill be honest...it depresses me a bit..and confused..that i just dont get her..... i would like to say just because she has done these fantastical things and asked of you things she shouldnt have asked....does not mean she wasnt raped.... as far as telling you her history and trauma....its easier to to often tell strangers than people close to you...its why sites like this flourish.....why group therapy is popular...anonymity of both these sources often makes it easier for non judgement to come into play...... sharing sensitive information without having to face the person the next day... i dont care what anyone says .....making up a rape story......is abhorrent in my mind .more so my heart........in most peoples minds and hearts i believe this would be true........and just not done.....its the lowest of the low..it puts down women who were raped and doesnt respect the actual survivors of rape....does everything to throw doubt at true survivors..........and that is the reason why i will always stand by and up for a woman who says she is raped...front and center.........even when the world questions it...doubts it...i am one who cannot.. as far as this woman goes.....you have done the best thing.....for you...and i hope she receives the help she truly needs.... im out.......deb The sad thing is, she is obviously going to find another man online...and do the same thing to him...again and again... She knows she's not ready..she should stop online dating until she's ready.. Link to post Share on other sites
mortensorchid Posted March 21, 2016 Share Posted March 21, 2016 I saw the title of this post and I didn't want to read it for obvious reasons. Then because curiosity took over, I did. I do not like a few of the signs in this first post. And they are these things based on the story about the first meeting ... 1) Telling about her ex bf - A woman who meets a man does not tell about her ex bf upon their first meeting. If and when I am going to tell certain stories about certain things in the past that a former bf was a part of, I always preface it by saying "Not that I want to bring up things from the past, but (name) is/was part of the story so, I will talk about him". And to bring up that is, very heavy. 2) The rape - Not that I would EVER say this to ANYONE, but over the years I have reevaluated things. I wonder now how many women I have / haven't met who actually were verses those who said they were but were not. Not admittedly, this is not something that I would just bring up to a man vs a woman friend, let alone a complete stranger like you are/were to her when you first met. 3) The stranger - You are/were a complete stranger. Did you ever ask yourself why she decided to tell you this fact? I think she is looking for sympathy, attention, etc. Once I was at a job years ago when a coworker asked how my weekend was, once I answered she then proceeded to tell me that she was declaring bankruptcy, that she was in hock with x amount of credit cards, that some guy she was with had partially done this, etc. I turned to the guy next to me at the coffee machine and asked "Why is she telling us this?" He said the same thing. I decided she wanted attention and kept my distance from her after that. It was a good move. 4) Your reaction - You want to help her or you want her to feel that she can trust you. I have also since learned with people that it's okay if you want to help people or if you want others to trust you or feel that they can tell you things when they can't tell others, etc. However, there is a certain line you have to cross and not cross. See who she is/isn't. There have been times in life that people would be like this with me, or I have confided certain things in others, and they go off and blabbed them and I have had others come back and make fun of me for it. Wanting to help people is one thing, but remember that there are those out there who will recognize and take advantage of you because of it. Also it concerns me that you are taking this "I want to help you" attitude with her. Are you thinking you are going to change the situation? Because women tend to think that about Bad Boys, and Bad Boys take advantage of those women. And I have met men who have that mentality. They are fewer and farther between, but they exist. You may say that my opinions on this are negative, cold and/or disrespectful. And I agree, they are. However, I HOPE AGAINST HOPE that you are going to make a difference and this woman is not going to prove herself to be a train wreck if you choose to stick around. I want the best for you and everyone else around me. Life has taught me otherwise. Good luck. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
todreaminblue Posted March 21, 2016 Share Posted March 21, 2016 The sad thing is, she is obviously going to find another man online...and do the same thing to him...again and again... She knows she's not ready..she should stop online dating until she's ready.. true.....she shouldnt what i really dont like i dont like the disrespect in this thread being handed out...the word pussy being thrown around by posters and some i believe are women who think its funny...its triggering me to feel ...feel anxious....like i have to defend.......the thread has degenerated .........which shouldnt happen with a thread involving rape...it is also bad taste.......so i wish you the best smoothman i think you have done the right thing.....see you round the board.....deb 2 Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted March 21, 2016 Share Posted March 21, 2016 The sad thing is, she is obviously going to find another man online...and do the same thing to him...again and again... She knows she's not ready..she should stop online dating until she's ready.. She is messed up and can't be saved. Doesn't want to be saved. Where she is, is safe and even though she can't see that it's an unhealthy place, it's all she knows. I'm glad that you aren't going to be a friend to her, she's not ready for that with you or anybody else. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
amaysngrace Posted March 21, 2016 Share Posted March 21, 2016 Unless she had counseling to deal with it I wouldn't bother being anything more than friends with her. Link to post Share on other sites
joseb Posted March 21, 2016 Share Posted March 21, 2016 and only left her because her BPD and suicide attempts forced my hand, I had to protect my children. What does this mean? I know how to have a long, healthy relationship. I'm not seeking endless sexual conquests Fair enough on not wanting endless sexual conquests. You want more substance. Nothing wrong with that. But I'd wonder about your "long healthy relationship" I've tangled with a BPD. And I've spent a lot of time researching it because of those years. It was at times fun, exciting, crazy, great sex, etc. But it came at a price. What it was not was healthy. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
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