Cell phone question [updated]

[Lobe]

^^^ I was going to say the same thing. That conversation sounds rehearsed or planned. I prefer to give the benefit of the doubt in these situations, but something's weird about that conversation.

 

Also, regarding the "disgusting guy talk", most men that I am familiar with that speak that way, they will speak that way whether their wives are around or not. They don't have a different personality or way of speaking when their spouses aren't there to hear them. And they don't disrespect their wives/GFs behind their backs, either.

 

True, he may have found the VAR. Let's hope that YST is right that this was the "scare" they both needed to play it straight. Is it possible it's a huge giant ruse? Entirely. Which is why I asked how he was treating her. If he is still being a prick or being evasive then there's a cause to continue being concerned.

 

And I disagree - both women and men talk differently with their friends than their spouses all the time. I have a totally different conversations and sometimes yes, I am bitching about my husband and talking about how nice Tom Hiddleston looks in a suit but how much nicer he'd look out of one.

 

YST, I doubt this is the end of the story - you will be hyper-vigilant for a long time to come. If it was me I swear I would just contact the OW - poking the hornet's nest will always get a reaction of some sort even if she denies it in spades but runs to your hubby and complains bitterly about it, because his behaviour towards you will become weird right then and there.

 

Move the VAR and in a few weeks when he is unlikely to look for it, find a new hiding place.

[angelcake]

As with the above posts, I immediately thought, "He is playing her".

 

I would continue to play detective and seek out the OW, or find some other way to spy. I say this because our gut feelings are usually correct.

 

However, it sounds like you are ready to move forward with trust. I hope he is indeed innocent and wish you the best. Thank you for the update.

[Cinnamonstix]

Sorry to burst your bubble OP, but I agree with the others.

That conversation doesn't sound natural at all and like it was intended to be heard by you.

He's likely looked up all the ways you can spy on him and is covering his bases.

He may have found the VAR.

I hope you're being stealth about this thread.

[S2B]

His conversation sounds staged. Could you hear the other voice he was speaking to? What was the other guy saying?

 

I think they planned the call and what was discussed. Otherwise, why wouldn't he just talk to the guy in person? Why all those details that makes it sound rehearsed...like he meant for you to hear it?

 

I think he's testing your resources for spying on him?

 

He might have a new burner phone too... For his real calls.

[merrmeade]

YST, here's the thing: What if what everyone is saying is right and you have bigger or different problems down the way?

 

Can you just consider one option? Postponing the adoption. Not forever. But just for a while. Give yourself more time to figure out some of these really important concerns.

 

Or think of it as best for those innocent children. Shouldn't you be more prepared as a couple and as individuals to give those children the full attention and emotional support of loving, united, mature, stable parents? Is what you are doing right—inviting them into your home at a time that you are the least united, mature or stable?

 

Don't commit one way or the other. Just postpone and give yourself time to think about what's best for everyone.

[66Charger]

His conversation was not staged. Note, directly after you told him about the freinds wife, is when he made the phone call. Good male freinds rarely lie to each other.

 

The VAR and infidelity. You found nothing in the beginning and you have nothing now, and its been 2 months. Some may say "he must have found it. Why, because there was no dirt? He is a bore and probally a Ahole, but you dont have a shred that proves infidelity. Flirting a few months ago? Yes. Maybe the start of a EA, which is disregarded for the male gender. It happpens, but it is what you DO AND DONT DO that counts.

 

Ask him for a poly, and tell him you will ask only one question. Did he ever physically cheat.

 

My guess the odds are 50/50, if not more and thats good for a long term. Ask him.

[yepsurething]

Oh, YST - this must be some relief! I certainly hope HE is doing a 180. Has he been treating you differently? I am so happy that he is cutting himself off from his friend - sounds like a bad influence! I suspect YOU will get a call from HIS wife now though... that will be fun to watch!

 

I'm off on holidays again with spotty reception for a couple of weeks - I'll be sending you happy "my husband is not a cheater" vibes the whole time!

 

He has been treating my differently. he has since this all started really. More affectionate, more patient, back to all the old things we did together, and liking them. I hate to think someone could influence him so badly and that he's that weak to be swayed away from who he says he is or wants to be.

 

his friends wife is nothing like me so I doubt she'll text or even care about her husband. from the texts Ive read she's out drinking and partying and leaving the kids home with hubby's friend. she's not interested in being a mom or being at home, so he has a wife that doesn't care about him or their kids etc. feels like crap, complains and my husband seems to get sucked into the wives are horrible garbage when it's not ME, it's her. Since my husband met this friend he's complained and hated his wife...it's the main reason I've never liked this friend. so Im glad if anything they can't be as close now because my husband is on watch.

 

hope you had a nice vacation.

[yepsurething]

Yeah, me either. There's something fishy about this -

 

First of all, you understood the conversation so well, got so much detail. Was he enunciating abnormally clearly as if he WANTED to be understood?

Second, he was so PARTICULAR to spell out to his friend all the things he/they DIDN'T do in this loud, clear voice. Who does that in normal conversatoins with freinds/

 

the conversations that were hardest for me to hear unfortunately were the car recordings, I since started putting the VAR in his computer bag and it records basically him in his office. Sometimes because he walks around the office or talks quietly because his office sometimes has other workers in it I have had a little trouble hearing, but mostly in his office I can hear most of what is said.

 

and yes, I'm suspicious still. and will keep looking and listening.

 

sadly I may never know the truth, and I'm still having some break down dont trust him times, but he swears he'll do what ever it takes to build trust. letting me see his phone, and he hardly uses it at home now except when he's on call.

 

said I can follow him with phone tracking or put a tracker on his phone. (location tracker)

He's even been looking for a new job. I hope he finds one.

[yepsurething]

I agree he has probably found the VAR.

 

ive wondered that too.

 

he's pretty convincing if he knows I'm listening but I have thought that and I am going to try to move the VAR and let him think I'm not snooping any more and see what happens.

 

for instance on Sunday I mentioned I didn't really care for one of his workers sharing so much of her personal life with him . (she sits in his office for long periods talking and she is definitely flirtatious with him) well the next day on the VAR I hear him calling her a few names and saying he can't stand her. so I'm thinking he's staging it a bit??

 

and at one point she flirts with him in the audio and another coworkers says 'whoa, this sounds kinky should I leave?' and my husband clearly sounded shaken and acted weird to the comment and then the women kind laughs and explains what she was talking about.

 

does he normally act shaken when a women flirts directly like that? or is it because he knew there was a recorder just feet away?

 

I can say he's always acted like this women is plain and unattractive but when I looked her up recently (could be the wrong person) but she's very attractive.

[yepsurething]

^^^ I was going to say the same thing. That conversation sounds rehearsed or planned. I prefer to give the benefit of the doubt in these situations, but something's weird about that conversation.

 

Also, regarding the "disgusting guy talk", most men that I am familiar with that speak that way, they will speak that way whether their wives are around or not. They don't have a different personality or way of speaking when their spouses aren't there to hear them. And they don't disrespect their wives/GFs behind their backs, either.

 

well, my hubby would never talk like that around me, because he knows I hate when guys talk badly, so he would hide that from me. and yeah, he's admitted that everything he said was garbage and horrible.

 

at one point he said he was glad I heard him because it's exactly the kind of man he didn't want to be and it's made him change. could all be a lie.

 

also, Ive got a spy program on his computer and see nothing there. and where he used to always go private browsing and I would say to him why browse private if you are't doing anything he is not not putting on the private browser.

 

he was using private browser even though he wasn't doing anything except reading reddit and looking things up. not sure why you would hide that?

[yepsurething]

As with the above posts, I immediately thought, "He is playing her".

 

I would continue to play detective and seek out the OW, or find some other way to spy. I say this because our gut feelings are usually correct.

 

However, it sounds like you are ready to move forward with trust. I hope he is indeed innocent and wish you the best. Thank you for the update.

 

I really don't want to contact this woman, especially since I don't really know anything for sure, and I feel confident she's out of the pic 100 percent.

 

even recently when she was CC'd on an email when replying back I saw he removed her email and only replied to the other workers, and she's even been removed from all of the work they used to do together. Maybe she removed herself? I'm glad if that's the case.

 

I don't trust him fully and still think something was up and of course will keep listening. because he will never admit to anything.

 

if anything this woke him up to losing his family, kids, home etc.

 

its like he was in a fog and is back. he's back to all our old dreams and fun.

 

he HATES his job and has since he took it, and I'm hoping he just let this flirtation go to his head and after realizing what he'd done it's over.

 

What he told her still makes me question him because if nothing was going on why would he even tell her anything. At first he said he told her 'my wife doesnt like me to be friendly to people' then he retracted that and said he was just mad when he told me that. He said he told her that he was sorry if he's been too friendly and given her any wrong ideas and that he wouldn't be asking her to lunch anymore and didn't want any troubles in his life. At one point he said he told her I found the emails then said he didn't tell her that.

 

Ugh. so yeah, he's not fully on the up and up, but I'm hoping it was just the beginning of and EA and because I am in tune with him and us I noticed it right away when he was cleaning the car and picking her up ( he said for the first time)

 

I imagine that a married man might act nervous and suspicious or excited for a first time picking up a women who had a crush or he had a crush on.

[yepsurething]

His conversation sounds staged. Could you hear the other voice he was speaking to? What was the other guy saying?

 

I think they planned the call and what was discussed. Otherwise, why wouldn't he just talk to the guy in person? Why all those details that makes it sound rehearsed...like he meant for you to hear it?

 

I think he's testing your resources for spying on him?

 

He might have a new burner phone too... For his real calls.

 

well, he has no burner phone unless he's using it out of the car and not in his office. the calls he is making are on his office phone. the friend lives an hour from his office, they work different regions so he doesn't see him in person much anyway.

 

and for that convo I couldn't hear the other voice much because it wasn't on speaker, but the call came in to my husband. it sounded like it was his friend over the line.

[yepsurething]

YST, here's the thing: What if what everyone is saying is right and you have bigger or different problems down the way?

 

Can you just consider one option? Postponing the adoption. Not forever. But just for a while. Give yourself more time to figure out some of these really important concerns.

 

Or think of it as best for those innocent children. Shouldn't you be more prepared as a couple and as individuals to give those children the full attention and emotional support of loving, united, mature, stable parents? Is what you are doing right—inviting them into your home at a time that you are the least united, mature or stable?

 

Don't commit one way or the other. Just postpone and give yourself time to think about what's best for everyone.

 

No, I can't postpone. If we don't take in our grandkids in they will go up for free adoption on the market. we'll never see them again. Our grandkids live 3000 miles away and are in foster care with strangers and it's killing these little boys. their only hope is us, and my husband is on board with this, he was fully a part of the first foster meeting which was 3 hours long, and we're taking foster classes in a couple weeks together, and he even said 'lets make this fun and have a date after the classes together'.

[ChickiePops]

I dunno..I think you should reread this thread and remind yourself of what you did find. I just did. The 'I love you' text..the 'effs like a racehorse' comment, the 'dumped her' comment, the smell of coconut, the constant accusations of being crazy, abusive, etc, the search for anti spyware...

 

I feel like you're being gas lighted.

[BuddyX]

He'll do anything to regain your trust but yet, according to him, he did nothing wrong. Hmmm.

[ShatteredLady]

They're your grandchildren, your FAMILY!! I completely agree with persuing the adoption. I would!

[merrmeade]

Ugh. so yeah, he's not fully on the up and up, but I'm hoping it was just the beginning of and EA and because I am in tune with him and us I noticed it right away when he was cleaning the car and picking her up ( he said for the first time)

 

I imagine that a married man might act nervous and suspicious or excited for a first time picking up a women who had a crush or he had a crush on.

Well, at least you're realizing how naive you were before and are getting more realistic and better at understanding what might be going on in his mind.

 

I want to tell you a part of my story that has some similar elements. It took a couple of years after d-day to fill in most of the pieces, but I now know that my husband had an affair with a woman at his work years ago. At the time, what he told me was that his office was urging employees to carpool to work during the energy crisis and so he was going to be carpooling to work. I also remember that he helped her move one Saturday because he had a truck. I imagined 3-4 people taking turns driving and that was all I thought about it. I do remember that he was a complete a--hole for several months.

 

Then, there was Dday because I discovered his affair four years ago (someone else). Then, TT - trickle, trickle, trickle truth - drop by drop over the next 2-1/2 years and I found out more and more about this affair eventually.

 

He first confessed that she had been aggressively provocative with him, groped him, followed him into the bathroom, basically putting it all on her as if he'd been a victim. But he said they hadn't had sex.

 

Then, more TT drip, drip but I was much more savvy and appropriately suspicious of the blame-shifting and minimizing and was finally able to get the story - PROBABLY most of it but can't ever be sure: He'd started working overtime for a project. She would stay late, too, and they started talking. The company said to carpool, so she asks him to carpool with her. (I never knew it was only two people until then.) During these trips or stops or pickups or whatever, she'd grope his groin and I don't know what else. I imagine whatever could be done in a car depending on who was around and where they were, and he's corroborated everything I suggested or asked about - bj, feel-up, etc. Then, the weekend he helped her move, they had sex. He says he finally introduced her to me and our baby so she'd leave him alone. (He actually said that to me - completely clueless how lame and insulting it was to be told that he couldn't end it himself for my sake or our sake or for whatever reason. He had to create a situation to get her to feel guilty and back off.)

 

I think it did end there but I also think - because I knew her - that she was in love with him (duh) and he was a complete coward - unable to do the right thing, unable to end it/turn her away himself and blaming her for the entire thing. I think it was probably true that she was the aggressor, but obviously he was a willing participant. He says there was no feeling or affection (EA) on his part, but I think that he probably didn't want it but was aware she had feelings. He always says it was flattering and he was vulnerable to that.

 

So it was the car and getting only part of the story at the time that reminded me. Also trying to convince you that he didn't have that kind of interest in her, etc. And just the fact that I believed and trusted at the time but found out later what can happen at the office and being stunned that I'd had no clue and he'd intended to keep it that way.

 

It's so obvious your husband is saying everything to everyone aware that you'll be listening. That he was cleaning the car for another woman is already disturbing, but you can be SURE that if he cared that much about her opinion he would have been open to more than a car ride with her. And what could happen in that ride? Remember affairs involve all manner in interactions., all manner of places and times. They're not just rendezvous in hotel rooms.

 

P.S. Of course, you have to go ahead with the adoption. I didn't know the details.

Edited July 26, 2016 by merrmeade

[yepsurething]

His conversation was not staged. Note, directly after you told him about the freinds wife, is when he made the phone call. Good male freinds rarely lie to each other.

 

The VAR and infidelity. You found nothing in the beginning and you have nothing now, and its been 2 months. Some may say "he must have found it. Why, because there was no dirt? He is a bore and probally a Ahole, but you dont have a shred that proves infidelity. Flirting a few months ago? Yes. Maybe the start of a EA, which is disregarded for the male gender. It happpens, but it is what you DO AND DONT DO that counts.

 

Ask him for a poly, and tell him you will ask only one question. Did he ever physically cheat.

 

My guess the odds are 50/50, if not more and thats good for a long term. Ask him.

 

um, are you saying that men are disregarded from having EA? how is that disregarded for the male gender?

 

and when you say it's what I do and don't do that counts what do you mean?

 

I did ask him for a poly and he said he would, but as he knows we can't really afford it its easy to agree to.

[merrmeade]

I did ask him for a poly and he said he would, but as he knows we can't really afford it its easy to agree to.

Find the money. Do it. Call him at his word. You need to know; you need the peace of mind. As far as the money goes, you can't afford marriage counseling either in that case - so if you could get peace of mind with a one-stop measure that he agrees to, why don't you do it? Polygraph tests are a few hundred dollars.

 

Sometimes the spouse ends up confessing beforehand; sometimes their innocence is verified. Either way - don't you want to KNOW?

[merrmeade]

I did ask him for a poly and he said he would, but as he knows we can't really afford it its easy to agree to.

You have done nothing wrong in asking him to do what he already said he would. Don't be guilted out of asking this! Even if all he's done is lie and flirt, that's enough. He owes you this much. YOU have done nothing wrong in asking and using the money for this. It's NOT a waste of money or time. It will bring something to a head one way or another and you NEED to stop treading water. You're going to drown eventually.

[underpants]

She will stay, make excuses. Unfortunately like so many others, and he will continue, like so many others.

 

Predictable, spackle on.

 

You stay out of fear of being your own person, that is rather sad.

[S2B]

Anything new happening this week?

[merrmeade]

YST, I'm sure everyone is still reading (and not just the finger-waggers who think that shaming and ridiculing BSs is motivating).

 

You're probably busy with your new family.

 

This is what i was afraid would happen after the adoption: The whole issue will have to go to the background as you start this new chapter.

 

Well, I certainly understand and am not one to wag a finger at you. But I do know one thing: You cannot be so busy that you forget or ever completely happy with that still unanswered doubt lingering in the back of your mind.

 

I still think that in your case the polygraph would be the best thing, but you may have missed your window of opportunity. He'd probably get mad at you for bringing it up. It's hard to make them listen when there's not new, fresh evidence of what they did, but I hope you do.

[Rachelkey]

I just spent the last hour and a half reading this whole thread. I think your husband and friend definitely cheat and he just figured out that you are listening. Of course he has been researching non stop to figure out how you knew stuff.....that's how we find the ways to spy in the first place.

However, I also feel you will always stay. Unless you actually see him in bed with another woman, there will always be an excuse for what you have heard or found. Unfortunately, that is what a lot of us do. Fear of change and unknown is so uncomfortable. Hopes of the same are to easy to sway to. I get it....I've done it my whole life.

I truly wish you the best.

[yepsurething]

Hi everyone

 

I have been busy with family visiting.

 

so, I can reread all my posts and bring myself to tears, but here is why I don't think he knows about the VAR and maybe his comments about not having a physical affair could be true, because the other day he was at a meeting with his 'cheat friend' and the friend shows a pic of a female to all the guys in the meeting and hubby says she looks like she'd f you to death, then comments on a hot chick passing by the window, doubtful he would do that if he knew I was listening.

 

could be a trick I guess.

 

I actually felt awkward and sorry for my husband. He's a top government worker and when he talks like this the other men just got quiet. He's making himself look embarrassing in front of his employees. it was after his muscle head friend made some comment about my husband being weak or skinny and the other men laughing at him that he started the crude talk.

 

sad, but it seemed (and I am sure I'm doing that thing where I"m looking for excuses for his bad behavior) like he did it to feel cool or more manly.? a couple men said that have replied to my thread have talked about that a bit.

 

we've been talking A LOT and spending a lot of time together and bonding basically. back to our old hobbies etc. like I mentioned it almost seems like he was woken up and is 'back'. loving our life and family and me.

 

I'm still looking and listening etc. He gives me access to his phone andI have a tracer on it, so I'd see deleted texts I think and there are none, he also keeps his GPS on now and shows me where he is while working because I've worried about that.

 

he leaves his phone just lying around and I have the code. and he's hardly on it anymore. and I've been spying on his computer still and nothing new.

 

it could all be because he's a master at lying, and he obviously lied so far.

 

and I do still have a million worries. I know some of you talk about how you are working on things and moving on...was there a point when you felt that your husband or wife stopped lying and things were 'back'?

 

I mean if I want to work on things I have to forgive and try to move on right?

 

thanks everyone, even the finger waggers. You have all given me the courage to know I have the 'right' to demand answers. It's changed everything for me and really it's changed my husband too because now he doesn't even question that I have the 'right' to see his stuff, especially if I'm worried..he said he wants me to have access to everything of his so I can feel at ease...maybe that's so he can go back to the same thing once I stop looking, or because he realizes he was a ass and was treating me badly. Thats what he's told me, that he was reckless with my emotions and feels devastated by that.