How do you know what to believe?

[whatatangledweb]

Why did you sent a message? Aren't you afraid she will send everyone those emails? He ended the affair, you will just end up getting more hurt by continuing to try to contact him. You will check throughout the day to see if you recieve a reply and this could go on weeks. That will be torment for you.

[malvern99]

Don't believe what he says. Words are wind, and they are easy to say. Believe what he does. Actions do not lie. Once you realize and accept that he is where he wants to be, you will be able to move on with your life. Good luck.

[ShatteredLady]

At the top of the infidelity forum there's an article "Things every wayward spouse needs to know". The fact that his wife has had her suspicions for a while means she's been festering on it & probably searching the Internet for help.

 

That article is a very good example of the general advise given to the bs...What you NEED from him to consider reconciliation.

 

They are the 'rules' that they are now following. PLEASE stop breaking NC. Read the infidelity section to see the kind of advise that BS's follow. It will not end well for you. You will loose more & more self-esteem the longer you keep this going. It's hurting you so much. Don't force her hand & have total exposure. You could loose so much.

[ashley1992]

Hun best for u to let this guy goo there no future here.. close this chapter of ur life

[elaine567]

Whether he pretended to be the wife to shut you down or the wife herself shut you down, the message is still clear.

He is not running screaming to you "Please do not leave me, I love you" is he?

 

Given the choice of all those fine words he said to you, prior to you sussing out her FB page, and how he is acting towards you now, you still hold on to the hope... why?

 

It is all so obvious, he has woken up, ditched you and thrown you under a bus, why do you really think he cares one jot about you?

He has made his decision, he is staying with his wife, so walk away with dignity.

Do not be the crazy, besotted OW who can't take no for an answer.

 

He is a MM, he lied to you, it happens all the time.

Stop thinking YOU are special.

The moment he shook his head in the car park and he refused to talk to you, should have shown you that you are NOT special to him.

[Lois_Griffin]

after thinking more about it, I don't believe that anymore.

There is no way he would do that to me. He was always so discreet.

I know what he felt for me had to have been real. It was real.

She had to have found out. It is the only thing that is logical.

I know he has feelings for me. There is no way someone can just say and be so into you day after day for 10 months and then just vanish on that for no reason. Only good enough reason would be a d day.

I don't understand why though when he was so adamant on leaving her, leaving his marriage. Even saying the kids would be better off as all they do is argue around them.

 

I changed the pw back. Out of curiousity and sent a message.

I don't care at this point. It's the weekend anyways.

I think the time will come when the rose-colored glasses truly come off and you see this snake for what he really is, not what you wish him to be.

 

I'm rather confused about why you can't believe he'd engineer a D-Day in order to save his own sorry hide when he's already clearly proven to you how low he'll sink to serve himself.

 

The guy has been lying to you since Day #1. There was never a divorce on the horizon, they were never living like unhappy roommates in a miserable, loveless marriage, his wife wasn't some fire-breathing creature from the depths of Hell, and he had NO PLANS WHATSOEVER to ride off with you into the sunset. Every single time he TOLD you those things, he knew he was lying to you.

 

And he told you those things because he selfishly wanted you right where you were willing to BE - letting your own life pass you right on by while he lived HIS life and had you eagerly waiting for him on the side. So in essence, you were living half a life and he was living a life and a half.

 

And he carried that charade on for almost a year and would have continued carrying it on indefinitely, KNOWING you'd be devastated one day when you found out it had all been one big lie. What kind of 'love' is that? If someone truly loves you, would they really set you up to be completely devastated and heartbroken one day? Because that's exactly what he was doing - and that's exactly what happened. And he did it because it served HIM, not you.

 

THAT'S how much he 'loved' you, NotTheChosen1.

 

When you peel away all the sugary words and bullsh*t he was feeding you on a daily basis, THAT'S what you're left with.

 

And I'm sorry, but I stand by my first post that if you haven't talked to this woman face to face, I don't believe he's had a D-Day. This guy is a scam artist and his FIRST loyalty is to protect his own sorry hide at all costs. It's not to you, it's not to his wife, it's not to his kids, it's not to his job, it's not to his family dog. His first loyalty is to his OWN sorry ass because he's a selfish, self-serving, self-entitled con artist who'll do whatever he can in order to serve himself.

 

You'll see this one day.

[anika99]

Well to be fair, the OP is married too. Why would the expectation be that the MM leave his wife and kids when the OP isn't leaving her husband?

 

OP I think the MM was probably infatuated with you early on, perhaps driven by lust, but that probably passed. Maybe when the affair started he was having problems at home, maybe he felt ignored and pushed aside so he sought your attention and told you things he believed to be true in the moment. However he apparently had a change of heart and realized his wife and kids were valuable and he didn't want to lose them. He likely didn't really give much thought to whatever he told you about sleeping in separate beds or being about to divorce because you are married too and you are not leaving your husband so he probably thought you were just playing the same game he was playing. Cheating and pretending to be leaving.

 

If there was a dday then I think the MM probably caused it himself by confessing to his wife. He was awfully quick to give her full access to his secret email and start reporting to her all of his interactions with you like when you waited for him by his car. Usually a cheater will deny everything until they are blue in the face and go to great lengths to protect their affair and their affair partner. I think that after you went off on him he realized that you could blow up his marriage if you were to really get angry and tell his wife so he proactively rushed to tell her himself so that he could save his marriage. He rightfully figured that confessing all and being totally forthcoming with all the details was the correct path to take to fix his life and his marriage.

Edited April 24, 2016 by anika99

[elaine567]

Well to be fair, the OP is married too. Why would the expectation be that the MM leave his wife and kids when the OP isn't leaving her husband?

 

The OP's husband left her and moved out 5 months ago. #60.

[whatatangledweb]

 

If there was a dday then I think the MM probably caused it himself by confessing to his wife. He was awfully quick to give her full access to his secret email and start reporting to her all of his interactions with you like when you waited for him by his car. Usually a cheater will deny everything until they are blue in the face and go to great lengths to protect their affair and their affair partner.

 

I caught my husband. He gave me everything that night. I know many will hide those things but not all. I don't think he confessed. Going by his wife's facebook page. They seem to have a good marriage. A MM is not going to blow that up by confessing most of the time.

 

OP, please stop looking at her page. I was so insulted and outraged that she was stalking my page even though it was set as private. You know how you felt about her reading your letters, the feeling is the same.

[Bittersweetie]

Notchosen1-

 

I had an A with a MM. I was married too. I thought the connection with MM was so unique...we were meant for each other. Then, after two months, he told me he could no longer communicate with me because he had another girlfriend. Not go back to his wife...no, he chose another OW.

 

Yet I clung to the fact that we had this connection, it was so strong, it had to mean something, right? I couldn't be the one to give up on it. I had to be true. I had to have faith! And I did, reaching out occasionally until finally eight months later he responded. The A continued and became physical. Then he dumped be again, with no explanation. I had a d-day.

 

I believe that the reason I held on so tightly to the idea of our connection is because I had to have a reason for myself, a justification, for why I was risking so much in my life for a person who really (I see now) didn't give two farts about me. Why would I risk everything to be a side piece? But to risk it all for a deep connection? That sounds so much more meaningful.

 

Please don't fall into the trap I did and hold on to that connection idea as a reason to still hope. He has shown you who he is...believe him. Yes you have risked and lost, but as time moves forward and you move forward you will become stronger and healthier as a person. I'm not going to lie, the time after MM ditched me the second time and then the d-day was ROUGH. But as I put one foot in front of the other, I also grew stronger, grew healthier inside, each day. You can too.

 

Good luck, BSW

Edited April 24, 2016 by Bittersweetie

[notthechosen1]

It really is over. I still go back and forth on whether he means it or not.

 

I talked to him quickly over the weekend. Through messenger on fb.

 

Basically his wife has somewhat known about me for months now. He wouldn't go into detail on how, he just kept saying he didn't know how she knew so much. but she knew a lot. As soon as she said my name to him and told him she knew what was going on is when he wanted out. He admitted he cares for me, feels bad, is so sorry, etc etc... did not mean the things he said in the emails to his wife. Was just trying to console her.

He said back when she said my name it changed something in him. It scared him and he really started to think about his marriage and her and what he wanted. It was her. I asked if he was staying for the kids or money a couple times and he finally said- no, I'm staying bc I'm so in love with her and don't want to lose her. I asked him how he can be in love with her after all the things he had said about her and how can he love her AND me??

 

This is where he started apologizing and saying he didn't mean to drag me in all this and lead me on for so long and that what we had in the beginning was real. What he felt for me was real. He admitted it didn't last though and as soon as he started wanting his wife back he started losing interest in me slowly. That hurt. I basically let my own husband walk out the door so this jerk can string me along until he finds out if his wife will 'take him back'.

 

He didn't give her the pw to our email. She went through his phone while he was doing something and he didn't log out of our account. He said she went ballistic, bawling, freaking out and saying she knew it all along, she was going to leave him, she was going to ruin my profession etc...

I don't know how they worked it out but they are I suppose. She held on to his phone for THREE days. So the day the email were being read, it was from her not MM. and she only knew I changed the pw bc it logged her out on his phone. She went crazy over this and accused him of doing it.

He still does not know how she knew we were talking at his car but he suspects he's been bugged or something for awhile I don't know.

 

The conversation was so sad, brutally honest and I needed to hear all he said. Then he got too honest and it hurt me and I still keep thinking about what he said. but i'm going to use it to keep NC. I almost think he was honest on purpose to ensure I stayed away.

 

He had been trying to end it with me for months is what he said. He said he didn't know how to just tell me he wanted to end it so he stopped sending me messages so much, seeing me on breaks every day. Which that did decline. I did notice he was taking his breaks on phone calls instead of with me. We used to do breaks, lunches, quick meetups after work, weekends, etc. By the last 2 months he had us down to meeting at breaks here and there and sending messages. The messages had also been not so lovey dovey once I re read them all. I asked him why he couldn't just tell me- he said it's be I was TOO PUSHY!!! WHAT? He said I was clingy and needy towards the end and he couldn't stand it. He said I kept pushing for more and more from him and time with him ever since my own husband left. He said once that happened he knew he had to get out but still couldn't find a way. He said he was also scared to break it off with me in fear I would tell his wife. He was scared to lose her all along. They were never going to divorce and he admitted that he lied about his wife and him being "separated" in the house.

I went on to ask him about the emails she showed me. I said is all that true what you said about me? His answer? "kind of". He would not go into detail on what was true and what wasn't. Just quickly shifted it back to "ok i'm really sorry and I will no longer contact you after this message and please do the same and respect NC for me so me and my wife can repair our marriage". he also assured me that his wife was in no way ever going to send out all the screenshots and pics and emails she took from his phone. He said shes not like that, shes really nice and just hurting so bad. etc. etc.

 

so now its all about wifey poo and here I am all alone having to see his smug lying face around here at work. UGH! I hate him. I hate that I ever met him!!!

 

DONT TRUST THEM EVER!!!! :mad::mad:

[anika99]

I'm sorry you are hurting but it sounds like the MM has given you all the information you need for closure and to move on. I suspect what he told you is true for a lot of MM who choose to end the affair and stay married but most don't have the guts to admit it to their OW. Instead they end the affair with more lies and manipulations, leaving the OW confused and hanging on to false hope. I know moving on will be difficult and you won't do it overnight but now that you have all this information you can start to heal. As you recover you will see that you always deserved better and better things will come. I wish you the best.

[heartwhole]

You have been given much more detailed information about the current state of his marriage than most OW. It's painful, but it will hopefully allow you to gain closure and begin working on your own stuff.

 

It really is over. I still go back and forth on whether he means it or not.

 

They've already called you pushy and clingy. I encourage you to maintain NC for your own sake, but also with the knowledge that if you continue holding on, you'll just be proving them right. Maintain your dignity and let it go. It is not rational to hope that he will come back to you after all the evidence you've been given.

 

The book Not Just Friends describes an affair similar to yours. Both APs are married. The female AP realizes that her marriage is dead and dreams of a future with MOM. As she becomes more invested in the A, he gets freaked out and realizes how much he doesn't want to lose his wife. He winds up with his wife; she winds up alone. I'd recommend reading the book to try to gain better insight into your actions.

 

I'm sorry you're hurting. They've really rubbed your face in it. I hope you can hunker down for some self-care now.

[SomethingToSay]

As soon as she said my name to him and told him she knew what was going on is when he wanted out. He admitted he cares for me, feels bad, is so sorry, etc etc... He said back when she said my name it changed something in him. I asked him how he can be in love with her after all the things he had said about her and how can he love her AND me??

 

 

This is so classic Affair 101. He adored you IN YOUR ROLE. He compartmentalized. You were the fantasy, fun side-chic. sure he may have mused about a future with you, but that's just part of the fantasy. Once you became un-content with your role...and his wife started to be on to him....the fantasy was shattered.

 

I basically let my own husband walk out the door so this jerk can string me along until he finds out if his wife will 'take him back'.

 

 

 

This is all on your I'm afraid. Yes you were a victim of his lies and disingenuiness but ultimately you will have to take ownership of this.

 

She went through his phone while he was doing something and he didn't log out of our account. He said she went ballistic, bawling, freaking out

 

 

Rightfully so. I think it very hard for many OW to have empathy for the utter devastation they play a role in causing the BS. yes the MM "betrayed her" but you were complicit in it. Don't brush this aside. Part of moving forward is learning what inside you allowed you to participate in something that would cause so much pain and devastation to an innocent party who had never done anything to you.

 

 

I asked him why he couldn't just tell me- he said it's be I was TOO PUSHY!!! WHAT? He said I was clingy and needy towards the end and he couldn't stand it. He said I kept pushing for more and more from him and time with him ever since my own husband left. He said once that happened he knew he had to get out but still couldn't find a way. He said he was also scared to break it off with me in fear I would tell his wife. He was scared to lose her all along. They were never going to divorce and he admitted that he lied about his wife and him being "separated" in the house.

 

 

Typical lying, cowardly, blam-shifting married man. Atho the part about you becoming single changing things for him is 100% true (see above about the Fantasy Affair Role) The way these MM get OW is by turning the charm on SO THICK. They shower and woo the way no regular, single, available man would EVER DO. They suck the OW away in a world of fantasy, feel good, soulmate , you and I against the world, mantras. No one can woo like the MM, and no one can turn it off cold turkey just like that, like a MM either.

 

 

Is it possible you can get another job? Id seriously consider it in order to really move forward and heal from this. It is also possible his wife will make him leave working there too, as part of her condition for allowing him to stay in the marriage with her.

[rainbowsandkittens]

Typical lying, cowardly, blam-shifting married man. Atho the part about you becoming single changing things for him is 100% true (see above about the Fantasy Affair Role) The way these MM get OW is by turning the charm on SO THICK. They shower and woo the way no regular, single, available man would EVER DO. They suck the OW away in a world of fantasy, feel good, soulmate , you and I against the world, mantras. No one can woo like the MM, and no one can turn it off cold turkey just like that, like a MM either.

Why is that, do you think?I agree with you that this is true, I just can't fathom why or how they are able to do this. Compartmentalization makes no sense to me tbh. It sometimes feels like they have a script on the things they say and do. It's uncanny. Do they teach this somewhere?

 

notthechosen1- I am so sorry that you're hurting so badly. My exAP said and did pretty much the same things. He knew I wanted more (I made a comment about how I wanted us to "keep moving forward," which sometimes I could kick myself for saying) so he started to distance himself from me. I felt something off and was desperately trying to pull him back in. I thought I was going crazy (he also made me think that since he told me he was just tired, busy, etc.) Went on christmas vacation with her and when he came back he was still off. Finally, I said something and he said pretty much the same thing yours did: I realized I love her, I never wanted to leave, I would not give you what you want. I asked a few calm questions (like, how all of a sudden do you love her when you've spent months telling me how horrible she is and you are together, etc. How did that change seemingly overnight?) and that was it. It's been 3 months and other than a little contact last week for his birthday, I never heard from him again.

 

You can't beg or plead bc, like any break up, when someone's mind is made up, that's it. You have to believe him bc what he's saying is true. He felt things for you but he loves her and he's not leaving. Bottom line.

 

Everyone told me that my AP's ending things the way he did was a blessing. I got at least some closure and answers that other people never get. It didn't feel that way then. But I can see now that it is better bc I never truly had hope that he would come back. I mean, of course I hoped. But I also knew that he didn't leave any door open.

 

I hope this is the end for you and you can truly start the process of healing and moving on.

[imperfectangel]

I really feel for you OP. Esp after the length of time that's gone by. Unfortunately MM has gown that ultimately what he wants is his wife (and family). It hurts so much I used to spend nights crying - I cried until I could cry no more but slowly but surely I am getting there. You can do that too. But only if you WANT to

[SomethingToSay]

Why is that, do you think?

 

 

Because they have to lay it on thick and woo like Prince Charming in order for the potential OW to overlook the fact they are married and living with their wife and children; they make up for the acceptance of that and the breadcrumbs and all the other ****tiness by bombing you with flowerly words, feel good sayings, texts and texts. They make a deep emotional connection to hook you so they can keep getting what they want -- fun, romance, sex, companionship...AND their married family life. Now, I will say some maybe do this subconsciously...ie maybe they aren't actively saying "hey let me really lay it on thick and reel her in"...but they are in denial themselves...telling themselves well I deserve this, my wife wont find out, no one will get hurt...etc etc

 

 

Then like the above 2 cases....once the OW ROLE becomes shaky...she pushes for more, makes him uncomfortable, asks questions he doesn't want to face....he pulls back. Or just consciously lies more and more to keep getting his CAKE (Marriage and OW)

 

 

But its why every OW thinks shes special, that he will leave, that they are destined soul mates, etc. B/c he lays it on so thick. He cultivates that "CONNECTION" and chemistry and everything else.

[Dancewithme]

I think this thread should be required reading for all OWs and potential OWs, esp #136

[Girlfromcali]

Because they have to lay it on thick and woo like Prince Charming in order for the potential OW to overlook the fact they are married and living with their wife and children; they make up for the acceptance of that and the breadcrumbs and all the other ****tiness by bombing you with flowerly words, feel good sayings, texts and texts. They make a deep emotional connection to hook you so they can keep getting what they want -- fun, romance, sex, companionship...AND their married family life. Now, I will say some maybe do this subconsciously...ie maybe they aren't actively saying "hey let me really lay it on thick and reel her in"...but they are in denial themselves...telling themselves well I deserve this, my wife wont find out, no one will get hurt...etc etc

 

 

Then like the above 2 cases....once the OW ROLE becomes shaky...she pushes for more, makes him uncomfortable, asks questions he doesn't want to face....he pulls back. Or just consciously lies more and more to keep getting his CAKE (Marriage and OW)

 

 

But its why every OW thinks shes special, that he will leave, that they are destined soul mates, etc. B/c he lays it on so thick. He cultivates that "CONNECTION" and chemistry and everything else.

 

It's true. The things he said to me were absurd, no single man would ever say those things to a single woman in the beginning of the relationship.

 

However, I did the same thing to him, so I do think it's a two way street. I don't think it's just the MM, it's also the OW, they both do it. OW does it more discreetly and passively, since the society says women are to be chased, and they are supposed to be feminine and let the man take the lead. It doesn't make them less culpable, though.

[rainbowsandkittens]

Because they have to lay it on thick and woo like Prince Charming in order for the potential OW to overlook the fact they are married and living with their wife and children; they make up for the acceptance of that and the breadcrumbs and all the other ****tiness by bombing you with flowerly words, feel good sayings, texts and texts. They make a deep emotional connection to hook you so they can keep getting what they want -- fun, romance, sex, companionship...AND their married family life. Now, I will say some maybe do this subconsciously...ie maybe they aren't actively saying "hey let me really lay it on thick and reel her in"...but they are in denial themselves...telling themselves well I deserve this, my wife wont find out, no one will get hurt...etc etc

 

 

Then like the above 2 cases....once the OW ROLE becomes shaky...she pushes for more, makes him uncomfortable, asks questions he doesn't want to face....he pulls back. Or just consciously lies more and more to keep getting his CAKE (Marriage and OW)

 

 

But its why every OW thinks shes special, that he will leave, that they are destined soul mates, etc. B/c he lays it on so thick. He cultivates that "CONNECTION" and chemistry and everything else.

 

That makes sense. I am usually good at bs and people future faking etc but boy, did I fall for it this time. Possibly bc he was unlike anyone I ever met. And the accent. But mostly he seemed so genuine. So sincere. I'm very cynical and he melted all that. I hope he didn't ruin it in me forever.

[Girlfromcali]

That makes sense. I am usually good at bs and people future faking etc but boy, did I fall for it this time. Possibly bc he was unlike anyone I ever met. And the accent. But mostly he seemed so genuine. So sincere. I'm very cynical and he melted all that. I hope he didn't ruin it in me forever.

 

Yup yup. Wow..every time I read these stories I'm wondering do we all have the same MM?

 

I'm very cynical too and extremely sceptical and wary. So maybe that's why because I have a hard time letting anyone close, and then someone just comes up and says he always gets what he wants and now he wants me.

 

But seriously, there's this element of desire and being wanted. I think it's normal to want to feel wanted and special. It doesn't happen every day that someone says he's never wanted anyone as much in his life bla bla bla..and yes, where was my BS meter then? But my BS detector is broken when someone says they want me.

[SomethingToSay]

Plus the fact he is married, some OW mistakingly twist that into being some sort of compliment ie "I must be so special and our connection so amazing that he is willing to risk his marriage for it". but in his mind, he isn't risking it at all. He will never get caught.

 

 

Also about the wooing and charming and developing of connection -- keep in mind MM have vast experience with the female psyche. They are married. They have spent years living with their wife. They know what makes a woman tick. They know how to really appease a woman. They have a lot of insight into female mind and sexuality due to being married. Moreso than many single men. So that is another factor.

 

 

No one woos like the MM

[Girlfromcali]

Plus the fact he is married, some OW mistakingly twist that into being some sort of compliment ie "I must be so special and our connection so amazing that he is willing to risk his marriage for it". but in his mind, he isn't risking it at all. He will never get caught.

 

 

Also about the wooing and charming and developing of connection -- keep in mind MM have vast experience with the female psyche. They are married. They have spent years living with their wife. They know what makes a woman tick. They know how to really appease a woman. They have a lot of insight into female mind and sexuality due to being married. Moreso than many single men. So that is another factor.

 

 

No one woos like the MM

 

This makes me laugh...it's SO true. And not only has he been married million years, he has daughters, sisters, and was extremely close to his mother. He's an expert on women, and how to seduce them.

[rainbowsandkittens]

And mine is French! A triple whammy!

[Girlfromcali]

And mine is French! A triple whammy!

 

I hear ya! I had a French boyfriend when I was young and I was totally obsessed about him too.. even years after the relationship had ended. And he wasn't even married lol..

But, now I know French so at least there's that..