Is it wrong or 'jerk-ish' of me to ask my girlfriend for a pre-nup if we got married?

[d0nnivain]

I think we're saying get ready -- take some financial courses both of you, get some premarital counseling (the conflict resolution stuff really helps) and find a way to work together to get what you both want. We want you to be successful but that requires a team work approach.

[DreamP]

Yes, what d0nnivain said. Right now, you are a driver who knows nothing about the rules of the road. The fact that you are taking an all or nothing approach is another sign you have no idea what marriage is. Marriage is about compromise, negotiations, meeting your partner half way, discussing things, making decisions and choices together and sharing the consequences of the decisions, good or bad, together. It is not about "yours" and "mine". There is no yours and mine after you get married. Even if you have a pre-nup, you can't think that way. That is a sure way to ensure that the marriage won't work. Any relationship requires you to constantly work on it. It is never the same. Things are always changing.

 

So educate yourself on the financial implications of marriage. Understand how it works. Talk about your financial planning together. Talk about large expenses (like weddings) together. Be prepared to share the consequences of the decisions you make together. The biggest reason I don't think you are ready for marriage is because you have no clue what marriage is and that is dangerous. It's not about your maturity, it's about your lack of "education" on marriage.

 

Do you have any friends who have been married for a long time? If so, talk to them about it. Althougt, don't tell them about you offering to lend your gf money for the wedding. Because that will surely get you laughed at.

 

If you truly want to get married, then act like you do. See the lawyer. Talk to a financial adviser. Talk to other married couples. Seek premarital counselling. And most of all, talk to your gf.

[ironpony]

You're right. I will plan everything financially with her, together. Thank you for the insight.

 

I would love to see a counseller about it, but she wouldn't go for it, until we got married or at least until I give her the ring, but right now I think I will just tell her that I love her and want to marry her, but I would like some prenup arrangement where we both decide together in the marriage. I will start with that and see what she says. My appointment to speak to an attorney will not be till next week, but I do not have any more time, and have to make a decision with her now.

 

Do you think it's fair of me to tell her that, not haven time to speak to an attorney yet, since she wants me to make a decision?

[Els]

The prenup only serves to protect savings accumulated prior to the marriage, particularly when one party has saved far more than the other.

 

Wow, is this for real? So in the US, if two people marry and then separate, the assets/savings gained before they even met are at stake?

 

I had no idea. Where I live, by default only savings/assets gained during the relationship/marriage are at stake during separation - it's very rare that anything you had before is touched. IMO if everything accumulated beforehand is at stake, I can't really blame anyone (of either gender) for desiring a pre-nup. (Frankly that just sounds like a system designed for the profit of lawyers who handle such matters, but I digress....)

 

On the other hand, pre-nups do sound rather distasteful to me, like you're already planning for the demise of a partnership that is supposed to be lifelong, before it's even started. But as I said, I can see why they might be necessary considering the law that your entire life's savings are at risk if you don't get one. So can't really fault either the OP or his gf in this case...

Edited May 12, 2016 by Elswyth

[d0nnivain]

Do you think it's fair of me to tell her that, not haven time to speak to an attorney yet, since she wants me to make a decision?

 

I think it's abundantly fair. You are trying to open a meaningful dialogue about your relationship & your future together. She is tossing out ultimatums. Reason & compromise have to be the foundations. Tantrums & selfishness will doom this before you even get started.

[clia]

You're right. I will plan everything financially with her, together. Thank you for the insight.

 

I would love to see a counseller about it, but she wouldn't go for it, until we got married or at least until I give her the ring, but right now I think I will just tell her that I love her and want to marry her, but I would like some prenup arrangement where we both decide together in the marriage. I will start with that and see what she says. My appointment to speak to an attorney will not be till next week, but I do not have any more time, and have to make a decision with her now.

 

Do you think it's fair of me to tell her that, not haven time to speak to an attorney yet, since she wants me to make a decision?

 

This thread is a month old and presumably you were thinking about a prenup before it even started. And yet you still haven't bothered to talk to an attorney, even though you were well aware of the timeline. You can certainly ask her for more time, but it kind of seems like you are delaying things. You might have better luck buying more time if you actually have an appointment scheduled. Frankly, until you've actually found out from an attorney whether it's worth it to pursue this path I don't think you should keep bringing it up with her because it's just going to cause issues that might not even be necessary.

[rester]

You're right. I will plan everything financially with her, together. Thank you for the insight.

 

I would love to see a counseller about it, but she wouldn't go for it, until we got married or at least until I give her the ring, but right now I think I will just tell her that I love her and want to marry her, but I would like some prenup arrangement where we both decide together in the marriage. I will start with that and see what she says. My appointment to speak to an attorney will not be till next week, but I do not have any more time, and have to make a decision with her now.

 

Do you think it's fair of me to tell her that, not haven time to speak to an attorney yet, since she wants me to make a decision?

 

I admit the legal aspects of this are out of my range of knowledge, but I still don't understand why a "prenup" is being discussed. That's the nuclear option and should be the worst case scenario. The mere mention of that type of document will automatically make some people defensive, and obviously it has not gone over well with your girlfriend, so no, I wouldn't agree that you should tell her that again, until you have spoken to an attorney, gone over the other options, and then decided what your best option is. Hopefully, that option would be something that your girlfriend would be agreeable to.

 

Protecting your current assets makes perfect sense. A quick google search indicates there are ways to keep your assets separate, with good documentation. Therefore, a prenup may not be necessary at all. Find out what the lesser options are before you drop the "prenup" bomb.

 

search:

"protecting assets without prenup"

"how to keep assets separate in marriage"

etc

 

That said, if she doesn't want to go to a counselor to discuss these issues, it sounds as though she can be difficult to reason with.

 

Go see an attorney ASAP!

[ironpony]

Okay thanks. Well I don't have time to actually see a lawyer, cause my appointment is not until next week and I think she will not give me past this weekend now, to make to say no to a prenup, but I will see if I can.

 

If I have been kind of cheap with money about her, than I will not be. Sometimes I tend to get defensive with it towards her, since he reaction to the prenup, and has been borrowing a lot of money from her ex lately, since I haven't been helping pay her bills as much. I pay to an extent but I do not give her everything she asks for, so her borrowing from her ex, and her reaction to the prenup has caused me to become defensive, but I will watch for that, and we will share our money in the marriage.

[ironpony]

How is a prenup a nuclear situation though? I thought it was insurance, in case something were to happen in a marriage, even though you are happy and hoping for the best. Is that really a nuclear situation?

[d0nnivain]

It's not a nuclear situation. It is insurance.

 

 

However some people like your GF & rester view it as a bad thing. They say if you get a prenup you are already thinking about breaking up. That is the same as a saying if you get car insurance you are thinking about getting in an accident or if you buy travel insurance you are jinxing your vacation.

[NTV]

since he reaction to the prenup, and has been borrowing a lot of money from her ex lately, since I haven't been helping pay her bills as much. I pay to an extent but I do not give her everything she asks for, so her borrowing from her ex

 

 

 

 

Dude, I don't think you have any idea how much of a HUGE red flag this is. She doesn't get what she wants financially from you so she asks another guy?

 

 

What happens when you get married and she doesn't get what she wants from you sexually? romantically? conversationally?

 

 

This is what you can expect in the marriage.

[d0nnivain]

Whoa. I clearly missed the section NTV quoted.

 

 

Ironpony forget the prenup. You can't marry a woman who is still emotionally & financial entwined with her EX. By running to an EX for help, she is showing you that she is not committed to you and is clearly not ready to "forsake all others". Get that addressed before you waste money on a ring or a lawyer.

[elaine567]

It's not a nuclear situation. It is insurance.

However some people like your GF & rester view it as a bad thing. They say if you get a prenup you are already thinking about breaking up. That is the same as a saying if you get car insurance you are thinking about getting in an accident or if you buy travel insurance you are jinxing your vacation.

 

There is no point in getting "insurance" if you do not actually own anything and that is where the gf is at.

She lives paycheck to paycheck and is paying for her fathers medical care and getting loans from her ex to get by.

The OP has enough money saved to buy a house.

He NEEDS "insurance", she doesn't.

It is a fundamental disconnect.

[CarrieT]

Sometimes I tend to get defensive with it towards her, since he reaction to the prenup, and has been borrowing a lot of money from her ex lately, since I haven't been helping pay her bills as much. I pay to an extent but I do not give her everything she asks for, so her borrowing from her ex, and her reaction to the prenup has caused me to become defensive, but I will watch for that, and we will share our money in the marriage.

 

WHY are you even considering marrying this woman!?!?!

 

I can guarantee that she will not ever pay back her Ex. She is sponging off him and for some reason, he is letting her.

 

This situation has catastrophe written all over it and you are walking in, face forward. :eek:

[rester]

It's not a nuclear situation. It is insurance.

 

 

However some people like your GF & rester view it as a bad thing. They say if you get a prenup you are already thinking about breaking up. That is the same as a saying if you get car insurance you are thinking about getting in an accident or if you buy travel insurance you are jinxing your vacation.

 

I wasn't saying that at all, and have nothing against prenups whatsoever. I don't view them as a 'bad thing'. I agree with you, that they are insurance.

 

What I was suggesting was to look at other options that his girlfriend may be more agreeable to, such as separating assets.

 

If a prenup is his best option, than I am all for it.

[rester]

And I agree with all of these responses, too. Borrowing money from her ex??

 

There are issues here that far surpass the 'prenup or no prenup' question.

 

 

Dude, I don't think you have any idea how much of a HUGE red flag this is. She doesn't get what she wants financially from you so she asks another guy?

 

 

What happens when you get married and she doesn't get what she wants from you sexually? romantically? conversationally?

 

 

This is what you can expect in the marriage.

 

Whoa. I clearly missed the section NTV quoted.

 

 

Ironpony forget the prenup. You can't marry a woman who is still emotionally & financial entwined with her EX. By running to an EX for help, she is showing you that she is not committed to you and is clearly not ready to "forsake all others". Get that addressed before you waste money on a ring or a lawyer.

 

WHY are you even considering marrying this woman!?!?!

 

I can guarantee that she will not ever pay back her Ex. She is sponging off him and for some reason, he is letting her.

 

This situation has catastrophe written all over it and you are walking in, face forward. :eek:

[ironpony]

Okay thanks. I can see if separating assets is a good idea as well. It's just I need to make a decision with her real soon, and will not have time to speak to an attorney likely, since I cannot get appointments till next week. The more I postpone making a decision, the more harsher she reacts and becomes more heartbroken at the thought of a possible prenup.

[bathtub-row]

Pre-nup or not, you had better have a bank account in your name only, even after you're married. If this woman can't pay her bills and handle her own money, she could possibly ruin you financially if she has any control. Don't ever let her have control over the finances.

 

I hate to point this out again but I really don't like the way she's manipulating you on this issue. It's a red flag if you ask me. She's no whizz with money, has to borrow from others, and yet digs her heels in about a pre-nup. None of this bodes well for your future. But she seems to have you completely wrapped around her finger. If I were you, I'd insist on a pre-nup. No if, ands or buts. You need to act like a decisive man and either gain her respect or lose her. it's altogether possible that she only marrying you for your money. Now wouldn't you feel the fool if that were the case and you didn't insist on protecting your assets?

 

I say stop stalling, stop giving into her childish behavior and let her know this is how it's going to be. If she doesn't like it, tell her bye.

[NTV]

The more I postpone making a decision, the more harsher she reacts and becomes more heartbroken at the thought of a possible prenup.

 

 

 

Dude, is she an adult? Is she at the mercy of her own emotions? Are you? Do you not see the manipulation?

 

 

When did you learn to control your emotions? 8 years old? 9?

 

 

You don't need to just postpone the postnup decision right now, you need to cancel any wedding plans until/if this get's sorted out.

 

 

I would bet that if you took money out of the relationship equation with her, she would either abruptly end the relationship or put it on the backburner while she looked for another man to replace you.

 

 

Of course this is just my opinion. You are going to do what you want to do. But I do think that you're here asking us these questions because you see red flags and want to make sure. I'm confirming for you that you are right. These are real major red flags that you should have major concerns over.

 

 

Like relationship ending concerns. It sounds like you're about to step onto a pile of dog poo, and even though I don't know you from anyone one else on this website and only recently joined, I'm concerned for you.

 

 

If you have family, run this by your family. Your friends. Not just the prenup thing. The money thing. The emotional thing. Please don't let yourself get taken advantage of here.

[elaine567]

Just read a snippet of your other thread and I see she is 39 and you are 31 and in your first proper relationship.

DO NOT and I repeat DO NOT marry this woman without a very tight prenup. You are ripe for being exploited here. I was prepared to give her the benefit of the doubt, but the ex being involved and her having loans from him, puts a different perspective on it, as well as your own inexperience in dating.

YOU could lose the lot here, do allow yourself to be manipulated any further.

YOU are only 31 you do not need to marry the first person that comes along, next time look for a woman who is in your own league financially, and can manage her money without any help from an ex.

[bathtub-row]

Just read a snippet of your other thread and I see she is 39 and you are 31 and in your first proper relationship.

DO NOT and I repeat DO NOT marry this woman without a very tight prenup. You are ripe for being exploited here. I was prepared to give her the benefit of the doubt, but the ex being involved and her having loans from him, puts a different perspective on it, as well as your own inexperience in dating.

YOU could lose the lot here, do allow yourself to be manipulated any further.

YOU are only 31 you do not need to marry the first person that comes along, next time look for a woman who is in your own league financially, and can manage her money without any help from an ex.

 

39?? I thought she was 18 from the way she's acting. Holy smokes.

[BettyDraper]

Okay thanks. Well I don't have time to actually see a lawyer, cause my appointment is not until next week and I think she will not give me past this weekend now, to make to say no to a prenup, but I will see if I can.

 

If I have been kind of cheap with money about her, than I will not be. Sometimes I tend to get defensive with it towards her, since he reaction to the prenup, and has been borrowing a lot of money from her ex lately, since I haven't been helping pay her bills as much. I pay to an extent but I do not give her everything she asks for, so her borrowing from her ex, and her reaction to the prenup has caused me to become defensive, but I will watch for that, and we will share our money in the marriage.

 

Your girlfriend seems very irresponsible about money and she clearly believes that men should always bail her out of her self inflicted financial problems. If this isn't a giant blood red flag, I don't know what other signs you need that your girlfriend is not mature enough for marriage.

 

Borrowing from her ex while being in a serious relationship is disrespectful to you and only keeps your girlfriend in contact with her ex as well as indebted to him. Doesn't this bother you at all?

[BettyDraper]

Yes you're right, I should believe in marriage that way. You say I am not ready for marriage but is that a bad thing? Should I give up on the best gf I have had, and the one I love, just because of unreadiness? A lot of people, say they lost their best significant other, cause they were not ready.

 

The way I grew up is, if you wait till you are ready, you will miss opportunities. I wasn't ready for high school but still went. Wasn't ready for certain jobs, but still took them. I have been raised to grab the bull by the horns, so to speak, otherwise I miss out on chances of lifetimes.

 

Marriage is a decision that will affect you for your entire life whether it works out or not. Of course you should be ready emotionally and financially for such a monumental commitment!

 

What I'm seeing is a very serious incompatibility about money and how it is shared in a marriage. You are expecting more of a roommate situation when it comes to finances whereas your girlfriend wants a man who is going to take care of her and be very generous. Couples need to be on the same page about pertinent issues such as finances and sex. Those are issues that often tear couples apart. Just because a woman makes a great girlfriend, it doesn't mean that she is wife material. You would likely be better off with a woman who has her own money and doesn't mind splitting everything down the middle. Be warned that most women will be turned off by that approach to finances no matter how much money they have.

 

As much as I believe that her attitude is overly fanciful and juvenile, it also appears that you are not prepared to share your assets in a marriage. If you are paying for a wedding, expecting your wife to pay you back as if you are a bank is cold. A wedding is a gift to both of you and your families if they are involved.

[dreamingoftigers]

Just read a snippet of your other thread and I see she is 39 and you are 31 and in your first proper relationship.

DO NOT and I repeat DO NOT marry this woman without a very tight prenup. You are ripe for being exploited here. I was prepared to give her the benefit of the doubt, but the ex being involved and her having loans from him, puts a different perspective on it, as well as your own inexperience in dating.

YOU could lose the lot here, do allow yourself to be manipulated any further.

YOU are only 31 you do not need to marry the first person that comes along, next time look for a woman who is in your own league financially, and can manage her money without any help from an ex.

 

Geesh. I thought she was young as well. I could've understood it. I would have thought when I was younger that it would be somewhat insulting not to be given a blank cheque on trust and assets.

 

But at 39?

 

That seems to be too out-of-balance.

[NTV]

How are things going with you man?