bicyclejunk Posted June 14, 2005 Share Posted June 14, 2005 Just a question........ I'm not bashing Christianity or religous beliefs in any way. I'm just noticing that in the Christian Church (because I work with several christians) it seems that they just do whatever God's will is for them, they don't follow their own Paths, juse whatever they think the Lord has mapped out for them. More than once, I've noticed them saying: "If the Lord wants me to have this or That, He'll make it clear to me"...or.. "The success of our Company is in God's hands, there's nothing more we can do". My Beliefs are, you get back, whatever you put into something. If you want something, you go after it and get it. It just seems like Christians keep themselves from following certain goals or chasing certain dreams because, They leave it in God's Hands. And I just don't understand that, nor do I agree with it. Case in point, I had a buddy who was an awesome musician/songwriter. But he wouldn't pursue any record companies or anything to try and get his music heard because, he felt, if God wanted him to be Successful, God would put him in touch with the right people. I just see it as somewhat keeping you on a leash or keeping you from going that extra step.... Link to post Share on other sites
westernxer Posted June 14, 2005 Share Posted June 14, 2005 I don't think Christianity hinders anyone's potential... people say "God's will" to lessen the impact of whatever outcome awaits them, especially if it's a longshot. Others say "if it's meant to be, it's meant to be," which is practically the same thing. Link to post Share on other sites
ConfusedInOC Posted June 14, 2005 Share Posted June 14, 2005 If anything, since I have become a Christian I have become more focused and goal oriented. Read my thread on F.A.I.T.H. based goals. Focused Attainable Individual Trackable Heartfelt And where do you suppose I got this from? Copyright Saddleback Church, Rick Warren, 2005 Yes, my Pastor. Link to post Share on other sites
moimeme Posted June 14, 2005 Share Posted June 14, 2005 No such thing as the Christian Church. Link to post Share on other sites
HokeyReligions Posted June 14, 2005 Share Posted June 14, 2005 It's PEOPLE not their GOD(s) who keep themselves back. God is just a convenient excuse/justification/feel-good-measure for some people. It's twisted. Didn't someone say God Helps Those Who Help Themselves? Duh! If one looks toward God for strength they will find it within themselves. People who expect their God to just sit something down in front of them and require no effort from them are naive- IMO. Link to post Share on other sites
Author bicyclejunk Posted June 14, 2005 Author Share Posted June 14, 2005 I was raised in the Church, a lot of my family are christians. But I just realized one day it wasn;t for me, but I respect those who follow that faith. But yeah, My ol' friend...He was so talented and wrote songs I could totally hear on the radio. But chose to stay within the church and relase his music that way. He could have gone secular and made terrrific statements with his music, but he never went that extra step because he'd always tell me, "If God wanted me to be on MTV or VH-1, he'd put me in touch with those people and show me the way. I'm quite happy in the church serving him. But all of his heroes were the Beatles or Zeppelin or the WHo and I knew he'd love to play with his peers, but he just said the same old thing.... Same with some of my co-workers, they just seem to leave everything in God's hands. What about venturing out on you own and following what your heart says? Link to post Share on other sites
ConfusedInOC Posted June 14, 2005 Share Posted June 14, 2005 Originally posted by bicyclejunk I was raised in the Church, a lot of my family are christians. But I just realized one day it wasn;t for me, but I respect those who follow that faith. But yeah, My ol' friend...He was so talented and wrote songs I could totally hear on the radio. But chose to stay within the church and relase his music that way. He could have gone secular and made terrrific statements with his music, but he never went that extra step because he'd always tell me, "If God wanted me to be on MTV or VH-1, he'd put me in touch with those people and show me the way. I'm quite happy in the church serving him. What's wrong with that?! Not everyone *wants* to be famous. If he is serving God through music and is happy doing it, I don't see any issue.... But all of his heroes were the Beatles or Zeppelin or the WHo and I knew he'd love to play with his peers, but he just said the same old thing.... Fame and fortune in this world means little when you're living to prepare yourself for an eternity in Heaven with God. People who don't believe or follow Christ will never understand. If he was unhappy, he'd branch out. Same with some of my co-workers, they just seem to leave everything in God's hands. What about venturing out on you own and following what your heart says? Who says they aren't following their heart? I think they are..... Link to post Share on other sites
moimeme Posted June 15, 2005 Share Posted June 15, 2005 Nothing stops anyone from striking out on a path and asking God to be with him on that path. It's kinda bogus to sit in your house, not lift a finger in aid of yourself, and expect God to deliver your life to you on a platter. God's not anybody's servant. He isn't there, like a genie, to fulfil your every wish. However, it seems, a lot of people have decided that that's exactly what they expect God to do for them. Link to post Share on other sites
quankanne Posted June 15, 2005 Share Posted June 15, 2005 I don't think it does, but simply gives the believer an opportunity to look at it from a different viewpoint. I can say "I want this this and this to happen" and make myself miserable or happy pursuing what I want. But I can also say "God's in charge, and I'm happy with whatever he puts in front of me, even if it means using my talents to serve him and not myself." Which I think is what your friend is saying here – yes, he's open to the idea of someday becoming famous, but he's leaving it in God's hands because he figures it'll happen according to the Big Guy's plans. In the meantime, he'll happily share his music the way he has been. And there's nothing wrong with that, as long as he is happy with his decision. What about venturing out on you own and following what your heart says? and If you want something you go after it and get it. who are we to say this isn't what your friend truly wants? It bugs you more than it bugs him, it seems; you cannot force your friend to want something simply because you feel he is wasting a good opportunity. It's his call, plain and simple, and you need to respect that. Link to post Share on other sites
Chris777 Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 Jesus said it to pilate himself, that he would have no power at all had it not been given to him from his father. Christianity is a straight and narrow path that FEW will follow. why worry about what the world deems success, when the world will be consumed in fire? everything here is temporary, and therefore ultimately meaningless. other than the souls left in the world what value is their in anything else? After all the streets are paved with gold in Heaven, giving some a clue as to its true value. Link to post Share on other sites
alphamale Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 Originally posted by bicyclejunk It just seems like Christians keep themselves from following certain goals or chasing certain dreams because, They leave it in God's Hands. Link to post Share on other sites
Marshbear Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 Originally posted by moimeme Nothing stops anyone from striking out on a path and asking God to be with him on that path. It's kinda bogus to sit in your house, not lift a finger in aid of yourself, and expect God to deliver your life to you on a platter. God's not anybody's servant. He isn't there, like a genie, to fulfil your every wish. However, it seems, a lot of people have decided that that's exactly what they expect God to do for them. I agree with this statement. God gave us a brain and he expects us to use what he gave us. If we were to be totally dependant on him we would still be in the garden of Eden. He wants us to improve our minds and make goals for ourselves. We can ask help in areas where we would like his input but we also have free will to do as we feel lead. People who think everything is God's will are just fooling themselves. Not all things that occur is God's will. He gave us a giude ( Bible ) to follow his advice but we ultimately make our own choices and he wants it that way. If he wanted us to be totally dependent on him he would not have gave us free will. Link to post Share on other sites
Chris777 Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 Originally posted by Marshbear I agree with this statement. God gave us a brain and he expects us to use what he gave us. If we were to be totally dependant on him we would still be in the garden of Eden. because of our "independence" the world has fallen into a corrupted sinful state. The end of the bible speaks of things being restored to a state quite similar to that of eden. Hell is described as a state absent from God, (outer darkness) And heaven is illiminated solely by God himself. He wants us to improve our minds and make goals for ourselves. We can ask help in areas where we would like his input but we also have free will to do as we feel lead. to do as you feel LEAD is the key word . Lead by whom, or what? being lead around by something isn't nessesarily free will. People who think everything is God's will are just fooling themselves. Not all things that occur is God's will. You mean like our being lead AWAY from him, kind of like your first sentence stated about us following the lead of satan in the garden of eden. and of course not everything is his will, as he wishes that all might be saved. but unlike us, he knows that not all will be. Jesus could have called down a legion of angels to protect him, at any time he wanted during his 1st coming. Yet he didn't , and he allowed the ruling romans to capture him, and as a result crucify him, so that Gods will would be fufilled, even in this fallen world. But if you read Revelations, (and the Prophets , not to mention the Gospels) You will see that not everything will be permitted forever. As He will soon again judge the earth. He gave us a giude ( Bible ) to follow his advice but we ultimately make our own choices and he wants it that way. Why do you suppose he offered a book of mere advice, if it were his actual will that we make our own choices? the Bible is far far more than just advice. If he wanted us to be totally dependent on him he would not have gave us free will. free will and dependency are seperate things, I can try not to be dependent on food or oxygen, but we all know the results of completely severing the use of either of them. God kept the israelites in the wilderness for 40 years following the exodus from egypt, and he made them totally dependent on him, as he was their only source of food and water. he dropped manna from heaven, but only gave them what they needed, when they tried to hoard it, and stockpile it to save for "a rainy day" he caused it to immediately rot before them. Doesn't quite sound like a God who wants man to be totally independent from him. Link to post Share on other sites
quankanne Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 why worry about what the world deems success, when the world will be consumed in fire? *snicker* and in the meantime, continue to display really poor taste with the things it considers "cultural," "necessary" and "good." again, I think it all boils down to respecting a "friend's" choice to lead the life he/she chooses: if that path happens to be God-oriented, who am I to tell him/her that it's not the path that's supposed to be taken? Link to post Share on other sites
Chris777 Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 Originally posted by quankanne and in the meantime, continue to display really poor taste with the things it considers "cultural," "necessary" and "good." like liesure suits, mohawks, zipper jackets, and multiple piercings in all appendages? again, I think it all boils down to respecting a "friend's" choice to lead the life he/she chooses: if that path happens to be God-oriented, who am I to tell him/her that it's not the path that's supposed to be taken? that the point as a friend you look out for your pals. Now I realize, that once I tell them, Thats really all I can do, until (or if) they decide to listen. I had several Christians, try and give me advice, before, I started listening to any of it. But I was just like many people on here slamming them after they tried to tell me what to do. But looking back alot of them gave good advice. Not all of them, but then again their are tares in every field, and sometimes you have to wait till its harvest time, to find out which is wheat, and which is weed. Link to post Share on other sites
moimeme Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 like liesure suits, mohawks, zipper jackets You're Amish? Link to post Share on other sites
Chris777 Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 Originally posted by moimeme You're Amish? they are a little too seperated from the world Its one thing not to follow the ways of the world, but when you take it to the extreme of isolation, I don't recall any verses saying not to spread the gospel. How many amish missionaries you ever heard of? Link to post Share on other sites
Nicholas Posted June 26, 2005 Share Posted June 26, 2005 I think the kind of people who defer goals to God are the kind of people who wouldnt' do much work to acheive their goals whether they believed in God or not. Link to post Share on other sites
quankanne Posted June 26, 2005 Share Posted June 26, 2005 I think the kind of people who defer goals to God are the kind of people who wouldnt' do much work to acheive their goals whether they believed in God or not. and sometimes it's a matter of being secure enough in themselves to trust what the future from God brings. Not everyone must give in to what ideals society holds as standards, i.e., fame, forture, looks. Some of us *underachievers* live contentedly without that stuff and don't give a damn if society tells us we must live up to its standards ... because their standards aren't even in the same ballpark as mine. like leisure suits, mohawks, zipper jackets, and multiple piercings in all appendages? like looking like/living the life of Barbie and Ken. Driving a Hummer when my money could be put to better use. Considering hip-hop the height of intellectually stimulating music or writing in "text talk" (IM grammar) as an acceptable form of written communication. Sure it's fun, but is it worth anything in the larger scheme of things? A lot of Christians will tell you that it's not, so they don't sweat them ... Link to post Share on other sites
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