Friends, boundaries, weakness

[BuddyX]

Nice job.

He'll reach out sooner or later. He'll send you a "Hey what's up?"

[Gloria25]

Yesterday was opening day of baseball season in my city. Knowing that I love baseball, xMM reached out to me by calling from a work phone line that I can't block. recognized the number and let it go to voicemail. He left a message saying that we hadn't talked in a while, he knows there has been a "shift", was I okay, and suggested we should talk to "clear the air."

 

I texted him the following:

 

got your voice mail

Not really much to talk about

You're married.

You can't offer me anything.

I need to move on with my life and stop being someone's secret.

I deserve more than that. A lot more.

You know all this.its time to face it and deal with it.

He responded:

 

Yes, you do deserve better. Never liked being part of bringing you down. I will not try to see you and if or when you ever wanted to get a drink or go for a run I will leave that to you.

 

Have fun in the glow of a killer opening day.

 

I didn't respond again and don't plan to, but I needed to vent (just a little, actually, which is a great feeling) so I'm posting it here.

 

the thing that struck me most was the sense of entitlement. The expectation that I will be back. the minimization of "bringing me down." He never liked it, but I guess he was willing to tolerate it for me? Ugh. we no longer have any work associations so that is the last response he will get from me.

 

And, he's clear.

 

Next time, I hope that you block his number and if it still goes to voicemail, delet it without reading it.

 

If he needs you so much, then divorce his wife and come get you.

 

Gotta love these creeps. They just are upset that their ball of string escaped them and they got nothing to play around with.

[Grapesofwrath]

You are being so clear-headed. Good for you.

 

But ugh, his response! You essentially say, I've realized this relationship has nothing to offer me. The door is closed.

 

And he says, yeah, it sucks that he didn't have anything to offer. The door is open.

 

 

NO, the door is CLOSED, you entitled brat! The relationship hasn't "shifted"; it's ended.

 

Yes, this exactly. xMM perceives of himself as someone who helps to "lift others up" and is a "force of positivity" in people's lives. He honestly sees himself this way, so I don't think he's able to tolerate the concept that he has actually been a force of destruction and negativity in my life, and at times in the life of his wife. (She does not have all the facts, but I believe that on some level she feels all this and it is toxic for her.)

[Gloria25]

Yes, this exactly. xMM perceives of himself as someone who helps to "lift others up" and is a "force of positivity" in people's lives. He honestly sees himself this way, so I don't think he's able to tolerate the concept that he has actually been a force of destruction and negativity in my life, and at times in the life of his wife. (She does not have all the facts, but I believe that on some level she feels all this and it is toxic for her.)

 

Yep, a lot of ego with this guy ^^ and how dare you diss him

[Grapesofwrath]

Hang in there Grapes you're doing great.

 

I see a bit of bravado in his reply to you. I'm sure he is reeling. If he has a heart, which I think he does (don't see someone who comes across as together as you are spending time with anyone less) he will be having a tough time of it.

 

Go team Grapes!

 

Thank you, Doublegold. In this experience, I have pondered all the questions that we so often see on LS: Is it possible for him to love 2 women at the same time? What does it mean when he tells me he loves me? If things are so wonderful at home, why is he cheating on her this way? (By "this way" I mean conducting a full-on relationship with another woman, not just simply having a ONS with someone and calling it done.) How could I ever trust him knowing what I know? What does love mean? Can I ever trust a man to be truthful and faithful to me? (It happens I am heterosexual, so I ask if I can trust a man, not that women are perfectly trustworthy. I get it that women do the same things in infidelity.)

 

Having said all that...I do think that xMM has a heart. I think he lacks the emotional intelligence and self-awareness to understand what he is doing with his cheating, and he is conflict-avoidant enough to prefer to keep it that way. His delicate self-concept requires that he view himself as a "good guy" and a good husband/family man. I'm sure he is reeling, and I believe it hurts to see me walk away like that. At this point, I am going to file that under Not My Problem.

[Gloria25]

Nice job.

He'll reach out sooner or later. He'll send you a "Hey what's up?"

 

And when they do, it has nothing to do with you...they're just seeking attention/validation.

[Chuff]

 

If he needs you so much, then divorce his wife and come get you.

 

 

Nothing else needs to be said.

[Chuff]

 

I texted him the following:

 

got your voice mail

Not really much to talk about

You're married.

You can't offer me anything.

I need to move on with my life and stop being someone's secret.

I deserve more than that. A lot more.

You know all this.its time to face it and deal with it.

 

 

 

I'm going to use this for when MM says we should talk "to clear the air."

[Gloria25]

I'm going to use this for when MM says we should talk "to clear the air."

 

Well, deleting his e-mails w/o reading them will avoid the need for use of those quotes....

 

He's clear about what he wants - his wife. So why read any of his e-mails?

[Chuff]

Well, deleting his e-mails w/o reading them will avoid the need for use of those quotes....

 

He's clear about what he wants - his wife. So why read any of his e-mails?

 

 

Ok, ok, point taken. You're right.

[Grapesofwrath]

I'm going to use this for when MM says we should talk "to clear the air."

 

Chuff: You are welcome to use those as they are, or as a starting point for your own words.

 

It took me 17 months to get to this point, with a few failed attempts in there. I think you have to really be ready to end it when you end it. Otherwise, you undermine your own credibility by breaking up then backing down. Please avoid this trip. Show up for yourself, and when you end it, mean it.

[Grapesofwrath]

Nice job.

He'll reach out sooner or later. He'll send you a "Hey what's up?"

 

I have no doubt that he will. The question for me is whether, by that time, I will be so indifferent to him that I will just ignore/delete/move on. That's where I would like to be. At times, I still think that if he does it I will tear him a new one so big he could hold a flea market in there.

[Grapesofwrath]

Yesterday was opening day of baseball season in my city. Knowing that I love baseball, xMM reached out to me by calling from a work phone line that I can't block. recognized the number and let it go to voicemail. He left a message saying that we hadn't talked in a while, he knows there has been a "shift", was I okay, and suggested we should talk to "clear the air."

 

I texted him the following:

 

got your voice mail

Not really much to talk about

You're married.

You can't offer me anything.

I need to move on with my life and stop being someone's secret.

I deserve more than that. A lot more.

You know all this.its time to face it and deal with it.

 

He responded:

 

Yes, you do deserve better. Never liked being part of bringing you down. I will not try to see you and if or when you ever wanted to get a drink or go for a run I will leave that to you.

 

Have fun in the glow of a killer opening day.

 

I didn't respond again and don't plan to, but I needed to vent (just a little, actually, which is a great feeling) so I'm posting it here.

 

the thing that struck me most was the sense of entitlement. The expectation that I will be back. the minimization of "bringing me down." He never liked it, but I guess he was willing to tolerate it for me? Ugh. we no longer have any work associations so that is the last response he will get from me.

 

oNe other thing...and perhaps I'm over analyzing. "I will not try to see you..." Uh, okay. But it doesn't matter whether you try or not because it's not going to happen. Just because you try doesn't mean you succeed. Not with me anymore, anyway.

[Minnie09]

Whoa - he sounds quite cavalier in that one.

[heartwhole]

oNe other thing...and perhaps I'm over analyzing. "I will not try to see you..." Uh, okay. But it doesn't matter whether you try or not because it's not going to happen. Just because you try doesn't mean you succeed. Not with me anymore, anyway.

 

Yeah, it's like the episode of Seinfeld where George tries to break up with someone but she says it's like a submarine where you both have to turn your key, so she refuses to be broken up with. Only in this case, MM is trying to take control back by pretending it's his decision not to "try" to see you. I understand that when people get dumped, they like to pretend they have a say or they would have done it anyway or whatnot, but it's very insulting to say, "Sure, you've asked me never to contact you again, but I could try anyway . . ."

[Grapesofwrath]

That didn't take long. Six days after the previous exchange, I received this last night...

 

"So I know we are in the “cold turkey” mode but just wanted you to know that I miss you. I miss my friend. No response necessary or expected."

 

I plan to delete and ignore. I need to get my thoughts out, however, so here we go for the LS community.

 

We were never friends. We were lovers, in a relationship that had to be kept secret. I don’t have “secret” friendships. I can text or call my friends whenever I need to. I know my friends’ families. I know their spouses. I have been to their homes. I can talk with them about any subject and not feel humiliated, dismissed, and demeaned by them. I don’t feel that they are making me press my face to the window of their lives while keeping me shut out from everything.

 

This is not “cold turkey” mode. This is the new normal. This is not some temporary state. This is it, buddy. We’re done.

 

My friends include me in things. They don’t hide my texts from their partners, because they don’t need to. They are proud to know me and make that plain. They are integrated into my life. My friends don’t rush out of my house after a few hours because they are afraid that someone will find out that they were here. My friends will be there for me if I need them, any day of the week, not just on the days that they won’t be caught. I notice you reached out to me on a night when you are away from your wife. I wonder if you would dare to send a text like this to your "friend" when you are home with her on a weekend.

 

Also, don't feed me that $hit that no response is necessary or expected. Of course you expect a response. You aren't going to get it, though.

[heartwhole]

That didn't take long. Six days after the previous exchange, I received this last night...

 

"So I know we are in the “cold turkey” mode but just wanted you to know that I miss you. I miss my friend. No response necessary or expected."

 

I plan to delete and ignore. I need to get my thoughts out, however, so here we go for the LS community.

 

We were never friends. We were lovers, in a relationship that had to be kept secret. I don’t have “secret” friendships. I can text or call my friends whenever I need to. I know my friends’ families. I know their spouses. I have been to their homes. I can talk with them about any subject and not feel humiliated, dismissed, and demeaned by them. I don’t feel that they are making me press my face to the window of their lives while keeping me shut out from everything.

 

This is not “cold turkey” mode. This is the new normal. This is not some temporary state. This is it, buddy. We’re done.

 

My friends include me in things. They don’t hide my texts from their partners, because they don’t need to. They are proud to know me and make that plain. They are integrated into my life. My friends don’t rush out of my house after a few hours because they are afraid that someone will find out that they were here. My friends will be there for me if I need them, any day of the week, not just on the days that they won’t be caught. I notice you reached out to me on a night when you are away from your wife. I wonder if you would dare to send a text like this to your "friend" when you are home with her on a weekend.

 

Also, don't feed me that $hit that no response is necessary or expected. Of course you expect a response. You aren't going to get it, though.

 

I'm so sorry. This just makes me really mad for you! It is so NOT OK to contact someone who has asked you (for very reasonable reasons) not to contact her anymore. "No response necessary or expected." Oh, how big of you!

 

And you're right. It's being neither a good friend nor a good lover to treat you like a dirty secret. You deserve so much better.

[Ms. Faust]

It's crazy how much entitlement he managed to squeeze in there. What does he mean "cold turkey mode"? Like this is a temporary thing that will soon change? And yeah, it's pretty obvious he was expecting a response! It's almost like he told himself "yeah, I'll throw out this bait, she'll take it".

[privategal]

No response necessary or expected means...I opened the door because my big ego DOES expect you to rush right in with your doormat ways because you desperately miss me...but in the 1% chance you got stronger and smarter I will build in a default "dont really care if you reply" therefore Im covered either way and dont take a hit.

Big fat JERK!!

[Grapesofwrath]

You guys are the best! Thank you for understanding and supporting. I agree with the above comments. The presumption that this is a temporary state and that a measly text can fix the situation is insulting and demeaning. It's just more of the same treatment, as mentioned by all of you.

 

I know that "no contact" is the gold standard on how to deal with ending the A, but I think in this case it actually helped me that he sent this. Last night was a big sports night here in town, and ordinarily this is the sort of event that we would have watched together. I could feel myself missing him a little, as a result. This message was a clear and obvious reminder of why this person is no longer welcome in my life.

[Grapesofwrath]

That didn't take long. Six days after the previous exchange, I received this last night...

 

"So I know we are in the “cold turkey” mode but just wanted you to know that I miss you. I miss my friend. No response necessary or expected."

 

I plan to delete and ignore. I need to get my thoughts out, however, so here we go for the LS community.

 

We were never friends. We were lovers, in a relationship that had to be kept secret. I don’t have “secret” friendships. I can text or call my friends whenever I need to. I know my friends’ families. I know their spouses. I have been to their homes. I can talk with them about any subject and not feel humiliated, dismissed, and demeaned by them. I don’t feel that they are making me press my face to the window of their lives while keeping me shut out from everything.

 

This is not “cold turkey” mode. This is the new normal. This is not some temporary state. This is it, buddy. We’re done.

 

My friends include me in things. They don’t hide my texts from their partners, because they don’t need to. They are proud to know me and make that plain. They are integrated into my life. My friends don’t rush out of my house after a few hours because they are afraid that someone will find out that they were here. My friends will be there for me if I need them, any day of the week, not just on the days that they won’t be caught. I notice you reached out to me on a night when you are away from your wife. I wonder if you would dare to send a text like this to your "friend" when you are home with her on a weekend.

 

Also, don't feed me that $hit that no response is necessary or expected. Of course you expect a response. You aren't going to get it, though.

 

Amended to add: when will you stop using the women in your life to satisfy yourself without any regard for them? When will you stop dumping on your wife and betraying her? Being married to you would suck.

Edited April 14, 2016 by Grapesofwrath
typo

[Cloudcuckoo]

Your resilience is palpable grapes, and that's bloody good going!

 

You've shown steely determination and that's admirable.

 

He's got some brass balls, I'll give him that.

 

It's just a shame they're only little fagotty ones that won't leave you alone nor honour the woman he married.

 

Cuckoo

[privategal]

You had him blocked via text what happened?

[Bufo]

His reason for contacting you is simple. It is much easier to try to reel a former AP in than it is to groom a new A with a new AP. He loves the feeling of two women in love with him. Without an A P he doesn't have that feeling

 

Nothing you could say to him would cause him to break off attempting to contact you. Ignore him entirely and he'll figure out that this A is over and done. Block whatever means of communication you can. I don't care if he emails you telling you he'll give you tomorrow's winning lottery number guaranteed to win. Nothing he says is truthful. It's only designed to reel you back in.

 

I've seen this too often. I know what he is doing. He is a man with a plan. Don't play his game. It only hurts once to rip off the bandage.

[Grapesofwrath]

You had him blocked via text what happened?

 

Work e:mail. He knows I can't block him that way.