Thoughts on Neediness

[Wave Rider]

In all the dating advice I've read, the most universally condemned trait for both men and women, the trait that will kill attraction faster than anything else, is "neediness." Especially in men's dating advice as I've experienced it, anytime someone is struggling with dating, the universal cry from others is that "it's because you're too needy." The trouble is, I'm not exactly sure what neediness is, because the word is used in two distinctly differently ways:

 

Neediness 1: trying to win the approval of others by suppressing your own feelings, desires, and opinions.

 

Neediness 2: wanting more intimacy and closeness in the relationship than the other person wants.

 

One is about a desire for approval and the other is about a desire for intimacy, and people use them interchangeably, even though they're not the same.

 

I agree that suppressing one's own desires to get the approval of other people is unhealthy and can rightly be called "needy." I'm not so sure about the second one. In any relationship, one person is going to want more intimacy than the other, and one will be more interested in the relationship than the other. In all such situations, it seems that the lower-interest partner will experience the higher-interest partner as being needy. If I'm in a relationship with a woman, and she wants to see me once a week and I want to see her four times a week, she will experience me as being needy. If I want to hold hands in public, and she doesn't because she doesn't like PDA, she will experience me as being needy. Even if I approach a new woman and ask for her phone number, and she's not interested, the fact that I'm more interested than she is will cause her to experience me as being needy.

 

The desire for intimacy has been a problem in my past relationships. I wanted more intimacy, she wanted less. Even when I was direct in asking for what I wanted, my desire for more intimacy seemed to set off her internal alarms that I was being too needy.

 

So what is neediness? Is it needy to want more intimacy than your partner wants? What are your thoughts?

Edited May 6, 2016 by Wave Rider

[blackcat777]

Super insightful distinctions about the way the word is used... but...

 

In any relationship, one person is going to want more intimacy than the other, and one will be more interested in the relationship than the other.

Why do you assume this? It isn't always true.

 

Also, when you get to know a person, you learn their rhythm... As long as you're compatible - lifestyles and libidos - I'd say the differences in wanting intimacy have more to do with timing... when one is tired, busy, etc., then communicating and working together to balance those issues is all it takes.

[sunking101]

Plus one partner's behaviour can make the other feel insecure and consequently more needy. Some people can act needy by wanting to live in each other's pockets and being controlling etc, but simply loving the other more strongly and being more committed/devoted shouldn't be labelled as neediness.

[jen1447]

Neediness 1: trying to win the approval of others by suppressing your own feelings, desires, and opinions.

 

Neediness 2: wanting more intimacy and closeness in the relationship than the other person wants.

 

I don't think either definition is correct. Relationship neediness is just emotional vulnerability and insecurity and the attendant need to be reassured and cared for more than is normal in most social dynamics. That's why it tends to put a strain on and 'turn off' the presumed caregiver - it's in itself a show (often a dramatic one) of insecurity, and that's not attractive. Add to that that it's often a result of the other partner having pulled away to begin with and it can be sort of a fait accompli - partner A sees sth about partner B they don't like and starts to withdraw, causing partner B to feel unfulfilled and thus desire to have that fulfillment restored, or become "needy." Insecurity over why the attention was withdrawn compounds the need beyond what it normally was. The compounded need only reaffirms what partner A feels about what they don't like about partner B and causes resentment over the perceived weakness. B sees the resentment and becomes more defensive and needy, etc., etc. A eventually rejects B, B falls into neediness despair and withdrawal and so on.

[fitnessfan365]

Well the saying "absence makes the heart grow fonder" does exist for a reason. Attraction tends to be driven by mystery, excitement, longing, etc.. So when you latch onto someone and they don't have a chance to miss you, this explains why needy behavior is such a turn off. It's also human nature to take people/things for granted. So they don't often see the true value in something until they're faced with being away from it.

 

I also think that Jen makes a good point about insecurity. The two different types being why someone becomes needy, and the fear of being perceived as needy.

[LookAtThisPOst]

Being that I live in a smaller area, neediness and/or co-dependence go hand in hand.

 

Once people get married around here, they give up their social circles to be around each other and it's typically a mutually satisfying thing. Of course, they'll stop by to see their friends during the holidays, but that's typically it.

 

I know of this co-habitating couple been together 7 years...they keep posting sexually flirtatious crap on each other's pages. EVERYONE on their friends list can SEE this...and it's typically her boyfriend that's doing it.

 

Some would call him "Needy" because of it, but she's actually turned on.

 

He was amped it up even more when she spent the weekend with some girlfriends at the beach (yeah she actually did something without him for a change), but he was continually posting moreso when she was away, because after all she did have her smartphone with her. lol

 

She encourages his "neediness", but...she loves every minute of it...even after 7 years.

 

So it is REALLY "neediness" at all, since she encourages/enables it?

[Wave Rider]

Relationship neediness is just emotional vulnerability and insecurity and the attendant need to be reassured and cared for...

 

I would say that insecurity is different from neediness in that insecurity is more about seeking reassurance by asking for it or by trying to prove something, and it's motivated by fear of rejection. Neediness is trying to directly or indirectly get some need met. I know we're splitting hairs on definitions here, but I'm frustrated with the number of times in men's dating advice I've heard, "You're too needy, you're too needy, you're too needy..." so I want to figure it out.

 

... need to be reassured and cared for more than is normal in most social dynamics.

 

See, and that's what I'm talking about with Neediness 2: if she feels that my need for intimacy and caring is more than she's willing to give, she's going to perceive me as being needy, regardless of what is normally expected in society. It's about her perception of my needs, not so much some generally agreed-upon standard of care and intimacy.

 

This was very much at issue in my last two relationships, which were with women who were somewhat cold, distant, unaffectionate, and emotionally unavailable. When they withdrew from me, I let them have their way because I didn't want to be needy - or Neediness 2, wanting more intimacy in the relationship than they did. But other people (on another forum) have criticized this action for being Neediness 1, which is suppressing my own feelings and desires to get her approval so I could keep the relationship together. So if I had been direct with these women about wanting more intimacy in the relationship by asking for more time together or for more physical intimacy, they might have said I was being too needy, which is Neediness 2 above. But by giving in and letting them withdraw from me without standing up for myself, I was committing Neediness 1 by suppressing my own desires to please someone else. So either option I picked - letting her have her way, or standing up for myself - someone was going to criticize me for being too needy. That's where all this is coming form, and that's what I'm trying to figure out.

[Cinnamonstix]

I don't like the term "needy". You might be needy to one person and not needy enough to another. It's all relative. Relationships work best when you're with someone who has very similar needs, or whose needs complement what you're willing to give and vice versa.

[preraph]

I think in most instances neediness stems from deep insecurities and low self-esteem. One needy person I know and love, it came from her dad abandoning her as a child. Neediness can be very ugly because it's usually accompanied by jealousy, which again comes from insecurities and low self-esteem. I'm not condemning everyone who gets jealous, of course, because most of us have not had perfect lives and have some things we'd be better off without. But if you've ever met and talked to a person who is sure of themselves and not insecure and positive that whatever happens, they can deal with it and move on and find someone else or be just fine on their own, then you will understand the difference there.

 

Being afraid someone will leave when there is literally nothing you can do to prevent that or cheating if they really want to, is a miserable life. I've met a couple of really secure people, and they just left the door wide open. They knew they were good enough to attract any number of people and that if they person they were with didn't want to be there, then it wasn't the right match.

 

I'm just saying to think about that perspective.

 

Of course, some people want a person or people around more than others and nothing wrong with that. In fact, it can make for a good family life. But if you keep finding others perceive you as being at the extreme end of it, you have some underlying issues that you might want to deal with if you think you can't find happiness if you don't. Good luck.

[Popsicle]

I ignore everything that is said about neediness. I think it's all BS and I've never had any problems with it (coming from either side). I happen to like neediness in men and I'm certain there are other women who like it too. I would call myself a needy girl as well. None of it bothers me.

[SammySammy]

Wanting approval or intimacy is normal. The problem is when we expect it from a particular person at a level greater than they can provide it.

 

Not being needy doesn't mean you don't want approval or intimacy. It's realizing the universe is a big place and there's enough love for everyone. Not getting it from one person only means it's available in someone else - someone more compatible.

[kendahke]

Some people become anxious when an expectation of behavior they have is not being met by someone who is unwilling or incapable of meeting it. What generally happens is they think "if I try harder, then they will try harder" and that rarely is the answer. The answer is to adjust the expectation or accept that the person they insist upon being with can only deliver so much--and be cool with that. However, that's not the answer the anxious person is trying to hear.

 

That can come across as neediness, because the harder they cling to that expectation being met, generally speaking, the further away from it they get. It's almost like a void that they need filling and that void becomes a drain--no matter what, what they're getting from their partner is never enough and it's never going to fill to satisfaction. That is when their need becomes overwhelming and threatens to swallow their partner whole.

[Charmed22]

I would say that insecurity is different from neediness in that insecurity is more about seeking reassurance by asking for it or by trying to prove something, and it's motivated by fear of rejection. Neediness is trying to directly or indirectly get some need met. I know we're splitting hairs on definitions here, but I'm frustrated with the number of times in men's dating advice I've heard, "You're too needy, you're too needy, you're too needy..." so I want to figure it out.

 

 

 

See, and that's what I'm talking about with Neediness 2: if she feels that my need for intimacy and caring is more than she's willing to give, she's going to perceive me as being needy, regardless of what is normally expected in society. It's about her perception of my needs, not so much some generally agreed-upon standard of care and intimacy.

 

This was very much at issue in my last two relationships, which were with women who were somewhat cold, distant, unaffectionate, and emotionally unavailable. When they withdrew from me, I let them have their way because I didn't want to be needy - or Neediness 2, wanting more intimacy in the relationship than they did. But other people (on another forum) have criticized this action for being Neediness 1, which is suppressing my own feelings and desires to get her approval so I could keep the relationship together. So if I had been direct with these women about wanting more intimacy in the relationship by asking for more time together or for more physical intimacy, they might have said I was being too needy, which is Neediness 2 above. But by giving in and letting them withdraw from me without standing up for myself, I was committing Neediness 1 by suppressing my own desires to please someone else. So either option I picked - letting her have her way, or standing up for myself - someone was going to criticize me for being too needy. That's where all this is coming form, and that's what I'm trying to figure out.

 

Its only called neediness by someone who can't/won't give it you.

 

I understand what your saying, Its kinda a damn if you do, damn if you don't situation and is really frustrating. In my experience which is not much, neediness is very relative. My ex would call me needy cause I wanted more affection. My sex drive is normal for a girl in their 20s and Im a toucher so I like to hold hands, cuddle, etc. My ex was not very compatible with me on that, unaffectionate, sex only once a week or so etc. He always called me needy and it would make me insecure wondering what I did to make him not want to be close to me. This would make me act more needy which only annoyed him and made it less likely for him to be affectionate to me which of course would make me more insecure. Its a stupid cycle that ends relationships if the communication isn't there. The kicker is at a point in the relationship I broke up with him. He would call me non stop, beg me to take him back, threaten to kill himself, tell me he will change. Pretty much do everything that I consider needy.

 

 

Now that Im attempting to date again, I have been called needy for responding to texts quickly even though I usually have my phone on me anyways, I have been called needy just for even asking a guy out to lunch. I have also been called cold for not responding to a text quick enough when I was in a work meeting. I have been called cold for canceling a date cause my car broke down, etc. Its all relative.

 

There are people out there that are compatible with you on things like this. People who you won't have to ask for affection, people who won't mind if you text them daily etc. You just have to find the person who matches your effort. Everyone else will see you as either cold or needy

 

In short, I feel like neediness is a label someone gives to you when they can't/won't meet your needs, so they don't feel bad about themselves. Its a way to make it less about them and more about you

Edited May 6, 2016 by Charmed22

[katiegrl]

u

I don't like the term "needy". You might be needy to one person and not needy enough to another. It's all relative. Relationships work best when you're with someone who has very similar needs, or whose needs complement what you're willing to give and vice versa.

 

So simple but SO true.

 

Issues re how much "space" (emotional, physical) one needs in a RL vary person to person, and IMO it's important to find and be with a person whose space needs jive with our own.

 

I myself require a bit more space than I think the average woman, and therefore I need to be with a man who understands this and whose needs in that regard jive with mine.

 

Problems come into play when one person requires more togetherness and the other requires more space. Neither is wrong, just different.

 

Not gonna work. The person who requires and prefers more togetherness is gonna perceive the other as cold, distant, emotionally unavailable, or whatever other adjectives come to mind..... while the person who requires more space is gonna perceive the other as too needy.

 

With different people whose needs jive, these same two people could perceive each other as being a perfect match... and not attribute those same qualities to each other at all!!

[Shanex]

This point adressed here has long been sort of stressful or made me anxious, OP. I wont make a central point but will agree with the posters saying you may or may not be needy to everyone. Just like you can be intelligent to some, or a fool to others.

 

Personally I always started RS or maybe some FWB being sort of distant and evasive and eventually became needy or clingy which became a problem both for me and the lady. I didnt realize it, and its not always easy for your mate to tell you bluntly.

 

Trying to be "steady" in your feelings or emotions is the key. Hard to control, but you can work on it aging. So with experience.

[Buddhist]

So what is neediness? Is it needy to want more intimacy than your partner wants? What are your thoughts?

 

I have my own definition of neediness.

 

It's wanting from your partner something you are not prepared to give to yourself.

 

I see this all the time, someone who displays attention seeking behaviour generally has real problems spending time with themselves. They are unwilling to give themselves the attention they seek from others. When someone wants a lot of intimacy in a relationship and yet it's obvious they don't have much idea of who they really are, then I see that as them wanting me to know them better than they know themselves. Which is frankly arse about face. If they don't care who they are then why should I?

 

Most people are very needy with love. They seek from others the unconditional love they are unwilling to give to themselves. The worst expression of this is the co-dependant. They attach themselves to someone who will never give them what they want and yet take on the role of caretaker while neglecting themselves and their own needs.

 

In all cases the person is attempting to extract from someone else what they neglect in themselves. Unfit people go gah, gah over someone who is the picture of health and vitality. Yet it doesn't occur to them to foster that same health and vitality within themselves. Instead they just become obsessed with what they see outside of them. I have to admit I did the same. But once I attained that same athletic physique the appeal of a ripped body isn't like some kind of drug, it's just recognising another fit and healthy person.

[katiegrl]

I can't remember where I read this (or heard this)... but I will always remember it.... 100% agree with it.

 

"Just because I don't need you as much as you appear to need me, DOES NOT mean I don't love you any less than you love me."

 

Need and love are not mutually exclusive.

 

You can love someone very much but be very secure, independent, self-contained... and NOT need them as much for your emotional security, etc..... and on the other hand you can need someone very much but NOT actually love them at all.

 

So many people seem to associate need with love.... he doesn't need me like I need him... therefore he doesn't love me.

 

I so don't agree with that line of thinking at all! And have seen quite a few RLs destroyed because of it too.

Edited May 7, 2016 by katiegrl

[Blanco]

I'm an attachment theory advocate, so I think a lot of it comes down to the type of partner you're with.

 

My best relationship was with a girl that would fit the "secure" attachment style. We eventually parted ways for various reasons, but in retrospect, I realize how secure I felt with her, with the relationship, and really, a lot of other things in my life while I was with her. This despite being more of the "anxious" attachment style. She was charming and very attractive, which meant she definitely had some guys eyeing her. Yet I never felt insecure or needy with regards to that or questioned her feelings for me. Years later, reading up on attachment theory, it all made sense: Anxious attachment style people who pair up with a secure style person can, over time, become a more secure attachment style themselves.

 

Now, compare that to my last relationship with someone who was an "avoidant" attachment style. After the honeymoon phase passed, her hot-cold, push-pull ways really brought to the surface the worst of my anxious attachment tendencies. It got so that even when things were going well, I knew it was only a matter of time before she got cold/pulled back. In a way, it became a self-fulfilling prophecy, because I definitely got increasingly needier in some ways, which is repellent to most people.

[PrettyEmily77]

Neediness = asking more than what an unwilling / detached partner is prepared to give, repeatedly, futilely, tirelessly, knowing full well in advance what the response will be, but asking anyway.

[katiegrl]

I'm an attachment theory advocate, so I think a lot of it comes down to the type of partner you're with.

 

My best relationship was with a girl that would fit the "secure" attachment style. We eventually parted ways for various reasons, but in retrospect, I realize how secure I felt with her, with the relationship, and really, a lot of other things in my life while I was with her. This despite being more of the "anxious" attachment style. She was charming and very attractive, which meant she definitely had some guys eyeing her. Yet I never felt insecure or needy with regards to that or questioned her feelings for me. Years later, reading up on attachment theory, it all made sense: Anxious attachment style people who pair up with a secure style person can, over time, become a more secure attachment style themselves.

 

Now, compare that to my last relationship with someone who was an "avoidant" attachment style. After the honeymoon phase passed, her hot-cold, push-pull ways really brought to the surface the worst of my anxious attachment tendencies. It got so that even when things were going well, I knew it was only a matter of time before she got cold/pulled back. In a way, it became a self-fulfilling prophecy, because I definitely got increasingly needier in some ways, which is repellent to most people.

 

Not sure I agree with you Blanco.

 

I am considered to have "secure attachment style," I love and NEED TO feel secure in my RLs and in turn love making my partner feel secure also. Avoiding attachment is the LAST thing I would ever want to do and would not seek that style in a partner either. In fact, I would run from it!

 

That said, I also require quite a bit of emotional and physical space. For example, my ex and I had separate bedrooms (we lived together), although we often ended up sleeping and waking together anyway. Just one example how we were a bit unconventional with respect to our space needs.

 

It worked beautifully for US because our needs jived.

 

That said, we both still needed to feel secure with each other... and DID. Simply because our space needs/requirements matched.

 

We didn't need from each other anything more than what each of us was willing to give at that particular point in time.

 

Whatever we were not getting from each other at any particular moment, we would give to OURSELVES.

 

Secure attachment and avoidant attachment styles have more to do with an individual's pathology, how they interact and relate and how close (or not close) they wish to be within the context of their RL.

 

Again, although my partners and I required more space than the average couple, we were still very very close and emotionally connected... and very secure within ourselves and also with each other.

Edited May 7, 2016 by katiegrl

[Blanco]

Not sure I agree with you Blanco.

 

I am considered to have "secure attachment style," I love and NEED TO feel secure in my RLs and in turn love making my partner feel secure also. Avoiding attachment is the LAST thing I would ever want to do and would not seek that style in a partner either. In fact, I would run from it!

 

That said, I also require quite a bit of emotional and physical space. For example, my ex and I had separate bedrooms (we lived together), although we often ended up sleeping and waking together anyway. Just one example how we were a bit unconventional with respect to our space needs.

 

It worked beautifully for US because our needs jived.

 

That said, we both still needed to feel secure with each other... and DID. Simply because our space needs/requirements matched.

 

We didn't need from each other anything more than what each of us was willing to give at that particular point in time.

 

Whatever we were not getting from each other at any particular moment, we would give to OURSELVES.

 

Secure attachment and avoidant attachment styles have more to do with an individual's pathology, how they interact and relate and how close (or not close) they wish to be within the context of their RL.

 

Again, although my partners and I required more space than the average couple, we were still very very close and emotionally connected... and very secure within ourselves and also with each other.

 

Wait, so what are we disagreeing about? Sounds like we're on the same page.

[katiegrl]

Wait, so what are we disagreeing about? Sounds like we're on the same page.

 

Well I said I wasn't sure if I agreed with you and that's why.

 

Cause we actually agree!

 

I probably didn't fully understand your post...... my bad.

[todreaminblue]

wouldnt it be cool if we could all pre empt a persons needs and "need to" fulfill them...maybe then ....this planet wouldnt be full of people surpressing their needs and never letting them show in case they thought of themselves as needy in a bad way that they have failed because they have desires and needs to be met........

 

 

everyone has needs in my opinion....so we are all needy.....

 

 

.when someone famous came up with the phrase the other half or even better half....that is actual fact.. that its actually true you need a complementing half...to feel fulfilled...and i guess that means...someone who fulfills those needs in you and you meet theirs..and you dotn have to play happy family...you are happy family...........making them...your other half....too romantic....maybe...but i guess i need ....romantic....and i am needy......in a "nice" way......deb

[Blanco]

Well I said I wasn't sure if I agreed with you and that's why.

 

Cause we actually agree!

 

I probably didn't fully understand your post...... my bad.

 

In short, I'm mostly an anxious attachment style, but when I had a relationship with a secure type, I started to feel secure myself. When I had a relationship with an avoidant type, the worst of my anxious tendencies bubbled up and I felt endlessly insecure and unsure about the relationship and myself.

 

Basically, I'll never let myself be involved seriously with an avoidant type again, because it brings out some of my absolute worst qualities and amplifies them.

[katiegrl]

In short, I'm mostly an anxious attachment style, but when I had a relationship with a secure type, I started to feel secure myself. When I had a relationship with an avoidant type, the worst of my anxious tendencies bubbled up and I felt endlessly insecure and unsure about the relationship and myself.

 

Basically, I'll never let myself be involved seriously with an avoidant type again, because it brings out some of my absolute worst qualities and amplifies them.

 

That's smart!

 

For me, I would never be with an avoidant type.

 

I mean, who in their right mind would?

 

Such types have major issues! Intimacy issues, commitment issues, no thanks!