Hurting me, hurting others

[AlwaysGrowing]

I don't want to lose my marriage (yes, I know selfish) which means I will work on that. But at the moment I need to focus on breaking this hold this man has over me.

 

If he and I can get on a more professional level then there will be no need to look for a job (reasons I cannot go into because it could give TMI).

 

As it is, at the moment I am posting here right now to stop me emailing him. The problem is I don't know whether I am doing that to protect myself and build those boundaries or whether it is to make him feel less pressured and therefore more open to us.

 

I hate that I just wrote that .

 

 

If you dont want to lose your marriage....then I suggest you put your focus there. Let yourself feel the weight of your betrayal. If you are able to be empathetic...then not contacting the OM will be easy.

 

Right now....you dont feel that your marriage is at risk.....therefore you are not putting any of your thoughts/energy there. Imagine if you put just 10% of your emotional energy on creating a new marriage.......the rewards emotional, physically and internally will be 10 fold.

 

Do not get caught in the trap of thinking that you could be "more happier" with this MM. Your life will be non-stop drama and pain.

 

It isn't easy to look at your family (and yourself) and know that they know...you deliberately ****ed up a good thing.

[Messy Lady]

I'm so glad I came here! I'm getting the see it for what it's lecture that I needed for the past few weeks! Thank you everybody.

 

Anika - now that he does the must stop line after coming on to me so heavily this week, I do feel angry and used. I fulfil a need at his convenience. I am usually a very strong minded, don't mess with me woman but with him, that all falls away. In some ways, this is part of what I find so attractive about him. I need to find me again.

 

Grapes - you raise concerns that I have had. From the very start, he has given me blatantly obvious preferential treatment to a peer. A lot of this is grounded in my work performance and the plans we have for work so all quite genuine. But that has created a high level of intimacy in a working relationship with a lot of shared secrets. A recipe for boundaries to get screwed up.

 

Grey cloud - I'm so sorry you went through that. I am just at that point of stepping into that cycle. I must step away from it now.

 

Which way - I know I am being selfish and we are using each other. The feeling of being used is because it all now seems to be on his terms with him in control of what happens next. I have read the Infidelity forums. The pain and devastation there is overwhelming. It makes me sound even more selfish for moaning about something I have done to myself. My husband is a good man and does not deserve this. I will be taking some time off work very soon and I had thought that would be useful to help create distance. As for working together and being purely work colleagues, I actually think I am more capable of doing this then he is in spite of him being the one who pulls away and me wanting this. After every pull away, I have gone into work mode no matter what I wanted and he has then started saying things or 'accidentally' touched me. I have reminded him that we are supposed to have stopped and he apologies, smiling away. Another thing I am glad I have written down - a reminder of how he is far from innocent in this and how he has taken advantage of how I feel about him. Ugh.

 

I have already thought that this is great for his ego. He is older than me (though neither of us are young!) and I also look good for my age hence a younger, attractive, bright woman shows an interest in him. Great for him. He gets me to admit it's more than flirting before he makes a move. Another ego boost plus safety measure in case he was wrong. The fact that he has been able to pull me back in every time is fabulous for him. He must be on cloud 9.

 

Always - I know I need to refocus my energies. That is part of what I hoped I would get from posting here. At the moment, seeing this man and what has been happening for what it really is does help on that. I know I wouldn't be happier with him than I would be with my husband. I'm like an addict at the moment and I need to break that habit before it destroys everything.

[Cloudcuckoo]

You have said that neither of you have done this before.

 

From what you describe of this married man, it sounds like he's very well practiced frankly.

 

You might bear this in mind for the next round of push/pull that is inevitable.

 

wishing you determination and strength, you've quite a battle ahead lady.

 

Cuckoo

[Messy Lady]

I have questioned him on that Cuckoo. He seems to go from being all naive on this to very self assured and confident very quickly. But he also knows that he does not need to lie about that to me.

[elaine567]

I have questioned him on that Cuckoo. He seems to go from being all naive on this to very self assured and confident very quickly. But he also knows that he does not need to lie about that to me.

 

Do not underestimate him. "Naivety" can be part of the game. http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/other-man-woman/575630-shocker-2.html#post6851090

[Messy Lady]

Do not underestimate him. "Naivety" can be part of the game. http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/other-man-woman/575630-shocker-2.html#post6851090

 

That was an eye opening post in that link!

 

He is always saying complimentary things about me, whether it be about work, how I look, my personality. He has also shared some very personal things with me and has got me to do the same through his asking me questions, building up an emotional intimacy, pulling me further in. I have seen how good he is at figuring out other people and how to deal with them so I am sure he has done the same with me. Even when he pulls away from me, he still says and does enough to hint at more and therefore keep me hooked.

 

I am so glad I started this thread!

[loveisanaction]

The people on here have given you fantastic advice....please please listen to them. They speak out of experience...they know how this will end and i echo all of them.

 

You are a married woman, you have a husband, please do not forget that. Your husband does not deserve this. He has made an honest woman out of you by making you his wife. He is not ashamed of you nor does he feel guilty after having sex with you. Do not betray him by giving your heart and body to a man who thinks nothing more of you than a casual affair partner who he spends a few moments with after work (or sometimes in his car).

 

Do not feel flattered that a man is sexually attracted to you. A man can be sexually attracted to you and 2000 other women…all at the same time.

 

Feel flattered when a man is in love with you and has handed over his heart for you to take care of.

[privategal]

Hello,

Since no one has stepped in to show you any tough love here yet...allow me.

You already answered all your questions...hes older, hes using you, hes stroking his ego, hes pushing and pulling...

You can continue to play the weepy "I just dont know what to do" role or you can get it together...open your eyes...its crazy, wrong, selfish to your spouses and you need to just woman up and get serious and firm.

And so you are together 8-9 hours a day but theres still work to discuss at night?

No...you arent at work nor being paid for that. Those evening hours are for your rest, downtime, family...YOUR LIFE.

How many times does a man have to say "I cant do this to my wife.. We need to stop" before you stop yourself too?

You arent helpless, you arent dumb.

You have a responsibility to your job and family and you need to refocus, regroup and say no more...no matter what.

You arent confused...your literally studying the infidelity and om/ow posts seeing what your own devastation could look like if you proceed...and your acting helpless?

You've been given the gift of this site...its like your personal crystal ball as to what lies ahead.

Stop laying on the traintracks waiting for whats next when you already see whats coming. Either be a statistic...or take control.

Lets say his name is John...

"dear John, I have thought this through. I see clearly we love our spouse's and family, we've made bad choices in jeopardizing our careers and marriage. I do not wish to play russian roulette with my spouse, job, family, nor yours.

This ends right now. Do not email at home, do not think I will fall to temptation from touching, flirting, please be professional. Im very serious about ending this and getting back to business. Im very firm in my decision I am commiting to a professional relationship ONLY and this time there will not be any falling back and I do not welcome any more advances at all from either of us starting this minute, that aspect of the relationship is finished and I need you to respect it 100%"

 

You arent teenagers, please forgive me for my harshness here if you see it as that but Id like to help you and also you need to help yourself.

[BuddyX]

That was an eye opening post in that link!

 

He is always saying complimentary things about me, whether it be about work, how I look, my personality. He has also shared some very personal things with me and has got me to do the same through his asking me questions, building up an emotional intimacy, pulling me further in. I have seen how good he is at figuring out other people and how to deal with them so I am sure he has done the same with me. Even when he pulls away from me, he still says and does enough to hint at more and therefore keep me hooked.

 

I am so glad I started this thread!

 

He's not good, you're just vaulnerble.

I encourage you to focus on your hubby. He, along with the wife are the victims. Let that one sink in for a min.

 

People at work, already know. I don't care how careful you are.

 

You're in a Fog right now.

 

Someone else said it best. Please take credit for the following;

 

"Unless both of you are ready to leave your primary relationships on your own accord (not for each other), you will experience immeasurable, earth-shattering pain. I'm not trying to scare you. But one day he or you will disappear because your partners find out. He will treat you as if you are nothing, even beneath his contempt. You will experience the worst form of betrayal imaginable -- abandonment."

[Messy Lady]

I both deserve and need the harsh words. I am actually thankful for them as it is all helping me come to my senses and see the reality. This thread has been good for me.

 

Our work does mean contact outside of the office but it will be purely work now. As it will be in the office too. I must be strong and tough on myself.

[Messy Lady]

My resolve does not feel so strong today. I emailed him yesterday on a work matter (on something I had to look at over the weekend for practical reasons) and he has not got back to me. I'm feeling disappointed about that when I know I shouldn't.

 

Ugh! Started typing something and deleted it. It was all excuses for him and I to continue being close. I know part of me still wants him. I know I would miss our "friendship" if we made it work only. I'm thinking too much about times we have spent together and I am wondering whether he is too. Whether he still wants me. Whether he will make another move on me.

 

This is a mess.

[R.Gant]

from your writing your the one pursuing OM not the other way around.

 

you want this to end quickly, confess you affair to your husband. that should put some brakes to it.

[Messy Lady]

I would disagree with that. He and I were both flirting initially and he was definitely the one who started the flirty touching. He was also the one who initiated the conversation on is this more than just flirting. He is also the one who makes the move every time after we have supposedly stopped. If you had seen how he was on Wednesday, you would have no hesitation in saying he pursued me. On all the physical aspects, he has led the way. However for other aspects, yes it is me sometimes. Some of the emailing has been led by me. Some by him though too.

 

At the end of the day, he is a grown man and anything that has happened has been because he wanted it to happen. I would actually say that he is the one who has been in control of all this from the very beginning. When he has pulled away from me, it was him who then restarted things. He is also the one who has led conversations so that I have ended up telling him I wanted him. This is all about him being in control, getting what he wants when he wants.

[BuddyX]

Wow, so you have no control over your emotions, feelings, and desires?

You appear to put all the blame on him while playing the victim role.

 

Reread what you wrote above. You're acting like a teenager with no sense of accountability.

 

Look, we all have our slip ups. We all want to have our cake and eat it. But that's not how the world works. There's spouses and kids involved. And oh yeah, marriage vows.

 

Part ways with him. At the very least, keep it professional. You're paid for your work not to make out while on the clock.

 

It was mentioned before, but this Will not end well. You will feel the worst kind of pain.

[Messy Lady]

Buddy

 

 

That is not what I said! I was just trying to correct R Gant's assumption that I was the only one doing the pursuing. If you re-read my post, I have said that I have led on some of the things that have happened. I was trying to make it clear that he is as accountable and responsible for this as I am. I am not a victim in this and neither is he.

 

 

If you care to read my other posts, you will also see that I know what I need to do and plan to take the professional colleague route from now on. I just acknowledge that it may not be easy.

[elaine567]

I know what I need to do and plan to take the professional colleague route from now on. I just acknowledge that it may not be easy.

 

You are on the right track, keep going.

[BuddyX]

Life's about not about action but reaction. Just remember, Every single time you allow the flirting to happy you're taking a step back. Focus on you and your family

[privategal]

Buddy

 

 

That is not what I said! I was just trying to correct R Gant's assumption that I was the only one doing the pursuing. If you re-read my post, I have said that I have led on some of the things that have happened. I was trying to make it clear that he is as accountable and responsible for this as I am. I am not a victim in this and neither is he.

 

 

If you care to read my other posts, you will also see that I know what I need to do and plan to take the professional colleague route from now on. I just acknowledge that it may not be easy.

 

Try to get out of the "it wont be easy" "its so hard" "I really care" "were in love" "its so strong"...get out of any and all of that mindset...its better to replace it with...

-ending this now is the only way

-theres NO other option but to just stop

-I will not go back no matter WHAT

-I can do this, for our spouses, familys I will succeed at all costs

[Messy Lady]

I have not even mentioned the word "love"!

 

I know what I need to do. I have not said it is impossible to do it either. I am just being realistic that it may not be plain sailing.

[BuddyX]

Have you actually told him "No", "This has to stop now"?

[privategal]

I have not even mentioned the word "love"!

 

I know what I need to do. I have not said it is impossible to do it either. I am just being realistic that it may not be plain sailing.

 

Were on your side. I understand why you are feeling defensive. I was too many times. Just want to help.

Breaking any addiction is not easy or smooth sailing.

Also hope none of my advice will ever beat anyone over the head with what they already know...the posters who have lived through some of the WORST pain usually have some of the strongest advice. My xeap cycled through variations of your situation for 15 years.

I just am passionate about people getting out but am sympathetic to how hard it is. The pain was brutal in tge end and aged me and took a huge mental toll. Hope to help spare others if possible. This is why some speak more firmly. They know the damage. No one gets out unscathed. Take care.

Edited April 10, 2016 by privategal

[whichwayisup]

I would disagree with that. He and I were both flirting initially and he was definitely the one who started the flirty touching. He was also the one who initiated the conversation on is this more than just flirting. He is also the one who makes the move every time after we have supposedly stopped. If you had seen how he was on Wednesday, you would have no hesitation in saying he pursued me. On all the physical aspects, he has led the way. However for other aspects, yes it is me sometimes. Some of the emailing has been led by me. Some by him though too.

 

At the end of the day, he is a grown man and anything that has happened has been because he wanted it to happen. I would actually say that he is the one who has been in control of all this from the very beginning. When he has pulled away from me, it was him who then restarted things. He is also the one who has led conversations so that I have ended up telling him I wanted him. This is all about him being in control, getting what he wants when he wants.

 

It doesn't matter who started what, or who's fault it is, point is, you BOTH are doing/choosing this.

 

You 'let' him restart things. You're not an innocent sitting duck here. You can (though you won't) just tell him to f off and leave you alone and stick to your own word, stay away from him. He didn't force a gun to your head asking you to confess your feelings. He manipulated you but deep down you must have known this too.

 

NOW you know, so find it inside you to get that inner strength and put yourself first. You're not a victim, you've been a willing participant. You want out? End it once and for all.

[privategal]

She cant really tell her boss to F off but she CAN tell him they both need to act professionally and that it went too far and needs to be upheld this time for good. Zero tolerance for boundary crossing, after work meetings and emailing from home.

No exceptions.

And NO trying to be friends.

He is betraying the ethics and code of conduct in his position also.

[Southern Sun]

My resolve does not feel so strong today. I emailed him yesterday on a work matter (on something I had to look at over the weekend for practical reasons) and he has not got back to me. I'm feeling disappointed about that when I know I shouldn't.

 

Ugh! Started typing something and deleted it. It was all excuses for him and I to continue being close. I know part of me still wants him. I know I would miss our "friendship" if we made it work only. I'm thinking too much about times we have spent together and I am wondering whether he is too. Whether he still wants me. Whether he will make another move on me.

 

This is a mess.

 

I was almost in your exact situation.

 

I had an affair with my married boss. He too played the push/pull with me, but it was after a very intense full-on A where we were "in love." Then he broke it off and THEN played push/pull. "We can't do this." "I love you, must have you." I fell for it, kept allowing him back. I felt like a used piece of meat by the end. I was a zombie at work, miserable, anxious, depressed.

 

You are going to end up in a very bad situation. It's already bad frankly, but it can get way worse. I doubt he has "feelings" for you, but you do for him. If you continue with this, your feelings will grow. He will keep on doing the hot and cold BS and will simply take advantage of your desire to be with him. He will tell you he must stop, but then he will want to scratch the itch again. You'll want to allow it because of your feelings, and then he'll withdraw due to "guilt." It will happen over and over and over until he drops you cold or you get caught.

 

It will only get worse. Also, you say you love your husband but you won't if you continue this. It will destroy your love for him. What you give to one takes from the other. Women normally can't maintain the love for their BHs.

 

(FYI I had a D Day and lost my job and career...maybe my marriage too, still TBD).

 

Listen to privategal. Be the one who stops this.

Edited April 10, 2016 by Southern Sun

[Jersey born raised]

It seems the two of you are in the affair for different reasons. I have two posts you might find helpful to clarify your thoughts. Normally I would PM you these post rather than cut and paste. Since you do not I will simply paste these two posts. The first is who your OM is and what he gets out of your adultery (harsh but true)

 

A player:

 

Thus was posted by a player who posted this. *What BS needs to understand that the void in a player is only within themselves and will never be filled. *Literary it is a case of it really is them and only them. *

Understand the player will always be looking for his next fix in an endorse quest to fill an unfillabke void.

 

My perspective- as a serial cheat. Before I start, I'm no GQ model look alike and I'm not wealthy.

 

For me, it was always about extra sex. The thrill of the chase and ego boost was a plus, but I just wanted more sex than my wife did. I always loved my wife and certainly never ever wanted to leave her or lose her. Especially not over someone else's wayward wife.

 

I had a simple method. I used it because it worked. I targeted married women. I figured they were safer for several important reasons.

1- Less likely to be sleeping around with random guys (STDs).

2- Less likely to pull the crazy girlfriend BS and call my wife.

3- In case of an unwanted pregnancy, I had a built in schmuck to pay the tab and would have claimed to have had a vasectomy.

 

The most important part of being a player is to hide it. I started with shy looks making certain I'd get caught and then doing my best to look embarrassed. If she started to come around more or dress sexier then I'd try a safe compliment. If she called me on my BS (yes, it happened) I simply acted highly offended. After all, I'm a married family man. That usually got me an apology. A few really smart ones just avoided me altogether.

 

If she accepted the compliment, I knew I had a chance. I never ever wasted time with someone that I didn't want to bed. If the compliment was successful, I simply followed with more as time permitted and just let things develop. Who knew where it would go? When she would speak with me about her frustrations with her husband (they always complained about their husband) I used that to my advantage. If they complained that he didn't do enough with the kids, I was dad of the year. If he didn't help out around the house, I did everything at home so my wife didn't have to. Yes, it was complete BS, but so what. My job was to make them feel special, pretty and needed and to paint the fantasy. After all, my goal was not conversation or friendship. I wanted to score.

 

Once things progressed and I had to keep it intense unless it was simply a once and done kind of thing. I would do that by pushing her boundaries for sex. Anal, public hook-up whatever. Keep in mind, I'm in it for the sex so I tried for everything I liked and heard more than once statements like... I never even let my husband do that. That was usually with anal, but sometimes public hook-ups also.

 

I certainly didn't want to be paying for hotel rooms out my pocket. If she wanted to pay, that was fine. Otherwise, we could hook-up anywhere, it didn't matter to me.

 

I always advised them to keep the secret between us, because it was so special. Actually, I didn't want to get busted. If they got busted, and some did. That was their tough crap to deal with. I certainly never vowed to love/honor/cherish them.

 

As I look back, I'm stunned at how easy it was and how many fell for my crap. I had some that would try to pull away and I'd feed them the star crossed lovers BS, you know... kept apart by the cruel hand of fate. That worked like magic to seal the deal. I also used things like I think my wife may have cheated on me. Then I'd work in how I got tested for STDs and it was clear and somehow manage to mention my vasectomy (never had one). Understand? I'm safe, you won't catch anything if you sleep with me and I won't get you pregnant. That was the message.

 

The one thing that sent me running was the fear of getting caught and sometimes I just wanted a quick bang and wasn't in it for a couple of months of an affair. I'm still also amazed by how many didn't see through my crap either. They didn't have to deal with the day to day stresses that adults face with me (finances, mortgages, car payments, child care, time commitments, etc.). With me, it was just fun and sex. The poor bastard at home didn't have a chance once the play was in motion. It also helped me to see him as a douche-bag when his wife whined about him for whatever reason.

 

I work with a woman that has lost everything over an affair with me. The house, husband, family, etc. It's difficult to see. She hates me now, but I never vowed anything to her or forced her to do anything. That's her tough crap. Her kids are in therapy, their grades tanked and she's struggling financially and the kids blame her, etc. Honestly, I wish she'd quit so I didn't have to see her every freaking day.

 

 

I do know a few like me that I consider even worse. They brag and laugh about getting wayward wives to do things and try to get email or text proof to show off. It's pretty easy, just tell her how much he liked doing X with her last night and let her respond. Then they had proof to brag about and trade notes. I didn't do that. I just wanted the sex and avoided the women they talked about. I liked to find the ones who would seem to be the last to ever do anything like this. Goes back to my 3 reasons.

 

I never flirted with a married woman unless I wanted in her pants. Plain and simple, you do have to hide it so they don't see it coming, but it's really that basic. Other players use different methods, but we all use what works and modify sometimes if we're not progressing to try a different angle. Not all women are the same, and sometimes deviations are required if she'll let you in her pants.

 

It was never about love, just sex. I sold the fantasy, yes. But that is all it ever was. A fair trade. They were adults and quite frankly should have known better. Am I a predator, I certainly never thought so and I certainly never thought about what would happen to them when we were done. Yes, all my affairs ended. Most stayed married to their H they *****ed about and screwed around on. Therefore, he must not have been that bad. People just get caught up with unrealistic expectations on life I think. For goodness sake, Prince charming is only charming because he wants a blow job.

 

Before I close, I'll say this as well. An engaged woman would have worked for me also, but I never found one that would go for me. Also, newly married women are much harder to get. I had the best luck with women who had been married for at least several years, throw a kid or two in the mix and they were usually more susceptible to being chased.

 

It was a fair trade. Attention and compliments for sex.

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