MrsBilliethekid Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 Hi, Perhaps if I can convince someone here, then maybe I can convince myself...... I'm 4 months into an affair with a MM. I'm separated from my H, who is a narcissist, therefore it's a very nasty split.....he knows about MM but not that he's still married....he's been threatening to tell his wife (even though he believes they're separated) and I kinda wish he would but that would be for my own selfish reasons....anyway, he's been in contact with MM, threatening him etc so it is a very highly charged situation. So, onto MM and BW......he says his marriage is over and has been for a long time, they'e split a couple of times before, even to the point of serving divorce papers, and then got back together. He said he can't give her what she wants and it's only a matter of time before she kicks him out again. He said it's always been him who's tried to patch things up with her but the next time she does it, he won't. They already pretty much live apart, he works near to me, 400 miles away from where they live, he only goes back every 3 or 4 weeks for an overnight stay (except holidays ugh) mainly to see their 11yo, he's in touch with me the whole time he's there so he can't really be paying much attention to her. All this history is pretty much backed up from my investigations on facbook and otehr social forums, so I do not doubt his account.2 or 3 years ago on facebook, the posts between him and his wife were all 'love you xxx' etc, now you would never know from her profile that she was married, she never comments on his stuff and if she does it's just to criticise and recently she has unfriended him and removed her tag from any of his photos. He said he also knows she was on POF last year...... As far as I go, he says he's never felt about anyone the way he feels about me.....he wants us to be together, we've even started looking at houses together, he's met my children and talks about having a full parenting role in their lives when we're together.... However, other than taking some stuff to the dump for me, it's all pretty much talk so far......I am head over heels in love with him but I am terrified that I'll just be another statistic....he says 'trust me please, hang in there, we will be together, I can't live without you' etc, all the things I want to hear....... ATM he's in the middle east on business, when he's away I start to question the relationship and decide to call it off and tell him when he's free to come back to me.......then of course when I see him I fall in love all over again....... OMG, am I wasting my time? xx Link to post Share on other sites
Author MrsBilliethekid Posted April 13, 2016 Author Share Posted April 13, 2016 Oh and the reason he won't leave her is because he says she is mental torture........the times they've split before she gets her friends and family to text him and phone him and is generally just horrible. He wants her to do it so that she never knows about me cos he said if she finds out about me she'll give me a hard time too (400 miles away, what's the worst she can do?), I think he's concerned about his pension too. I never meant this to happen........my exH cheated on my twice, the first time I thought I might die from the pain......the second time it gave me evidence to throw his sorry ass out, I felt like thanking the OW......... Link to post Share on other sites
Ms. Faust Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 I couldn't say for sure if you are wasting your time. It can go either way, I suppose. But this stuck out to me: he's met my children and talks about having a full parenting role in their lives when we're together.... My first thought: How is he going to be a full time parent to your kids when he is not even a full time parent to his own kid? He spends the majority of his time 400 miles away from his kid... and then when he is with his kid he spends all his time talking to YOU. So effectively what you are saying is that his (and your) current plans are for him to permanently move 400 miles away from his kid to help raise yours. So when is dad of the year planning on leaving his wife? 8 Link to post Share on other sites
heartwhole Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 I'm trying to understand this clearly. Everything about his marital situation sounds pretty bleak/over and done with, except his insistence that he can't be the one to initiate a divorce. I would guess that he is conflict-avoidant like many people in affairs. Are you in IC? Having been married to a narcissist is no walk in the park, and I'm sure you are afraid of repeating any negative dynamics in a new relationship. It would be good to have an objective third party's opinion on MM beyond what we can give you. Personally, I'd want a solid plan on when he is leaving and divorcing before making any future plans or getting my hopes up. And keep in mind, if you have a future with him, the conflict-avoidance will be all yours to navigate . . . 3 Link to post Share on other sites
anika99 Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 Do you love drama? Why are you inviting this kind of drama into your life and the lives of your children? Don't you think going through having a narcissistic father and a nasty divorce is enough for them? Now you have brought a cheating married man into their lives? Where are your standards when it comes to choosing a husband and stepfather for your kids? This guy lies and cheats, is rarely home and when he does visit his son he ignores him so he can spend his time communicating with you. He is a lousy husband and a lousy father and this is the man you have decided your kids need. Between this man, yourself and your kids, who do you love the most? If it's your kids then you won't spend even another minute with this ridiculous laughable man who has pretty much abandoned his marriage and his own child to travel and cheat yet claims he needs permission to divorce. Oh please. 5 Link to post Share on other sites
carhill Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 If the guy doesn't love his wife anymore (unknown since we can't read minds), the top three reasons he'll stay are: 1. Kids - big one 2. Assets - his life's work is at risk 3. Convenience - men like familiarity and a stable home base for all their risk-taking in life You mentioned two of the big three....his child and his pension. Save for the current spouse being in the picture, his life will continue as currently experienced. He'll be co-parenting for another decade or so and will be in contact with his exW, should they divorce, off and on for life since they share a son. His work life and travel will continue. I recall one MW I met early on. She was back and forth with her H many times. Met her in 1984. They divorced in 2000. Like a dope I hung in until '92 or so, thinking each separation would be the last. Heh. Comparatively, you've apparently been involved four months and, yeah, each person is different. Conventional wisdom on these forums indicates, if in affairs, men tend to stay with their wives and women tend to leave their husbands. Now, I personally haven't seen that with MW's but perhaps that underscores how each person is an individual. If this guy is outlier to CW here, then he'll file for divorce. That'll be your sign. If you want to wait around, OK. If you do, IMO accept that a divorce may never happen and continue to date other men. Yeah, I know that can be hard. It helps though, in more ways than one. Link to post Share on other sites
Minnie09 Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 Do you love drama? Why are you inviting this kind of drama into your life and the lives of your children? Don't you think going through having a narcissistic father and a nasty divorce is enough for them? Now you have brought a cheating married man into their lives? Where are your standards when it comes to choosing a husband and stepfather for your kids? This guy lies and cheats, is rarely home and when he does visit his son he ignores him so he can spend his time communicating with you. He is a lousy husband and a lousy father and this is the man you have decided your kids need. Between this man, yourself and your kids, who do you love the most? If it's your kids then you won't spend even another minute with this ridiculous laughable man who has pretty much abandoned his marriage and his own child to travel and cheat yet claims he needs permission to divorce. Oh please. He WORKS away from home, it's not like he leaves the family to go on fun trips. Either way, long-distance marriages like that (due to work and sometimes for other reasons) are a lot more at risk than "conventional" marriages. Add the physical distance to the problems they've already had before, which may be a reason why he decided to work away from home in the first place - doesn't look good for the M in my opinion. The OP is physically and emotionally closer to him than his own wife, and they seem to spend a lot of time together, which will distance him further from his M. At some point living two lives will be too exhausting for him, and he'll have to decide which path to hit. This could take forever or happen quickly. Depends on the MM. It's only been 4 months between op and mm, so it's not like she's been waiting around for years. A divorce takes time, and yes - he has the child to consider, but it doesn't look like he's much involved in his M - and tbh, his BW sounds like she' isn't, either. Link to post Share on other sites
WasOtherWoman Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 If he loves you and wants to be with you, he will get a divorce. I know everyone tries to overcomplicate it, but that is the truth. Not suggesting that divorce is not complicated, it can be, but it is certainly doable if it is what one wants. That said, to find out whether you are wasting your time or not... ask him directly. 1) Are you leaving? 2) What exactly needs to take place before you leave? If you find the answers to those questions acceptable to you, then sit back and watch his actions and progress. If he really is leaving, he will want to PROVE to you that he is, and will not only take action, but keep you apprised of the progress of such. Otherwise, he runs the risk that you will meet someone else while he is waffling around at home. If he truly loves you, he will not want to take that risk. I would not be waiting unless i knew EXACTLY what I was waiting for and the timetable in which it would happen. Anything other than that is just not smart, in my humble opinion. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
carhill Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 OP, something else to consider, accepting you're separated and apparently your differences with your H are irreconcilable...... the longer you remain in this milieu, a limbo of sorts, the more opportunities for a relationship with a healthy and available life partner will pass you by. If you're done with your H, get a D, go through the 'nasty split', recover and then see where this MM is and where your other life priorities are. You may find a completely different perspective. Personally, I found divorce to be a life-refresher and, combined with finishing business with a past affair partner, it changed my whole outlook on relationships and my role in them. Life tends to work like that. We make plans and then it happens. Hard to know for sure what tomorrow will bring. Make today count. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Author MrsBilliethekid Posted April 13, 2016 Author Share Posted April 13, 2016 Thank you for all the replies, some of them made hard reading........ Yes, he is 400 miles away because of his work, his job is very specialised and he went where the work was, this was 4 years ago. He wanted his wife and son (and 2 step children from her previous marriage) to relocate with him but she refused. She won't even come up for school holidays, despite the fact she doesn't work and has nothing stopping her. Although she did for her first husband which grates on MM.....he's a good dad, yes I guess he has been somewhat vacant the past 4 months but previous to that, everytime he was there he spent practically the whole time with his son, his fb is full of photos of him and his son on trips here, there and everywhere and none of her cos she would refuse to go. I have asked him if he'll leave and I usually get a woolly reply about trusting him to do it his way, that it will happen, that she'll get fed up and throw him out again (she wants him to give up his job, move back, give up all his hobbies and just sit in with her watching telly every night (him and I have the same interests so more common ground and we can share his interests))......he just says 'soon'....... He is the most perfect man, everything my exH is not......perfect except for the wife........we are both on our secnd marriages, he has 2 sons from his first marriage who hate his wife, his parents hate his wife, his MIL hates him....it really is toxic but he needs to grow a pair and do what needs to be done.............he said the last split was so traumatic he ended up in counselling and he can't go through that again.......but he's happy enough to continue to put me through the torture of the weekends he does go down there....and obviously the fact I have to lie to all my friends and family and say he's separated............ I have a ;lot to think about xx Link to post Share on other sites
Minnie09 Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 Yeah that's bs. If everybody hates everybody in this family then he should just make a final decision and end it. I'm sure he's worried about his boy, but a lawyer can set up a visitation schedule and shared parenting and whatnot. That shouldn't be an issue esp if his current family life is THAT bad. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
sandylee1 Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 What I don't understand... is why she would text friends and family to be nasty to him when she was the one who threw him out. That doesn't seem to make sense to me. I guess if he really wants her to kick him out he could push her buttons or he could confront her about being on POF. He certainly has enough reason to leave if he wanted to ... but it seems like he wants to be the good guy and not be the one to pull the plug on the marriage. I don't know in what capacity he's met your kids ... but after 4 months? Sounds a little premature and isn't your children's father the person to parent with? 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Author MrsBilliethekid Posted April 13, 2016 Author Share Posted April 13, 2016 OP, something else to consider, accepting you're separated and apparently your differences with your H are irreconcilable...... the longer you remain in this milieu, a limbo of sorts, the more opportunities for a relationship with a healthy and available life partner will pass you by. If you're done with your H, get a D, go through the 'nasty split', recover and then see where this MM is and where your other life priorities are. You may find a completely different perspective. Personally, I found divorce to be a life-refresher and, combined with finishing business with a past affair partner, it changed my whole outlook on relationships and my role in them. Life tends to work like that. We make plans and then it happens. Hard to know for sure what tomorrow will bring. Make today count. That all makes perfect sense. As soon as we've been separated 2 years (which happens next month) my lawyer is instructed to serve divorce papers. He has already told me he refuses to sign anything, won't read anything, instead he just tries to poison everyone against me. He doesn't actually realise that by doing nothing the divorce will simply be granted.......so yes....I may feel differently when I'm a divorcee.......Ive had mm come onto me before and always told them to get lost.......this guy was just so wonderful, he's also the first man I've been with since splitting with my ex so perhaps I was vulnerable to bs........... Link to post Share on other sites
Author MrsBilliethekid Posted April 13, 2016 Author Share Posted April 13, 2016 Yeah that's bs. If everybody hates everybody in this family then he should just make a final decision and end it. I'm sure he's worried about his boy, but a lawyer can set up a visitation schedule and shared parenting and whatnot. That shouldn't be an issue esp if his current family life is THAT bad. Yes, I think it's only bearable because he's there so seldom....so I'm torn between not wanting him to go and also wanting him to go so they can annoy each other iyswim.......I'm so conflicted....... Link to post Share on other sites
Author MrsBilliethekid Posted April 13, 2016 Author Share Posted April 13, 2016 What I don't understand... is why she would text friends and family to be nasty to him when she was the one who threw him out. That doesn't seem to make sense to me. I guess if he really wants her to kick him out he could push her buttons or he could confront her about being on POF. He certainly has enough reason to leave if he wanted to ... but it seems like he wants to be the good guy and not be the one to pull the plug on the marriage. I don't know in what capacity he's met your kids ... but after 4 months? Sounds a little premature and isn't your children's father the person to parent with? Because she's nuts. She actually messaged me nearly a year ago asking if I was having an affair with him, at that point we'd only met the once through a shared interest and although we were friends on fb there had been no other contact........so when he says she's always accusing him of having affairs, I know there's some truth to that. Apparently she walked in on her first husband in bed with someone else and expects him to do the same........well I guess her expectations have come to fruition...... He's met my kids once or twice, just casual and briefly. My ex is not capable of co-parenting, he's messed up, drinks too much, smokes to much, doesnt work and leads a very chaotic lifestyle, he sees the kids for a cople of hours at a time and no overnight stays, I couldn't trust him to look after them properly, plus I'm still breastfeeding my 2yo (who was only 6 months when we split) x Link to post Share on other sites
carhill Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 That all makes perfect sense. As soon as we've been separated 2 years (which happens next month) my lawyer is instructed to serve divorce papers. Wow, mandatory two year separation. Man, that can be tedious. I'd have that calendar out and be crossing the days off. Good to read that default judgments are part of your jurisdiction too. We have them here in California and, if no response to the petition filed with the court in 30 days, the petitioner can file for a default judgment on the original lawsuit terms. If things work kinda like that for you, how the filing is crafted can make a big difference if it goes to default. Hope your solicitor does well! Yeah, if one feels like they've been idling along for awhile, it's nice and invigorating to rev the old engine up again. Makes one feel alive and vital. Perhaps, in that vein, this has been productive use of time and not a waste, in that you identified emotions which are valuable to you and you can prioritize moving forward. Link to post Share on other sites
anika99 Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 He WORKS away from home, it's not like he leaves the family to go on fun trips. Either way, long-distance marriages like that (due to work and sometimes for other reasons) are a lot more at risk than "conventional" marriages. Add the physical distance to the problems they've already had before, which may be a reason why he decided to work away from home in the first place - doesn't look good for the M in my opinion. The OP is physically and emotionally closer to him than his own wife, and they seem to spend a lot of time together, which will distance him further from his M. At some point living two lives will be too exhausting for him, and he'll have to decide which path to hit. This could take forever or happen quickly. Depends on the MM. It's only been 4 months between op and mm, so it's not like she's been waiting around for years. A divorce takes time, and yes - he has the child to consider, but it doesn't look like he's much involved in his M - and tbh, his BW sounds like she' isn't, either. Yes she has only known the MM for 4 months and that's all the more reason why she should end it now. How much more should she invest of herself and her children into this MM? Yes divorces take time and they take forever when the MM doesn't even have a plan to divorce. Remember his plan is to wait for the BW to kick him out? Does that sound like a divorcing man to you? We don't know anything about the BW or how she feels about her marriage. The OP is just regurgitating whatever the MM tells her. Link to post Share on other sites
anika99 Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 Because she's nuts. She actually messaged me nearly a year ago asking if I was having an affair with him, at that point we'd only met the once through a shared interest and although we were friends on fb there had been no other contact........so when he says she's always accusing him of having affairs, I know there's some truth to that. Apparently she walked in on her first husband in bed with someone else and expects him to do the same........well I guess her expectations have come to fruition...... He's met my kids once or twice, just casual and briefly. My ex is not capable of co-parenting, he's messed up, drinks too much, smokes to much, doesnt work and leads a very chaotic lifestyle, he sees the kids for a cople of hours at a time and no overnight stays, I couldn't trust him to look after them properly, plus I'm still breastfeeding my 2yo (who was only 6 months when we split) x There is a high probability that he has cheated on her before and that is why she is quick to accuse him. I actually thought by reading your first post that he sounded like a practiced serial cheater. You say he is a perfect man. That alone indicates that you are not thinking rationally. Nobody is perfect and you know so little about him. You know him only the context of your life and only for 4 months. I really think he has had multiple affairs and you won't be his last. He has his shtick down perfectly. He knows just what he has to say to get women to agree to sleep with him while he stays married. I say enjoy your affair for however long it last but prepare for the end and keep your children away from him 4 Link to post Share on other sites
Author MrsBilliethekid Posted April 13, 2016 Author Share Posted April 13, 2016 There is a high probability that he has cheated on her before and that is why she is quick to accuse him. I actually thought by reading your first post that he sounded like a practiced serial cheater. You say he is a perfect man. That alone indicates that you are not thinking rationally. Nobody is perfect and you know so little about him. You know him only the context of your life and only for 4 months. I really think he has had multiple affairs and you won't be his last. He has his shtick down perfectly. He knows just what he has to say to get women to agree to sleep with him while he stays married. I say enjoy your affair for however long it last but prepare for the end and keep your children away from him Gulp........this thought has crossed my mind...... 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author MrsBilliethekid Posted April 13, 2016 Author Share Posted April 13, 2016 It would be good to have an objective third party's opinion on MM beyond what we can give you. We have a friend in common, who doesn't know about the affair, I have considered speaking to him.......as he is actually the only person that I know who knows MM..................should I do it? Link to post Share on other sites
Ms. Faust Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 It crossed my mind that maybe he cheated with his current wife. Link to post Share on other sites
elaine567 Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 We have a friend in common, who doesn't know about the affair, I have considered speaking to him.......as he is actually the only person that I know who knows MM..................should I do it? Why? ....... Link to post Share on other sites
Author MrsBilliethekid Posted April 13, 2016 Author Share Posted April 13, 2016 It crossed my mind that maybe he cheated with his current wife. There was def a gap, he told me about someone he went out with inbetween. That is a question I haven't asked him though......why his first marriage failed. Gee, the odds are terrible really. My first marriage ended because I was having an affair....the OM finsihed with me and I was so upset I left my husband in the hope of getting OM back.....I didn't......then I met exH who was messily ending a relationship, but wasn't quite ended....anyway, he cheated on me twice which I thought was punishment for what I did to my first H....what a mess! Why? ....... 3rd party opinion........he knows him relatively well, he would be able to tell me if there was any history I should know about.....and probably corroberate his version of events with regards to his wife. Link to post Share on other sites
Ms. Faust Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 Ahhh... Well, not being rude, but I don't think it matters at this point whether he leaves or not. If you or if you don't end up with him if your relationship goes long enough one of you will cheat. Your coping mechanism is to cheat... And he does sound like someone who has been down this path before. We see a lot of this, OW/M pondering and mulling over the affair when they should be looking inward wondering how they allow these situations to happen. 6 Link to post Share on other sites
Author MrsBilliethekid Posted April 13, 2016 Author Share Posted April 13, 2016 Ahhh... Well, not being rude, but I don't think it matters at this point whether he leaves or not. If you or if you don't end up with him if your relationship goes long enough one of you will cheat. Your coping mechanism is to cheat... And he does sound like someone who has been down this path before. We see a lot of this, OW/M pondering and mulling over the affair when they should be looking inward wondering how they allow these situations to happen. Mine was but that was a long time ago and I was very young then. I never, nor was even tempted to, cheat on my 2nd husband.....I was too busy dealing with his philandering ways. My days of 'cheating on' are over....but clearly not being 'party to'........anyway, as I say, he's in the middle east atm on business and I've had 2 messages from him today, I know he's busy, but 2 messages.......perhaps I'm not so far up his list of priorities as I would like to believe. Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts