Trouble is around the corner

[frogss29]

You mentioned you never had a male role figure.........but you did, sort of.

You had how "NOT to behave".

Your father is a perfect role model of how NOT to behave.

But you are following in exactly his footsteps.

You saw first hand how difficult it was for your mother.

Ask HER what you should do.

[LadyIrish]

Aside from your finances, why do you remain married to your wife?

[wmacbride]

When you get right down to it, your wife is a woman you once loved, who still treats you well, and who, from what you say, is a pretty decent person.

 

Does she deserve this kind of treatment?

 

If you ever loved her, or if you feel that, as a human being, she deserves the honesty f knowing what is going on in her life, then talk to her. Tell her how you feel and what you have been doing.

 

That can be a frightening prospect, as you don't know the outcome, but I guarantee you it will be far better if she hears the truth from you rathe than finding it out for herself or hearing it from the ow.

 

btw, underneath all the 'money, money, money" talk, I get the impression that you are, at heart, not a bad guy. you are just sort of lost and used to seeing yourself a certain way. Right now you need to listen to the "honest and decent" side of you that knows what the right thing to do is. That way, no matter what happens, you will have acted honorably.Even though you pretend not to value that, I really get the sense that you do more than you realize.

[FlyingHighAndLow]

Further down the rabbit hole, from bad to worse... More on it below.

 

- Tell everything to W - I don't think I will ever have guts to do that knowing what possibly lies ahead, see my initial post. A spineless slug, I know.

- Why staying married - Described it several times already, in short life style, comfort, habit and fear to loose it all.

- Cut it with OW - I don't think I'm able to, at this point I must admit that I want her in my life one way or another.

 

So we progressed to something that looks like full-blown dates and its getting really hard to justify it under work or friendship category, I probably still keep fooling myself somehow.

Basically we sneaked away from work to attend some event then she took me to a nice restaurant in the waterfront area to have lunch out, we had great time together laughing and talking about everything, you know all that "soulmates" thing people keep talking about once they fall into an affair. We both drank, moderately of course, which is still not my idea of a proper working week lunch.

Also did stupid things like overtipping a waiter and not paying for parking having agreed to split the ticket cost should she get get caught. She seemed to be so happy with me smiling and giggling all the time, I guess I looked like an idiot myself as well - thinking more of it, probably it has some merit as in the office environment she's more of an Ice Queen type woman so none of the colleagues is guessing what kind of mess we are dragging ourselves into...

The whole setting was kinda bizarre, as we were the only customers in the restaurant at this hour - that's more of a dinner place as people normally don't shell out such money on week lunches.

Didn't kiss - just some pats and held hands for a little while. OW paid the bill.

 

I'm not sure how do I call her after that, my girlfriend or something? Also no idea how all that aligns in her head, maybe she is flattered to have 2 bfs.

At the moment I find myself in a state of emotional disarray, trying to hold it all together started to drink every evening and also churning through a lot of music, not a happy place to be, not at all...

Saying that, the highs one gets are incredible, beats any drugs I guess. The same for the lows, a crazy emotional roller coaster.

No idea how I get off it, it's really getting worse every hour.

[wmacbride]

Further down the rabbit hole, from bad to worse... More on it below.

 

- Tell everything to W - I don't think I will ever have guts to do that knowing what possibly lies ahead, see my initial post. A spineless slug, I know.

- Why staying married - Described it several times already, in short life style, comfort, habit and fear to loose it all.

- Cut it with OW - I don't think I'm able to, at this point I must admit that I want her in my life one way or another.

 

So we progressed to something that looks like full-blown dates and its getting really hard to justify it under work or friendship category, I probably still keep fooling myself somehow.

Basically we sneaked away from work to attend some event then she took me to a nice restaurant in the waterfront area to have lunch out, we had great time together laughing and talking about everything, you know all that "soulmates" thing people keep talking about once they fall into an affair. We both drank, moderately of course, which is still not my idea of a proper working week lunch.

Also did stupid things like overtipping a waiter and not paying for parking having agreed to split the ticket cost should she get get caught. She seemed to be so happy with me smiling and giggling all the time, I guess I looked like an idiot myself as well - thinking more of it, probably it has some merit as in the office environment she's more of an Ice Queen type woman so none of the colleagues is guessing what kind of mess we are dragging ourselves into...

The whole setting was kinda bizarre, as we were the only customers in the restaurant at this hour - that's more of a dinner place as people normally don't shell out such money on week lunches.

Didn't kiss - just some pats and held hands for a little while. OW paid the bill.

 

I'm not sure how do I call her after that, my girlfriend or something? Also no idea how all that aligns in her head, maybe she is flattered to have 2 bfs.

At the moment I find myself in a state of emotional disarray, trying to hold it all together started to drink every evening and also churning through a lot of music, not a happy place to be, not at all...

Saying that, the highs one gets are incredible, beats any drugs I guess. The same for the lows, a crazy emotional roller coaster.

No idea how I get off it, it's really getting worse every hour.

 

As a former bs, it can remember how it felt to find out my h was having an A. It was as if someone had punched me in the stomach and I couldn't stop crying or feeling sick. It was horrible.

 

Is your "high" really worth your wife's pain? Are you really the type of person to ask her to endure the full brunt of the pain of you A?

[FlyingHighAndLow]

Is your "high" really worth your wife's pain? Are you really the type of person to ask her to endure the full brunt of the pain of you A?

 

I don't want to hurt her, never would. But I don't seem to be able to stop it, as I want more of OW's time, laughter and herself eventually. That's a terrible thing to say, I realize it and at the same time I don't want to go for it and didn't, on a purely physical level at least.

Edited May 6, 2016 by FlyingHighAndLow

[summerdowling87]

Well since you can seem to stop yourself from seeing the OW and you don't want a divorce why not have an open marriage? Why not let you W have what you are having?

[deadparrot]

It seems like your desire to see more of this woman and continue this affair is stronger than your desire not to hurt your wife.

 

If that is indeed the case, you need to tell your wife. It'll almost certainly hurt her tremendously, but she deserves a chance to find someone who will stay faithful, assuming that a monogamous relationship is what she wants. An open marriage is also a possibility, but it's not a thing every couple can pull off.

[FlyingHighAndLow]

Well since you can seem to stop yourself from seeing the OW and you don't want a divorce why not have an open marriage? Why not let you W have what you are having?

 

Well, I've touched this topic already, see posts above - I tested my W's patience before but this time it's really bad as it seems that I got involved with OW deeply on the emotional level, just banging each other once in a while would have been so much easier.

Based on that, I anticipate a fair chance that telling the truth would lead to a messy divorce anyway plus battling for each acre in courts for months, such a perspective scares me off enough to become a coward and try to keep it under the carpet as long as I can.

[Mrs. John Adams]

I truly am sorry to hear that instead of feeling remorse for what you are doing... You feel more excitement.

 

You stand to lose everything.... Is she worth it? Is the rush worth it?

 

Be honest with yourself.., how would you feel if your wife was acting like you are?

 

You are making choices that will affect her life without asking her how she feels about it. Totally selfish and not fair.

 

But you won't stop.. You will screw this woman....

And it may be way more than your wife is willing to accept.

 

If you stop now... She may forgive you.

 

Make an appointment with a therapist and a lawyer because you are going to need them both

[FlyingHighAndLow]

Few more things:

c) leads to a) no matter what.

b) will be VERy, VERY difficult without support. At this point only freewill won't be enough to hold you back as this OW is also tempting you. Is just a questions of days to get in a)

 

To all of you that might find themselves in a similar situation, that's completely true per my own experience.

While trying to do c) for sometime I find myself almost in a), and that happens damn swiftly.

Another possibility is that I've been lying to myself that it's c) I'm doing while being actively engaged in a), I'm trying to be frank here so you decide.

[FlyingHighAndLow]

I truly am sorry to hear that instead of feeling remorse for what you are doing... You feel more excitement.

 

You stand to lose everything.... Is she worth it? Is the rush worth it?

 

Thanks for your thoughts, I feel kinda connected to you in a bit weird fashion after your first post in this thread as its clear to me that you have been through what you are talking about.

So yeah I do feel more excitement probably as the OW keeps winning over me in the same fashion I did in the beginning of this drama.

Honestly I do not know, I don't know who's worth what here as I think we are all bound to loose in one way or another.

After talking to few friends meanwhile I've learned more about her bf which is from a locally prominent family I heard of and have common acquintences with so oh yeah boy, that could be quite a sparkle should this becomes public knowledge and the s*t hits the fan. That said I (or we as the initiative is hers mostly as of recent) can't stop

[Mrs. John Adams]

Thanks for your thoughts, I feel kinda connected to you in a bit weird fashion after your first post in this thread as its clear to me that you have been through what you are talking about.

So yeah I do feel more excitement probably as the OW keeps winning over me in the same fashion I did in the beginning of this drama.

Honestly I do not know, I don't know who's worth what here as I think we are all bound to loose in one way or another.

After talking to few friends meanwhile I've learned more about her bf which is from a locally prominent family I heard of and have common acquintences with so oh yeah boy, that could be quite a sparkle should this becomes public knowledge and the s*t hits the fan. That said I (or we as the initiative is hers mostly as of recent) can't stop

 

No...you CAN stop....you don't WANT to stop. There is a huge difference.

 

You are playing with fire...and you will get burned.

 

You see...she has a boyfriend...you have a wife. You are both taking a huge risk...going out to eat...leaving work early...etc.

 

People will notice...talk will happen. Be prepared for your world to come crashing in...because it is only a matter of time.

 

Can I make a suggestion? Tell your mom. Talk to your mom about this....she will have your back and your best interest at heart and she will be honest with you. She will have wisdom....

 

You are so caught up in the excitement that you are not logical....you are taking so many risks....

 

Let me tell you something...straight from my heart. I have one regret in life....one thing that i would give anything to be able to go back and undo.

One afternoon in my 61 years...that changed my life forever.....I stabbed my husband in his heart and twisted the knife. You cannot undo that my friend...you can never make it go away.

 

Please don't do what i did...please don't make a bad decision that you will forever regret. Think long and hard about this....

 

You love your wife....and if you give her the chance...she would do anything to keep you from doing this.

 

I did not give my husband the chance.....I made the decision for him.

[LadyIrish]

Please tell your wife. She doesn't deserve what you are doing. None of the reasons you stay in this marriage were because you love her. Lifestyle, comfort, habit are not reasons to stay married to your wife. You stay married because you love them so much you couldn't possibly imagine the idea of being without them a single day. You stay married because you love them so much your heart literally aches when they leave the room and you're not quite the same until they walk back in. You stay married because the thought of spending the rest of your life making that person happy makes you feel like the luckiest person in the world. Do you feel that way about your wife?

 

I have been with my husband for 16 1/2 years. Married 10 years. We've had our ups and downs. But I can honestly tell you, when I hurt my husband, I am in deep pain. When I make my husband happy, I feel ALIVE! When my husband kisses the back of neck every morning before he leaves the bed, I still get butterflies in my stomach and shivers down my spine. That is what a loving marriage FEELS like.

 

Do you think this is something you can have with your wife? Are you willin to work for it? If not, you need to let her go. Don't deprive her of the chance to find real abiding love with a more worthy man.

Edited May 6, 2016 by LadyIrish

[FlyingHighAndLow]

You are playing with fire...and you will get burned.

You see...she has a boyfriend...you have a wife. You are both taking a huge risk...going out to eat...leaving work early...etc.

People will notice...talk will happen. Be prepared for your world to come crashing in...because it is only a matter of time.

 

Can I make a suggestion? Tell your mom. Talk to your mom about this....she will have your back and your best interest at heart and she will be honest with you. She will have wisdom....

 

You are so caught up in the excitement that you are not logical....you are taking so many risks....

 

Please don't do what i did...please don't make a bad decision that you will forever regret. Think long and hard about this....

 

I did not give my husband the chance.....I made the decision for him.

 

Thanks again my friend for your sober and hearty thoughts, let me answer below.

 

1. Yes, that's clear to me. The thing is that I can probably still think reasonably but I don't care about this ability of a sapient human being anymore, you see... Or worse I think but yet ignore the outcome, which fits one of the insanity definitions nicely - I think emotions still rule us all often, even such rational and calculating b*rds as myself. That's ironic

 

2. I wish I could but she left this world few years ago, I talk to her nevertheless in my dreams. I don't think she would like a person I became but what I heard her saying was to me be happy no matter what, so I take it she'd say get a divorce and go for the OW if you like her that much.

 

3. That's true. I don't think it's called a "risk" anymore, I chose the fire that will burn us all in the end. Will I regret? Who knows...

 

4. You are a much better (and kinder) person than I am, honestly. If I didn't work with the OW at least, all other things like marriage, bf and the rest stay the same I'd be dating her right away, so would she I guess.

 

5. I won't give her a chance because I lost it with the OW (I'm ashamed to say it aloud, but who cares anymore) and she is the only one for me at the moment I guess - that's gross and laughable but that's the way it is... I care for my wife but I can't give her this chance because in my heart she lost it already, no matter how unfair it is. And that's sad for both of us.

[FlyingHighAndLow]

I have been with my husband for 16 1/2 years. Married 10 years. We've had our ups and downs. But I can honestly tell you, when I hurt my husband, I am in deep pain. When I make my husband happy, I feel ALIVE! When my husband kisses the back of neck every morning before he leaves the bed, I still get butterflies in my stomach and shivers down my spine. That is what a loving marriage FEELS like.

Do you think this is something you can have with your wife? Are you willin to work for it?

 

I envy you in some sense. We had it but lost so many years ago.

[Mrs. John Adams]

Thanks again my friend for your sober and hearty thoughts, let me answer below.

 

1. Yes, that's clear to me. The thing is that I can probably still think reasonably but I don't care about this ability of a sapient human being anymore, you see... Or worse I think but yet ignore the outcome, which fits one of the insanity definitions nicely - I think emotions still rule us all often, even such rational and calculating b*rds as myself. That's ironic

 

2. I wish I could but she left this world few years ago, I talk to her nevertheless in my dreams. I don't think she would like a person I became but what I heard her saying was to me be happy no matter what, so I take it she'd say get a divorce and go for the OW if you like her that much.

 

3. That's true. I don't think it's called a "risk" anymore, I chose the fire that will burn us all in the end. Will I regret? Who knows...

 

4. You are a much better (and kinder) person than I am, honestly. If I didn't work with the OW at least, all other things like marriage, bf and the rest stay the same I'd be dating her right away, so would she I guess.

 

5. I won't give her a chance because I lost it with the OW (I'm ashamed to say it aloud, but who cares anymore) and she is the only one for me at the moment I guess - that's gross and laughable but that's the way it is... I care for my wife but I can't give her this chance because in my heart she lost it already, no matter how unfair it is. And that's sad for both of us.

 

ok if you feel this way then you need to visit your lawyer....and get all of your ducks in a row.

 

You need to ask your wife for a divorce

 

It is really that cut and dried. If you continue in the path you are on...you stand to lose a lot more by sneaking than if you are above board and honest.

 

I am not sure what you from from us here at loveshack. You have clearly already made up your mind to cheat....regardless of what is right...regardless of who you hurt.

 

in the end....you will hurt the person you love the most...you

[LadyIrish]

Thanks again my friend for your sober and hearty thoughts, let me answer below.

 

1. Yes, that's clear to me. The thing is that I can probably still think reasonably but I don't care about this ability of a sapient human being anymore, you see... Or worse I think but yet ignore the outcome, which fits one of the insanity definitions nicely - I think emotions still rule us all often, even such rational and calculating b*rds as myself. That's ironic

 

2. I wish I could but she left this world few years ago, I talk to her nevertheless in my dreams. I don't think she would like a person I became but what I heard her saying was to me be happy no matter what, so I take it she'd say get a divorce and go for the OW if you like her that much.

 

3. That's true. I don't think it's called a "risk" anymore, I chose the fire that will burn us all in the end. Will I regret? Who knows...

 

4. You are a much better (and kinder) person than I am, honestly. If I didn't work with the OW at least, all other things like marriage, bf and the rest stay the same I'd be dating her right away, so would she I guess.

 

5. I won't give her a chance because I lost it with the OW (I'm ashamed to say it aloud, but who cares anymore) and she is the only one for me at the moment I guess - that's gross and laughable but that's the way it is... I care for my wife but I can't give her this chance because in my heart she lost it already, no matter how unfair it is. And that's sad for both of us.

 

You need to muster up what ever care you have left for your wife and put your big boy pants on and suffer the financial consequences and end your marriage. It's the honorable thing left to do.

 

Here's another story for you. Even with all our love, I have fallen. In the months leading up to our wedding, I engaged in an emotional affair with another man. My husband (then fiancé) is the only and still the only man I've ever been with. This EA started out as flirting (we both worked in the same building) eventually led to texting and lunch one time. Then one day there was a make out session in the hall. It's not as extreme as other affairs I've read, but it was wrong nonetheless. I can't explain why I did it other than it was exciting to have another man's attention. But at the end of the day, I came clean to my husband. The hurt on his face - I'll never be able to unsee it. It completely knocked me out of whatever temporary insanity I had. I knew this man was the only one for me. I'm lucky that he still chose to marry me. We have a beautiful life, with amazing children. He has never been embittered by my indiscretion. He accepted me fully and loves me every day and I devote myself to loving him every day. I tell him every single day that I only have eyes for him. That I am his and have never been anyone else's.

 

Imagine telling your wife. Can you see the look on her face? Can you imagine the pain? If that doesn't wake you up and doesn't make you want to vomit at the thought that you caused that, then it's time to end it. There is nothing left to redeem and you owe her the respect to bow out of this marriage with what little integrity there is left to salvage.

[FlyingHighAndLow]

ok if you feel this way then you need to visit your lawyer....and get all of your ducks in a row.

 

You need to ask your wife for a divorce

 

I am not sure what you from from us here at loveshack. You have clearly already made up your mind to cheat....regardless of what is right...regardless of who you hurt.

 

in the end....you will hurt the person you love the most...you

 

1. I guess I will, probably our whole finances & legal team should get to work to figure what we could do...

Therapist - I'm more than old fashioned in this regard - if I can't sort my s*t out on my own I don't deserve any better.

2. I won't do this, unless it's really unevitable and the matters mentioned above are fully taken care of. As I told it already - yes I'm a coward and spineless slug but I will do it on my own terms and only if there is no other way to keep the things the way they are.

3. I have not until this very moment, but I guess you are right - with the picture I have in my head the only way is to go full speed with the OW, no matter what the costs are as well as my soothing lies. That is sad and I'm degrading fast as just a few days ago that was a rather very remote option. But yeah, I'll go for it - I'm sure it gonna be disastrous but I want her in my life therefore I'll get her there... I know she already is but I want more.

4. Maybe I'll become a better person then, pain could be a cleanser according to what I've heard.

 

To all of you who has doubts - do not do this.

For the rest - I'll try to post updates to show you the hell I've chosen.

I think I disappointed quiet some people around here, I'm sorry about it:(

[ShatteredLady]

So very many people find themselves where you are. They "Go for it". Then their wife either discovers the truth or they confess. It becomes very, very real.

 

Before you do something that you can NEVER take back please try to picture your wife completely destructing right before your eyes. I went into shock. I couldn't control my physical reaction. I was shaking, vomiting. There aren't words to describe it. I lost many cherished parts of myself, my innocence, my love story, my faith, my family.

 

It completely broke me & I will never be the same.

 

That's the agony that your W will endure. I know that this sounds cold...If you're finished with your marriage. If your true happiness is DEFINITELY with this OW then what needs to be done, needs to happen. Be kind. Have principles. Be truthful. Explain the cold, hard truth & divorce.

 

The reason why I told you to REALLY picture it is many, MANY people change their mind when they see the results of their actions & words. The bubble bursts. They realize that they just can't do it!

 

The fantasy lived on its own. The high, the lust, the stolen moments fade when they witness first hand the person they love disintegrate before them. The theory of being with someone that you have immense passion for vs not being married, being free to sink into the affair IS NOT THE SAME as destroying & loosing your lifetime love.

 

If you truly know that you can have this conversation with your wife & regardless of her reaction you will divorce "go for it".

 

The absolute TRAGEDY that so many live is inflicting this devastating, emotional carnage on your marriage & realizing it was a mistake.....then trying to fix it!

 

You are so very LUCKY. You are here BEFORE its turned into a PA. You're here BEFORE d-day.

 

As I wrote before, PLEASE KNOW YOURSELF!

[ShatteredLady]

I had the fortune/misfortune of reading message by message how my H preyed upon the OW. It's HORRIBLE! When I think about it I'm embarrassed to be associated with him.

 

They don't see it that way. It's a freakish mentality to really grasp. How can you care (& I do believe that my H sort of cared about her) & PLAN knowing that it's not 'clean', 'innocent', I don't have the vocabulary....I don't truly understand really....it's knowing that you're inflicting pain but not seeing it, not really. "She knows what she's getting into as well as I do" is the biggest lie.

[ShatteredLady]

4. Maybe I'll become a better person then, pain could be a cleanser according to what I've heard.

 

Your wife & OW will be far from improved or cleansed by the pain. They will be changed forever. Something very precious inside of them will be destroyed for ever.

[heartwhole]

I can't speak for your wife, but I can tell you without a doubt that I would not have given my low-empathy, high-selfishness husband a second chance had we not had kids. So "go for it" knowing that you are playing Russian Roulette with your marriage.

 

In the year since I learned about his affair, we have both worked on ourselves and our marriage, but his work has been significantly harder. I have worked on the minor things that he magnified into reasons to cheat on me -- not asking enough about his day, not doing enough things together due to my chronic illness. He has worked on a thousand things, and given up a thousand things. He has had to accept that almost every time he thought he wasn't getting enough, he actually wasn't giving enough.

 

It has been "empathy and selflessness boot camp" up in these parts. Before he scheduled "work meetings" (happy hours) at 5 p.m. whenever he felt like it, he planned numerous trips with his friends, he worked out most mornings, etc. It was just expected that I would step up and take care of the kids. Now he chooses about one or two things per week. The rest of the time, he puts me and the kids first.

 

Sounds fun, right? Sounds totally worth it, right? Just jump into the affair and deal with the marriage later. Hey, maybe you'll become a better person out of it! You might. But I would argue that it would be much easier to work on the marriage now, to work on being a better person now. There will always be women willing to sleep with you, willing to play along. The availability of this one woman is nothing earth-shattering. If you want to blow up your marriage, fine, but do it with your eyes open. You can't undo what you are about to do.

 

Despite the enormous effort my husband has put into learning how to put us first, despite the thousand ways he has tried to make the affair up to me, despite all his therapy and self-sacrifice, all I see when I look at him is the affair. I think about it 50 times a day. I suffer from a form of PTSD from it. Nearly every day I'm quiet, he asks what is wrong, and then he has to hug me and tell me I'm the only one for him. Multiple times a day he sends me loving text messages. Flowers, dates, trips, gifts . . . It's been over a year since his 5 month, long-distance affair. He has put 100x more effort into rebuilding our marriage than he did into destroying it. And yet, we are long way from putting this behind us. The wound still bleeds and oozes.

 

Most people who have poor enough boundaries, judgment, and coping skills to cheat will not then dig deep enough to practice the humility and empathy and selflessness needed to save their marriages.

 

Remember that your wife has a right to autonomy over her own body. You do not have a right to expose her sexually to this other woman without her knowledge or consent.

 

Honestly, it sounds to me like you and OW deserve each other. Just tell your wife before you run off to sleep with the great love of your life. Don't keep your wife as some kind of barely tolerable plan B because you don't want to lose a little cash. Lose the cash and the marriage, keep your self-respect, put this love of the ages to the test out in the open. Will that relationship make it? Probably not, but hey, you might surprise us.

[elaine567]

I am slightly concerned here and it is for you.

YOU are a man who has been seduced by a very ambitious and clever younger woman, who is in your top management team.

She is well aware of your less than ethical working practices and that you do "not pretty things for the money."

She is your subordinate.

YOU have laid yourself bare here and if she really is the "Ice Queen", then she may take you for all that you are worth. Sexual harassment charges may be the least of your concerns. She may blow up your marriage but she could also blackmail you or blow up your businesses.

As you say she is a liar and a cheater, she may be capable of anything.

She has kept you at arm's length sexually, so the bf may even be in on it.

Get your head out of that affair fog and get your business head back on.

Of course there may be part of you that wants to sabotage everything, you may need to consider that.

[wmacbride]

Oh wow! #3 paints a very clear picture of a predator. Gosh, that's downright frightening the way you typed it.

 

Do all (most) MM become this calculating in preying upon their chosen OW?

 

There is no difference here between the op and the ow. She is cheating on here fiance.

 

Both are predators and prey in this situation.